Indian Coast Guard: News & Discussion

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby kvraghav » 18 Feb 2015 14:15

^^
Dosent this qualify as voilation of official secrets act? Just asking. Not that i am worried about it.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby symontk » 18 Feb 2015 15:32

uddu wrote::lol: Our media is full of morons
Question to media is...Let's assume that if the order is to blow of the boat..then tumko kujli kyon hota hai?
"


Is that how you will react if Srilankans are killing Indian fisherman or US Navy shooting our fisherman in Dubai? If some thing is done wrongly, lets accept it and move on. There is no shame in admitting a mistake if its there

My 2 cents

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Karan M » 18 Feb 2015 15:36

symontk, we are facing a proxy war from pakistan more or less.

question of "how would you react if <insert country with whom we have peaceful relations>" does not hence arise.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby ravip » 18 Feb 2015 15:49

When we did shoot at the boat, why deny it in the first place. We did the right thing by blowing it up, as it did not adhere to warning shots, but committed mistake by telling half truth. This is enough for MSM to blow it out of proportion. Most of all many here criticized fellow members and questioned their patriotism, when they were spot on in guessing the exact cause of the event. Many here have been made to eat the humble pie.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby uddu » 18 Feb 2015 15:50

Here the Pakistanis are killing Indians.
How are you going to solve it. It's the congress saying that says India's are not supposed to defend themselves. Those days are over. :)

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby uddu » 18 Feb 2015 15:52

See guys denial may be just to ensure that area which is international waters and the terrorists have not entered Indian territory and the legality associated with it. That never means that terrorist can roam around international waters. International waters are for peaceful purposes and not for backpaki terrorists. All backpakis intenting to carry out acts against India will be blown out of water and send to meet their 72s. This was the message send and the ones who are supposed to get it has got it...the media morons in here are crying. Let them...:)

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby symontk » 18 Feb 2015 16:11

Karan M wrote:symontk, we are facing a proxy war from pakistan more or less.

question of "how would you react if <insert country with whom we have peaceful relations>" does not hence arise.


yes, "countries that we have peaceful relationships", I don't want to say more on them because this topic is not about them, and what about countries that we don't have peaceful relationships? If they harm Indian citizens on pretext of being terrorists?

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Karan M » 18 Feb 2015 16:41

symontk,

if india was sending terrorists into their countries, they would shoot our ships to pieces.

even otherwise, they take harsher measures than we do to protect their military assets.

you are off on a weird tangent here.

india has suffered terror & that too from the sea repeatedly from one nation. it is well within its rights to take what measures it deems necessary.

zimble onlee.

all rest is shadow boxing

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Karan M » 18 Feb 2015 16:42

comparing india's relation with Pak & other countries using it as an excuse for their behavior is pointless IMO.
any other country which did it, would justifiably paint itself in a corner with this GOI.
are they then going to claim they too did stuff like 26/11?

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby JTull » 18 Feb 2015 17:12

symontk,

Scuttling/demolition maybe an objective and Explosion maybe a result.

There were no reports of CG boarding the vessels and setting up explosives. So they didn't set out to 'explode' the boat.

If firing at the boat causes fuel or explosives on board the vessel go off, then so be it. If the target vessel had responded positively to the warning shots, direct firing would not have been needed.

---

By many reports, USN arrests the Somalian pirates and deliberately destroys their boat. That too in international waters. Why is it wrong to target a boat in Indian waters which doesn't respond to warnings?

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby symontk » 18 Feb 2015 18:19

Karan M wrote:india has suffered terror & that too from the sea repeatedly from one nation. it is well within its rights to take what measures it deems necessary.


i am not disputing this, but if due to this, all our actions are justified, then I would say we are on a slippery slope

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby member_28533 » 18 Feb 2015 19:05

symontk wrote:
Karan M wrote:india has suffered terror & that too from the sea repeatedly from one nation. it is well within its rights to take what measures it deems necessary.


i am not disputing this, but if due to this, all our actions are justified, then I would say we are on a slippery slope



Would you have been happier if CG had not done its job, allowed the craft to land in Mumbai and terrorists had carried out v2 of 26/11 attacks ?

The only slippery path is when you are trying to put yourself somewhere in the arbiter's role between the two - rather than firmly backing any action that would further national interests - because you cannot see the big picture of India needing to safeguard its national security or suffer from guilt/shame when things go your way.

It seems this mindset of repeatedly belittling, feeling ashamed of every aspect of India has picked up of late.. MSM started perpetuating this "culture of guilt" post the Delhi bus rape - national shame or what not is the new mantra of the naive youth - masochistic self-flaggellation is the new symbol of "open mindedness"... naive youth are just floating around without a firm ideological grounding except wallowing in self-doubt, guilt and shame. Ability to think on their own to resolve Dharmic nuances is missing and as such, easily susceptible to MSM propaganda methinks.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby manjgu » 18 Feb 2015 20:27

atleast the stmt that 'we dont want to serve them biryani ' shows that the boat had terrorists was established...

now the question is wether it blew itself up or was blown up...? i think the defence minsiter should say warning shots were fired ( not at the boat) and in response the boat was blown up by the intruders..everybodys H&D is preserved... however I will uncork champagne if the CG officer is right...

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Sagar G » 18 Feb 2015 20:29

[Edited out personal attack]

Lets see what actually has been said and reported. IE has properly quoted the DIG who said

I hope you remember 31st December night, we blew off the Pakistan. We have blown them off. I was there at Gandhinagar and I told at night, blow the boat off. We don't want to serve them biriyani.


Other than the obvious gloating and the horrible grammar by such a high ranking officer I don't see any indication given by him that the blown Puki boat was carrying civilians/fishermen/innocent people. Infact his words, "We don't want to serve them biriyani" only shows that intel was spot on and puki boat was indeed carrying terrorists. The officer himself has down hill skied and told the truth i.e.

"The operation was classified in nature and its details were not shared (with me)," he told reporters, adding it was his boss Inspector General, North West region, Kuldip Singh Sheoran who was in charge of the operation.


The disciplinary action initiated against him by DM is right and will hopefully teach a useful lesson about the cons of gloating in public and claiming credit for things which you are not responsible for.

So basically Italian Express is doing another hitjob so that it's congi masters get their two minutes of fame on national channel and resident idiots are well.......being idiots.
Last edited by Raja Bose on 19 Feb 2015 09:21, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: No personal attacks please. Banned for 3 days.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Aditya_V » 18 Feb 2015 20:31

First the officer claiming he gave the order is administrative officer in charge of staff welfare, no way he could or his order be accepted by the CG boat since he is not part of chain of command. Yet we have soo many influential Indians taking the Paki line.

Shows we are nation filled with termites

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby KLNMurthy » 18 Feb 2015 21:22

ravip wrote:When we did shoot at the boat, why deny it in the first place. We did the right thing by blowing it up, as it did not adhere to warning shots, but committed mistake by telling half truth. This is enough for MSM to blow it out of proportion. Most of all many here criticized fellow members and questioned their patriotism, when they were spot on in guessing the exact cause of the event. Many here have been made to eat the humble pie.


How is it that one dubious report by known liars, crooks and traitors is enough to call for the eating of humble pie?

Credibility of IE and MSM is very low. We can't take their investigative reports and claims at face value. We shouldn't be pushed into accepting half-truths and insinuations against defense forces as gospel truth. If MSM are acting as advocates for our enemy interests , we should learn to be advocates for the forces.

The report says that the DIG boasted about giving the order to fire at the paki boat, and the Raksha Mantri stated that the boat blew itself up. We should give the RM the benefit of the doubt.

Is it not possible that the CG had orders from the DIG to sink the paki ship but the pakis blew themselves up before the order could be carried out?

Is it not possible the DIG was simply making an idle, and false, boast after some drinks? Is there corroborating evidence that the CG boat received and noted such an order?

Is it not possible the agents of IE, in an attempt to impugn the RM, fed leading questions to an incautious officer and created a misleading tape? From the IE account, the DIG was caught on tape saying these things at social occasion. Why go to a social occasion with a recording device?

Point is, let us bat for our side, and not allow ourselves to be led by the nose by people who have no ethics or patriotism.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby ravip » 18 Feb 2015 21:25

Sagar G wrote:Lets see what actually has been said and reported. IE has properly quoted the DIG who said

I hope you remember 31st December night, we blew off the Pakistan. We have blown them off. I was there at Gandhinagar and I told at night, blow the boat off. We don't want to serve them biriyani.


Other than the obvious gloating and the horrible grammar by such a high ranking officer I don't see any indication given by him that the blown Puki boat was carrying civilians/fishermen/innocent people. Infact his words, "We don't want to serve them biriyani" only shows that intel was spot on and puki boat was indeed carrying terrorists. The officer himself has down hill skied and told the truth i.e.

"The operation was classified in nature and its details were not shared (with me)," he told reporters, adding it was his boss Inspector General, North West region, Kuldip Singh Sheoran who was in charge of the operation.


The disciplinary action initiated against him by DM is right and will hopefully teach a useful lesson about the cons of gloating in public and claiming credit for things which you are not responsible for.

So basically Italian Express is doing another hitjob so that it's congi masters get their two minutes of fame on national channel and resident idiots are well.......being idiots.


oh.!!!here starts the name calling and the tendency to shoot the messenger. No one is condemning the Coast Guard for blowing up the boat,in fact it is good that we were able to neutralize it, but for the way MoD handled the situation. If we go by your argument then what right have we got in persecuting the Italian Marines. So lets no get into this ridiculous argument about who is more patriotic or come from either Italian express or Nagpur express.

The point here is there will be questions asked when there is a controversy, unlike Pakistan we are a functional democracy, so the best way to settle the dust is to answer those questions than to shoot the person asking such questions as terrorist sympathizers.
One should not defend blindly like modi bhakts do, rational thinking is required.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby KLNMurthy » 18 Feb 2015 21:35

Sagar G wrote:
Footure seclet mass grave site Hunter 1 wrote:There is no shame in admitting a mistake if its there :rotfl:


Footure seclet mass grave site Hunter 2 wrote:Many here have been made to eat the humble pie. :rotfl:


Lets see what actually has been said and reported. IE has properly quoted the DIG who said

I hope you remember 31st December night, we blew off the Pakistan. We have blown them off. I was there at Gandhinagar and I told at night, blow the boat off. We don't want to serve them biriyani.


Other than the obvious gloating and the horrible grammar by such a high ranking officer I don't see any indication given by him that the blown Puki boat was carrying civilians/fishermen/innocent people. Infact his words, "We don't want to serve them biriyani" only shows that intel was spot on and puki boat was indeed carrying terrorists. The officer himself has down hill skied and told the truth i.e.

"The operation was classified in nature and its details were not shared (with me)," he told reporters, adding it was his boss Inspector General, North West region, Kuldip Singh Sheoran who was in charge of the operation.


The disciplinary action initiated against him by DM is right and will hopefully teach a useful lesson about the cons of gloating in public and claiming credit for things which you are not responsible for.

So basically Italian Express is doing another hitjob so that it's congi masters get their two minutes of fame on national channel and resident idiots are well.......being idiots.


Good one Sagar G. You did a much-needed dissection. Is "told" == giving an order?

Who he told? Chaprassi? To whisky bottle?

Where he told? Officers' club?

Who was he to tell anything?

Are they even his words or the words of some half-literate IE paid-media staffer?

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby ravip » 18 Feb 2015 21:47

KLNMurthy wrote:
Good one Sagar G. You did a much-needed dissection. Is "told" == giving an order?

Who he told? Chaprassi? To whisky bottle?

Where he told? Officers' club?

Who was he to tell anything?

Are they even his words or the words of some half-literate IE paid-media staffer?


So you are commenting without watching the DIG video, so that is how you evaluate others credibility when you are completely at dark about the information. Watch the video.

Last edited by Indranil on 18 Feb 2015 22:32, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Fixed youtube link

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Sagar G » 18 Feb 2015 21:49

ravip wrote:oh.!!!here starts the name calling and the tendency to shoot the messenger.


Doesn't like the taste of his own medicine ,so typical :roll:

ravip wrote:No one is condemning the Coast Guard for blowing up the boat,in fact it is good that we were able to neutralize it, but for the way MoD handled the situation. If we go by your argument then what right have we got in persecuting the Italian Marines. So lets no get into this ridiculous argument about who is more patriotic or come from either Italian express or Nagpur express.


Their is a limit to which ridiculousness can be handled but you are creating new milestones post after post.

How the hell is even CG case any way similar to the Italian marines case which is being tried in SC and the perpetrators are not from a terrorist nation (atleast a well known one) ??? Who has given you the right to come here and do an == with any and whatsoever case that you want to bring up just so that you can lay claim to have found the truth and "exposed" the government ??? Instead of trolling and showing your immaturity post after post why don't you actually put an effort to learn about the matter instead of trying to become Mallika Sarabhia of BRF ???

ravip wrote:The point here is there will be questions asked when there is a controversy, unlike Pakistan we are a functional democracy, so the best way to settle the dust is to answer those questions than to shoot the person asking such questions as terrorist sympathizers.


Again showing your immaturity, trying to act smart by using a few technical words here and there. Listen kid, functional democracy doesn't mean that you go on creating unnecessary controversy just so that you can spite the GoI so as to be able to feel good about yourself and the democracy that you are touting here. Being responsible citizen is one of the basic requirements of having a "functional democracy", being a self absorbed doubting Thomas doesn't make you one. So insteda of giving moral lectures about all the good things under sun it would have been prudent if you would have cared to look into the matter before shooting off from your mouth.

ravip wrote:One should not defend blindly like modi bhakts do, rational thinking is required.


Given the quality of your post (rather the lack of it) it would be better if you follow your own advice instead of posting moral lectures after lectures. Such post are going to be challenged and if you don't like it then deal with it, your problem.

For starters why don't you put up some facts to back up the claims that you are making, lets' see how much "rational thinking" you are capable of doing.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby KLNMurthy » 18 Feb 2015 21:52

ravip wrote:
...

So basically Italian Express is doing another hitjob so that it's congi masters get their two minutes of fame on national channel and resident idiots are well.......being idiots.


oh.!!!here starts the name calling and the tendency to shoot the messenger. No one is condemning the Coast Guard for blowing up the boat,in fact it is good that we were able to neutralize it, but for the way MoD handled the situation. If we go by your argument then what right have we got in persecuting the Italian Marines. So lets no get into this ridiculous argument about who is more patriotic or come from either Italian express or Nagpur express.

The point here is there will be questions asked when there is a controversy, unlike Pakistan we are a functional democracy, so the best way to settle the dust is to answer those questions than to shoot the person asking such questions as terrorist sympathizers.
One should not defend blindly like modi bhakts do, rational thinking is required.

Let me point out two things:

1. MSM in general, and IE in particular have richly earned the contempt of anyone with intellect, discernment and a sense of ethcs. Anyway, as a powerful public institutions, we the public have lots of leeway in judging and condemning them.(Personally, other than factual reporting like cricket scores and labeled opinion pieces, I assume they are lying unless proven otherwise.) That is what free speech is.

2.By labeling the very real and human BRF posters "modi bhakts" in a pejorative way just for not accepting your argument in toto and without question, you are definitely engaging in name-calling of fellow BRF members, which is a violation of policy IIRC.

On a personal note, I have learned that BRF has some very formidable brains, and would consider it sheer impertinence on my part to preach here that "rational thinking is required."
Last edited by KLNMurthy on 18 Feb 2015 22:27, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Sagar G » 18 Feb 2015 21:54

ravip wrote:So you are commenting without watching the IG video, so that is how you evaluate others credibility when you are completely at dark about the information. Watch the video.


LeL here comes another one.

You need to put on your specs or get your eyes checked. If your natural lenses are in order and your comprehension, reading skill is normal then you can see in my previous post that I have already posted what DIG has said in the video. What other thing is to be seen in the video when the relevant portion has already been posted ???

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby KLNMurthy » 18 Feb 2015 21:57

ravip wrote:
KLNMurthy wrote:
Good one Sagar G. You did a much-needed dissection. Is "told" == giving an order?

Who he told? Chaprassi? To whisky bottle?

Where he told? Officers' club?

Who was he to tell anything?

Are they even his words or the words of some half-literate IE paid-media staffer?


So you are commenting without watching the DIG video, so that is how you evaluate others credibility when you are completely at dark about the information. Watch the video.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Id3hYsRmnx0[/youtube]

The video is not viewable for me.

I have read the report which refers to the video. Do you mean that the report distorted the information in the video?

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Sagar G » 18 Feb 2015 22:07

The relevant part of the video,


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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby ravip » 18 Feb 2015 22:09

Sagar G wrote:
ravip wrote:oh.!!!here starts the name calling and the tendency to shoot the messenger.


Doesn't like the taste of his own medicine ,so typical :roll:

ravip wrote:No one is condemning the Coast Guard for blowing up the boat,in fact it is good that we were able to neutralize it, but for the way MoD handled the situation. If we go by your argument then what right have we got in persecuting the Italian Marines. So lets no get into this ridiculous argument about who is more patriotic or come from either Italian express or Nagpur express.


Their is a limit to which ridiculousness can be handled but you are creating new milestones post after post.

How the hell is even CG case any way similar to the Italian marines case which is being tried in SC and the perpetrators are not from a terrorist nation (atleast a well known one) ??? Who has given you the right to come here and do an == with any and whatsoever case that you want to bring up just so that you can lay claim to have found the truth and "exposed" the government ??? Instead of trolling and showing your immaturity post after post why don't you actually put an effort to learn about the matter instead of trying to become Mallika Sarabhia of BRF ???

ravip wrote:The point here is there will be questions asked when there is a controversy, unlike Pakistan we are a functional democracy, so the best way to settle the dust is to answer those questions than to shoot the person asking such questions as terrorist sympathizers.


Again showing your immaturity, trying to act smart by using a few technical words here and there. Listen kid, functional democracy doesn't mean that you go on creating unnecessary controversy just so that you can spite the GoI so as to be able to feel good about yourself and the democracy that you are touting here. Being responsible citizen is one of the basic requirements of having a "functional democracy", being a self absorbed doubting Thomas doesn't make you one. So insteda of giving moral lectures about all the good things under sun it would have been prudent if you would have cared to look into the matter before shooting off from your mouth.

ravip wrote:One should not defend blindly like modi bhakts do, rational thinking is required.


Given the quality of your post (rather the lack of it) it would be better if you follow your own advice instead of posting moral lectures after lectures. Such post are going to be challenged and if you don't like it then deal with it, your problem.

For starters why don't you put up some facts to back up the claims that you are making, lets' see how much "rational thinking" you are capable of doing.


when did i indulge in name calling, let me leave it to Mods than to indulge in this mud slinging with you. Let Mods decide who is the malika or what ever of this forum. No One is doing an equal equal here, and i don't need your permission to do that even if i were to do that.

1). The DIG addressing the officers gathering happened a month ago, and no one had a problem until IE brought it up.
2). Who can prompt the DIG to say what he said, he is not a constable.
3). If what the DIG had said was false then at least the officers present in the gathering should have raised the objections, if not in that gathering but certainly after that.

Now that you have said that the DIG is traitor, congress stooge and what not. It shows that you passed the judgement even before knowing the relevant facts, and there ends the rational thinking.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Sagar G » 18 Feb 2015 22:20

ravip wrote:No One is doing an equal equal here, and i don't need your permission to do that even if i were to do that.


Equally as well no body here needs you ****** permission to state what they want to, so don't try and be all smartass making claims about eating humble pie and all.

ravip wrote:3). If what the DIG had said was false then at least the officers present in the gathering should have raised the objections, if not in that gathering but certainly after that. :rotfl:


Now from telling BRF what to do and not his eminence has graduated to telling CG and Naval officers to act according to Herr Fuhrers wishes :lol:

ravip wrote:Now that you have said that the DIG is traitor, congress stooge and what not. It shows that you passed the judgement even before knowing the relevant facts, and there ends the rational thinking.


:rotfl:

Is this Victors second account ???

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Aditya G » 18 Feb 2015 22:26

I think the MoD needs to come out with a 2-3 pager dossier style press release to close this. There is all sorts of negative campaign around and the DIG made it worst.

Aside from the end result, the media is racking up the lack of inter-service coordination issue again.

Aditya G wrote:Who needs enemies when we have each other to fight ...

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/paki ... 19108.html

...

On the evening of January 3, when the 50m long ICGS Rajratan commissioned into the ICG in February 2013 returned and berthed alongside at the Porbandar Coast Guard jetty inside the Gujarat Maritime Board's all-weather jetty, already awaiting its arrival was the Naval Officer In Charge (NOIC), a Commodore rank officer of the IN alongwith local officials. While the presence was not objected to at any point but the ICG had to categorically deny the Commodore access to the ship and crew, which was sought. The IN team had to be asked to step aside and the ICG prevailed. Meanwhile senior officials of the ICG also prevailed upon the defence ministry and committed themselves to sending a detailed report on the issue as well as share photographs and videos of the incident at the earliest. That very evening, the Commander Coast Guard Region (North West), an Inspector General rank officer, flew down to Porbandar, collected the videos and by Monday, i.e. January 5, the videos were handed over to the office of the Defence Secretary with no copies made. From conversations pieced together in New Delhi as well as in Porbandar, the entire team led by the NOIC was aghast at this treatment meted out to them and felt the ICG was being too defensive. However, it was mutually decided to not aggravate the same. The Coast Guard ship Rajratan, which can embark a compliment of six officers and 30 sailors sailed out of Porbandar on the evening of January 5 for patrolling the maritime boundary line as well as spotting debris, if any, of the Pakistani boat.

...

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby ravip » 18 Feb 2015 22:50

If what the raksha mantri says is right then how too justify the recent olive branch extended by Modi to Sharif???

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby KLNMurthy » 18 Feb 2015 23:08

ravip wrote:The point here is there will be questions asked when there is a controversy, unlike Pakistan we are a functional democracy, so the best way to settle the dust is to answer those questions than to shoot the person asking such questions as terrorist sympathizers.


It seems you believe that the rights and privileges of a democracy should apply also to suspected enemy agents outside the national boundaries. You are wrong, there is no legal or moral basis for such a belief.

Further, in no democracy do ordinary citizens have an automatic right to know the details of a classified military operation.
...

The kind of muddled thinking seen below is unfortunately quite typical in what passes for debate, and it is not usually questioned.
1). The DIG addressing the officers gathering happened a month ago, and no one had a problem until IE brought it up.

By definition, we can't be bothered about what is not known or reported.

so,why didn't IE bring it up a month ago when the matter was still fresh? If they were taking the time to confirm what was said, they didn't share that confirmatory evidence in the report.
2). Who can prompt the DIG to say what he said, he is not a constable.

Your premise seems to be that every DIG level officer is an inherently superior creature who will never make a mistake, whereas every constable is a gullible and manipulatable idiot. Would you tell me to "think rationally" or maybe deride me as a modi bhakt if I tell you I have seen some very stupid very senior officers as well as very intelligent, responsible and shrewd constables?
3). If what the DIG had said was false then at least the officers present in the gathering should have raised the objections, if not in that gathering but certainly after that.

I see that you are using reductio ad absurdum to prove your case. But for that to work, the consequent--the other persons present did not call out the DIG on his statement--would actually have to be absurd. But is it so absurd that no one wants to be involved in discussing a classified matter? In fact, not discussing is the correct reaction; IIRC the matter doesn't become unclassified once an officer imprudently chooses to discuss it.

KLNMurthy
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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby KLNMurthy » 18 Feb 2015 23:14

symontk wrote:
Karan M wrote:india has suffered terror & that too from the sea repeatedly from one nation. it is well within its rights to take what measures it deems necessary.


i am not disputing this, but if due to this, all our actions are justified, then I would say we are on a slippery slope

Not all actions but all actions taken in a military situation with proper rules of engagement and chain of command accountability.

It is not very difficult for me to understand the difference, I am surprised you are raising this question.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby KLNMurthy » 18 Feb 2015 23:18

ravip wrote:If what the raksha mantri says is right then how too justify the recent olive branch extended by Modi to Sharif???

Are you asking to be educated about the possible relationship between India's Pakistan policy and the Dec31 incident?

Or are you just indirectly saying the RM lied?

Please clarify.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby vishvak » 18 Feb 2015 23:53

unlike Pakistan we are a functional democracy

This is also why we need to stop wasting time when some terror boat from pakistan is spotted. By analogy, pushing a havildar to face a terrorist - in order to let terrorist prove his totally pure intentions - is not very smart.

We can not let one bit terrorist country throw in a few terrorists across the border, or run a terror boat here & smuggle some drugs over there, or allow some rudali-rona about dead terrorists in international fora, and then also let that decide levels of democracy in India or in other country.

By the way, the pakis have just been quite all the while as if they are some innocent little bystanders who can not be questioned. The pakis don't care about all this after pushing terrorists across as much as we Indians do.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby symontk » 19 Feb 2015 08:29

ravip wrote:No one is condemning the Coast Guard for blowing up the boat,in fact it is good that we were able to neutralize it, but for the way MoD handled the situation.


Exactly!!

it would have been very easy for MoD to say they fired warning shots and the boat got fire. Of course warning shot were fired after non-compliance. Instead they twisted the story to say that they didn't fire, what was the need, who asked them to do that? This is the case of bad advice

DIG was trying to impress his Boss by that speech, back fired literally

I am reminded of a malayalam film where the hero tries to hide the lady visitor's shoes in a fridge being afraid of infidelity charge from her. Wife being wife finds the shoe in minutes. What was the need?

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Nikhil T » 19 Feb 2015 08:40

I think one good thing out of this entire episode will be that the MoD/Home Ministry will learn to stay quiet and not go into too much details when coming out to the media. More details you share, more likely you get entangled in such issues. Had the original statement said something like - "ICG intercepted a suspicious boat and was fired upon. When ICG retaliated the boat caught on fire and no survivors were found due to inclement weather conditions" - there would've been far fewer questions. It is only when the Press Release insinuated a 26/11-like operation that the media went berserk. The original press release & later tweets from RM smacked of bravado (might be well deserved, not commenting upon that), which was unnecessary.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby KLNMurthy » 19 Feb 2015 08:43

symontk wrote:
ravip wrote:No one is condemning the Coast Guard for blowing up the boat,in fact it is good that we were able to neutralize it, but for the way MoD handled the situation.


Exactly!!

it would have been very easy for MoD to say they fired warning shots and the boat got fire. Of course warning shot were fired after non-compliance. Instead they twisted the story to say that they didn't fire, what was the need, who asked them to do that? This is the case of bad advice

DIG was trying to impress his Boss by that speech, back fired literally

I am reminded of a malayalam film where the hero tries to hide the lady visitor's shoes in a fridge being afraid of infidelity charge from her. Wife being wife finds the shoe in minutes. What was the need?


Do we know for a fact that warning shots were fired, other than the shaky conclusion by IE?

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby symontk » 19 Feb 2015 09:01

KLNMurthy wrote:Do we know for a fact that warning shots were fired, other than the shaky conclusion by IE?
All news reports suggest warning shots were fired as per MOD statements. You can ask Google chacha

KLNMurthy wrote:Not all actions but all actions taken in a military situation with proper rules of engagement and chain of command accountability


Yes and that command accountability has come out into open, only thing remaining is ROE. Entire media is going behind that

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby member_28533 » 19 Feb 2015 09:16

vishvak wrote:
unlike Pakistan we are a functional democracy

This is also why we need to stop wasting time when some terror boat from pakistan is spotted. By analogy, pushing a havildar to face a terrorist - in order to let terrorist prove his totally pure intentions - is not very smart.

We can not let one bit terrorist country throw in a few terrorists across the border, or run a terror boat here & smuggle some drugs over there, or allow some rudali-rona about dead terrorists in international fora, and then also let that decide levels of democracy in India or in other country.

By the way, the pakis have just been quite all the while as if they are some innocent little bystanders who can not be questioned. The pakis don't care about all this after pushing terrorists across as much as we Indians do.



BRFites to note that this is sheer psy-ops by the MSM w/ foreign support and inadvertently supported by naive natives.

This is NOT a war that can be won by sheer logic. Even if you make the most coherent, logical, factually sound statement in defense of national interests - there will be an emotive, highly unsubstantiated generalized irrational accusation that will be flung at you from a "universalist" perspective.

Making you sound like a parochial, narrow minded bigot just for protecting national interests.

Any incident could be twisted and re-analyzed, to make nationalists lose face.

End effect is aimed at - a) demoralizing nationalists from strongly backing military action, as military actions will now be treated as "potential to violate universal human rights" b) creating self-doubt in the hearts of armed forces c) trying to put themselves (media+libtards) in a super-exec role of "sanitizing" our armed forces.

But the bottomline is this - These people just WANT to hate nationalists and are only looking for excuses.

The sooner we realize and give up trying to "rationalize" and "convince" them, the better it is.

The best approach perhaps:

(a) CG needs to stop caring and continue to do their job.. blow up a dozen more paki boats if necessary, either on indian or international waters, just to get a raise out of Libtards and their foreign backers that Media doesnt own armed forces.

(b) Send widows and Ex-soldiers, police and other victims of terrorism with amputated limbs, deformed faces to media shows - how would the Libtards and media like their own families to be like them without national defense ? Would they support mass murder of Indians through possible terrorism or would they let armed forces do their job ?

(c) If they persist, pure and simple... ask them to move to Pakistan - a one way ticket provided courtesy of CG.

Sick of this persistent BS in support of "human rights of terrorists" and continuous India==Pakistan nonsensical drivel... now picking up even in BRF.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Sudip » 19 Feb 2015 09:58


Aditya G
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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby Aditya G » 19 Feb 2015 21:16




http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 277796.cms

MUMBAI: After almost 11 hours search operation, the Indian Coast Guard (ICG) ship Agrim commanded by Commandant(JG) Umed Singh's team interdicted Russian flagged Cargo vessel—MV Sevastopol—110 nautical miles (204 km) that tried to escape on Tuesday.

Agrim is a Cochin class FAC #241.

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Re: Indian Coast Guard Discussion

Postby KLNMurthy » 19 Feb 2015 22:18

symontk wrote:
KLNMurthy wrote:Do we know for a fact that warning shots were fired, other than the shaky conclusion by IE?
All news reports suggest warning shots were fired as per MOD statements. You can ask Google chacha


Looks like unreliable second and third hand media reports have overwhelmed the official Defence Ministry statement. I would not take this sloppy "everybody is saying it" as any authoritative standard.

KLNMurthy wrote:Not all actions but all actions taken in a military situation with proper rules of engagement and chain of command accountability


Yes and that command accountability has come out into open, only thing remaining is ROE. Entire media is going behind that

IIRC Rules of Engagement need not be made public, they can be classified.

I think a lot of the trouble is coming due to GOI going out of its way to overshare with media, instead of controlling the flow of information.


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