Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

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Viv S
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Re: Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Viv S » 15 Jul 2011 01:36

abhik wrote:
Gaur wrote:Naval blockade tantamount to declaring war. No, I don't mean figuratively. Legally Naval Blockade = Declaration of War.

Having said that, this fact is sometimes ignored when war isn't desired. Case in point, Cuban Missile Crisis.

Of course on the other hand state sponsored terrorist strikes on the parliament, civilians and military installations tantamount to declaration of waaa.. I mean piss and love only.


I believe you've misinterpreted his point. He wasn't talking about the morality of the action. What he said is quite simple, to enforce a blockade is to make war, its not an alternative to war. There may be a very valid justification for going to war no doubt, but the idea that a confrontation can be localised to the region off Karachi and Gwadar is flawed.

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Re: Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby himanshugoswami » 15 Jul 2011 10:27

Rahul M wrote:
himanshugoswami wrote:Actually, IN did implement a COMPLETE blockade of Karachi harbour during the Kargil war- one of the main reasons for Mian sharif to go running to papa Bill.

no, they were ready to do so. there's a difference.

btw, I vividly remember a sequence on star-news during op parakram

News Presenter : Indian Navy spokesperson has declared that its forces are fully mobilized and ready to tackle any eventuality on the western seaboard.
(very next piece of news)
News Presenter : In other news, Pakistan navy admiral so-and-so suffered a cardiac arrest and is hospitalized.



Sorry my friend, but I have to disagree. Everything that comes on the news is not accurate.

I am stating this with a fair degree of certainty that IN did enforce a blockade of Karachi harbour and at the forefront were a few Indian subs. I can give you the names of most vessels as well, but not on an open forum. PM me if interested.

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby HarshS » 15 Jul 2011 12:12

1653: The Saudi crew has deserted its ship; they’re in boats pulling away.

1655: The limpet mines on board the Pakistani ship detonates. There’s a fireball and the ship vanishes. India’s blockade has claimed its first victim.

1656. Pakistani air force fighters reach missile launch range; informed about the destruction of the Pakistani ship, they execute a well-planned operation. All of them fire off their Exocet missiles aimed at only one target: the rearmost Indian warship—INS Rajput.

1658: The IN and IAF fighters launch air-to-air missiles at the Pakistani air force which is fleeing back to Pakistan with afterburners lift.

1700: All IN ships in the area go into missile defense mode: Kashtan guns; SAMs are ripple launched across the flotilla targeting the incoming Exocets. Out of ten missile, eight are shot down.

1702: Two missiles hit INS Rajput—one after another. The ship staggers; comes to a stop; and in both ends bursts into flame. Ten minutes later, the ship will sink; carrying with it the bodies of 200 of the 250 officers and men. Pakistan has avenged the loss of its merchant ship; and to in a horrible way.

1703: All Pakistani planes are blasted out of the sky: a small consolation for the loss of INS Rajput.

1704: The Saudi sailors are picked up by the Indian submarine; which also dispatches two more boats to the abandoned ship.

1705: The three Pakistani warships reach firing range to attack the Indian fleet. However, all of them receive messages on radio: “Pakistan navy ships: if you take any offensive action; you will be sunk. You are facing overwhelming force of guns, missiles, and torpedoes. However, if you return to Pakistani waters, you will not be harmed, as per the Government’s declaration.

1706: The Pakistani captains chatter with each other. They also confer with their superiors. The Pakistani top brass order: attack, or be shot for cowardice, if you return.

1708: Again, all three Pakistani ships open concentrated fire, at the second-last (now last, after INS Rajput) ship in the line: INS Godavri. The frigate is hit, but not mortally. 40 sailors and officers die.

1710: The Indian Navy hits back, but with a plan: Guns open fire at the three Pakistani ships—this is the first gun-battle between two opposing fleets after Leyte Gulf (B-R navy aficionados—please confirm).

1711: All three Pakistani ships are damaged, but in their bows only. The engines are intact, but they’re holed and their bows are damaged. The combined loss of men is over 100.

1712: The Pakistani ships stop fire; their guns are all damaged. The Indian Navy radios them: you are free to proceed to Karachi. If you take one more offensive action, you’ll all be sunk.

1715: All three ships, on fire, and moving slowly, head to Karachi.

1720: IN sailors take charge of the abandoned Saudi ship. That ship is sailed to Kandla under naval escort. Later, India tells an outraged Saudi Arabia that it can buy the empty hull back at whatever is the value in international salvage court—since they’d abandoned it, it’s legitimate prize of war. However, given the long-standing Indian relations, a 15 percent discount will be given on the assessed value.

2000: The three damaged Pakistani ships reach Karachi. They’re berthed for repairs. The Indian Navy is happy: all has gone to plan. Three valuable berths in the naval base have been taken up by damaged ships, which will take weeks to repair. Three other ships have to sail out; making the harbor still more crowded.

2030: The crew of all the remaining merchant ships berthed in Pakistan refuse to sail. Seeing the loss of both ships that had left, they know that India means business—it will enforce the blockade, even if it means the loss of its own ships and men.

2035. Two of the four merchant ships that were about to enter Pakistani territorial waters turn back. Their owners warn them to do so, saying that they don’t want to see their names put on the “shipstobesunk.in” list.

The first day’s honors are in some sense in Pakistan’s favor. It has lost one merchant ship, and five planes, to a destroyer.
However, India has made its point.

And the blockade will continue.

And, so will I, but on Monday—away for a weekend retreat on work. So, enjoy till then.

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Shrinivasan » 15 Jul 2011 18:41

Can Paki F-16s carry Exocet anti-Ship missiles? I thought they were to be carried ONLY by larger platforms like PC3 Onions?

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby aniket » 15 Jul 2011 19:22

Valid point.

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby aniket » 15 Jul 2011 19:34

According to some reports the Japanese and the Taiwanese have modified their F-16's to carry the Harpoon missile
Also the F-16 Block 50 can carry the AGM-84 Harpoon anti shipping missile.The aircraft can launch the Harpoon in line-of-sight, bearing-only, and range/bearing modes. The addition of the Harpoon gives the F-16 a significant standoff range anti-shipping capability, especially when combined with optional 600-gallon fuel tanks.

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Singh » 15 Jul 2011 19:50

HarshS wrote:1640: A IN Seaking flies up to these ships; above it three IAF planes form a CAP over it. The Seaking flies between the two, and it gives the two ships a visual (by light through Morse); radio; and finally by loudspeaker. “Please evacuate this ship in ten minutes; you’ll be sunk after that, and we cannot guarantee your safety. If you evacuate, you’ll be picked up.”


Question to fellow readers: should the Paki or the Saudi ship be sunk?


Mind blowing stuff maite... Was almost on d verge of my seat with anticipation... Glad u sealed their fate in the next post otherwise i might jst have fallen off. I swear I could almost hear the background music too!!!!
The only problem is that you kinda broke my handle on reality

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby nachiket » 15 Jul 2011 22:44

1. What guns are the IN and PN supposed to be using? Each ship only has a single deck gun. Why would they use them when they are armed with anti-ship missiles? This is not a WW2 battle.

2. If the pakis sink INS Rajput, why will the IN allow the three damaged PN warships to leave, so that they can refit and return to battle later on?

Stuff needs to make sense.

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby abhinavjo » 15 Jul 2011 22:55

^^
The IN's plan seems to be to pressure Pakistan not by sinking its ships but by choking their sea based economy by cluttering the harbor with enough damaged ships so no new ships can come and de-board any cargo.

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby jamwal » 16 Jul 2011 23:15

Kind of agree with Nachiket here.

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Bala Vignesh » 16 Jul 2011 23:35

Nachiket miyan,
Its fiction.. We can accept light sabres and intergalactic wars but nit pick for a naval gun battle using 30mm guns.. Let HarshS have some creative freedom..

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Aftermath of the sinking

Postby HarshS » 18 Jul 2011 09:39

The morning of the fleet’s departure for hostile waters, the wife of the Naval Chief accompanied by the wife of the C-in-C of the Western Naval Command had met the wives of the officers and sailors—ship-by-ship—at the sprawling Western Naval Command Mess. There, they’d patiently answered the questions of the wives; admitting that they didn’t know how long their men would be at sea. They’d also warned that the fleet was sailing to battle, so causalities were to be expected. However, they reassured them that the Navy would take care of its own. A helpline was announced for counseling wives who were worried.

The sinking of INS Rajput and the damage of INS Godavari, resulting in the deaths of 220 brave warriors sent shockwaves throughout Navy Nagar. A somber-faced Defense Minister read out the names of the dead men on TV. Within an hour of the loss, the CNS and his wife flew to Mumbai in a special aircraft, and then by helicopter to INS Shikra, the naval air station in Colaba. The C-in-C and his wife, and the CNS and his wife, split into four and spent the next eight hours—all the way to 0700 going house-to-house consoling each family, especially for the fact that for many, they would not have the privilege of seeing the bodies of their loved ones, since all those who had died were at sea. They offered both solace and immediate money, as well as briefing them about the Navy’s special and enhanced compensation package.

At 0700, the two exhausted senior officers went to the Naval War Room deep inside INS Angre (headquarters of the WNC) and reviewed the status of the fleet. They conferred with the Fleet Commander, who told them that there was great despondency across the fleet in letting the three Pakistani ships sail away damaged, but not sunk.

Reacting to this, the CNS decided to immediately fly out to the fleet flagship INS Viraat—he tried to nap on board the noisy helicopter. As soon as he arrived, he went straight into the wardroom to address the captains of each of the ships to answer the queries. After that, through encrypted radio, he also spoke to each of the ships of the fleet who’s crew were addressed by simultaneous PA systems. He explained the rationale of the navy’s strategy; complimented them on their forbearance; explained the package offered to the families of their dead compatriots; and warned them, that further losses could be expected, before Pakistan’s economy was starved into submission.

The CNS had answered all questions clearly, except one. The captain of INS Veer, a missile corvette, and thus a relatively junior officer, had looked at the shipstobesunk.in list, and asked: “We sank a Saudi-flagged ship, and seemed to have got away. However, one of the ships on that list, MV Aberdeen is a UK-flagged ship. If it sails, and crosses the 12-mile limit, will we also sink it? If so, will we be expected to fight the Royal Navy, in return, especially if their two frigates in the Gulf come out to escort it?”

The other officers had laughed. The Royal Navy’s surface fleet was so few and far deployed that it was not a threat to the Western fleet. But the CNS knew that right now n the Indian Ocean was also a nuclear attack submarine, HMS Vengeance, which was quite likely to sink INS Viraat, and get away with it, if ordered to by London.

After a short rest, and a light lunch, the CNS returned to Kandla, where a flight took him to Delhi, where he’d asked for an urgent meeting of the Cabinet Committee on Security to discuss what do if the British-flagged ship sailed out of Karachi. There was also one Italian ship and six Chinese ships. With the Saudis, India had got lucky: what about these ships and their crew?

To be continued …

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Bala Vignesh » 18 Jul 2011 10:36

well this is my take on the situation. If we let the brit, italian or the chinese ships leave the port unharmed, then the saudis will eat us alive for sinking their ship, whereas if we can work out an arrangement where they act like they surrender and we escort the ship to our port and let it leave after the appropriate amount has been paid by the respective governments, these ships can sail away unscathed. And we don't lose our faces.
BTW are you sure we sunk the saudi ship, didn't the crew surrender and the ship towed away to our port???

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Shrinivasan » 18 Jul 2011 10:41

Bala Vignesh wrote:well this is my take on the situation. If we let the brit, italian or the chinese ships leave the port unharmed, then the saudis will eat us alive for sinking their ship, whereas if we can work out an arrangement where they act like they surrender and we escort the ship to our port and let it leave after the appropriate amount has been paid by the respective governments, these ships can sail away unscathed. And we don't lose our faces.
BTW are you sure we sunk the saudi ship, didn't the crew surrender and the ship towed away to our port???

WE sank the Paki ship and disabled the Saudi ship, this was abandoned later, towed by IN to an Indian Port.

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Khalsa » 18 Jul 2011 13:18

I am sorry to crash but where on earth is synergetic effect out of this.
In Kargil, Navy almost blockaded Karachi. Jaguar IM were seconded to Navy. Army from Indira Col to Gujrat was in tune with Navy was thinking and vice versa.

I love your scenario but the fact is that Navy going and being sent out to fight by itself is never going to happen. We fight as one. All forces punch together as one. That is the overwhelming effect that Pakis know and are shit scared about.

One force fighting it out byitself without co-ordinating it with the others is what the other side does ... aka Paki Army in Kargil without PAF or PN or the Govt evern

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Bala Vignesh » 18 Jul 2011 13:26

Khalsa ji,
IAF is providing CAP over the flotilla. Don't know what the army is doing though. But the intention here is not fight but force them into submission by crippling their economy, if i am right.

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Gurinder P » 18 Jul 2011 16:02

The blockade makes no sense at all. If ships can go in without being harmed, Pakistan can still function as food and Oil are only needed to keep the PAK DEF operating, whats to stop Karachi Port Authority from freeing up Docks to unload oil, foods etc, and telling the ships to sod off and anchor outside or risk going through the Indian ships.

Wait, is the Indian Navy only going to harass PN vessels and Oil Tankers? Thereby scaring off oil exporters?

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Shrinivasan » 18 Jul 2011 19:30

Khalsa wrote:I am sorry to crash but where on earth is synergetic effect out of this.
In Kargil, Navy almost blockaded Karachi. Jaguar IM were seconded to Navy. Army from Indira Col to Gujrat was in tune with Navy was thinking and vice versa.

You have a point... I think Harsha has not yet expanded the scenario to cover those..
Harsha: Could you add elements of Army reinforcing border positions, relieving BSF elements of mainline duties. positioning of Artillery and MBRLs. UAV flights by Army for assessment. Forward positioning of other assets...
Airforce moving fighter detachments to forward bases. activation of ALGs, moving ordnance to forward bases.
CANCALLATION OF ALL LEAVE AND INSTRUCTION TO PROCEED TO BASE STATIONS.

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The mood inside Pakistan

Postby HarshS » 19 Jul 2011 15:40

Meanwhile in Karachi, there was celebration at the sinking of INS Rajput and the damage to INS Godavari. The “escape” of the three damaged warships was also made much off—their captains were felicitated for their daring (earlier threats of execution for treason forgotten).

However, across the port city, crews of merchant ships reacted with disquiet. They knew of the loss of the Pakistani flagged ship and the abandonment of the Saudi-ship. Emails and yes, faxes, were exchanged between ship owners and masters. Should they sail? Messages were sent to the Defense Minister and the Naval Headquarters, asking for protection from the Indian fleet.

The most harassed was the harbor master of Karachi. He had no more berths, but two ships had entered late last night and were waiting to discharge their cargo; two more ships had come earlier in the afternoon. His naval counterpart also had to do deft juggling. Three warships had moved out to the outer roads to make way for the damaged ships. Two more warships were fueled, victualed, and armed, and told to move out to nine nautical miles; two of the three summarily-ejected warships were bought back inside.

The commercial enterprises that had contracted the inbound cargo from the two ships awaiting berths began to ask about when their cargo would come. No new cargo was coming in; all the cargo to be exported was already loaded.

Pakistan’s National Security Council met in urgent session. Should they wait for a few more days for the Indians to “tire” of the blockade—after all it was difficult to maintain such a large fleet at sea continuously? Should they egg their Saudi compatriots to in-turn stop selling crude to India? Should they deliberately send out their foreign-flagged ships, hoping that these would be either sunk—and thus India dragged into a war with other mightier powers—or allowed to go, and thus exposing India’s weakness? Should the Pakistani navy backed by the air force asked to go out and fight so that the Sea Lanes of Commerce were kept open?

This meeting was inconclusive. It was felt that no action was needed now. Ships were still coming in. If merchantmen refused to sail to sea; they would be asked to vacate their berths and wait in the outer roads. To back up the harbor master’s authority, it was decided that those ships that refused to empty their berths, would have their fuel and water cut.

Compliance with India’s demands to hand over terrorists and shut down camps wasn’t even thought of as an option by Pakistan’s supremos.

Late that night, four Pakistani flagged ships sailed out of the harbor and waited.

IN strategists told the CNS that this clutch of old warship and old merchantment would be an excellent target for an air attack. All could be easily sunk, and by doing so, would choke Karachi harbor almost totally. Armchair warriors following this on some forums on the Internet also saw this as the next step for India.

The official strategists were told to keep their own counsel. India would not go inside Pakistan’s 12-mile limit; and no offensive air attacks would be made against any target. Patience was the watchword, as India had to outlast their foes, so that Pakistan would blink first, and accede to India’s demands.

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Ajit.C » 26 Jul 2011 16:57

looks like another of our scenario writer have hit the WRITER'S BLOCK. :twisted:

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby silod » 29 Jul 2011 12:26

Harsh Ji,

Kya hua? You were writing this piece nicely, why this sudden break???????

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Yogi_G » 30 Jul 2011 14:53

Dang, for the first time I began reading a fiction story on BR and reached an interesting position and then it stopped all of a sudden. :((

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby Bala Vignesh » 30 Jul 2011 15:37

The story of BR.. The scenario starts and goes onto pick up full steam and then out of the blue just screeches to a halt...

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Re: Fiction : Naval blockade of Pakistan

Postby silod » 01 Aug 2011 15:13

Koi Harsh Ji ka pata lagao.... Hope he has not been abducted by Pakistanis........ :rotfl:


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