Indian Army: News and Discussions 15 Apr 2012

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 11 May 2013 07:13

they are mil version, must be lighter

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 11 May 2013 14:35

This is what comes of appointing rank amateurs to "study" stategy.

http://www.dnaindia.com/india/1832258/r ... manoeuvres

dna Special: Government calls bluff on army's Ladakh manoeuvres
Thursday, May 9, 2013, 10:30 IST | Place: New Delhi | Agency: DNA
Manan Kumar

National security establishment sees red as troops built bunkers, started aggressive border patrolling in Chumar sector but gave inaccurate details of manoeuvres.

The border face-off between India and China seems to have cooled for now but there is considerable anger within the government against the army for giving inaccurate details regarding Chumar sector in Ladakh.

The army had built bunkers and started undertaking aggressive border patrolling in Chumar in early April, according to highly placed sources. This had prompted China to play it off in Daulat Beg Oldi sector in the north of Chumar by undertaking a 19 kilometers incursion inside the Indian territory and pitching tents in Rakinala.

Top sources revealed that the high-level China Study Group (CSG) — consisting of national security advisor Shiv Shankar Menon, cabinet secretary Ajit Seth, defence secretary Shashikant Sharma, home secretary RK Singh and top heads of the central security agencies — took a very dim view of the army giving an inaccurate picture of its manoeuvres in Chumar.

When the CSG sat down to take stock of the Chinese incursion on April 15, the army had apparently said that it had only set up some makeshift shelters in Chumar sector to take care of its troops in times of need.

Within the next couple of days, the CSG gathered evidence about the army’s actual position from independent sources and confirmed it with the agencies. The information proved that the army had given inaccurate information and was building bunkers that were not in line with the 2005 Border Patrol protocol singed by the two countries. On being asked by dna, the army denied having undertaken construction of any bunkers or intensifying patrolling in Chumar sector.

The episode has prompted the CSG to take a strong view of maintaining the independence of the ITBP and not to handover its operational control to the army.

Sources said that the army had undertaken construction of seven bunkers of which one had already been built and earthwork of four others had finished when China flexed its muscles in Daulat Beg Oldi sector. This sector is strategically important from Indian perspective as it overlooks the Karakoram highway.

By positioning themselves in Rakinala, the Chinese prevented Indian forces from patrolling to at least for patrol points along the Line of Actual Control, just as Indian manoeuvre in Chumar had prevented the Chinese from entering into disputed areas of Eastern Ladakh, which it considers its own.

Sources told dna that when the CSG discussed Chinese incursion in Daulat Beg Oldi Sector on April 15, it asked the army to suspend the visit of its delegation to China to finalise the proposed joint counter terrorism exercise in October later this year.

However, top officials of the army later met the NSA and surprisingly the decision was overturned and the delegation went ahead with its visit to China on April 18.

The unsavoury face-off between the two countries has prompted India to re-look at China’s offer to rework the 2005 border protocol and may seek to redraft in the near future.

Hilariously, the Foreign Secretary, Defence Secretary, and Cabinet Secretary, and DG ITBP etc are described as the "national security establishment", while the Army is seen as something outside it! This country is doomed.

vic · Post by **vic** » 11 May 2013 15:19

Blame the army for your own cowardice

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 11 May 2013 16:17

There is a political decision since 2000 that we wont engage in a fight or would get provoked to fight ....its not cowardice or any thing but a political decision.

From top leadership since ABV time they have stated on many occasion that India will not fight against Pakistan or China ...but issues will be resolved diplomatically if required involving big players like US.

We just need to guard our borders as a matter of deterrent which works in most circumstances and for IS issue we will just absorb hits and move on.

War is not a choice or option for us on the table so accept it and move on , our top political leadership has been consistent about it both in words and deeds

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 11 May 2013 17:39

koti wrote:Is this mentioned before??
Army to replace Maruti Gypsy

Mahindra Scorpio, Tata Safari to replace Maruti Gypsy in Indian Army

vic · Post by **vic** » 11 May 2013 18:10

Great, we will not fight any war, just import and import and import to generate bribes & kill domestic defense production.

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 11 May 2013 18:20

i think you are used to that statement so much that you forgot both are indian company

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 11 May 2013 18:26

^^^
Do not underestimate them. What if they want to procure Mahindra Whatever from Spain

vic · Post by **vic** » 11 May 2013 21:10

I was referring to Austin comment

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 11 May 2013 21:12

vic wrote:Great, we will not fight any war, just import and import and import to generate bribes & kill domestic defense production.

I Agree by and large , My only submission is bribes would be taken no matter if its imported or domestic production.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 12 May 2013 07:59

Austin says

I Agree by and large , My only submission is bribes would be taken no matter if its imported or domestic production.

true with the only saving grace being that the money stays inside and more benefits to local economy

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 12 May 2013 08:45

Money stays inside , not sure that is true because they might want to stash it up in Swiss Bank or make the black money white by pumping in local economy...that has its own downside because you end up pushing up prices like the case it happens in property markets in India ,encouraging more bribe takers and bribe givers and ending up building a parallel black economy..... bottom line is corruption both local and phoren end up eating our society like cancer all at the cost of common citizen and tax payers.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 12 May 2013 18:42

I meant the actual production in the local economy

the bribes per se maybe - maybe not or partly

no disagreements with the rest

pentaiah · Post by **pentaiah** » 12 May 2013 20:36

Maruti gypsy is very inconvenient to go shopping trips and has little cargo space to stack the purchases of memsaabs

Better if Scorpio or Tata Safari

I have seen 10 wheeler 4x4 4.5 ton vehicles used as school buses by IA to drop kids in kendriya viidyalaya AOC and EME do that.

I think 6 months fuel costs for these trips is enough to by Swaraj Mazda school buses instead.

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 13 May 2013 01:54

^^

Listen, @ss, if this is what you think of the armed forces, why dont you just stay off this forum?

member_24146 · Post by **member_24146** » 13 May 2013 13:23

Army's Dhruv crashes at Siachen, both pilots safe

An Army helicopter, on air maintenance operations, crashed this morning in the icy heights of Siachen glacier but both the pilots survived the accident and were being evacuated for treatment, army sources said.

The advanced light helicopter (ALH) 'Dhruv', flown by two pilots of the Army Aviation Squadron, crashed in the northern glacier at around 8:00am., the sources said.

They said of the two pilots, one had fallen into a crevasse on the glacier and was being moved to safety. The other pilot has suffered minor cuts, the sources said.

"Both the pilots are safe and are being evacuated for further treatment," they said

The Dhruv ALH Mark III, of the Army Aviation Squadron, had taken off from Leh this morning for Siachen as part of air maintenance operations, the sources said.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 13 May 2013 21:11

Thank god they are safe.

pentaiah · Post by **pentaiah** » 14 May 2013 01:20

ASPuar wrote:^^

Listen, @ss, if this is what you think of the armed forces, why dont you just stay off this forum?

Sorry for the delay AS$puar
I consider it a honor to be so called when you carry the same epithets in your name and I concede you are far superior to me in those OLQ.

It is as much derelection of duty if you ignore what is going on in the forces.

I have not said anything that is new or not going on. I myself as a kid went on such excursion (incursion)trips from Opel staff cars to Landmaster to Ambassadors.

Yes Tata and Scorpios would more comfortable and are good ass_ets, the expertise in those matters is wholly yours I concede.,

member_26622 · Post by **member_26622** » 14 May 2013 02:24

Tata Safari spiced up with LandRover cross terrain tech can turn out to be a top choice. The Chinese will turn green with envy if they see Indian troops rolling around in landrovers

This will be a good incentive for Tata's to set up a LandRover manufacturing facility in India for export to rest of Asia. And we have already bought the technology in this case!

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 14 May 2013 07:49

Dhruv's better crash resistance seems to have made the difference

phew

jai · Post by **jai** » 14 May 2013 10:08

nik wrote:Tata Safari spiced up with LandRover cross terrain tech can turn out to be a top choice. The Chinese will turn green with envy if they see Indian troops rolling around in landrovers

This will be a good incentive for Tata's to set up a LandRover manufacturing facility in India for export to rest of Asia. And we have already bought the technology in this case!

Land Rover Defender would be top choice - its going to be launched in the Indian market and made in India by next year as per the industry buzz. IA ran extensive trials last few years with Axe types - wonder what came out of it.

archan · Post by **archan** » 14 May 2013 20:24

ASPuar wrote:^^

Listen, @ss, if this is what you think of the armed forces, why dont you just stay off this forum?

Your 12 years with a clean record means you don't get official warning this time but this kind of behavior will earn you a few in the future.
pentaiah, this is about IA news and discussions and it is expected that the news be of relevance to military matters. The rants can go in the whines thread instead. Considering that you have tried to re-register for the forum yet again with another pseudonym, this forum does not need you anymore.

Vipul · Post by **Vipul** » 18 May 2013 16:50

Army blames DoT for delays in Defence cable network.

The Directorate-General of Signals at the Army headquarters has raised concerns over the delay in laying the Defence optical fibre cable network.

The cable network was part of an agreement signed between the Department of Telecom and the Ministry of Defence signed in 2009. Under this deal, the DoT had promised to build an exclusive cable network for the Defence forces in return for vacating spectrum.

Since then the Defence has released 40 MHz of spectrum for mobile operators but the cable network is no where near being rolled out. The tender for laying the network has been cancelled thrice. In a communications to the DoT, Lt Gen S P Kochhar, Signal Officer-In-Chief & Senior Colonel Commandant said, “The project was approved by the cabinet Committee on Infrastructure on December 3, 2009, with a mandate to roll out the Defence network in 36 months. However 40 months down the line, there is no progress.”

“Post release of 40 MHz of spectrum by the Ministry of Defence, critical communication has been affected,” the letter stated.

Procedural delays and a flawed tendering process have pushed back the Rs 7,000-crore optical fibre project for the Defence forces.

Bharat Sanchar Nigam Ltd was entrusted to roll out this cable system aimed at connecting key installations of the armed forces. But the company has not been able to close the tender for procuring the optical cable. BSNL had floated the tender initially in January 2010 but this was cancelled. A fresh tender was brought out in November 2012, which has also been cancelled.

As many as 14 top companies, including L&T, Sterlite and Punj Lloyd, had expressed interest in this turnkey project, which involves laying optical cable across 57,000 route km. The network will connect 129 Army, 162 Air Force and 33 Navy installations. The Government has already earmarked $3 billion for the project.

While this agreement was important in 2009 when DoT did not have spectrum to allocate, now there is no urgency post the 2G licence cancellation. The DoT has excess spectrum now with not many takers in the last auction. The question now is whether it needs the spectrum owned by the Defence anymore.

According to the letter from Kochhar, the Telecom Ministry is delaying the project on grounds that some part of it should be reserved for state owned Indian Telephone Industries when in 2010 it was decided that quota will not apply to defence network.

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 20 May 2013 01:56

After A Successful Start On Twitter, Indian Army Joins Facebook

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 22 May 2013 05:54

From Times Of India: Finance ministry nod likely for new Army unit along China border

NEW DELHI: The finance ministry is expected to soon approve the revised proposal of the Army to raise a mountain strike corps along the China border. Once the ministry's approval comes through the Cabinet Committee on Security will give its nod, a senior source said.

The ministry of defence (MoD) is not expecting any further objections from the finance ministry over the ambitious proposal to raise a dedicated offensive capability in the north-east border with China.

According to sources, the strike corps is expected to cost Rs 62,000 crore spread over the entire 12th five-year Plan (2012- 17).

The Army has proposed a mountain strike corps, two independent infantry brigades and two independent armoured brigades to plug its operational gaps along the entire Line of Actual Control (LAC) with China, as well as to acquire offensive capabilities.

India started the catch-up game with the Chinese military and infrastructural capabilities only in the past decade, and is now furiously working to find some kind of parity with Beijing. The mountain strike corps would be a significant step towards that bid, a senior official said.

The raising of the new formations will together cost over Rs 81,000 crore over the 12th Plan period. However, some parts of the entire build up — especially the independent brigades — will spill over into the 13th Plan as well.

The proposed mountain strike corps, with over 40,000 soldiers and headquartered at Panagarh in West Bengal, will for the first time give India the capability to also launch offensive action into Tibet Autonomous Region (TAR) in the event of a Chinese attack. The corps will have two high-altitude divisions for rapid reaction.

India has already raised two new infantry divisions at Lekhapani and Missamari in Assam in 2009-10. They are operationally tasked to defend Arunachal Pradesh.

India is also beefing up its missile and fighter capabilities along the China border in its desperate effort to catch up with a burgeoning People's Liberation Army's military capabilities and highly developed infrastructure up to the border.

The proposal for raising India's first mountain strike corps has been hanging fire for the past few years. The finance ministry has in the past returned the file to the MoD objecting to the huge financial commitments.

Even as India plays catch up, China has built aggressive military and infrastructure capabilities. It has at least five fully-operational airbases, an extensive rail network and over 58,000-km of roads along the Indian border. This would allow China to move over 30 divisions (each with over 15,000 soldiers) to the LAC, outnumbering Indian forces by at least 3:1 there.

maitya · Post by **maitya** » 22 May 2013 10:36

VinodTK wrote:From Times Of India: Finance ministry nod likely for new Army unit along China border
NEW DELHI: The finance ministry is expected to soon approve the revised proposal of the Army to raise a mountain strike corps along the China border. Once the ministry's approval comes through the Cabinet Committee on Security will give its nod, a senior source said.
...
The Army has proposed a mountain strike corps, two independent infantry brigades and two independent armoured brigades to plug its operational gaps along the entire Line of Actual Control (LAC) with China, as well as to acquire offensive capabilities.
...

All fine and dandy - but what exactly will these "Independent" Infantry Brigades and Armored Brigades will be supported with?

Independent Infantry brigades without required multi-layer embedded Artillery elements are of limited use, IMHO.
Shouldn't each of these Infantry brigades have, in their direct operational command, a multi-layered SMERCH-Pinaka-towed 155 mm artillery (M777) regiments providing the required artillery support.
And given the self-imposed limited mobility constraints on our side shouldn't these regiments be embedded at the battalion level?
And at the division level, shouldn't there be an element of "flying" support as well - a regiment of weaponised and a regiment of non-weaponised ALH would nicely complement it as wholesome "Independent" fighting unit.

Similarly the independence of these Armored Brigades are really applicable when they are supplemented with again multi-layered Artillery Support (as in the case of Infantry Brigades) plus an element of air-defense elements (more so, since these Armored Brigades will have limited mobility elbow-room due to the nature of their operational terrain).
Which also begs a question, why this limited mobility constraint can't be mitigated by supplanting them with "flying artillery" of 2-3 regiments of LCHs. And since there's an element of "strategic" nature to Armored Brigades (compared to Infantry Brigades), shouldn't they have operational command on Prahar type missile regiments embedded as well.

Or is it just another attempt to throw bodies to solve an issue or worse, pretend to solve an issue. If the intent is to have offensive formations, then why do we try and constrain ourselves by just increasing body-count in guise of raising (I) Infantry Brigades.
Yes it will be costly, but if we can't afford it, why pretend to do so something in-effective in the first place.

Rohitvatsji, pls weigh in.

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 22 May 2013 14:35

archan wrote: Your 12 years with a clean record means you don't get official warning this time but this kind of behavior will earn you a few in the future.
pentaiah, this is about IA news and discussions and it is expected that the news be of relevance to military matters. The rants can go in the whines thread instead. Considering that you have tried to re-register for the forum yet again with another pseudonym, this forum does not need you anymore.

You'd have done better to just delete the offending post, and mine along with it. If irrelevant and deliberately provocative posts are left hanging about, then eventually someone will get provoked, as I regrettably did.

member_22906 · Post by **member_22906** » 22 May 2013 21:17

Ofcourse it would be great to have LCH and all the bells and whistles, but you need to consider the cost of acquiring them at an Independent Inf or Armd Bde level. What is really important is to know if the Corps and Command Level resources can be deployed quickly and seamlessly when needed by some of these independent formations

Typically an independent Inf Bde has an Arty Regt as part of its Orbat. What are really effective in mountains are (surprisingly to many) Heavy Mortars since they can take out enemy positions hiding behind the mountains due to the trajectory of the mortar shells. Therefore, these formations may require specialized equipment to operate and strike in high altitude.

In any case, we can't say with certainty (based on the limited info we have today) whether these formation will or will not get M777. It says that the raising/equiping of these independent formations will go beyond the current 5 year plan. So for all you know, you may get some of your wishlist then

member_23455 · Post by **member_23455** » 22 May 2013 21:49

In a perverse way our pathetic road infrastructure vis-a-vis China makes US style Airmobile/Air Assault army formations highly attractive and in many ways inevitable.

Also, Colonel and Brigadier level officers are getting further exposed through exercises like Yudh Abhyas 2013 to how these formations are equipped, trained and fight (beyond the CI ops for PR consumption). These chaps are tomorrow's ARTRAC brains trust and Army commanders.

I can just imagine the fit the IAF's going to have when the Army casts a coveting eye at their Chinooks.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 22 May 2013 22:08

army should go in for its own fleet of chinooks.

big problems demand big solutions.

member_26965 · Post by **member_26965** » 23 May 2013 12:10

Tattoos are so common in villages. After officer shortage, they might have jawan shortage.

http://isikkim.com/2013-5-200-candidate ... outs-10-1/

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 23 May 2013 14:59

It isn't exactly news, but I liked this article:

Ode to the army man

“Hey you know, yesterday another army man died and another was injured at the border, fighting some insurgents,” I said.

“Ya things keep happening there everyday.”

I was frankly quite shocked at this remark. I never expected such casual attitude towards that man who laid down his life so we could live fearlessly. So we could travel in Metros and crib about all the ‘unnecessary’ security checks. So we could have a fun weekend at the mall with our kids. So another 26/11 would not happen.

I wonder where have we become so insensitive?

My first memory of an army man came from the ’84 riots. My city, Ranchi had been burning for a day now. Literally burning. From our terrace we could see smoke arising from all corners of the small city that Ranchi was then. We could even guess if now it was Bhatia sports shop up in flames or the Punjabi Sweet shop. At the tender age of ten, I did not quite understand the hatred. I could not figure out why our downstairs Sikh neighbours were fraught with worry. A widow, the aunty lived with her two sons in the ground floor house. Not the safest house in our building if any attackers decided to enter our relatively quiet colony.

Just a day ago I had been crying for Indira Gandhi. She had been my hero. I had wanted to be as charismatic as her. My world seemed to be in a chaos.

The rampage went on the entire day and well into the night. Finally army was called in to control the situation. Sec 144 (curfew) was declared all over the city – even in our calm colony that had thankfully been unaffected by the rioting. We came to know what it was like being cooped inside the house day in and day out. Those days we had no TV either!

Army men were posted in most corners of the colony. Our building was on the main crossroads with a small security checkpost. A single army man was dropped off there.

I remember hiding behind our balcony wall and watching him. Green army fatigues, boots, a cap and a machine gun. He looked a bit scary infact. While my brother and I just watched, other kids, boys, started playing with their toy machine guns. Aiming it at the man and going rut tut tut, the fake sound the toys make. Yet the man did not even flinch from his place. His stood there quietly, alone in the sun, always watchful always alert, always the gun on his shoulder within reach.

But something bothered our parents. The man had been there since before we woke up and now it was well into the afternoon. He hadn’t had anything to eat or drink. Out of humanity or respect, my mother put some tea in a flask and sent the tea and some biscuits with me and my brother.

Still somewhat scared I hid behind the bushes and called out, “Uncle”

I tried to give him the goods but he ardently refused and warned us to go back inside. When even at night there was no sign of food for him, we were sent again. This time I felt bolder and insisted a little. His face didn’t look as scary as his uniform. He was like any other uncle. This time I think he accepted the flask, but no biscuits.

Slowly he became a friend to us kids. He even allowed us to play outside, but behind the building.

“But if you see the truck coming, hide yourselves,” he told us benevolently.

The curfew lifted in some days and the man was gone. I never saw him again. But that image of him guarding us day and night while we slept peacefully is stuck in my mind. For me he had restored peace in my little world. It turned into a respect that I cherish within my heart everyday. Every army man reminds me of his dedication and strength.

Let us not be so insensitive. Yes, things keep happening and soldiers keep dying at the border – but do we think the same when civilians are killed in terrorist attacks all over the country? No we remember dates 9/11, 26/11, we hold candle marches, we make human chains! For an army man or woman each day is a date. Let us learn to atleast respect that commitment they take just for us to live on our daily lives.

Courtesy;shwetasheel. via Army Wife: Loving A Soldier

member_22906 · Post by **member_22906** » 23 May 2013 22:28

A very touching and apt article, Jamwal. Thanks...

Unfortunately, the lack of gratitude and respect is prevalent (sadly) on this forum also...

nits · Post by **nits** » 24 May 2013 12:34

Jamwal - Really a great article... we don't have that respect for our Amred Forces and does not care if they die; max of janta think they are recruited for that and its part of there Duty...

2 Days back when a solider was beheaded in UK; the UK PM was on a foreign tour and he left his tour and came back to take stock of situation.... do you think MMS will ever do that; will he come back from foreign tour just because a solider died... never

Our Armed forces get 1% of atual respect compared to what they deserve; and to be frank they don't ask much - small gestures matter. I always make it a point to give my seat in train ( my train route has army guys very often) to an army person to show respect or give them lift in car... not a big deal but they feel the respect that they DESERVE

Will · Post by **Will** » 24 May 2013 21:53

http://stratrisks.com/geostrat/11163

Wary of China’s defence modernisation and infrastructure building in the Tibet Autonomous region, India will be raising a new formidable corps-sized formation of 30,000 infantry in the 13th Five-year Plan period that ends in 2022.

This new infantry force will be over and above the new Mountain Strike Corps with nearly 40,000 soldiers that India will raise, to act as a counter to China, in the northeastern region.

Defence Minister A K Antony revealed the raising of the force when he told Parliament this week that “30 infantry battalions are proposed to be raised in the 13th five-year plan towards enhancing combat capacity” of the 11.3-lakh-strong Indian Army.

This novel proposal is part of the Indian Army’s Long-Term Integrated Perspective Plan that was given an “in principle” approval by the Antony-headed Defence Acquisition Council in April 2012.

Along with the raising of the 30 infantry battalions, the government also proposes to provide for enhancing their mobility by introducing superior vehicles with better cross country mobility.

The Army’s mountain strike corps proposal for the 12th plan period, which awaits the Cabinet Committee on Security approval, is apart from the two independent infantry brigades and armoured brigades that are being raised to plug the operational gaps along the 4,057-km-long Line of Actual Control (LAC) and for building offensive capabilities against the giant neighbouring nation’s powerful military.

While creating the new Mountain Strike Corps is likely to cost the government close to ` 62,000 crore spread over the 2012-17 12th five-year period, the expenditure could spill over into the 2017-22 13th five-year period too, when an additional ` 19,000 crore could be provided.

The raising of the 30 infantry battalions in the 13th five-year period could cost an equal amount, Defence Ministry officials said.

The Mountain Strike corps proposal has already been tweaked and approved by the Chiefs of Staff Committee (CoSC), which is at present headed by Indian Air Force (IAF) chief Air Chief Marshal N A K Browne and has Army chief General Bikram Singh and Navy chief Admiral D K Joshi as members.

The CoSC had been tasked to take a fresh look at the proposal which now has to pass muster at the Defence Ministry and the Finance Ministry.

Has all the makings of another corps and maybe a strike one at that. This one for the northern sector?? Maybe based in Ladakh?????? Wishful Thinking??????? Maybe this time the IA and MOD is trying to skirt under the radar and not raise to many alarm bells in Bejing for the moment like the news of the proposed mountain strike corps has done.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 24 May 2013 22:02

^^^So, the plan for raising 7-11 new divisions seems to be coming along.

vivek_ahuja · Post by **vivek_ahuja** » 24 May 2013 22:26

I am still not sure where the infrastructure and equipment to support these Divisions in areas such as Laddakh and AP is going to come from? Forming Divisions is one thing, but if the regional infrastructure and unit TO&E is lacking, it kind of defeats the purpose. Else it seems just adding manpower and waiting years for the equipment to come along.

That old saying comes to mind: "It should be our goal to have a good army rather than a large one."

Rohit,

It might be a good idea to do a simulation/scenario analysis to see theoretically how many units can be pushed into a certain sector (say DBO, for example) assuming a best case scenario and a worst case one. We can probably uncover some numbers for supplies tonnage per day for different type of units and see if these new forces can even be used as projected and if so, what is the logistical backbone that will be needed.

Thoughts?

-Vivek

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 24 May 2013 22:33

vivek_ahuja wrote:I am still not sure where the infrastructure and equipment to support these Divisions in areas such as Laddakh and AP is going to come from? Forming Divisions is one thing, but if the regional infrastructure and unit TO&E is lacking, it kind of defeats the purpose. Else it seems just adding manpower and waiting years for the equipment to come along.

That old saying comes to mind: "It should be our goal to have a good army rather than a large one."

Rohit,

It might be a good idea to do a simulation/scenario analysis to see theoretically how many units can be pushed into a certain sector (say DBO, for example) assuming a best case scenario and a worst case one. We can probably uncover some numbers for supplies tonnage per day for different type of units and see if these new forces can even be used as projected and if so, what is the logistical backbone that will be needed.

Thoughts?

-Vivek

You're a man after my own heart....

I just posted an Orbat on the Discussion Board (http://tandemwarhead.blogspot.in/) and was wondering how many troops can actually be committed for fighting along the LAC in Ladakh Sector by the Chinese? I mean, even if the terrain is flat at places, the valleys still form a funnel and we have mountain ranges in other areas.

You're asking the question from our POV. I need to re-read the 1962 war and refurbish my knowledge.

Will help to understand how many troops and mechanized assets we need from defense and offense perspective.

Vipul · Post by **Vipul** » 25 May 2013 01:21

Army for IIM-A study to review officer selection process.

Facing a shortage of around 10,000 officers, Army Chief Gen Bikram Singh has ordered a study by IIM-Ahmedabad to review the six-decade-old process of their selection and make it speedy and more transparent.

The study under a senior faculty of the IIM-A would also be asked to recommend changes in the duration of the Services Selection Board which at present takes five days to choose an officer, Army officials said here today.

The SSBs can undertake only 60 batches in a year due to the lengthy procedure. The study would recommend changes to shorten the procedure for enhancing the number of candidates to be tried for selection.The rate of in-take is also very low with only four to five per cent of the candidates clearing the process. The study would also look at recommending changes which may help in improving the induction rate, they said.

Talking about the scope of the study, officials said this will review the techniques used in the selection and suggest refinement in it with alternative tools.
Officer-like qualities tested in the candidates for the SSB process would also be reviewed by the study and they will be made relevant as per changing socio-economic environment.

The study would also review the officer selection process of some foreign armies including the US and the UK besides other major forces in the world.The study would also help in evolving a "fair and more transparent" selection system for the force. The study would be completed by the premier management institute in three phases in one year.

Will · Post by **Will** » 25 May 2013 03:00

vivek_ahuja wrote:I am still not sure where the infrastructure and equipment to support these Divisions in areas such as Laddakh and AP is going to come from? Forming Divisions is one thing, but if the regional infrastructure and unit TO&E is lacking, it kind of defeats the purpose. Else it seems just adding manpower and waiting years for the equipment to come along.

That old saying comes to mind: "It should be our goal to have a good army rather than a large one."

-Vivek

You have a very valid point there. Maybe the IA should first concentrate on increasing the mobility and firepower of exisiting forces. This mindset of "Holding" and "Strike" corps needs to be broken. The IA needs to be turned into a highly mobile and adaptive force where each Corps should be able to switch roles seamlessley. Each Corps should have highly integrated assets that enable it to carry out any role that it is faced with at that moment. Just increasing numbers without the firepower or logistics just makes them cannon fodder.

How easy or difficult is it to mount an offensive into Chinese territory from Ladakh ?