Artillery Discussion Thread

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ramana
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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby ramana » 02 Apr 2018 22:53

Vips wrote:
Vips wrote:Check from 0:50:00 onwards on the link below. Details about the 130 mm gums being upgraded to 155 mm system by OFB Nalanda factory. It has been named Sharang. Has max range of 40 Km's if fired from an angle of 45 Degrees. The Army has given order for 300 Guns (to be delivered in 4 years with first year delivery at 3 guns).Weight 8245kg. Barrel life 650 rounds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJ47qnrY6Wc


The 130 mm gun carriage has a direct fire capability. Soviets had anti-tank role for all their guns.
Wonder is there is plan to have a penetrator shell for this upgraded 155mm/45 calibers gun.
Even a delayed fuze would do the trick.
That would put an end to tall those bunkers/wunkers built by Pak..

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby ramana » 05 Apr 2018 08:43

Did we hear anything about the M777 resolution?

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Pratyush » 05 Apr 2018 10:22

ramana wrote:Did we hear anything about the M777 resolution?


Should it be any different from the Fh 77 solution. As they're both NATO compatible guns.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby ramana » 05 Apr 2018 20:54

Yes. The US team had blamed the OFB shells and had brought in instrument shells for a test firing to be conducted last month.

So my question was what is the update from that?

US has a clever solution. They have a instrumented plug with radial and axial accelerometers and a couple of pressure sensors that fits in the fuze well. It has patch antennas that transmit the data from these sensors.

BTW I don't see how BAE can blame the OFB shells which are made to NATO standards. The whole work package we have gone through numerous times in these pages only.
And OFB has fired quite a few shells from the Dhanush (45 calibers vs 39 calibers for M777) at max charge and found no issues.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Kartik » 10 Apr 2018 02:56

Congratulations to the IA ! The day these first 10 K-9 Vajras are delivered to the IA will mark a historic day for the IA.

Credit: Livefist

Image

First L&T Hanwha Techwin K9 Vajra-T 155 mm SPH

Seen in final Indian Army skin for the 1st time, an L&T-Hanwha Techwin K9 Vajra-T 155mm gun. First 10 ready for delivery soon. Seen here during final integration at L&T Hazira, Gujarat facility.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Rakesh » 10 Apr 2018 03:19

Kartik, that is beautiful. Thank You!

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby ArjunPandit » 10 Apr 2018 03:20

They had been laying very low profile , and on time delivery I must say that. I had posted earlier that if ATAGS /Dhanush orders are finalized 2019-20 onwards India will start getting ~100 artillery pieces every year. If napakis dont mend their ways, they will have to get used to getting solid jhappads from these every now and then

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Kartik » 10 Apr 2018 03:30

More images of K-9 Vajras on the assembly line at L&T's facility at Hazira, Gujarat.

Image

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Rakesh » 10 Apr 2018 03:34

Thanks again Kartik. I like this camo better than the other one!

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Amoghvarsha » 10 Apr 2018 04:21

ArjunPandit wrote:They had been laying very low profile , and on time delivery I must say that. I had posted earlier that if ATAGS /Dhanush orders are finalized 2019-20 onwards India will start getting ~100 artillery pieces every year. If napakis dont mend their ways, they will have to get used to getting solid jhappads from these every now and then


Pandit ji apun log kidhar lagayenge? Kidhar use hoga ye?

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Kartik » 10 Apr 2018 04:34

Rakesh wrote:Thanks again Kartik. I like this camo better than the other one!


You mean you like the dark green versus the one with the pattern that I posted first?

It looks like they go through paint shop at the end, so those K-9s will likely also get the camouflage pattern like the first one. Its better in terms of breaking the shape than an all-dark green colour.

Anyway, I think the K-9 Vajra is one handsome beast.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby ArjunPandit » 10 Apr 2018 07:28

Amoghvarsha wrote:
ArjunPandit wrote:They had been laying very low profile , and on time delivery I must say that. I had posted earlier that if ATAGS /Dhanush orders are finalized 2019-20 onwards India will start getting ~100 artillery pieces every year. If napakis dont mend their ways, they will have to get used to getting solid jhappads from these every now and then


Pandit ji apun log kidhar lagayenge? Kidhar use hoga ye?

...........poof............deletd upon moderator comments
Last edited by ArjunPandit on 10 Apr 2018 08:16, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Vips » 10 Apr 2018 07:53

Kartik wrote:More images of K-9 Vajras on the assembly line at L&T's facility at Hazira, Gujarat.

Image


Simply super to see the pvt sector equivalent of Avadi (pretty soon). Waiting now to see LCA and AMCA rolling out of Pvt sector plants.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Rakesh » 10 Apr 2018 07:59

ArjunPandit wrote:
Amoghvarsha wrote:
Pandit ji apun log kidhar lagayenge? Kidhar use hoga ye?

ATAGS ya Vajra. In my opinion, everything apart from K10 will see initial activitiy in J&K. Can't comment on specific sectors as I myself dont know myself. Deejay/Akshay Kapoor/Ramana/shiv sir can talk specifics. As for K10, I think in desert and plains. Will be happy to learn from them

Please do not reveal exact (or even guesstimates) locations of weaponry.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby abhik » 10 Apr 2018 09:56

Are those actually built by L&T or are they the first set of fully built/knocked down kits imported from SoKo? The K9 deal was finalized only a few months ago.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Pratyush » 10 Apr 2018 10:04

The guns look good in olive. Only beef with this project is the small numbers ordered.

Personal wish would be to have one regiment of these guns attached with every mechanised infantry brigade and armoured brigade for operations.

But will take it however it is employed by the IA.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Indranil » 10 Apr 2018 10:39

Mounted Dhanush.

Image

I hope that OFB works with Tata. They seemed to have a much more TFTA solution on their 8X8 platform.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Pratyush » 10 Apr 2018 10:48

I am woefully behind the development of Indian arty scene. Amazing initiative by OFB.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Philip » 10 Apr 2018 11:04

Great pics Kartik.Drool time! One Q.How many crew members.There appear to be 2 hatches forward of the turret, presumably for the driver and commander, two more in the turret- gunner and loader?

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby nam » 10 Apr 2018 14:28

Indranil wrote:
I hope that OFB works with Tata. They seemed to have a much more TFTA solution on their 8X8 platform.


My opinion Tata's should not. Tatas must be designing a MGS based on ATAGS. I want the OFB one to be pitted against a Tata MGS, who will beat the OFB hands down on automation and sensor fusion. Not to mention a better paint job.

The ideal scenario, BF for towed, Tatas for MGS, OFB for Dhanush & L&T for K9. L&T should make a deal with the Koreans to produce K9 cheaper in India and market it worldwide jointly.

From a time when we struggle to induct a single piece, we will have four producers! And artillery could become our biggest arms export!

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Thakur_B » 10 Apr 2018 14:46

We are well on the path of having 3000 thundering guns in 10 years, inshallah.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby tsarkar » 10 Apr 2018 17:12

Indranil wrote:Mounted Dhanush.

Wonderful development! The Artillery team at OFB is working wonders!

Indranil wrote:I hope that OFB works with Tata. They seemed to have a much more TFTA solution on their 8X8 platform.

Unlikely, OFB being a PSU would work with BEML Tatra since its another PSU. And technically the Tatra is a higher mobility platform than the Tata solution (though as a consequence Opex of Tatra is more than Opex of Tata). The initial Indian contenders including Soltam and Denel T5 Condor were Tatra based guns

https://www.army-technology.com/projects/atmos2000/

http://www.military-today.com/artillery/t5_52.htm

Later Denel went via Tata to circumvent the ban.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby arun » 10 Apr 2018 19:02

Video of K9 Thunder, yes video notwithstanding opening bit consisting of photos, with AC/DC song Thunderstruck as background music:

You Tube


Hanwha Land Systems web page for the K9 Thunder:

Clixky

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Rakesh » 10 Apr 2018 19:29

OT, but Thunderstruck by AC/DC has to be one of the greatest songs ever composed by humanity.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Bart S » 10 Apr 2018 19:45

abhik wrote:Are those actually built by L&T or are they the first set of fully built/knocked down kits imported from SoKo? The K9 deal was finalized only a few months ago.


It's just glorified screwdriver giri. We should have done this in-house based on Dhanush/ATAGS and Arjun.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby suryag » 10 Apr 2018 20:05

They have developed 11 systems got india specific optimizations

The L&T-produced indigenous systems on the gun will include the fire control system, hull, turret, electronics, NBC systems, auto loaders, air conditioning and direct fire systems. The VAJRA-T was declared the sole qualified gun after user evaluation trials at Pokhran. The Russian competitor could not meet the requirements. Among the 13 Indian systems on the winning prototype was a fire control system to cater to a huge mix of Indian ammunition.

The deal is being described as a “step higher than licensed production”. “It will be an Indian product made made in an Indian factory,” claimed the L&T executive.


It is not screw driver giri, it is more of an MKIsed version that is being made. The mobility/powerpack can easily be swapped with another and the barrel can be replaced with indigenous maal once it gets through its paces. All in all a good start(considering we had to start somewhere)

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby nam » 10 Apr 2018 21:18

One of the advantages of having a R&D ecosystem. Arms manufacturer will more than willing to do a true local production (at least partially) when they know India has the required tech to build one itself. This is format we need to follow to rapidly build up MIC.

L&T needs to go to town with this. Locally produce items, reduce the cost and make it extremely competitive against Chinese maal.

DRDO does not need to invest time and effort on developing a SPH. Just use K9 as the base platform and L&T can work with DRDO to build the capability. MoD just needs to make sure the order flows.
Last edited by nam on 10 Apr 2018 21:21, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby nam » 10 Apr 2018 21:20

suryag wrote:
It is not screw driver giri, it is more of an MKIsed version that is being made. The mobility/powerpack can easily be swapped with another and the barrel can be replaced with indigenous maal once it gets through its paces. All in all a good start(considering we had to start somewhere)


The powerpack is MTU, similar to Arjun. Lower rating though. So we know the engine.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Kartik » 10 Apr 2018 23:07

Was thrilled to see the OFB Dhanush Mounted Gun..so good to see them being proactive and coming up with a solution internally that could mean no need for an imported solution that is made in India like the NEXTER CAESAR.

Here's the NEXTER CAESAR Mounted Gun on an Ashok Leyland truck..being done as part of a consortium with L&T here

Image

Image

Elbit Kalyani ATMOS Mounted Gun

Image

Do these 2 foreign designs honestly look that much more TFTA than the OFB Dhanush Mounted Gun? Get a better paint job and then people will be going waah waah over the desi solution as well.

Now to find out more details on the OFB MGS solution..

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby JTull » 10 Apr 2018 23:25

Rakesh wrote:OT, but Thunderstruck by AC/DC has to be one of the greatest songs ever composed by humanity.


+1

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Indranil » 10 Apr 2018 23:57

Kartik wrote:Do these 2 foreign designs honestly look that much more TFTA than the OFB Dhanush Mounted Gun? Get a better paint job and then people will be going waah waah over the desi solution as well.

Now to find out more details on the OFB MGS solution..

The mounting points is different. OFB seems to have loaded the turret behind the wheels, whereas ATmos, Caesar and even the Tata solution was loaded atop the back wheels. That gives a much more shorter overhang. I don't think this OFB solution is complete yet. Imagine the gun firing at 90 degrees to the truck's orientation. What is stopping it from rolling the truck over. I think Tata will do a fantastic job of mounting the gun on their truck.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby JayS » 11 Apr 2018 00:16

^Can it turn 90deg..? Looks unlikely. +-30deg or so more likely to my noob eyes.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby kit » 11 Apr 2018 01:13

JTull wrote:
Rakesh wrote:OT, but Thunderstruck by AC/DC has to be one of the greatest songs ever composed by humanity.


+1


+1 .. i can imagine these howitzers dishing it out at the Pakistani border with this as the background 8)

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby tsarkar » 11 Apr 2018 01:20

JayS wrote:^Can it turn 90deg..? Looks unlikely. +-30deg or so more likely to my noob eyes.

The Denel system can traverse quite a bit

https://www.armyrecognition.com/south_a ... 11163.html

OFB historically never had a traverse mechanism and will need to develop it from scratch. Bhim used Denel turret and the Bofors FH-77B02 used APU and wheels to traverse. The OFB truck mounted looks like a quick fix job.

Indranil wrote:I think Tata will do a fantastic job of mounting the gun on their truck.


Even in the Tata Denel gun, the traverse mechanism is from Denel rather than Tata. Not sure whether Denel will allow Tata to use it with OFB gun.

But its not a big thing to develop. We can use components from Arjun turret traverse mechanism but this gun, its elevation & recoil mechanism will much heavier than Arjun gun & turret.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby kit » 11 Apr 2018 01:27

Kartik wrote:More images of K-9 Vajras on the assembly line at L&T's facility at Hazira, Gujarat.

<snip>


Quite TFTA .. The ordnance factories are better off privatized :D
Last edited by nachiket on 11 Apr 2018 02:01, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: edited out quoted images

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby kit » 11 Apr 2018 01:28

deleted
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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby kit » 11 Apr 2018 01:29

Happy to see the artillery segment of the IA picking up after years of decades of neglect ..shows how policy changes do help

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby tsarkar » 11 Apr 2018 01:44

The Denel traverse mechanism is quite good

http://www.military-today.com/artillery/t5_52.htm

This artillery system can fire in 360° arc, however it has to return to the 80° arc to simplify the loading process.


Kit - you dont have to quote a whole series of images for a one line post. For those of us using mobiles, its a pain scrolling.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby Picklu » 11 Apr 2018 03:10

Indranil wrote:
Kartik wrote:Do these 2 foreign designs honestly look that much more TFTA than the OFB Dhanush Mounted Gun? Get a better paint job and then people will be going waah waah over the desi solution as well.

Now to find out more details on the OFB MGS solution..

The mounting points is different. OFB seems to have loaded the turret behind the wheels, whereas ATmos, Caesar and even the Tata solution was loaded atop the back wheels. That gives a much more shorter overhang.
...............

Indeed. Looks odd that the front wheels are not airborne already in the process of toppling back.

I think the current solution is a quick PoC and the entire Dhanush mechanism "as is" added to Tatra giving it the lopsided look.

Further refinement would be needed to add the ploughs to different position of the truck and add traversing mechanism.

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Re: Artillery Discussion Thread

Postby nam » 11 Apr 2018 03:46

Image

Tata denel mgs. It is quite neat. OFB looks like they welded dhanush on to the first tatra they found.

Hope ofb refines it and Tata brings out a mgs based on atags.


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