Indian Army News & Discussions - 11 June 2014

[Baikul]

Indian Tales of Heroism usually involve ordinary Indians who speak Hindi, Bhojpuri, Dharwad Kannada or Tulu. For the story to reach our English reading eyes it has to get past the anglophile media controllers of India led by stalwarts like Turdesai, Ghose, that bowtie bugger, or DButt. They are simply not interested in this kind of stuff.

On the other hand the media of nations like Russia, the US and even Britainistan take pains to write out these things - in the English media of course and English reading Indians pick that up. So we are all up to date about Western accounts of heroism, who was the best sniper of them all, how he killed all the baddies; how it felt to come under intense Iraqi fire, and what Patton said. The heroes we remember and identify with are in the West............

Beautifully said.

But the reasons for this run deeper than media attitudes. As For the longest time we were bought up on Enid Blyton adventures where English children captured our imagination, Sudden and JT Edson novels in which we imagined ourselves as macho cowboys. We had Amar Chitra Kathas but they seemed to occupy the realm of religion. Commando novels reinforced western bravery and heroes. In college - whether as engineers, doctors or pursing the liberal arts- many of our classic texts were written by westerners. Our reading of fiction and non fiction was and is dominated by western writers and the western experience. For example, I can't remember a 'great English language novel' or, forget great, even a hugely popular war novel, written by an Indian, about an Indian war post independence. The last one that comes to mind is Mulk Raj Anand's Across The Black Waters set in World War One.

The Kargil war is a great opportunity for several non -fiction books written in the Black Hawk Down style- where are they? But I am sure may of us have read Leon Uris on the Arab Israeli war (among other books), or Jim Jones' Thin Red Line . Is it any surprise then that,as we are thus awkwardly juxtaposed to our cultural and social roots, the heroism of those who "speak Hindi, Bhojpuri, Dharwad Kannada or Tulu" seems less immediate to some of us than the deeds of some western hero in a far off land?

[shiv]

There are some fabulous stories that have come out especially after the advent of the Internet. Stories of COIN in Kashmir, that Siachen story ("Rope"), the story "Kempy's nose" by "cyclic" and Alfred Cooke's account of his 2+1 Sabre saga over Kalaikunda, and many other less well known ones. I have deliberately put the one's I recall off the top of my head in this post. I think they need to be collected and put in one place for Indian English readers to digest.

Bollywood and TV have done a moderately good job - but they don't enter the consciousness of the English reading elite of India

[Pratyush]

Shiv, are the English language elite of India relevant to the future of the country.

That is a question that I am asking myself. I see my Dad, I see my wife. They have both come from rural background and succeed.

It is the same with most of the young generation.

[shiv]

Shiv, are the English language elite of India relevant to the future of the country.

That is a question that I am asking myself. I see my Dad, I see my wife. They have both come from rural background and succeed.

It is the same with most of the young generation.

A huge subject but OT. Maybe some other thread. But English currently dominates media space and controls the discourse for Indians and it is 90% western.

My only reason for bringing it up is that in all military discussions on here the greatest weightage is given to what is prominent in the English language media - and typically that is American thought, ideas and emotions.

For example - in the Bush era Iraq was the enemy. Now Iraq was never directly opposed to India. OK it was Islamic and that was brought up as "ummah and therefore anti India". But Indian advisors and workers made their lives in Iraq. But once Iraq was declared an enemy by America the chorus was taken up by educated elite Indians. The hated Iraqi Republican guard was derided as looking idiotic doing their "double march" on parade. And when Indian special forces on Republic day did that same double march, it was greeted with horror and disgust on here. A double march by itself requires great fitness which is what was on display apart from rigour and discipline. But that made no impact on the disgust in copying "the enemy" that is Iraq. But outside of elite English language fora that double march attracted no negative attention among Indians at large.

Our attitudes are moulded by what America says and does because of familiarity with language and intense bombardment of media with western ideas and if some of those attitudes have crept into decision makers then we are in trouble. In military terms there are things that Indian armed forces do and have done that work well. But that is virtually unknown and unrecognized by the vast majority because of English language media domination over a country where only a minority are completely comfortable in English.

[jayasimha]

http://www.tribuneindia.com/news/nation ... 17052.html
First battalion of Indian Gorkhas is born

Vijay Mohan
Tribune News Service
Chandigarh, April 2
The Army has turned over a new leaf by raising a new Gorkha battalion comprising entirely of Gorkha troops of Indian domicile. Traditionally, the majority of troops in Gorkha regiments belong to Nepal.
This is the first Gorkha battalion to have come up in 50 years. The new battalion, the Sixth Battalion of the First Gorkha Rifles (6/1GR), christened “Kanchi Paltan”, has been raised at Sabathu in the Shivalik foothills near Shimla, that houses the 14 Gorkha Training Centre.
In 1815, the British had raised the first Gorkha battalion, 1/1 GR, from the remnants of General Amar Singh Thapa’s forces following the Gurkha War fought between the Gorkha kings of Nepal and British East India Company.
Col Avaneesh Chambial is the battalion’s first Commanding Officer. The recruits for the battalion had been undergoing training at the centre for the past nine months and the battalion’s regimental flag was unfurled by the Colonel of the First Gorkha Rifles, Lt Gen Ravi Thogde, at a ceremonial parade on Friday.
The Army has several Gorkha regiments — 1GR, 3GR, 4GR, 5GR, 8GR, 9GR and 11 GR. The stipulated ratio of composition of these regiments between Nepalese and Indian domicile Gorkhas is about 70:30. In some units it is 60:40.
The Army’s plans are that each Gorkha regiment will raise an additional battalion in due course as part of the approved force accretions and the ongoing organisational restructuring.
A senior officer said more Gorkhas of Indian domicile i.e. those settled in the hilly regions of northern India and the North-East and even other parts of the country would be recruited and Gorkha regiments were envisioned to have a pan-India footprint. The minimum educational qualification for Gorkha troops was also being raised from matriculation to Class XII.
Three years ago, the Army had raised the Sikkim Scouts comprising locally recruited youth from the state for deployment in the border regions. The unit has been affiliated with 11 GR.

[NRao]

Lay a bridge:

[youtube]PbaD2-2Ktwc&nohtml5=False[/youtube]

[Kersi D]

There are some fabulous stories that have come out especially after the advent of the Internet. Stories of COIN in Kashmir, that Siachen story ("Rope"), the story "Kempy's nose" by "cyclic" and Alfred Cooke's account of his 2+1 Sabre saga over Kalaikunda, and many other less well known ones. I have deliberately put the one's I recall off the top of my head in this post. I think they need to be collected and put in one place for Indian English readers to digest.

Bollywood and TV have done a moderately good job - but they don't enter the consciousness of the English reading elite of India

Dr Shiv. Would you be able to spare time and energy to have a BR section on such saga ?

[Kersi D]

Shiv, are the English language elite of India relevant to the future of the country.

That is a question that I am asking myself. I see my Dad, I see my wife. They have both come from rural background and succeed.

It is the same with most of the young generation.

A huge subject but OT. Maybe some other thread. But English currently dominates media space and controls the discourse for Indians and it is 90% western.

My only reason for bringing it up is that in all military discussions on here the greatest weightage is given to what is prominent in the English language media - and typically that is American thought, ideas and emotions.

For example - in the Bush era Iraq was the enemy. Now Iraq was never directly opposed to India. OK it was Islamic and that was brought up as "ummah and therefore anti India". But Indian advisors and workers made their lives in Iraq. But once Iraq was declared an enemy by America the chorus was taken up by educated elite Indians. The hated Iraqi Republican guard was derided as looking idiotic doing their "double march" on parade. And when Indian special forces on Republic day did that same double march, it was greeted with horror and disgust on here. A double march by itself requires great fitness which is what was on display apart from rigour and discipline. But that made no impact on the disgust in copying "the enemy" that is Iraq. But outside of elite English language fora that double march attracted no negative attention among Indians at large.

Our attitudes are moulded by what America says and does because of familiarity with language and intense bombardment of media with western ideas and if some of those attitudes have crept into decision makers then we are in trouble. In military terms there are things that Indian armed forces do and have done that work well. But that is virtually unknown and unrecognized by the vast majority because of English language media domination over a country where only a minority are completely comfortable in English.

Something OT

A lot of we the Indians talk nasty, really nasty, about one Mr Osama Bin Laden.

To the bast of my knowledge, Mr Osama Bin Laden was NEVER against India. He has never even spoken a harsh word to or about India, forget about executed any evil deeds. But we are programmed (read whitewashed / brain washed ) by English press that he was the evil most gentleman to walk on Earth.

[shiv]

There are some fabulous stories that have come out especially after the advent of the Internet. Stories of COIN in Kashmir, that Siachen story ("Rope"), the story "Kempy's nose" by "cyclic" and Alfred Cooke's account of his 2+1 Sabre saga over Kalaikunda, and many other less well known ones. I have deliberately put the one's I recall off the top of my head in this post. I think they need to be collected and put in one place for Indian English readers to digest.

Bollywood and TV have done a moderately good job - but they don't enter the consciousness of the English reading elite of India

Dr Shiv. Would you be able to spare time and energy to have a BR section on such saga ?

Kersi many of them are already there. No one looks on BR.

The only way is to have an active "propaganda dept" that posts links to FB/Twitter. The other thing I have found roaring success with is to tell a war story in a video. This is an era of mobile phones and increase bandwidth. Videos are the way to tell stories. No one reads.

[Abhay_S]

^^ here is one such story shared by Rohit ji,

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... a#p1917891

[wig]

Army hones proactive strategy with massive exercise in Thar
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 834944.cms

Honing its "proactive war strategy" to swiftly mobilise and hit hard with multiple conventional military strikes across the Pakistan border, the Indian Army is conducting a massive exercise, codenamed "Shatrujeet", in the Thar desert..
Several armoured, artillery and infantry formations have been mobilised for the high-tempo operations conducted under a simulated nuclear, biological, chemical (NBC) warfare environment, a defence source said.
The exercise is being steered by the Mathura-based 1 Corps, one of the three principle `strike corps' of the 1.18million strong Army, along with `offensive elements' of the `pivot corps' under the South Western Command headquartered at Jaipur
"Pakistan might be foolish enough to talk about tactical nukes as weapons but India's no-first-use nuclear policy is clear. It warns of a massive and harsh retaliation to any first NBC strike by an adversary , be it tactical or strategic," the source said.
Army chief General Dalbir Singh Suhag is slated to review the final phase of Shatrujeet. The exercise seeks to validate the capability of the Army to "first generate and then maintain" intense offensive manoeuvres backed by long-range artillery and the Air Force. It will include major airborne operations, including paradropping of 2,000-3,000 soldiers behind 'enemy' lines.
Though Pakistan has Shaheen and Ghauri series of long-range nuclear missiles, it often flaunts its 60-km Nasr (Hatf-IX) missiles with subkiloton plutonium warheads as a counter to India's conventional military superiority. Islamabad makes no bones that it has developed its tactical nuclear weapons to deter any Indian conventional military thrust into its territory.
But the Indian forces remain unfazed. The Army was forced to develop its "pro-active war strategy" -colloquially called the Cold Start doctrine -after it took a month for its strike formations to be forward mobilised under Operation Parakram in the aftermath of the terror attack on Parliament in 2001. By then, Pakistan had managed to shore up its defences, even as the US worked to get India to stand down. Since then, the Army has been systematically building its capabilities to undertake mobilisation and cross-border strikes within three to four days, backed by proper logistics and reinforcements to sustain the momentum.

[tsarkar]

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 834944.cms

Honing its "proactive war strategy" to swiftly mobilise and hit hard with multiple conventional military strikes across the Pakistan border, the Indian Army is conducting a massive exercise, codenamed "Shatrujeet", in the Thar desert..
Several armoured, artillery and infantry formations have been mobilised for the high-tempo operations conducted under a simulated nuclear, biological, chemical (NBC) warfare environment, a defence source said.
The exercise is being steered by the Mathura-based 1 Corps, one of the three principle `strike corps' of the 1.18million strong Army, along with `offensive elements' of the `pivot corps' under the South Western Command headquartered at Jaipur
"Pakistan might be foolish enough to talk about tactical nukes as weapons but India's no-first-use nuclear policy is clear. It warns of a massive and harsh retaliation to any first NBC strike by an adversary , be it tactical or strategic," the source said.
Army chief General Dalbir Singh Suhag is slated to review the final phase of Shatrujeet. The exercise seeks to validate the capability of the Army to "first generate and then maintain" intense offensive manoeuvres backed by long-range artillery and the Air Force. It will include major airborne operations, including paradropping of 2,000-3,000 soldiers behind 'enemy' lines.
Though Pakistan has Shaheen and Ghauri series of long-range nuclear missiles, it often flaunts its 60-km Nasr (Hatf-IX) missiles with subkiloton plutonium warheads as a counter to India's conventional military superiority. Islamabad makes no bones that it has developed its tactical nuclear weapons to deter any Indian conventional military thrust into its territory.
But the Indian forces remain unfazed. The Army was forced to develop its "pro-active war strategy" -colloquially called the Cold Start doctrine -after it took a month for its strike formations to be forward mobilised under Operation Parakram in the aftermath of the terror attack on Parliament in 2001. By then, Pakistan had managed to shore up its defences, even as the US worked to get India to stand down. Since then, the Army has been systematically building its capabilities to undertake mobilisation and cross-border strikes within three to four days, backed by proper logistics and reinforcements to sustain the momentum.

I hope members realize the significance of this exercise.

1. In the summer season, IA is practicing a desert offensive

2. In a simulated NBC environment. Takes into account that Indian formations would be hit by nuclear weapons.

3. With a brigade sized paradrop. I'm assuming IAF Transport Squadrons are concentrated. Despite two C-17 & Il-78 in US for Red Flag. Note it says paradropping and not heli-dropping.

4. 3-4 days mobilization & strike. During Gulf War 1 & 2, the US took months to mobilize despite pre-positioning in Diego Garcia and Saudi Arabia

5. The logistic effort would be significant

6. Even in the case of biological or chemical attack, Indian response will be nuclear.

[deejay]

...
I hope members realize the significance of this exercise.

1. In the summer season, IA is practicing a desert offensive

2. In a simulated NBC environment. Takes into account that Indian formations would be hit by nuclear weapons.

3. With a brigade sized paradrop. I'm assuming IAF Transport Squadrons are concentrated. Despite two C-17 & Il-78 in US for Red Flag. Note it says paradropping and not heli-dropping.

4. 3-4 days mobilization & strike. During Gulf War 1 & 2, the US took months to mobilize despite pre-positioning in Diego Garcia and Saudi Arabia

5. The logistic effort would be significant

6. Even in the case of biological or chemical attack, Indian response will be nuclear.

Sir, interesting review. Not to disagree but to add some small inputs from my side on para drop and heliborne insertion through slithering ops (or similar ops).
> Para drop can be undertaken by An 32s and Mi 17 (family). I am not aware of usage of Dhruv though I am pretty sure this would have been tried at some point. So the assets available are beyond the C 17s, Il 76s and 78s and C 130s. Over unfriendly skies the use of helicopter for para drop will not be the first option though.
> An exercise for quick deployment or behind enemy line insertion will practice slithering drops or low hover jumps though it is not specifically mentioned in the news report.
> Your point 6 is perhaps the most important take away from this news report.

My first two inputs are based on a couple of exercises I participated in many years ago. We specially practiced night time insertions and slithering with IA formations.

[Christopher Sidor]

Something OT

A lot of we the Indians talk nasty, really nasty, about one Mr Osama Bin Laden.

To the bast of my knowledge, Mr Osama Bin Laden was NEVER against India. He has never even spoken a harsh word to or about India, forget about executed any evil deeds. But we are programmed (read whitewashed / brain washed ) by English press that he was the evil most gentleman to walk on Earth.

In 1998 Osama Bin Laden was targeted by cruise missiles in Afghanistan. Osama was not killed but approximately 6 terrorist died in the camp which was attacked by US Cruise missiles. These 6 people belonged to HuM. HuM went on to stage the IC-814 hijacking. When the ill fated IC-814 was returned back to India on account of release of 3 monsters from Indian Jail, the person who feted Maulana Masood Azhar was Osama Bin Laden. Maulana Masood Azhar went on to form JeM. It is rumored that JeM went on the provoke India every time pressure mounted to Al-qedia and the Taliban in Pakistan. His links with most of the terrorist who operate in Kashmir and against India is well documented.


This is what was said by the same guy in the year 2000,

"The Mujahedin in Kashmir are engaged in a jihad to please God.
....
....
India's enmity towards Islam and Muslim is growing. All Muslims are obligated to undertake Jihad against India.
....
....
No mujahid can waste 16 year old jihad and the blood of 300,000 martyrs."

The 16 year old jihad is the Kashmir terrorism that has been undergoing.

[SaiK]

Lt Gen Bipin Rawat: ‘Being prepared for war is the biggest deterrent for war’
Lt Gen Bipin Rawat, Army Commander, Southern Command, speaks to The Indian Express.

http://indianexpress.com/article/india/ ... r-2755454/

[Austin]

Defence Ministry all set to equip all infantry units with UAV squad

Read more at:
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/art ... aign=cppst

[vasu raya]

^^^
Good development, even the counter terror ops can use them, as an example a night vision device flying tree top height can spot movement much farther

[member_27581]

I hope members realize the significance of this exercise.

1. In the summer season, IA is practicing a desert offensive

2. In a simulated NBC environment. Takes into account that Indian formations would be hit by nuclear weapons.

3. With a brigade sized paradrop. I'm assuming IAF Transport Squadrons are concentrated. Despite two C-17 & Il-78 in US for Red Flag. Note it says paradropping and not heli-dropping.

4. 3-4 days mobilization & strike. During Gulf War 1 & 2, the US took months to mobilize despite pre-positioning in Diego Garcia and Saudi Arabia

5. The logistic effort would be significant

6. Even in the case of biological or chemical attack, Indian response will be nuclear

I find #1 also an interesting to sustain a war in summers is different from our historical approach of december wars. This exercise seems very similar to Akraman II exercise last year with similar objectives. We are rotating strike corps every year

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 042976.cms

The exercise conceptualized by Sapta Shakti Command involved rapid mobilisation and execution of offensive plans by launching multiple thrusts in sync with the Air force, a defence statement said.

More than 300 combat vehicles, main battles tanks, long range artillery guns and about 10,000 troops took part in the exercise.

Swift mechanized manoeuvres along with troop insertion using third dimension were thoroughly rehearsed during the exercise.

Around the same time we also conducted ex. brahmshira...
not clear how brahmshira was different that was from akraman II and how does the strike corps concept change in light of IBGs

[member_27581]

Another question to the gurus, do we conduct such exercise on eastern border as well? quick google search only yielded two results 1. operation chequerboard in 87 and 2. operation pralay in 2009
If we are actively thinking of a two front threat then are we actually preparing for both the fronts?
Wondering if should have we have a separate thread to track these exercises?

[jamwal]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but India always had a nuclear response for Biological and Chemical attacks. Point 6 is not new.

[tsarkar]

Thanks for your views, Deejay.

Indeed, the An-32 and Mi-17 fleet undertake the lion's share of sorties. Their pilots, navigators, engineers & loadmasters are not sufficiently appreciated as public perception of air force is limited very myopically to fighters.

The Meghna heli-lift and Tangail drop were strategic pivots to victory, as was the airlift of AMX-13 tanks to Ladakh in 1962 by An-12 where they defeated the Chinese in the Battle of Chusul.

@Ranjan - there are exercises in the Central & Eastern Command Sectors too. However, Corps level exercises are less because of lack of freedom of movement in the mountains and jungles, and unavailability of road/rail/air transport for logistics until very recently. With the new border roads, railways and airlift capabilities available, we may see the number of exercises increase.

@Jamwal, indeed point 6 is not new. Refer to point (vi) here that the news article was reiterating.

http://pib.nic.in/archieve/lreleng/lyr2 ... 20033.html

However, in the event of a major attack against India, or Indian forces anywhere, by biological or chemical weapons, India will retain the option of retaliating with nuclear weapons;

[sivab]

http://www.dnaindia.com/mumbai/report-f ... my-2202541

First artillery gun in 3 decades to be inducted in army

The first artillery gun after three decades — a 155mm/45-calibre Dhanush gun — will be inducted in the Indian Army, said defence minister Manohar Parikkar during an event organised by ex-servicemen in Panvel on Thursday evening. The last artillery gun — a Bofors gun — was inducted in 1984.

By the next month, the Dhanush artillery gun, a towed howitzer with a strike range of 38km developed by the Ordnance Factory Board (OFB) in Kolkata, will be handed over to the Indian Army. Dhanush artillery guns are also called 'desi Bofors'.

Parikkar said: "The required critical trial of the gun has been completed and, by next month, the gun will be inducted in the artillery." He added that this is the first gun to be inducted in the Indian Army artillery after the Bofors gun.

The gun has been developed by the OFB after going through the design and voluminous documents that were delivered to India under the first phase of the Transfer of Technology (ToT) as part of the Bofors gun deal in the late 80s. The Swedish Bofors company (now owned by Britain's BAE System) could not complete the ToT for the 155mm howitzer with 39 calibre to India as the deal got embroiled in a major political row in the 80s over alleged kickbacks.

However, during this period, OFB manufactured and supplied several components or spare parts to keep the Bofors howitzers operational in India, especially during the Kargil war.

In addition, Parikkar also informed that in the next four months, a self-propelled gun developed by L&T and specially designed for operation in the desert areas bordering Pakistan will also be inducted.

Taking note of the Indian Army facing an acute shortage of artillery, Parikkar said that in two-three years, all artillery deficits will be covered. "The intention of our government is clear when it comes to strengthening our forces," Parikkar said.

On the Kashmir issue, the defence minister said that freedom has been given to the forces to take action, without needing to wait for orders. "The lives of our security personnel are more important than that of our enemies," Parikkar said. He added, in regard to the recent Pathankot attack, "I do not see this as a terror attack. This is similar to war and we will give a befitting reply. We will decide the nature of the reply — how, when and where."

[jayasimha]

http://indianexpress.com/article/india/ ... r-2755454/






SUSHANT KULKARNI: Media is one of your fields of interest. Your study is on how the media can be used as a force multiplier. Don’t you think that the friction between the media and military is because the military wants us to be a force multiplier, but the media wants to play its role of a watchdog? -

Why,,, why,, why,,,, IE is under assumption that there is friction between media and Military... They want to check themselves if others know they are DDM

[Kakkaji]

Totally OT. Mods please remove if inappropriate.

Last Tuesday (Apr 12), the CoAS Gen Suhag and his wife were my co-passengers in the Air India flight from JFK to Delhi, sitting 2 seats in front of me. It must have been an official visit as a couple of 3* and 2* generals in full uniforms, presumably from the Indian embassy, and what seemed to be GOTUS security types in civilian dress, accompanied them to the boarding gate.

He seems to be a very unassuming man with no airs, no 'nakkhra'. Did not ask for any special service from the AI staff. He was in the business class, and not first class. His aide travelled in the economy class, and was not called even once during the flight by General Saheb for any valet service.

They were sitting 2 rows away from me. The General and Mrs Suhag ate from the same menu as other passengers. Stowed their own luggage in the overheads.

I was surprised and so proud to see that the Chief of the Indian Army, travelling in the GoI owned airline, traveled just as other civilian passengers, and did not inconvenience his co-passengers at all. Had it been the chief of the Paki army, or even a 4 star general of the US army, I don't think they would have behaved the same.

I had a thought to go up to him, ask him if he knows about BR, write 'For Bharat Rakshaks' on a blank paper and ask him to autograph it. But I chickened out.

Jai Hind.

[JE Menon]

Thanks for sharing Kakkaji.

These are the tell-tale signs that our country is getting stronger and greater! When the COAS does this, he is setting an incredible example.

[member_27581]

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 891657.cms

Municipal authorities in violence-hit Handwara town in north Kashmir today removed three security force bunkers from the main market, fulfilling one of the long pending demands of local residents. "Three bunkers, which were constructed on top of shops in Handwara main market, have been removed by municipal authorities," a police official said. He said the main bunker, located in the round-about of the main market, has also been vacated and taken over by municipal authorities. "This bunker will also be demolished and the task will be completed by 2 PM today," the official said.
The municipal authorities also erected a board on the premises of the bunker, marking the place for conversion into a public park.
The locals had been demanding removal of the bunkers for quite sometime but the Army had put its foot down, saying it was strategically important for the troops. Three bunkers, which were constructed on top of shops in Handwara main market However, the demand for removal of these bunkers intensified after last week's violence triggered by alleged molestation of a girl by an army soldier.
Three persons were killed in security forces firing while dealing with the protestors.

All that drama and stone pelting was apparently to get army off the back. Handwara seems to be have caught some attention from Porkies, some SF casualties also happened in last one year, but wasnt that in the forest area

[vaibhav.n]

^^For the un-initiated, some terrain briefing. The names would be familiar all too well to most folks. All the gulley's are infamous infiltration routes...

Kupwara District

Kupwara district was initially part of the erstwhile Baramulla district and in July 1979, it was carved out as a separate district. The district is situated at an mean altitude of 5300 feet asl with varied topography. The western, northern and eastern areas of the district are hilly while as the southern areas are mainly plain. The district is flanked in the east and south by Baramulla district and in the west and north by LoC separating it from Muzafarabad district presently under the illegal occupation of Pakistan. It is located about 90 kms from Srinagar in the north–west corner of Kashmir Valley.

The Himalayan spurline running from the Zojila goes to the west separating the valley of Kishan Ganga from the main Kashmir valley. This is crossed by the main Srinagar–Kargil route over the Rajdhani pass joining Gurez with Bandipora. This spur goes along the left bank of Kishan-Ganga valley, finally near Shamas Bary peak it veers towards the south and ends at the gorge of Jhelum near Uri. The south extension is called Qazinag range. This range forms the western wall of Kupwara district. The Zojila Qazinag spur is crossed by famous passes like Tootmar Gali, Nastichum Gali, Furkhian Gali, and Jar Gali connecting Leepa valley in Pakistan occupied Kashimir. The Hilly areas of Karnah, Keran, Tangdhar and Machil are situated on the Line of Control. These areas generally remain cut-off from rest of the district during winter for about five months. Kupwara district is surrounded by thick forests, mountain slopes and snow clad peaks from three sides.

[vaibhav.n]

The Handwara town post, manned by the 21 Rashtriya Rifles, had come under attack on Tuesday after a mob went on the rampage on rumors that a local girl had been molested by soldiers. Three people were killed in firing by security forces to control the situation after an Army bunker was burnt down and soldiers surrounded.

The district magistrate will now be writing to the Army to remove the post, with sources saying that political pressure may also come into play to diffuse the situation. However, security officials told ET that the post is crucial to anti-militancy operations in the region and overlooks five converging roads.

"The post is of strategic importance and has been vital in keeping an eye on over ground workers. It is a major town post that is led by a company commander," an official said, adding that militant activities in the town are kept under watch from the post.

Handwara and its surrounding areas have seen heavy militant activity in recent years. "The 21 RR has a good grip on the area and has neutralized two militants already this year," Col SD Goswani, the spokesperson for the Army's Northern Command told ET.

The Handwara post and 21 RR's presence in the area is also a political sticking point, with Engineer Rashid, the local independent MLA raising its removal from the town as an election agenda in 2015 in which he eventually won, defeating powerful candidates of the PDP and National Conference.

Link:http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 848979.cms

[ShauryaT]

I had a thought to go up to him, ask him if he knows about BR, write 'For Bharat Rakshaks' on a blank paper and ask him to autograph it. But I chickened out.

Jai Hind.

Next time do not miss the opportunity. Met VK Singh at a social function, asked for an autograph and got it too. They are humble. The ADC even pulled me out from to go and meet the COAS, as I was patiently waiting without barging in front of the COAS, as some others were doing. So decency pays .

Having said that, I did chicken out, when I ran into Arun Shourie someone I admire a lot. So all part of being normal. Thanks for sharing.

[jayasimha]

Totally OT. Mods please remove if inappropriate.

Last Tuesday (Apr 12), the CoAS Gen Suhag and his wife were my co-passengers in the Air India flight from JFK to Delhi, sitting 2 seats in front of me. It must have been an official visit as a couple of 3* and 2* generals in full uniforms, presumably from the Indian embassy, and what seemed to be GOTUS security types in civilian dress, accompanied them to the boarding gate.


Jai Hind.

http://pib.nic.in/newsite/PrintRelease. ... lid=138709

Press Information Bureau
Government of India
Ministry of Defence
08-April-2016 17:08 IST
COAS Visit to USA


Gen Dalbir Singh, Chief of the Army Staff of the Indian Army, met Gen Mark A Milley, the Chief of Staff of the US Army (CSA), the Chief Host for the ongoing four day visit to the USA on 07 April 2016. He was given the Guard of Honour in an Army Full Honour Arrival Ceremony.

Earlier in the day, he paid homage at Arlington National Cemetery in the Army Full Honour Wreath Ceremony at the ‘Tomb of Unknown Soldiers’.

Later in the day, the COAS also visited the Pentagon and called on the Chairman, Joint Chief of Staff (CJCS) and Commandant, US Marine Corps. The military & security leaders of both the nations discussed a range of strategic and security issues of mutual interest.

The Army Chief of the Indian Army will also visit one of the Regiments of the US Army Rangers and the Maneuver Center of Excellence.

Col Rohan Anand, SM
PRO (Army)

[Karan M]

http://indianexpress.com/article/india/ ... r-2755454/





SUSHANT KULKARNI: Media is one of your fields of interest. Your study is on how the media can be used as a force multiplier. Don’t you think that the friction between the media and military is because the military wants us to be a force multiplier, but the media wants to play its role of a watchdog? -

Why,,, why,, why,,,, IE is under assumption that there is friction between media and Military... They want to check themselves if others know they are DDM

Presstitute#1

Isn't the friction because we are deracinated jerkoffs who posture as journalists whilst pandering to anyone who gives the right amount?

Fauji: yup, that's it.

[member_27581]

[quote="vaibhav.n"]^^For the un-initiated, some terrain briefing. The names would be familiar all too well to most folks. All the gulley's are infamous infiltration routes...

[quote]Kupwara District
Thanks vaibhav sir, is there anyway to see it in a military type of map other than google earth?

[rohitvats]

Thanks vaibhav sir, is there anyway to see it in a military type of map other than google earth?

There are no military type maps.

The best way to under a geography from military perspective is to first mark all the important peaks, features, nullas, rivers, villages, towns etc on a map. While most of the villages and towns and important passes and peaks are already marked, lesser known ones are not. Even important passes are at times not marked. For example, GE will not tell you about one spur-line or ridge line from another.

Trick is to use physical maps which one gets from internet and in books and correlate these important points on GE. Best way is to download Google Earth and mark these features on it. Another important thing to do it look at maps on GE in Terrain Mode. This will tell you the lay of the land and gradient.

For starters, take the write-up which vaibhav has given, look up a map of J&K which shows these features and try to mark them on GE. Books on military/war history tend to explain the Military Geography well. The one by General VP Malik on Kargil explains the geography pretty well in this region and beyond including Siachen. But the maps are not too great.

Forums which discuss hiking related topics offer good maps - many a times made by hikers themselves with geo coordinates.

One of the best sources of India maps, and especially about north, north-west, POK, Gilgit-Baltistan etc is this:

http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/india.html

Look for topographical maps there.

[Aditya G]

Ex Shatrujeet. T-55 and river crossing boat?

[Sid]

Some BRFite was claiming there were no T-50s in active service now.

[Khalsa]

Some BRFite was claiming there were no T-50s in active service now.

Thats a yes and a no.
There are no T-55s in service with the Armoured Corps.
T-55s were mothballed and our back up however the new reserves will be the T-72s.

The last two T-55s regiments have converted to Arjun Mk1.

The T-55 you see above are in service are now with the corps of Engineers.
They have inherited a lot of these.
So the Engrs are mainly using them for demining purposes under active threats and under fire.
They also provide a highly suitable battle wagon for carrying them into battle not to mention them keeping up with the Armoured Columns over terrain that may be unsuitable for their wheeled vehicles.

I found this out in another Exercise where I saw a picture of large column of T-55s crossing a field under the cover of choppers.

Never forget the motto of the Engrs.
First In, Last Out

[Lalmohan]

come to think of it, using T55's as battle taxis for the engineers is a really good idea
might even be an idea to modify the turret to take out the main gun and create more space for troops and equipment
the chassis is still pretty durable

[Karan M]

How are we using T-55s as battle taxis? How many engineers can they carry with equipment? Doens;'t add up..

[rohitvats]

^^^ These are not battle taxis. These are used with the mine ploughs. These are specific Engineering Regiments for this task.

[Lalmohan]

do they all have mine ploughs?