Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

The Military Issues & History Forum is a venue to discuss issues relating to the military aspects of the Indian Armed Forces, whether the past, present or future. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
Surya
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5034
Joined: 05 Mar 2001 12:31

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Surya » 07 Jan 2015 23:51

+100 d_berwal

vsunder
BRFite
Posts: 814
Joined: 06 Sep 1999 11:31
Location: Ulan Bator, Mongolia

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby vsunder » 08 Jan 2015 00:18

I think people on BRF speak too soon. Next time there is Red Flag or Cope India, the Gsuited reporter will go in, come here on the forum and say in a breathless tone, "how I went in" and the IAF pilot flew 60 sorties in a day and kicked butt big time and blah, blah, blah and people will say " dil mange more yeh jingo ka dil" and all will be ready to go to bed with these very same reporters.
Time and again I have noticed this and I predict the very same people who are negative today will be posting all positive things then. The best point is never to react to what they say here or do not say here, ignore them totally and their posts, as if they do not exist. The fact is they know they have an audience here so they manipulate you more so the youngsters and the impressionable ones who think this is playing ludo and snakes and ladders or video games. The day you stop taking interest in these purveyors they will naturally die out. Shiv had it right a long time ago, no linking and no discussing any news from Pakdeaf and the same strategy should be applied to these folks. Let them come and post, if there is no reaction they will have to go and get their egos high somewhere else no? But where else is there is a level of understanding of Defence matters other than on this forum and they crave your adulation, if you withold it their egos go for a toss. They need you and you are too eager to be enslaved by them.
Last edited by vsunder on 08 Jan 2015 00:20, edited 1 time in total.

sunilUpa
BRFite
Posts: 1795
Joined: 25 Sep 2006 04:16

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby sunilUpa » 08 Jan 2015 00:19

Berwal - +1. Puzzled by BRF putting up with such non sense.

ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 52780
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby ramana » 08 Jan 2015 00:45

Spinster was pointing out the boat episode is similar to the opening scene in "Guns of Navarone" and that Nevil Shute wrote a book "Most Secret" published in 1945 about a Royal Navy operation to launch an attack on Nazi occupied Europe using four officers and other ranks on a boat..

Rudradev
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3404
Joined: 06 Apr 2003 12:31

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Rudradev » 08 Jan 2015 00:47

Hari Seldon wrote:^^ Next time on, such boat-sinkings should happen completely quietly. No word to be leaked anywhere on dhimmedia or elsewhere.

Those in the know will know and those who need to know will get the message.

Not worth it, this song and dance by paid media pimples.


Very very very much worth it.

What has the result of the song-and-dance been?

The profound Pakistani allegiances and anti-national agendas of some very-high-profile media pimples, not to mention the Indian National Congress, have come under the full glare of public attention like.... well, like a terrorist trawler floodlit by a coast guard helicopter (and setting itself on fire).

Every statement these individuals and organizations retch forth on any other issue in the short-to-medium-term will be inescapably coloured by the diesel-red glow of their fulminations on this issue.

A much-needed dose of perspective, if you ask me. Even for some gents on this forum, who were making grand political statements about refusing to vote BJP if Modi didn't construct devalayas before shauchalayas, or some such thing. Helps to have a little reminder of the ever-present alternative lurking in the wings, and how far we have yet to go before we're out of the woods.

Prem
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21049
Joined: 01 Jul 1999 11:31
Location: Weighing and Waiting 8T Yconomy

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Prem » 08 Jan 2015 01:16

How true is that paki actually lost Agosta and rest is just cover up. :)

UlanBatori
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11689
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby UlanBatori » 08 Jan 2015 03:30

My sources say that the 4 on the boat were Musharraf, Shrilleen, Mullah Omar and Haqqani seeking refuge from Dronacharya, and they are now in (shhh!!! deleted) being de-briefed. (Yech! what a horrible thought!)

ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 52780
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby ramana » 08 Jan 2015 05:41

So after the Paris shooting the boat 'encounter' story has lost its sheen?

I still wonder at Pravin Swami's motives?

Shreeman
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3762
Joined: 17 Jan 2007 15:31
Location: bositiveneuj.blogspot.com
Contact:

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Shreeman » 08 Jan 2015 05:50

^^^ Wants to be the famoust eastern journ+analyst in western media. Imitating the news cycle bit regardless of what the ahdience cares about. Sardesai was no different. Everything must fit personal growth agenda.

kmkraoind
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3908
Joined: 27 Jun 2008 00:24

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby kmkraoind » 08 Jan 2015 08:32

So What Happened on New Year's Eve? - Vikram Sood

All this would make intelligence and security agencies in India edgy, as for them the crisis of 26/11 and the many before that are memories that will always linger. Intelligence agencies normally function on a worst-case scenario and work from that high base, eliminating threats. It also known that smugglers are commonly used as couriers or even to provide cover to terrorists (Remember Mumbai 1993). Moreover, terrorists do not come wearing uniforms or carrying genuine identity cards. The task of intelligence agencies is to detect, deter, and help destroy threats, and none of this is easy.
.........
The boat was apparently in the wrong place at the wrong time, and the choice was limited take the challenge to its logical conclusion, including shooting it down or blowing up the boat as soon as possible. Inviting the suspects over for a cup of tea to find out their plans was not an option the Coast Guard or anyone else had at that time. The venue was close to Porbunder, where the Prime Minister was scheduled to visit, and there would have been a high-security alert prior to the visit. There was no foolproof way of ascertaining whether the boat was on an innocent mission, was probing defences, or on a live operation. Refusal to respond to the challenge should be enough cause for suspicion, and an attempt to sail away, more so. The choice was limited to challenge and intercept, or pretend nothing happened. Any worthwhile force would have taken the first option.

partha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3989
Joined: 02 Jul 2010 15:25

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby partha » 08 Jan 2015 08:33

What pissed me off most about terror boat reporting was that Swami and his friends couldn't wait at least until the operation was over to raise questions. No, they had to do speculative reporting even before the CG ship was back to port and show that they are all anti establishment Sherlock Holmes. When the Pak jihadis have already demonstrated what they can do with boats, any unidentified boat in Indian waters trying to escape should be suspected as a terror boat by default. It's straight forward logic. This default line of giving clean chit to Pakistan and casting doubts about GoI even after 26/11 and that too in circumstances similar to that of 26/11 is deeply troubling. Please note that not a single question was raised by Swami and his friends on the Pakistani report on the incident. That report by a Pakistani journo in Indian Express was shared as if that was the ultimate truth. One Paki after an NDTV show on terror boat tried to project a BJP vs Rest (Paki + Congress + Swami and friends) image. It does look like Pakis are using Swami and friends like people as psy war tools. B Raman Sir was way ahead in spotting this.

Here is a good one by ex RAW chief Shri Vikram Sood - http://www.mid-day.com/articles/so-what ... e/15898185

Himalay
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 5
Joined: 22 Aug 2007 09:33

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Himalay » 08 Jan 2015 11:36

d_berwal wrote:
chackojoseph wrote:The plus point of the ops is that it will raise the cost for Pakis to communicate and take weirder routes for smuggling etc. The other side is UAE, Iran/ Oman etc who have also some good interception capabilities. Once they have a narrow corridor to operate they become more vulnerable. This puts pressure on Pakistan's state sponsored non state actors.


chacko...bhai thodi to sharam karooooo..... smuggling ?

Is Bharat ke kya din aa gaye ke is ke pute ise ke rakshak pe shak karte hai? aur ise desh/desh_ke_rashak ko nicha dhikata he?

Jab aap ke suraksha ke baat aye to is desh ke rekshaooo ko yaad matt karnaa....

very ssorryy to pen it downnn :( :( :(

chacko... bahi sharam hai ya pure besharam ho gaye hoooo!!!!

aap ne apne aap ko to baceh deya hai but desh ko to mat becho!!!!!

but desh ke aur us ke rakhwalooo ke aap ko kya perva... aap ke to lotri nikal gayeeee!!!!!



Our Coast Guard would have been very much within their rights, even to shoot and sink the intruder terror boat (which of course they did not do in this case)

Above, i think Mr. Chacko Joseph, has been mis-quoted... here, he is not referring to the current incident.. he is referring to other (ind-pak) smuggling activities, which has been going on for years.

chackojoseph
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4297
Joined: 01 Mar 2010 22:42
Location: From Frontier India
Contact:

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby chackojoseph » 08 Jan 2015 15:19

Himalay wrote:Our Coast Guard would have been very much within their rights, even to shoot and sink the intruder terror boat (which of course they did not do in this case)

Above, i think Mr. Chacko Joseph, has been mis-quoted... here, he is not referring to the current incident.. he is referring to other (ind-pak) smuggling activities, which has been going on for years.


Yes Himalaya. Thank you Very Much. I am referring to the plus points that this operations brings.

d_berwal
BRFite
Posts: 513
Joined: 08 Dec 2006 14:08
Location: Jhonesburg

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby d_berwal » 08 Jan 2015 16:25

@ Himalay @ Chacko ^^

Chacko is trying to imply that it was smuggling route so, thus his questioning of armed forces is justified (its all about implied meanings)

besharmi ke had hoti hai...... but app logo ka kya jata hai!!!

Mahendra
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4407
Joined: 11 Aug 2007 17:20
Location: Chronicling Bakistan's Tryst with Dysentery

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Mahendra » 08 Jan 2015 16:38

Plus point of 26/11 was that Mumbaikars got to hold candle light vigils and show western kind of solidarity with the victims. Now give me my lifafa

Mahendra
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4407
Joined: 11 Aug 2007 17:20
Location: Chronicling Bakistan's Tryst with Dysentery

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Mahendra » 08 Jan 2015 16:40

Four Marine boars and Suarpak viman got their 72 surely reason to rejoice?

rohitvats
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 7645
Joined: 08 Sep 2005 18:24
Location: Jatland

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby rohitvats » 08 Jan 2015 16:42

Akshay Kapoor wrote:<SNIP> You don't mess with fauji docs when they are treating casualties.


Trust you me, NO ONE even in the army or armed forces in general, mess with army doctors! :mrgreen:

Especially, the ones who are crack-pot enough to do a Para course - or, Para SF even...Imagine, a Nephrologist whom you've gone for consultation wearing a Balidan Badge :twisted:

Surya
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5034
Joined: 05 Mar 2001 12:31

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Surya » 08 Jan 2015 18:26

Above, i think Mr. Chacko Joseph, has been mis-quoted... here, he is not referring to the current incident.. he is referring to other (ind-pak) smuggling activities, which has been going on for years.


no he was not - it was a too clever by half attempt to keep his original line of argument since blown out of the water

pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11361
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby pankajs » 08 Jan 2015 18:53

My take on the media tamasha is rather simple.

Coast guard is kamoonal where as Navy is seecooler. So you see sending Coast guard to intercept the baki vessel was kamoonal square on account of the minority angle. That prompted an *enlightened* media to raise the logical question "Why was the Navy not deployed?" and "Why was the Navy not in the loop?"

Similarly, Dornier is kamoonal while UAV is seecooler. That is why there was much khujli when it was found that Dornier had been deployed instead of UAV for surveillance/tracking/monitoring and you had giants of media asking in unison "Why was the UAV not deployed?"

I mean can anyone on this forum imagine a *certified* seecooler government like CON led UPA deploying Dornier for surveillance and sending Coast guard for interception? India maintains the Coast guards and the Dorniers just to keep the yindoovadis busy and out of circulation to prevent them from creating any mischief. But with a kamoonal government at the helm what can you expect ...sigh.

The simplest explanation is almost always the correct one.

vishvak
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 5345
Joined: 12 Aug 2011 21:19

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby vishvak » 08 Jan 2015 20:40

This is also why we need stealth platform aircraft (FGFA/PAK-FA naval) in case even the Dornier the kamoonal not able to detect some terror boat from heaven.

The uncertified kamoonal did a total SoP investigation of a terror boat from heaven, but it looks like a hit job by uncertified on chota mota regular smuggling only.

A question is how come all the king's certified men and all the certified horses from all over never knew anything about smuggling route manned by some poor smuggler from Balochistan only? It will anyways take much time to find out actual people on the boat only. The ratholes run deep in Balochistan only which even the best of king's horses could not know.

d_berwal
BRFite
Posts: 513
Joined: 08 Dec 2006 14:08
Location: Jhonesburg

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby d_berwal » 08 Jan 2015 21:02

chackojoseph wrote:
Himalay wrote:Our Coast Guard would have been very much within their rights, even to shoot and sink the intruder terror boat (which of course they did not do in this case)

Above, i think Mr. Chacko Joseph, has been mis-quoted... here, he is not referring to the current incident.. he is referring to other (ind-pak) smuggling activities, which has been going on for years.


Yes Himalaya. Thank you Very Much. I am referring to the plus points that this operations brings.


Breaking News...2015 ke superduper hit Philm "Chacko Aur Himalya ke Love Story"

PratikDas
BRFite
Posts: 1916
Joined: 06 Feb 2009 07:46
Contact:

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby PratikDas » 08 Jan 2015 21:08

Surya wrote:
Above, i think Mr. Chacko Joseph, has been mis-quoted... here, he is not referring to the current incident.. he is referring to other (ind-pak) smuggling activities, which has been going on for years.


no he was not - it was a too clever by half attempt to keep his original line of argument since blown out of the water

+1

Prem
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21049
Joined: 01 Jul 1999 11:31
Location: Weighing and Waiting 8T Yconomy

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Prem » 08 Jan 2015 22:10

partha wrote:What pissed me off most about terror boat reporting was that Swami and his friends couldn't wait at least until the operation was over to raise questions. No, they had to do speculative reporting even before the CG ship was back to port and show that they are all anti establishment Sherlock Holmes. When the Pak jihadis have already demonstrated what they can do with boats, any unidentified boat in Indian waters trying to escape should be suspected as a terror boat by default. It's straight forward logic. This default line of giving clean chit to Pakistan and casting doubts about GoI even after 26/11 and that too in circumstances similar to that of 26/11 is deeply troubling.
Here is a good one by ex RAW chief Shri Vikram Sood - http://www.mid-day.com/articles/so-what ... e/15898185


He is on Twitter and quite receptive to enquiries.

K Mehta
BRFite
Posts: 955
Joined: 13 Aug 2005 02:41
Location: Bangalore

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby K Mehta » 08 Jan 2015 22:35

Devinder berwal Saab are you trying to get personal with chackoji?
Requesting mods to keep personal stuff out.

ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 52780
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby ramana » 09 Jan 2015 01:04

d_berwal,
you made your point in your post just before Surya's reply. So delete your other posts.

ramana

arshyam
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3334
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby arshyam » 09 Jan 2015 02:18

Saurav Jha's take on CSN improvements of late. As usual, lots of info, posting some snippets:

Terror boat incident brings India's post-Mumbai Coastal Security Network into focus

The feasibility study led by the ICG came up with a plan to implement CSN in two phases. Under Phase-I of the network, static sensors would be put up at 46 different locations along the Indian coast, with 36 on the mainland, 6 in the Lakshadweep & Minicoy Islands and 4 in the Andaman & Nicobar Islands. Phase-I, which is now complete, has been tailored to provide surveillance around areas of high sensitivity and traffic density along India's coast line. Near gap free real­time surveillance covering up to 25 nautical miles from the Indian coastline would however be achieved only with Phase-II, when 38 additional remote radar sites would be established as part of the CSN and these would be further complemented by some 8 mobile surveillance units.

As such, the project involves the setting up of frequency diversity radar, electro-optical sensors including CCD day cameras, low light television (LLTV) and thermal imagers, VHF sets and meteorological equipment on lighthouses and masts erected on DGLL land at up to 84 locations under both phases. The data generated by various static sensors would flow over a robust hierarchical network architecture, connecting ICG District Headquarters and Regional Headquarters to Coast Guard Headquarters in New Delhi.


Now despite CSN plugging into NAIS and various VTMS sites at ports along the Indian coastline there is concern that it would be able to identify only boats above a certain size. After all more than 2,00,000 small fishing boats operate from our coasts and several of these do not carry any kind of transponder whatsoever that would have otherwise plugged them in with the NAIS, CSN or VTMS. Indeed, it was just such a boat (typically less than 20-25 metres in length) that was used in the suspected terror attempt off the coast of Porbandar. The Mumbai 2008 attackers too came in such a boat.

So even if detected, final identification of friend from foe becomes a major issue for coastal security agencies when tracking very small vessels devoid of transformers. This is one of the reasons why the ICGS Rajratan was sent to physically tag the suspected Pakistani terror boat and investigate it.

It seems that at the moment the ICG and DGLL are also testing at least three different technologies for tagging and monitoring these kinds of small fishing boats. One of the technologies being trialled could involve the widespread use of radio frequency identification devices.


These vessels therefore represent a very complex asymmetric challenge for the defenders. They are made using easily available materials in workshops often in remote and forested locations. Yet they increase the costs of defending disproportionately. It is perhaps time that all concerned stakeholders start brainstorming on ways to defeat such threats before they manifest themselves. Besides refashioning deployment procedures perhaps using new modelling methods, attention will have to be given to garnering enough intelligence about networks that might be involved in the construction of such vessels, in order to neutralize the supply chain and expertise as it were.


Indeed regardless of the technology augmentation that the ICG's CSN represents, at the end of the day, given the sheer numbers of vessels that need to be tracked and the length of our coastline the role of intelligence cannot be highlighted enough. An extension of this would suggest that cultivating fishermen via outreach programs and making them an integral part of the CSN is imperative as is the need for multiple agencies to bury petty differences and share information in an actionable manner. Ultimately the real 'soft upgrades' in the security domain lie in getting the social network right as it were. The foiled terror boat attack shows that things may indeed be moving in the right direction for India on this front.

kish
BRFite
Posts: 959
Joined: 07 Jun 2010 23:53

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby kish » 09 Jan 2015 02:46

ramana wrote:So after the Paris shooting the boat 'encounter' story has lost its sheen?

I still wonder at Pravin Swami's motives?


Not just pravin, host of all leftist rags are at it. Its as if someone has tutored them to peddle the same theory. Remnants of Dynasty slaves in intelligence is helping the Dynasty to discredit this government.

This outlook piece says Shah-Doval duo has issued a gag order on leaks. But, it looks like it will take a couple of years for Modi govt to get rid of anti-nationals.

It gives the impression Team Modi is still not completely in control of all govt. machinery.

Why it was particularly important to garb this operation—seemingly routine in nature—in secrecy is a matter of conjecture. The operation was carried out under the supervision of Ajit Doval, informs a disgruntled source in the IB.



There are political implications. “The BJP is desperate for an easy victory and is impatient to take credit,” says Dr Ajai Sahni, Executive Director of the Institute of Conflict Management. So much so that contradictions and loopholes punctuate the official version of sequences of events that night.

The sleuths of intelligence agencies agree with Sahni and not with Amit Shah’s diatribes. There were series of leaks contradicting the official version. Doval promptly issued a gag order, say sources in the IB, to quell the discordant voices emanating from within the intelligence apparatus. A couple of days ago, the new IB Chief Dineshwar Sharma had an informal chat with select scribes to inform them about the gag order.


It’s unlikely that the " mysterious terror boat" will ever be investigated. Dirty tricks are played, not probed. For example it was never investigated who pumped bullets on S.A.R. Geelani in February 2005 after he was acquitted by the Delhi High Court, revoking his death sentence, in the Parliament Attack Case of 2001. He had, allegedly, blamed the IB under Doval for the attempt on his life.

arshyam
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3334
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby arshyam » 09 Jan 2015 02:56

^^ So they are trying to go after Doval now, interesting. Looks like our media wants only peaceful diplomatic IFS types to address national security, who have no clue what it is. A professional NSA seems to be giving serious indigestion to the MSM.

Gagan
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11091
Joined: 16 Apr 2008 22:25

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Gagan » 09 Jan 2015 03:51

kish wrote:informs a disgruntled source in the IB.



The sleuths of intelligence agencies agree with Sahni and not with Amit Shah’s diatribes.

AOA
The above sounds suspiciously like Hazrat Jahil Ham-ied's, "India ke Daaleet and Shooodaarrr pulis walon se andar ki khabar mili hai"

And these retards claim to be Journalists hain ji?
:rotfl:

chackojoseph
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4297
Joined: 01 Mar 2010 22:42
Location: From Frontier India
Contact:

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby chackojoseph » 09 Jan 2015 05:29

Pak boat: Will put forth evidence in due time, says government

There appears to be serious issue on the credibility of the claim that it was terror boat. Note that I am not saying it was terror boat or smuggling boat. Government is yet to bring out evidence that it is a terror boat and Parrikar's "circumstantial evidence" were more of rhetorical nature like why did they call maritime security (not specifying whom they called actually) and why did the occupants blow up the boat (which the CG says that the boat was first set on fire leading to explosion).

Below are the actual alerts as claimed by HT.
NTRO's alert to Coast Guard over Pak boat never mentioned terror. Here's what it said

“Suspect Pak entity… undertaking suspect transaction in area (340 km off Porbandar),” said the first alert sent out by the NTRO to the Coast Guard and the Navy on December 31, 2014. HT saw the alerts the NTRO sent to the coastal agencies.

The NTRO followed its “suspect Pak entity” alert with a second alert to the Navy and Coast Guard, which did not mention the word “terror” either and revised the boat’s location from 340 km off Porbandar to 357 km from Porbandar.

Anyone claiming that the issue has been conclusively decided that it was terror boat and using journalists as punching bags, they have to read the official statements coming out now.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

The idea of terror came only when the boat did not stop. There is no photographic evidence or visual evidence of presence of arms inside. Two jerrycan's with 200 liters of fuel was mentioned CG later.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Only a probe can now establish the truth.

sunilUpa
BRFite
Posts: 1795
Joined: 25 Sep 2006 04:16

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby sunilUpa » 09 Jan 2015 06:20

Yawn...first navy was not informed, not involved....and now this.

Chaccko bhai...thank god you accept it as Paki boat...that's reason enough for me to sink it. But let that not stop you...please continue with your agenda.

Sid
BRFite
Posts: 1638
Joined: 19 Mar 2006 13:26

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Sid » 09 Jan 2015 06:22

chackojoseph wrote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

The idea of terror came only when the boat did not stop. There is no photographic evidence or visual evidence of presence of arms inside. Two jerrycan's with 200 liters of fuel was mentioned CG later.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Only a probe can now establish the truth.


To be very frank even Porki media is not that suspicious as our media is. Folks who actually did are sitting quietly enjoying the whole tamasha.

Frankly if you were given all the resources to investigate this issue what actions will you take? Material evidence is nearly impossible to gather from wreckage. And given the situation any other CG in world would have taken similar actions. If something was wrong they would have hailed their Porki marine brothers on radio with distress call and they would have happily released the audio.

NTRO is not releasing the full audio of intercepts because that will close any possible leaks. If they will release everything related to a anti terror op it will make their next op that much harder. Is that so hard to understand?

Damn Italian Marines have been doing all the tamasha even after openly admitting of killing indian nationals on high seas.

But we have not heard same outrage and noise by our fellow jurnos on this issue? Only outrage by Italians officials have been reported in papers. Why sudden love for Porkis may we ask?

I for one do not even care for these Porkies, who for sure had something going on.

1. A boat of Porki origin.
2. Not responding when hailed on radio
3. Kept on trying to sail away from CG
4. Was monitored for whole day (commendable patience). US CG would have blown them after failing to respond on 2 or 3 attempt.
5. Was on same route which was used last time to massacre 160 of our own people.

Even if they were not terrorist CG had every right to use lethal force.

chackojoseph
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4297
Joined: 01 Mar 2010 22:42
Location: From Frontier India
Contact:

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby chackojoseph » 09 Jan 2015 06:44

Sid,

Take this question in spirit. If the same happens to Indian's then? We term it poor people who strayed across, bombed by jihadists pakis (which ofcource they are). Maloy Krishna Dhar once told me a fact that I really understood well. I was in favour of R&AW constituting a black ops team eliminating the enemies inside and outside. He said it would be a Frankenstein, which is the truth. If we conduct military actions without accountability, then we will turn out as another Pakistan.

Any military action, anywhere in the world, brings on diverse reactions. it includes patriotism, skepticism, anti action groups, saboteurs and vested interests. The list is not all inclusive. Just a couple in the entire discussion thread were seen patriots. Me, I am a skeptic. Majority, were seen as vested interest, as they were trying to desperately inflaming hatred for particular group and trying to personally attack the skeptics to make their leader look good. Some are using the opportunity to score the pent up grudges. There was another vested interest, which gave an opposite view of the happenings, in the Indian Express.

As most military actions, it lacks conclusive evidence. Journalists. historians, investigators, patriots etc will interpret in their own templates. Especially a right minded journalist will use word allegedly and will give both sides of the story, which includes pro and anti.

Only conclusive evidence can now salvage the situation.

Comer
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3574
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Comer » 09 Jan 2015 07:13

chackojoseph, have you come across any piece of evidence that clearly preclude them being terrorists?
Suppose if there is not overwhelming proof for a terror boat, what is the endgame here in your opinion?

Sid
BRFite
Posts: 1638
Joined: 19 Mar 2006 13:26

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Sid » 09 Jan 2015 07:25

CJ bro,

With all due respect this situation and actions by CG cannot be judged as a isolation incident. How many times Indina hijacked a boat to sail towards Karachi with intention to kill hundreds?

If you have a criminal track record and some cops starts chasing you they keep that thing in mind and excercise due caution and use deadly force when needed.

And you cannot get conclusive evidence in this scnerio. Thats a fact. You cant take this case to court and win it.

If you dont want to call it a terror boat, cool. But they acted suspeciously and got sunk in the end due to non compliance with law enforcement agency. I will stand by law enforcemnt agency in this case.

It would have been suspecious if CG had blown them on first contact. Then i would have called it overreaction and illigal act. But this op was executed for full day, how much due diligence do you want CG to excercise?

shyams
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 47
Joined: 18 Feb 2010 02:39

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby shyams » 09 Jan 2015 07:25

chackojoseph wrote:Sid,

Take this question in spirit. If the same happens to Indian's then? We term it poor people who strayed across, bombed by jihadists pakis (which ofcource they are). Maloy Krishna Dhar once told me a fact that I really understood well. I was in favour of R&AW constituting a black ops team eliminating the enemies inside and outside. He said it would be a Frankenstein, which is the truth. If we conduct military actions without accountability, then we will turn out as another Pakistan.



If Indians are to venture out in the open seas and talk over interceptable channels of communication (in a manner that raises the suspicions of our defense folks) and don't stop or submit to requests for even a "chat" with CG or Navy, then the Navy and/or CG should assume the worst and deal with them just like they did with the Pakistani boats..

You don't see US president hesitating to kill US citizens who go outside of US jurisdiction and work against US interests.

National security is supreme. Never forget that and never compromise it for anything else.

chackojoseph wrote:
Any military action, anywhere in the world, brings on diverse reactions. it includes patriotism, skepticism, anti action groups, saboteurs and vested interests. The list is not all inclusive. Just a couple in the entire discussion thread were seen patriots. Me, I am a skeptic. Majority, were seen as vested interest, as they were trying to desperately inflaming hatred for particular group and trying to personally attack the skeptics to make their leader look good. Some are using the opportunity to score the pent up grudges. There was another vested interest, which gave an opposite view of the happenings, in the Indian Express.

As most military actions, it lacks conclusive evidence. Journalists. historians, investigators, patriots etc will interpret in their own templates. Especially a right minded journalist will use word allegedly and will give both sides of the story, which includes pro and anti.

Only conclusive evidence can now salvage the situation.


A good Journlist is supposed to know that his job of "educating" the people on the basis of sound logic based upon facts should never compromise nation security and national interest. In the context of the current boat incident, you do not have both sides of the story. You just have one side and that is by the Indian govt. How can you construct theories out of thin air and they say that is the opposite side?

It is only the bad journlists who seek fame by trampling over national security who argue along the lines that you and your types are doing to our dear country.

The sad thing is while I don't think you are intentionally hurting the country, your actions and words in media do however hurt the nation more than any trained enemy combatant can. The seeds of doubt you are attempting to sow in the name of "seeking truth" when you don't have the capacity to do so in any form or fashion will weaken the govt. structure.

Please don't be a useful idiot (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot) to our enemies.

NEVER ever forget that democracy is just means to an end. The end being a safe and sound place where we Indians can live and prosper. Democracy is not an end in itself and therefore one should not take it to the extreme by questioning the govt. and the security apparatus for the minutest details. The govt. don't owe you media a damn thing with regards to the evidence. You the media is JUST the media, and not the judiciary to demand evidence. If you have concerns about safety of Indians then either go through our constitutional channels to redress your grievance - i.e. go to courts .

If you don't want to do that then please leave the country and seek citizenship in your "utopian" country where your concerns are addressed.

chackojoseph
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4297
Joined: 01 Mar 2010 22:42
Location: From Frontier India
Contact:

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby chackojoseph » 09 Jan 2015 07:33

saravana,

why do you assign me with the credit of believing that it was not a terror boat. I speculated it might not be one, citing some circumstances; and govt speculated it is one, citing circumstances. Just because some vested interest in the forum shouted their loudest does not mean truth has been established.

Neither me , nor govt has conclusively said that it is a terror boat or smuggling boat. I am asking for an investigation and the govt is saying that they will bring evidence after investigation.

Sid,

You are right. However, even CG did not call it a terror boat in the first release. They mentioned illicit transfer and setting up of fire and then explosion.

shyams

US does not hesitate but verify. Even in osama case, they had live link where prez was in the room to give the orders. Just as an example. They make mistakes inspite. A useful idiot can be an idiot who fans that it was definitely a terror boat. How can you be sure that pakis won't use that to advantage? In my opinion they rely on such useful idiots to fan enemity and disharmony.

shyams
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 47
Joined: 18 Feb 2010 02:39

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby shyams » 09 Jan 2015 07:39

chackojoseph wrote:Sid,

Any military action, anywhere in the world, brings on diverse reactions.

As most military actions, it lacks conclusive evidence. Journalists. historians, investigators, patriots etc will interpret in their own templates. Especially a right minded journalist will use word allegedly and will give both sides of the story, which includes pro and anti.

Only conclusive evidence can now salvage the situation.


You are absolutely correct in that most military actions lacks conclusive actions. What should also be noted is that unlike in India, in all other countries you don't see the media questioning the govt. with silly outlandish scenarios and peddling them as possible truth.

For e.g. did anyone ever ask in US media or any main stream media on whether Bin Laden could be captured alive. Why? Because in the end it did not matter. The govt. gave the story and media does not have a choice but to stick with it. Anything else outside of that would be speculation and not news.

Being a skeptic is good. But you have no right to spread your skepticism to the rest of the nation by misusing your position as a journalist if you don't have evidence to back it up. And copying another journalist's words does not constitute evidence. It is called plagiarism.

chackojoseph wrote:
Only conclusive evidence can now salvage the situation.


NO. This is totally absurd. GOI has given a side to the story. We trust the democratically elected govt. and the defense forces who are entrusted with national security under our constitution. Learn to deal with it.

Hari Seldon
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9219
Joined: 27 Jul 2009 12:47
Location: University of Trantor

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby Hari Seldon » 09 Jan 2015 07:47

^Sri chacko has a point here.

In the 26/1 case too, but for Kasab's capture due to Sri Tukaram Omble's courage and sacrifice - the high brow desi journalism community would join hands with the foreign journalist community in labeling it "an alleged act of terrorism plotted in Pakistan". No?

The tapes our agencies released of TSP-terrorist comms could also be 'allegedly' unverified, doctored etc. No?

Why, blaming the RSS or indian muslims or some such scapegoat then becomes so much easier.

shyams
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 47
Joined: 18 Feb 2010 02:39

Re: Breaking news: Coast guard intercepted terrorist boat

Postby shyams » 09 Jan 2015 07:49

chackojoseph wrote:saravana,

shyams

US does not hesitate but verify. Even in osama case, they had live link where prez was in the room to give the orders. Just as an example. They make mistakes inspite. A useful idiot can be an idiot who fans that it was definitely a terror boat. How can you be sure that pakis won't use that to advantage? In my opinion they rely on such useful idiots to fan enemity and disharmony.


A useful idiot is someone who goes to great lengths to undermine ones own country. Calling it a terror boat does NOT in any manner degrade our security establishment or the security apparatus. On other other hand your statement does degrade the security apparatus since the govt. will be forced to release evidence which will have compromise our intel channels. Hence I would prefer to be a lesser of a useful idiot than your are making yourself to be.

Your assumption that a "terror boar" is needed to fan enimity itself speaks volumes about your understanding of ground realities. Pakistan is a basket case and not something we can change. Deal with the reality.

Everyone makes mistake. But we need to learn to know when to stop pushing our govt. into something that could have a negative impact.

I still see that you are hung up on "terror boat" vs "non-terror boat". At this point, the issue is not about the right classification of the boat, but rather the attitude of the media which is showing a penchant for not trusting the govt.


Return to “Military Issues & History Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Ambar and 45 guests