India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

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vinod
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby vinod » 04 Jan 2016 20:53

SBajwa wrote:Defense minister should declare that since terrorism has no religion we have decided to burn the bodies of the killed militants with pork, etc fat. Get this televised across around the world so that Jihadis and wannabe jihadis are deterred. no body means no 72 hoors.


If body is not claimed, they should be treated as above. This is the ONLY way to stop these B*****

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby kit » 04 Jan 2016 21:40

and certainly no economic deals that can benefit Pakistan in any way ! ..forget the pipeline.. without india that is a dead duck

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby sudeepj » 04 Jan 2016 21:41

Our only option is to grit our teeth and recalibrate our strategic goals in the near term to be as below.

Adopt
1. Degradation of Pak capability to support Jihad and to deter Jihadis using offensive capability against PakMil, intelligence and also the Jihadi leaders.
2. Degrade Pak capability to mount a conventional challenge to Indian forces, were they to "go in" for counter terror operations.

Giveup
1. We should give up on strategic pipe dreams of "peace within our time", that is not possible with the venom injected into Pak society and leadership.
2. Actual Economic cooperation. (But talks about economic cooperation must go on, and on, and on...)


By giving up on the option of offensive irregular warfare, Indian leadership has let down millions of Indian victims of Pak sponsored Jihadi terrorism.

MQM/Altaf bhai and Pakhtoon nationalists remain our best bet.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Ramu » 04 Jan 2016 22:00

SBajwa wrote:Defense minister should declare that since terrorism has no religion we have decided to burn the bodies of the killed militants with pork, etc fat. Get this televised across around the world so that Jihadis and wannabe jihadis are deterred. no body means no 72 hoors.


Absolutely! This should be institutionalised and documented for every other country to follow. This is fighting ideology with ideology. Even the lone superpower gave sea burial to sheikh osama shaheed.

It took 15 years of power before Putin could properly flex his muscle by taking crimea and wither western economic blockade. It will take us time to weed out internal threats and build muscle. So far the efforts in buildin up intelligence and war fighting capability itself is commendable. But its been a huge disappointment in terms of media regulations. It is no more an anti bjp/anti modi media. certain sections are outright antinational.

May be in 10 years time we may have a putin equivalent who can capture Lahore, put economic sanctions, send few cruise missiles towards muridke & karachi. But now is time for baby steps.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby SBajwa » 04 Jan 2016 22:14

Having more economic ties with Bakistan means we are putting ourselves into much deeper hell hole.

1. A terrorist has to destroy a Pipeline at will of ISI or Army to hurt India any time they want in their own area.

2. Congoons/Aapturds/etc just have to convey across the border to go easy on Onions, tomatoes, potatoes, cotton, etc (whatever we import) and they easily win elections due to "Price of Onions, etc".

3. Playing cricket with the Terrorist country means more opportunity for the terrorists to come in as "cricket lovers"

4. Selling them electricity means they can stop paying the bill whenever they want., no option for us., same thing with other things.

5. Nawaz Sharif only wants his ittefaq group of industries to thrive by exporting to India. We already have hundreds of companies better than Ittefaq.

Our only option is to not talk and massive retaliation each time (get ammunition factories in full production) Talks and business to resume only when we get masood azhar, saeed hafez, omar sheikh, zargar, I-814 hijackers, saladeen and UJC, Dawood and Chhota Shakeel., along with other assorted terrorists.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby KJo » 04 Jan 2016 22:29

I don't think we should do pork etc. Just do a "Ghar Wapsi" to the bodies and cremate according to Hindu rites hoping the atma goes to swarga instead of jannat.
Pork cremation will not reflect well on us.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby sanjaykumar » 04 Jan 2016 23:12

When I plan my career moves, I plan 2 steps ahead, including plans B and C. India gets an expected terrorist strike and responds by convening a parley of all living ex-High Commissionars.

I have to commend Indian optimism.


(For those sarcasm challenged, I am disgusted more by India than Pakistan).

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby BajKhedawal » 04 Jan 2016 23:45

sanjaykumar wrote:(For those sarcasm challenged, I am disgusted more by India than Pakistan).


You sir are welcome to the company of Shahrukh Khan, Amir Khan, Sonia Maino, Rahul Maino Gandhi, Burkha Dutt, Sagrika Ghosh, Rajdeep Sardesai, Arundhati Suzzane Roy, Pranoy Roy.....etc

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby A Sharma » 04 Jan 2016 23:47

As per G Parthasarathy on Barkha show , he said ex-High Commissioners meeting was pre-planned and had nothing to do with Pathankot incident.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby ramana » 05 Jan 2016 00:12

Good of GP for bringing out the matter.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby ldev » 05 Jan 2016 00:15

Get 12 S400 systems with 96 launchers to provide saturation defence to block any Pakistan retaliation. And do it if necessary by paying the Russians a premium of $10 billion to have those systems in place within the next 2-3 months. And then for every terrorist attack into India, launch a salvo of Brahmos missiles targeting ISI headquarters in Islamabad, PAF Sargodha, etc. Cause real pain to the Pak Army and the ISI for any attack terror attack on India.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby sudeepj » 05 Jan 2016 00:45

ldev wrote:Get 12 S400 systems with 96 launchers to provide saturation defence to block any Pakistan retaliation. And do it if necessary by paying the Russians a premium of $10 billion to have those systems in place within the next 2-3 months. And then for every terrorist attack into India, launch a salvo of Brahmos missiles targeting ISI headquarters in Islamabad, PAF Sargodha, etc. Cause real pain to the Pak Army and the ISI for any attack terror attack on India.


This was precisely what was done by the Americans. Where they were able to find an anti-American insurgent, they bombed him. Were they able to achieve their strategic goals? If not, how will India that
(a) Does not have the luxury of being on the other side of the planet, separated by at least two oceans on either side from Pakistan.
(b) Does not have the technological ability
(c) Does not have the cultural homogeneity

as the Americans be able to achieve its goals?

Developing our Covert capability is the only option on the table. All visible actions by the Union of India need to be legal, and according to the principals of international law and diplomacy. But RAW/IB/MI on the other hand can ...

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby NRao » 05 Jan 2016 00:55

The problem is ISI and the PA.

Who ever are their sponsors need a visit from India. No matter who they are.

If that does not help then go to the next step and act. There will be collateral damage for sure. But with warning.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby ldev » 05 Jan 2016 01:04

sudeepj wrote:
ldev wrote:Get 12 S400 systems with 96 launchers to provide saturation defence to block any Pakistan retaliation. And do it if necessary by paying the Russians a premium of $10 billion to have those systems in place within the next 2-3 months. And then for every terrorist attack into India, launch a salvo of Brahmos missiles targeting ISI headquarters in Islamabad, PAF Sargodha, etc. Cause real pain to the Pak Army and the ISI for any attack terror attack on India.


This was precisely what was done by the Americans. Where they were able to find an anti-American insurgent, they bombed him. Were they able to achieve their strategic goals? If not, how will India that
(a) Does not have the luxury of being on the other side of the planet, separated by at least two oceans on either side from Pakistan.
(b) Does not have the technological ability
(c) Does not have the cultural homogeneity

as the Americans be able to achieve its goals?

Developing our Covert capability is the only option on the table. All visible actions by the Union of India need to be legal, and according to the principals of international law and diplomacy. But RAW/IB/MI on the other hand can ...


The objective is to raise the costs to the Pak Army and the ISI by directly targeting them. How will they respond to these Brahmos salvos? Clearly by launching counter attacks against India via aircraft, ballistic missiles and cruise missiles. That is where the S400s come in for defence. Also certainly additional terror attacks are possible, additional shelling along the border etc. The big difference is that they will pay a big price by these Indian attacks by being attacked directly in retaliation. As of today they are sitting pretty. And that Indian retaliation could be the deterrent needed.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby sudeepj » 05 Jan 2016 02:48

ldev wrote:The objective is to raise the costs to the Pak Army and the ISI by directly targeting them. How will they respond to these Brahmos salvos? Clearly by launching counter attacks against India via aircraft, ballistic missiles and cruise missiles. That is where the S400s come in for defence. Also certainly additional terror attacks are possible, additional shelling along the border etc. The big difference is that they will pay a big price by these Indian attacks by being attacked directly in retaliation. As of today they are sitting pretty. And that Indian retaliation could be the deterrent needed.


For sure, cost will be raised for both us and them. But if our objective is to stop these 'ruin your day' nuisance attacks, what if the Paks dont stop? We cant continue in an indefinite state of war, lobbing over missiles and bombs.. What happens when the Paks react and make the lives of our citizens difficult?

If we had the kind of conventional superiority that the US has, that made the US nearly impervious to any Pak retaliation, Paks would have rolled over (or have pretended to roll over) by now. This means that "ghus ke marenge" type targeting of the cannon fodder jihadis, even senior leadership will only give us temporary, tactical respite, a kind of ugly stalemate. Reaching out and touching the generaals, colonels (and even the journalist mullahs) is something that hasnt been tried yet and should, IMO, help a lot. But doing so in an overt way will lead to a war like situation that will make lives difficult for us and our own populace.

Therefore, one should stop diddling the missiles and start talking to the MQMs. A little less Brahmos and a lot more Balouch. Pakhtoon nationalism is going to be a very potent tool going forward.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby ldev » 05 Jan 2016 03:44

sudeepj wrote:
For sure, cost will be raised for both us and them. But if our objective is to stop these 'ruin your day' nuisance attacks, what if the Paks dont stop? We cant continue in an indefinite state of war, lobbing over missiles and bombs.. What happens when the Paks react and []make the lives of our citizens difficult?[/b]


With an economy 9x that of Pakistan and the gap becoming bigger every year, India can afford those costs more than Pakistan. There will be no defeating Pakistan without some costs to the citizens. Made for TV wars are only fought by the US.

Have an impregnable (or as close to impregnable as possible) air/missile defence. Then start lobbing those Brahmos/Nirbhay missiles every time there is a terrorist attack. Pakistan will try and escalate, no doubt about it. Shoot down their aircraft/missiles/cruise missiles with the S400/Akash other ballistic missile defences. Sure, a few will get through, but the cost to Pakistan will be 10x more than India.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Nikhil T » 05 Jan 2016 04:16

S-400s/paying $10b to Russkies/lobbing missiles at PAF bases/

Time to wind up (or stay away) from this thread.

/rant

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby RoyG » 05 Jan 2016 04:24

Just hit their consulate/embassy in Nepal. Simple first step. This will buy us some time.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby SSundar » 05 Jan 2016 05:20

Gurus,

Is a single Brahmos strike to flatten the JeM or LeT headquarters too much of an escalation? What are the parameters here?

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby sudeepj » 05 Jan 2016 05:26

Nikhil T wrote:S-400s/paying $10b to Russkies/lobbing missiles at PAF bases/

Time to wind up (or stay away) from this thread.

/rant


Fire Nirbhayas that we don't have, and ward off the counter attack using S-400s that we ALSO dont have!

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Screambowl » 05 Jan 2016 05:30

SSundar wrote:Gurus,

Is a single Brahmos strike to flatten the JeM or LeT headquarters too much of an escalation? What are the parameters here?


Better take opportunity of shia sunni conflict which has gained momentum. And Pakistan is trying to suppress it in within it's territory. More over in 4 days, Saudi FM will be arriving in Pakistan to persuade them for joining the sunni coalition led by Saudi Arab.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby ldev » 05 Jan 2016 05:50

sudeepj wrote:
Nikhil T wrote:S-400s/paying $10b to Russkies/lobbing missiles at PAF bases/

Time to wind up (or stay away) from this thread.

/rant


Fire Nirbhayas that we don't have, and ward off the counter attack using S-400s that we ALSO dont have!


Moral of the story. Buy weapons that can be used to address the specific threats that India faces from Pakistan and to escalate if necessary. Otherwise be prepared to hand wring every time there is a terror attack.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby sudeepj » 05 Jan 2016 06:14

Apologies for the harsh tone, but the discussion was to figure out the kind of retaliation possible. Instead we have members going into flights of fancy lobbing imaginary bombs from imaginary planes and shooting down imaginary counter attacks by yet more imaginary S-400s that we will procure spending, you guessed it, imaginary dollars. The only thing left is to make pew-pew sounds as we go about it.

Fact is, the kind of superiority that will make conventional attacks deep inside Pak feasible, i.e. we can either deter or shoot down any counter attack, will require a budget that is perhaps twice what we have right now. It'll also take years if not decades to materialize because these complex weapon systems take that much time to operationalize. In the current global economic environment, even a whiff of war or quasi war will scare away investors. When people invest billions, they expect that their investments will not go up in smoke.. They will support a war, but only one in which they can be sure their investments stay safe! Same can be said about domestic capitalists.

Few jingos going pew-pew on a forum do not a war make.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby UlanBatori » 05 Jan 2016 07:35

Immediate Befitting Reply Plans:
1. Downgrade Nawaz Sharif's invitation card to Republic Day Parade. He will now be seated in Burkha section where he will have his bottom pinched by the Bibis/ Mothermas there.

2. Change the notice on the wall outside Pakistan Embassy/High Commission from "Stick No Bills" to "Biss Freely, Biss Often".

3. Remove (external) ladder to the roof of the Samjhauta Express. After it has been boarded and is ready to leave from Wagah to Dilli.

THAT oughta teach 'em!

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby SwamyG » 05 Jan 2016 08:04

ramana wrote:Need to close down criminal, police and politician (CPP) networks in India first.

Both Mumbai (1993, 2008) and Punjab (2015, 2016) attacks are due to these networks.

these are within Indian sphere of control.

When CPP starts impacting national security its no longer a crime issue.

Arnab seems to be picking things from BRF :rotfl: He was wondering about connection between Cops and Drug cartel.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby ldev » 05 Jan 2016 08:43

sudeepj wrote:Apologies for the harsh tone, but the discussion was to figure out the kind of retaliation possible. Instead we have members going into flights of fancy lobbing imaginary bombs from imaginary planes and shooting down imaginary counter attacks by yet more imaginary S-400s that we will procure spending, you guessed it, imaginary dollars. The only thing left is to make pew-pew sounds as we go about it.

Fact is, the kind of superiority that will make conventional attacks deep inside Pak feasible, i.e. we can either deter or shoot down any counter attack, will require a budget that is perhaps twice what we have right now. It'll also take years if not decades to materialize because these complex weapon systems take that much time to operationalize. In the current global economic environment, even a whiff of war or quasi war will scare away investors. When people invest billions, they expect that their investments will not go up in smoke.. They will support a war, but only one in which they can be sure their investments stay safe! Same can be said about domestic capitalists.

Few jingos going pew-pew on a forum do not a war make.


I dont even know where to begin when faced with such a defeatist attitude. :((

Everybody thought war was expensive because it has been drummed into people's head via watching television and reading about the way the US fights wars. How come the Russian's are fighting an expeditionary war which is costing them less than $5-10 million per day according to estimates? And making a difference in that war in Syria?

Just because the babus in the MOD take 15 years to finalize an MRCA and another 5 years to induct it, does not mean that is how should be done. If India is serious about fighting terrorism, then something different has to be tried. All that paper and pen pushing endless files down rows of babus has to stop.

If the US can induct Patriot batteries into Turkey and the Middle East at will and if the Russians can induct S400 batteries into Syria within 24 hours, are you saying that India cannot induct a basic defence in 3 months? Yes, crew training will not be complete and no it will not be perfect, but it will be a defence so that when the next terror attack happens, as will will, India will have something to respond with and protect itself with. And the Russians are asking $500 million per system, so 12 of them will be $6 billion and if you pay them something extra I am sure that you can negotiate for something quicker. If the Rafale can be bought for $8-9 billion and won't be seen in IAF colors till 2018/9 and then a measly 36 of them, why not spend money smartly? Money that will allow India to fight the wars that it faces, the terror attacks which are relentless and to be able to respond.

As far as investors are concerned, they will always stay if your defences are good enough . Are investors fleeing Seoul even though it is within artillery range of North Korea and the sabre rattling that goes on there all the time? No, investors will flee when they see that you cannot even defend yourself nor the will to defend yourself. That is the problem in India today. It needs a robust impenetrable defence. Something like the S400 will protect India's assets from air/missile attacks should India decide to retaliate. As far as domestic investors are concerned, they already invest whereever the grass is greener. And foreign investment in India is a FII game.

Money on defence in India needs to be spent smarter on needs that will make a difference to respond to current threats.

Of course one can support your argument and do nothing. After all India has 1.3 billion people and growing. Does it really matter if a few hundred or even a few thousand die every year due to terror attacks? Maybe the supply of humans is so overwhelming that a few thousand dying is OK to protect the welfare of the remaining billion +. And then one can simply roll over and :(( every time there is a terror attack.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby ldev » 05 Jan 2016 08:43

sudeepj wrote:Apologies for the harsh tone, but the discussion was to figure out the kind of retaliation possible. Instead we have members going into flights of fancy lobbing imaginary bombs from imaginary planes and shooting down imaginary counter attacks by yet more imaginary S-400s that we will procure spending, you guessed it, imaginary dollars. The only thing left is to make pew-pew sounds as we go about it.

Fact is, the kind of superiority that will make conventional attacks deep inside Pak feasible, i.e. we can either deter or shoot down any counter attack, will require a budget that is perhaps twice what we have right now. It'll also take years if not decades to materialize because these complex weapon systems take that much time to operationalize. In the current global economic environment, even a whiff of war or quasi war will scare away investors. When people invest billions, they expect that their investments will not go up in smoke.. They will support a war, but only one in which they can be sure their investments stay safe! Same can be said about domestic capitalists.

Few jingos going pew-pew on a forum do not a war make.


I dont even know where to begin when faced with such a defeatist attitude. :((

Everybody thought war was expensive because it has been drummed into people's head via watching television and reading about the way the US fights wars. How come the Russian's are fighting an expeditionary war which is costing them less than $5-10 million per day according to estimates? And making a difference in that war in Syria?

Just because the babus in the MOD take 15 years to finalize an MRCA and another 5 years to induct it, does not mean that is how it should be done. If India is serious about fighting terrorism, then something different has to be tried. All that paper and pen pushing endless files down rows of babus has to stop.

If the US can induct Patriot batteries into Turkey and the Middle East at will and if the Russians can induct S400 batteries into Syria within 24 hours, are you saying that India cannot induct a basic defence in 3 months? Yes, crew training will not be complete and no it will not be perfect, but it will be a defence so that when the next terror attack happens, as it will, India will have something to respond with and protect itself with. And the Russians are asking $500 million per system, so 12 of them will be $6 billion and if you pay them something extra I am sure that you can negotiate for a quick delivery. If the Rafale can be bought for $8-9 billion and won't be seen in IAF colors till 2018/9 and then a measly 36 of them, why not spend money smartly? Money that will allow India to fight the wars that it faces, the terror attacks which are relentless and to be able to respond.

As far as investors are concerned, they will always stay if your defences are good enough . Are investors fleeing Seoul even though it is within artillery range of North Korea and the sabre rattling that goes on there all the time? No, investors will flee when they see that you cannot even defend yourself nor the will to defend yourself, so how will you defend their investment? That is the problem in India today. It needs a robust impenetrable defence. Something like the S400 will protect India's assets from air/missile attacks should India decide to retaliate. As far as domestic investors are concerned, they already invest whereever the grass is greener. And foreign investment in India is a FII game.

Money on defence in India needs to be spent smarter on needs that will make a difference to respond to current threats.

Of course one can support your argument and do nothing. After all India has 1.3 billion people and growing. Does it really matter if a few hundred or even a few thousand die every year due to terror attacks? Maybe the supply of humans is so overwhelming that a few thousand dying is OK to protect the welfare of the remaining billion +. And then one can simply roll over and :(( every time there is a terror attack.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Prem » 05 Jan 2016 10:15

sudeepj wrote:
Nikhil T wrote:S-400s/paying $10b to Russkies/lobbing missiles at PAF bases/
Time to wind up (or stay away) from this thread. /rantFire Nirbhayas that we don't have, and ward off the counter attack using S-400s that we ALSO dont have!


Apparently going rate to buy suicide bomber from Jihadi seminaries in pakiland is about 10k. 10-12 Billions will buy more than million of them to put 3/4 of Poakootars on train to station 72.
Last edited by Prem on 05 Jan 2016 10:19, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Philip » 05 Jan 2016 10:17

The feeling in the country across the board is so inflamed that any attempt to save Nawaz Sharif from the attack responsibility will diminish enormously Mr.Modi and the govt's reputation and credibility. After all Nawaz S is the PM of Pak and responsible for the actions committed by his men in uniform.He cannot shirk it.The very fact that he has kept silent,or been forced to keep silent by the army chief indicates that he is party to the backstabbing,as he behaved in similar fashion when Mush-a-Rat stabbed ABV at Kargil.

There has to be a long period of a diplomatic cold war and ostracism of Pak by India to see if it changes tack (little chance),before diplomatic action is supported by a gradation of mil action overt and covert.
Pak only learns its lesson and squeals when it has a bayonet up its backside. The glee on the faces of the Paki talking heads on the Arnab show was so evident, that one expected them to pop a bottle of bubbly so delirious with joy where they.

The stark fact is that we are NOT ready for any kind of mil action at this moment.There's a huge amt. of repair work to be done to the armed forces.This will take a few years to rectify.Knee-jerk upping of Rafales is not the answer.I've pointed out a few ideas in an above post. For our Afghan policy,boots on the ground is asinine.Look at the experience of the US and NATO.We need to work together with Russia and the Central Asian states to support the Afghan govt. in a coalition.India cannot do it alone,we don't have either the money or need to spill the precious blood of our jawans in that firang land. To paraphrase Bismarck, "Afghanistan is not worth the blood of one Indian sapper...." It has been the graveyard of armies for centuries. Let it be Pakistan's graveyard not India's!

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Altair » 05 Jan 2016 10:39

ldev wrote:Get 12 S400 systems with 96 launchers to provide saturation defence to block any Pakistan retaliation. And do it if necessary by paying the Russians a premium of $10 billion to have those systems in place within the next 2-3 months. And then for every terrorist attack into India, launch a salvo of Brahmos missiles targeting ISI headquarters in Islamabad, PAF Sargodha, etc. Cause real pain to the Pak Army and the ISI for any attack terror attack on India.

This wont work because the 4 fathers want Pakistan to remain a 1-800-Army4Hire. If we destroy all infra, US will ensure Pak will be rebuilt from scratch and make them even more powerful.
The best option I believe is the Israeli option. We gather enough intelligence on people and network of Jihadi industry and develop deep strike options using Unmanned Lethal Drones. We go after mid level commanders no body cares about. Kill them regularly and it will become a recruiting problem. It is easier to recruit dummy guys who can explode themselves. It is not easy to hire leaders who can rally these dummy guys who are in excess supply to ISI and its subsidiaries.
Israel goes after mid level leaders. It lets people like Khaled Mashal to survive eventhough all it takes is one missile strike to neutralize him.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby UlanBatori » 05 Jan 2016 11:11

Temporary Sanity Break:
Heard on Tee Vee today:
GOI has "passed on the evidence of Pakistani complicity in the attack to the Pakistan authorities. They have not **COMPLETELY** rejected the evidence yet.


So, in Free India, in 2016 the Government Of The People By The People, 4 Da PPL, sees fit to pass on the tough, clinching evidence of Pakistani complicity in terror attacks TO THE PAKISTAN GOVERNMENT - IOW the perpetrators!!


Therefore this information is in the public domain, and worse: it has been given to the enemy.

My question with all doo respect:

WTF is the hangup preventing this government from sharing the **SAME** information with the aam log who went and voted them into power, and pay the salaries of the EyeEffEss Baboos?

Are Indian voters so far below goddamn Pakistan sh1theads in the esteem of the Government Babus?

Why is this question not being asked, please?

shaun
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby shaun » 05 Jan 2016 11:15

hire foreign mercenaries to kill the top echelon of isi with their piglets and covertly equipping balochs is the best options India have and ofcourse , equipping and training the ANA. Talks with dosas should continue in between.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Aditya G » 05 Jan 2016 11:33

Following appreciation is purportedly by a SF officer. Clear thinking and articulated in minimum words.

http://jagrukbharat.com/uncategorized/1639/

ATTACK ON 18 WING : IAF AIRBASE PATHANKOT..ACT OF WAR
By Admin, jagrukbharat.comView OriginalJanuary 5th, 2016

ATTACK ON 18 WING : IAF AIRBASE PATHANKOT

1.18 WING ,IAF is located at Pathankot in the state of Punjab. The IAF base was attacked by a group of Pakistanti terrorists on 02 Jan16. These Pakistanis were trained and armed inside their camps in Pakistan. They were then briefed regarding their mission in one of those training camps located in side Pakistan and there after infiltrated through Pakistani BORDER into India. Once inside India, they still remained in constant touch with their Controllers inside Pakistan.

2. This attack on our IAF airbase SHOULD NOT repeat SHOULD NOT be called AN ACT OF TERROR OR TERRORIST ATTACK. Instead in all our Official Statements, TV and Print Media and every utterance from our Countrymen should term this AN ACT OF WAR. Thus our Airbase has been attacked by an ENEMY.

3. Now who is this ENEMY? Presently the Enemy remains unidentified but in time to come whoever may be responsible will be identified. Then we will go all out to destroy that ENEMY. However as they have come into India from the soil of Pakistan, through the Pakistani border controlled by the Govt of Pakistan , therefore the Govt of Pakistan and the people of Pakistan have to bear the responsibility . Incase they are not forth coming to own up their share of the blame for this attack then we must apportion a proportionate share of the blame on them. As we are a responsible democratic nation we will not be unreasonable and therefore in this instance we will apportion not more than 30 % on the Govt of Pakistan and just 10% blame on the People of Pakistan for having elected such an Govt. Next such incident and the percentage of blame increases accordingly.

4. Now the action part. The comfort level of all the ACTORS…Terrorist Organisations, Terrorist Leadership, Govt of Pakistan, Pakistan Armed Forces and the People of Pakistan… has to be brought down notch by notch , till either such ATTACKS end or the comfort level ENDS . For every such ATTACK, there has to be a well calibrated , gradually upgraded retaliatory action from our side . The retaliatory action from our side may be one of actions listed below or a combination or all action as listed , simultaneously:

[a] Diplomatic Action

[b] Economic Retaliating

[ c] Overt intelligence Retaliation

[ d] Overt Military Retaliation on the LOC / LC

[ e] Covert intelligence Retaliation

[f ] Covert Military Retaliation

[ g] Cultural/ Sports Retaliation

5. [a]DIPLOMATIC ACTION. This has to be immediate. We continue the Talks but at Embassy level only, with constant threat of down grading it to Consular level. No PM/ FM/ NSA level talks. Matter to be raised at all International Forums, Regional Forums and wherever possible. Pakistan to be totally isolated within SAARC, South East Asia, ASEAN and wherever possible in Middle East and Europe.Ask Pakistan to hand over the Terrorist Leadership as per our list starting with Sallauddin.

[b] ECONOMIC ACTION . Certain economic sanctions in the form of ban on Export / Import of selected goods to be imposed forth with , with a threat to expand the list. Ask Pakistan to freeze the bank and all economic assets of all the Terrorist Outfits. Ask other countries todo the same or they too may face actions as deemed fit by us [ we will not spell it out and just keep them wondering ]. Through use of NAVAL DEMONSTRATION STRATEGY keep the threat of blockade of Pakistan alive.

[ c ] OVERT INTELLIGENCE RETALIATION . All out action against outfits/ modules/ suspects within own country and internationally with help of friendly Countries.

[d ] COVERT INTELLIGENCE RETALIATION. Establish contact with Baluch, Pakhtoon and Sindh Freedom Fighters. Gradually provide training and increase supply of weapons and equipment. Later plan for joint covert operations. Target militant leadership inside Pakistan and in other countries too.

[e ] OVERT MILITARY ACTION. Target all known militant camps within range of Medium Arty/ rockets and issuethreat of use of BRAHAMOS AND ARMED UAVs. First announce and then strike by UAV the last known position of Sayyed Sallaudin. Heavy arty retaliation on any attempted act of Infiltration.

[ f] COVERT MILITARY ACTION. A few cross border raids at Formation level in selected areas. At least one major well planned raid on an important Militant Organisational HQ / Major Camp by our Special Forces and brazenly deny it but keep talking about PEACE all the time 24 * 7.

[ g ] CULTURAL AND SPORTS RELATIONSHIP . All bilateral sports ties to be cancelled . Cultural ties initially only on case to case basis .

6. Govt of India has to fine tune the above response and we the people must support it. The Media too has to share the National Aim

habal
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby habal » 05 Jan 2016 11:44

>> The feeling in the country across the board is so inflamed that any attempt to save Nawaz Sharif from the attack responsibility will diminish enormously Mr.Modi and the govt's reputation and credibility

Nawaz Sharif may not be able to physically stop ISI-sponsored elements from entering India, but he can through his eyes & ears in certain circles warn India of impending attacks. And that is what may have happened, so it is not exactly good cop-bad cop but sheer helplessness to overwhelm the strongest institution in that country which is constantly challenging NS political chain of command. NS should work with India in overwhelming pakistan army and taking them down a notch or two. If not, he is part of the problem.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Comer » 05 Jan 2016 11:57

Establishing a military foothold with the permission of Afghanistan Govt is one way to go. Squeeze the Pakis from the other side as well.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Y. Kanan » 05 Jan 2016 13:18

SBajwa wrote:Why can't we just mine...

Also why are we still giving "Islamic burials" to these Jihadis? Just burn them in pork fat! and get some Maulvi to declare a Fatwa that burned bodies with pork fat are declined in Heaven!


There's no money left to fund a truly secure border; we thiught it a better idea buy aircraft carriers while the BSF goes underfunded.

As for your pigfat idea; I wonder how our own muslims would react? I like the idea but India lacks the stomach for that sort of thing.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby member_28990 » 05 Jan 2016 14:48

No amount of money, equipment, missiles, nukes, training, robots, tanks, Djinns can help someone to grow a backbone. Ram went and led an expedition to what was then superpower of the time with an army of irregulars. Kurukshetra happened because evil must be fought against, no matter what the costs are. What is happening across media and political establishment is nothing but a reflection of the cowardice and spinelessness of the national population at large. We are so busy squabbling among ourselves for our petty problems that any 'duty' to nation is equated to 'demand' and 'injustice.' The biggest fear our politicians have is not pak retaliation, but a subsequent election loss if there is a war and the daily life of our entitled citizens in 'inconvenienced.'

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby rajanb » 05 Jan 2016 15:02

Shaun wrote:hire foreign mercenaries to kill the top echelon of isi with their piglets and covertly equipping balochs is the best options India have and ofcourse , equipping and training the ANA. Talks with dosas should continue in between.


I agree. And randomly take out ISI assets in third countries. Revenge is sweet when it is dished out cold and at leisure. And a Bakistani General or two when he is having a happy ending massage somewhere.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Chinmayanand » 05 Jan 2016 17:30

Can we launch cruise missiles from subs? Will give total deniability.

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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist str

Postby Karan M » 05 Jan 2016 17:35

maxratul wrote: Kurukshetra happened because evil must be fought against, no matter what the costs are. What is happening across media and political establishment is nothing but a reflection of the cowardice and spinelessness of the national population at large. We are so busy squabbling among ourselves for our petty problems that any 'duty' to nation is equated to 'demand' and 'injustice.'


Completely agree with the underlined part.


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