India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

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Shankk
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Shankk »

While other options are being weighed and gradually adopted (at least hoping so) some of the low hanging fruits are

1. Target paki sympathizers in India. Call them out publicly. Make them pay in real terms including their life.

2. Let there be terror in India for pak sympathizers openly peddling support to pakis. A version of men in trench coat knocking on the door.

3. Most importantly separate and target pakjabis for special treatment.
  • Kick any paki Panjabi out from India.
  • Openly discriminate against pakjabis.
  • Do not allow them to enter India either for interviews, Bollywood, tourism or anything else.
  • At the same time allow some non pakjabis to thumb our nose and make it diplomatically easier to handle.

Separating pakjabis out from other pakis will help a lot in many ways.
deejay
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by deejay »

rkirankr wrote:
deejay wrote:
Satisfied already?

Abhi khatam nahin hua hai.
where is this info from
Info? None. I was reacting to Manish ji's early indications of Satisfaction. The info of Uri engagement is available on twitter.
Manish_Sharma
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Manish_Sharma »

Cosmo_R wrote:
Aditya_V wrote:Or dump chemical effluvents into the rivers when flowing into Pakistan.
And get hauled up for eco-terrorism? Set precedent for Cheen to do same to us? Not a good idea
Arrey boss we can always deny vehemently na, US has published the proof of cheen nk porkistan proliferation of missiles nukes many times, they all deny vehemently, no sanctions nothing, just set up a private company making highly toxic materials, and accidently like union carbide dumps those materials in porki going rivers, 10 years for all the committee enquiry chai biscuit, then we ask our teams should be allowed to go and do the investigation, the team comes back and pooh pooh porki claims.

With trade imbalance in cheeni favour, can they digest sanctions by us?

With russo-cheeni alliance against usa the sanctions by usa will also hit them and we can drop lemoa shit !
Shankk
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Shankk »

In addition to above it is important to make India congress mukt as soon and as much as possible. They already screwed India by keeping the armed forces impoverished and ensuring that we have only limited retaliation options no matter how much pakis provoke us.

Timing of Cauvery dispute is also not a co-incidence. Perfectly timed and coming from a congress ruled state. Something that was relatively dormant issue for some time was conveniently raked up to time this attack on India. As per congressi tradition keeping Indians divided right in the midst of war like situation. I would trust Congress perfidy more than their integrity in that they have allowed traitors so up their hierarchy that they would have inkling of this attack and timed the controversy accordingly.
Lilo
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Lilo »

With respect to abrogating IWT,we are getting diverted on issues which come relatively far later in the escalation ladder.
Storage & permanent diversion etc come into effect a long time after we give notice of withdrawing from IWT. Other strategies like dumping of chemical waste is a nonstarter.

Immediate need is for the govt to strike a public blow to IWT questioning its legitimacy as a river sharing treaty negotiated as per conditions which existed in 1960.Parliament is a good place to begin such a discussion.Let the smug pakis sit up & take notice.

Now that the conditions are completely different from 1960 with explosion of needs & usage on Indian side farmore than the meager 20% of water the treaty offers to us.
Additional developments are continued hostility by pakis towards India, breeding of terrorism directed at India under a nuclear umbrella,denial of historical transit rights which linked India to Afghanistan & Central Asia etc.

Let all those conditions be listed as the "materially changed conditions" based on which parties can withdraw from International treaties as per Vienna convention.
manjgu
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by manjgu »

pankajS...i wish i could sit with u over coffee and explain how India CAN screw pakis with timings of water release. this in fact has been one of the many complaints of NaPakis wrt IWT.
Gagan
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Gagan »

Cosmo_R wrote:
Gagan wrote:How do we stop Indus waters? There is NO dam on the indus
It's a mystery. Actually we can't even stop any of the other rivers without flooding our own land. Better to spend monies on interlinking of rivers in India.
It is a 10 year project.
Link all the J&K rivers via a network of tunnels, canals and dams and barrages to drain into the Punjab rivers and then Yamuna.

The rivers / canals in punjab can supply Sindh in the future

It will eventually be done.
RoyG
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by RoyG »

You don't have to stop Indus waters. You simply have to withdraw from the treaty. Simple.
asinh
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by asinh »

Brilliant discussion on Times Now now.
Lilo
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Lilo »

RoyG wrote:You don't have to stop Indus waters. You simply have to withdraw from the treaty. Simple.
Exactly.
Begin the process - lets see if Pakis still have the stomach to push us then.
pankajs
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by pankajs »

manjgu wrote:pankajS...i wish i could sit with u over coffee and explain how India CAN screw pakis with timings of water release. this in fact has been one of the many complaints of NaPakis wrt IWT.
ALL NaPakis used to say India has NO rights on the 3 rivers allocated to them per IWT before the court of arbitration verdict. Napakis claim we are stealing their water which is absurd because India has NO way of making a transfer OUT of the Indus river system and hence all water must necessarily flow to Bakis no matter how many diversions or run-of-the-river projects are constructed. Don't be taken in by their analysis. It is self serving bereft of any truth.

I can list many many things that the napakis say about Indian's right under IWT and about other things some so patently absurd that only someone outsourcing his thinking wholesale would believe.

They do it to constantly reinforce the Bak narrative that India is the eternal enemy and the Bakis the victim. That narrative is an important glue to keep their quam together and counteract their fissiporous tendencies.
---------------------->
One easy way is > Figure out the total storage that India has developed on the 3 rivers allocated to them and compare it with the total storage capacity of their Mangla and Terbela dams. If the total usable storage capacity in the Baki dams is higher that the total usable *pond* capacity of the Indian ROR project you have your answer.

You start with ALL our ROR *ponds* empty and their Dams full. Now We close all the gates on our projects to cut off the *entire* flow downstream. To compensate the Bakis release an amount equivalent to the loss of upstream flow form their dams into their river/canal systems. You can figure out if their dams will empty first or our ROR projects *ponds* fills up and start overflowing the spillway first. That will conclusively tell you if strategy of emptying and refilling back to the brim the ROR ponds will bring Bakis to their knees. Simple onleeee.
Last edited by pankajs on 21 Sep 2016 20:54, edited 1 time in total.
Austin
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Austin »

From the article
It was found that the Indian military machine, hollowed by years of neglect, lacked the decisive conventional edge to localise a conflict.
Every time the armed forces comes up with the same excuse that they are not prepared , Since 1990 the Armed forces have the same excuse of years of neglect , exactly when does our armed forces be it Army Navy Airforce remain prepared for a limited strike or full scale war at short notice.

Hopefully Rawalpindi give them 5 years of advanced warning before a major terror strike so that all three forces are prepared !
ssundar
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by ssundar »

If DDM is to be believed, we have started some serious dosa diplomacy today.
manjgu
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by manjgu »

pankajs..the pakis have to continously release water from mangla/tarbela to generate electricity. indians CAN control flow of water into Pakistan to deprive them of water during cropping season. that India has not done is another aspect..but the numerous dams coming up on the rivers in kashmir do give us that capability. Pakis are shit scared of that possibility ..rest i leave it to u comprehend.
pankajs
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by pankajs »

Ours are all run-of-the river with very little storage capacity in total as compared to Mangal/terbela which are proper dams. Without storage you can do jack to stop flows for any reasonable period. You can't wish things into existence just because it supports you theory.

This is the last one form me on this.
Last edited by pankajs on 21 Sep 2016 21:25, edited 1 time in total.
Gagan
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Gagan »

No mangju,
The J&K rivers are massive. India's dam are moderate sized only. They can't stop the river, the reserviors quickly fill up, there is so much flow!
India has stayed true to the spirit of the Indus water treaty.

The only diversion India has done is from the Kishenganga to the Jhelum. IWT allows diversion from one river to the other within the indus basin. Wonder why India did not do it?
India plans to build one medium sized dam on the indus at Dumkar, which will generate a crummy 130 MW of electricity, but that's it.
vinod
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by vinod »

Why can't we reduce the flow when they need it for crops and then immediately flood them after few days with stored up water?
manjgu
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by manjgu »

gagan..india has stayed true to IWT thats why we did not do hanky panky with the flow..if the political class has the balls..the water can be controlled.my last one on this too..
ssundar
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by ssundar »

While withdrawing from the IWT is of no immediate practical use, the very act of withdrawal takes away India's commitment NOT to mess with the water Porkiland gets. THAT is the message - we reserve the right to build dams and do what we please with those rivers. It does not matter that it might take us 20 years to actually build a dam.

This should not be the only act of retaliation. It should be part of a package that includes declaring Pakistan a terrorist state and stopping ALL business and diplomatic relationships with that country.
Gagan
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Gagan »

It is very expensive to build dams, tunnels and canals.
India is only now, in the last 10-20 years building a lot of them.

The way there is water crisis in north india, India will sooner or later have to do this.
Do remember, that the rivers in punjab hold all the water in india, and these rivers are extensively connected via a meshwork of canals on our side. Very little flow is released towards Pakjab.
Pakjab is irrigated by the Indus, Jhelum and Chenab. India already has Uri 1, Uri 2, Lower Jhelum Barrage on the Jhelum, + we are diverting water from the kishenganga to the wular lake to energize the jhelum and allow river navigation in the valley of kashmir.
Then there are so many projects on the Chenab, already built or in advanced stages of planning or starting to build.: Salal, Baglihar, Ratle, Pakal Dul, Dul Hasti, Bursar.

I have hope. India is now drilling tunnels to make roads in J&K, at least 3 major tunneling projects across mountain passes. There is a plan for a rail link from Pathankot-Jogindernagar to Leh!
River interlinking will happen, but is 2 decades away.
sivab
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by sivab »

https://www.thequint.com/uri-attack/201 ... terrorists
Exclusive: Uri Avenged, Spl Forces Cross LoC; Kill 20 Terrorists

At least 20 terrorists have been neutralised in a daring cross-LoC operation by the Indian Army in response to the Uri attack.
Two units of the elite 2 Paras comprising 18-20 soldiers flew across the LoC in the Uri sector in military helicopters and reportedly carried out an operation that killed at least 20 suspected terrorists across three terror camps in Pakistan Occupied Kashmir (PoK).
Casualties suffered, including those injured by terrorists, could be as high as 200, sources said.

Military sources revealed to The Quint, which confirmed this information from two other independent sources, that the operation happened during the intervening hours of 20 September and 21 September.
:twisted: :mrgreen: 8)
prahaar
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by prahaar »

Does the 200 number include our guys? The text seems quite fuzzy and picked up verbatim.
sivab
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by sivab »

Kolahoi ‏@PawanDurani 3m3 minutes ago
Kolahoi Retweeted Harini Calamur
I insist that news is correct and those killed were Pakistan regulars
sivab
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by sivab »

Aviator Anil Chopra
‏@Chopsyturvey
Elite Para Commandos of Indian Army already in PoK. 3 militant camps targeted. PM @narendramodi was in MO Ops room till 2230 last night. Wow
Aviator Anil Chopra
@Chopsyturvey
Retd Air Marshal of Indian #AirForce, Test Pilot. Member Armed Forces Tribunal
Karan M
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Karan M »

Why just twenty - don't stop till the numbers hit a few hundred!!
sivab
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by sivab »

Image
Gagan
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Gagan »

Dhruv / Dhruv WSI must have flown in low
UAV above, beaming directly to mission control !
PM, COAS listening to live audio, video feed!

Wow!
RoyG
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by RoyG »

If this is indeed true, he should go on national television after the op is over and the dust settles and inform the nation.
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by GShankar »

I checked the handle - https://twitter.com/Chopsyturvey
Elite Para Commandos of Indian Army already in PoK. 3 militant camps targeted. PM @narendramodi was in MO Ops room till 2230 last night. Wow
And I could not find the specific tweet (I only checked what was posted in the last few hours to a day). Not sure if it was deleted or faked or something else.
Karan M
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Karan M »

Its below in the same handle. Its a tweet from him. Keep scrolling down..its after all the J&K and other tweets.
RoyG
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by RoyG »

We hit 3 camps and killed 20 regulars? Doesn't make sense. So 6-7 regulars in each camp? If so where were the irregulars? I think we did a raid on a few bunkers on the border. That sounds more likely and gives our SF more wiggle room. Putting them on choppers and intruding 15-20 km inside, dropping them, waiting for them to complete the mission, and ex filtrating them whether through air or ground, past a very heavily guarded border and sky is just not doing it for me. Could be wrong.
RoyG
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by RoyG »

There is a lot of bullsh*t going around. We'll have to wait on more news.
Vamsee
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Vamsee »

GShankar wrote:I checked the handle - https://twitter.com/Chopsyturvey
Elite Para Commandos of Indian Army already in PoK. 3 militant camps targeted. PM @narendramodi was in MO Ops room till 2230 last night. Wow
And I could not find the specific tweet (I only checked what was posted in the last few hours to a day). Not sure if it was deleted or faked or something else.
It was legit. I think he deleted it later on.
Karan M
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Karan M »

GShankar - he might have deleted it. It was right below the tweet on shaili chopra. Is she related to him (off topic)
Karan M
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Karan M »

Yes Vamsee - i checked after sivab's post. It was there.
disha
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by disha »

Can somebody pls tweet to Airwind Kejru and ask "Is this true?" and tag pappy

And Mogambo khush hua and all that ... :)
Karan M
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Karan M »

AM (rtd) Chopra has just now, also retweeted Quint story..
Aditya G
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Re: India's Retaliation Options to significant terrorist strikes

Post by Aditya G »

Austin wrote:...Every time the armed forces comes up with the same excuse that they are not prepared , Since 1990 the Armed forces have the same excuse of years of neglect , exactly when does our armed forces be it Army Navy Airforce remain prepared for a limited strike or full scale war at short notice.

Hopefully Rawalpindi give them 5 years of advanced warning before a major terror strike so that all three forces are prepared !
Austin, I take exception to your statement. The Army chief is supposed to present a realistic appraisal of his ability to meet the ask. Atalji asked Army to deploy for war and they didnt they? Army Navy and Air Force.

We dont know what MMS asked of the Army; say "can you achieve X objective in Y time with Z resources", then what do we expect Army chief to do?
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