China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

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chola
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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby chola » 30 Oct 2020 14:52

Their 40K-ton helo-carrier is now tooling around the IndoChina Sea. 1500 miles from Shanghai where it was built.

The keel was laid down on March of last year onlee. The second of the class is in fitting and a third is under contruction and will launch in a few months at most.

https://mobile.twitter.com/HenriKenhmann/status/1322045140614189057

East Pendulum
@HenriKenhmann
Le 1er porte-hélicoptère chinois de Type 075 semble avoir été photographié près de Sanya, l'île de Haïnan, bordant la mer de Chine méridionale.

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----- Google Translate from French ------

The 1st Chinese Type 075 helicopter carrier appears to have been photographed near Sanya, Hainan Island, bordering the South China Sea.



chola
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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby chola » 02 Nov 2020 14:02

Not mil but definitely dual-use. The C-919 and ARJ-21 at the Jiangxi airshow. We'll be seeing mil versions in a few years, I reckon.

The ARJ-21 looks like a version of the McDonnell-Douglas MD80 that used to be assembled in Shanghai. And the C919? Could be a half-brother of the A320 which incidently had its 500th delivery from Airbus' Tianjin assembly plant in Cheen. Airbus's only plant outside Yurop and the US: https://simpleflying.com/airbus-china-fal-500/

They know how to leverage their market for technology transfer/hijacking. Period.

And no social distancing in Cheen it seems.

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby Dilbu » 12 Nov 2020 14:00

Air Force video reveals Chinese fighter jet’s mysterious new missile
Chinese fighter jets are apparently getting a mysterious new type of missile, a recent recruitment video of the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Air Force shows. The unidentified missile could be an advanced anti-radiation missile or a new long-range air-to-air missile, and either possibility could significantly increase the PLA's capabilities in destroying hostile early warning aircraft, analysts said on Wednesday.

The Air Force video showed a J-11BS fighter jet carrying a type of missile previously unknown to the general public, reported Weihutang, a military program affiliated with China Central Television. This report was reposted by the PLA Eastern Theater Command on Sina Weibo on Tuesday.

Weihutang said that this missile could be a type of new long-range air-to-air missile, which could be used in shooting down high-value targets like early warning aircraft and aerial tankers from afar, or it could be an advanced anti-radiation missile similar to the US' AGM-88G.

An anti-radiation missile is a type of weapon that homes in on hostile radio emission sources, usually radars.

Ordnance Industry Science Technology, a defense magazine based in Xi'an, Shaanxi Province, said in a Tuesday report that since the screenshot of the video is not of sufficiently high quality, further details of the missile cannot be ascertained.

US media outlet thedrive.com said that it is more likely an anti-radiation missile.

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby MeshaVishwas » 14 Nov 2020 17:06

Cheen is arming up rapidly
China's growing bomber fleet?

A little over 2 years ago, I put up this thread about China's fleet of H-6 bombers. Counting them using open-source imagery, I determined that they numbered almost 200, more than the 150 or so of most open-source estimates.

https://twitter.com/tshugart3/status/13 ... 51168?s=20
Go through the thread.

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby brar_w » 14 Nov 2020 19:34

An interesting, though still speculative , thread on the J-20 production rate which we had been trying to decipher a few months ago in this thread. A late 2020's numerical parity with F-22A fleet wouldn't be too far fetched and would also explain why the USAF was always interested in a 2030 F-22A replacement fighter as a target. Also explains why China is buying the SU-35, cranking out its flanker clones and the J-10 concurrently. They probably need close to 100 new build aircraft a year to recapitalize their 3rd and early 4th gen fighter fleet and scale production of stealth isn’t easy.

https://twitter.com/RupprechtDeino/stat ... 4892058626

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby jamwal » 15 Nov 2020 20:20

https://www.scmp.com/economy/china-econ ... ir-us-tech

Roll-out of China’s home-grown passenger jet still up in the air as US tech restrictions expected to persist under Joe Biden

Concerns are growing over China’s access to key American-made components for the C919 passenger jet, due to a dependency on US exports
China’s answer to the Boeing-Airbus duopoly on passenger jets still has hurdles to overcome to meet its planned roll-out next year, and not all analysts think it will arrive on time

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The C919 relies on imports of a number of crucial parts, from its engines to its flight-control systems, so access to US suppliers such as General Electric (GE), Honeywell International and Rockwell Collins is vital for future deliveries of the new model.


Comac said last year that it aimed to get all of the necessary certificates for the C919 by the end of 2021 – a delay from the previous target of the end of this year – due to technical issues involving its design, manufacturing, airworthiness compliance and operational suitability.
However, Kevin Michaels, managing director of Michigan-based AeroDynamic Advisory, told the Post this month that he expects the C919 to be delivered later than the 2021 target – possibly in 2022 or even 2023 – due to obstacles involving technical issues and CAAC certification.

He added that it is impossible for China to develop its own jet engines, calling this a chronic “Achilles’ heel” for China. The CFM jet engine used on the C919 is 20 years or more ahead of Chinese technology, and was designed for reliability, he added.
Reuters reported in February that the Trump administration was considering blocking GE from selling the LEAP-1C engine to Comac, citing concerns over the possible military applications of the technology. But in the end, the US granted GE a licence to sell the engines to the Chinese company.

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby jamwal » 21 Nov 2020 13:03

https://thetaiwantimes.com/chinese-troo ... order/7342

Chinese Troops Struggle With Low Quality Winter Clothing On Indian Border

Despite having an advantage of the flatter terrain of the Tibetan plateau, the PLA troops are struggling to survive in sub-zero temperatures with poor quality of clothing and accommodation.

PLA commanders who have no prior experience in high altitude and winter deployments initially invited local garment manufacturers to produce winter clothing for their troops deployed in the Ladakh region.

As part of Chinese communist propaganda, the Global Times released a number of videos showcasing newly developed winter clothing being provided to the Chinese soldiers.
The McMahon Line forms the northern border of the area shown in red
However, the lack of combat experience across the entire PLA is so glaring that commanders and their political masters did not realize surviving in heights greater than 12,000 feet is totally different from equipping soldiers for operations at normal altitudes of up to 9,000 feet.

Also, there may have been a Napoleonic mindset at work attempting to eke out a quick victory before the winters set in.

Like Napoleon, this has turned out to be a logistical nightmare.

Having misread the logistics requirements, local Chinese garment manufacturers produced clothing that can at best be utilized by troops deployed at 9,000 feet.

Once the temperatures in the Ladakh region plummeted to minus 20 degrees and below in areas around the Pangong Tso and Kailash ranges, one could witness a steady line of emergency medical evacuations from the PLA positions.

Reports indicate that casualty evacuation of PLA troops through helicopters and stretchers has been observed on a daily basis.

It is also learnt that on an average one PLA soldier succumbs to altitude and temperature related ailments every day.

Morale and motivation at the posts has dipped below freezing point.

Currently, the PLA troops deployed in Ladakh are facing extreme shortage of specialised cold climate clothing and have been forced to go for emergency procurements.

This is the same PLA which was showing off its insular cabins and multipurpose jackets and pants just a few weeks ago on Chinese national TV.

Available input indicates that PLA Joint Logistics Support Force (JLSF) has constituted a Quality Supervision Team for emergency procurement of Extreme Cold Climate clothing.

This team has now been tasked to ensure good quality clothing and fast delivery to forward area troops.

Emergency plans such as the setting up of special working classes, scientific planning, factory supervision, on-site inspections and placement of military representatives in factories to supervise production have been put in place.

This team is reported to have been reporting directly to the Central Military Commission.

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby Cyrano » 21 Nov 2020 16:08

This is exactly what I was expecting, when I said in the border security thread that after occupying strategic heights around Pangong and in Chushul, India should be in no hurry to de-escalate and wait out the winter and make further moves next spring, to kick PLA's frozen butt out of Aksai-Hind.

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby vivek_ahuja » 23 Nov 2020 05:32

Looks like the Chinese Y-20 flew with four WS-20 engines today to complete the C-17 look and feel:

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This is where their IL-76-type limitation with engines on transport aircraft will disappear and merge with western designs. The WS-20 powered Y-20 design should be a lot more capable and efficient.

Steady progress overall on this program.

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby Vivek K » 23 Nov 2020 06:23

Sad to see our own stunted aircraft programs.

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby chola » 01 Dec 2020 07:58

^^^ The WS-20 was tested on an IL-76 platform that they bought from Gromov. Yes, the Kaveri was tested on the same model (or possibly even the same plane) in Russia.

They spared no expense on their engines. We ran on a shoe-string for ours (just $280M.) We spent $9.5B for 32 Rafales and hoped that the French can help us with the Kaveri. A billion or two on the Kaveri would have given us an engine, I'm sure of it.

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chola
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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby chola » 01 Dec 2020 08:35

Interesting. They reversed engineered the CFM-56 to develop the core for the WS-10. The WS-10 variant for the J-20 is the "C" with a supposedly uprated thrust of 145/150kN.

https://mobile.twitter.com/HenriKenhmann/status/1331662865288183808

East Pendulum
@HenriKenhmann
Un J-20 équipé de moteurs WS-10, en livrée basse visibilité de l'armée de l'air chinoise, a été filmé dans l'usine d'assemblage de CAC à Chengdu.

Vidéo via 斯图卡98
Embedded video



Hapag
@fcf58053475
·
Nov 26
Replying to
@HenriKenhmann
The sound is quite different from Su-27. It's actually more similar to F-15. Probably due to the fact the the core of WS-10 is from CFM-56
1

日月同明
@onceggyy123
·
Nov 27
Yes, closer to f110

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby nam » 01 Dec 2020 15:53

Reverse engineered means, the French must have sold the tech.

It cannot be that straight forward to sell M2K to Taiwan..

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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby arvin » 01 Dec 2020 16:29

The core of CFM 56 is GE contribution (HPC, Combustor and HPT) and is derived from B1 bomber and was built with Department of Defense funding. French dont have any contribution in that. Dont see any merit in that tweet.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CFM_International_CFM56

The work split between the two companies gave GE responsibility for the high-pressure compressor (HPC), the combustor, and the high-pressure turbine (HPT); Snecma was responsible for the fan, the low-pressure compressor (LPC), and the low-pressure turbine (LPT).[15] Snecma was also responsible for the initial airframe integration engineering, mostly involving the nacelle design, and was initially responsible for the gearbox, but shifted that work to GE when it became apparent that it would be more efficient for GE to assemble that component along with their other parts.[16]

chola
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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby chola » 01 Dec 2020 20:28

^^^ The CFM-56 powers the Boeing 737 and Airbus A320 which are ubiqitous in Cheen. They are familiar with it to say the least. The WS-10 being a RE of the CMF-56 is pretty reasonable not least in that the engine has a mil pedigree. Why wouldn't they target an engine they can easily get their hands on and has a core that was designed for an American warplane to boot? The chini MIC copies Amreeki whenever possible.

Whether the French might have helped is a legitimate question though. The engine is jointly built with the French and to this day, there are lot of French licensed built stuff in chini armed forces.

chola
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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby chola » 02 Dec 2020 15:06

J-20 prototypes 2021 and 2022 from 2017/2018 that tested out the WS-10C engines in current production models.

They really have a deliberate program with the WS-10. We've seen prototypes first and then full-blown production with the engine in the J-11, J-10 and now J-20.

The first copies of the WS-10 were horrendous that threw shards during tests and had a life of a few hundred hours, no better than a turbojet. But iteration after iteration has given them something useful enough that all their frontline aircraft are now being produced with it.

https://mobile.twitter.com/RupprechtDeino/status/1333657850883739651

@Rupprecht_A
@RupprechtDeino
Wow Astonished face ... Here is at least to my knowledge the first clear image of J-20A '2022' and it clearly shown that patch!

Any info when this image was posted first? Thinking face... and even more why I missed it? Smiling face with open mouth and cold sweat

(Image via @szheng615 from the http://lt.cjdby.net/forum)

Thanks to
@onceggyy123

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https://mobile.twitter.com/RupprechtDeino/status/1332940857885020161
@Rupprecht_A
@RupprechtDeino
I must admit, Face with open mouth I'm surprised that I missed this image, but perhaps this is the second J-20A prototype no. 2022 powered by WS-10C engines. Thinking face

So far I knew only a hand-full of images showing no. 2021, which flew first on 19. Sept. 2017 and reports of a second one in Jan. 2018.
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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby sum » 02 Dec 2020 19:22

chola wrote:J-20 prototypes 2021 and 2022 from 2017/2018 that tested out the WS-10C engines in current production models.

They really have a deliberate program with the WS-10. We've seen prototypes first and then full-blown production with the engine in the J-11, J-10 and now J-20.

The first copies of the WS-10 were horrendous that threw shards during tests and had a life of a few hundred hours, no better than a turbojet. But iteration after iteration has given them something useful enough that all their frontline aircraft are now being

Hats off to the Chinese for persistence and keeping at it relentessly with adequate funding

chola
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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby chola » 03 Dec 2020 19:22

Y-20 apparently powered by 4 WS-20s. Looks like it is being filmed by J-11BS chase plane so this is probably a test flight or a prototype:
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(Caption on bottom is Japanese so this was first exposed by watchers from there.)

chola
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Re: China Military Watch - Sept' 2016

Postby chola » 03 Dec 2020 20:05

sum wrote:Hats off to the Chinese for persistence and keeping at it relentessly with adequate funding


Watch this space for the WS-15 and WS-19. I have no doubt now that they'll put them into mass use. It won't matter if the initial models are substandard or subpar. They'll get things working over time because they have a process and a track record for doing that now.

They should be a constant reminder, a kick in our pants to fund our own engine projects adequately. The 110kN medium engine for the AMCA is our next test. We NEED to carry it over the goal line and not give it a pittance (like the $280m onlee for Kaveri) while funding phoren MICs with billions.


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