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Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby sudhan » 08 Mar 2017 15:38

shiv wrote:*: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_n ... ite_note-9 - Wiki notes that this was an 8 kt explosion


H-bomb? Do H-bombs have small yields? Wiki says its a tactical nuke.. From the description in the article (dimensions 6 ft and weight 1 ton) seems like an early tactical nuke design to me..

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 08 Mar 2017 17:47

sudhan wrote:
shiv wrote:*: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_n ... ite_note-9 - Wiki notes that this was an 8 kt explosion


H-bomb? Do H-bombs have small yields? Wiki says its a tactical nuke.. From the description in the article (dimensions 6 ft and weight 1 ton) seems like an early tactical nuke design to me..

In the story - Chairman Mao wanted a H-bomb tested "to raise morale" of the PLA. This pilot was the guinea pig - or it may have been a bluff from day 1 - not a H bomb at all. In those days H bombs had to get megatons or the testing country would die of embarrassment. The first mission failed and perhaps they sent up a sure fire device so that the bomb designers would not be slaughtered by Mao.

But this whole business of "testing to improve morale", "testing to send a signal" or "punish India" is emblematic of Chinese behaviour even today

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby chola » 08 Mar 2017 18:10

That's was a good read though. Especially about the failed launching and having to bring the live nuke back to the empty base because everyone was scared shitless. lol

Sounds like what we in the US calls a Mickey Mouse operation or Amateur Hour. It does humanize them, I must say. (And I share a bed and intimate space with a chini for a decade but there are still times when this porcelain-skinned creature in front of me doesn't seem of this world.)

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Philip » 08 Mar 2017 18:39

Keep these facts in mind gents,the PLAN is being given the largest share of the def. budget and China is now calling itself an "Ocean Power". Ironic as India for thousands of years was the predominant "Ocean Power" in the Asian/Indo-China region. Time for India to also start boasting about its former glory in the Indo-China region and Sea and its exploits just as the "Beijing ducks" boast about their great eunuch Adm. Zheng He.

https://sputniknews.com/asia/2017030810 ... eans-seas/
The Fast Boat to Chinese Sea Dominance: Naval Boost to Project Beijing's Power

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 10 Mar 2017 08:16

shiv wrote:No this thread is not forgotten. Am working on it - thinking of suitable ways to present the info
Airfields relevant to us:
Image


Tibet Air bases - the few there are - are all over 3500 meters (save one)

Read this for perspective on how 200 Y 20s will land a division of Chinese troops in 24 hours. Or 6 hours
Flying the Bofors into Thoise

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby ranjan.rao » 10 Mar 2017 10:57

chola wrote:(And I share a bed and intimate space with a chini for a decade but there are still times when this porcelain-skinned creature in front of me doesn't seem of this world.)

:lol: :lol: :lol: :rotfl: :rotfl:
now I know why you are for outright ban of Liu :p

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Garooda » 11 Mar 2017 06:15

Not sure if anyone noticed but chini_psyop..check it out. They boast about how they are home to a dozens of different ethnic groups including mongols, tibetans etc. Keep knocking that kakkaa on everyone's head thru live stage shows (shen yun) to somehow steer the mindset. Yaani ke abhi se salesmangiri aur marketing shuru. :lol: Uski maa kaa.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 11 Mar 2017 07:21

^^This is Taiwanese and is a slap on the face of the Communist party
http://www.shenyun.com/spirituality/challenges-we-face
Will the World Allow the Chinese Communist Party to Dictate the Arts?

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Garooda » 13 Mar 2017 18:37

^^ In that case I stand corrected. Wish Bollywood/Tollywood/Kollywood/Mollywood :rotfl: can use soft diplomacy to promote Indian Strategic Objectives.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby chola » 17 Mar 2017 14:52

ranjan.rao wrote:
chola wrote:(And I share a bed and intimate space with a chini for a decade but there are still times when this porcelain-skinned creature in front of me doesn't seem of this world.)

:lol: :lol: :lol: :rotfl: :rotfl:
now I know why you are for outright ban of Liu :p



I want a ban of Liu because his presence on the thread creates a situation where the jingos among us feel the need to swell their breasts defend bharat's honor so there is never any serious discussion about the one major nation we have as a neighbor.

Secondly, his poor english and inane posts give us nothing that we can't get from PDF.

Finally, I am tired of the PRC sending us this same old retread of a 50-center. It is an insult to our forum that we do not get better treatment in the form of more and better chini propaganda operatives whom they deploy in Unkil and UK forums. So I rather we say fvck you to the PRC's propaganda organ and ban their one dreg!

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby hnair » 17 Mar 2017 15:07

Garooda wrote:Not sure if anyone noticed but chini_psyop..check it out. They boast about how they are home to a dozens of different ethnic groups including mongols, tibetans etc. Keep knocking that kakkaa on everyone's head thru live stage shows (shen yun) to somehow steer the mindset. Yaani ke abhi se salesmangiri aur marketing shuru. :lol: Uski maa kaa.


Those birds are not PLA. Shen yun is Falun Gong types, trying to fit the "chinese culture before commies" into western mindsets. They are *probably* funded by Culinary Institute's benevolent grants, considering their high value productions and excellent calendar management in western venues :)

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Garooda » 17 Mar 2017 21:04

hnair wrote:
Garooda wrote:Not sure if anyone noticed but chini_psyop..check it out. They boast about how they are home to a dozens of different ethnic groups including mongols, tibetans etc. Keep knocking that kakkaa on everyone's head thru live stage shows (shen yun) to somehow steer the mindset. Yaani ke abhi se salesmangiri aur marketing shuru. :lol: Uski maa kaa.

Those birds are not PLA. Shen yun is Falun Gong types, trying to fit the "chinese culture before commies" into western mindsets. They are *probably* funded by Culinary Institute's benevolent grants, considering their high value productions and excellent calendar management in western venues :)

Yea. I missed the quote in the original link. I know Bollywood has been approached by the West for soft diplomacy in Afghanistan and Pakistan but they should start such grand scale international live shows for Nepal, Tibet, Assam, AP etc.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby ranjan.rao » 18 Mar 2017 02:46

chola wrote:Finally, I am tired of the PRC sending us this same old retread of a 50-center. It is an insult to our forum that we do not get better treatment in the form of more and better chini propaganda operatives whom they deploy in Unkil and UK forums. So I rather we say fvck you to the PRC's propaganda organ and ban their one dreg!

There was no need to explain this, i took the freedom of just light bantering with you (the emoticon should have helped). We both understand the same thing just that my inference/opinion about him is different from urs.

I can see exhaustion in ur post, again on a lighter note (no lecturing), perhaps visiting this forum is not the best thing for ur sanity :) :)

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Atmavik » 19 Mar 2017 05:29

Ever watched those chinese defence shows and wondering WTH they are talking about? some one has added hindi dubbing to it. its about the ABM

warning: nothing serious here watch for comedic relief. posting it here as the thread contains "the Die Laughing"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhH3mcaby_s

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 19 Mar 2017 08:02

Atmavik wrote:Ever watched those chinese defence shows and wondering WTH they are talking about? some one has added hindi dubbing to it. its about the ABM

warning: nothing serious here watch for comedic relief. posting it here as the thread contains "the Die Laughing"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhH3mcaby_s

:rotfl:

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby deejay » 19 Mar 2017 09:03

Atmavik wrote:Ever watched those chinese defence shows and wondering WTH they are talking about? some one has added hindi dubbing to it. its about the ABM

warning: nothing serious here watch for comedic relief. posting it here as the thread contains "the Die Laughing"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhH3mcaby_s


Thank You Saar. Had a good time. :rotfl:

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 19 Mar 2017 22:40

As I work on to try and post an understandable description of Chinese intrastructure - my own mind is filling up with facts and statitstics and names become familiar. and as that happens I am able to recognise shoddiness in scholarship and how the magnitude of studying China makes people too lazy to get into detail and enables then to skip facts and publish errors which are transmitted as fact

Now here is an article by a think tank called IPCS written by a woman called Teshu Singh. The following sentence caught my eye:
http://www.ipcs.org/issue-brief/china/i ... y-204.html
China is planning to build a 256 km extension of the 1956 km Golmud –Lhasa railroad to the Nepal border by 2014.


There is an error there that to me is only shoddiness and is inexcusable because we don't know how many more such errors exist. The entire railway from Xining to Lhasa is 1956 km. The Golmud-Lhasa segment is about 1100 km. Golmud itself will be within range of maurauding Jaguars, Su-30s and Rafales. But I will try and address these details in a presentation - most probably in the form of 2-3 videos with narration

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby NRao » 20 Mar 2017 19:24

This article seems to have some numbers for PLAAF that may be of interest.

The introduction of fourth-generation fighters, bombers, unmanned aircraft and advanced cruise missiles has transformed it from a defensive force to one that can project Chinese power throughout Asia and its eastern Pacific sea board. Its current modern combat aircraft holdings include 73 Su-30 MKK, 75 Su-27, 24 J-16, 205 J-11, and 250 J-10 fighters. They operate 120 H-6 bombers, and 16 Ilyushin IL-76, 69 Shaanxi Y-8/Y-9 transport aircraft among others. China developed the KJ 2000 AEW&C with radar and avionics mounted on IL-76 aircraft. China has also developed the KJ-200 by installing a simplified system on board the Shaanxi Y-8. Plans are to modify a Boeing 737-800 to host the radar. KJ-3000, a newer variant with next generation radar is already under development.

On April 6, 2015, a new Chinese KJ-500 AEW&C based on Y-9 turboprop airframe (An-12 copy) entered service and will eventually replace the eleven KJ-200s in service. There are also four export models of the same (ZDK-03) in Pakistan. Shaanxi Y-9/Y-8 based 20 Electronic warfare aircraft and 4 Tupelov Tu-154 ELINT aircraft are for support roles. 10 Xian H-6 are the main aerial refuellers along with a few IL-78. PLAAF has nearly 150 helicopters include Z-9, Z-18, Mi-8/Mi-17, and Eurocopter AS332 Super Puma.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 21 Mar 2017 23:23

OK folks - I have nearly finished doing what I can to study the India-Tibet border in the North East. I will start with a video explaining basic geography and the main roads that pose a threat.

I will follow these with separate videos each detailing railways, airfields and two heavily militarized areas near Tawang and Nathu la.

After that I will move on to the area west of Nepal and South of Aksai Chin.

I have already done an article on Aksai Chin and will probaby not bother doing a repeat of that as video. Too late to start the uploads tonight.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 22 Mar 2017 08:58

This will be the first in a series of videos about Chinese military and strategic infrastructure in Tibet. Please excuse any deficiencies - this was a sort of practice video in which I was coming to grips with the possibilities offered by Google earth. 3-4 more videos will follow

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wUkKcSBtss

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 26 Mar 2017 10:51

OK here is the second of my video series on Chinese infra in Tibet

"Chinese Airfields of Relevance to India".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJKc4AwM6KA


The next video is likely to be about the China-Tibet railway

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Deans » 26 Mar 2017 11:26

Excellent videos Shiv. Its a good primer for anyone interested in the subject.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Deans » 26 Mar 2017 11:37

NRao wrote:This article seems to have some numbers for PLAAF that may be of interest.


Most of these aircraft are deployed in the East. The number of PLAAF aircraft in the Western military region were mentioned in an earlier post
of mine . There are a max of 96 modern aircraft ( J11/J10/ SU 27) can be deployed against us, with 24 in reserve. This is not formidable - even considering the depleted strength of the IAF.
However, the threat from these aircraft to us, is further diminished by the distance from the border they have to operate from
(or the severe payload penalty here taking off from high altitude airstrips as Shiv's video highlights). Add to that, the need for the PLAAF to
maintain a CAP at different points along the border to prevent the IAF attacking the ring road highway and the roads leading to the border.
The Chinese roads and forward airfields are particularly vulnerable as attacking aircraft will be masked by the mountains, giving the defenders little warning of their approach and even near misses on the narrow roads can cause landslides, which road clearing parties, operating at very high altitudes, will find difficult to fix.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 26 Mar 2017 11:41

Deans wrote:Excellent videos Shiv. Its a good primer for anyone interested in the subject.

Thanks Deans. I am hoping to provoke interest and further study.

While Chinese military developments are undoubtedly awe inspiring, we also need to separate the hype from hard facts. It really is not easy to get to Tibet from China - road or no road, railroad or no railroad. Unless Indians understand their weaknesses we are going to spend all our energy in worrying about how we will get kicked rather than exploiting what are obvious military problems that China faces.

I bet you, like me and everyone else was taught the geography of Europe and Australia in school, but nothing beyond the Himalayas. And regarding history, the less said the better.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby VinodTK » 26 Mar 2017 18:50

shiv: "Chinese Airfields of Relevance to India".

^^^Very helpful presentation with lots of details, thanks for creating and posting it.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby ranjan.rao » 26 Mar 2017 20:18

Deans wrote:
NRao wrote:This article seems to have some numbers for PLAAF that may be of interest.


Most of these aircraft are deployed in the East. The number of PLAAF aircraft in the Western military region were mentioned in an earlier post
of mine . There are a max of 96 modern aircraft ( J11/J10/ SU 27) can be deployed against us, with 24 in reserve. This is not formidable - even considering the depleted strength of the IAF.
However, the threat from these aircraft to us, is further diminished by the distance from the border they have to operate from
(or the severe payload penalty here taking off from high altitude airstrips as Shiv's video highlights). Add to that, the need for the PLAAF to
maintain a CAP at different points along the border to prevent the IAF attacking the ring road highway and the roads leading to the border.
The Chinese roads and forward airfields are particularly vulnerable as attacking aircraft will be masked by the mountains, giving the defenders little warning of their approach and even near misses on the narrow roads can cause landslides, which road clearing parties, operating at very high altitudes, will find difficult to fix.

Dean,
the numbers on wiki are quite high (obviously they need to be discounted with the propaganda factor). I am listing the numbers
Su 27: 75
Su 30 MKK: 73
Su 35: 24(assuming them out of picture)
J11: 205+
J-10: 240
will these planes not be transferred to the bases in case of conflict?
Also, Shiv Saar, thx for the videos

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby NRao » 26 Mar 2017 21:52

Shiv,

Great start.

I would suggest using Tibet, instead of China, wherever it is best for India. We are in an era, unfortunately, of fake news, so it is what it is.

I will try and pitch in, but a decent analysis of fuel dumps is also essential. Difficult I am sure.

will these planes not be transferred to the bases in case of conflict?


AF especially.

More than that I am opposed to static analysis. It would be best to provide rolling numbers and preferably by gen types. So, how many 5/4th gen by year. Followed by capability, by AC, by model. Like LCA, MK1 vs. MK1A the radar changes and thus grouping them together makes no sense.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 26 Mar 2017 21:58

NRao wrote:Shiv,

Great start.

I would suggest using Tibet, instead of China, wherever it is best for India.

In fact I use Tibet everywhere - but the video is of Chinese airfields in Tibet and in Eastern China as well as the Xinjiang and Lop Nor areas. So it would be inaccurate to say "Tibetan airfields"

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 26 Mar 2017 22:13

NRao wrote:but a decent analysis of fuel dumps is also essential. Difficult I am sure.

will these planes not be transferred to the bases in case of conflict?


Actually refineries and major fuel depots are easily visible and I will be posting more info about them in due course

But the grind is set to get deeper.

Seeing PLA sites on otherwise uninhabited heights or along highways is easy - but spotting them in Lhasa or Nyingchi is more difficult. I have marked 40 or 50 sites where the PLA is present but most of them together cannot account for 200,000 troops. The biggest ones I saw could probably house a 1000 or 2000. So where are the missing troops?

Today after a dedicated search I found 3 sites in Lhasa which can probably house several thousand troops. Lhasa is important in light of a discussion I had earlier with Shaurya. Typically acclimatization requires a few days or weeks at about 3500 meters before the troops go to higher altitudes like 4500 or 5000 meters. Lhasa seems to be the ideal spot

That apart I have been looking for army trucks and vehicles. Although I have spotted them parked as well as in highway convoys - the only really large concentration of vehicles I found was in Golmud with 100s of tanks, trucks and even what appear to be trucks to carry missiles (minus the missiles) But I want to find some heavy vehicles elsewhere too. Not just in Golmud 800 air-kilometers from the Indian border

The main Tibet railway starts at Xining and goes east to Golmud and then goes 900 km south up the permafrost to Lhasa. So the tanks/trucks at Golmud are just 12 hours away from Lhasa by train. But Golmud is at 2800 meters - not high enough for acclimatization and the train is oxygen enriched. So there must be a body of troops (probably in Lhasa) getting interim acclimatization. at 3000-3500 meters.

There are other issues. At least part of the troop strength is for internal security in Tibet. Also because Tibet food supply is marginal - food has to be shipped in. The more the troops, the more the food. And the best route is the train. Train route video coming up soon.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Karthik S » 26 Mar 2017 22:51

shiv wrote:OK here is the second of my video series on Chinese infra in Tibet

"Chinese Airfields of Relevance to India".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJKc4AwM6KA


The next video is likely to be about the China-Tibet railway



Thanks Shivji, very informative. You mentioned MKIs, Jags and Rafales. But I now after watching the video recall one of pigeon's videos, where he says missiles will play crucial role in future Indo china conflicts. I am not able to recall his exact words. Now I realize how important Nirbhay is to us. Barrage of Nirbhays to all those airfields should disable them to a fair extent.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Deans » 27 Mar 2017 15:55

ranjan.rao wrote:
Deans wrote:
Most of these aircraft are deployed in the East. The number of PLAAF aircraft in the Western military region were mentioned in an earlier post
of mine . There are a max of 96 modern aircraft ( J11/J10/ SU 27) can be deployed against us, with 24 in reserve. This is not formidable - even considering the depleted strength of the IAF.
However, the threat from these aircraft to us, is further diminished by the distance from the border they have to operate from
(or the severe payload penalty here taking off from high altitude airstrips as Shiv's video highlights). Add to that, the need for the PLAAF to
maintain a CAP at different points along the border to prevent the IAF attacking the ring road highway and the roads leading to the border.
The Chinese roads and forward airfields are particularly vulnerable as attacking aircraft will be masked by the mountains, giving the defenders little warning of their approach and even near misses on the narrow roads can cause landslides, which road clearing parties, operating at very high altitudes, will find difficult to fix.

Dean,
the numbers on wiki are quite high (obviously they need to be discounted with the propaganda factor). I am listing the numbers
Su 27: 75
Su 30 MKK: 73
Su 35: 24(assuming them out of picture)
J11: 205+
J-10: 240
will these planes not be transferred to the bases in case of conflict?
Also, Shiv Saar, thx for the videos


Ranjan,
I think the wiki numbers are correct. However,
it's not easy for the PLAAF to transfer fighter divisions (not squadrons or regiments) from the east to west, though individual aircraft can be moved to replace losses. Apart from a relatively less flexible operating structure, the PLA sees the US and its allies (Japan, Taiwan, SoKo) as it's principal adversaries. Their existing strength of Chinese 4th generation fighters based in the East, is only slightly higher than each of the individual countries that oppose them (I'm including USAF contingents based in Japan and Soko as part of the strength of the air forces of both countries). This will, my view, make the PLA reluctant to transfer forces to the Western theatre - apart from its reserve regiments in the Jinan military district, that I've included in my numbers.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Deans » 27 Mar 2017 18:14

I've been studying the road from Hotan (the division nearest to Aksai Chin) to the point where the highway comes closest to Ladakh. I do not find locations with trucks, fuel tanks, military style huts etc. Nothing suggesting that a large body of troops can quickly deploy there. On the other hand there are areas where the road is broken by landslides. Though Hotan looks close to the Indian border, it's about 900 km by road to reach areas close to Daulat Beg Oldi on the Indian side.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby manjgu » 27 Mar 2017 18:49

Deans..China may see USA, Japan etc as its principal adversaries but in case of a hot war with India ( with no corresponding hostilities with Japan, USA..) why would China be reluctant to move its planes towards Indian side? does not sound logical to me.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 27 Mar 2017 19:12

manjgu wrote:Deans..China may see USA, Japan etc as its principal adversaries but in case of a hot war with India ( with no corresponding hostilities with Japan, USA..) why would China be reluctant to move its planes towards Indian side? does not sound logical to me.

There are two diametrically opposite possibilities IMO

1. As Deans said - they will have to keep a substantial part of their fleet in the east. The reasons are because they cannot leave their eastern friends like Amreeka. Japan etc uncovered, but also because some aircraft of their fleet may be virtually useless in the Tibet/Chengdu region. A third reason is simply physical - where are they going to accommodate all those extra aircraft? But I may be wrong on this last count

2. The other possibility is as you say - they will a large part west. In fact all those eastern friends will welcome that move and would probably be happy to see the Chinese move their assets towards Tibet. They may even fiddle with supplies to India to make China nervous. But I speculate here.

I would like do an analysis/though experiment/jerkoff regarding what assets would be most useful for the Chinese in case of conflict with India

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby shiv » 27 Mar 2017 19:14

Deans wrote:I've been studying the road from Hotan (the division nearest to Aksai Chin) to the point where the highway comes closest to Ladakh. I do not find locations with trucks, fuel tanks, military style huts etc. Nothing suggesting that a large body of troops can quickly deploy there. On the other hand there are areas where the road is broken by landslides. Though Hotan looks close to the Indian border, it's about 900 km by road to reach areas close to Daulat Beg Oldi on the Indian side.

Yeah. This is exactly what I found. The little military stuff I located was within Aksai Chin.

But move to the Barahoti area south of Aksai chin and you will find some significant Chinese military positions there. I have looked at them but they are currently far away on my radar.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby ranjan.rao » 27 Mar 2017 22:41

Dean Sir,
with due regards for your research and prior knowledge. I think this is a big assumption that we are making. Unless we have asiatic nato, which treats an attack on one as attack on all, we are more likely to see shifting of assets from one sector to another. While rigid, they are meticulous war planners as was seen in korean and '62 war. Perhaps playing devil's advocate and not dhoti shivering. They can stockpile spares, ammo and supplies to support men and equipment. Have they done it yet? Does not seem to be the case from Shiv sir's analysis. But the thing is they have supported their war efforts in korean war in '50s when they too were not as rich even in harsh winter environments against USA

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby ranjan.rao » 27 Mar 2017 22:43

BTW I am kinda missing Liu to tell me that China can grow crops in lahasa to feed millions and trasnsportation capabilities to feed billions of their army and support staff

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby Karthik S » 27 Mar 2017 22:48

I saw a cold war documentary, in that the presenter spoke to few airbases in USSR that didn't "exist" on a map. In present day scenario, I know it will be difficult to hide a runway let alone an airbase, but we need to have every inch scanned to 1000KM from our border. Just like in battle of Thermopylae where the Persian strength didn't matter in that narrow passes, if we are successful in denying the chinese any runways to land, their air power can be diminished by a large extent.

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby manjgu » 28 Mar 2017 00:06

Even in India, Paki, Chini matrix..if there are active hostilities between Pakis and Indians..dont u think IAF will transfer assets from east to west..( even though we are aware India-China have a more actively hostile relationship than China vs Japan, USA) . In fact switching air assets is probably most easily done as compared to other assets. In one the recent IAF excercises..the emphasis was on such a switch from one theater of operation to another ( under the assumption that both theaters are actively hostile)

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Re: Latest Chinese boast: should we shiver or die laughing?

Postby ranjan.rao » 28 Mar 2017 00:47

For asset transfer, they might time an attack along with some other crisis; like they did last time around with Cuban crisis.

I think more than asset shifting that might prefer to operate from safety of their far away air bases with refuelling. Now there are two factors I am not sure of
1. does long range flight pose any problem for pilots? Even if a significant part is flown over home territory with inflight refuelling. I remember someone mentioning that before the arrival of Su-30 IAF did not have very long sorties.
2. Can high numbers of fighters taking off from multiple bases can compensate the fighters not being able to take off with full load. I understand that obviously they cant take heavy bombs but not sure of payload combinations which their planes can try(which is beyond my knowledge and capacity)

I was watching a documentary on korean war this weekend and how they initially outsmarted the americans by camouflaging their infantry movements from aerial recons by moving in night and in daytime using bushes as camoflauge and accumulated ~100k force around Yalu river and then attacked in -20 temp on americans and decimated their lines.
While their future attacks may not be be same, but this is not entire implausible and in such cases we need heavy arti/mortar support. Hopefully, situation will get better with the upcoming programs


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