Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

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Gyan
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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Gyan » 04 Oct 2018 14:22

Roughly 3 years for first delivers.

ramana
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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby ramana » 04 Oct 2018 18:55

S-400 is not just range but capability.
IAF does need the capability for defending certain airbases.
No more discussion.

Are we in the mode to critique every decision whether we have information or not?

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby SaiK » 04 Oct 2018 21:22

Image@strategic_front
ImageAKASH-NG/2
Last edited by SaiK on 04 Oct 2018 21:29, edited 1 time in total.

souravB
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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby souravB » 04 Oct 2018 21:29

^^ is this NAG from Rudra? looks so.. Satisfying.. :D

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Haridas » 04 Oct 2018 21:38

Austin wrote:
ramana wrote:Thats Soviet design.


Ramana , you are right , its a old Soviet R-29RMU1 SLBM with the conical RV , The picture was just recently declassified as all this class of Missile is now out of service. Post R29RMU1 , 2 more variants were developed R-29RMU2 Sineva 2006 and more recently R-29RMU2.1 Liner 2014

The upgrade R29RMU2/Liner SLBM carries a more modern RV and was presented by its designer in 2015 , The picture is below , Dubbed as high speed hypersonic manouvering warhead

Image

The hot gas is primarily for roll control , not for pitch. With built in hypersonic lifting surface of the RV, the scheme requires minimal weight of control apparatus and minimal structural weight of maneuvering warhead.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby srin » 04 Oct 2018 22:03

souravB wrote:^^ is this NAG from Rudra? looks so.. Satisfying.. :D


No mid-body booster, so not Nag. Helina or SANT ?

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Indranil » 04 Oct 2018 23:24

^^^ The picture from Rudra is that of Helina. Sant is not canisterized.

SaiK wrote:Image[/url]AKASH-NG/2

This is not a picture of Akash-NG/2. It is picture of Mk1 with the push rods and the nonfolding wings.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby kit » 05 Oct 2018 01:17

ramana wrote:S-400 is not just range but capability.
IAF does need the capability for defending certain airbases.
No more discussion.

Are we in the mode to critique every decision whether we have information or not?


and that does seem like a knee-jerk reaction for some :mrgreen: .. no thinking required :((

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Cain Marko » 05 Oct 2018 05:01

Bhailog, IAF itself is giving very very high priority to this purchase, just take a dekko at ACMs statements.. This seems every bit the game changer that folks speak of
no need for over analysis..

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby arun » 05 Oct 2018 19:12

X Posted from the India-Russia thread.

Russian media outfit Sputnik on the deal for 5 squadrons of S400 Triumf quoting Kremlin Spokesman Dmitriy Peskov and Rosoboronexport Director-General Alexander Mikheev. Deliveries to begin in October 2020:

India, Russia Formally Ink $5.4 billion S-400 Air Defense System Deal – Kremlin

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby ks_sachin » 05 Oct 2018 20:59

ramana wrote:Are we in the mode to critique every decision whether we have information or not?

The degree of criticism or rona dhona is inversely proportional to the amount of info available!!!

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby sudeepj » 05 Oct 2018 21:42

Is the S400 going to be customized with Indian radars? Is there any contribution by DRDO into the deployed systems such as seeker heads etc.? Will the IFF be customized to India?

I am at a loss to understand how we can have an adversarial relationship with China, yet share the same air defense system. Its a bit like buying the F16A back in the 80s or 90s.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby arun » 05 Oct 2018 21:52

^^^ The Russians say customisation with foreign equipment is possible so presumably we will avail the opportunity.

Excerpt from Rosoboronexport catalogue regards the S400:

In order to use the Triumph ADMS in the foreign customer’s defence system, the appropriate changes to equipment, software and operational documentation may be made in accordance with established procedure.


For above and other specs of the S400 see here:

Triumph : Air defence missile system S-400

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby nits » 05 Oct 2018 23:50

Gyan wrote:Roughly 3 years for first delivers.


2 years as per media reports IMHO

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby JayS » 06 Oct 2018 00:07

sudeepj wrote:Is the S400 going to be customized with Indian radars? Is there any contribution by DRDO into the deployed systems such as seeker heads etc.? Will the IFF be customized to India?

I am at a loss to understand how we can have an adversarial relationship with China, yet share the same air defense system. Its a bit like buying the F16A back in the 80s or 90s.


Its good and bad. We would know a thing or two about how to surmount S400 challenge from China. Even a stalemate where none can use it against each other is sufficient success and worth investing money on, wouldn't you say..?

I hope it will bring some tech and experience for us and we can integrate all our desi Air Def systems into similar such master system in coming decades.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby nam » 06 Oct 2018 00:11

Also S400 provides a reference point to compare our VLR SAM and BMD plans. It is one of the best out there and we will know what the best can do.

In few years time once deployed, I can see DRDO coming out with GaN AESA version of Indian S400.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby John » 06 Oct 2018 00:30

arun wrote:X Posted from the India-Russia thread.

Russian media outfit Sputnik on the deal for 5 squadrons of S400 Triumf quoting Kremlin Spokesman Dmitriy Peskov and Rosoboronexport Director-General Alexander Mikheev. Deliveries to begin in October 2020:

India, Russia Formally Ink $5.4 billion S-400 Air Defense System Deal – Kremlin

To put the price into perspective i believe 9 squadrons of Barak-8 cost about $2.4 billion.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby ramana » 06 Oct 2018 01:06

nits wrote:
Gyan wrote:Roughly 3 years for first delivers.


2 years as per media reports IMHO


I think already a production setup order of 50 Astra was given to BDL.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Cain Marko » 06 Oct 2018 01:27

Did the order for the Frigates also go through? The s400 will create some breathing room for an air Force with depleted fighter numbers and help defend the skies until more offensive platforms like the Tejas and AAMKA come along in numbers.

Very essential move by the GOI.
Last edited by Cain Marko on 06 Oct 2018 03:05, edited 1 time in total.

ramana
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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby ramana » 06 Oct 2018 02:31

I think so.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby krishna_krishna » 06 Oct 2018 05:02

Cain Marko wrote:Did the order for the Frigates also go through?


Apparently three frigates and license AK production did not go through, there was a note in press somewhere about continuing negotiations.

On a separate note, trash reporting by TOILET (Indrani Bagchi) look at the press conference by both the leaders and what is reported, crap like we seek permission from uncle. Total contrary to what both leaders said about new changing world vs. trying to demean India's independent choices.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Singha » 06 Oct 2018 07:53

Msm is baiting the usa to impose sanctions which then can be used to beat modi

New arena same old plan

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Aditya_V » 06 Oct 2018 08:15

The US Govt has aldready shot 1 main arrow for Iran Oil and Russians weapons. Using all it can to put make its currency highly valuable. Putting direct sanctions would be counterproductive. And remember some parts of our MSM are more easily influenced by the US govt rather than our Govt through various carrots and sticks.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Austin » 06 Oct 2018 16:38

Haridas wrote:The hot gas is primarily for roll control , not for pitch. With built in hypersonic lifting surface of the RV, the scheme requires minimal weight of control apparatus and minimal structural weight of maneuvering warhead.


Thanks Haridas , The weight of physics package is the key for the other things in RV

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Austin » 06 Oct 2018 16:40

Security Scan : S-400 Triumf [ Good Discussion ]


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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby JayS » 06 Oct 2018 22:37

Prithvi-II tested again. Hemant R tweeted.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Cain Marko » 06 Oct 2018 22:48

krishna_krishna wrote:
Cain Marko wrote:Did the order for the Frigates also go through?


Apparently three frigates and license AK production did not go through, there was a note in press somewhere about continuing negotiations.

On a separate note, trash reporting by TOILET (Indrani Bagchi) look at the press conference by both the leaders and what is reported, crap like we seek permission from uncle. Total contrary to what both leaders said about new changing world vs. trying to demean India's independent choices.

Can't expect too much from this press, anything to beat modi with. Although to some extent the US influence is noticeable, will know when Trump comes to visit.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby anupmisra » 06 Oct 2018 23:28

And the first sounds of "concern" from the mob next door masquerading as a nation:

Russia-India S-400 air defence systems deal problematic: Pakistan

Pakistan is concerned about India moving closer to acquiring Russian S-400 air defence systems and urges Moscow not to bet on New Delhi alone, Information Minister Fawad Chaudhry told Sputnik in an interview.
“That is the problem,” Chaudhry said on Friday when asked what Islamabad thinks of the possible purchase by India. “India is using its might against Pakistan, they are building their power against Pakistan, and that is very unfair. :(( We know that Russia and India have a relationship, but now I think Pakistan is also getting closer to Russia, so Russia should not place its bets on India only.”
Russia and Pakistan’s relationship, Chaudhry added, is improving day by day and Islamabad is looking forward to working closely with Moscow on defence, trade and economic issues.
Responding to a question, Fawad Chaudhry said Pakistan is open to dialogue with India, but believes domestic political affairs in India prevent New Delhi from engaging in cooperation.



https://nation.com.pk/30-Sep-2018/russi ... c-pakistan

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby nam » 07 Oct 2018 00:03

DRDO needs to come up with better explanation that Prithvi-2 for missile test :D

No one will believe when DRDO says it is testing a missile which has ceased production!

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Katare » 07 Oct 2018 00:05

So if IAF deploys one of these systems at or west of Jalandhar, it’ll effectively shut down Sargodha airforce base :mrgreen:

Put 5 of these along the border at 300km distance and you have completely closed down all of Pak air space to its own airforce :eek:

They need Strategic depth :lol:

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Vips » 07 Oct 2018 00:32

And we need at least another 5 system to take care of the 2 front situation.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Yagnasri » 07 Oct 2018 06:14

We may never really know how many and what kind of system we are getting. I do not think this is only about Air defence

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby dinesha » 07 Oct 2018 09:28

Successful night trial of Prithvi-II missile
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 102762.cms

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Singha » 07 Oct 2018 10:11

S400 may be a useful supplement to our PAD+AAD sites for TBMD and also targeting high flying assets at long range like tankers, transports, ELINT birds.
but the big missiles will be very costly. we cannot just shoot off dozens in hope.

we need to integrate it into our existing ADGES including akash and spyders for full effect.

I am not convinced what it brings to the table over akash mk1 + mk2 + Barak8 at medium ranges.

maybe partially quid pro quo for help on our SSN program ( <--- Yasen tech) and other strategic help on black projects.
better S400 than stuff like armata or ka226 :D

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Karthik S » 07 Oct 2018 11:22

Singha wrote:maybe partially quid pro quo for help on our SSN program ( <--- Yasen tech)


Along with 12 VLS in our SSNs I suppose?

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Kakarat » 07 Oct 2018 13:18

https://twitter.com/zone5aviation/statu ... 1985835008

Of the many firsts at this year’s #IAFDay parade is the IAF’s Spyder SAM system on static display. Normally quite camera-shy, but in full view here sandwiched between a Su-30MKI and ALH MK.3


Image
Image

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby Paul » 07 Oct 2018 14:41

ramana wrote:
Yagnasri wrote:What did you do? :lol:



I don't know. This happens often. Much bigger folks have blocked me.


Do they know your BRF credentials.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby nits » 07 Oct 2018 15:09

Image

5 should be able to cover both borders...

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby nam » 07 Oct 2018 15:17

S400 is a mobile VLR SAM. It will not be static as drawn on a map. Our volume search radar (THD, Swordfish, future HPR) will drive where exactly S400 will be deployed. It will be a waste of resource, if S400 are given the job of volume search during peace time.

Since they are phased array, there will be frequency hopping. So it will be difficult to know where are S400 deployed.

So there will not be anything called covering all gaps. It will be on need basis. If required all 5 could be on western front.

In peace time, it provides a tremendous anti-SAM training to our pilots. Nothing like going against the big daddy. For DRDO it is the SAM & ECM.

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Re: Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Postby vinod » 08 Oct 2018 01:08

Can we not create a dummy S-400 which sort of looks and quacks like it but just sends out signals mocking S-400?


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