Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

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fanne
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby fanne » 30 Dec 2019 02:50

Mig 31 and Russians AD are integrated.

manjgu
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby manjgu » 30 Dec 2019 09:14

nam...u r assuming 24*7 coverage via AWACS which will not be possible in a real war situation. Feb 27 did not prove anything conclusively. it just proved that in some situations/positions/geometries we can dodge the AMRAAMs. Dont read more than that in the Feb 27 episode.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby chola » 30 Dec 2019 10:46

^^^ Yes, expecting to dodge mijjiles is a risky proposition. It is better to detect first and fire first. That is why we have BVR in the first place.

We need the Tejas in numbers. No matter how we dissect the action in February, it comes down to the MKI dodging mijjiles while a MiG-21 was able to close with the F-16s. If Abhi were in a Tejas instead of that very game but ancient fighter, he might have shot it down a BVRAAM instead of dogfight heat seeker and avoid being shot down himself. Losing the MiG and having Abhi captured muddied the results and tipped it into a propaganda opportunity for the pukes.

With so many MKIs, it confused me as to why we ended up with a MiG-21 crossing into POK since it is a point defense fighter. The chini-thai exercise gave me a reason why. The Flanker's RSC is 12 while a F-16 is around 4. The Flankers had to dodge and were on the defensive.

The RCS on a Gripen/Tejas/JF-17 is between 1.5 to 2. A Tejas with modern sensors would have an upper hand even on a F-Solah in BVR combat.

The following from a JF-17 pilot on Hushkit could be just lies but some of the points are intriguing since the chini-thai exercise.

https://hushkit.net/2019/07/19/flying-fighting-in-the-jf-17-thunder-interview-with-pakistan-air-force-fighter-pilot/amp/

We had the MKI's in numbers during the Balakot and the pakis were about to detect and "spike" them beyond "50-60" NM if true.

Again, it could be just BS. But it should be food for thought. Stealth is critical for 5th gen. A small jet has natural stealth on the account of its RCS.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Aditya_V » 30 Dec 2019 11:06

In your RCS calculations, please consider JF-17 is all metal radar reflecting design and IAF through IACCS now probably knows fully abouts its Radar signature since they flown quite a few sorties close to the Indian border

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby sajaym » 30 Dec 2019 11:28

nam wrote:...May be ability to datalink BVR with AWACS to let it cue it towards target...Integrate our SAM's with our AWACS...


This capability is something I had extensively described in my post in the below page.

https://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=7675&p=2322188&sid=ab7a8c81aa359e45091b33fb7f83ce71&sid=ab7a8c81aa359e45091b33fb7f83ce71#p2322188

Integration of SAM with AWACS dramatically cuts down the Kill loop, increases the Kill Area and increases the number of targets which can be engaged simultaneously. I would really like this to be implemented ASAP.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby vivek_ahuja » 05 Jan 2020 13:40

Please consider this an open post for archiving purposes.

I was doing the analysis for my post in the AEW thread and I realized that I was getting very confused by the PAF Erieye numbers. I am posting what I have collated here, but please consider this open for revision:

2006: Pakistan ordered four Erieye AEW&C from the Swedish defence firm Saab. It had intended to acquire six, but some program funding had to be diverted to support recovery and reconstruction efforts in Kashmir following the 2005 Kashmir Earthquake, resulting in the order being trimmed to four.

June 2006: Saab signed a SEK 8.3 billion provisional contract to supply Argus turboprop airborne early warning external link (AEW&C) systems to Pakistan, based on the Saab 2000 regional turboprop airliner and the Erieye fixed active array radar.

2009: 1 Erieye delivered to PAF (total 1)

2010-2011: 3 more Erieye delivered to PAF (total 4).

August 2012: Tehreek-e-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) assailants had infiltrated and attacked PAF Minhas in Kamra with the apparent aim of attacking the Erieye AEW&C. The result of the attack left one Erieye as a complete write-off and two others damaged. The fourth Erieye AEW&C was not present at the base. In effect, the attack had left the PAF with only one of its four originally ordered Erieye AEW&C aircraft (total 1).

2015-2016: The PAF – along with Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) – took the lead in trying to resurrect the two damaged Erieye AEW&C. It succeeded in recovering the two aircraft, with the first returning in 2015 and the second in 2016 (total 3).

2017-2018: PAF reportedly ordered three additional Erieye AEW&C aircraft (Air Forces Monthly), of which the first was slated for delivery in December 2017 and the remaining two in 2018 (total 6).

2019: Speculation that one more Erieye has been delivered to replace the lost unit from 2012 (conversion of the original 5th airframe delivered in 2010-2011?). The PAF had originally ordered five Saab 2000s, i.e., four to house the Erieye airborne early warning and control (AEW&C) system and one for VIP flights and training. This last aircraft is the one in question. (total 7?).

Feel free to add corrections to the tally above.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby MeshaVishwas » 07 Jan 2020 14:12

News reports coming in that an FT-7 Fighter-Trainer has crashed.
Occupants may not have survived.
https://jang.com.pk/news/719149-2-pilot ... ne-crashes

manjgu
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby manjgu » 07 Jan 2020 14:50

1 plane .. 1 tree ...2 crows dead

Barath
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Barath » 10 Jan 2020 18:19

Link 1 Link 2

China & pakistan 9 day joint navy exercises - Sea Guardian 2020 - conducted in North Arabian sea, out of karachi. The 6th such, but the first with this name. This exercise is also the first between China and Pakistan that will feature anti-submarine and submarine rescue training,

The Chinese troops mainly come from the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Southern Theater Command Navy, including the guided missile destroyer Yinchuan, guided missile frigate Yuncheng, comprehensive supply ship Weishanhu, submarine rescue ship Liugongdao, two ship-based helicopters and some 60 Chinese Marines, the PLA Daily reported.

Pakistan will have two frigates, two missile boats, a fixed-wing anti-submarine aircraft, two vessel-based helicopters and about 60 members of special forces participating in the drills.

They will conduct joint cruising, air defense, maritime interception, anti-submarine and live-fire exercises at sea.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby viveks » 14 Jan 2020 02:18

Pakistan's top gun movie....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Anv3Y95eL9Q :D :D :D :)

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Kartik » 14 Jan 2020 02:50

:rotfl: Lol.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Shameek » 14 Jan 2020 04:43

:roll: Interesting they portray only Mirages as the IAF aircraft.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby chola » 14 Jan 2020 06:12

^^^ So the IAF has one mijjile onlee between three planes :rotfl:

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Sid » 14 Jan 2020 09:38

viveks wrote:Pakistan's top gun movie....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Anv3Y95eL9Q :D :D :D :)


I have observed in multiple blogs/interviews by ex-PAF folks that the only aircraft they seem seriously respect is Mirage 2000, specially the upgraded one.

And in all major strikes by IAF, we seem to prefer Mirages.

Probably those $2 billion for the upgrades were worth the price.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby sajaym » 14 Jan 2020 10:27

viveks wrote:Pakistan's top gun movie....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Anv3Y95eL9Q :D :D :D :)


OMG! The picturization is top class! Our ch*****as in Bollywood should watch this. None of our Bollywood war movies have any aircombat scenes so vividly picturized.

chetonzz
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby chetonzz » 14 Jan 2020 12:28

Phakistani movie industry(LOL) as same as TSP is bought and paid by TPSA/COASS, with help of phoregn VFX guy they have made this propaganda movie-
in India we produce thousands of movies per year in infinite languages for generating revenue of major studios while they rely on DGI-ASS-PR to produce 4-5 max a year with shitty item songs where phaki girl plays role of bindi wearing yindoo dancer-

AFAIK- we have plenty of movies on IAF both in Bollywood and T/K-ollywood
lets see what SLB does with his future project on balakot air strike...

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby ranjan.rao » 14 Jan 2020 15:10

Shameek wrote::roll: Interesting they portray only Mirages as the IAF aircraft.

a lot to do with the american propaganda that they have drank and got high on....

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Avinandan » 15 Jan 2020 00:29

viveks wrote:Pakistan's top gun movie....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Anv3Y95eL9Q :D :D :D :)

With meagre budget with respect to Bollywood movies, I would say it was well made. The director stole ideas from multiple movies, Behind the enemy lines starting sequence, Pearl Harbor, dog fight episode with Hellcat and Mitsubishi Zero are the ones that come me my mind at the moment. This might be one of the reason where lot of action was with guns as the original movies also involved gun fight.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby manjgu » 15 Jan 2020 10:11

tauba tauba .mere fiziye tayare ke pichwade mein kufr tayara laga hua hai.. mard e momin mizzile no 1 phire karo bhai jaan khalid

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby mody » 15 Jan 2020 14:51

The propaganda aside, it is well made for a paki movie. Better then most Indian movies involving air combat. As mentioned above, a mish-mash from various Hollywood movies. The lack of missile use in the dog fight is obviously stupid.
All hollywood military movies are also for propaganda only. Pentagon has a special desk to cater to Hollywood for movies.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby chola » 15 Jan 2020 17:00

Ready for Top Gun 2?


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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby nam » 15 Jan 2020 17:53

JF17 must be the only jet which gets SAM warning on a IR guided Mica-IR without having a MAWS...

And you don't want to do afterburners when a IR missile is chasing you.. may be because another name for IR is heat seekers..

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Shameek » 15 Jan 2020 23:30

Its important to remember that movies like this including the original TopGun are made for propaganda and sometimes to act as a recruiting tool for the armed forces. Accuracy and authenticity does not matter to 90% of the people watching the movie who wouldn't be able to differentiate between a F-16 and a JF-17 anyways. Actual air combat and the dangers/emotions are very difficult to capture on screen which is why people resort to gimmicks that look 'cool'.

manjgu
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby manjgu » 16 Jan 2020 07:41

Shameek wrote:Its important to remember that movies like this including the original TopGun are made for propaganda and sometimes to act as a recruiting tool for the armed forces. Accuracy and authenticity does not matter to 90% of the people watching the movie who wouldn't be able to differentiate between a F-16 and a JF-17 anyways. Actual air combat and the dangers/emotions are very difficult to capture on screen which is why people resort to gimmicks that look 'cool'.
true ...this is not a paf training movie!!

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Kartik » 21 Jan 2020 14:32

From AW&ST



Pakistan has given Turkey another year to secure export permits for the engines that will power a new fleet of attack helicopters being supplied by Ankara.

Islamabad signed contracts in 2018 to purchase 30 Turkish Aerospace T129 ATAK attack helicopters, but Ankara has struggled to secure export licenses from the U.S. State Department for the Honeywell/Rolls-Royce LHTEC T800 engines, senior Pakistani officials have reported.

Ismail Demir, president of Turkish defense industries ministry SSB, told a press conference Jan. 6 that Pakistan had granted Ankara an additional year to make the deliveries.

“Pakistan has agreed that they are ready to wait for one more year,” Demir said.

He said Turkish Aerospace (TUSAS) and its partner TUSAS Engine Industries (TEI) are trying to accelerate development of an indigenous turboshaft engine, the TS1400, which has been proceeding since February 2017.

“After one year, Pakistan will either see the stage of our national motor, or if we get the necessary export permits, this will continue,” Demir said.

Turkish Aerospace also wants the TS1400 to power the T625 Gokbey twin-engine medium utility helicopter currently under development. “We believe this need can be provided by the national motor system and we believe this process can be accelerated,” Demir said.

These issues are adding to the woes experienced by Pakistan as it tries to replace its aging fleet of Bell AH-1 Cobra attack helicopters. Plans to introduce Zulu-model Cobras were thwarted when the U.S. government decided to withhold security aid from Islamabad, which resulted in the aircraft being stored in an Arizona boneyard. Islamabad also has purchased several Mil Mi-35M “Hind” helicopters from Russia.

Separately, TEI has delivered the first production batch of 13 PD-170 turbodiesel aviation engines for retrofit onto TUSAS’ Anka medium-altitude, long-endurance unmanned aircraft system to replace the German-made Thielert Centurions that currently power the platform. An early model PD-170 was flown on the Anka at the end of 2018. The engine also is likely to be used on the twin-engine Aksungur platform, which was developed from the Anka.

Demir said 90% of the PD-170’s components have been supplied by Turkish companies and the remainder will come from local vendors by year-end.


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