Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion

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ArjunPandit
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by ArjunPandit »

technically you can read it from right to left..as it is paxtan where the books are read the other way...
Rakesh wrote:
manjgu wrote: someone posted a pic of the participating men ..no F16s in the background.
This is the picture. The PLAAF aircraft is at left, followed by F-7PG, JF-17 and Mirage III.

If you flip that picture horizontally, what does it read? :lol:

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chola
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by chola »

Pakis are making a big deal out of unmarked J-10C at the exercise.

No PLAAF unit insignia means Pakis will get a gift when exercise ends!

https://mobile.twitter.com/PakistanArmy ... 5520038914
Pakistan Army News
@PakistanArmyNe2
Close shots of PLAAF's J-10C from Shaheen-IX Exercise.

Here you can clearly see that there are no markings whatsoever.

Intresting times ahead....... Dragon faceFlag of Pakistan

Note: No markings doesn't mean that these J-10Cs are for PAF.

Image
Image

chola
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by chola »

It seems a PLANAF (chini naval air) unit is participating this year:
https://mobile.twitter.com/89_twombly/s ... 7538463747

twombly89
@89_twombly
Replying to
@RupprechtDeino
A J-11BH(blue 24)from 8th Division is participating in Shaheen-IX.

Image



@Rupprecht_A
@RupprechtDeino
·
Dec 10
Replying to
@89_twombly
That's the famous no. 24 which scrambled the USN P-8 some time ago.


doubleh
@doubleh_sama
·
Dec 10
Smiling face with sunglasses

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MeshaVishwas
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by MeshaVishwas »

This is just Golden :rotfl:

Aditya_V
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Aditya_V »

MeshaVishwas wrote:This is just Golden :rotfl:
Actually, this makes sense, there are "No Non State Actors" in Pakistan, anyone having proper armament is armed by the state. And I wonder why we still deal with H&K as they are cleary in bed with the Paki Army.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by chola »

^^^ I watched the whole thing. Fascinating. Like the presenter I have a certain level of respect for the cavemen who can make a rifle that actually fires with nothing more than a "big file" to make them. lol
MeshaVishwas
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by MeshaVishwas »

Aditya_V wrote:
MeshaVishwas wrote:This is just Golden :rotfl:
Actually, this makes sense, there are "No Non State Actors" in Pakistan, anyone having proper armament is armed by the state. And I wonder why we still deal with H&K as they are cleary in bed with the Paki Army.
They still make great small arms so not a big deal.
Lots of nations/companies play both sides so a real solution is achievable self sufficiency.

Meanwhile the "Next" Gen POF systems are more or less a joke
G3 abomination with COTS parts and a new name PK18 and true to tallel/sweetel birather influence AK ripoff PK21
For full-scale production, POF will need access to polymers and other materials as well as a highly precise machining equipment. In fact, in November 2017 POF requested $250 million US (spread over five years) to modernize its facilities, especially as 58% of its machinery is now over 30 years of age.
(Paki news website)
Karan M
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Karan M »

MeshaVishwas wrote:This is just Golden :rotfl:

Brilliant. I still remember some folks on BR going on about how even Darra Adam Khel made better firearms than India. Hope they wake up now and realize what Pak local artisan shop level stuff is really capable of.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by mmasand »

A news outlet putting a story out that Turkey will not be granted export licenses for the T-129 sale to Pakistan in light of the looming CAATSA sanctions. It's likely Biden will not veto if it passes the senate with 2/3 majority.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by brar_w »

mmasand wrote: It's likely Biden will not veto if it passes the senate with 2/3 majority.
The bill is to be signed by Donald Trump. Even if were to veto the NDAA for FY21, both the houses passed it with enough majority that it goes back to them and gets passed again and becomes veto proof. It will still be enacted while he is still in office. Biden won't be signing an NDAA (FY22) till perhaps November or December of 2021.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Aditya_V »

Important thing to note it is not that cheap to run these non state actors, we keep doing g the right thing they will break
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by chola »

Apparently the Paki Air Marshal Mujhahid Anwar Khan flew in a chini jet yesterday at Shaheen "Xi".

Probably the two-seat J-11BS since I'm not sure the chinis would just hand him a single seat aircraft and have him fly himself with the instruments all in Chinese. "Which one is gear down!?!"

Heavy Paki rumors that they are evaluating the J-10C as panic response to Rafale.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Aditya_V »

J10C will also not match the Su-30 MKI, the MKI was limited by short range of the R-77 AE models, which has been fixed, a few J 10C here are there is not really going to make a difference, they are mainly protected by their F16 fleet. Admitting the JF-17 which has always been about H&D would be a major blow. The CHina will have to export full versions hoping the Pakis don't leak their secrets out.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by MeshaVishwas »

chola wrote:Apparently the Paki Air Marshal Mujhahid Anwar Khan flew in a chini jet yesterday at Shaheen "Xi".

Probably the two-seat J-11BS since I'm not sure the chinis would just hand him a single seat aircraft and have him fly himself with the instruments all in Chinese. "Which one is gear down!?!"

Heavy Paki rumors that they are evaluating the J-10C as panic response to Rafale.
IMO Birather has heavy focus on the North Arabian Sea, most soft loans for weapon systems also point to that.

The KJ-500, maritime attack missiles like the CM400/YJ-83 for the JF-17,AIP Subs with questionable end use restrictions,decent frigates with VLS,Long endurance UAVs etc.

Even this year for the Shaheen-9, the PLANAF brought their J-11BH to Bholari which was noteworthy.

Also, according the German PLAAF watcher, all the J-10C that participated in the flagship exercise were powered by Saturn engines so maybe the Pakis would want to take a rain check, considering how the Ruskies greet them.

:lol:

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by nachiket »

MeshaVishwas wrote: Also, according the German PLAAF watcher, all the J-10C that participated in the flagship exercise were powered by Saturn engines so maybe the Pakis would want to take a rain check, considering how the Ruskies greet them
The Pakis might actually prefer Saturn engines to the Chinese ones considering the problems the Chinese have faced with their own engines. Their entire JF-17 fleet present and future will be powered by Russian engines and the Russians have merrily sold them all the engines they need and continue to do so.

The pakis have wanted J-10's for a long time but never had the money to buy them. Presumably, the Chinese weren't interested in handing them out free. The pakis will get J-10's if that policy has changed.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Vips »

Uncle Sam would for sure sanction the Pukis if they buy any Russian hardware. The Pukis will have to say goodbye to their textile exports to the US, Not sure though how Biden would use the sanctions regime to promote and safeguard American interests.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by chola »

MeshaVishwas wrote: IMO Birather has heavy focus on the North Arabian Sea, most soft loans for weapon systems also point to that.

The KJ-500, maritime attack missiles like the CM400/YJ-83 for the JF-17,AIP Subs with questionable end use restrictions,decent frigates with VLS,Long endurance UAVs etc.

Even this year for the Shaheen-9, the PLANAF brought their J-11BH to Bholari which was noteworthy.

Also, according the German PLAAF watcher, all the J-10C that participated in the flagship exercise were powered by Saturn engines so maybe the Pakis would want to take a rain check, considering how the Ruskies greet them.
:lol:
Right you, Sir. The naval angle of this Shaheen is very interesting. I don't think the PLANAF had ever participated before. And these are from a veteran unit since one of the planes (no.24) was actually photo'ed from an USN P8 during interception.

You never greeted a Paki or Bangladeshi with namaste? I have.

As noted, the entire JF-17 fleet (~150) is powered by Russian engines. A variant of our "reliable" MiG-29 engine.
Last edited by Rakesh on 23 Dec 2020 21:45, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Please DO NOT re-quote pictures when replying. Post Edited.
nam
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by nam »

It is a given that Chinis are coming down to Gawadar. So PLANF flying with PAF make sense, as they might have to deploy in PAF airbases, until they have a proper US style airbases in Gwadar.

If J10C is a panic buy against Rafale, as I have mentioned earlier, instead of fiddling around with more Rafale or F18, we are better off asking US for F35. Just the panic about nothing available to counter it, will be a sight to watch.

I am not convinced Paks will get the "C" version. It might be an older version or at the extreme, one of those flanker knock off.

Chinis gave Paks a fighter they don't deploy, on an engine they don't use, a second grade radar which can see around 80KM and a second grade BVR. Even the updates on JF17, the radar is that air cooled thing...

J10C with PL15 is their primary kit. Chinis knows very well, Pak would flip in a second, if US offers F16.. and give a nice tour of the J10C to the Khan.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/TheWolfpackIN/statu ... 40608?s=20 ---> Report: Pakistan Air Force planning to purchase Chinese EW/ECM plane Y-9G as IAFs acquistion of BNET SDR with TDL has made PAFs aging DA-20s obsolete. Even then BNET system with its Spectrum Aware, Merge & Heal and counter jamming capabilities are far too advanced for Y-9Gs also.

https://twitter.com/TheWolfpackIN/statu ... 99876?s=20 ---> PAF DA-20s are equipped with 25 yr old tech like Indra Taran or Thales Barrage systems or other similar equivalents.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by AkshaySG »

nam wrote: If J10C is a panic buy against Rafale, as I have mentioned earlier, instead of fiddling around with more Rafale or F18, we are better off asking US for F35. Just the panic about nothing available to counter it, will be a sight to watch.
And what good would that do to anyone apart from Amreeki coffers ??? .. The Rafale was already bought to counter China's best planes , You don't need to upgrade from it just because they are handing down some knockoff version of J-10 which itself is a knockoff of our Flankers .

Besides we can barely afford enough Rafales ...Adding another complicated fighter system with its own weapons just to watch the Pakis shiver makes zero sense , Pakis operate on a "bleeding from a thousand cuts " philosophy they're gonna keep paying jihadis and terrorists rather than engage in full on conventional warfare .

A 100 million$ cache of Sig Sauer's for the border troops is going to do much more to make them fear than any single 100mil jet can .
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Rakesh »

:lol: :rotfl:

https://twitter.com/TheWolfpackIN/statu ... 89218?s=20 ---> US to give Pakistan $10 million aid for gender studies program.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by chola »

nam wrote:It is a given that Chinis are coming down to Gawadar. So PLANF flying with PAF make sense, as they might have to deploy in PAF airbases, until they have a proper US style airbases in Gwadar.

If J10C is a panic buy against Rafale, as I have mentioned earlier, instead of fiddling around with more Rafale or F18, we are better off asking US for F35. Just the panic about nothing available to counter it, will be a sight to watch.

I am not convinced Paks will get the "C" version. It might be an older version or at the extreme, one of those flanker knock off.

Chinis gave Paks a fighter they don't deploy, on an engine they don't use, a second grade radar which can see around 80KM and a second grade BVR. Even the updates on JF17, the radar is that air cooled thing...

J10C with PL15 is their primary kit. Chinis knows very well, Pak would flip in a second, if US offers F16.. and give a nice tour of the J10C to the Khan.
Pakis have their AZM (green painting the FC-31) which basically a panic project against the AMCA. We get the F-35 and you will crush the morale of these people who have put the F-Solah on a golden pedestal. lol

BTW, no flanker knockoff because the Russkies would be angry -- for real.

Cheen started advertizing J-10 pretty recently with the J-10CE. E for export. That's official export designation. There were no export models of the J-10 before. So if they get it, it will be the C but a monkey version.

But they have never advertized any Flanker knockoff for export -- no J-11BE or J-16E or J-15E. They knocked off the MiG-19 (J-6) and MiG-21 (J-7), called them the export versions F-6 and F-7 and sold them by the hundreds everywhere.

But no hint of export Flanker knock-offs whatsoever. The Sino-Flankers even comes with WS-10s and still they have never hinted at exports. Guess why? It's because the J-11 is not RE like the J-6/7 but a licensed ToT.

Cheen will not sell the Flanker to Pakistan unless Russia says yes. The PAF will sooner get a SU-30/35 directly from Russ than a J-11 from Cheen.

And I don't see Russia selling them the Flanker as beyond the realm of possibility.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by nam »

Our fight with Paks is one of "morale". The mango abdul on the street and forum, needs to be shown that their fauj is no state to defeat India.

Over the decades, the sense of superiority has been driven by one factor: US weapons. We are seen as a 3rd world country with Russian kit, while they are superior with American kit.

Still harbor the dreams of F16 Block 70! The missing Cobras have caused hurt deep as a well..

Their biggest fear is that we will get US fighter!. Just the news of Boeing offering F15 to us, causes them to go wild...!
Last edited by nam on 24 Dec 2020 01:44, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by nachiket »

Vips wrote:Uncle Sam would for sure sanction the Pukis if they buy any Russian hardware. The Pukis will have to say goodbye to their textile exports to the US, Not sure though how Biden would use the sanctions regime to promote and safeguard American interests.
Uncle Sam had no trouble with 100+ JF-17's powered by Russian engines with more coming. Neither did they have an issue with the Mi-35's they bought back in 2017.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by sudeepj »

J10 is an LCA Mk2 analogue. PAF doesnt have the money to operate a two seat fighter like J11. So its logical that their next acquisition will be the J10 or second hand F16s if they can swing it.

India should consider putting LMT on a blacklist for two-five years if they sell or support F16s for Pak.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by nachiket »

sudeepj wrote: PAF doesnt have the money to operate a two seat fighter like J11.
Twin engined you mean. The J-11 is a single seater.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by nam »

Wonder what is Pak offering in return for recognizing Israel. The beggars are desperate to do it, but must have asked for something, which is difficult for Israel to give. We just gave a juicy 200M order..

They must be talking to the Americans. Like Moroco, Pak must be expecting some "recognition".

The things I can think off from the US
Usual cash/ loan waiver
F16 block 70
AIM 120 C8/ D
the usual "talks"?

The fact that their FM joker, made a noise about we attacking, in UAE, tells me he was told to recognize Israel by UAE and he made up this attack story.

Now I am thinking, the jokers might have asked for US to guarantee no Indian response for any terror attack..along with Block 70/ C8.

Wonder what it could be..
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by nam »

On the F16's, I am fairly confident, the new administration will allow Paks to get additional F16 from either USAF stocks or some other country, which are retiring them. Not to mention more Aim120.

With the F35 coming in, lots of F16 will be freed up.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by ArjunPandit »

nam wrote: Now I am thinking, the jokers might have asked for US to guarantee no Indian response for any terror attack..along with Block 70/ C8.
1. i think right now us can give only baksheesh of loans or some imf aid.
2. Weapons may be hard due to bipartisan movement against china pak
3. Uri happened in 2016. Hopefully the indian govt won't ask for permission before conducting..neither would India give such guarantee without getting a guarantee of no attack from paxtan
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by sudeepj »

nachiket wrote:
sudeepj wrote: PAF doesnt have the money to operate a two seat fighter like J11.
Twin engined you mean. The J-11 is a single seater.
Meant a twin engine fighter.. but two seats also add additional costs. They can only afford light weight fighters.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by sudeepj »

What will a Pakistani recognition of Israel practically mean? They arent a neighbor that poses an invasion threat. They have nukes, but that doesnt mean they are about to launch them at Israel. Any benefits to Israel are only notional here. The real threat to Israel comes from its immediate neighbors, which Trump has neutralized to a large extent. Pakistan has 0 weight internationally and is an international beggar, they cant swing even maldives vote internationally. They have no carrots for Israel, they have no sticks. Therefore Pakistans recognition means nothing and therefore is worth nothing. At most they may get some signal/verbal assurances. But it wont mean a carte-blanche to resume proxy war against India.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by brar_w »

Yes there are limits to how you will be treated to recognizing Israel. How much your recognition weighs is obviously directly propositional to whether your non-recognition actually mattered in the first place. Mattered in terms of either threatening or impacting Israel's security or indirectly via influencing others who could threaten Israel. I mean next we'll be talking about Bangladesh recognizing Israel and getting a squadron of F-22's in return for their generosity.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Vips »

nachiket wrote:
Vips wrote:Uncle Sam would for sure sanction the Pukis if they buy any Russian hardware. The Pukis will have to say goodbye to their textile exports to the US, Not sure though how Biden would use the sanctions regime to promote and safeguard American interests.
Uncle Sam had no trouble with 100+ JF-17's powered by Russian engines with more coming. Neither did they have an issue with the Mi-35's they bought back in 2017.
This was before the US govt passed laws to sanction the Russians and by extension any country planning to buy Russian Mil Hardware.
Last edited by Vips on 25 Dec 2020 03:42, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Vips »

Rakesh wrote::lol: :rotfl:

https://twitter.com/TheWolfpackIN/statu ... 89218?s=20 ---> US to give Pakistan $10 million aid for gender studies program.
A good chunk of the aid will be used in a program by Pak Army afsars for investigating whether charsi Imran married a Trans or a old hag :P
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by VinodTK »

China sells 50 armed drones to Pakistan, begins psyops. It’s a reminder | Analysis
This month, China’s state media publicised its decision to supply 50 Wing Loong-II armed drones to Pakistan, which it prophesied, would be a nightmare for Indian ground formations in high-altitude areas as India’s military does not have the ability to respond to the new-age stand-off weapons.

Arguing that armed Chinese and Turkish drones had played a crucial role in Libya, Syria and Azerbaijan conflicts by decimating the enemy defences and conventional armour, the Chinese media said Indian ground formations would be unable to parry an attack by a large number of armed drones.

While the Chinese emphasis on the success of Wing Loong-II in African and Asian theatre is a matter to be noted, Indian military officials point out that the armed drones perform optimally in uncontested air spaces or where it has air dominance. Like in Afghanistan and Iraq where the United States drones have been used to carry out strikes against insurgents or terrorists because the US was dominating the air space.

This isn’t going to be the case with China or Pakistan’s border with India.

“Whether it is Line of Control in Jammu and Kashmir or the Line of Actual Control in Ladakh, the airspace is very closely monitored by radars and hotly contested with fighters. The armed drones will simply be shot down if they cross the lines,” said a former Indian Air Force chief.

But Pakistan’s acquisition of the armed drones from China does underscore the need for India to acquire weaponised drones and anti-drone systems since the unmanned aerial vehicles can be used to launch air-to-ground weapons without crossing the LoC or LAC. The drones can discharge the weapons beyond the engagement envelopes of the Indian guns or surface-to-air missiles on the ground.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by A Sharma »

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Rohit_K »

A Sharma wrote:PA Army Aviation helicopter crashes
4 jihadis killed
1 + 4

Pak Army helicopter carrying soldier's body crashes in GB
https://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/76475 ... shes-in-gb
A Pakistan Army Aviation helicopter carrying a soldier's body crashed in Minimarg, Gilgit-Baltistan on Saturday, Inter-Services Public Relations said. According to the ISPR statement, the crash occurred "due to technical reasons".

The helicopter was evacuating the body of martyred soldier Sepoy Abdul Qadeer to Combined Military Hospital in Skardu.

"The following officers and soldiers embraced shahadat in the crash," said ISPR.

1. Pilot Major M. Hussain

2. Co Pilot Maj Ayaz Hussain

3. Naik Inzimam Alam

4. Sepoy Muhammad Farooq
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by Mort Walker »

nam wrote:On the F16's, I am fairly confident, the new administration will allow Paks to get additional F16 from either USAF stocks or some other country, which are retiring them. Not to mention more Aim120.

With the F35 coming in, lots of F16 will be freed up.
This is most likely correct. It is not a good sign when the PAF aren't participating in the PLAAF exercises. It means the PAF contacts at the Pentagon have told them to hold off to get a favorable review in the Biden administration and the first "South Asian" vice president.
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by bharathp »

Imagebaloch liberation army has claimed responsibility of an attack that destroyed a Pak Army camp:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1342908647618334728
I dont know how to post full twitter message here- please do the needful
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Post by bharathp »

Rohit_K wrote:
A Sharma wrote:PA Army Aviation helicopter crashes
4 jihadis killed
1 + 4

Pak Army helicopter carrying soldier's body crashes in GB
https://www.thenews.com.pk/latest/76475 ... shes-in-gb
A Pakistan Army Aviation helicopter carrying a soldier's body crashed in Minimarg, Gilgit-Baltistan on Saturday, Inter-Services Public Relations said. According to the ISPR statement, the crash occurred "due to technical reasons".

The helicopter was evacuating the body of martyred soldier Sepoy Abdul Qadeer to Combined Military Hospital in Skardu.

"The following officers and soldiers embraced shahadat in the crash," said ISPR.

1. Pilot Major M. Hussain

2. Co Pilot Maj Ayaz Hussain

3. Naik Inzimam Alam

4. Sepoy Muhammad Farooq
Just wanted to add the type of aircraft that crashed:
Pakistan Army Aviation
AS350 Ecureuil with
5 Sqn based in Skardu

wiki says 10 are on order with PA Avation - one is crashed as of now.
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