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Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

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Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 18 Aug 2017 20:32

old thread locked starting new one

old link viewtopic.php?f=3&t=6389&start=3080

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 18 Aug 2017 20:35

The first helicopter AH-1Z for Pakistan
On the Pakistani web resources , photos of the first combat helicopter Bell AH-1Z Viper, built for the army aviation of Pakistan, appeared. The helicopter with the Pakistani side number "786-061" is the first in a batch of three AH-1Z, which is reportedly to be transferred to Pakistan in late 2017. In total, Pakistan should receive 12 new AH-1Z helicopters, the remaining nine helicopters should be delivered by the end of September 2018. The first combat helicopter Bell AH-1Z Viper, built for the military aviation of Pakistan (Pakistan side number "786-061") (c) twitter.com

Image

Pakistan will be the first foreign recipient of Bell AH-1Z Viper helicopters, the latest development of the family of the world's first specialized helicopter gunships Bell AH-1 Cobra. Production of the helicopter AH-1Z (brand name Bell 449 SuperCobra) is carried out by Bell Helicopter (part of Textron Corporation) since 2006 exclusively for the US Marine Corps, which intends to purchase 226 helicopters of this type (37 converted from AH-1W and 189 new ones Buildings) by 2021.


In April 2015, the Defense Security Cooperation Agency (DSCA) sent a notification to the US Congress about the forthcoming sale of 15 helicopters Bell AH-1Z Viper with arms (including 1000) to Pakistan through the inter-governmental military sales of Foreign Military Sales (FMS) . guided missiles AGM-114R Hellfire II) and equipment with a total value of $ 952 million

, however, is actually a result of the intergovernmental agreement on the FMS lines were signed for the supply to Pakistan only 12 helicopters AH-1Z and at a lower cost - the agreement for the supply lane s three helicopters was signed in August 2015 and the agreement for the supply of a further nine - in April 2016.

As far as can be judged, the delivery of AH-1Z helicopters to Pakistan will be made against US military aid, and it is still unclear whether Pakistan has chosen the type AH-1Z independently, or this machine was imposed on the Pakistani side as a condition for financing the delivery.

Bell Helicopter has been trying to promote the AH-1Z to the international market for a long time, but before the Pakistani contract this was not crowned with success (in 2000, the AN-1Z project won the first stage of the long-drawn Turkish helicopter tender under the ATAC program, Turkey AH-1Z did not reach due to disagreements between the parties on the cost and transfer of technology).

Army aviation of Pakistan is a long-time operator of Bell AH-1 Cobra helicopters, having received 20 AH-1S from the USA in 1984-1986 and 32 AH-1F helicopters from availability in 2003-2010, as well as buying eight AH-1F from the availability Jordanian Air Force in 2013.

The army aviation of Pakistan also received three new Chinese military helicopters WZ-10 (becoming their first foreign operator) in 2015, and in August 2015 ordered four Russian Mi-35M combat helicopters (delivery is scheduled for 2017).


Image
Image


http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2791455.html

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 18 Aug 2017 20:40

Pakistan signs warship, training planes deal with Turkey
Turkey and Pakistan have signed a memorandum of understanding for the sale of four Turkish made corvette warships and 52 Pakistan-made training planes for Ankara's armed forces, Turkey's defense industry undersecretariat said on Wednesday.

Karachi Shipyard (KS&EW) will buy four corvettes made under Turkey's MILGEM warship program, aimed at designing and building locally a fleet of multipurpose corvettes and frigates that will replace older ships.


The Turkish defense undersecretariat said the final deal was expected to be signed on June 30. The statement did not provide any financial details.

Turkey will buy 52 Super Mushshak training planes from Pakistan Aeronautical Complex - Kamra, to replace the T-41 and SF-260 planes currently in use, a statement by Ankara's defense undersecretariat said.

This would be the first time a NATO country has used Super Mushshak planes, the statement added.

Two warships built under the MILGEM project so far, named TCG Heybeliada and TCG Buyukada, were delivered to the Turkish navy in 2011 and 2013. Construction is ongoing for TCG Burgazada and TCG Kinaliada, which are expected to start active duty in 2018 and 2020, respectively.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 18 Aug 2017 20:41

Pakistan Air Force jet crashes during training mission

On August 10, a PAF fighter jet crashed near Mianwali some 350-km from Lahore after its take off leading to the death of the pilot. According to reports, about 10 or 11 F7-PGs/FT-7PGs (aircraft) have been lost during their 15 years in service.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 19 Aug 2017 13:11

Special Services Group Pakistan SF


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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 20 Aug 2017 20:01

Pakistan builds nuclear warhead underground storage facility in Balochistan: Report
WASHINGTON: Pakistan has built a "hardened, secure, underground" complex in a remote mountainous region in the restive Balochistan province that could serve as a storage site for nuclear warheads, an American thinktank said today.

It said in a report that the underground complex in the southwestern province "could serve as a ballistic missile and nuclear warhead storage site".


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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 20 Aug 2017 20:31

US Centcom chief stresses sustained ties with Pakistan

ISLAMABAD/PESHAWAR: Senior US commander Gen Joseph Votel on Saturday departed after his two-day visit to the country with “increased understanding of the counterterrorism and counter-insurgency efforts of the Pakistani government”.


According to a statement issued by the United States embassy, the general, who was also taken to North Waziristan that was once home to some of the most violent terrorist groups, including the Haqqani network, emphasised sustained cooperation with Pakistan and welcomed Islamabad’s commitment to bilateral ties.

“Military cooperation, and even stronger cooperation with Pakistan, is very important, and we deeply appreciate the hospitality and willingness to continue an honest and open relationship,” the commander of the US Central Command (Centcom) said in the statement issued at the conclusion of the visit.


He, nevertheless, underlined the need for ensuring that “Pakistani soil is not used to plan or conduct terrorist attacks against its neighbours”. This has been a consistent message from visiting US officials. Acting Assistant Secretary of State for South and Central Asian Affairs and acting Special Representative for Afghanistan and Pakistan Alice Wells, who visited Pakistan earlier this month, too had left behind the same note.

Gen Votel’s third trip to Pakistan as Centcom commander took place as the US government continued a review of its South Asia policy amid speculation of a looming rupture in ties because of a strong opinion in the White House that Pakistan had not been an honest partner in the fight against terrorism in Afghanistan.

However, the US defence department believes that Pakistan’s support is crucial for operations in Afghanistan and any eventual peace deal with the Taliban. Therefore, the department has been counselling against a split even though Defence Secretary James Mattis had refused to certify that Pakistani actions had denied safe haven to Taliban and the Haqqani network. Reimbursements for Pakistani actions in support of US military operations under the ‘Coalition Support Fund’ were cut because of the defence secretary’s refusal issue the certification.

Gen Votel tried to assuage the concerns in Islamabad about a complete breakdown in relationship by noting: “We are extraordinarily pleased to continue these enduring relationships.” The embassy said the commander had in his meetings “focused on the need to further strengthen US and Pakistani military-to-military relations… to ensure greater regional security and stability”.


Chief of the Army Staff Gen Qamar Bajwa had a day earlier, in his meeting with Gen Votel, renewed the commitment to cooperate with US-led coalition troops in Afghanistan and Afghan security forces for “improved security environment in Pakistan-Afghanistan border region”. :rotfl:

Gen Bajwa had at the same time stressed acknowledgment of Pakistan’s sacrifices in the fight against terrorism.

A similar resolve was expressed by Prime Minister Shahid Khaqqan Abbasi when Gen Votel called on him.

PM Abbasi agreed on cooperation for dealing with “regional concerns” and underscored that the ongoing policy review in the US should recognise Pakistan’s efforts in fighting terrorism and its commitment to peace and security in Afghanistan.

In North Waziristan, the US delegation headed by Gen Votel briefed about the army’s operations in the area and the Pakistan-Afghanistan border security mechanism through enhanced surveillance measures.

It was also briefed about progress in socio-economic development, including return of displaced people to their native areas.

The US delegation appreciated efforts and sacrifices of the army and local tribes for re-establishing peace and order in the area and realised the importance of the bilateral border security coordination.

Later, the delegation visited the Army Public School in Miramshah and interacted with the students.

Upon arrival in the tribal region, the delegation was received by Peshawar Corps Commander Lt Gen Nazir Ahmad Butt, while Chief of General Staff Lt Gen Bilal Akbar accompanied it.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 20 Aug 2017 22:41

Special Report about JF-17 Block 3 Fighter Jet


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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Aditya_V » 20 Aug 2017 23:02

Thats all fine but any videos of BVR missile firings, Ariel Refuelling probe, AESA radars, LGB and PGM tests , Carrier Killer missile, all of which was supposed to have been done before JF-17 Blk 2. Or is there is a video of JF-17 completing its full vertical loop, not where it reaches its apex and turns the other way.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 20 Aug 2017 23:12

Came across this video of J-17 firing WVR missile and Dropping Dumb Bomb

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paz9UNDGHj8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3GEAbq41KQ

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Aditya_V » 21 Aug 2017 11:14

Yup, I remember in 2002 during operation Parakram , when Pakistan was buying F-7PG were being inducted by the PAF, thee was huge talk of it being a very advanced version with a Radar capable of engaging BVR targets - some italian Grifo radar was being bandied about. Regarding the JF-17, if BVR and in flight refuelling had been intergrated I am sure there will be PAF or Chengdu produced videos of such a test. There are no such videos. The WVR missile also seems to explode within a few secs of the missile being fired indicating a range of 1-1.5KM indicating it that the missile launched was not guided by the aircraft radar but the missile seeker activated launch.

It would be nice if there was transparency on what additional capabilities Block II and Block III aircraft inducted into PAF bring to the table.


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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby anupmisra » 27 Aug 2017 17:44

Two reports and one source on paki nuclear infrastructure and where the warheads may be stored.

Potential Nuclear Weapons-Related Military Area in Baluchistan,Pakistan
Pakistan’s Evolving Nuclear Weapons Infrastructure


First source:
Pakistan has constructed a hardened, secure, underground complex in Baluchistan Province that could serve as a ballistic missile and nuclear warhead storage site (see figures 1 and 2). The underground complex is near a possible ballistic missile base, first identified in 2016 by Hans Kristensen of the Federation of American Scientists (FAS) and Colonel Vinayak Bhat (Ret.), a military intelligence veteran of the Indian Army
This analysis resulted from a 2014 request from a journalist who provided the coordinates of the ballistic missile base and the mountain site. The person requested that they remain anonymous


Second source:
Robert Norris and I estimate that Pakistan has produced an estimated stockpile of 130-140 nuclear warheads for delivery by short- and medium-range ballistic missiles, cruise missiles, and fighter-bombers.
Although there have been many rumors over the years, the location of the nuclear-capable launchers has largely evaded the public eye for much of Pakistan’s 19-year old declared nuclear weapons history. ... But over the past several years, commercial satellite pictures have gradually brought into light several facilities that might form part of Pakistan’s evolving nuclear weapons launcher posture.


Third source:
Image

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INSTITUTE FOR SCIENCE AND INTERNATIONAL SECURITY: http://isis-online.org/uploads/isis-rep ... _Final.pdf

https://fas.org/blogs/security/2016/11/ ... structure/

https://twitter.com/rajfortyseven/statu ... 4447114240

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Kartik » 01 Sep 2017 23:53

Russia delivers 4 Mi-35M helos to Pakistan

Russia has completed delivery of four Mil Mi-35M 'Hind E' attack helicopters to the Pakistan Army Aviation Corps (PAAC), Brigadier General Waheed Mumtaz, spokesperson for the Defence Export Promotion Organization of Pakistan, was quoted by Russian news agency RIA Novosti as saying on 25 August.

"The contract was signed, we received all four [helicopters], and now we get new equipment," Brig Gen Mumtaz told reporters at this year’s Army-2017 defence exhibition, which took place from 22-27 August near Moscow.

The spokesperson said that Pakistani pilots are now becoming acquainted with the new equipment. Based on the PAAC’s experience with the helicopters, Islamabad will now decide whether to place an order for additional helicopters as well as for other Russian military equipment and platforms, he was quoted as saying.

Pakistan and Russia had agreed to the Mi-35M deal in August 2015 in a move that was considered a breakthrough between the two countries. Pakistan's minister for defence production, Rana Tanveer Hussain, was quoted by local media last December as saying that Islamabad paid a total of USD153 million for the four helicopters.

Mindful of Indian concerns, Moscow had for years opted against engaging in any military co-operation with Pakistan.

However, in 2014 Russia decided to lift its self-imposed arms embargo against the South Asian country.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby kit » 04 Sep 2017 01:53

Austin wrote:Pakistan builds nuclear warhead underground storage facility in Balochistan: Report
WASHINGTON: Pakistan has built a "hardened, secure, underground" complex in a remote mountainous region in the restive Balochistan province that could serve as a storage site for nuclear warheads, an American thinktank said today.

It said in a report that the underground complex in the southwestern province "could serve as a ballistic missile and nuclear warhead storage site".


make one in Kashmir as well .. logic seems to be that one will be the first to be bombed !!

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Rakesh » 04 Sep 2017 08:20

US prevents sending of F-16 training pilots to Turkey
http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/us-ref ... sCatID=510

The government, which has been focused on measures that would increase the number of jet pilots, is searching for F-16 trainers abroad. Pakistan was the only country to accept Turkey’s request. However, the U.S. objected to Pakistan sending F-16 jet pilot trainers to Turkey, based on the agreement that U.S.-origin equipment’s purchase, sale, maintenance and training between third countries needed approval from Washington.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Rakesh » 04 Sep 2017 20:30

Lockheed Martin to provide F-16 jet tech services to 12 countries
http://www.defenseworld.net/news/20416/ ... a1petN94UQ

Contractor engineering and technical services will be provided to elevate the technical expertise of system maintainers.
Work will be performed at Hill Air Force Base, Utah; Toledo, Ohio; Tucson, Arizona; McEntire Joint National Guard Base, South Carolina; and in 12 countries, Bahrain, Pakistan, Chile, Jordan, Turkey, Morocco, Taiwan, Oman, Egypt, Iraq, Thailand, and Indonesia. Work is expected to be completed by June 30, 2020.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Rakesh » 04 Sep 2017 21:06

Pakistan to the US: Don’t Threaten Us. We Can Walk Away :rotfl:
https://rusi.org/commentary/pakistan-us ... -walk-away

Opium is in full effect here....

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Aditya_V » 18 Sep 2017 11:04

Just thinking aloud on what the PAF fighter capabilities as it stands today are:-

1. F-16's Fleet of about 75, operational ratio say 66% - 50 Aircraft with true BVR and PGM's

2. JF-17 Fleet of about 75, block 1,2,3, no real PGM or BVR tests, 3 or 4 have crashed, operational ratio 65% with RD-33 engine - say 50 Aircraft

3. F-7 and F-7 PG, around 100 F-7 acquired in the late 80's and 50 F-7 PG in 2002, we know 10-15 F-7 PG itself have crashed and atleast 2 F-7 acquired per year since the late 80"s, so this fleet which neither has BVR or PGM capability with an operating ratio of 60% -45 Aircraft

4. Mirage III/V- 140 acquired in various steps since 1970's, ignore ~20 -30 defunct aircraft acquired in the late 1990's from Libya etc for spare parts, even France had closed the line in 1980's and stopped making spare parts in the 1990's. There have crashes at 2-3 a year of this type since the 90's. SO the fleet can't be more than 60 and operational ratio is at best 40% -25 aircraft. Yet these were the aircraft taken to Skardu recently.

And I still think this is optimistic, best case scenario PAF can through 175 aircraft into battle.

It shows a few things

1. If the 3 or 4 US mandated bases are targeted with a combination of BM/CM's and IAF strike groups of 30/40 aircraft with PGM's/ ARM's Spice/ Garuda/ Garuthama etc. within the First hour, given the lack of BVR and PGM capability of other aircraft, the PAF may quit the fight within the first few hours. They are very much dependent on US providing spares through the Turkey route

2. PAF with its budget clearly does not have a choice with respect to JF-17, they are paying through the nose for aircraft which can't complete a vertical loop and till date does not have any refueling, PGM or BVR capabilities which has been demonstrated. No wonder PLAAF does not want this aircraft but to keep its capabilities secret, does not export J-10's or any of REVERSE ENGINEERED TOT produced Flankers J-11 to J-15.
There is no transparency from the PAF on servicebility of these aircraft and sortie rates etc. the PAF chief claiming the RD-33 engine as trouble free is hard to believe since everyone has had problems with the parent RD-93 engine from Russian Airforce, Indian Airforce and anther 20 airforces int he world.

3. Looking at satellite images of PAF bases expect in 1 or 2 bases with 2/3 aircraft being outside aircraft shelters it seems the PAF is not flying much of any type especially the JF-17.

4. The US supply of F-16 C/D and modernizing the F-16 fleet with 500 amraams has clearly behind the Paki belligerence we have seen in 2010-17, without which the fleet IAF will have Air dominance. IF we can throttle the supply of spare parts, I don't even the Paki army willing to go up on the escalation order on LOC, the will be willing to take more casualties and hide it from the general public.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Karthik S » 18 Sep 2017 11:14

Pakis' main strength comes from nukes and missiles, not in conventional military terms. Our aim should to be take out their missiles and related facilities.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Aditya_V » 18 Sep 2017 11:40

Missiles will be launched if the generals have time to slowly see they are losing the war, if the PAF is take out quickly, our aircraft, CM's etc can freely target their missile launchers a) taking out the decision out of thier hands pretty quickly b) Given past experience from Egypt to ME, once the Army becomes prey psychologically they know that the Indian Armed will be able to Target them and thier families pretty easily, keeping them of suicidal decisions. Its only a belief in some of survival or weakness shown by Indians with PAF still in the Air with the GHQ generals think India will not retiatle appropriately that they will pull the trigger.

One of the learnings from 800 years of Invasions, large parts of our population was deliberately disarmed, there was general complacency with a limited amount of Military equipment and Soldiers. Once this little amount of soldiers and equipment was lost thew will to fight was lost like Nadir Shah and Jaffer khan etc.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Thakur_B » 18 Sep 2017 18:19

In any conflict, PAF would get decimated in a week, and by decimated, I mean left with nothing more than hand launched UAVs and a few mobile air defence platforms.

The army though will dig in like ticks and town after town would have to be liberated in seiges.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 18 Sep 2017 18:24

Pakistan Air Force Base Technologies And Innovation | HQ Debate With Hamza Ali Abbasi


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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 18 Sep 2017 18:25

Mirages in Pakistan Air Force Special Documentary on 50 years of Mirages 2017


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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Aditya_V » 18 Sep 2017 23:01

Jf-17 hmmm looks like a very bare bones assembly with limited electricals and PAF Kamra is the only entity in Pakistan with no other Pakistani vendors?
HAL Su 30 production or even the earlier Jaguar Mig 27 Mig 21 had many Indian vendors. I don't think they have reached the stage of HAL Mig 21 manufacture. That didn't look like a busy assembly line manufacturing 12-16 aircraft. Seems like most of the work is done in China with the major parts put together in PAF Kamra.

Looking at it against the so called production machines seem to have done nothing and shiny. There are 3 or 4 aircraft being in various stages of assembly but no subcomponents parts etc all over the place.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Philip » 22 Sep 2017 12:33

The cinderella of the Paki services,just like its counterpart in India was,is its navy.However,in recent times it has been steadily improving its capabilities,esp. its sub fleet.Apart from building/acquiring 4 Agosta-90B AIP subs from France,Pak is set to acquire at least 8 Yuan AIP subs and may even be planning with China for the lease/buy of a genuine N-boat. The next chief has to be selected within a v.short time with the current chief retiring in a couple of weeks time .Given that the PN plans to mirror India's second-strike capability by putting N-tipped missiles aboard its subs in the future,the next chief of the PN will have an onerous responsibility.Here are the runners according to the Paki media.

http://dunyanews.tv/en/Pakistan/406202- ... aval-chief
.Who will be Pakistan's next naval chief?
20 September,2017 11:27 pm

Current Naval Chief Admiral Zakaullah will hang his boots on October 8
ISLAMABAD (Dunya News) – Process to appoint Pakistan Navy’s news Admiral has been started and for this purpose four names have been forwarded to the prime minister of Pakistan, reported Dunya News.

According to details, the following four names have been sent to the Prime Minister Shahid Khaqan Abbasi; Vice Admiral Zafar Mehmood Abbas, Vice Admiral Syed Arifullah Hussaini, Vice Admiral Waseem Akram and Vice Admiral Kaleem Shaukat. Admiral Zakaullah will hang his boots on October 8. On Prime Minister’s recommendation, President of Pakistan will give the approval for naval chief.

On basis of seniority, Vice Admiral Zafar Mehmood Abbasi, who is also the current chief of staff, is on the top on seniority list. He got commission in Pakistan Navy in 1981. He also received sword of honor at Pakistan Naval Academy. He studied at Britain’s Royal Naval College.
*(most likely to get the nod)

He was appointed as Commandant Pakistan Naval Academy, Commander Surface Ships and DG Pakistan Maritime Security Agency at different points during his career.

Second on the seniority list is Vice Admiral Syed Arifullah Hussain, who is also the deputy chief of operations. He also got commission in 1981. He took higher education from Britain. He also commanded surface ships and mine warfare squadrons.

Vice admiral Waseem Akram is third on the list of seniority, while Vice Admiral Kaleem Shaukat is ranked fourth. Both these officers took commission in 1982. They are appointed deputy chief of training and evaluation and commander Pakistan fleet respectively.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Aditya_V » 22 Sep 2017 12:44

Philip Pakistan Acquired 3 Agosta 90B's only last one has AIP.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby arun » 23 Sep 2017 11:30

X Posted from the ISI News & Discussions thread.

C Christine Fair highlights the very close links between the Uniformed Jihadi’s of the Punjabi dominated Military of the Mohammadden Terrorism Fomenting Islamic Republic of Pakistan and the Un-Uniformed Jihadis of UN proscribed Islamic Republic of Pakistan based Mohammadden Terrorist group Jamaat Ud Dawa JuD.

………………. studies exhibit little awareness of the important domestic perquisites JuD affords its handlers in the army and the brutal intelligence agency that the army oversees, the Inter-services Intelligence Directorate (ISI).
a

In the last decade, JuD spawned numerous related organizations, such as the Idara Khidmat-e-Khalq (IKK, Organization for Humanitarian Assistance), declared by the US Department of Treasury to be an FTO in April 2006.10 In 2009, JuD constituted a new humanitarian front, Falah Insaniat Foundation (FIF, Foundation for Welfare of Humanity), which the United States also designated as an FTO in 2010. In 2012, the United Nations designated FIF pursuant to UN Security Council Resolutions 1267 (1999) and 1989 (2011).11 Most recently, in early August 2017, JuD has floated a political party named the Milli Muslim League (MML) headed by a senior leader of the JuD named Saifullah Khalid.12 The MML is fielding a candidate in the September 17, 2017 by-election to fill the seat left vacant by Nawaz Sharif’s recent ouster even though the MML has not yet completed its registration with the Pakistan Election Commission.13 The MML plans to field more candidates in the 2018 elections. This represents a serious retrenchment from the organization’s long-standing position that it has no role in electoral politics and that elections and democracy are in fact anathema to its interpretation of shariat. While little is known about the MML given its recency, speculation is rife about its relationship to Pakistan’s deep state. Some analysts interpret the development of MML as a positive sign that Pakistan is trying to rein in its proxy by giving it a nonlethal domestic role that will allow the state to decommission its jihad function gradually.14

I reject this interpretation. As I have previously argued and also note here, LeT is the only militant organization in Pakistan that argues explicitly against violence within Pakistan while also offering the perquisite of loyally executing lethal attacks at the behest of the deep state.15 While only time will tell which interpretation is correct, I see the emergence of the MML as a further effort by the deep state to formally embed JuD within Pakistani politics. The timing of the MML’s nascence is also notable because it coincides with the army’s exhaustion with both of the mainstream political parties (the Pakistan Peoples’ League and the Pakistan Muslim League of Nawaz Sharif) and the ongoing failure of Imran Khan’s Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf (PTI) to develop a national presence. In effect, the army has few options to engineer Pakistan’s political leadership in the forthcoming general elections.16 While the MML is unlikely to fare well in elections (as no religious party ever polls more than 10 percent in a free and fair Pakistan election),17 the MML can play a useful role as a member of a coalition groomed by the army and the ISI.


Conclusions and Implications

JuD remains the subject of scholarly and policy analytical inquiry. Most extant scholarship views this organization from the singular point of view of its external utility as a loyal and effective proxy of Pakistan’s military and intelligence agency. This singular focus upon its role in waging so-called jihad in India and, to a lesser extent, in Afghanistan significantly understates the significance of JuD to Pakistan’s deep state. Not only is it a crucial partner in prosecuting its national security interests abroad, it is also a vital partner in managing Pakistan’s internal security arrangements. JuD is the only militant organization in Pakistan that deliberately preaches the message that the only legitimate jihad is the external jihad. It is also the only militant organization that explicitly disavows not only sectarian violence, but also communal violence. This does not mean that JuD is insouciant about deviations from tawheed or other shortcomings. However, it believes that within the borders of Pakistan, the only method to deal with wayward Muslims—either ordinary citizens or in leadership—is through dawah and preaching the message of the external jihad. With the launch of the MML, JuD will be even more effective in spreading this message. Consequently, JuD will likely become even more valuable to its masters in the Pakistani army and intelligence community, even if it comes at the cost of being more difficult to control and manage over the longer term.


Hudson Institute:

Jamaat-ud-Dawa: Converting Kuffar at Home, Killing Them Abroad

Austin
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 23 Sep 2017 19:00

Pakistan Navy conducts successful anti-ship missile test


Austin
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 23 Sep 2017 19:02

Pakistan Navy shows off its largest Warships at Navy Day


Aditya G
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Aditya G » 23 Sep 2017 21:05

Austin wrote:Pakistan Navy shows off its largest Warships at Navy Day



PMSA BN-2 Islanders are still operating....

Which missile did Sea King fire? PN is truly on a revival trajectory with large expansion in assets.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Rakesh » 23 Sep 2017 21:23

I believe the AM-39 Exocet...compare the video to the photo of the Exocet on the PN Sea King Mk 45



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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Rakesh » 25 Sep 2017 02:50

A must read....

Pakistan Air Force officials outline Erieye AEW&C recovery process
http://quwa.org/2017/09/22/pakistan-air ... y-process/

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Aditya_V
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Aditya_V » 25 Sep 2017 18:39

But can Quwa website. As per it JF17 has Aesa and aerial refuelling and can carry a 3 tonne ACG400 carrier killer missile

Austin
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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 20 Oct 2017 10:35

PAF is currently conducting a multi-national air exercise in Pakistan (ACES Meet 2017) with 19 participating air forces, with 2 active participants with aircraft (the Saudis and Turks).

RSAF F-15SA's and TuAF F-16 Block 52s at Mushaf AFB, Sargodha to participate in 'ACES MEET 2017".


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via keypubs/AFM

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Kartik » 21 Oct 2017 00:04

"Brothers in Arms"..full attempt to co-opt the fellow Muslim nations into Pakistan's sphere, to allow them to somehow increase their reserves in case of a full blown conflict against India.

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Bishwa » 24 Oct 2017 08:27

https://www.dawn.com/news/1364641/pakis ... er-attacks

PA is fencing parts of the border with afghanistan. This article has a collection of photos including some of the sensors they are installing

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Khalsa » 26 Oct 2017 01:01

Bishwa wrote:https://www.dawn.com/news/1364641/pakistan-fortifies-border-with-afghanistan-to-reduce-cross-border-attacks

PA is fencing parts of the border with afghanistan. This article has a collection of photos including some of the sensors they are installing



awesome
the cows are coming home. Spend money on a fence and then spend more money on patrolling to make sure the muslim brothers don't make holes in it
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

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Re: Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion Thread

Postby Austin » 30 Oct 2017 21:18

Development Of JF 17 Block 3 Complete Documentary



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