MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

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Rakesh
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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby Rakesh » 06 Aug 2020 18:40

Khalsa wrote:If you go over his words twice and then watch his eyes and his face and when he begins talking about the almost reduced but equivalent capacity. I believe he is literally reading your words or maybe you talked to him before the interview.

I think there is a chance of 90 being the final number for the IAF. But the amount his body speaks about the 114 MRCA tells me he is damn confident about it being nothing more than a pipe dream

Thank you for pointing me towards the IAC I & II. I had my IAF blinkers on forgot about their (Naval) requirements.

What the IAF wants must translate into reality in the budget.

If it does not, either the entire program will be scrapped or the IAF will go with another phoren 4th generation fighter. If the latter scenario pans out, it will be a redo of the 80s' saga of the Mirage 2000 and MiG-29 acquisition. Only thing this time, another fourth generation fighter will be a Western bird. I don't see how the Russian planes are going to work out politically for the GOI or technically for the IAF.

Now if the GOI pulls a surprise (i.e. money growing on trees) and orders 90 Rafales, they could split the order between the IAF and IN programs. 54 aircraft for the IAF could raise three more squadrons, two of which will land up at Hasimara and Ambala and the third at Gwalior. The 36 for the IN will be based at INS Hansa in Goa. Since IAC-2 is 20 years away and the upcoming Vikrant shows no sign of accommodating Rafale on the vessel's lifts, those 36 birds (and the pilots who operate her) could be seconded for the IAF i.e. like how the MiG-29Ks are doing now.

Assuming the above scenario pans out ---> 2 IAF Rafale units now + 3 more IAF Rafale units + 2 IN Rafale units = 7 squadrons or 126 aircraft. The exact number of the MMRCA 1.0 contest. With jointmanship and CDS being the buzz words, this scenario (funds being the main thorny issue) could very well pan out.

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby Rakesh » 06 Aug 2020 18:44

JayS wrote:I believe he is talking from the MRO/serviceability perspective and not comparing capability and saying x Rafale = Y some other fighter. If you buy 90 more Rafale, you have total 126 Rafales. But if you want to buy another X fighter then you have 36 Rafale + 90 X Fighter. You cant just numerically match these two cases considering different lifecycles, Maint schedule, availability requirements etc of the two types. So with some logic IAF came up with a number 114 which they think makes the second case equivalent to the first one ie. 126 Rafale = 36 Rafale + 114 other fighters.

I think this is what is saying. But then question arises, if Rafale is chosen as MRFA, why buy additional fighter over and above 90 and engage money in those 24 extra jets..? Surely the tender is not gonna change later once down-selection happens. So just to hedge against the possibility that Rafale may not be chosen for whatever reason, we are commiting for 24 more jets which is worth around 3B USD.. .!! Thats how disfunctional our procurement process is.

Satya Vachan! So true. Kudos to you Saar.

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby Khalsa » 09 Aug 2020 15:23

OMG, the Navy is going to go for Raffy.
I am sure of it now. That pose is that of post flight.
:D

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby Kartik » 10 Aug 2020 14:13

Khalsa wrote:OMG, the Navy is going to go for Raffy.
I am sure of it now. That pose is that of post flight.
:D


That image of Admiral Arun Prakash is well over 15 years old. Nothing to get excited about now. It was during the first evaluation of the Rafale M along with the MiG-29K and Su-33.

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby Manish_Sharma » 10 Aug 2020 18:54

@livefist:
On the Indian MoD’s import ban list including indigenous items like the LCA Tejas, Light Combat Helicopters Pinaka, Astra & Akash missile systems, the MoD has a “clarification” just in: https://t.co/fxX4rsT2uv

Image
https://twitter.com/livefist/status/1292772080287535104?s=09
_____________________

^MoD clarifies that 'foriegn equivalent' of LCA, LCH, Astra, Pinaka & Akash will not be allowed to be imported.

So that means grippen will be removed from MRCA?

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby Rakesh » 18 Aug 2020 00:21

Rakesh wrote:As Group Captain HV Thakur (Retd) so aptly points out...

https://twitter.com/hvtiaf/status/12356 ... 49856?s=20 ---> Abstract Ex - think about it. police gun range = 100 meters, but thief's gun range = 120 meters. Will this be reason enough for the thief to be allowed to escape? No. There's all kinds of tactics. For policing, as also, for air combat.

Read this tweet above and then read this tweet below....

https://twitter.com/TheWolfpackIN/statu ... 91713?s=20 ---> Report: Taiwan govt is requesting US to approve supply of AIM-120Ds for ROCAF F-16 Block 70s to improve deterrence against new Chinese BVRAAMS like PL-15.

=============================

Range of AIM-120D is > 160 km and range of PL-15 is 300 km. Range of Meteor is around 150 km. Astra is 110 km onlee. That 300 km range of the PL-15 is from the Chicom propaganda machine.

NaPaki/Lahori Logic conclusion from this is that JF-17 is superior & cheaper to Rafale and thus Rafale is a waste of money.

Solution from BRF's "import pasand, pro American" lobby --> Buy F-21 with AIM-120D and all problems will be solved! Better yet, just buy the in-development AIM-260 JATM which the Amreekis will be eager to sell along with F-21 :mrgreen: :lol:

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby Rakesh » 18 Aug 2020 00:29

So much for MMRCA addressing squadron shortage.

https://twitter.com/Nik_Pandharikar/sta ... 71392?s=20 ---> 1. Submarines, AK 203 deal-two Make in India projects Modi govt set to push on priority - MMRCA to take more time.

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby k prasad » 18 Aug 2020 03:37

Lets hope this is because there is increased confidence that AMCA, LCA Mk2/MWF, and Mk1a are mature enough to be ordered in bulk.

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby nachiket » 18 Aug 2020 03:48

k prasad wrote:Lets hope this is because there is increased confidence that AMCA, LCA Mk2/MWF, and Mk1a are mature enough to be ordered in bulk.

More likely because there is simply no money to buy/build 100+ foreign fighters. The situation is no different than the last time and there is no reason to believe the outcome will be any different either. Proceeding with the usual RFI-RFP-eval process will be a monumental waste of time. It is even a bigger joke now than the last time with the F-15EX and Su-35 being pushed along with the Gripen and F-16 for the same requirement.

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby k prasad » 18 Aug 2020 06:11

Well, the only real silver lining is, the longer this process takes, the closer AMCA and MWF will be to readiness. At some point, IAF will just end up biting the locally-made bullet in the face of decreasing sqn strength. At most, I suspect we'll buy another 2 sqns of Rafales.

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby V_Raman » 25 Aug 2020 04:45

What is this?

Lockheed Martin Scores $62 Billion F-16 Sale
https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/08/ ... f-16-sale/

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby brar_w » 25 Aug 2020 05:15

V_Raman wrote:What is this?

Lockheed Martin Scores $62 Billion F-16 Sale
https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/08/ ... f-16-sale/

The international aerospace thread has the details. This was long expected and now has been awarded. Basically sets the contractual framework and definitizes the value for the next 10 years of F-16 production for FMS customers.

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Re: MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

Postby Aditya_V » 25 Aug 2020 07:54

This is one of the reasons why the US even though it knows will not state Paki Amraams missed and a F16 was taken down . The truth will cost a lot of money and given our position better for us keep the proof under wraps till these sales get complete. Former Eastern block are replacing Mig 21s with F16 at USD 100 million a pop. Politics is such that the opposition parties in these countries will not understand the difference between Bison various Mig 21 and F16 variants leading to some F16 deal cancellations.


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