Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby kit » 02 Mar 2018 22:37

they have to i guess .. its shooting in the foot if they dont ( No money for the fancy stuff )

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby ramana » 02 Mar 2018 22:40

SaiK wrote:Actually, 324 is a good number. :-)

Any numerology?



18 squadrons with 18 planes each.

So replaces all the Mig lineage.
That's what is good with that number.

There is discussion about 18 or 20 planes per squadron for Tejas. Understood.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Singha » 02 Mar 2018 22:42

> 20 Tejas aircraft to be delivered between April 2009 and December 2010.

in which planet can that happen? even with skd kits, HAL would struggle to deliver 20 in 18 months

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby deejay » 02 Mar 2018 22:48

That was the contract HAL signed.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Vivek K » 02 Mar 2018 22:51

srai wrote:^^^
There is a difference. The supportive process of orders needs to follow the timelines of the R&D. Back in 2010, IOC-1 (Jan-2011) was getting ready, but the IAF didn't accept that and instead waited for IOC-2 (Dec-2013) before serial production of the first 20 could begin. Add 36 months standard lead-time for deliveries to begin, that puts the first lot deliveries of IOC-2 at Dec-2016. IOC-2 is a very capable configuration (multi-role) and could continued to be procured even if there were delays with the FOC. Later these can be upgraded to FOC. Talking about FOC, the requirements are quite strigent with the addition of new radome, AAR, etc. That is almost ready. But the order book is staying at 20 FOC. The IAF wants the next lot of 83 be Mk.1A with AESA radar and integrated jammer among other maintenance changes. Doesn't help anything by insisting they ordered 20 + 20 planes in 2010. Situation has changed and they need to have the flexibility to make adjustments. Tejas Mk.1 is far superior to the MiG-21/27 that are retiring and with squadron shortages more quantities of Mk.1 being procured in 2018 would go a long way.

Rai sahab, you are 100% right. But If the 324 number is true then I am on the Chief's side. HAL needs to work towards faste deliveries (we know they are). Deliveries should be AHEAD of schedule in the future once production is stabilized and SP-5 type issues do not recur. If LCA will be the mainstay of the IAF like the MKI, then it needs to be available to the IAF on time.

This number is acknowledgement of the fact that local production best serves national (defence and economic) interests.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby kit » 02 Mar 2018 22:59

HAL can deliver if there are enough suppliers and *they* stick to the time lines as well ., the US can build at a prodigious rate since they have a well established industrial base manufacturing almost every aerospace component.

They ( HAL ) did somewhat stick to the schedule of building all those MKI s .

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby PratikDas » 02 Mar 2018 23:14

I plead with members on this thread to resist the urge to point fingers at IAF, ADA, HAL, their suppliers, at least till the next big piece of news comes out. Can we take a break from the usual?

IF we get 18 squadrons of Tejas, where would we want them to be?

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Rakesh » 02 Mar 2018 23:21

Pratik Saar, they will be deployed everywhere the F-16 and F-18 were supposed to be :mrgreen:

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby SaiK » 02 Mar 2018 23:33

Multiple theaters... let's focus on functional deployments.

1. We have refueling probes (good to have retractable)
2. Brahmos advanced lite version
--- deep strike /sead
3. Astra ready to strike aerial blips
---air superiority
4. Uttam or 2052s integrate well for cuing from MKIs
---net-centric
5. LPI/low RCS signature - Comparable with Rafale or even JSF.
--- BVR

EW suite, passive sensors like in raptors , IRST like in OLS 50, hopefully retractable-towed decoys/jammers like in EF2K, ... even it spells nightmare to Rafale, JSF and PAKFA.

We got work! 8)

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby saumitra_j » 02 Mar 2018 23:39

srai wrote:^^^
There is a difference. The supportive process of orders needs to follow the timelines of the R&D. Back in 2010, IOC-1 (Jan-2011) was getting ready, but the IAF didn't accept that and instead waited for IOC-2 (Dec-2013) before serial production of the first 20 could begin. Add 36 months standard lead-time for deliveries to begin, that puts the first lot deliveries of IOC-2 at Dec-2016. IOC-2 is a very capable configuration (multi-role) and could continued to be procured even if there were delays with the FOC. Later these can be upgraded to FOC. Talking about FOC, the requirements are quite strigent with the addition of new radome, AAR, etc. That is almost ready. But the order book is staying at 20 FOC. The IAF wants the next lot of 83 be Mk.1A with AESA radar and integrated jammer among other maintenance changes. Doesn't help anything by insisting they ordered 20 + 20 planes in 2010. Situation has changed and they need to have the flexibility to make adjustments. Tejas Mk.1 is far superior to the MiG-21/27 that are retiring and with squadron shortages more quantities of Mk.1 being procured in 2018 would go a long way.

Sirji, I agree with you that the R&D time has to be baked in but the contracts were agreed to and signed by all! Also, contractual delays are not just in Tejas, but even for Su30 we had delays despite doing so called "Screwdrivergiri" - leading to completely messing IAF's operational plans.
Anyway, with all the good news about Tejas Mk 2, if timelines are met, we can finally see a road map to stop importing big ticket items (i.e. Fighters) in the next two decades. Without the Tejas program, all of that would be just a pipe dream! Also, I strongly believe that FGFA or AMCA without Tejas Mk2 would be very difficult to achieve - we need to go through these steps in the technology ladder before we dream of becoming state of the art!

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby SaiK » 03 Mar 2018 01:58

Kartik wrote:* The AMCA effort is relocating to Coimbatore, Tamil Nadu (that per the EOI). The destination for delivery of parts, for the AMCA, is Coimbatore. And, looks like the AMCA team is standing up testing, etc facilities/efforts in Coimbatore
* While the MK2 effort is yet to start in earnest, the AMCA (based on the EOI) is a lot more mature. The AMCA team is actually ready to push out a variety of drawings, etc to have them build. I would not be surprised if the two (MK2 and the AMCA) pretty much arrive at the same time.[/uote]
.. But for the AMCA, it is a whole new effort and will be much larger in scale.

I was reading it as HAL + few private to fund assembly lines in CBE .. with strict process engineering to churn rate achieve by 4 years from start of contract. So most likely it is an assembly and not R&D for AMCA at CBE.

ADA and HAL still be doing r&d and integrations at both places and private taking over for AMCA in a joint biz model.

Essentially the common components between Mk2 and AMCA will be still in Bangalore. /JMR

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby srai » 03 Mar 2018 03:26

saumitra_j wrote:
srai wrote:^^^
There is a difference. The supportive process of orders needs to follow the timelines of the R&D. Back in 2010, IOC-1 (Jan-2011) was getting ready, but the IAF didn't accept that and instead waited for IOC-2 (Dec-2013) before serial production of the first 20 could begin. Add 36 months standard lead-time for deliveries to begin, that puts the first lot deliveries of IOC-2 at Dec-2016. IOC-2 is a very capable configuration (multi-role) and could continued to be procured even if there were delays with the FOC. Later these can be upgraded to FOC. Talking about FOC, the requirements are quite strigent with the addition of new radome, AAR, etc. That is almost ready. But the order book is staying at 20 FOC. The IAF wants the next lot of 83 be Mk.1A with AESA radar and integrated jammer among other maintenance changes. Doesn't help anything by insisting they ordered 20 + 20 planes in 2010. Situation has changed and they need to have the flexibility to make adjustments. Tejas Mk.1 is far superior to the MiG-21/27 that are retiring and with squadron shortages more quantities of Mk.1 being procured in 2018 would go a long way.

Sirji, I agree with you that the R&D time has to be baked in but the contracts were agreed to and signed by all! Also, contractual delays are not just in Tejas, but even for Su30 we had delays despite doing so called "Screwdrivergiri" - leading to completely messing IAF's operational plans.
Anyway, with all the good news about Tejas Mk 2, if timelines are met, we can finally see a road map to stop importing big ticket items (i.e. Fighters) in the next two decades. Without the Tejas program, all of that would be just a pipe dream! Also, I strongly believe that FGFA or AMCA without Tejas Mk2 would be very difficult to achieve - we need to go through these steps in the technology ladder before we dream of becoming state of the art!

Yes, contracts need to be adhered to but how are all parties signing unrealistic contracts for the LCA? My guess would be India didn’t have experience with R&D and production of its own indigenous fighter. There is also the case that if ADA/HAL didn’t agree to those terms LCA would have been dead. Too used to acquiring ready made foreign fighter, even which take 36 months to start first lot deliveries.

Anyways, above is bridge underwater so to speak. Agree on the good news on 201 Mk.2 intent. Times are changing. Hope the mistakes of the past are not repeated.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Rakesh » 03 Mar 2018 03:40

ACM Dhanoa said in Nov 2017, that the IAF will start inducting Mk2 by 2027. Timelines will change, but underscores what Dr Christopher said. Link below.

No overpricing in Rafale deal: IAF Chief Marshal BS Dhanoa
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 677068.cms

He said the IAF would induct Mark 2 fighters with higher thrust engines and new weapons by 2027. Shortcomings in LCA Mark 1 will be removed in the LCA Mark 1A aircraft and then Mark 2 will be manufactured, he said.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Cain Marko » 03 Mar 2018 03:50

saumitra_j wrote:[Also, I strongly believe that FGFA or AMCA without Tejas Mk2 would be very difficult to achieve - we need to go through these steps in the technology ladder before we dream of becoming state of the art!


Now this I don't believe or agree with despite it being a vague tbought on the forum. The mk1 and mk1a will be considered 4.5 gen. No need to make 4.7 gen as a stepping stone for it to 5 gen. Hardly adds much to the picture in this context.

Neither russia nor cheen not Japan nor Korea are doing this
Secondly, I've never heard of any such suggestions coming from ADA themselves
Thirdly, the mk2 is hardly envisioned as anything like to gen5. No Supercruise, no shaping, no internal carriage of weapons and definitely no stealth (skins, s shaped ducts, ir suppression etc.)

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby srai » 03 Mar 2018 04:06

^^^
There is at least a 10-year gap between Mk1A end-of-production and AMCA start-of-production. That is where Mk2 fits in in the lower medium category i.e. Mirage-2000 class. The IAF has a requirement for some 6-9 squadrons in that category, which is what the MMRCA/SEF/TEF/MMRCA-2 are trying to acquire.
Last edited by srai on 03 Mar 2018 04:08, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby kit » 03 Mar 2018 04:08

Cain Marko wrote:
saumitra_j wrote:[Also, I strongly believe that FGFA or AMCA without Tejas Mk2 would be very difficult to achieve - we need to go through these steps in the technology ladder before we dream of becoming state of the art!


Now this I don't believe or agree with despite it being a vague tbought on the forum. The mk1 and mk1a will be considered 4.5 gen. No need to make 4.7 gen as a stepping stone for it to 5 gen. Hardly adds much to the picture in this context.

Neither russia nor cheen not Japan nor Korea are doing this
Secondly, I've never heard of any such suggestions coming from ADA themselves
Thirdly, the mk2 is hardly envisioned as anything like to gen5. No Supercruise, no shaping, no internal carriage of weapons and definitely no stealth (skins, s shaped ducts, ir suppression etc.)


two things .. time money ..you give the latter to buy the former . LCA mark 2 would be Indian gen 4.5 .. we need not be american Gen 5. The MCA would be Indian gen 5.Or would you rather buy American Gen 5 straight away instead of going through all that pain ? .. and sign away your capability and independence ? .The Tejas mark 1 , 1 a , 2 is the way for the Indian industry and AF. Forget about other countries, they had worked long before they got there.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Cain Marko » 03 Mar 2018 04:16

kit wrote:
Cain Marko wrote:
Now this I don't believe or agree with despite it being a vague tbought on the forum. The mk1 and mk1a will be considered 4.5 gen. No need to make 4.7 gen as a stepping stone for it to 5 gen. Hardly adds much to the picture in this context.

Neither russia nor cheen not Japan nor Korea are doing this
Secondly, I've never heard of any such suggestions coming from ADA themselves
Thirdly, the mk2 is hardly envisioned as anything like to gen5. No Supercruise, no shaping, no internal carriage of weapons and definitely no stealth (skins, s shaped ducts, ir suppression etc.)


two things .. time money ..you give the latter to buy the former . LCA mark 2 would be Indian gen 4.5 .. we need not be american Gen 5. The MCA would be Indian gen 5.Or would you rather buy American Gen 5 straight away instead of going through all that pain ? .. and sign away your capability and independence ? .The Tejas mark 1 , 1 a , 2 is the way for the Indian industry and AF. Forget about other countries, they had worked long before they got there.


Where did I say buy phoren? I'm arguing that you don't need the mk2 as some sort of stopping stone, whatever that's supposed to be, to create an AMCA. I'm saying that the mk1a and even the mk1 foc standard are as 4.5 gen as can be, buy more of them.

And if mk2 is developed, then it stands on its own merit as an advanced iteration to meet the IAFs need for large numbers of single engined fighters in the future. No need to use a contrived reason such as stepping stone and what not, to justify it.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Cain Marko » 03 Mar 2018 04:19

srai wrote:^^^
There is at least a 10-year gap between Mk1A end-of-production and AMCA start-of-production. That is where Mk2 fits in in the lower medium category i.e. Mirage-2000 class. The IAF has a requirement for some 6-9 squadrons in that category, which is what the MMRCA/SEF/TEF/MMRCA-2 are trying to acquire.

Possibly. And that would be a good reason for the mk2 although they can work on both programs concurrently.

In either case, this doesn't make mk2 a stepping stone to 5gen tech.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby srai » 03 Mar 2018 04:21

^^^
India needs continuity. Big gaps need to be avoided.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby kit » 03 Mar 2018 05:12

India is learning that there is no short cuts to building and operating a 5th gen fighter ., even Russias 5th gen is not a true american style 5th gen fighter so why be coy about it ?

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby nrshah » 03 Mar 2018 12:09

kit wrote:India is learning that there is no short cuts to building and operating a 5th gen fighter ., even Russias 5th gen is not a true american style 5th gen fighter so why be coy about it ?


Why should Russian 5 Gen aircraft be equivalent to American 5 gen Aircraft?? Both have different philosophy of fighting war and their mic is based.to cater their own philosophy...

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby kit » 03 Mar 2018 16:08

nrshah wrote:
kit wrote:India is learning that there is no short cuts to building and operating a 5th gen fighter ., even Russias 5th gen is not a true american style 5th gen fighter so why be coy about it ?


Why should Russian 5 Gen aircraft be equivalent to American 5 gen Aircraft?? Both have different philosophy of fighting war and their mic is based.to cater their own philosophy...


Good point . And the IAF has it's own .. we need to see if the LCA Mark 2 has a role in it's doctrine .if the chief said yes then there we are. It's not controversial.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby SaiK » 03 Mar 2018 17:55

LCA Tejas Fighter Gets Big Push From Modi Govt, All Eyes On Action

https://www.livefistdefence.com/2018/03 ... ction.html

NLCA must be heard again. Whatever happened to IN.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Rakesh » 03 Mar 2018 18:03

^^^ Another fantastic find by SaiK! SECOND confirmation now received and this is as official as it can get. First from Dr Christopher and now from Minister Sitharaman. From the above article....

What was that nonsense - in the MRCA thread - about the IAF not ordering any more Tejas aircraft? :lol: I want to go visit some Sadhu up in the Himalayas and learn how to read tea leaves. Then come back to BRF and make moronic predictions like F-18 is the best choice, 200 F-16s are definitely coming and so are 100 F-18s. They are so intelligent after all, their predictions are never wrong. What's next guys - Sixth Generation Aircraft from Amreeka with full ToT? :lol:

Desperation to cozy up to Amreeka is really *HIGH* with some on this forum. This is not American Rakshak Forum, but Bharat Rakshak Forum :)

Defence Minister Nirmala Sitharaman today said, “We are looking forward to the LCA Mk.2 coming at the earliest. We have made provisions for the program.”


“For instance, if the production rate is six per year, we cant wait six years for 36 aircraft,” she said, adding, “We are putting our full energies into the Tejas program.”


And some more gems from Dr Christopher....

“I am absolutely confident that the LCA Tejas Mk.2 will meet all requirements in a timely manner. I am also 100 per cent sure of further orders of not just the LCA Mk.1A but at least 200 of the Mk.2. Both of these aircraft will have tremendous export potential,” Christopher said.


“The aircraft has matured wonderfully, to the full credit of our teams of engineers and scientists,” Christopher said. “It is a moment of great pride for us, but also a priority to see that the rest of the Tejas journey is very smooth.”

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Gagan » 03 Mar 2018 19:40

Boss log
The ONLY way that 324 number will get built in a reasonable timeframe - our lifetimes, is if Private Industry picks up a major bulk of the production AND integration

Tata / Mota Bhai / L&T types will have to be brought in if the plane has to be exported and to maintain quality and volume

We have the example of L&T delivering some 30-40 odd vessels for the coast guard well ahead of set schedule, how Reliance seems to have turned around Pipavav shipyard (Alcock Ashdown should be done next).

The inefficiencies of a part or fully Government Owned builder are immense! The Jugaad and Chalta hai is damaging and unbearable

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Singha » 03 Mar 2018 20:02

HAL nasik & koraput will be kind of jobless after the su30 line is done, barring MLU. perhaps they can also start a final assembly and QC line while hiving off structural parts like MLG, wings, tails, ribs to pvt sector kind of like airbus toulouse is final assembly but big things like wings get made elsewhere and wheeled in. avionics anyway come from a variety of suppliers.

we should get pvt sector into fields like small arms, shells, missiles and bombs for sure too.



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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Singha » 03 Mar 2018 20:05

cash rich deep state players like mota bhai should actually be encouraged to buy up or buy into small aerospace parts makers all over the world and open their indian ops too for tejas type projects to absorb technology and build scale. it gives euro govts too some skin in the success of our game.
Embraer sources things from all over...

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby nvishal » 03 Mar 2018 20:10

Gagan wrote:The ONLY way that 324 number will get built in a reasonable timeframe - our lifetimes, is if Private Industry picks up a major bulk of the production AND integration

I figured out this problem long time ago but always held myself from mentioning it.

Apparently, the indian govt does not understand the difference between a prototype industry and a generic assembly line.

IMO, both HAL and ADA are prototype industries and should not attempt to run mass assembly line. That is a job for fit for private players. But I also sense that govt does not want private companies involved in assembly.

why?

Are there any secret components in the Tejas we don't know about?

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Singha » 03 Mar 2018 20:14

HAL seems to have a lot of clout in delhi. perhaps its lakhs of jobs and resources for netas to use gives it that kind of power. coal india is another one with a lot of clout.

Government Commits To New Variant Of Tejas Fighter, Future For Gripen And F-16 Unclear
https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/governm ... ar-1819238

NEW DELHI: In a clear sign that it may not be interested in acquiring either the Swedish made Gripen E/F fighter or the American made F-16 Block 70IN, both of which were on offer to the Indian Air Force, Defence Minister Nirmala Sitharaman today said her government has decided to back a heavily upgraded and revised variant of the home-built Tejas Light Combat Aircraft. According to Ms Sitharaman, monetary "provisions for Tejas Mk-2 are being made," making it absolutely clear that "we are not ditching" the Tejas. Significantly, when asked whether the government now believed the next-generation variant of the Tejas would be as capable as the Gripen and F-16, Ms Sitharaman responded positively stating that this would be a reality once a series of modifications were carried out.

Two years ago, the government had announced that it was looking to acquire a single-engine jet fighter to supplement the Tejas jet. This fighter would be somewhat less capable than the Air Force's Sukhoi-30s and Rafales (36 of which have been ordered from Dassault of France) but would be larger and more capable than the Tejas Mk-1 jet being manufactured in Bangalore presently. The two front-runner to this single-engine deal were seen to be Sweden's SAAB with its Gripen E/F fighter and the US aerospace major Lockheed Martin with its F-16 Block 70IN jet.

The government has already announced that it is going ahead with the purchase of 83 Tejas jets in a contract worth more than Rs. 33,000 crore. These include the Tejas Mk-1, the initial variant of the jet, a handful of which have entered squadron service with the Indian Air Force and the more capable Tejas Mk-1A which is in the process of being developed. Significantly, the Defence Minister has now made it clear that the government is working to ensure that the "per year manufacturing capability of Tejas must increase." According to Ms Sitharaman, "We want them to produce much more", a reflection of the present manufacturing facilities of the jet where only approximately six can be built per year by Hindustan Aeronautics. Hindustan Aeronautics, which manufacturers the Tejas is looking to utilise a second Tejas production line while outsourcing components of the fighter to private manufacturers to reduce the time taken to build each fighter.

The Tejas, Ms Sitharaman indicated, will continue to be developed for the Indian Navy. Earlier, the Indian Navy Chief Admiral Sunil Lanba had indicated that the jet, in its present state, was not capable of embarking operations onboard India's aircraft carriers, the INS Vikramaditya or the INS Vikrant which is yet to be commissioned. Indicating that the Tejas fighter had serious export potential, Ms Sitharaman said "countries are talking about Tejas, not just Indian markets." Recently, the Air Force Chiefs of France and the United States both flew rear-seat on trainer variant of the Tejas fighters. In February, sources within the Defence Ministry had indicated that India was no longer interested in a class of single-engine fighter other than the Tejas and had asked the Indian Air Force to revise its requirements to also include multi-engine fighters. There is, presently, no clarity on the shape of this acquisition and whether a deal for another multi-role fighter jet will at all progress.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Gagan » 03 Mar 2018 20:42

*deleted*
Last edited by JayS on 04 Mar 2018 23:17, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: moved to whining thread

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Vivek K » 03 Mar 2018 20:46

BRADMINS please add Lungi dance emoticon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby nrshah » 03 Mar 2018 20:58

kit wrote:
nrshah wrote:
Why should Russian 5 Gen aircraft be equivalent to American 5 gen Aircraft?? Both have different philosophy of fighting war and their mic is based.to cater their own philosophy...


Good point . And the IAF has it's own .. we need to see if the LCA Mark 2 has a role in it's doctrine .if the chief said yes then there we are. It's not controversial.


Which is fine and I am not asking to go for Russian standards. We have our own needs and since Su30mki, we are asking for what we need... mki, Rafale India specific additions and 43 changes suggested in Pakfa as well...I am sure every plane we made has a role in orbat and should be accepted. We used mig 21s for many roles and still using it. Tejas whatever tranche is many multitude addition in capabilities than over it....

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Rakesh » 03 Mar 2018 21:09

Yet another fantastic news piece. Thank you Singha Saar! :)

Import lobby go peddle F-Solah and Rakhi Sawant elsewhere now :lol: May I humbly suggest producing F-Solah, Block 70 in the Terrorist State of Pakistan - a fitting tribute to that nation's contribution on the War on Terror 8)

This is lungi dance time indeed. Beautiful. A great day for the country. A great day for the services. A great day for the government. Kudos to all! Jai Hind! Vande Mataram! Mera Bharat Mahan!

At this time, I would also like to thank former Prime Minister Vajpayee-ji who chose the name Tejas for the LCA. Tejas means Radiance and let her radiance shine forth throughout all of India and beyond. Tejas Tejasvi Namaham - Touch The Sky With Glory!

To all the scientists at DRDO and ADA who developed this plane...Kudos to you guys! You guys truly rock and are HEROES. Jai Vigyan! A big thank to you the Indian Air Force as well for signing a letter of intent for 201 Tejas Mk2 aircraft. She will not let you down.

To my fellow BRF Jingos ---> Celebrate this occassion with your family and loved ones. This is a Day to Remember.

Some parts that I want to highlight....a few points from the article below that can now be inferenced;

1) Ramping up Tejas production is now definitely happening.
2) Tejas Mk2 for the Air Force and even the Navy is on the cards.
3) Naval fighter contest - if progresses to contract signing stage - will be the Rafale.
4) MRCA Contest - Episode 3 will likely never take off. It is done, just like SEF went no where.
5) Not from the article below - but ties in to point 3 - but I strongly believe that Tejas Mk2 and AMCA will feature engines from Safran.

Singha wrote:Government Commits To New Variant Of Tejas Fighter, Future For Gripen And F-16 Unclear
https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/governm ... ar-1819238

According to Ms Sitharaman, monetary "provisions for Tejas Mk-2 are being made," making it absolutely clear that "we are not ditching" the Tejas. Significantly, when asked whether the government now believed the next-generation variant of the Tejas would be as capable as the Gripen and F-16, Ms Sitharaman responded positively stating that this would be a reality once a series of modifications were carried out.

Significantly, the Defence Minister has now made it clear that the government is working to ensure that the "per year manufacturing capability of Tejas must increase." According to Ms Sitharaman, "We want them to produce much more", a reflection of the present manufacturing facilities of the jet where only approximately six can be built per year by Hindustan Aeronautics. Hindustan Aeronautics, which manufacturers the Tejas is looking to utilise a second Tejas production line while outsourcing components of the fighter to private manufacturers to reduce the time taken to build each fighter.

The Tejas, Ms Sitharaman indicated, will continue to be developed for the Indian Navy. In February, sources within the Defence Ministry had indicated that India was no longer interested in a class of single-engine fighter other than the Tejas and had asked the Indian Air Force to revise its requirements to also include multi-engine fighters. There is, presently, no clarity on the shape of this acquisition and whether a deal for another multi-role fighter jet will at all progress.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Singha » 03 Mar 2018 21:15

with both a proven GE414 and future M88mki/Kaveri-mki possible we can hedge our bets on the AMCA a bit. in any case, the m88/kaveri-mki use cases go way beyond AMCA into future desi pakda, large global hawk sized drones, ucavs.......
AMCA engine is derisked and not a problem anymore in terms of thrust from day1.

all these noises indicate we are finally starting to take cheen seriously and plan to compete and confront not just lament.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Haridas » 03 Mar 2018 21:52

Wonderful auspucious happenings in Holi parva. Very happy. :lol: :D :rotfl:
Rakesh ji is excited as kid in candy store. So am I.
I really hope M88-Kaveri is chosen. Let GE make final enhancement to 414 on their own penny, India can consider it later. With phoren agents strung up the pole, Indian defense market will be buyers market instead of sellers, presstitute pontifications like "India has been offered /allowed to buy xyz" never to resurface.

Be happy today, tomorrow have to go to work, to ship a squadron an year of the apsara named Tejas.
Last edited by Haridas on 04 Mar 2018 11:48, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Cain Marko » 03 Mar 2018 22:09

I'm just wondering....

Is this a result of the kaveri snecma coming through?
Will macaroni come with champagne?

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Rakesh » 03 Mar 2018 22:21

Cain Marko wrote:I'm just wondering....

Is this a result of the kaveri snecma coming through?
Will macaroni come with champagne?

Mithai and Champagne deliveries have already begun from my side...

Bees saal der ho chukee hai, lekin aapako mil gaya...ab shikaayat mat karo!!! 8)

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Indranil » 03 Mar 2018 22:43

Great day!

Vivek K wrote:BRADMINS please add Lungi dance emoticon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can feel your happiness. You have fought tirelessly and have many scars and lash marks to show for it. Yes, we need a lungi icon!

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Bharadwaj » 03 Mar 2018 22:48

This development has been in the works for a while now... Ever since we heard of Doval's involvement. Kudos to both him and the RM for seeing through the smoke and mirrors.

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Re: Tejas Mk.2 News & Discussions: 25 February 2018

Postby Rakesh » 03 Mar 2018 23:09

Indranil wrote:Great day!

There can be no Tejas thread on BRF without your inputs and inputs from your chaiwallahs. You and your chaiwallahs gave all of us hope, when SEF was going strong. So thank you IR.


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