Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Rakesh » 22 Nov 2020 01:51

Below tweet is from Commodore Siddharth Mishra (Retd) CMD-BDL....

https://twitter.com/CMDBDL/status/13301 ... 79777?s=20 ---> BDL crosses another milestone. The first Varunastra, manufactured by BDL for the Indian Navy, was flagged off today by Dr G Satheesh Reddy, Sec Dept of Def R&D at BDL, Vizag Unit in the august presence of Vice Admiral K Srinivas, Dr Samir V Kamat, DG (NS&M) and Dr OR Nandagopan, Director NSTL.

https://twitter.com/ThingNavy/status/13 ... 26850?s=20 ---> BDL has signed a contract worth Rs. 1,187.82 crore for supply of heavy weight torpedoes to the Indian Navy in June 2019.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Rakesh » 22 Nov 2020 02:15

https://twitter.com/ThingNavy/status/13 ... 18977?s=20 ---> BDL on Saturday delivered the first Varunastra, a heavy weight torpedo, to the Indian Navy. Varunastra is a ship launched, heavy weight, electrically-propelled, anti-submarine torpedo capable of targeting quiet submarines, in an intense countermeasures environment.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Rakesh » 22 Nov 2020 04:37

Good data point...

https://twitter.com/TheWolfpackIN/statu ... 94080?s=20 ---> First Varunastra heavyweight torpedo with a strike range of 40+ km handed over to Indian Navy.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Rakesh » 22 Nov 2020 04:37

https://twitter.com/ThingNavy/status/13 ... 03552?s=20 ---> INS Karanj S23 during construction.

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Not sure if this is the Karanj, but that is the French Ambassador to India (Emmanuel Lenain) at left, on a Kalvari Class boat....

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Rakesh » 22 Nov 2020 05:13

Moving in elite company in Exercise Malabar, Indian Navy warships are hamstrung by dire shortfalls
https://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2020/11 ... rcise.html
21 Nov 2020

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Philip » 22 Nov 2020 11:08

Reading the above piece by AS,it's simply unacceptable forthe entire establishment,esp. babudom and the political masters to have been so negligent.We've been saying this from the days of the SR tragedy and multiple accidents aboard IN warships and subs that saw the resignation of Adm.Joshi in protest of IN neglect. If we can take urgent acquisition decisions in the wake of Ladakh, why not with the torpedoes ,sonars and helos too?
The French F-21 has a v.long range and endurance,makes repeated attacks until the target is destroyed,only a hard-kill anti- T system like Paket can destroy it. No idea if the German rival has the same capability. Indian littoral water capability a major factor. Given the huge challenge from the PRC and our trump card,our current superiority in the IOR,the IN must on a war-footing basis be provided with its critical needs. Nothing less is acceptable.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby jamwal » 22 Nov 2020 13:47

Any idea what is the optimal firing range of Varunastra?
Surely it cant be expected to hit anything if fired from 35-40 km range.

Additionally which platforms will it arm?

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Vips » 22 Nov 2020 20:59

India to launch deep sea mission in 3-4 months: Ministry of Earth Sciences.

India will soon launch an ambitious ‘Deep Ocean Mission’ that envisages exploration of minerals, energy and marine diversity of the underwater world, a vast part of which still remains unexplored, a top official of the Ministry of Earth Sciences said.

The ministry’s secretary, M Rajeevan, said required approvals are being obtained for the “futuristic and game-changing” mission, and it is likely to be launched in the next 3-4 months.

The mission, which is expected to cost over Rs 4,000 crore, will give a boost to efforts to explore India’s vast Exclusive Economic Zone and Continental Shelf, another senior official of the MoES said.

Rajeevan said the mission will also involve developing technologies for different deep ocean initiatives.

The multi-disciplinary work will be piloted by the MoES and other government departments like the Defence Research and Development Organisation, Department of Biotechnology, Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO), Council for Scientific and Industrial Research (CSIR) will be stakeholders in this mission, Rajeevan added.

Some of the technologies involved will be developed by organisations such as the ISRO and DRDO.

“One of the main aspects of the mission will be design, development and demonstration of human submersibles,” the MoES official said. Another aspect is exploring the possibility of deep-sea mining and developing necessary technologies, the official added.

The official said the move strategically significant as it will enhance India’s presence in the Indian Ocean where other players like China, Korea and Germany are active.

Last week, China live-streamed footage of its new manned submersible parked at the bottom of the Mariana Trench. This was part of its mission into the deepest underwater valley on the planet.

India has been ear-marked nearly 1.5 lakh square kilometres of area in the central Indian Ocean for exploration.

In September 2016, India signed a 15-year contract with the International Seabed Authority (ISA) for exploration of Poly-Metallic Sulphides (PMS) in the Indian Ocean. The ISA is an institution set up under the Convention on Law of the Sea to which India is a Party. The 15-year contract formalised India’s exclusive rights for exploration of PMS in the allotted area in the Indian Ocean.

The ISA earlier approved 10,000 sq. km for India with a 15-year PMS exploration plan along the Central Indian Ridge (CIR) and Southwest Indian Ridge (SWIR) region of the Indian Ocean.

Poly-Metallic Sulphides (PMS), which contain iron, copper, zinc, silver, gold, platinum in variable constitutions, are precipitates of hot fluids from upwelling hot magma from the deep interior of the oceanic crust, discharged through mineralized chimneys.

PMS in the Ocean Ridges have attracted worldwide attention for their long term commercial as well as strategic values. “The aim is to be prepared when rules are formalised in this area. The deep oceans frontier is yet to be explored. We have been working on it on a piecemeal basis but the thrust is to carry out work on mission mode,” the official added.

The mission will also involve the procurement of more advanced deep-sea vessels for explorations. The existing vessel Sagar Kanya is nearly three-and-half decades old.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Aditya_V » 23 Nov 2020 12:47

Another Interesting tidbit, we have gone for Electrical propusion for Torpedos for Varunastra and also twin screw propellors to propel it, can experts tell us the pros and cons Vs Thermal ( Internal Combustion population) or Chemical where sea water activates a Chemical reaction to power these Torpedoes?

http://webserver.dmt.upm.es/~isidoro/bk3/c17/Marine%20propulsion.pdf

Before WWII, torpedo propulsion was mainly by a pneumatic motors driven by compressed air (up to 20 MPa), with air bubbles being released. The first torpedo, the Whitehead of 1866, had a 2.6 MPa compressed-air tank, that fed a piston-engine driving a single screw-propeller at about 100 rpm, able to reach 180 m at 3 m/s; large adiabatic air expansions yielded icing problems, which were first avoided byheating the expanded air with sea water, and later by burning some fuel with the air or better with pureoxygen; most torpedoes used in World War I and World War II were of this type.

After WWII, powerful electrical batteries and an electrical motor were used (the best being silver oxide Ag2O primary batteries,which need no maintenance). However, long range torpedos need a conventional heat engines (usually a Marine propulsion 15rocket / gas-turbine combination with special fuels). Underwater combustion is a complicated process, with interest not only in propulsion but in welding and cutting metals underwater, lighting, etc.Sizeable vanes are required to compensate the torque of single screw propellers, and two contra-rotatingscrews are common. Mark-50 torpedos (USA, since 1991) use a small tank of sulfur hexafluoride gas which is sprayed over a block of solid lithium, SF6(g)+6Li(s)=S(s)+6LiF(s), an exothermic reaction with volume shrinking (no need of exhaust pipe), used to generate steam in a closed Rankine cycle supplying
power to a pump-jet.

Modern submarines use either swim-out systems or a water-ram push to discharge the torpedo from the tube, both of which have the advantage of being significantly quieter than previous systems based on a pulse of compressed air or a hydraulic ram, what helps avoid detection of the firing from passive sonar.
The torpedo tube in a submarine operates on the principle of an airlock.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby JTull » 23 Nov 2020 20:30

Rakesh wrote:Killers Version 2.0: Carrying Forward The Illustrious Legacy
https://thedailyguardian.com/killers-ve ... us-legacy/
15 May 2020

By Commodore Srikant B Kesnur


Thumbs up!

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Rakesh » 23 Nov 2020 23:13

https://twitter.com/airnewsalerts/statu ... 51266?s=20 ---> Indian Navy's survey vessel INS Sarvekshak goes green by installing a solar power system on board.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Rakesh » 23 Nov 2020 23:16

https://twitter.com/strategic_front/sta ... 85286?s=20 ---> HSL is making two 118m long Diver Support Vessels (DSV) weighing ~7,650 tons. The vessels will based at Vizag & Mumbai respectively. The design is from Vik-Sandvik. The ships will have 12 man saturation diving capability, two AK-630s, towed sonars & the DSRV.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Cyrano » 23 Nov 2020 23:29

Great news, the importance of DSV can't be stressed enough given India's growing sub fleet.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Lisa » 24 Nov 2020 00:33

Rakesh wrote:https://twitter.com/strategic_front/status/1330443450613985286?s=20 ---> HSL is making two 118m long Diver Support Vessels (DSV) weighing ~7,650 tons. The vessels will based at Vizag & Mumbai respectively. The design is from Vik-Sandvik. The ships will have 12 man saturation diving capability, two AK-630s, towed sonars & the DSRV.


Is it me or are those 2 gatling mounts near the helicopter?

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Rakesh » 24 Nov 2020 00:38

Tweet says it will be a pair of AK-630 CIWS, however someone replied to that above tweet with this...

IMhttps://twitter.com/saptarshichand8/s ... 72512?s=20 ---> IMO, those are CRN 91 not AK-630 given the lack of FCR.

CRN 91 Naval Gun ---> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CRN_91_Naval_Gun

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby John » 24 Nov 2020 01:11

Yes it is CRN-91, technically Ak-630 has variant that can be guided via EO but we don’t utilize it.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby nam » 24 Nov 2020 02:11

Japanese new frigate, order signed in 2018, launched today, to be delivered in 2021!

3 years from contract to delivery. So painful to watch.. :((

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Vips » 24 Nov 2020 03:52

Sirji, Please consider in India:
-Shipyards have Unionized labour force and one of the labour union is CITU which is communist and openly owes allegiance to China
- Yearly press conference and photo- op of the Shipyard moron chairman handing over a check of few crores in dividend to the jackass Union Minister (whoever he may be)

In this age and time having PSU's (with its inherent lack of accountability) manufacturing/assembling defense and strategic hardware is mind boggling.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby chetak » 24 Nov 2020 04:32

jamwal wrote:Any idea what is the optimal firing range of Varunastra?
Surely it cant be expected to hit anything if fired from 35-40 km range.

Additionally which platforms will it arm?


it will be updated with the targeting information on the quarry.

It will only go into active search if it cannot pick up the target passively.

at the speeds that these things travel, 35-40 km is quite doable.
with fuel enough for search and attack

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby John » 24 Nov 2020 06:04

nam wrote:Japanese new frigate, order signed in 2018, launched today, to be delivered in 2021!

3 years from contract to delivery. So painful to watch.. :((

You talking about Kumano it is supposed to be commissioned on 2022. Nilgiri is about 4-5 years if things work out.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Prithwiraj » 25 Nov 2020 07:27

USN Video on Malabar 2020 part 2


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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Philip » 25 Nov 2020 07:41

Looking at the DSV design,I feel that the heli- deck in front will pose operarational problems when the vessel is moving forward,if the helo and vessel approach each other from opposite ends. It could've perhaps been situated amidships or the deck cantilevered further forward for safety. In fact 2 heli-decks cantilevered amidships on either beam would've been a better solution. Easier for a helo to approach the landing pad from astern or aside.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby basant » 25 Nov 2020 10:08

Philip wrote:Looking at the DSV design,I feel that the heli- deck in front will pose operarational problems when the vessel is moving forward,if the helo and vessel approach each other from opposite ends.

Why can't the helo simply rotate by 180 before landing thereby moving in same direction?

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby hnair » 25 Nov 2020 10:52

It is the most common helipad design for oceanographic, deep diving platforms and deep sea support type vessels, which need to have the stern freed up for heavy duty winches and flooded ramps for pulling in heavy loads. Such vessels are not going to operate helos at full speeds and need to be mostly static during actual operational times.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Philip » 25 Nov 2020 11:59

That being the case,static condition seems ok,but in bad weather when the ships is moving restricts helo ops.
Basant,if it rotates and is stationary,it might get a burst from the gatlings up its backside! :rotfl:

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Aditya_V » 25 Nov 2020 12:51

Lisa wrote:
Rakesh wrote:https://twitter.com/strategic_front/status/1330443450613985286?s=20 ---> HSL is making two 118m long Diver Support Vessels (DSV) weighing ~7,650 tons. The vessels will based at Vizag & Mumbai respectively. The design is from Vik-Sandvik. The ships will have 12 man saturation diving capability, two AK-630s, towed sonars & the DSRV.


Is it me or are those 2 gatling mounts near the helicopter?


In war time they would need to defend themselves doing a rescue in a hostile environment, ideally something like a Barak-1 can also be added.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby chetak » 25 Nov 2020 16:50

basant wrote:
Philip wrote:Looking at the DSV design,I feel that the heli- deck in front will pose operarational problems when the vessel is moving forward,if the helo and vessel approach each other from opposite ends.

Why can't the helo simply rotate by 180 before landing thereby moving in same direction?


the helo can point in any direction and fly in any other direction so why can't it formate with the ship while flying backwards and then simply slide over the deck to land.

unless the ship is stationary, the helo will not approach it from a direction that is diametrically opposite.

the picture shown is simply representational and as such not deserving of any great discussion. Ultimately, it is only the capt of the helo who has the final say and he alone decides what he will do.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Kakarat » 25 Nov 2020 21:29

Admin Note: Let us keep the drone news in the Drone Thread. Otherwise, multiple discussions will occur - on the same topic - in various threads.
Last edited by Rakesh on 25 Nov 2020 22:55, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Post Deleted

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Aditya G » 26 Nov 2020 03:16

basant wrote:Why can't the helo simply rotate by 180 before landing thereby moving in same direction?


Erm, how will the pilot see where he is landing? :roll:

The helideck is clearly a sub-optimal design, and is probably meant for limited/emergency use only.

Offshore ships normally have the following design (note: SCI Sabarmati is the current mothership of the DSRV):

Image

They must have positioned it lower to allow a free firing arc for the CRN-91 cannons - an avoidable compromise imho.

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Re: Indian Navy News & Discussion - 03 July 2018

Postby Philip » 26 Nov 2020 14:38

A helideck immediately aft of the main superstructure high up the best location. Then guns forward can fire without restrictions.

The lease of 2 Sea Guardians by the IN from Nov. is a v.good idea as we can't afford 30 of them for $3B.$3 B better spent on critically reqd. subs,etc. We could get at least 2 more Akulas for that cost. Similarly,the Phillippines who want BMos,sales sanctioned by both India and Russia, are struggling for the money for thr same. We too could " lease" BMos batteries to several countries and have a clause in it that if we are attacked by any country ( read the PRC) we could operate these leased batteries if on land. Those fitted to warships will have to be bought outright.

Leasing of India milware is a fast- track solution to export of Indian defence weapon systems. If we can lease them from other nations,so too can others lease them from us. I can see a whole range of items from patrol vessels,OPVs,corvettes,etc. to LCAs,BTs, ALHs,LUHs,LCHs, 155mm Dhanush arty,MBTs,AVs,etc.SAM systems like Akash,tactical missiles under 300km range like Prahar,etc. It will also give us a physical footprint on foreign soil if the lease is akin to a " wet lease", where the operators too are Indian tech. " advisers", much like the Sov. advisers to Egypt,etc. in decades past. I can immediately see where one country vital to our security can gel leased weaponry,Afghanistan.

In the maritime arena, key nations in the IOR like the Maldives,Mauritius,Myanmar/ Burma, some African nations,Sri Lanka too- to offset the PLAN intrusion in the island, could receive IN/ CG vessels for their coastal security,apart from radar stations on land and surveillance aircraft like DO-228s. MOD/ IN opportunities to lease,seize them.


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