INS Arihant: News & Discussion

[shaun]

Are Arihant and Chakra deployed as we speak

Yes I'm tweeting from chakra... Will hoop to akula tomorrow

[Gagan]

I kid you not.

—deleted—

[ramana]

Looks like all good on the deterrent patrol line.

[Philip]

Was reading an interesting analysis on our Arihant class- dated but observant.The front portion from the sail onwards is totally Kilo.Even the sail is Kilo + with the planes fixed to it though. The aft portion differs and being the first boat, carries limited no. of missiles.Described as a " pocket SSBN".Once the later boats planned with 12 to 16 silos arrive, we may see the Arihant reconfigured as an SSGN carrying 12 non- N missiles for land attack.

A thought did strike me with some US analysts proposing merchant ships packed with missiles like an arsenal ship.Our old carriers like the Viraat could simply be stationed at port but equipped with a heavy load of mixed missiles, possibly even SAMs like S-400s on deck!

[Singha]

but her elderly boilers would need lot of upkeep and crew. not cheap to keep such a floating dated arsenal ship.

if its a arsenal ship we want the fleet support ships/tankers provide stable volume platforms with cheap diesel engines and uptime.

USN has taken a leaf from this playbook and will build some ABM arsenal ships off the San antonio class hull by deleting the well deck in the rear and using that freed up area to house a gigantic X band radar and ofcourse tons of VLS cells here and there.

zumwalt type side arrays of vls cells and big radar

some even claim these could replace the Tico class cruisers though I doubt it, for lack of speed. to hunt in a pack with the DDGs it needs to 30 knot+ which this hull form does not look so designed for.

[Karthik S]

Was reading an interesting analysis on our Arihant class- dated but observant.The front portion from the sail onwards is totally Kilo.Even the sail is Kilo + with the planes fixed to it though. The aft portion differs and being the first boat, carries limited no. of missiles.Described as a " pocket SSBN".Once the later boats planned with 12 to 16 silos arrive, we may see the Arihant reconfigured as an SSGN carrying 12 non- N missiles for land attack.

A thought did strike me with some US analysts proposing merchant ships packed with missiles like an arsenal ship.Our old carriers like the Viraat could simply be stationed at port but equipped with a heavy load of mixed missiles, possibly even SAMs like S-400s on deck!

What's the point of that? We can rather have a run of the mill military base with same number of missiles.

[Philip]

They already have the old infra accommodation-wise , combat centre, and sensors which could be upgraded, moored at a convenient location. Just a thought.

[JTull]

You're proposing a sitting duck!

[Yogi_G]

If at all the df-31 missiles had a chance of targeting some naval asset then it would be this. Forget our carrier groups.

Our Sagarika and subsequent missiles were tested off submersible silos first. Even they would do some justice here.

[prasannasimha]

Moderator note -please do not deviate from the primary discussion - This thread is about Arihant and its sister boats . No more talk of land based or moored formations etc please.

[souravB]

Some analysis on Arihant. Most of it we have already discussed, few new info with graphics.

[kit]

Not exactly the best source

India Next Generation S5 Ballistic Missile Submarine Leaked
http://idrw.org/india-next-generation-s5-ballistic-missile-submarine-leaked/#more-209159


S5 will be first in lead class next generation Nuclear Ballistic Missile Submarine which will have a surface displacement of 13000 tonnes and will be nearly double the size of S4 and S4* SSBM which are Extended version of INS Arihant and INS Arighat Class of the first-generation SSBN currently in active service of Indian Navy. S-5 SSBN Scale model reveals an interesting bit of information in radical design changes which new submarine will have. Mast: Unlike Arihant class which had clear Russian influence in the design of its Mast, S-5 has design influence of Vanguard-class SSBN operated by Royal Navy and has a Short Mast unlike seen in Arihant which also has dividing rudder design. The mast is usually the place where All above water sensors are combined into self-protection masts in the submarine’s fin. Forward Hydroplane: Not to be confused with Bow Planes as seen in Virginia class submarine. Forward Hydroplane has seen in S5 design is again influenced by Vanguard-class SSBN which is located in the forward section and not placed on Mast. Silo Hump: This is where Vanguard-class SSBN influence stops and Silo Hump as seen in the scale model is more influenced by the Russian Delta-IV class submarine which might have something to do with design influence also with S5.

[Ankit Desai]

https://twitter.com/IndoPac_Info/status ... 2768346112

Thread: #India's Next Generation S-5 SSBN revealed - Much larger than the existing Arihant Class with 16 x K-6 missiles, so same number of missiles as #USNavy next generation Columbia Class SSBN. By http://hisutton.com/S-5_SSBN.html

[Varoon Shekhar]

^
Are these Indian developed and manufactured?

[Rakesh]

What are you referring to - the sub or the K6 missile? Both are Indian in origin.

[Varoon Shekhar]

The sub essentially. Thanks, that's great, both are Indian. I wonder what degree( if any) of foreign assistance was needed. Maybe none! It's still a bit foggy about how much Russian technical help was rendered for the Arihant. Even after a decade since it was launched.

[Philip]

A little better shaping forward of the silo hump and sail, blending the hump into the sail and hull can be affected.
It does look more like a Delta class SSBN , with refinements. Considering its chief requirement is to hide
in the oceans even on the seabed too ,depths considering, stealth is more important to the SSBN than speed along with a deeper diving depth to counter std. torpedo operating depths.If the BM s also have MIRV warheads, then each sub could theoretically carry around 48 warheads. Add to that previous Arihants and we could have around 100 missiles and 200+ warheads in our second strike arsenal.

[Supratik]

16 K6 missiles is meaty. Wki says warhead 2-3 tonnes and MIRV. If 10 MIRV then that is a beast. Real power projection.

[Vips]

S5 build will start in 2022 and deliver (hopefully) in 2029. It will be powered by a 190 MW reactor which is under design and development.
S2 and S3 are in service and trial respectively. Any news if construction of S4 has started? It is supposed to be extended version of S2/S3. Do not know what is the tonnage and overall length increase compared to S2/S3. It will be certainly underpowered if it is going to be using the same 83 MW reactor that went into S2/S3.

[pushkar.bhat]

Asking a fundamental question. Will S4 be a sea-going beast or like S1 a shore-based Test Bed for the 190 MW reactor?

[Supratik]

S2 and S3 are Arihant class. S4 and S4* will have the same reactor but "augmented". How is not clear. Maybe physics guys in this forum can tell. At least one may already be under construction.

[khan]

The sub essentially. Thanks, that's great, both are Indian. I wonder what degree( if any) of foreign assistance was needed. Maybe none! It's still a bit foggy about how much Russian technical help was rendered for the Arihant. Even after a decade since it was launched.

Let’s not get carried away here, those of us old enough to remember, recall the Russian Ambassador being present at the launching of the Arihanth.

[Varoon Shekhar]

^
No one doubts the Russian assistance to Arihant. It's the details and the degree that are foggy. For the new sub, there may be no or minimal help required.

[Philip]

The more foggy the details are the better.No need to educate the conniving chinks of the PRC. Let them get a surprise...up their nether end when the S-5+++ arrive.

[dinesha]

S2 and S3 are Arihant class. S4 and S4* will have the same reactor but "augmented". How is not clear. Maybe physics guys in this forum can tell. At least one may already be under construction.

S3 is an "Arihant Plus" class with additional plug for 4 more K4 tubes . It is provisioned to carry 8 K4s.

[Supratik]

yes

[Gagan]

Google earth images show TWO Arihant Class subs in the water.

[Suraj]

Second is still under the covered dock but clearly looks like it's floated out. Can't tell how long it is.

[Gagan]

We have confirmation that the Indian Navy now has at least 3 N subs in the water.

[Rakesh]

Please keep discussions on the number of SSBNs only to Google Earth images.

If you happen to see one in your travels to a dockyard, please *DO NOT* post them in here.

That program needs to stay silent.

[Gagan]

Only info that is already open source comes in here.
But some posters here, need to adhere to it as well

[Prem Kumar]

Looks like Venkronym Naidu's photo with what looks like S-5 has made everyone sit up and take notice. OSINT jai ho!

https://www.forbes.com/sites/hisutton/2019/09/08/tweet-may-have-inadvertently-revealed-indias-next-gen-nuclear-weapons-platform-with-global-reach/#306986f37212

[prasannasimha]

^Nothing that is released would be Inadvertent- it would have been done on purpose

[arshyam]

Exactly. There is also a videographer in that photo - shows its not exactly hush-hush.

[Yogi_G]

Love it when the joke is on us Our "paaliticians" and "afsars" exploit our now stereotypical views of them being unmindful about the intricacies, they now leak hard hitting in-your-face strategic stuff like this. More n-subs we have out there makes it all the more difficult for unkil to attach vessels SSNs to shadow our boomers.

[Austin]

Looks like Venkronym Naidu's photo with what looks like S-5 has made everyone sit up and take notice. OSINT jai ho!

https://www.forbes.com/sites/hisutton/2019/09/08/tweet-may-have-inadvertently-revealed-indias-next-gen-nuclear-weapons-platform-with-global-reach/#306986f37212

Looks like they went for Delta 4 like Turtle Hump Back design

[Suraj]

Looks like Venkronym Naidu's photo with what looks like S-5 has made everyone sit up and take notice. OSINT jai ho!

https://www.forbes.com/sites/hisutton/2019/09/08/tweet-may-have-inadvertently-revealed-indias-next-gen-nuclear-weapons-platform-with-global-reach/#306986f37212

Sutton is getting ahead of himself. He's a good artist no doubt, but hardly a policy expert, and is just trying to get publicity. He thinks this kind of news is revealed in official announcements like his own government does.

[Karan M]

Even somebody who subscribes to inadvertent leaks (like meself) would find it very suspicious that Rajnath Singh made those comments on NFU and then this pic emerges.

[Rakesh]

I looked for that tweet. But could not find it. Could someone kindly provide the link?

[Snehashis]

I looked for that tweet. But could not find it. Could someone kindly provide the link?

Here is it.

https://twitter.com/VPSecretariat/statu ... 4051951616