Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

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Indranil
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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby Indranil » 03 Mar 2019 10:57

JayS wrote:
Austin wrote:N Tejas had MLG and Tail Hook but they had levcons

new NLCA MK2 has Vortex flaps. :wink: I am surprised to see no one has pointed it our so far.

I did not not point it out because the LEVCons are used currently in the same manner. But, there is something wrong in that diagram or that flap is really oddly shaped. Are they going to have a flap which stands up like a spoiler at the LE?

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby JayS » 03 Mar 2019 12:13

Indranil wrote:
JayS wrote:new NLCA MK2 has Vortex flaps. :wink: I am surprised to see no one has pointed it our so far.

I did not not point it out because the LEVCons are used currently in the same manner. But, there is something wrong in that diagram or that flap is really oddly shaped. Are they going to have a flap which stands up like a spoiler at the LE?


While Levcons are used at 30deg angle, vortex flap will be kept at much higher angle, may be even 90deg just like a spoiler. But spoilers are perpendicular to airflow, these will be along LE. Cant say with surety about final config for landing as of now. We dont have sufficient info.

When I was looking for Levcon in literature like 4yrs ago, I hit a lot of papers on Vortex flaps. Functionally Levcons in Landing config of 30deg up are same as vortex flaps. But Levcons can be used as LE slats as well with downward deflection.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby JayS » 03 Mar 2019 20:39

ashishvikas wrote:Sorry if its getting repeated.. LCA NP5 in making at HAL.

Source: DFI.

Image

As far as i understand, NP5 is LCA Navy mk2 / NLCA MK2 !!
@Rakesh,JayS,IR can confirm.


Saw the video. But it doesn't say its NP5. Just like 1 sec video in there. Could be old also.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby JTull » 04 Mar 2019 00:40

NP5 is trainer version of Mk1

Indranil
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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby Indranil » 04 Mar 2019 03:33

Jay,

And that is why I find the flap “odd”. If it were to be hinged at the TE, it could have acted as a slat at TO, and as a vortex flap at landing. In this arrangement, they have completely foregone the first use. There must be a good reason. I just want to know why.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby ks_sachin » 04 Mar 2019 04:10

Indranil and JayS,

Pls you both seem to be having a parallel conversation.

For mango men and women please do share your aerodynamic callisthenics.

Regards

S

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby Indranil » 04 Mar 2019 09:36

Sachin sahab,

Explaining this in detail will only involve more jargon :wink:

I will try sometime later when I have a little time on hand.

Till then please bear with us.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby ks_sachin » 04 Mar 2019 11:42

Indeed IR thanks.
I am reading up and will try to post my explanation of your interaction.
Let's see where my aerodynamics.
I think I know what diagram you are referring to.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby JayS » 04 Mar 2019 18:22

Indranil wrote:Jay,

And that is why I find the flap “odd”. If it were to be hinged at the TE, it could have acted as a slat at TO, and as a vortex flap at landing. In this arrangement, they have completely foregone the first use. There must be a good reason. I just want to know why.


Wing is extended now. Equations change. But I need to revise through old material go get my thoughts aligned once more on this. There's been too much going on these days and I am not able to do anything else but put my ears to news all the time on whats happening on the border.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby ks_sachin » 06 Mar 2019 13:15

IR and Jays,
Stabilators with a delta wing.
Any precedence

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby ks_sachin » 06 Mar 2019 13:19

JayS wrote:
Indranil wrote:Jay,

And that is why I find the flap “odd”. If it were to be hinged at the TE, it could have acted as a slat at TO, and as a vortex flap at landing. In this arrangement, they have completely foregone the first use. There must be a good reason. I just want to know why.


Wing is extended now. Equations change. But I need to revise through old material go get my thoughts aligned once more on this. There's been too much going on these days and I am not able to do anything else but put my ears to news all the time on whats happening on the border.

Are there enough aerodynamic refinements that they don't need whatever assistance the flap provides at TO.
And prefer all the assistance at landing.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby Khalsa » 13 Mar 2019 14:36

In light of second wave of photos and info coming from AI_19.

Does the Navy have any planning to go past the 2 X Mk1s flying for them ?
Both are the Prototypes. Any plans to go to LSP for say even four of them to iron out any testing, concepts, process building.
Anything.

Just curious.

I have some questions for Mk2/ navy which I will ask later on.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby JTull » 13 Mar 2019 14:47

Khalsa wrote:In light of second wave of photos and info coming from AI_19.

Does the Navy have any planning to go past the 2 X Mk1s flying for them ?
Both are the Prototypes. Any plans to go to LSP for say even four of them to iron out any testing, concepts, process building.
Anything.

Just curious.

I have some questions for Mk2/ navy which I will ask later on.


Please check above conversation. NP5 is under fabrication and is a trainer version of Mk1 but incorporating several changes as learnt from previous 2 prototypes.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby Khalsa » 13 Mar 2019 14:58

JTull wrote:
Khalsa wrote:In light of second wave of photos and info coming from AI_19.

Does the Navy have any planning to go past the 2 X Mk1s flying for them ?
Both are the Prototypes. Any plans to go to LSP for say even four of them to iron out any testing, concepts, process building.
Anything.

Just curious.

I have some questions for Mk2/ navy which I will ask later on.


Please check above conversation. NP5 is under fabrication and is a trainer version of Mk1 but incorporating several changes as learnt from previous 2 prototypes.


Thank you saar. I jumped straight into the Question mode after feasting on the picture gallery in tejas mk1 and mk2 threads.
Sir with regards to NP3 and NP4 then. If i remember correctly one of the NPs was made into an air force trainer (LSP or PV series right)
What about the second NP before NP5.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby JTull » 13 Mar 2019 23:43

Two line summary of facts:

Both NP1 and NP2 are derived from LCA Trainer. The rear cockpit has been used for avionics. In NP2 the canopy has been greyed out.

NP3 and NP4 will be Mk2 prototypes. One newsletter out of AI-19 had an interview with ADA Director, where it was stated that a prototype of LCA Navy Mk2 is already under fabrication which should be completed in 18 months.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby nachiket » 15 Mar 2019 00:54

ks_sachin wrote:IR and Jays,
Stabilators with a delta wing.
Any precedence

The Mig-21 has them. Although it's wing is much smaller proportionally to its size than the Tejas.

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Re: Naval Tejas Mk1/Mk2: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

Postby Indranil » 15 Mar 2019 09:56

Yes: F-5, A-4, Su-9, Su-15 immediately spring to mind. If you take cropped delta, then the list is much longer.


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