Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

The Military Issues & History Forum is a venue to discuss issues relating to the military aspects of the Indian Armed Forces, whether the past, present or future. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
Karan M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 17897
Joined: 19 Mar 2010 00:58

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Karan M » 01 Mar 2019 08:37

Guys the image above has been widely discredited.. Tom Cooper (ACIG) & some others identified it as MiG-21 fuselage sidewall.

vish_mulay
BRFite
Posts: 624
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 05:07

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby vish_mulay » 01 Mar 2019 08:38

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1101 ... 70434.html
From Twitter. Someone has done ser no check from wreck pictures to confirm F16 B double seat bought from Jordenian airforce in 2014.

krishna_krishna
BRFite
Posts: 729
Joined: 23 Oct 2006 04:14

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby krishna_krishna » 01 Mar 2019 08:39

A_Gupta wrote:
Aditya_V wrote:Few Questions right now
5. Some accurate info and confirmation of which particular PAF aircraft shot down, hopefully some gun camera image from the other MIg 21 Bision.



There is only one F16 pic, if you look at all the pictures you will see they all differ in background with the first pic. The rest I believe is of Mig21 only one pic they messed up in this whole fog of war twists their undies. All other pictures are of mig 21. Again jai ho yak herder.

Karan M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 17897
Joined: 19 Mar 2010 00:58

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Karan M » 01 Mar 2019 08:40

Sid wrote:
Ganesh_S wrote:My chaiwala says that one j f 17 has been shot down during balakot attack's.


Not chai wala, but I saw several comments where people mentioned 1 or 2 JF-17s were capped during first strike. There is no evidence to that.

Plus after our Wng Cmdr was captured, IAF could have simply released this information as we were way past being gentlemen.


They might still want to protect the WingCo. After he is released, perhaps then we'll see more info emerge from the IAF. I have to admit the 1st 2 days MEA driven press conference was really bizarre & somewhat frustrating. If we did cap JF-17s it explains a lot about our "errmm, oops, lets talk about the ground strike onlee" reaction.

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66493
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Singha » 01 Mar 2019 08:40

the places bombs were dropped was in reasi district , after crossing rajouri district.
you can look up the district map of kashmir.

https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/p ... 2019-02-28

===

TOI said the weapons were mix of Spice1000 and popeye2 which makes no sense for the same target as the powered popeye2 would arrive much faster and alert any survivors to clear out before the gliding spice's arrived.

I feel the popeyes went to balakot and the spice's some other places , perhaps isolated high value target mansions in the wilds or vice versa.

Ganesh_S
BRFite
Posts: 174
Joined: 09 Mar 2010 06:40
Location: united kingdom

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Ganesh_S » 01 Mar 2019 08:42

Second jf 17 claim isnt confirmed.

Mort Walker
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7441
Joined: 31 May 2004 11:31
Location: The rings around Uranus.

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 01 Mar 2019 08:45

DEL
Last edited by Mort Walker on 01 Mar 2019 09:10, edited 1 time in total.

Karan M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 17897
Joined: 19 Mar 2010 00:58

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Karan M » 01 Mar 2019 08:45

vish_mulay wrote:https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1101035287914770434.html
From Twitter. Someone has done ser no check from wreck pictures to confirm F16 B double seat bought from Jordenian airforce in 2014.


Apparently even the S/Nos image is from a MiG-21 structure.

Ganesh_S
BRFite
Posts: 174
Joined: 09 Mar 2010 06:40
Location: united kingdom

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Ganesh_S » 01 Mar 2019 08:46

Infact it was the jf 17 loss which prompted the misadventure by PAF.

Karan M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 17897
Joined: 19 Mar 2010 00:58

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Karan M » 01 Mar 2019 08:47

So basically, the night Balakot was attacked, the Mirage 2000s gunned down a JF-17?

Ganesh_S
BRFite
Posts: 174
Joined: 09 Mar 2010 06:40
Location: united kingdom

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Ganesh_S » 01 Mar 2019 08:48

Mort Walker wrote:
Ganesh_S wrote:My chaiwala says that one j f 17 has been shot down during balakot attack's.


This is in addition to the F-16? Or was it a JF17 that was shot down instead? When the Wing Commander comes back, we will know the full story.


This was a first kill during balakot attack's. Rest what you see happened later.

Aditya_V
BRF Oldie
Posts: 10725
Joined: 05 Apr 2006 16:25

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Aditya_V » 01 Mar 2019 08:49

Well there is no confirmation of such info, unless IAf realeases some data lets not talk about JF 17, if the Pilot died it will be intresting if the PAF does quite burial

yensoy
BRFite
Posts: 1318
Joined: 29 May 2002 11:31
Location: USA

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby yensoy » 01 Mar 2019 08:52

There would be no confirmation of any kills during Balakot strike because that would negate the "non-military pre-emptive strike" with no collateral damage story. A fatal engagement during the Balakot run would necessarily make it a military strike, regardless of the original intent of the mission.

Ganesh_S
BRFite
Posts: 174
Joined: 09 Mar 2010 06:40
Location: united kingdom

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Ganesh_S » 01 Mar 2019 08:55

Karan M wrote:So basically, the night Balakot was attacked, the Mirage 2000s gunned down a JF-17?


Chaiwala didn't name the fighter that shot down jft. Says will become evident once the evidence is released. Matters have to be kept under wraps now.

UlanBatori
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11318
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby UlanBatori » 01 Mar 2019 08:56

Ppl, there is only one way to fit all the reports (bearded Sikh pilot? What beard? Indian WingCo has a fierce moustache but no beard.

The Pakis beat up their own surviving pilot, may have beaten one to death too. UBCN WAG is saying that this was PROBABLY deliberate, because PA terrorists are so mad at PAF for not protecting the 500 that Embraced Pest-e-Shaeed.

So we have a complete picture.
1. PAF just did CYA by sticking to flying around over Abbotabad and their own bases while the Indian raid(s) on Muzz'bad, the other terrorist place, plus the massive hit on Balakote. THREE RAIDS, causing massive death and damage to the terror enterprise.

2. Under immense pressure, PAF decided to do a token "raid", to lob some bombs over the LOC and claim to have done ==.
3. The style of that "raid" (turned tail at LOC on seeing Indian planes), shows that they ***KNOW** that their AAMs won't work beyond LOC.
4. They fired at 2 Indian planes, to try and save their Air Marshal's baccha in the 2-seat F-16. One missile worked because it was still over Pak side of LOC. The other went fizz once across LOC (WingCo Ananth's wingman turned into Indian side at LOC).
5. Wing Co had the lock on the tail of the 2-seat F-16 and stayed on task, when he realized AIM was on his tail. Hero. Shot down the 2-seat F-16.
6. 3 chutes opened.
7. 2 Pakis landed first. One beaten to death by friendly PA/terrorists, one saved to be hospitalized with critical injuries.
8. Indian pilot landed last, was arrested by PA.

9. I think the fellow shown in the "interview" was a Paki actor, not the WingCo, which makes me VERY worried about our WingCo's health.

10. Net story: Pak cannot defend their planes from IAF once over India!!
11. F-16 with Paki Air Marshal's baccha no match for 1960s-vintage Made In India MiG 21 and Indian missile.
12. PAF dare not engage even over Pakistan (maybe JF117(s) did and got shot down).
13. The helicopter crash was the tragic thing, probably due to hurry of SAR mission: probably due to terrorists with shoulder-fired SAM.
14. ENTIRE LOC + Lahore + Murdike + Sialkot all very much Spicy targets.
15. Pak needed desperately to stop air tamasha due to #10-12+14 above, hence returning Indian pilot and basically suing for peace.

***********
16. Balochistan heating up......

UlanBatori
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11318
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby UlanBatori » 01 Mar 2019 08:57

IIRC the first report to come out on any action was that 2 Thundaars had been shot down.

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66493
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Singha » 01 Mar 2019 09:00

i have heard of a geofencing module based off a GPS receiver being put into Stinger missiles.

but it does make sense to be there when sophisticated arms are supplied to rogue state puppets like TSP.

yensoy
BRFite
Posts: 1318
Joined: 29 May 2002 11:31
Location: USA

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby yensoy » 01 Mar 2019 09:00

Paki perfidy in using F-16s as offensive weapons against us is hitting MSM: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-28/india-says-has-evidence-pakistan-used-f-16-jet-in-feb-27-strike

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66493
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Singha » 01 Mar 2019 09:01

NDTV has already started how it was UAE Saudi USA who put pressure on TSP to get the POW released - (and not GOI)

back to regular scheduled slanted news coverage.

ArjunPandit
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2439
Joined: 29 Mar 2017 06:37

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby ArjunPandit » 01 Mar 2019 09:02


that might explain their comment of mandir main ghantiyan nahin bajengi. I think the GOI has not raised this information a lot because of the potential effect of this item on national mood and internal security

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66493
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Singha » 01 Mar 2019 09:03

their airspace is still close :rotfl: today the sun is out. the hot runways must be in use to dry the wet pants, panties and shalwars for next 12 hrs.

Patni
BRFite
Posts: 853
Joined: 10 Jun 2008 10:32
Location: Researching sub-humans to our west!

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Patni » 01 Mar 2019 09:04

I don't get why this "we missed out on massive retaliation chance" mood. We at BRF know, how this lion of Bharatmata, has made napakis, participate in mass browning of pants ceremony with unprecedented regularity. Didn't we got told by him yesterday, that he likes scientific concept of "pilot project" first, get results, analyse and if needed fine tune and then go for large-scale roll out! Napakis gets it, what has happened on 26th has brought back nightmares from 1971 to them. They are busy doing headless chicken dance routine cause till now they relied on China get out of jail card at UNSC which is now poof gone! modiji has got us out of retaliation only mindset and showed all the advantages of being "preemptive". I for one feel we are blessed to have him and treat this as just starting "pilot episode" in a script that has long series of episodes, each of which making every Pakistani wakeup to realise they are being lead up to revisit 1971. More n more lndians will start seeing it as well and that's what BIF is most nervous about and causing massive burnol shortages.

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66493
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Singha » 01 Mar 2019 09:05

photo of wagah border this morning. the whole place should be cleared out and no circus.

https://lbimg.in.com/LiveBlog/img/2019/ ... 3c7c1.jpeg

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66493
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Singha » 01 Mar 2019 09:06

ibnlive

Pakistan’s foreign minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi has admitted that Jaish-e-Mohammad chief Masood Azhar is in the country, but said he is very unwell and not even in a position to leave his house.

abhijitm
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3472
Joined: 08 Jun 2006 15:02
Contact:

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby abhijitm » 01 Mar 2019 09:07

Ganesh_S wrote:
Karan M wrote:So basically, the night Balakot was attacked, the Mirage 2000s gunned down a JF-17?


Chaiwala didn't name the fighter that shot down jft. Says will become evident once the evidence is released. Matters have to be kept under wraps now.

Please don't spread rumors or unconfirmed stories. IAF is highly professional institution and if then down an enemy plane or even there was an engagement they will come and openly state it. There is no need to hide. Military engagement is not a collateral damage.

kancha
BRFite
Posts: 895
Joined: 20 Apr 2005 19:13

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby kancha » 01 Mar 2019 09:08

ramana wrote:kancha, You understood the best what #Balakotstrike was all about.
Kudos
ramana


Thanks for the endorsement, RamanaJi

Vivasvat
BRFite
Posts: 252
Joined: 11 May 2005 08:03

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Vivasvat » 01 Mar 2019 09:09

Singha wrote:ibnlive

Pakistan’s foreign minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi has admitted that Jaish-e-Mohammad chief Masood Azhar is in the country, but said he is very unwell and not even in a position to leave his house.

Are they expecting India to demand that the rotund terrorist be handed over? Otherwise, why say that he cannot leave house? Or maybe so that he does not have to taste jail.

khan
BRFite
Posts: 474
Joined: 12 Feb 2003 12:31
Location: Tx

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby khan » 01 Mar 2019 09:11

To me the acid test to how comfortable Pakistan feels boils down to one simple question - is their air-space open?

As long as their air-space is closed, they are s**t scared of IAF and there is no peace - there is no deal.

Ignore PR, media, Pundits on the media and forms pontificating about nonsense (including my humble self :mrgreen:) - it is just noise. In the absence of an official statement, keep checking to see if Pakistani air-space is open.

khan
BRFite
Posts: 474
Joined: 12 Feb 2003 12:31
Location: Tx

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby khan » 01 Mar 2019 09:14

Vivasvat wrote:
Singha wrote:ibnlive

Pakistan’s foreign minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi has admitted that Jaish-e-Mohammad chief Masood Azhar is in the country, but said he is very unwell and not even in a position to leave his house.

Are they expecting India to demand that the rotund terrorist be handed over? Otherwise, why say that he cannot leave house? Or maybe so that he does not have to taste jail.

I am sure Prime Minister Modi will be happy to charter a fully staffed Médecins Sans Frontières fling to bring him to an Indian hospital where he can be gently nursed back to health before being put on trial and executed :mrgreen:.

Mort Walker
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7441
Joined: 31 May 2004 11:31
Location: The rings around Uranus.

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 01 Mar 2019 09:14

Karan M wrote:
Mort Walker wrote:
Bingo. That is what will happen. If it doesn't come to a head at UNSC, then TSP will get one more warning and Chinni, Unkil, Aunty and Frogistanis will be told that military option may be exercised.


If this happens and that rotten swine is targeted by any action, I'll buy you a tanker of beer whenever we ever meet!


I'm not a beer drinker, but would be very happy to sip some tea with BRF members at RYK.

naird
BRFite
Posts: 206
Joined: 04 Jun 2009 19:41

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby naird » 01 Mar 2019 09:17

Folks - this may have been answered. Abhinandan was a Su 30 pilot, how come he was piloting Mig 21 ? I mean i have heard pilots graduating themselves to better machine but havent heard pilots getting re-assigned to fly older machines. Is this norm ?

yensoy
BRFite
Posts: 1318
Joined: 29 May 2002 11:31
Location: USA

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby yensoy » 01 Mar 2019 09:20

naird wrote:Folks - this may have been answered. Abhinandan was a Su 30 pilot, how come he was piloting Mig 21 ? I mean i have heard pilots graduating themselves to better machine but havent heard pilots getting re-assigned to fly older machines. Is this norm ?


I don't think it works that way, they are promoted and reassigned to different bases which have the planes they have.

Also, the fact that he was flying a 2 seater indicates to me that he must be the alpha of the pack who also mentors & trains newbies. Just my guess.

yensoy
BRFite
Posts: 1318
Joined: 29 May 2002 11:31
Location: USA

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby yensoy » 01 Mar 2019 09:21

khan wrote:To me the acid test to how comfortable Pakistan feels boils down to one simple question - is their air-space open?
As long as their air-space is closed, they are s**t scared of IAF and there is no peace - there is no deal.


Ok again my uninformed guess here. One reason for Pakis to curtail flying might be to conserve aviation fuel for air force use.

Though I think they will run out of planes before they run out of fuel.

Shaktimaan
BRFite
Posts: 410
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Shaktimaan » 01 Mar 2019 09:23

Saars, a poonch comes to mind.

Let's say that in the New Normal, India strikes at terrorist camps whenever there is any reason to do so (either as retaliation for a terrorist attack in India or actionable intelligence of high-value targets / imminent attacks). Right now the terrorist camps are on the LOC, just to the rear of the LOC/IB, and in Southern Pakjab. All within airstrike range.

What is stopping the NaPakis from simply moving the terrorist training camps hundreds of km inland, say for example into Balochistan?

Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23314
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Austin » 01 Mar 2019 09:24

yensoy wrote:Paki perfidy in using F-16s as offensive weapons against us is hitting MSM: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-28/india-says-has-evidence-pakistan-used-f-16-jet-in-feb-27-strike


That sort of thing Only to Use F-16 against Terrorist are peachy talk to sell F-16 and get the right sounding word which they can selling it through media .
When US Sold AMRAAM C-5 and other gadgets they said it was to be used against Terrorist , Which terrorist in the world uses fighter aircraft that needs AMRAAM class missile wth F-16 Upgrade ?

These weapons will only be used against us and the only weapon they use against their terrrorist are their Ground Forces and Tribals

Mort Walker
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7441
Joined: 31 May 2004 11:31
Location: The rings around Uranus.

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 01 Mar 2019 09:24

Singha wrote:their airspace is still close :rotfl: today the sun is out. the hot runways must be in use to dry the wet pants, panties and shalwars for next 12 hrs.


Someone needs to tell them to be afraid of what comes in the night time sky.

sanjaykumar
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3899
Joined: 16 Oct 2005 05:51

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby sanjaykumar » 01 Mar 2019 09:25

The Baloch.

Sid
BRFite
Posts: 1634
Joined: 19 Mar 2006 13:26

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Sid » 01 Mar 2019 09:26

abhijitm wrote:
Ganesh_S wrote:
Chaiwala didn't name the fighter that shot down jft. Says will become evident once the evidence is released. Matters have to be kept under wraps now.

Please don't spread rumors or unconfirmed stories. IAF is highly professional institution and if then down an enemy plane or even there was an engagement they will come and openly state it. There is no need to hide. Military engagement is not a collateral damage.


This statement is incorrect...

“Bharat Maa” heart is a deep ocean of secrets :)

Mort Walker
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7441
Joined: 31 May 2004 11:31
Location: The rings around Uranus.

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Mort Walker » 01 Mar 2019 09:27

yensoy wrote:
khan wrote:To me the acid test to how comfortable Pakistan feels boils down to one simple question - is their air-space open?
As long as their air-space is closed, they are s**t scared of IAF and there is no peace - there is no deal.


Ok again my uninformed guess here. One reason for Pakis to curtail flying might be to conserve aviation fuel for air force use.

Though I think they will run out of planes before they run out of fuel.


Civil Aviation is afraid of SAMs. Thanks to the Russian based thugs in eastern Ukraine who shot down MH17 everyone in commercial aviation is scared and pissed off.

Bharadwaj
BRFite
Posts: 273
Joined: 09 Oct 2006 11:09

Re: Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Postby Bharadwaj » 01 Mar 2019 09:28

Iaf is not Paf... We are not going to claim aircraft shot down on the sole basis of ground reports. There will be clear evidence on both ground and airborne radar playback. Showing this publicly is suicide as it will clearly reveal capabilities. I admit that many of us have gotten overexcited with some photos from the other side but that video of drop tanks and other wreckage being hurriedly loaded into trucks during daylight is still to be explained. The mig-21 wreckage was still at the spot during night when some pigs were dancing over it.


Return to “Military Issues & History Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 15 guests