India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

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Rakesh
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Rakesh »

k prasad wrote:My bet is they have a remotely detonated device in the pit and someone far away presses the button once all the soldiers are on the ground.
What purpose this melodrama serves is puzzling. Would make better sense for them to devote their energies to actual military training.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Rakesh »

What is with the Chinese and their fetish for stone throwing? They did it to the Indian Army at Doklam and now they are doing the same to the Vietnamese. Do their infantry weapons not work? Click on the link below for video.

https://twitter.com/TheLegateIN/status/ ... 87584?s=20 ---> Chinese PLA troops carrying out stone-pelting on Vietnamese excavators along the Sino-Vietnam border.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by k prasad »

Rakesh wrote:What is with the Chinese and their fetish for stone throwing? They did it to the Indian Army at Doklam and now they are doing the same to the Vietnamese. Do their infantry weapons not work? Click on the link below for video.
Don't worry Saar... With the new ROEs on the LAC, their next attempt at Shaolin Kung fu in Ladakh will look something like this:

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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Prem Kumar »

Rakesh wrote: What purpose this melodrama serves is puzzling. Would make better sense for them to devote their energies to actual military training.
Sun Tzu say: "1 ounce of propagandu is worth 1 pound of combat training"

Confucius say: "1 line of SunTzu'ism is worth 1 year of military planning"
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by vijayk »

https://carbuntracy.com/2022/01/06/did- ... at-galwan/
Did CCP use Chinese actors to stage flag ceremony at Galwan?


Breaking: Did #CCP use #Chinese actors to stage flag ceremony at #Galwan?
- Some users on Chinese social media platform Weibo have indicated that CCP used Chinese actors to stage the entire ceremony.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by rohitvats »

Good morning!

Details of S-400 System and its AD cover.

- Details of key components like surveillance and fire-control radars, TELs, support vehicles etc. which constitute S-400 Air Defense Missile System.
- Configuration of a typical S-400 missile regiment.
- Likely configuration of S-400 squadron in IAF service.
- Hypothetical scenario of deployment of 2 x S-400 squadrons on India's western border, and the type of air defense cover provided by them.

- Coverage provided by hypothetical deployment of 2 x S-400 Squadrons. One squadron is in the general area of Jalandhar, and other Squadron is close to Bikaner. The image shows primary (91N6E 'Big Bird') and secondary (96L6E 'Cheese Board') radar cover, and range of 40N6E(400-km), 48N6E3(250km), and 9M96E2 (120-km) range missiles.

Image

Complete video with details of the system and coverage:


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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Cyrano »

Nice work Rohitvats ji !
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by rohitvats »

India-China stand-off

Here are some thoughts on the subject -

1. If you want to understand what happened in 2020, you need to first revisit an incident that happened in September 2014.
2. Modi had just become the Prime Minister, and the Chinese initiated a big incursion in the Chumar sector.
3. They came prepared with more than regular number of troops.
4. However, what they had not fathomed was the changed leadership at the center.
5. Indian Army reacted in a much more forceful manner.
6. A Brigade of 39 Mountain Division (Northern Command Reserve) was exercising in eastern Ladakh, and it was immediately pushed into the Chumar sector.
7. We even had special forces in the area.
8. I don't recall who it was, 14 Corps Commander or GOC-in-C, Northern Command, who used this opportunity to even push a brigade into DBO Sector.
9. In the two decades before 2014, the PLA was used to having its way.
10. But here, they suddenly found themselves outnumber 4:1, or even higher. And that too, in a sector where they're geographically very disadvantaged.
11. And they had to back down, w/o any concessions from the Indian side.
12. So, when 2020 happened, the Chinese came with a MUCH LARGER body of troops, AS COMPARED to their earlier transgressions in eastern Ladakh.
13. Because they had gamed that India will reinforce using local sources, and they had worked out numbers to maintain parity.
14. Please remember that the PLA earlier used to manage the whole of eastern Ladakh with just 2-3 Border Défense Regiments (BDR).
15. They could do this because they know they'll be the first ones to fire shots in anger and that India will not use its numerical superiority to do any hanky-panky.
16. But in 2020, they came prepared lest India repeat Chumar performance. The numbers they had were meant to have parity with our forces deployed upfront. They did not come to launch attacks or fight a war.
17. BUT -
18. What India did was completely out of syllabus.
19. We mobilized double quick, and the Chinese suddenly found themselves facing ~three divisions worth of troops.
20. The Chinese suddenly found themselves on a weak wicket and had to pull in troops from Xinjiang Military Region, and if I go by some data that I've seen, even Combined Arms Brigades from one of the Group Armies situated outside the Tibetan Plateau (more than 2,500 km from eastern Ladakh).
21. The force level they've inducted just about gives them parity with us.
22. Now, if you're looking for attacking an adversary, you need at least 3:1 advantage in numbers. Sure, the Chinese have considerable firepower but except for Combined Arms Brigades from 76 or 77 Group Army, their best have not been committed. Xinjiang Military Region has their least modernized troops.
23. Having inducted troops, the Chinese then went about building infrastructure to house these troops. And remember, you don't need only accommodation for troops but offices, vehicle parking areas, ammunition depots, Petroleum-Oil-Lubricant (POL) depots, food, supplies, etc.
24. They basically had to build large cantonments because remember, what they has earlier were only couple of Border Défense Regiments.
25. From couple of thousands of troops, the Chinese went to 50,000+ troops in a few months.
26. Yes, while also had to create new infrastructure, remember, we already has almost two division worth of troops already in the sector.
27. We went from X to 2X but they had to go from 0 -> 2X.
28. Hence, the massive infra that you see on Google Earth and various Twitter handles.
29. One more thing - while our lines of communication are tougher as we've to cross many mountain passes, the Chinese lines of communication to their LAC from major nodes is much longer.
30. So, if Rudok or Ngari is their equivalent of Leh, you'll see 2 to 3 sub-nodes from these super-nodes and their side of LAC.
31. The Chinese never came with the intention to fight a war; as it is, they'll never start a war if they're not sure of winning it.
32. They came with the intention of intimidating Indians, and to ensure that little bit of encroachment that they do, is not challenged, and prevented by the Indians. Like Chumar where they had to back down because numbers weren't in their favour and Indians had made their intentions known.
33. But after Indians reacted the way, it did, they had no option but to reinforce the sector themselves.
34. Because you, me and others on this forum and outside might feel that India will not be first to use force, as an adversary, you cannot go by this assumption. They'll do by capability because intentions can change, and we'd planted the capability to go bang-bang if we wanted.
35. Chinese are now riding a Tiger they don't know how to get-off from. And they're stuck. Not least because Galwan happened.
36. Chinese cannot to be seen losing face.
37. As the bigger power, Chinese will lose if they're not seen explicitly as having won. While as a relatively smaller power, we will win if we simply hold them to stalemate.
38. Why is 2020 different from earlier times?
39. Well, earlier the Chinese ended up doing salami-slicing of Indian territory in Eastern Ladakh with handful of troops. Now, they've to induct 50,000+ troops to try and retain few square kilometres of territory they've tried to grab.
40. Even that they've had to give-up in the process of establishing buffer zone, and disengagement.
41. A message has gone all over the world that there is ONE country which will stand toe-to-toe with the Chinese and not give in to their bullying.
42. What next?
43. Well, I see a major China-India confrontation coming-up in next 5-7 years.
44. Chinese are upping their infra in East and developing a lot of infra here.
45. Especially in Eastern Ladakh, all this infra will form the firm base from where to next launch assault on India.
46. It could be in the form of short, sharp conflict with territory grab, or much larger one.
47. My estimate is that it will be a high optic, small, sharp, and intense operation where the Chinese will be visibly seen by everyone to have 'defeated' India.
48. They'll do this by achieving disproportionate superiority in one or two sub-sectors. And use the presence of their much larger force in rear areas to dissuade India from escalating the conflict further.
49. All in all, interesting times ahead.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by rohitvats »

Cyrano wrote:Nice work Rohitvats ji !
Many thanks!
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Manish_P »

^^ Rohit ji, thanks for that 49 pointer summary of the situation.

Could you add your 5 points thoughts about our possible/probable counter-actions, to deny China it's optical win.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by shaun »

Kudos to you Rohit Saab.. nicely painstakingly done. More power to you
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Rakesh »

Well written Rohit. Good job.

This is such an amazing writeup. Its like one is actually there.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Dilbu »

Thank you Rohitji.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Zynda »

Rohitji, nice work. It would be helpful if you can add some more points on what you think should GoI/Indian Armed Forces should do to at least prevent giving the impression of "victory" to Chinese. If we have to upgrade our infra+resources, what specific areas...I am sure GoI & upper echelons of Armed forces are already aware of the above and hopefully are working on the same...of course it should be posted here if it does not compromise any strategic or tactical situations.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by VinodTK »

^^^^ India-China stand-off

Thanks Rohitji +++
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by nandakumar »

Hats off to rohitvats for a brilliant and painstaking analysis of the situation. I am educated beyond measure.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Pratyush »

Rohit good work and nice summary.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by ShivS »

Rohit

Very nice. Two questions.

1. What can the IA do? Force deployment apart, a super quick response strategy is going to be needed. More at the brigade level than the division level?

2. This may work at a tactical level for the PRC but they will create a multi decade long enemity for no tangible gain. Is it worth it? Till now the PRC has been careful to avoid armed conflict on its borders.

Gut is that they will act in 12-36 months, no more, with Indian civilian targets threatened as the price for threaten level escalation rather than a 6/8 division strong force.

Super work.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by ldev »

rohitvats wrote:India-China stand-off

Here are some thoughts on the subject -

46. It could be in the form of short, sharp conflict with territory grab, or much larger one.
47. My estimate is that it will be a high optic, small, sharp, and intense operation where the Chinese will be visibly seen by everyone to have 'defeated' India.
Totally agree on the bolded portion. Chinese political objective is to emerge as the undisputed power in Asia. India is far too large with 1.4 billion people to be occupied. So for China the objective is to demonstrate to the rest of the world and specially to Asian neighbors and in particular to India's neighbors that India cannot even protect itself so do not hitch your wagon to India and to India to accept the inevitability of Chinese supremacy in Asia. So China needs a made for TV war, they were inspired enough by Gulf War 1 that they have modeled their armed forces modernization since then based on that conflict. This in turn IMO needs demonstrated proof on television of damage in India while China is unscathed. The border areas and mountains are not ideal for such a demonstration because there are no TV crews etc. and which member of the average worldwide audience, beyond us nerds, can figure out whether a particular peak or valley in eastern Ladakh is with India or China or frankly what the implication of that possession means in military terms. Ideally from the Chinese viewpoint they would like to demonstrate some damage to infrastructure in India which Indian television which is free will air in a loop around the clock for the world to see, while Chinese propaganda will show that people are living normal lives in Beijing/Shanghai etc. IMO, that is the challenge that India faces. At the tactical level at the border, India will be more than able to hold it's own and China will not want to lose territory for purely domestic political reasons i.e. Xi will face a revolt if China loses territory in a conflict that it initiates, but at the global audience level, that local gain/loss of territory will be immaterial from a propaganda standpoint.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by KL Dubey »

ldev wrote:
rohitvats wrote:India-China stand-off

Here are some thoughts on the subject -

46. It could be in the form of short, sharp conflict with territory grab, or much larger one.
47. My estimate is that it will be a high optic, small, sharp, and intense operation where the Chinese will be visibly seen by everyone to have 'defeated' India.
Totally agree on the bolded portion.
I also "fully agree". Leadership changes in the PLA forces facing India strongly seem to indicate this. The PLA has already designated the two leaders of the impending short sharp conflict (Lt Gen Wu Jing and Lt Gen Xie Nan). It is also rumored that the rearguard forces to discourage Indian escalation will be commanded by Maj Gen Li Lianjie (Ladakh area) and Maj Gen Chan Kong-sang (Arunachal area). These latter two have been deputed from the Central and Southern theater commands.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by KL Dubey »

rohitvats wrote:India-China stand-off
On a different note, this is a very good timeline and excellent "ready reference".

If I were to suggest a "point #50", it would be that the PLA/CCP is a paper tiger. It will not fight but instead continue a propaganda war and try to support internal security disturbances in India.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by konaseema »

I sincerely believe that China, with help from Pakistan will continue to create civil unrest in India (Protest against CAA, Farm laws, Reigniting the Khalistan movement, Cyber Warfare - Mumbai Power outage, Closure of Sterlite Copper, Foxxconn factory etc) which will lead to trust deficit on the current BJP government at center. Be it China or Pakistan, both will sit tight, while enhancing their war fighting capabilities and wait for a non-BJP government at the center, before they attack India from either sides or both. India has shown its intent in no uncertain terms on what to expect if either of them try to escalate the situation through the series of capability demonstration, in terms of quick troop induction in Ladakh, series of missile tests, continue to keep Pakistan in the FATF Grey list and certain economic measures against China.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by S_Madhukar »

+101 ... and because there is no direct threat IA and IAF will Carry on with MRFA., winter summer moon trials etc. We are the frog being boiled slowly ... Eleven and Imi is having internal problems so Modi India is a common bakra they are targeting
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by bharathp »

S_Madhukar wrote:+101 ... and because there is no direct threat IA and IAF will Carry on with MRFA., winter summer moon trials etc. We are the frog being boiled slowly ... Eleven and Imi is having internal problems so Modi India is a common bakra they are targeting
the sudden increase in missile tests suggest otherwise - what we can build at home, we are building quickly.
also, there is an effort to create economic defense (PLI schemes, banning shein, tiktok)

my anticipation is- the independence day will see a lot of desi MIC stuff.. Modi believes in invigorating the nation during Aug 15.
mk2 initially was to be launched in aug 2022 - it looks to be slightly behind schedule
Mk1's last few flights havent been publicised
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Cyrano »

Agree with Rohitvats prediction that China will again attempt to create a military victory over India when they think they have moved away from parity and created a significant advantage for themselves.

If Galwan casualities were the other way and India had squealed a bit, they might have taken and painted it as a victory and cooled off, and gone back to salami slicing now and then. In non-military terms, they would have tried to compel India to join RCEP, BRI etc, stay away from US and support Chinese shenanigans on world stage like a good vassal.

But Col Babu & his brave men changed all that, followed by further manoeuvres on Kailash range etc. and like Pak with Kashmir, China in Ladakh is left holding the proverbial banana in the jar. Their Tofu growth story is being called out by world for what it is, demographics won't change in a year or two, they can keep building show piece DingDong carriers without experience of operating them, despite having no unfettered access blue waters. They know this, so they are counting on "winning" a "war" against one of the most battle hardened and well equipped armies without actually fighting one.

China's entire strategy (if it can be called that) hinges on one fundamental, bedrock assumption - that India will not attack first. What if we do ? There are so many places across the 3000Km frontier to choose from, where should India make a counter move? :)
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by SSridhar »

rohitvats,

Awesome work, both about the S-400 system and the timeline. Thanks.

One correction, I thought you were referring to the Sep. 2014 incident.
1. If you want to understand what happened in 2020, you need to first revisit an incident that happened in September 2017 2014.

The following are instructive too, lest we had forgotten. It is very obvious that Xi wanted to employ coercive behaviour to achieve his goals in three incidents (two in 2013 and one in 2014)

On April 15, 2013, in a deep incursion, forty Chinese troops entered the Indian Territory in the Daulat Beg Oldi (DBO) sector and erected a tented post, 19 Kms inside Indian Territory at Depsang Valley, setting the stage for a face-to-face situation with Indian troops which continued for 21 days. In the three flag meetings, the PLA put several demands such as the Indian Army destroying certain structures, calling off of night patrols, not tailing Chinese patrols and reducing troop levels in return for Chinese troops to vacate Depsang valley in DBO sector. The incursion took place just within a fortnight after the new Chinese President met Indian PM Man Mohan Singh (at the BRICS Summit Meet in Durban in March 2013) and requested Man Mohan Singh to accommodate Chinese PM Li Keqiang’s visit in May to India (as he was keen on making India his first stop) and weeks before the state visit of the Chinese Premier Li Keqiang to India as his first stop after he took Prime Ministership. After nearly three weeks of stand-off, India acceded to certain demands such as dismantling some Indian structures and withdrawing Indian forces facing the Chinese and the stand-off ended. Li's visit was to enlist India in the OBOR (now BRI). Foreign Minister, Salman Kurshid went to Beijing to resolve the Depsang issue and Li’s visit took place. This was soon followed by the Chumar incident which occurred in June 2013 just two weeks before the first ever visit by an Indian defence minister in seven years.

India signed the BDCA with China in October 2013.

Then, the September 2014 Chumar incident happened. Again, it preceded the arrival of XJP in India and continued even after he left.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by yensoy »

SSridhar wrote:... forty Chinese troops entered the Indian Territory in the Daulat Beg Oldi (DBO) sector and erected a tented post, 19 Kms inside Indian Territory at Depsang Valley, setting the stage for a face-to-face situation with Indian troops which continued for 21 days...
They had 40 troops 19 km deep inside our territory and we couldn't siege/surround them and prevent them from leaving? We should have set up loudspeakers around these fellows and played kolaveri at full volume 24/7.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by SSridhar »

yensoy wrote: . . . played kolaveri at full volume 24/7.
:D That song was unfortunately unavailable at that time.

Yes, we followed the CBMs and the border engagement rules to a T like we always did.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Prem Kumar »

Cyrano wrote: China's entire strategy (if it can be called that) hinges on one fundamental, bedrock assumption - that India will not attack first. What if we do ? There are so many places across the 3000Km frontier to choose from, where should India make a counter move? :)
Perhaps this is what NSA Doval means by "offensive defense". We will not initiate the proceedings, but if they initiate, our response will not be just defensive, but offensive too. We will incur into their territory, either to absorb it permanently or to hold it as a bargaining chip.

Though this strategy doesn't go far enough IMHO, its still a world of improvement over what we had in the UPA days or earlier!
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by rohitvats »

SSridhar wrote:rohitvats,

Awesome work, both about the S-400 system and the timeline. Thanks.

One correction, I thought you were referring to the Sep. 2014 incident.
1. If you want to understand what happened in 2020, you need to first revisit an incident that happened in September 2017 2014.
Thank you for correction. Yes, I meant September 2014.
The following are instructive too, lest we had forgotten. It is very obvious that Xi wanted to employ coercive behavior to achieve his goals in three incidents (two in 2013 and one in 2014)

On April 15, 2013, in a deep incursion, forty Chinese troops entered the Indian Territory in the Daulat Beg Oldi (DBO) sector and erected a tented post, 19 Kms inside Indian Territory at Depsang Valley, setting the stage for a face-to-face situation with Indian troops which continued for 21 days.
This is what the Chinese were expecting in September 2014 but got a shock of their life! And then we had Indians going toe-to-toe in Doklam. There again, the Chinese found themselves in a tight spot, not able to bring their superiority to play against the Indians.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by srin »

Don't we have aerostat radars that can look deep into Baki airspace?
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by rohitvats »

Cyrano wrote:<SNIP> China's entire strategy (if it can be called that) hinges on one fundamental, bedrock assumption - that India will not attack first. What if we do ? There are so many places across the 3000Km frontier to choose from, where should India make a counter move? :)
This is exactly what happened when we deployed troops on the Kailash Range. It was once more a case of out of syllabus question for the Chinese!
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by SSridhar »

rohitvats wrote:Yes, I meant September 2014.
I have corrected your original post.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Larry Walker »

To prevent PLA from winning a TV war - we need some basic capability to hit Chengdu from standoff distance and have a air-mobile or expeditionary force ready to land in PRC south-west mainland (like in Lijiang or any other smaller city) cutting through Myanmar. Pipe dreams for now - but this is what is minimum needed to ensure that dragon does not think of a TV war.
Eastern sector is where we tame the dragon - Northern sector is where Dragon will try to win the war.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by nam »

The key capability that we need to rollout is cooperative engagement. Something the F35 displayed along with Aegis. Here the target was detected and tracked by F35, outside of Aegis search zone and the SAM from the ship was cued to the target by F35.

In our case a Su30/Netra detects a Paki target and gives coordinates to a S400/MRSAM/XRSAM launcher placed in a remote location near the LC.

The SAM being guided by airborne asset. PAF will be under constant lookout for a SAM popping up from nowhere..

I am assuming S400 may have some sort of coop engagement with Su30 already in built.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Cyrano »

What about lobbing a few from Arihant / Arighat / Kalaveri etc. targeting costal oil depots ? Spectacular, minimum collateral loss life, undeniable and will shake CCP to the core. Hit where the enemy is least expecting you to. Simultaneously blockade Malacca from Andamans and Arabian sea lanes from Cochin/Karvar. World powers will intervene, calm things down and broker a truce. India's terms for ceasefire - China withdraws from Tibet to pre-1952 positions. We'll settle Ladakh, Shaksgam & Doklam with the new independent Tibetan Govt in Lhasa. P5 composition changed.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by SSridhar »

Cyrano wrote:What about lobbing a few from Arihant / Arighat / Kalaveri etc. targeting costal oil depots ?
Apart from many other imponderables, these three have not yet ventured out that far as the kind of missiles that they currently have would demand them operating from within the Indo-China Sea.
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by SriKumar »

rohitvats wrote: This is exactly what happened when we deployed troops on the Kailash Range. It was once more a case of out of syllabus question for the Chinese!
This govt started to make moves that was out of syllabus. Dokalam was one such. If a few more out-of-syllabus moves are made before the real deal, at least a message will go out to the other party that a greater preparation cost is needed if they decide to pull the trigger. Perhaps some out-of-syllabus options have been conveyed through back-channels and are not mentioned in public domain.
Roop
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by Roop »

Larry Walker wrote:...we need some basic capability to hit Chengdu from standoff distance ...
We have this already, in the from of SSMs. Or, for that matter, air-launched Shaurya missiles.

From the most NE point of India (say Tinsukia or beyond) to Chengdu is roughly 1000km -- well within range of Shaurya launched from an Su-30. But more than this or that specific weapon, what we need is the mindset, i.e. the mental willingness, to form contingency plans for using these weapons in this manner, and then for actually using them.

Do we have this toughness? Honestly, I don't know, but if China thinks we do, they will never take their aggression that far to put us to the test.
titash
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Re: India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

Post by titash »

Roop wrote:
Larry Walker wrote:...we need some basic capability to hit Chengdu from standoff distance ...
We have this already, in the from of SSMs. Or, for that matter, air-launched Shaurya missiles.

From the most NE point of India (say Tinsukia or beyond) to Chengdu is roughly 1000km -- well within range of Shaurya launched from an Su-30. But more than this or that specific weapon, what we need is the mindset, i.e. the mental willingness, to form contingency plans for using these weapons in this manner, and then for actually using them.

Do we have this toughness? Honestly, I don't know, but if China thinks we do, they will never take their aggression that far to put us to the test.
You need a bit more than mindset. You need some laws-of-physics bending to achieve a Shaurya launch from a Su-30

The BrahMos is < 3 tons. The Shaurya is > 6 tons. No pylon in the IAF's inventory can lug a 6 ton missile around
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