Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

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Rakesh
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Rakesh »

So finally confirmed!

https://twitter.com/ShivAroor/status/15 ... O-t3Btr4VA ---> BREAKING: Lt Gen Manoj Pande named India's next Chief of the Army Staff. He is from the Corps of Engineers. Takes over at the end of this month with the retirement of General MM Naravane.

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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Rakesh »

vimal
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by vimal »

I hope he brings deeper partnerships with domestic MIC and aatmnirbharta.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Guddu »

His skills would be very useful in taking back POK. Of late, I am getting the impression that everything is moving in that direction....
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ks_sachin »

We have more important challenges in AHQ than Atmanirbhar and PoK folks.
There is existential angst about one of these and it was in the news.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Manish_Sharma »

@rathorekaran17:

#Tourofduty
A thread on bringing in #Tourofduty concept into the armed forces without doing a deep dive into the possible ramifications and without tying up all loose ends .

Background
1. Prior to independence in the British Indian Army colour service gor a sepoy was 7 years.

Following which the sepoys were released from the army with a reserve liability. The British had an informal system that worked, wherein the centre commandant or CO would write to the Distt admin or concerned State for re employment of the retiring soldier and it was honoured.

So this informal system ensured all retiring pers desirous of getting a job got one. The British ensured that.
2. Post independence, govts coming to power kept increasing the colour service. It was a demand from the rank and file, and had deep political connotations.

Finally it came to be that the govt ordained all ranks will serve above 15 years and hence were all pensionable. The pension bill incr considerably. The pendulum had swung the other way. Now the Govt was pressing the armed forces to reduce pension bill.

3. There are various factors at work in this imbroglio. First the pressing need to keep the armed forces young. This is in steep contrast with all other govt jobs or CAPFs and police jobs where pers serve upto 60 years across the board.

Secondly was the pressing need to resettle the retiring service pers who on account of different terms of service are retired at a young age starting at 35 years. As stated earlier the British had a functional informal system to do so.

Post independence, the govt seized of the problem directed reservation of 12.5 and 15 percent in all govt jobs, incl police and CAPF to resettle ESM.
As is typical of this nation, there is a yawning gap between theory and practice.

The present rate of absorption of ESM in Govt jobs at the centre and states incl the police and CAPFs varies between 0.2 to 2 percent. Surprisingly even police and CAPFs don't want ESM. And the few that they induct, are inducted at the bottom of the rung

with no cognisance given to the experience, training and competence of the ESM. The ESM find it extremely humiliating. In fact in most states the ESM joining the police are made to undergo the recruit training along with new recruits all over again, Ditto for CAPFs.

We really seem to have bid goodbye to our good sense. These decisions are being taken by officers of these forces. Of course @adgpi maintains a stand offish attitude and has failed to intervene at the appropriate levels.

So as things stand today, there is formidable angst in the ESM for the step motherly treatment being handed out after demobbing them at young age of 35-40 years, whereas all others serve till 60; and even more importantly failing to ensure the 12.5 and 15 percentage job

Reservation commitment is fulfilled wherein the could serve again with dignity and assurance covered by well drafted rules .
In context of the #Tourofduty now being contemplated this will aggravate an already adverse situation with very serious consequences for the nation.

So we would be well served to carry out an in depth analysis before jumping ship, and by letting the tail wag the dog, wherein to fulfill the demand to reduce pensions, we tinker with fundamentals of the services and also create conditions which have possible disastrous effects.

To amplify.
The #Touroffuty pers will be released after3/5/7 years of service with no assurance ( except on paper) of re employment or reabsorbtion in Govt service. So we will have hundreds of thousands of youth, thrown out of service at age below 30 with no future in sight

Lack of suitable absorption will lead to intense frustration towards the society and govt for having neglected them. These are all trained soldiers. It will have deep repercussions on the stability and peace of the society, simply stated.
It will have a cascading effect.

The angst in #Tourofduty pers will find reflection in the serving pers of the army. It will have serious repercussions. Hopefully @adgpi will examine it in depth and NOT come under pressure of the govt/bureaucratic establishment who don't have to handle the baby.

So what's the way out. Well the following is suggested.
1. Ensure such terms of service that those pers desirous of serving on, are assured emp in CAPFs/ police/ govt jobs with protected service and pay.

Lobbies that have thwarted this sound concept thus far must be ruthlessly dealt with.
2.We must close the loop. You can't enroll a young man in the Services at 18 years and at 22-27 years age tell him to fend for himself. Throw him to the wolves. Repercussions will be serious.

https://twitter.com/rathorekaran17/stat ... BPddw&s=19
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ks_sachin »

Who is @adgpi?
The ADGPI I know is the Additional Directorate General of Public Information.
Who says this has not been or is being discussed threadbare with the issues highlighted.
But there is political pressure and ultimately the Armed Forces are subservient to the government.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Rakesh »

ks_sachin wrote:Who is @adgpi?
The ADGPI I know is the Additional Directorate General of Public Information.
Who says this has not been or is being discussed threadbare with the issues highlighted.
But there is political pressure and ultimately the Armed Forces are subservient to the government.
That ADGPI onlee Sirjee, which manages the official twitter account of the Indian Army.

https://twitter.com/adgpi
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ks_sachin »

Rakesh wrote:
ks_sachin wrote:Who is @adgpi?
The ADGPI I know is the Additional Directorate General of Public Information.
Who says this has not been or is being discussed threadbare with the issues highlighted.
But there is political pressure and ultimately the Armed Forces are subservient to the government.
That ADGPI onlee Sirjee, which manages the official twitter account of the Indian Army.

https://twitter.com/adgpi
Rakesh I was referring to this para from Manish’ post
The angst in #Tourofduty pers will find reflection in the serving pers of the army. It will have serious repercussions. Hopefully @adgpi will examine it in depth and NOT come under pressure of the govt/bureaucratic establishment who don't have to handle the baby.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ramana »

ks_sachin wrote:We have more important challenges in AHQ than Atmanirbhar and PoK folks.
There is existential angst about one of these and it was in the news.
Please elaborate.
Thanks, ramana
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ks_sachin »

ramana wrote:
ks_sachin wrote:We have more important challenges in AHQ than Atmanirbhar and PoK folks.
There is existential angst about one of these and it was in the news.
Please elaborate.
Thanks, ramana
Sir,

The pension bill is becoming a huge part of the defence budget and especially so for the Army. One proposal to reduce it is to do recruitment on a contract basis (3 to 5 yrs) and then release.

The plan is to recruit on contract and then retain a % based on a number of parameters with the rest let go with a lump sum payment after the contract ends.

Obviously, this has huge implications and the predictable "Rona dhona". However, ultimately the decision is political and there is the political impetus behind this even if AhQ would not like to see this happen.

One of the issues that Armed Forces leaders now have to contend with is that decisions are being taken for them because they have not been on the front foot with addressing organisational issues (this is just my comment by the way). 3 and 4-star officers have to see beyond their noses. Otherwise then provide an open invitation to the bureaucrats to dip their toes in decision making.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Pratyush »

ks_sachin wrote:
ramana wrote:
Please elaborate.
Thanks, ramana
Sir,

Snip....

One of the issues that Armed Forces leaders now have to contend with is that decisions are being taken for them because they have not been on the front foot with addressing organisational issues (this is just my comment by the way). 3 and 4-star officers have to see beyond their noses. Otherwise then provide an open invitation to the bureaucrats to dip their toes in decision making.


I guess that this is what Vidur is also seeing and has pointed out in one of his posts in a different thread as evidence of defensive thinking.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ks_sachin »

I think there is a difference here Ramana. What Vidur is talking about is a risk-averse culture that is seeping in and that has a direct bearing on operations.
What I am talking about is a propensity in the armed forces to blame everything on politicians and bureaucrats and not taking concrete actions and taking the lead.
For example, the pension bill has been known for a while but where in the Army has there been a serious focus on technology investment to bring down the tooth to tail ratio. One way of bringing down the bill is to find ways to do more with less. Why do we need to have men posted at godforsaken places if technology can help us reduce the risk - I don't know if it is possible but the armed forces should be leading the charge on this.
Why was there myopia in supporting domestic industry so that more of the defence budget could be used for capital acquisition? After all, if we bought an arty gun for a 1mill $ from overseas and we get the same for $200K then there is a saving of $800K and we can get 5 guns.
Do we need so many Lt Generals / Maj Generals?
Every chief seems to have his pet project rather than looking at the bigger picture and looking at institutional changes.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/manupubby/status/15 ... osfrfffW2A ---> Good news for Indian defence manufacturers. Defence ministry has exceeded its target to spend capital budget on Indian suppliers in 2021-22. Rs 75,140 crore spent on Indian sources. Rs 39,770 crore on foreign sources. Target was 64% of budget on Indian companies, achieved 65.50%.

https://twitter.com/manupubby/status/15 ... osfrfffW2A ---> Most interesting budget utilization numbers for 2021-22 are from the Army. General Naravane has managed to spend 82 percent of the Army’s capital budget on domestic weapons suppliers.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Anoop »

https://youtu.be/KdXxFaz5a8Q

Calls out the problems of drawing the wrong lessons from the Russia-Ukraine war. And the problems with proposed Tour of Duty model.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ks_sachin »

Anoop wrote:https://youtu.be/KdXxFaz5a8Q

Calls out the problems of drawing the wrong lessons from the Russia-Ukraine war. And the problems with proposed Tour of Duty model.
Any solutions to how we decrease pension bill?
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Anoop »

Any solutions to how we decrease pension bill?
Did you watch it, to the end?
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by kit »



Why the Tank will be THE Tank !

this video is also useful in understanding the huge amounts (running into thousand or so every week) of anti tank missiles uke using against Russian tanks and the results per se.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ks_sachin »

Anoop wrote:
Any solutions to how we decrease pension bill?
Did you watch it, to the end?
I have been sitting with retired offrs and got fed up of the ‘’this won’t work and that won’t work’’. Sometimes I wonder whether they r divorced from reality. So don’t expect constructive options. If this video has it then I will watch it.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Yagnasri »

How many people do we take for Para Military forces per year? How many armed constabularies did we take per year in each state? If we can handle all of them from the armed forces after the service of say 5/7 years, then no pension + trained personnel will be taken in with little additional cost for mainly reorientation purposes etc. CISF, CISF, BSF, RAF, Railway security etc etc etc so many forces are there which can take trained personnel from armed forces into their ranks.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ramana »

ks_sachin wrote:
Anoop wrote:
Did you watch it, to the end?
I have been sitting with retired offrs and got fed up of the ‘’this won’t work and that won’t work’’. Sometimes I wonder whether they r divorced from reality. So don’t expect constructive options. If this video has it then I will watch it.

Its Ok. They are like neti, neti!
Not this, not that!
Eventually will get to what is this and that.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ramana »

Yagnasri wrote:How many people do we take for Para Military forces per year? How many armed constabularies did we take per year in each state? If we can handle all of them from the armed forces after the service of say 5/7 years, then no pension + trained personnel will be taken in with little additional cost for mainly reorientation purposes etc. CISF, CISF, BSF, RAF, Railway security etc etc etc so many forces are there which can take trained personnel from armed forces into their ranks.
In the BIA, color service was 7 years. with the proviso, the ex-servicemen will get other jobs.
Color service got extended quite a lot.

The problem is not bad as is made out to be by activists.

Many of my college mates retired at Col rank and went into teaching and administration jobs in State govts.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Adrija »

How many people do we take for Para Military forces per year? How many armed constabularies did we take per year in each state? If we can handle all of them from the armed forces after the service of say 5/7 years, then no pension + trained personnel will be taken in with little additional cost for mainly reorientation purposes etc. CISF, CISF, BSF, RAF, Railway security etc etc etc so many forces are there which can take trained personnel from armed forces into their ranks.
Just a few thoughts:
1. Let us break the ex-servicemen into ranks and officers, as the likely deployment considerations, numbers and scenarios are very different
2. The simpler one is for the Officers- they can be considered for lateral entry into the bureacracy (where we are facing a severe shortage anyways), or sponsored for (say MBA or any post-graduate program globally in lieu of pension) and then encouraged to go into public sector or even private sector. The find employment easily, and in fact AMZN actually prefers them.. so surely not a problem. The numbers are also small
3. The bigger challenge is for the ranks.
3a. Lateral entry into CPOs, or Armed Constabulary, or police, is a bit problematic as there is need to similar, or just marginally more relaxed, age profile as that of the Defense forces.
3b. Instead, may I subnit that we could consider them for an area where we are crying for lack of trained manpower, which is local self governance bodies (urban management/ village panchayats), teachers etc. That would solve for what is our biggest societal eye sore today and where the problem is as much of human managerial capabilities as it is of politics (state governments generally do not want vibrant local self-government bodies)

The biggest challenge, however, is that Armed forces are central government employees, whereas state constabularies/ state police, or even local government agencies, are all state governments.. transfer of employment from central to state is not something that is easily achievable in our current set up. But IMHO there is no other real solution long term for the pension problem

My 2paise and all that
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ks_sachin »

Adrija wrote:
How many people do we take for Para Military forces per year? How many armed constabularies did we take per year in each state? If we can handle all of them from the armed forces after the service of say 5/7 years, then no pension + trained personnel will be taken in with little additional cost for mainly reorientation purposes etc. CISF, CISF, BSF, RAF, Railway security etc etc etc so many forces are there which can take trained personnel from armed forces into their ranks.
Just a few thoughts:
1. Let us break the ex-servicemen into ranks and officers, as the likely deployment considerations, numbers and scenarios are very different
2. The simpler one is for the Officers- they can be considered for lateral entry into the bureacracy (where we are facing a severe shortage anyways), or sponsored for (say MBA or any post-graduate program globally in lieu of pension) and then encouraged to go into public sector or even private sector. The find employment easily, and in fact AMZN actually prefers them.. so surely not a problem. The numbers are also small
3. The bigger challenge is for the ranks.
3a. Lateral entry into CPOs, or Armed Constabulary, or police, is a bit problematic as there is need to similar, or just marginally more relaxed, age profile as that of the Defense forces.
3b. Instead, may I subnit that we could consider them for an area where we are crying for lack of trained manpower, which is local self governance bodies (urban management/ village panchayats), teachers etc. That would solve for what is our biggest societal eye sore today and where the problem is as much of human managerial capabilities as it is of politics (state governments generally do not want vibrant local self-government bodies)

The biggest challenge, however, is that Armed forces are central government employees, whereas state constabularies/ state police, or even local government agencies, are all state governments.. transfer of employment from central to state is not something that is easily achievable in our current set up. But IMHO there is no other real solution long term for the pension problem

My 2paise and all that
The 3 to 5 yr contract proposal is only for Jawans.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Anoop »

So it looks like nobody watched the discussion I linked - after all, BRF is ahead of the curve :roll:. So here's a partial recap:

1. A Tour of Duty concept puts the Army into a perpetual training cycle to replace lost talent. There are no regimental or training facilities (space, equipment, manpower) available to handle these training needs. This does not even take into account the deployment state in COIN.

2. A largely conscript core severely compromises operational efficiency, as seen in the Russian side. The Ukranian side is fighting for dear life and the country is devastated as they trade space for time. This approach is not acceptable in the Indian doctrine.

3. Manpower rationalization can be achieved to some extent by outsourcing civil jobs like housing construction, cantonment upkeep etc on contract basis and reducing the permanent civilian cadre employed, like MES.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ArjunPandit »

might be suited more for strat thread...so mods please feel free to move
1. demilitarization of indian society: india has been systematically demilitarized, with the trend being accelerated since 80s when other jobs were available in large no.s., to the extent that there is a trivialization of war fighting efforts. Modi talked once about what it entails fighting a war, e.g., black outs etc...also, there is general aversion to "organized" violence in majority as compared to another community.
2. potential long period war: In a total war, even a large army would be stretched and we will have to act at some point or another in case there is ww3. In such cases, it helps to have semi trained people who are equipped.
Could point 1 be taken by police reforms? or NCC or something else???
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by SinghS »

ArjunPandit wrote:might be suited more for strat thread...so mods please feel free to move
1. demilitarization of indian society: india has been systematically demilitarized, with the trend being accelerated since 80s when other jobs were available in large no.s., to the extent that there is a trivialization of war fighting efforts. Modi talked once about what it entails fighting a war, e.g., black outs etc...also, there is general aversion to "organized" violence in majority as compared to another community.
The reasons are simple:
1. Majority community is of the view of why to sacrifice and for whom to sacrifice when the ecosystem is not supportive and corrupt.

War fighting requires soldiers and to be a soldier is to be a man of principles. A soldier requires a society which respects them and allows them to maintain their principles in the civilian life. Molding kids into soldier starts from very young age and society plays a very important role in it. Our society and politicians are missing this crucial aspect and also messing with it.

Our soldering is currently running due to less employment opportunity and long time tradition of the hinterland. The more we fragment the society based upon the cast, religion, community & reservation and allow bureaucracy to undermine services, the more difficult it would be to maintain quality of the forces.

The tour of duty proposal smacks like a cannon fodder being looked for by the politicians.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by ks_sachin »

Anoop wrote:So it looks like nobody watched the discussion I linked - after all, BRF is ahead of the curve :roll:. So here's a partial recap:

1. A Tour of Duty concept puts the Army into a perpetual training cycle to replace lost talent. There are no regimental or training facilities (space, equipment, manpower) available to handle these training needs. This does not even take into account the deployment state in COIN.

2. A largely conscript core severely compromises operational efficiency, as seen in the Russian side. The Ukranian side is fighting for dear life and the country is devastated as they trade space for time. This approach is not acceptable in the Indian doctrine.

3. Manpower rationalization can be achieved to some extent by outsourcing civil jobs like housing construction, cantonment upkeep etc on contract basis and reducing the permanent civilian cadre employed, like MES.
Anoop there is political pressure to get the this done. A detailed study including all downsides has been submitted to GOI. Army is subservient to the government.
Army has brought it on itself by not being proactive and addressing manpower domain in all its dimensions.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by shaun »

Anoop wrote:So it looks like nobody watched the discussion I linked - after all, BRF is ahead of the curve :roll:. So here's a partial recap:

1. A Tour of Duty concept puts the Army into a perpetual training cycle to replace lost talent. There are no regimental or training facilities (space, equipment, manpower) available to handle these training needs. This does not even take into account the deployment state in COIN.

2. A largely conscript core severely compromises operational efficiency, as seen in the Russian side. The Ukranian side is fighting for dear life and the country is devastated as they trade space for time. This approach is not acceptable in the Indian doctrine.

3. Manpower rationalization can be achieved to some extent by outsourcing civil jobs like housing construction, cantonment upkeep etc on contract basis and reducing the permanent civilian cadre employed, like MES.

Yes this MES is the low hanging fruits , civilian part should be the 1st to be separated and merged with other civil departments. True reform will come if these departments under departments are dismantled and let military maintain their own base , cantonment etc . Their corps of engineers and other clerical posts can very well look after that job. These civilian entities eat a greater pie of the MOD resources . These are British legacy and should be dismantled ASAP , no more relevant in today's world .

Defence Ministry abolishes 9,304 military engineering service posts
The proposal of abolition of 9,304 posts in military engineering services out of the total 13,157 vacancies of the basic and industrial staff was approved by Defence Minister Rajnath Singh

https://www.businesstoday.in/jobs/story ... 2020-05-07

Good initiative but let's see whether those posts actually abolished or road blocked by babus
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by eklavya »

General Manoj Pande takes charge as Army Chief:

https://indianexpress.com/article/india ... f-7894829/

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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by eklavya »

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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by eklavya »

https://twitter.com/ANI/status/15206818 ... mes.com%2F

We are very clear that we will not permit any change in the status quo and any loss of territory: Army Chief General Manoj Pande to ANI on the India-China border issue
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by mody »

Desi defence start-up helps Army go off decades-long dependence on imported cold-weather gear
https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/other/de ... 20557a584a

Extreme cold weather clothing now being offered by Indian private sector company. Better and cheaper than imported alternatives. The defense sector being opened up for the Indian private sector is bearing fruits. Hopefully we will have many such success stories in the years to come.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Thakur_B »

mody wrote: Desi defence start-up helps Army go off decades-long dependence on imported cold-weather gear
https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/other/de ... 20557a584a

Extreme cold weather clothing now being offered by Indian private sector company. Better and cheaper than imported alternatives. The defense sector being opened up for the Indian private sector is bearing fruits. Hopefully we will have many such success stories in the years to come.
We have at any given time in excess of 50K troops that require these clothes. For the last 50 years or so. That's a bigger market than entire global mountaineering community. Yet we continued to import these.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Manish_P »

Thakur_B wrote:
mody wrote:...

Extreme cold weather clothing now being offered by Indian private sector company. Better and cheaper than imported alternatives. The defense sector being opened up for the Indian private sector is bearing fruits. Hopefully we will have many such success stories in the years to come.
We have at any given time in excess of 50K troops that require these clothes. For the last 50 years or so. That's a bigger market than entire global mountaineering community. Yet we continued to import these.
If the powers-that-were had understood that simple sentence then we would have long been exporters and not importers

Then again may be they have always understood it but didn't (or couldn't) act against the entrenched import lobby
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by sum »

With the Army confident about the product, they have re-ordered the indigenous ECWCS, rather than importing it from Switzerland, Vietnam or even Sri Lanka, as they earlier used to do.
Sri Lanka and Vietnam... :roll: :roll:
Downright sad as to the state of affairs all these years
Vips
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Vips »

The (Con)gress eco-system systematically nurtured to generate kick-offs in every purchase/contract.
Manish_P
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Manish_P »

Request for assistance of a veteran, by a veteran (Shri Vikas Manhas)

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The mobile number of the veteran Shri Jithu R is 9048539457
(for easy transfer to account via mobile/UPI)

Link on twitter - Link
Sachin
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Sachin »

Yagnasri wrote:How many armed constabularies did we take per year in each state?
This is not an answer to your question. But for many states police recruitment is also one way to placate the people of the state. These recruitments are often tom-tommed as the government's love to the state's people and providing them job opportunities. So states will not be very happy to keep aside a percentage of vacancies for ESMs. Some states (like KL) do employ ESMs in some risky jobs like BDDS teams, where ESMs would have prior experience.
Adrija wrote:transfer of employment from central to state is not something that is easily achievable in our current set up.
It is not a very difficult task - even administration wise - provided the state government has the right intent. The state government's Public Service Commission generally calls for candidates with military background for a clearly defined number of vacancies. And they have to clear the recruitment tests etc, and then the selected candidates move into the state service. Only tricky area seems to be the pensions, as I don't think a person is entitled for two pensions at the same time. In southern states I have also seen lot of ESM who start appearing for PSC exams when they are in the 14th of 15th year of service. And they land up in state government jobs right after they come out of the defence force. Air Force NCOs seems to be the champions in this ;).
Anoop wrote: A Tour of Duty concept puts the Army into a perpetual training cycle to replace lost talent.
Was talking about this with an ex-I.A officer. He obviously was not happy with this "Tour of Duty" scheme. It takes around 9 months to make a soldier. And then his services can only be retained for another 4 years and 3 months. Secondly, these soliders also undergo regular "in service" training courses. All those efforts would go waste if a soldier is planning to quit in next 3-4 years. Another disturbing fact is that, India may also see a situation of lots of unemployed men in the age of 25-30 years who are also weapon trained and would be even knowing how the government machinery works against terror groups etc. Some of the smarter terror groups can actually send in their good candidates for "tour of duty" and kind of out source the entire to Weapon Trainings and Tactical trainings to the Indian Army :P.
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Re: Indian Army News & Discussion - 23 March 2021

Post by Rakesh »

‘Myths busted, need for hard power reinforced’: Top Indian Army officer shares learnings from Russia-Ukraine war
https://www.timesnownews.com/india/myth ... e-91762516
24 May 2022
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