Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

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bala
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by bala »

Baikul wrote:
titash wrote: Since when has the "will of the people" ever mattered in real life?
Many times IMHO. This may sound like a cheap shot, but India’s fight for independence?
OT:
The Brits left India after bankrupting the Indian Exchequer for WW-II expenses (payable to the USA). India's fight for independence was a side show for the Brits and a means to saddle their version of transition by thrusting leaders groomed by them. Another factor was the mutiny staged by the Indians in Indian/British Navy of India.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

https://twitter.com/GhalebM0nz1i7/statu ... 5516947456

embedded video
Russian Tupolev Tu-95 are conduct joint air patrols with Chinese aircraft in the Asia-Pacific region.
"Asia-Pacific"
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by titash »

Pratyush wrote:
Baikul wrote:

Many times IMHO. This may sound like a cheap shot, but India’s fight for independence?

People's voices are heard only when all other options have been totally exhausted. Not one minute before that.

If Britain had an option. India would not have gotten independent. Regardless of what the people were saying.
+100

Baikul-ji,

If England wasn't weakened severely during WWII and humbled militarily during the Battle of France, Dunkirk, Singapore, Force Z, etc...it wouldn't have any incentive to withdraw from India (or from East of Suez for that matter during the 1960s). It was a strategic decision to run down the Royal Navy from 1960 to 2000 and use that money for other things because there was no longer an empire to pay the bills

The "will of the people" as expressed during the Indian Freedom Struggle (and even today with Babri/Gyanvapi) was really the culmination of 1000 years of Islamic Rule (suppressing said "will of the people") and 200 years of British Rule (again suppressing said "will of the people") and 70 years of Lutyens/Pseudo-secular Rule (yet again suppressing said "will of the people")

Let's not forget that Britain was a "democratic country" when they presided over the world's largest colonial empire. The USA was a "democratic country" that legally enabled slavery & civil rights apartheid. The question is which fraction of the people enjoys said democracy and which fraction of the people are left out of it
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Baikul »

Hungary has declared an emergency, citing among intent things the Russia Ukraine war.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... ar-economy
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Deans »

KrishnaK wrote:d, whether because of your exposure to Russia or the forum's slant, to assign all responsibility for Russia's current predicament to the US. This entirely ignores the threat perception of central/eastern European and Baltic states. No one compelled Russia to remain unattractive as partner whether it was politically or economically. Those were choices that Putin made.

This was what Russia was facing with the largest nuclear arsenal in the world. This is excluding facts like Germany and much of EU continuing to buy gas from Russia inspite of US warnings.

Russian logic behind its perception of the NATO threat is precisely the same as Pakistan's perception of India. One that must be accepted as self evident truth and repeated ad-nauseam as justification for one entity's monopoly over the country's political scene and its resources. There's other comparisons with Pakistan as well - Russia sees itself as not getting the respect it deserves. Its GDP is a measly 1.5 trln. Barely larger than Australia or Canada.

Funnily enough the claims of Russian victory being made here mirror Pakistan's about the wars its won. Putin has miscalculated badly. Oh and btw, it isn't Ukraine that's radicalized, it's Russia.
Krishna ji, I think Cyrano ji has addressed your post, but let me add some points.
You make a relevant point about Germany. Russia has blamed US (not Germany or NATO) for what it sees as its attempts to surround Russia with hostile states and attempt regime change. We may not agree with Russia's POV, but India didn't lose 15% of its population in a war, so our views, or any other country's, are not relevant in understanding what drives Russia's security compulsions.

Russia has not threatened any NATO state. If it wanted to, it could have invaded any of the Baltics in a day (or occupied non NATO state, Georgia).
In the year preceding the Ukraine invasion, US attempted regime change in Kazakhstan and Belarus and supplied arms (through NATO) and training to Ukraine at an unprecedented level.

That said, I think Putin failed to plan adequately for the invasion as he possibly believed it would be a repeat of Crimea. US made the same mistake in estimating the force required to control Iraq and Afghanistan, so it's not that Putin was singularly incompetent. Russia is a corrupt and inefficient dictatorship. That has probably exacerbated the problem it faces. Ukraine is the same, but had decided to go with the US agenda.

Both sides have made exaggerated claims on the other sides losses. What is verifiable is that every day Russia controls more Ukrainian territory than they did the previous day and that Ukraine's army and economy is damaged more than Russia's (given Ukraine's lower GDP).
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Nihat »

What are the long term implications of this war on Russia. Ukraine is a big country and rus is not aiming to occupy it fully. Will it cause a decades long insurgency and permanent headache for Russia, fuelled by some very powerful nations. All these war crimes being committed, surely there will be an impact and western nations will take advantage for years to come.

Already Russia is considered no more than a regional power and has basically nothing to its economy other than energy and soviet era defense sector. If energy reliance is cut and it keeps losing its edge and market in the Def sector, what will be left of Russia in 20 years. A vast landscape will minimal influence in the world.

I expect that India too will be a far more superior technological, cultural and economic powerhouse compared to Russia.

This needless war is only going to drive the decline of the country further
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Vayutuvan »

Nihat wrote: If energy reliance is cut ...
There is in lies the problem. How to cut energy reliance on fossil fuels? By declaring "that Americans have to go through an incredible transition" a la Biden?!
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Shanmukh »

Nihat wrote:What are the long term implications of this war on Russia. Ukraine is a big country and rus is not aiming to occupy it fully. Will it cause a decades long insurgency and permanent headache for Russia, fuelled by some very powerful nations. All these war crimes being committed, surely there will be an impact and western nations will take advantage for years to come.
Ukraine is pretty much hated in eastern Ukraine - these people are Russian. There is no great anti-Russian activity in Novorossiya. If the Russians keep to Donbas, Kherson, and may be Kharkov, Zaporozhie, and Odessa, they won't face any significant insurgency. OTOH, if they expand westwards into Sumy, Dnepropetrovsk, etc, there may be resistance. There are significant Ukrainean populations there.

As for war crimes, Ukraineans have perpetrated more crimes in Novorossiya there in the last 8 years than anyone else. Very few will agree to die for Ukraine or NATO. The few die-hard Ukrainean nationalists and partisans will be outnumbered 100:1 in Novorossiya.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Pratyush »

I think that river Don is the natural boundary for the Ukrainian's. East of Don is predominantly Russian speaking. So the endgame would be a defacto division of the country.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Deans »

Pratyush wrote:I think that river Don is the natural boundary for the Ukrainian's. East of Don is predominantly Russian speaking. So the endgame would be a defacto division of the country.
Donets & Luhansk are majority Russian. Zaparozhye, Kharkiv and Kherson have a significant Russian minority. However, a lot of Ukrainians in those 3 districts have not voted for the more right wing/ Polish/catholic parties in Ukraine and favor friendly relations with Russia.
If Russia occupies the Donbass, the area between the Don and Donbass is almost indefensible. If Russia occupies Kherson, they have a springboard west of the Don and can also impose a blockade of the Ukraine coast even if they don't occupy Odessa.
Last edited by Deans on 25 May 2022 19:24, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Cyrano »

The Russian occupied territories aren't going back to Ukraine. Russia spent many lives to capture them, and given the atrocities Kiev sanctioned militias have perpetrated there for 8+ years, no people there want to be part of Ukraine.

As for the rest to the center and the west - their fate is a lot less clear. Russia will not find it easy to occupy them or retain them. Plus it wants a buffer zone between its new borders and NATO (Poland, Romania etc). Its in this context that Kiev-Poland collusion and agreements change the equations in some fundamental ways.

It doesn't bother the west that such sovereignty and destiny altering agreements are being entered into by Kiev in a war emergency period, bypassing all need for wider consultation, plebiscite etc. Of course for Kiev, remote controlled by US, such unilateral actions with no accountability to its people are nothing new. (I've stopped calling it Ukrainian Govt and will only refer to it as Kiev regime here on.)

I see signs that Poland is jumping into the fray quite enthusiastically to efface borders and governance with Kiev, they haven't consulted anyone within Poland either. So we now have Axis powers Ukr+Poland backed by the US. With Germany vacillating and France clearly distancing itself gradually. Baltic states will get their 15 minutes of fame for joining NATO and not much else except Russia's ire and quadrupling energy bills.

What this Axis will set out to do is not yet clear. Is it a desperate move to try and stall Russia's victory in Donbas and when that inevitably happens, this Axis will dissipate -OR- will it continue to fester in what's left of Ukraine and try to harass Russia at grave danger to itself, remains to be seen.

Russia will be hugely boosted by capturing Donbas - its image in the non-International community will become very strong, Putin & his govt will be more popular than ever, and will be able to dictate what should happen next with Ukraine, Baltic states and NATO.

Russia hasn't yet used its plethora of military and (not very) civil options to get back and punish the west. It may actually go easy, because if you step back and look at it, if US didn't run the Maidan and start the civil war in Ukraine and pushed all that followed, Russia would have slumbered on rather aimlessly with diminishing influence and stature, and wouldn't have become the sharp, dynamic, rejuvenated fighter its become now. And for that it can only thank the US !
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Nihat »

Vayutuvan wrote:
Nihat wrote: If energy reliance is cut ...
There is in lies the problem. How to cut energy reliance on fossil fuels? By declaring "that Americans have to go through an incredible transition" a la Biden?!
Americans are hardly great consumers of Russian energy. It's the European population and it all depends on the efforts of EU to cut use of Russian energy. The transition to green energy will become much more intense. I'm not sure if Russia has an abundance of lithium, cobalt, etc. but fossil demand will keep on reducing.

Declining fertility rates, declining influence and losing key markets such as defense and energy to the west. I fear for what might become of Russia in a bipolar world dominated by China and USA
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Nihat »

Cyrano wrote:
Russia will be hugely boosted by capturing Donbas - its image in the non-International community will become very strong, Putin & his govt will be more popular than ever, and will be able to dictate what should happen next with Ukraine, Baltic states and NATO.

Russia hasn't yet used its plethora of military and (not very) civil options to get back and punish the west. It may actually go easy, because if you step back and look at it, if US didn't run the Maidan and start the civil war in Ukraine and pushed all that followed, Russia would have slumbered on rather aimlessly with diminishing influence and stature, and wouldn't have become the sharp, dynamic, rejuvenated fighter its become now. And for that it can only thank the US !
This sounds more hopeful than anything else.

Russia is on a downward spiral regardless, it's economy will continue to decline and western sanctions will not help. This war is not suddenly going to make them gain influence, quite the contrary rather. From our perspective, it makes Russia a China dependent state, which is so much worse. The deficiencies of its defense equipment have been exposed and that's another alarm bells moment for us.

It would be really good to see Russia emerge as a strong global power but its decline into a marginal regional power seems inevitable. It needs a far more pragmatic and level headed leader than putin, who at times displays the strategic genius level thinking on par with the pukes
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Cyrano »

The transition to green energy will become much more intense. I'm not sure if Russia has an abundance of lithium, cobalt, etc. but fossil demand will keep on reducing.
It would enlighten us if you can back up this assertion with any facts & figures, studies etc. From all that I've learnt, there is no decrease in demand for fossil energy anywhere in the world, nor forecast. Its actually quite the opposite. There is an acceleration of demand as developing countries are consuming more and more as they pull themselves out of poverty, and developed countries continue to consume evermore, all the greenwashing doesnt alter this fact.

We aren't even talking about the REAL ABSOLUTE energy consumption of the west, including the energy needed to produce, transport, and finally recycle all the products they source from cheap mfg countries mostly in Asia. Haven't counted the energy needed for its agri imports from all over the world, a significant portion of them used to feed meat animals, and careless food wastage that could feed all the hungry in the world many times over.

But perhaps you have data and insights I don't. So please do share.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Cyrano »

Nihat bahi,
Assertions are fine, even my great grandmother can make them. Substantiating with well laid out arguments will make it interesting. Else its just your word against mine and we're none the wiser.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Deans »

Sanctions will hit Russia hard, but will also hit the West (everyone in NATO, barring US and Canada who don't import energy and food).
In my opinion however, they won't hit Russia to a point where there is a revolution/coup, which brings the regime change desired by the West,
or even causes Putin to seek talks to end the war, before he achieves his military aims.

Question is weather EU or Russia will fold first. Given the history of sacrifice of the Russian people, I'm not betting it will be Russia.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Rakesh »

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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Deans »

Nihat wrote: It would be really good to see Russia emerge as a strong global power but its decline into a marginal regional power seems inevitable. It needs a far more pragmatic and level headed leader than putin, who at times displays the strategic genius level thinking on par with the pukes
In my opinion, Putin has been around for far too long. His govt is a corrupt and inefficient dictatorship. That said, he has achieved the following for Russia's national security:
1. Ended the Chechen war with a friendly govt in Chechnya (West intention was to make it Russia's Afghanistan 2.0/ Iraq.)
2. Successful intervention in Georgia.
3. Liberation of Crimea without firing a shot.
4. Successful intervention in the Donbass, forcing the Minsk agreement.
5. Successful intervention in Syria to protect his ally (when the US abandoned their allies in the region).
6. Intervened to prevent regime change in Kazakhstan and Belarus.
7. Govt of Mali asked the French to leave and outsourced their security to the Wagner (PMC) group of Russia.

I think the planning for Ukraine was flawed, because it assumed the best case scenario and because Putin's style of management does not allow dissenting opinions. Even the above however, I would hesitate to say 'thinking on par with the Pukes'.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Pratyush »

I have been reading about the Russian history over the last century.

They lost WW1, when they gave up fighting Germany.

Won WW2 when in the first year they had suffered more losses in the first 2 years. As compared to the entire WW1. Yet they kept on fighting and ultimately marched into Berlin.

The Russians overthrew USSR when it became evident that communist regime was not able to meet it's promise. They spent 20 years comming out of the mess left behind by communism.

Given the lesson of history, if the Russian state has any sense of its place in the world. Will continue to fight untill it either prevails or is no longer able to contest.

Submission to US insanity is not an option.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Pratyush »

Nice, Poland is turning into a Pakistan for NATO.

I we weeks ago I was watching a program on you tube titled it time to bring Russia in from the cold. It was hosted by Nik Gowing, the old BBC news reader

It had a former Polish defence minister as a speaker.

Man, he was talking in terms of setting historical wrongs right. This was back in 2017.

If this is the attitude then Russians are justified in being concerned about NATO expansion.

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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

Deans wrote:Sanctions will hit Russia hard, but will also hit the West (everyone in NATO, barring US and Canada who don't import energy and food).
In my opinion however, they won't hit Russia to a point where there is a revolution/coup, which brings the regime change desired by the West,
or even causes Putin to seek talks to end the war, before he achieves his military aims.

Question is weather EU or Russia will fold first. Given the history of sacrifice of the Russian people, I'm not betting it will be Russia.
I doubt that these sanctions will hit Russia at all. Especially in the long run.

EU is bickering - DNA. (Anyone watched "The Guns of August"? The shorter, 10 minute video or the full 1 hour 40 min version or read the book? EU is exactly where she was pre-WW1 - Queen of England in place too).

The sanctions have failed - at least for the time being. It has hurt everyone but the Russians.

Finally, the call by the NYT and Uncle Henry for peace talks says it all.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Baikul »

NRao wrote:….

I doubt that these sanctions will hit Russia at all. Especially in the long run.

EU is bickering - DNA. (Anyone watched "The Guns of August"? …… or read the book?…

OT: It was among the two I read as a teenager that ignited my interest in military history, the other being A History Of The First World War by Basil Liddell Hart.

I had to look up that memorable opening paragraph of Tuchman’s:
So gorgeous was the spectacle on the May morning of 1910 when nine kings rode in the funeral of Edward VII of England that the crowd …. Together they represented seventy nations in the greatest assemblage of royalty and rank ever gathered in one place and, of its kind, the last……on history’s clock it was sunset, and the sun of the old world was setting in a dying blaze of splendor never to be seen again.
I’ll carry on before the bredators turn their attention my way. :D
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Vayutuvan »

Cyrano wrote:... finally recycle all the products ...
What is that? Strange word. Most electronics waste is very difficult to recycle where I live. There is no recycling facilities for KED bulbs, glass, mobile phones, TVs (unless one buys a new TV and pay $100 for the store to take away the old one), same with major appliances, no concept of repairing anything that is broken (integrated manufacturing, anyone?), on and on. More junk is being produced as we speak - windmills (how will those be recycled at the end of life?) will, solar panels (same problem).

Anyway OT.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

https://twitter.com/thesiriusreport/sta ... 3617904642
Lavrov:

West is calling on everyone to abide by the “rules-based order.” No one has seen these “rules” or participated in devising them. Our logical question as to why they are dissatisfied with the rules known as the UN Charter is not answered. But we know the answer.
Interesting that he uses the word "West"
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

Sad. However, I suspect this means Russia will provide the technical assistance that Motor Sich was providing to China.

New section: The Russian army destroyed the facilities of the "Motor Sich" factory in Zaporozhye
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

https://twitter.com/thesiriusreport/sta ... 4029997056
Delegations from over 90 countries have confirmed their participation in the 25th St. Petersburg International Economic Forum (SPIEF) in June.

Another example of how the WORLD supports Russia.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Roop »

NRao wrote:I doubt that these sanctions will hit Russia at all. Especially in the long run. ...
The sanctions have failed - at least for the time being. It has hurt everyone but the Russians.

Finally, the call by the NYT and Uncle Henry for peace talks says it all.
An excellent summary of the current military/political situation in Ukr.

I never understood the deranged predictions coming from "the West" about how Russia was getting its arse kicked by Ukr, how the Ukies were going to drive Russia out of Ukr and back to Moscow or whatever.

Based on what, exactly? Apart from wishful thinking and perhaps generous propaganda-funding from DupleeCitee, what else could lead to these predictions? It was all simply Putin Derangement Syndrome, or maybe Russia Derangement Syndrome coming from the Western media and dutifully parroted in various internet fora, including occasionally this one.

Look at the current state of affairs:
  • Russia had a strategic plan (a list of war aims) and announced it to the world in advance. These aims were: keep Ukr out of NATO and EU, neutralize it as a possible future military threat to Russia, implement the Minsk Agreement w.r.t. the Donetsk and Lugansk oblasts, establish a land bridge to Crimea, de-nazify Ukr (i.e. get rid of the Azov Brigade) and eliminate any threat of NATO capturing/taking over any part of the Ukr Black Sea coast.
  • Today, all of these aims have either been achieved or are about to be achieved. No one in his right mind doubts the eventual success of Russia's strategic plan.
  • True, Putin's tactical plan was faulty, in that he used insufficient force and ferocity in his initial assault, i.e. for the first few weeks. I think he underestimated his enemy, expecting things to go smoothly, as they did in Crimea. Shame on him for that; but, faulty initial tactics and all, he has achieved his strategic aims.
  • Byedenn/Bojo/Tusk/Elensky can huff and puff and pontificate all they want, but they can't change any of the above facts.
  • Finally, I've heard people say Putin is insane because he threatened to use nuclear weapons if NATO attacked Russia. In fact, I think the opposite is true -- he would have been foolish and derelict in his duty if he did not make the threat, because, make no mistake, Byedenn/Bojo/Tusk/Elensky would love to do a "shakinah" against Russia if they though they could get away with it.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Baikul »

Pratyush wrote:Nice, Poland is turning into a Pakistan for NATO.
….
You’re not kidding.

Polish President Duda just condemned Germany for not giving Poland their very best tanks free of cost.

https://www.politico.eu/article/polish- ... eliveries/

In short, Poland gave its 200 strong T -72 tank fleet to Ukraine. There was an in principal agreement amongst the NATO countries that Poland (and anyone who donated their Russian equipment to Ukraine) would be compensated.

However Poland wants the latest Leopold A7 tanks from Germany in compensation. Now Germany says it never promised the high end version of which it has only 50 anyway, but the older A4 was on the table.

Germany claims that the Poles are deliberately misinterpreting the agreement. Poland is claiming betrayal.

Others are claiming that Poland just wants to modernise its army green of cost.

Much rona dhona. :((
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by Cyrano »

<<<
Macron urged Erdogan to respect the sovereign choice of Finland and Sweden to join NATO, according to AFP. | #UkraineWar | #Russia | #Ukraine |
>>>
What about Turkey's sovereign right to use its veto I wonder ! Not just in NATO, if any country in EU tried to use its veto against the wishes of the three stooges, they will also face threats and intimidation.

Eeehai wokey bideshiyan tu dekh babua...
Democracy ki dagariyan tu dekh babua !
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by YashG »

If you will read 'Guns, germs & Steel' - Geography plays a major part in defining the character of a civilization.

Why are indians tolerant? because our fertile river valley never required us to be outward looking. We were the world's #1 or #2 GDP civilization till 17th century.

Imperialism was european character because their cold temperature meant , agriculture was never great and thats why they ended their dependence on agriculture the first.

Russia - never had access to hot water ports and weren't part of the trade routes, so they naturally became tenacious people. They could endure a lot of hardships. And like some of you have said - they came out on top in WW2 largely because of tenacity. Tenacity is russian civilizational value and that doesnt change easily. So you could expect russia to fight long and fight hard here. Now this is expected but some change that mayn't happen - tea leaves will be how russia shapes up the battle post donbas battles into zapho and odessa campaigns. Perhaps with some more war victories, it might become clear to global audience that russia is fighting like WW2. As that becomes clearer to west, you will see less intention to arm Ukraine and more intention to go back to BAU.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

Alex Christoforou and Alexander Mercouris reported that the West froze only $130 billion instead of $300 billions.

Brussels says about $24 bln of Russian central bank assets frozen in EU, less than expected
Last edited by NRao on 27 May 2022 02:36, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

few more observations, via Alex Christoforou and Alexander Mercouris:

* Russia has reduced its interest rates by 1%, to 11%
* Putin has increased pensions by 10%
* Putin has the largest budget surplus in Russian history
* India is buying "record" oil from Russia ----- via Greece. Suspect EU too is dipping into this new "pipeline"
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

https://twitter.com/s_m_marandi/status/ ... 9119236099
Now that Russia & Iran are both sanctioned by the US/EU, the 2 countries have decided to swiftly expand trade & investment in all fields. Developing the International North–South Transport Corridor has become a top priority for both countries.

The US/EU are isolating themselves.

Image

Image
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

After grabing, illegally, billions .... this prediction from the neoconservative

White House says Russia will likely default on debt; Belarus to send troops to Ukraine border
NRao
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

NRao
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

https://twitter.com/snarwani/status/1530219237146509313
Unconfirmed news that Iran has today seized two Greek ships in the Persian Gulf in retaliation for the seizure and theft this week of an Iranian oil cargo by Greece and the US
News was confirmed by Iranian state radio, that Iran has seized two Greek oil tankers
kit
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by kit »

What's Greece' s khujli with Iran ?
morem
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by morem »

I think it is historical e.g. the movie 300
NRao
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Re: Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

Post by NRao »

My understanding: The "Greek", in this drama, is only an oil tanker. Someone else (US?) stopped a passing (Iranian) tanker, someone connected the pipes between the two tankers, etc, and someone pushed the button to transfer the oil.
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