Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

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IndraD
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by IndraD »

Storm Shadow Disappoints, Ukraine’s Counter-Offensive Sputters As Russian Jets Decimate Zelensky’s Troops
https://eurasiantimes.com/storm-shadow- ... -sputters/
Deans
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Deans »

YashG wrote:The latest attack on Kiev...as reported went on for 5 Hours with 50+ drones.

Nothing was hit and all drones neutralised.

But im trying to figure out...why would russia send 50 + drones over five hours and not in shorter period and all at once if it really wanted to hit something... ?
$4 million per patriot missile to shoot down a $ 15k drone.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by chanakyaa »

YashG wrote:The latest attack on Kiev...as reported went on for 5 Hours with 50+ drones.

Nothing was hit and all drones neutralised.

But im trying to figure out...why would russia send 50 + drones over five hours and not in shorter period and all at once if it really wanted to hit something... ?
Despite @Deans saar's deep experience and knowledge, doesn't have latest and greatest. Ukraine's wild success was revealed by the First lady of Ukraine. Wish there was a positive news dhaaga.
"One woman saw a drone from her balcony and shot it down with a jar of tomatoes."

~ Olena Zelenska, First Lady of Ukraine in conversation with Hilary Clinton
https://twitter.com/ThePollLady/status/ ... 96?lang=en
On a serious note, several TG channels have reported Kiev being hit causing some infra damage..
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by mody »

https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/world/ba ... 5e76&ei=63

Bayraktar TB-2's have all but disappeared from the skies over Ukraine.
These type of slow and low flying drones with line of sight command and guidance can only work against non-sophisticated air defense systems and absence of strong electronic warfare defenses.

For India, a lesson to learn, is to invest heavily in both ground based and airborne EW systems. Both offensive and defensive. We have started the efforts and a new ground based system is being developed.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by gakakkad »

On a serious note, several TG channels have reported Kiev being hit causing some infra damage..
Maybe when the jar of tomatoes fell they took out a few buildings .
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Aditya_V »

mody wrote:https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/world/ba ... 5e76&ei=63

Bayraktar TB-2's have all but disappeared from the skies over Ukraine.
These type of slow and low flying drones with line of sight command and guidance can only work against non-sophisticated air defense systems and absence of strong electronic warfare defenses.

For India, a lesson to learn, is to invest heavily in both ground based and airborne EW systems. Both offensive and defensive. We have started the efforts and a new ground based system is being developed.
They are good propaganda weapons but this was called out, they were useless after about 3 days in the conflict, interesting thing is Shaheed stays but the much more expensive Bayraktar is Kaput.

And internet rumors will tell that Ukrainan's destroyed factories have supplied engines to Akinci drones which is yet to be developed by Turkey have been sold to Pakistan.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by sudhan »

Looks like the storm shadows have been mounted on Su-24s

Image


There were some rumours that the release of this very pic brought some Russian CMs on the base hosting the Fencers..
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Pratyush »

The war has come to Moscow with the Ukrainian's attacking the civilian quarter of the city.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Nihat »

Pratyush wrote:The war has come to Moscow with the Ukrainian's attacking the civilian quarter of the city.
It was bound to and this can have untold consequences. Don't see how Moscow can even further escalate on Kyiv without making their own capital a perfectly legitimate target for NATO weapons
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by IndraD »

US seems to have decided
-it will keep crossing red lines; today talks of long range missiles from US to Ukraine (ATACMS)
-if ru uses nukes even better: it brings war to a freeze temporarily, US gets an excuse to supply nukes to countries around Russia

US is losing conventional war, it is looking for a way out of it.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by IndraD »

https://tass.com/politics/1625293
apparently Ru struck Ukr intel HQ no less than Putin announced it, SM buzz is that NATO operatives were inside who have been flown to Berlin
"We have already mentioned the possibility of strikes against decision-making headquarters and centers. Of course, the Ukrainian military intelligence headquarters, which was hit two or three days ago, also falls into this category," Putin said during a visit to the Zotov Center, while answering a question from the head of the non-commercial organization Agency of Strategic Initiatives Svetlana Chupsheva regarding Tuesday’s UAV attack on Moscow.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by williams »

IndraD wrote:US seems to have decided
-it will keep crossing red lines; today talks of long range missiles from US to Ukraine (ATACMS)
-if ru uses nukes even better: it brings war to a freeze temporarily, US gets an excuse to supply nukes to countries around Russia

US is losing conventional war, it is looking for a way out of it.
Ru needs to wait out this year. Next year it is election season and there is no way out for the Biden administration if they cannot show any progress in Ukr.
Pratyush
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Pratyush »

Elections in the US are not going to make any difference to US support for Ukraine.

Only once the dollar domination is over. Along with an emergence of a strong alternative trading mechanism with India a deciding voice in it. Will the US understand that Ukraine is not in it's long term interests.

That is when the war will end.

Not before.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Jay »

williams wrote:
IndraD wrote:US seems to have decided
-it will keep crossing red lines; today talks of long range missiles from US to Ukraine (ATACMS)
-if ru uses nukes even better: it brings war to a freeze temporarily, US gets an excuse to supply nukes to countries around Russia

US is losing conventional war, it is looking for a way out of it.
Ru needs to wait out this year. Next year it is election season and there is no way out for the Biden administration if they cannot show any progress in Ukr.
Williams ji, 2024 elections will not be fought upon UKR-Rus conflict. This conflict is just a lone item for any upcoming admin at this point, unless something g drastic happens. In this matter the outcome of this conflict will be a non story for both Dem and Rep parties.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Yagnasri »

The economic problems of the US will be increasing by the day, and Biden's defeat looks the most likely outcome. Trump or anyone from GoP may not be too keen on this war.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Manas »

Ukraine and Allies Plan Peace Summit Without Russia
https://www.wsj.com/articles/ukraine-an ... _lead_pos1

Latest idiocy of the west. Peace summit hosted without one of the parties to the war !. Lot of references in the article (including a picture of Modiji) about how critical it is for Modi to participate in this peace summit. Why will Russia accept (or for that matter China endorse) what is bound to be a one sided peace plan ?!

The west is increasingly seeing Ukraine as cold war type payback for Russia to destroy Russia economically (what Afghanistan was to the Soviet Union). Another year or two of this might make the Russian situation precarious, while the west escapes with a few bruises unless a majority of the countries de-dollarize their economies and weaken the international economic and multi-lateral institutions like the WB, IMF, assorted UN agencies, ICC etc. But if Putin, Russia are backed into an existential crisis all bets are off on what their reaction might be. If the west supplied weapons are being used against Russian mainland to attack buildings in Moscow then it is really Nato vs Russia with Ukraine being just a willing pawn of the west. I am sure Russia can think of ways to inflict very painful blows to the west overtly and dare the west to enter a direct hot war. Ordinary people around the world should be deeply worried.

Pity the hapless Ukranian citizens who have been displaced by the millions. They deserve every right to live in peace as do citizens of every (any) other country. In some sense they have themselves to blame for putting a comedian and an useful idiot for the U.S. deep state in charge. Like clockwork Biden's deep state cabal of Blinken, Nuland created another hotspot - like they did with Libya, Syria and Ukraine 1.0. Unfortunately, millions of ordinary civilians get killed, wounded and displaced due to the big power play chess moves by these "diplomats". It is really sad and terrible.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Tanaji »

There is a video of couple of Ukrainian soldiers dancing to the NAtu Natu song. Its filmed similar to the original and shows the soldiers practising dropping bombs using drones…

In other news a drone attack on a Russian refinery yesterday. I wonder what effect this is having in the Russians.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Pratyush »

Putin has been saying that it's an existential conflict with Ukraine.

Such attacks are going to inform the population that the government is right and further firm up the resolve.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by vijayk »

Yagnasri wrote:The economic problems of the US will be increasing by the day, and Biden's defeat looks the most likely outcome. Trump or anyone from GoP may not be too keen on this war.
I doubt it. Trump fear made all candidates like Desantis going full crazy on abortion laws. That is going to hurt them. SC hurt Republicans badly with their ruling. The people are voting even dead candidates and zombies as they did for PA senate and Republicans are not getting it.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by sanman »

Yagnasri wrote:The economic problems of the US will be increasing by the day, and Biden's defeat looks the most likely outcome. Trump or anyone from GoP may not be too keen on this war.
Democrats have increasingly been stooping to Machine Politics -- ie. they will harvest any ballot they can, by means fair or foul, in their ruthless bid to hang onto power. They're ready to try their own versions of booth-capturing.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by YashG »

Gentlemen, maybe time to bring this thread back to combat issues (away from US elections).
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Avid »

Great analysis from John Mearsheimer about current state and what he sees as possible outcome of this war.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-rHBRwdql8

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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Avid »

Yagnasri wrote:The economic problems of the US will be increasing by the day, and Biden's defeat looks the most likely outcome. Trump or anyone from GoP may not be too keen on this war.
Caution on those hopes.

Dems were not pro Iraq/Afghanistan etc. -- and it still took from 2008 to 2021
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by sanman »

sanman
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by sanman »

Never previously heard of this Su-34

All I'd heard of was Su-27, then Su30-MK & MKI, and Su-35, and most recently Su-57

Deans
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Deans »

Good analysis of the battle of Bakhmut.
Serge is Russian and has a good knowledge of military history. Not jingoistic and writes in English.

https://bigserge.substack.com/p/the-bat ... postmortem

This is his earlier article on the leaked US documents.

https://bigserge.substack.com/p/russo-u ... um=reader2
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Cyrano »

Unconfirmed reports say that "decision making centers" in Kyiv were hit, dozens of casualties including many NATO personnel, critically wounded were flown out EU countries for better treatment. This is in retaliation for Ukr striking Russian cities including Moscow. Not much details coming thru since Ukr clamp down on SM posters a few weeks ago.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Cyrano »

Thanks Deans ji. Seems like Afg exit redux in terms of incompetence, hubris and total disconnect between military and the leadership. And these same guys are beating the drums over Taiwan now...
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Manish_P »

sanman wrote:Never previously heard of this Su-34

All I'd heard of was Su-27, then Su30-MK & MKI, and Su-35, and most recently Su-57

...
Do you mean that you had never heard about the Su-34 aircraft itself?

If so, you have missed many stimulating discussions around it's advantages/disadvantages, it's features.... including some rather heated ones about it's onboard toilet (the discussions were heated, not clear if the toilet was..)
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by sanman »

Manish_P wrote:Do you mean that you had never heard about the Su-34 aircraft itself?

If so, you have missed many stimulating discussions around it's advantages/disadvantages, it's features.... including some rather heated ones about it's onboard toilet (the discussions were heated, not clear if the toilet was..)
What would the western counterpart for this aircraft be? F-15? I thought Su-27, 30, 33, 35, etc were all in that category. Why this Su-34 variant? What advantages does it bring to the Ukraine war?
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Pratyush »

It's an evolutionary development from the Su 33 trainer aircraft.

It's used by the Russians as a straight line successor of the Su24.

Because post 91 the Russians chose to simplify the aircraft types in service.

They choose to rescue Sukhoi design bureau. This aircraft along with the MKI saved the bureau during the dark days of the 90s.

Mig got culled.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Manish_P »

sanman wrote:...
What would the western counterpart for this aircraft be?...
The F-111, to some extent.. (IMO)
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by sanman »

Manish_P wrote:
sanman wrote:...
What would the western counterpart for this aircraft be?...
The F-111, to some extent.. (IMO)
I too immediately thought of F-111 Aardvark when I heard Su-34 described as "fighter bomber" -- and yet to me, Su-34 doesn't seem to be large enough to perform that role.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Manish_P »

No. It isn't (if you do apple to apple comparison). That way only to some extent.

Pratyush has given the background of how it came into the role.

The Russians (like us) find multiple uses for things.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Tanaji »

For the umpteenth time Baniansky says counteroffensive is about to start

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ze ... 023-06-03/

He is milking it for all its worth.
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by drnayar »

Tanaji wrote:For the umpteenth time Baniansky says counteroffensive is about to start

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ze ... 023-06-03/

He is milking it for all its worth.
for one thing it can go either way and odds favor the Russians ..also the deep state wont want a quick end to the gravy train
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Tanaji »

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-65806152

Russia says it thwarted Ukranian offensive.

More interestingly why is BBC giving this prominent coverage as they normally try to minimise such reverses..
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by AdityaM »

People expect soldiers to fight, but don't realise what horror they are condemned to.

Video of severely injured soldiers on battle field

https://twitter.com/mylordbebo/status/1 ... tthk9D0-Gg
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Re: Russian-Ukrainian War: Combat Tactics & Strategy

Post by Lisa »

There is a saying, War is old men talking and young men dying. This saying stays upmost in my mind before I write about our borders and the giving the recommendation of action. Talk is cheap!
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