Indian Missiles News & Discussions - 30 June 2022

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 21 Feb 2023 13:01

https://mobile.twitter.com/otvnews/stat ... 1397714944

ITCM test launch from Odisha. Only 1 Twitter handle above has reported it so far

Ashokk · Post by **Ashokk** » 21 Feb 2023 13:49

Hemant Kumar Rout

India's first Indigenous Technology Cruise Missile (ITCM) with domestic small turbo fan engine Manik & upgraded radio frequency seeker test fired from a defence facility off Odisha coast. The new engine's performance evaluation on, details awaited.

Nikhil_Naya · Post by **Nikhil_Naya** » 21 Feb 2023 18:27

Nikhil_Naya wrote:Whilst my paanwaalah didn't have information on the 8th-10th NOTAM, he did tell me that NoFear has undergone some more fine tuning. Improved Waypoint navigation in closed loop, actuators have been changed and the MTFE will be powering it. Expecting testing soon...very soon.

Ahem ahem… jingo khush hua!

basant · Post by **basant** » 21 Feb 2023 18:58

Indigenous Technology Cruise Missile Test-Fired From ITR At Chandipur

Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) successfully flight tested the indigenously developed ITCM missile from Launch Complex-III, ITR, Balasore in Odisha, today.

ashishvikas · Post by **ashishvikas** » 21 Feb 2023 19:32

IAF successfully test fires indigenously developed all-weather beyond visual range air-to-air missile Astra from fighter jet Sukhoi-30 MKI off Odisha coast. The missile with a range of 70 km is capable of destroying targets at different altitudes.
@XpressOdisha @NewIndianXpress

https://twitter.com/TheHemantRout/statu ... Kicpw&s=19

Is it Astra IR or Astra 1/2 ?

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 21 Feb 2023 19:39

Prem Kumar wrote:https://mobile.twitter.com/otvnews/stat ... 1397714944

ITCM test launch from Odisha. Only 1 Twitter handle above has reported it so far

Good news.

How many more launches for entry into service?

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 21 Feb 2023 21:28

https://twitter.com/TheHemantRout/statu ... 02017?s=20 ---> India's first Indigenous Technology Cruise Missile (ITCM) with domestic small turbo fan engine Manik & upgraded radio frequency seeker test fired from a defence facility off Odisha coast. The new engine's performance evaluation on, details awaited.

A Deshmukh · Post by **A Deshmukh** » 21 Feb 2023 22:04

basant wrote:(DRDO) successfully flight tested the indigenously developed ITCM missile

successfully flight tested in DRDO terminology == it flew only == failed.
not sure, why DRDO is struggling with Nirbhay and ITCM, when it has succeeded in many other missiles.
I suspect, engine problems with new Manik engine.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 21 Feb 2023 23:15

ashishvikas wrote:IAF successfully test fires indigenously developed all-weather beyond visual range air-to-air missile Astra from fighter jet Sukhoi-30 MKI off Odisha coast. The missile with a range of 70 km is capable of destroying targets at different altitudes.
@XpressOdisha @NewIndianXpress

https://twitter.com/TheHemantRout/statu ... Kicpw&s=19

Is it Astra IR or Astra 1/2 ?

ANI retracted their report as the test was postponed...

k prasad · Post by **k prasad** » 22 Feb 2023 02:46

A Deshmukh wrote:
basant wrote:(DRDO) successfully flight tested the indigenously developed ITCM missile
successfully flight tested in DRDO terminology == it flew only == failed.
not sure, why DRDO is struggling with Nirbhay and ITCM, when it has succeeded in many other missiles.
I suspect, engine problems with new Manik engine.

Or maybe their first test was focussed on the flight dynamics & propulsion elements, and these worked successfully. Later tests should expand the envelope.

It makes sense for missiles such as these, for reducing development timelines, compared with say, ballistic missiles, where we can do far fewer tests, which means more systems are fine-tuned for concurrent testing across fewer tests, with the flip-side being that it'll take a bit longer to develop and fine-tune the systems.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 22 Feb 2023 04:11

Just to be clear what would a successful missile test news release look like?

basant · Post by **basant** » 22 Feb 2023 07:46

ramana wrote:Just to be clear what would a successful missile test news release look like?

"missile met all mission parameter during the test"

"all mission objectives were met"

"a complete success"

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 22 Feb 2023 10:51

They are probably looking at all telemetry as it's a development flight.

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 22 Feb 2023 11:17

https://www.newindianexpress.com/states ... 49789.html

Hemant Rout's report above. Looks like a reduced range test to validate the engine.

I am concerned about the terminology of ITCM being a "tech demonstrator" and the future, 1500 Km range LR-LACM being the induction-ready missile. We already made a mistake with Nirbhay by closing the project as a "tech demonstrator", where the smart thing would have been to induct it with Russian engines. Then came ITCM with a desi engine, which was supposed to be the real deal.

ITCM = Nirbhay airframe + Manik + new seeker = 1000 Km range

This looks good enough to be inducted. Hope they do that rather than keep moving the goalpost for 1500 Km range LR-LACM. That can be inducted as tranche-2

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 22 Feb 2023 12:18

Intresting quote from Hemant Rout artilce.

Before the ITCM project, India had inducted subsonic cruise missile Nirbhay that was powered by a Russian NPO Saturn 36MT engine. India is planning to develop a 1,000 km range supersonic cruise missile for land attack and a 1,500 km range naval version with the new Manik engine.

So Nirbhay has been inducted in limited Nos.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 23 Feb 2023 00:41

Can someone post the full text of Rout's article?
It has a few inconsistencies.

In the early days of IGMP it was nice to hear about the many models being developed.
Now it is not funny anymore when they keep announcing new models.
From now onwards DRDO needs to have an official spokesman talk and not these anonymouse sources.
There was a successful test and the way it is reported casts doubt on the CM program.
Also, services need to get out of an import /detached mentality and make their requirements known well in advance.

Why did the Army and Navy not make their needs known before Nirbhay's development?
Which officer gave the early requirements?
For instance, Adm Arun Prakash, ~~key person~~for the Vikrant lift fiasco gives daily gnan like SuSwa on Twitter.

Added later. He was just one of the many and not solely.
IN Carrier Admirals did not envision an a/c other than Mig-29s for IN.
Hence the lift was sized for that in 2009.
The second carrier will take care to have adequate clearance.
IMHO they saved the IN from becoming a USN auxiliary force.

Ashokk · Post by **Ashokk** » 23 Feb 2023 03:27

ramana wrote:Can someone post the full text of Rout's article?

Haridas · Post by **Haridas** » 23 Feb 2023 21:00

https://youtu.be/TTyXQLPwxro
India has 14,000 Brahmos Midsiles

For those who know me: No kidding on the numbers.

Chinkies shivering inspite of sipping bitter chai.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 23 Feb 2023 21:10

Similar news came out last year, funnily quoted by some very respected Chinese expert.

YashG · Post by **YashG** » 23 Feb 2023 21:10

^^^
Love to believe it. But this youtube handle is not a very solid source.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 23 Feb 2023 21:32

fanne wrote:Similar news came out last year, funnily quoted by some very respected Chinese expert.

Deterrence is not what we cynically deride but what the opponents believe.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 23 Feb 2023 22:40

I believe that we have these numbers!!

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 23 Feb 2023 23:19

Prem Kumar wrote:Fantastic news, if true!

I wonder how Janes is getting these scoops during Aero India, while an order like this goes unreported in the mainstream media?

Got rid of Rahul Bedi the left-wing JDefense reporter!!!

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 23 Feb 2023 23:20

Fourteen fooking thousand!

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 23 Feb 2023 23:49

Why did you think PLA backed down?

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 24 Feb 2023 03:11

Good to see a success from GTRE with the Manik engine ! Hope this gives them the boost and support needed to deliver bigger things in future!

V_Raman · Post by **V_Raman** » 24 Feb 2023 03:31

14,000

I remember an interview from BrahMos chief of the time Dr. Pillai saying something along the lines of "Imagine a salvo of 1000 BrahMos missiles as a first round against targets in Pakistan...". I remember that it created quite the flutter at that time.

Cannot believe we followed through on it

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 24 Feb 2023 05:55

In that case there won’t be a day two of an Indo-Pakistani war.

JTull · Post by **JTull** » 24 Feb 2023 06:03

14,000 Brahmos? And we believe it?

This is silly.

At $3-5million a pop, that's 42-70 billion dollars. Someone is extrapolating massively. 3-4000 will also be extraordinary.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 24 Feb 2023 06:06

Are we now supposed to believe numbers cited by random YT handles claiming "Thar Thar kaanp rahi hai Chinese media"? The effect of propaganda/psyops is intended for the adversary not ourselves.

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 24 Feb 2023 06:56

nachiket wrote:Are we now supposed to believe numbers cited by random YT handles claiming "Thar Thar kaanp rahi hai Chinese media"? The effect of propaganda/psyops is intended for the adversary not ourselves.

Well said Saar.

bharathp · Post by **bharathp** » 24 Feb 2023 08:15

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/ind ... 670805.cms

shows that by oct 2022, 38000 cr worth of orders for brahmos was placed
in sep 2022, 1 usd = 80 rupees
38000cr = 4.75 billion
brahmos orders started around 2006? 2007? lowest point was aug 2007 at 40 rs a $ = so its about 8 billion $ at the lower bound

if brahmos was really 3-5 million a pop (from here:https://www.rediff.com/news/report/reve ... 220926.htm) -thats between 1.5k to 3k at a lower end

I dont quiet believe the cost of this missile can be "inadvertently" released. the cost of the yakhont/p800 is 1.5 million (from wiki)

again, this is all "hearsay" of how much the brahmos costs.

i would say even that number is enough to flatten TSP and decimate sugarlands industrial capacity (although, sugarlandsdoes not need to be decimated throughout - for the snakes, cutting of the head is usually enough)

Thakur_B · Post by **Thakur_B** » 24 Feb 2023 08:15

There is an extra zero in those numbers.

YashG · Post by **YashG** » 24 Feb 2023 09:09

We should definitely have 14K brahmos but not via Brahmos Aerosapce. It has 49% russian equity, so money goes to russia.

Kersi · Post by **Kersi** » 24 Feb 2023 10:46

Haridas wrote:https://youtu.be/TTyXQLPwxro
India has 14,000 Brahmos Midsiles

For those who know me: No kidding on the numbers.

Chinkies shivering inspite of sipping bitter chai.

Sounds like a dream from which I do not wish to get out

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 24 Feb 2023 12:05

Lot of inaccurate claims in that video. Standard stuff made to get clicks & monetize the desi public for personal gain.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 24 Feb 2023 12:26

14000 looks to be exaggerated, Air launched ones might 200-300, ship launched ones ~ 500, Navy Coastal defense ~100, even considering reloads that would ~ 13000 Land launched Land attack variants, does anyone think we 1000 Launchers for Brahmos?

JTull · Post by **JTull** » 24 Feb 2023 15:14

YashG wrote:We should definitely have 14K brahmos but not via Brahmos Aerosapce. It has 49% russian equity, so money goes to russia.

It is not like we wire 49% of gross costs to Russia. Only share of net profit, and costs of any components sourced from Russia! All R&D, including for import substitution of Russian components, are deductible expenses.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 24 Feb 2023 15:20

By all accounts, it is an expensive system. No, we may not have it in such numbers. Even the Chinese do not have such a number of missile units. Nirbhay things, once finalised, need to be purchased in 1000s asap. Even a bigger warhead and short range of, say, 300 to 500 km will take care of pakis at a cheaper cost.

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 24 Feb 2023 15:31

Are we having any plans for about a cheap scooter motor plastic wings attack drone à la Geran ? They were a surprise success in Ukraine. Anti a/c, S300, fighters none had an effective response to them.

Sorry couldn't get the image to display. URL: https://www.arabnews.com/sites/default/ ... drone3.jpg

The full article:
https://arab.news/z6mbk