Defence Expo 2004

JCage
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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby JCage » 07 Feb 2004 00:45

Originally posted by Rudra Singha:
the side skirts have always been there. see PVNs
days photo
http://hot.ee/t96tank/pictures/arjun.jpg
Thx, I got addled seeing a few pics of protos sans ballistic skirts.

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby JCage » 07 Feb 2004 01:59

Originally posted by Sanjay:
Nitin Bhai, drop me an e-mail.
We have some BDL issues to sort out regarding Agni.
Sure!

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Marcos » 07 Feb 2004 02:00

No pic of our carrier model yet? :D and more close-up of that scope too if possible a pose from that lady in uniform for a pose in the aiming position ---- and damn miss a grenade launcher attached to the rifle and i bet that wud give the INSAS get a deadly look as it badly needs ... wished DRDO attached that too

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Marcos » 07 Feb 2004 02:11

hey guys anything related to agni that can't be sahred with me (if u guys permit though) :) or any confidential stuffs?

and guys is there any model of the Sukhoi's UAV at the show namely this one
http://www.uscc.gov/Assets/chinamoscowairshow_files/image028.jpg

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby JCage » 07 Feb 2004 02:13

Originally posted by Raj_Kumar:
hey guys anything related to agni that can't be sahred with me (if u guys permit though) :) or any confidential stuffs?

and guys is there any model of the Sukhoi's UAV at the show namely this one
http://www.uscc.gov/Assets/chinamoscowairshow_files/image028.jpg
Naah, its nothing confidential or something, just some old stuff...so cool you/br arent missing out on anything.

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Marcos » 07 Feb 2004 02:41

yup sorry...well cant wait to see all the new stuffs especially our Gorshy :D ..so all these excitment ;) anyway tks ... what aby Abhay it look cool, seems like all ICV's are getting the same looks the Chinese one too looks pretty the same

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby JCage » 07 Feb 2004 02:51

The Abhay pic...I have a theory that says OFB/DRDO will adopt the BMP 30mm 2A72 for the main gun.
The AFV will make use of Kanchan, probably ERA as well, if the Army deems fit!

The look of the front hull suggests the PT76 design legacy- flotation and all.

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Pranay » 07 Feb 2004 03:02

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3466117.stm

Kalashnikov upset by Indian "copy" seen at DefExpo...

The Russian company behind the world's most infamous rifle, the Kalashnikov AK-47, is up in arms over an alleged copy made by India's state weapons maker.
Representatives from Izhmash, the gun's original manufacturer, discovered what they see as an Indian rip-off of the AK-47 at an arms fair in Delhi.

But India's Ordnance Factory Board says the weapon is different enough to count as a distinct design.

AK-47 copies are produced in dozens of countries, but only a handful have formally licensed it.

The row blew up, Izhmash representatives told Agence France Presse news agency, when the man who invented the AK-47 in World War II visited OFB's pavilion at the arms fair and saw what he thought was a copy of his brainchild.

"I don't see any permission being given to India to manufacture the rifle" and sell it for export, said Izhmash's Andrei Vishnyakov.

Russia is India's largest supplier of weapons - although not of AK-47s.

'Threat'

The new weapon has yet to appear on OFB's website, which advertises products ranging from pistols to main battle tanks.

Still, OFB staff were keen to deny the accusation.

"The cocking mechanism is different, the lever has been changed and the barrel is chrome-plated," OFB gun designer Mohammad Ali told AFP.

For general manager MK Garg, Izhmash's complaint rests on a false premise.


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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby JCage » 07 Feb 2004 03:24

Am I the only one going :rotfl: at what the OFB did?

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby JTull » 07 Feb 2004 03:37


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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Priyank » 07 Feb 2004 07:55

The Phalcon deal was to be signed during Def Expo. Any word on what happened to it?

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby JCage » 07 Feb 2004 08:00

Originally posted by Priyank:
The Phalcon deal was to be signed during Def Expo. Any word on what happened to it?
Said to be delayed, some bureaucratic hurdle.

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Abhisham » 07 Feb 2004 18:02

By when are all the promised pics coming.. :(

Abhisham

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Joeqp » 07 Feb 2004 18:06

Yeah, cut the jibber-jabber, where are the pictures? And how come no booth-babes ??? :p

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Harry » 07 Feb 2004 22:40

Originally posted by aditya.g:

Also the bottom cylinder is shorter from bot ends.
The Tusker pod's bottom cylinder is indeed shorter on both ends but so's the Jag's one. There's also a stub in the rear end.

Yeh Dil mangey less?

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Rupak » 08 Feb 2004 10:31

More pic coming up at 8:30 PM IST.

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Rupak » 08 Feb 2004 18:07

Tusker and Tarang are part of the Tempest EW Project. The first is a noise jammer and the other is an RWR. The Tusker was developed for the MiG-27, but can be used on any aircraft. Known to be capable of jamming all AD radars in theatre.

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Rupak » 08 Feb 2004 18:15

More pictures up....captions coming later!

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Rudra » 08 Feb 2004 19:36

who displayed the three naval VLS systems on Page3?

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Aditya G » 08 Feb 2004 21:25

Who has the meet photo? mail it to me please: aditya @ tranceaddict dot net.

Also, rupak - I want one specific INSAS photo that you took - in case it is not being uploaded somewhere in the normal course can you please mail it to me?

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Cybaru » 09 Feb 2004 01:11

Originally posted by Rudra Singha:
who displayed the three naval VLS systems on Page3?
Wanted to ask the same question..
Indian company hopefully ?

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby shiv » 09 Feb 2004 09:33

Originally posted by Raj_Kumar:
hey guys anything related to agni that can't be sahred with me (if u guys permit though) :) or any confidential stuffs?
[/URL]
Actually there is some stuff - I hope you read this soon - because I will have to delete this message.

I heard through my brother in law whose uncle is working on the Indian Army's Agni project - a secret project deceptively called SMKJ - short for Sati Mata Ki Jai - that they have used the "GoMata" GPS system developed by the private company BramnBan IA infosystems to program in the coordinates of the houses of the top Army commanders of Pakistan. They are working on delivery systms for a genetic vaccine that will affect only males above 18 in the Sati development program

Please save this message - I will delete it soon.

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Kapil » 09 Feb 2004 11:27

I spent 12 hours over 2 days this time and looking at the digital cameras with Maz and Rupak,wisely decided not to take too many pics with my poor old slr.

Exhibition was fun but somehow I missed the screaming engines one heard at Aero India

Cheers
Kaps

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby JCage » 09 Feb 2004 11:40

Originally posted by Kapil:
I spent 12 hours over 2 days this time and looking at the digital cameras with Maz and Rupak,wisely decided not to take too many pics with my poor old slr.

Exhibition was fun but somehow I missed the screaming engines one heard at Aero India

Cheers
Kaps
Where are the reports? :o :roll:

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby amarnath » 09 Feb 2004 11:55

nitin saabjee

It suddenly occured to me that information posting has been restricted since the past few weeks due to adverse affects.After Umesh did his visit aboard the IN-ships ,admins have been a little secretive.I myself had a post of mine edited though it had only 5 characters plus a question mark !(no problem with that ;) ).

Remember what to post and not to post thread ?
I was astonised that how much adverse affect a project like BR can do after reading that thread.
Call it side-effect or what_ever !

PS : I find many people using email to discuss non_open_source info. Question is can a dedicated hacker find whats inside the mail bag ?

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby JCage » 09 Feb 2004 12:03

Hey, plain nitin is great, unless you meant to call me subzi. :eek:

Jokes apart, in an era where the blessed paki attache goes and freaks out at defexpo masquerading as a journo....man, a few reports on BR as to what was publically reported at defexpo wont hurt.

cheers,
nitin

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby amarnath » 09 Feb 2004 12:08

nitin : (OK ?)

its not subze its subjee ! ;)

I very well like this word "saab-jee" after the movie LoC-Kargil !

I am happy to hear some stuff too, but please to read this thread and compare it with other show threads like Aero-India.....or are our delhi members lazy ?

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Jagan » 09 Feb 2004 12:56

Originally posted by Amarnath.G:
nitin : (OK ?)

am happy to hear some stuff too, but please to read this thread and compare it with other show threads like Aero-India.....or are our delhi members lazy ?
I would attribute that with the lack of access to Scanners / or lack of Digital Cameras. If they have either one then they are definitely lazy
!

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Kapil » 09 Feb 2004 15:28

HeHe---
As someone asked me at Defexpo-What joy do you guys get from finding out so much info? :)

Dekho-Rupak and the delhi crowd visited everything in detail and took pix with digital cameras.I was only picking up freebies as nobody would 'know English' when you ask them anything.
Frankly, it was all a repeat of Aero India .not much new stuff
Again,thats my opinion...ask the others.

Cheers,
The Lazy One

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Kersi D » 09 Feb 2004 18:23

Originally posted by rupak:
Tusker and Tarang are part of the Tempest EW Project. The first is a noise jammer and the other is an RWR. The Tusker was developed for the MiG-27, but can be used on any aircraft. Known to be capable of jamming all AD radars in theatre.
I visited the BEL stall which displayed the Tarang system. Spoke to one very nice typicaly Southi looking lady, very well informed. She is working on the Tarang project.

Tarang is only a RWR. It consists of

1) 4 radar recievers mounted such that they can cover the space all over the aircraft

2) The power unit

3) The processor

4) LCD Display

Tarang can detect 64 - 72 radations simultaneously and can display 16 sources. It can idetify the source. It can locate the source. It ives an audio beep whenever a new radiation is detected.

Tarang has been installed in MiG 21s and the installation is in progress for MiG 27s. Trials are on for the Jaguars and next will be the MiG 29s.

Initial testing, for a single radiation, is carried out over Bangalore airspace. But multiple radiation trials take place over the Gwalior AFB, where IAF has an instrumented EW range in operation.

I do not have the fancy gadgets for taking pix of wheeled or tracked or two legged models of the show. I leave that to Kapil and Maz. But I have gathered a lot of data and brochures which I will share with you all, from time to time.

Regards
Kersi

Regards
Kersi

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby maz » 09 Feb 2004 18:23

3 missile launchers from L to R are Sylver launchers for Scamp, Aster 15/30 and Aster 15.

The indian shipyards were not always forthcoming with info citing the usual secrecy stuff.

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Pranay » 09 Feb 2004 18:24

PS : I find many people using email to discuss non_open_source info. Question is can a dedicated hacker find whats inside the mail bag ?
It's pretty simple... U don't even need a "dedicated" hacker...For people whose job it is to know... this is child's play...

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Kersi D » 09 Feb 2004 18:34

Originally posted by John Umrao:
he did, look at the left side of the page. you will enter Rupaks Expo. ;)

Rupak, what is Sujav ( I dont like the name sounds like sulabh), some kind of direction finder, ECM or communication relay?
Sujav is an Indian Army ECM / ESM system. It identifies, locates and jamms enemy radio communication. One Sujav unit, with four vehicles, can monitor an area of about 10 - 30 km.

To the best of Samyukta is the bigger brother of Sujav. It can control a much larger area and can also deal with radar radiations. Please correct me if I am wrong

Regards
Kersi

George J

Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby George J » 09 Feb 2004 18:36

Originally posted by Kersi Dotiwalla:
Tarang is only a RWR. It consists of

1) 4 radar recievers mounted such that they can cover the space all over the aircraft

2) The power unit

3) The processor

4) LCD Display

I think in later iterations of ' forthcoming a/c' the processor and the display will be integrated into the CAC. The stand alone LCD display is only for literally... diplay. With all the new fangle a/c coming out with muliple MFD, the RWR mode will be an integrate option meant to be displayed in any of the zillion MFD at the pilot's pleasure.

Interesting times...

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Kersi D » 09 Feb 2004 18:42

Originally posted by cy_baru:
Cool, thanks rupak...

How does this work ???
http://groups.msn.com/BharatRakshakDefexpo/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=6

The thing floats in water ???

--------

http://groups.msn.com/BharatRakshakDefexpo/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=12

Eight pack launcher of what ??
This is a wheeled Trishul launcher for the IAF. Both L&T and Tata Power claim to have developed it for the DRDO / IAF. A model was also displayed on the TATA stall.

By the way a model of the 'Brahmaputra' class frigates was displyed by the GRSE / Indian Shipyards stall. This model also shows a similar pack launcher, probabaly for the naval Trishul

Regards
Kersi

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Vick » 09 Feb 2004 18:49

Mission: Possible

Develop a VLS Trishul for the IN.

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Kersi D » 09 Feb 2004 18:52

Originally posted by Sanjay:
Negev in the OFB stall ?

Weird - esp. since AFAIK only SF units operate a limited number of Negevs

Are they now in Indian production for the IA ?

I understand from the OFB stall that teh INSAS 5.56 mm gun and LMG has been accepted by IA and in regular production. The para version, with folding butt, is also in prodcution.

But IA has not acsepted the carbine verison sayiong it is too noisy !!! IA has probably bought Negevs till a silent verison of INSAS carbine is available. By the wya the Israeli stall displayed a wie range of small arms including Negevs, Tavor 21s, Uzi etc.

Regards
Kersi

Any sign of optical sights for Excalibur or INSAS and any night sights ?

Would hope you can get some more small arms photos as they are really interesting.

Any indication of production of any of the new small arms ?

Was it an Indian made 0.50 cal HMG on the Indian MPV ?

What of those new wheeled APCs for the paramilitary forces ?

Jai SR: Sorry, no clue on Barak-8. Heard range estimates of up to 40km but I am guessing.

George J

Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby George J » 09 Feb 2004 21:19

Since none of you have dared to ask, let me be the first to ask.

How do they make such cool and detailed scale models? Is it contracted out to phoren cos? Can a civilian get their hands on such ...ahem...toys?

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Rudra » 09 Feb 2004 21:33

the trishul itself will need some modification to
thrust it into right alignment after launch. Jonesy@afm says barak and Shtil have side firing rockets . the electronic command link work to do the same is minor.

the cells we see on tatra are likely reuseable..some extra structure below to vent the hot gases and provide access.

all depends on whether trishul can match barak in
tests. imho its better to induct it in huge numbers into IA and IAF for now. the goalposts are moving at sea (literally).

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Re: Defence Expo 2004

Postby Sanjay » 09 Feb 2004 21:43

Kersi,

Negev is an LMG - changable barrel, bipod etc.

Somebody made the comment that a Negev LMG was in the OFB booth. Don't think Negev looks like INSAS LMG very much, so somebody please confirm this.

IF OFB is producing Negev, it would be a very positive development since we really do need a superior LMG to the INSAS LMG which is more of a heavy barrel machine rifle.

INSAS LMG is finally in production ? Good, but notice we don't see many !


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