Aero India 2015

ShauryaT
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby ShauryaT » 24 Feb 2015 07:45

shiv wrote:
Dileep wrote:We had taken three labourers to help packing. They were initially denied admission, saying that they should have obtained (at Rs 2500 a piece) exhibitor badges!!

I don't know what kind of ass backwardness is this!!


No wonder some poor BRFite reported that on the last day everyone was busy packing and no one was interested in explaining.

Unfortunately government run things are like marrying a whore. The hardware looks and feels like a wife but the behaviour is that of a whore. These grabbing cheapos need to get these finer points sorted out.
:lol: Shiv ji, when you get some time, please do put all your quotes/analogies in book form some day, it would be a riot!

Philip
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Philip » 24 Feb 2015 10:13

Forgot to mention an interesting item at the Israeli pav. The Panther/mini-Panther VSTOL UAV,ideal for our naval vessels.Osprey-like concept,compact .The Schiebel UAV has also long been a class act.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DzqO1xBF7A

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Dileep » 24 Feb 2015 11:29

Uploaded the infoboards to photobucket

Did any Jingo try to look up our stall (and failed, because I met no one)

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby SagarAg » 24 Feb 2015 12:25

Dileep wrote:Uploaded the infoboards to photobucket

Did any Jingo try to look up our stall (and failed, because I met no one)

Yours truly was definitely there :)
Image

SaiK
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby SaiK » 24 Feb 2015 18:09

great picks dileep! so the SC blades are at 1400*C TET.

and the uttam spec sheet is blurred and hidden behind a chair obstruction. cool

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby mraghu » 24 Feb 2015 18:40

DP (Data Patterns) seems to be going great guns, I worked with them in chennai for a few months.. It was a very small company then... Ranga (CEO) is a great individual....

Karan M
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Karan M » 24 Feb 2015 20:54

Good overview of NLCA Mk2 and other programs including AWACS etc

http://www.aeromag.in/sites/default/fil ... %20web.pdf

ramana
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby ramana » 24 Feb 2015 21:05

KaranM and all, Now that the dust has settled and hue and cry subsided, what are the general impressions of AI2015?
1) The exhibits
2) General state of affairs and prospects for :
-IAF
-IN
-IA
-DRDO?

Please address your thoughts in those areas and then make general remarks.

Thanks,
ramana

vipins
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby vipins » 24 Feb 2015 21:06

Few picks from AI 15 including of standoff glide weapon etc

https://www.flickr.com/photos/129816625@N06/sets/72157651021927825/

ramana
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby ramana » 24 Feb 2015 21:11

Looks like the Alpha Systems-Elbit Lizard-IN makes the Sudarshan LGB redundant. Is this made in India with components from Elbit?

ramana
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby ramana » 24 Feb 2015 21:13

Dileep and Vipins, Thanks for the photos.

Karan M
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Karan M » 24 Feb 2015 21:20

ramana wrote:Looks like the Alpha Systems-Elbit Lizard-IN makes the Sudarshan LGB redundant. Is this made in India with components from Elbit?


Its competing with Griffin. Some components can be made inhouse but I doubt seeker tech will be transferred!!

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Karan M » 24 Feb 2015 21:21

vipins wrote:Few picks from AI 15 including of standoff glide weapon etc

https://www.flickr.com/photos/129816625@N06/sets/72157651021927825/


Thank you, very nice quality!

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Karan M » 24 Feb 2015 21:22

Dileep wrote:Uploaded the infoboards to photobucket

Did any Jingo try to look up our stall (and failed, because I met no one)


Thanks Dileep. The radar stuff is very interesting. 100 targets TWS for the Uttam! Jingo khush hua.
I hope they continue to refine the modules for higher power & performance.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby vipins » 24 Feb 2015 21:28

Karan M wrote:
vipins wrote:Few picks from AI 15 including of standoff glide weapon etc

https://www.flickr.com/photos/129816625@N06/sets/72157651021927825/


Thank you, very nice quality!
ramana wrote:Dileep and Vipins, Thanks for the photos.

Thanks Saars,will add more pics of planes once camera pics are processed,these are from cell.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Thakur_B » 24 Feb 2015 21:52

Karan M wrote:Good overview of NLCA Mk2 and other programs including AWACS etc

http://www.aeromag.in/sites/default/fil ... %20web.pdf


A brief mention of "Ghatak" in there :)

Karan M
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Karan M » 24 Feb 2015 21:56

Missed it.. whats Ghatak? (Apart from the IA ones..)

Indranil
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Indranil » 24 Feb 2015 23:50

Aura - IUSAV - Ghatak

vipins
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby vipins » 24 Feb 2015 23:55

LCA Tejas
Image
click

LCH
Image
click

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Raveen » 25 Feb 2015 03:00

vipins wrote:LCA Tejas
Image
click

LCH
Image
click



Still amazed at huge wingtip vortices the LCA generates, largest I've seen on a fighter...I'd figure that they'd install either wing fences or wing tip devices to control the induced drag.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Karan M » 25 Feb 2015 03:30

indranilroy wrote:Aura - IUSAV - Ghatak


Thanks

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Indranil » 25 Feb 2015 03:34

Raveen wrote:Still amazed at huge wingtip vortices the LCA generates, largest I've seen on a fighter...I'd figure that they'd install either wing fences or wing tip devices to control the induced drag.


They are not wing tip vortices. There are vortices shed by the leading edge of the wing. The wingtips of LCA are actually very lightly loaded to lower induced drag and hence don't create large vortices. This is evident when the LCA flies level (around 0.28 mins in the video). The vortices are only created when the LCA is flying at high AoA. This is actually a good thing. All modern fighters depend on vortex-lift at high AoA. Actually, the LCA did a very short and energetic display, almost always turning or doing acrobatics, that's why you see those large vortices.

Notice that when the Rafale is a turn, it sheds the same kind of vortices (at about 5:17). Also remember, that the smoke emitter on the Rafale is actually attached to the wingtip. This is not the case with LCA.


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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby saumitra_j » 25 Feb 2015 07:01

Folks, please find the photo album here: AI 2015

Dileep
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Dileep » 25 Feb 2015 07:39

My impressions from AI05 FWIW.

1. A lot of stuff is being done by the pvt sector, including stuff that was unthinkable a couple of years ago, like the jet engine metal part done by Avalon or the seeker by Alpha and DP.

2. There GOT TO BE a lot of stuff that the companies CAN'T show. We can't show the 'paanchajanyam' work we do, for example.

3. Foreign companies are desperate to find offset/make in India partners. We were approached by several entities.

4. Not entirely from AI05, but the bureaucrazy makes it impossible to deal with the forces/drdo/DPSU. Constantly moving goalposts is one. You can't close a project unless the guys who run it are desperate to do so. Also, even if you spent your money and effort to develop something, it still goes to open or limited tender!!! Of course, there are ways to work around that, but it still is a pain.

5. For desi companies, it is much easier to deal with French and Israelis, in comparison with USA. Americans go by the DO/FAA stuff, while the french just gets it done. I say this from first hand experience. We just shipped something that actually flies on the transports of Armée de l'Air with no big deal about the system/process. We are nowhere close to DO-254 or even full compliance of AS9100. They didn't care.

6. We still need to learn how to efficiently run a show :devil:

Finally, the next one WILL NOT be at Bengaluru. IAF said they can't handle it.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Karan M » 25 Feb 2015 11:37

Saumitra,

That is one amazing album!! One of the display boards shows a UHF TR module. DRDO you sneaky fellows!! :lol:
Clearly, there is a lot of stuff going on & this is a great step forward.

sankum
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby sankum » 25 Feb 2015 14:50

Thanks, Saumitra and Dileep

Prasad
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Prasad » 25 Feb 2015 15:01

Oh well. Given the tremendous response this years AI got, I'm sure if b'luru doesn't want it, some other city will. Tambaram isn't too far off and isn't much smaller than Yelahanka :)

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby vipins » 25 Feb 2015 19:29

Few more pics of Aero Show part
Click 1
Click 2

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Rahul M » 25 Feb 2015 20:51

>> We can't show the 'paanchajanyam' work we do, for example.


IIRC, then :twisted:

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby saumitra_j » 26 Feb 2015 05:47

Thanks Karan and Sanku. I have collected as many brochures as I could, I will scan and share them over the weekend.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby shiv » 26 Feb 2015 06:55

Interesting pic from Rahulrds of DFI. Guess what brings a smile to my face?
:D
http://i.imgur.com/LY7oYkJ.jpg

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Rahul M » 26 Feb 2015 07:10

gripens and tornados vs su's and rafales. I wonder what scenario can have that mix.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby sunilUpa » 26 Feb 2015 07:43

The airspace around B'Lore is closed from 10-12 am and 2-4 pm during AeroIndia....

shiv
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby shiv » 26 Feb 2015 09:06

shiv wrote:Interesting pic from Rahulrds of DFI. Guess what brings a smile to my face?
:D
http://i.imgur.com/LY7oYkJ.jpg

Rafale and So 30 are "friend". Others are "foe".

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Karan M » 26 Feb 2015 16:32

ramana wrote:KaranM and all, Now that the dust has settled and hue and cry subsided, what are the general impressions of AI2015?
1) The exhibits
2) General state of affairs and prospects for :
-IAF
-IN
-IA
-DRDO?

Please address your thoughts in those areas and then make general remarks.

Thanks,
ramana


Ramanaji, well I didnt visit so can't judge it effectively
But generally speaking this is a good show in that a lot of M/SMEs took part and DRDO/Pvt firms showed some of their less well known programs

For me
- The SOC part, both MIU and OBC are in development @ DRDL & they have a range of other items in production, successful trials mean they flew on our missiles as testbeds. Interesting part is how much weight these items will save versus the large boxes we currently deploy
- Radars - C Band, UHF Band and X Band Tx/Rx modules show how far we have come in radar tech. The AESA FCR prototype & also the comments by BRF folk about the AEW&C meeting requirements and then some is very heartening. VK Saraswat before leaving, had mentioned (3-4 years back) about DRDO looking at UHF Long Range radars for BMD (and this has effects elsewhere too as we try to counter LO platforms), and those modules are now available
-MTRDC showing a large number of their products. They have silently worked to get us independent of imports of high priced, scarce TWTs, microwave modules.
-EW: Dare mentioning the dual color MAWS and DR-118 for Su-30s. DR118 is an advanced digital RWR that addresses the issue with RWRs being blanked by the canards and also has digital capability to do pulse to pulse discrimination - this should help against LPI radars too
-The number of firms with mechanical forging, casting and precision mfg facilities.
-Some good stuff around SATCOM, SDR etc which show how we are gradually but steadily edging foreign firms out in these critical areas which cost us a lot of money and leave our networks at least partly open to the OEM
-MCA, nice video showing RCS testing (a first)

Going forwards, i hope the next show displays more advanced radars, EW, sonars and hopefully a bunch of PGMs, missiles with desi designed seekers. Then we would have gone ahead.

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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby vipins » 01 Mar 2015 17:43


Austin
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Austin » 01 Mar 2015 22:29


Will
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Will » 02 Mar 2015 03:52

No latest model of the AMCA? :(:(:(

Philip
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby Philip » 02 Mar 2015 19:18

General impression. Slightly better organized than previous shows. Linking the main pavilion was a good idea,where one did not have to wander in and out of hangars alternating between air-con insides and blazing heat outside. Toilets pathetic! Where were the AC toilets? perhaps for the pilots in the chalets,but for visitors,no better than 2 years ago.broken washbasins,stinking sheds reminiscent of latrines in WW2 movies! Food courts again could've been better.Why some were not air conditioned beats me,esp. when business vistors pay a hefty entrance fee .The usual HAL/DRDO "family and friends" invasion was there right from the start.This simply atrocious.Families could not have paid for business visitor tkts. and would've got passes.They could be limited to day 3 onwards. The mini-buses taking bus. visitors from the car park were so obsolete and positively dangerous with their sharp projections,narrow entrances,low celings,belonged to the stone age where at BLR airport fancy Volvo coaches take passengers to the city! These vehicles should be banned from the roads altogether let alone carry people at an intl. air show. In fact right from the city special air show Volvos should'be been available in large numbers taking visitors right into the show area/zone. Bag screening could've been done in the city itself.If there were some available,they were invisible.

The pavilions.Intl. participation was smaller than in previous shows,because at an AI show,there is little business conducted unlike in other foreign shows,esp. those in the Gulf. There was no announcement of deals at the show.US presence was also much reduced.The Russian and Israeli pavilions/displays were the largest and best.manned by large staff as well. One solitary Japanese at the amphib stall. They could've instead had a Japanese pavilion showcasing their other wares.Shortsightedness personified.Next time we should invite the Chinese! The Israeli C-Dome anti-missile defence for naval warships right down to small patrol craft was featured. Something new.A huge screen with video displays of various wares was excellent.

DRDO and HAL.BMos was the best of the lot.Nothing notable in the naval sphere unlike previous shows.No model of BMos subs."The missile is ready but we've not been given a sub!",moaned the boffin in charge.Previously there were naval weaponry like lightweight torpedoes,heavy ones,anti-T decoys.In the DRDO pav,there was a small model of a ski-jump and a carrier.Appeared old and not a reliable configuration of IAC-1.There are better graphics on the net. Lots of desi components however.Impressive.The LCA's AESA radar to be fitted some time soon for testing on display. I think that in future the DRDO should categorise its wares better under aerospace,naval and land pavilions/stalls,engines,missiles,etc.,etc. These could all be placed in the centre of the dedicated pavilion,with the individual DPSU entities having their stalls with brochues,etc.,around. This would look very impressive. At the moment,their display designs are v.unimpressive when compared with the foreign ones,crude,lacking in imagination and one has to search for hidden gems.Even the brochures could do with better ad sense.

If India is going to be a defence exporter,then there should be far greater professionalism which only a corporate mentality/entity will succeed. Our DPSUs have learnt nothing from the umpteen air shows at BLR .In fact the LUH mockup outside,barricades all around,had a sign "only for invitees" or such keeping out visitors. At previous shows the ALH had complete mockups inside where one could sit in the seats. I looked for HAL's BTT in vain but couldn't find it. If it was there in any form could someone post pics please? I don't know on what basis the MOD is plumping for this BTT to arrive and deliver.

pyogi
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Re: Aero India 2015

Postby pyogi » 02 Mar 2015 22:21

Hello Friends,

I was having some issues logging in but am glad finally i did get online :-)
Hoping to still generate some interest with some of my images
here goes
[mods the formating got jumbled]
ImageDSC_5521 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_0098 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_2309 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_5343 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_4911 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_3038 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_3008 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_2987 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_2943 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_3106 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_9366 by photoyogi,

ImageDSC_8540-Edit by photoyogi,

ImageDSC_2824 by photoyogi,

ImageDSC_8095 by photoyogi,
ImageDSC_4911 by photoyogi,

I also have another gallery on my website that you might find interesting which is http://bit.ly/Aeroindia disclaimer you may find the images here watermarked, i have put it there for a reason :-) I will post some other images of interest to BR later.

Quick Review on this times AeroIndia, I got to meet Shiv after many years and it was indeed good time we spend chatting and clicking, among the things that flew, the girls on the wings were boring but i wish we had more jets participating.
For those who thought that the USAF C17 had US paras, i guess not, they were our own parajumpers. Personally i thought the IAF para jumping display was much better.
We had the F15 on static its a shame it did not fly! I tried to get it on its way out but clearly there was some delays it left AFS Yelahanka much after 23rd.
More for laters
Cheers!
Praveen / Photoyogi


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