Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

anmol
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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby anmol » 15 Feb 2013 12:18

hnair wrote:^^^ Indeed, Suraj. Even better would be to provide subtitles to the video in various languages (or a voice over). This sort of oratory models are gravely missing, amongst the rabble-rouser types that dominate the current scene.


I can do Hindi to english subtitle.

Its pretty easy, download the video and open it in a subtitle editor and start typing.

One nice (free) subtitle editor for WIndows: http://code.google.com/p/subtitleedit/downloads/list

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby sum » 15 Feb 2013 12:32

Well known resident $%#^, Shri Katju on why India needs to be saved from NaMo:
All the perfumes of Arabia

Narendra Modi is being projected by a large section of Indians as the modern Moses, the one who will lead the beleaguered and despondent Indian people into a land of milk and honey, the man who is best suited to be the next Indian Prime Minister. And it is not just the Bharatiya Janata Party and RSS who are saying this at the Kumbh Mela. A large section of the Indian so-called ‘educated’ class, including many of our ‘educated’ youth, who have been carried away by Mr. Modi’s propaganda is saying this.

I was flying from Delhi to Bhopal recently. Sitting beside me was a Gujarati businessman. I asked him his opinion of Mr. Modi. He was all praise for him. I interjected and asked him about the killing of nearly 2,000 Muslims in 2002 in Gujarat. He replied that Muslims were always creating problems in Gujarat, but after 2002 they have been put in their place and there is peace since then in the State. I told him this is the peace of the graveyard, and peace can never last long unless it is coupled with justice. At this remark he took offence and changed his seat on the plane.

The truth today is that Muslims in Gujarat are terrorised and afraid that if they speak out against the horrors of 2002 they may be attacked and victimised. In the whole of India, Muslims (who number over 200 million) are solidly against Mr. Modi (though there are a handful of Muslims who for some reason disagree).



I appeal to the people of India to consider all this if they are really concerned about the nation’s future. Otherwise they may make the same mistake which the Germans made in 1933.

Islam Khatre mein hain!!!

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Arjun » 15 Feb 2013 12:47

sum wrote:Well known resident $%#^, Shri Katju on why India needs to be saved from NaMo:
All the perfumes of Arabia

Actually a good development. Katju is widely regarded as a nitwit, and his voice carries zero resonance either with the masses or with the chattering classes. Katju's association with the anti-Modi camp will only serve to further discredit it...

By the way, interesting how I've seen most other newspapers / mags in India start to 'blow with the wind' and hedge their bets with a growing number of pro-Modi voices, but The Hindu has remained steadfastly anti-Modi. They'll get caught with their pants down soon.

PS: Katju is from a Kashmiri Pandit family settled in UP, like Nehru. Anyone care to comment why that community has turned out so Islam-pasand ?
Last edited by Arjun on 15 Feb 2013 12:54, edited 1 time in total.

member_20317
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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_20317 » 15 Feb 2013 12:51

Markandey Katju, a former judge of the Supreme Court, is Chairman of the Press Council of India



birds of a feather flock together....

This Judge Dredd is a strange guy. Mentions doubts on what really happened at Godhara and that inflexible lightening rod that is so nicely a round figure '2000'. Very plasticy with the Truth. Makes no mention of history except where it is the 'authorised version'.

And in a piece meant to address Indians he mentions 'Kristallnacht'. WT_. Is Judge Dredd here, an Indian!!! Kaisi boli bhasha hai bhai.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Singha » 15 Feb 2013 13:07

I am expecting Katju and Karnad to bag rajya sabha seats soon.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sri » 15 Feb 2013 13:43

The fake debate: Communal Modi fanboys vs Sickular Commies

The point of contention is the importance of minority rights. Where Mantri and Gupta flay ‘left-liberals’ for supporting identity politics as a form of cultural redistribution of power, i.e. socialism, Varshney touts the US model of hyphenated citizenship — Indian-American, Chinese-American et al — that protects its minorities without imposing a unitary national identity.


Varshney does a valuable service, for example, by calling out the disingenuous use of the term ‘left-liberals.’

Except for a few nostalgic souls in the National Advisory Council, those still marching to CPM tunes, those admiring Arundhati Roy’s travels to Naxal lands and a few more, no one today is against markets… Gupta and Mantri lend the term “left-liberal” considerable imprecision. They see many more economic adversaries than there actually are. Very few oppose markets today. The bone of contention is whether markets alone would lead to mass welfare, or state intervention is also required. Liberals like me find markets necessary, but not sufficient. India needs greater play of market forces, but the government’s welfare, regulatory and public-goods functions remain.


Don't miss the comments section. One guy (BRF?) takes on the writer head on...

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_20317 » 15 Feb 2013 15:35

I would not mind it if NM does nothing and says nothing about Hindutva/RJM or even if he treats the Sangh in the most abject manner. But I just hope he does something about the Hindus coming in from Pakisatan.

Kongis can get the whole of Bangladesh into India with Ration cards and Voters ID card but here are people who deserve to be in India but this Dynasty and its lackeys would just marinate them in their troubles.

The plight of these people must find space in the BJP Manifesto.

Cross Linking from Terrorist Pakistan thread and posting in full since this is what the Dynasty has done to this land:


viewtopic.php?f=1&t=6492&start=2520#p1410892

SSridhar wrote:Kafirs there, Pakistanis here - Mahim Pratap Singh, The Hindu
Random epiphanies can often lead people out of their homelands and across borders, where they are doomed to spend their lives in gloomy tent house settlements.

For Chetan Bheel, a burly, middle-aged man from Pakistan’s Sindh province, that epiphany came during his last visit to Jodhpur, when he went to visit a well-to-do relative. The man was sitting in his courtyard and beside him was his pet dog sitting on a chair, says Chetan. “On seeing me, he did not shoo his dog off the chair but instead asked his servant to bring another chair for me to sit on.”

That was when he realised that “pet dogs are treated better in India than Hindus are in Sindh”. {And, come to think of it, Sindh is the best region for the Hindus}

So last year, Chetan, along with his family and another 166 people, decided to leave Sindh and move to India, “the land of our ancestors”, for a life of dignity. The 171 Hindus that arrived in Jodhpur last September comprised the single largest group to have crossed over since the fencing of the Indo-Pak border.

“But now my people curse me for leading them here. ‘We left our homes and came here on your advice, now it rains and we are left facing this bitter winter out in the open’ , they say,” rues Chetan, adding, “There they used to call us all kafirs, and here we are ostracised for being Pakistanis.”

There are five major and several other smaller settlements of Pakistani Hindu immigrants in Jodhpur and about 7,000 Hindus continue to live as asylum seekers all across the State.

While spending harsh desert winters under the open sky and sleeping out the nights on wet ground make for extremely inhuman living conditions, for the 171 Pakistani Hindus, cramped in a small cluster of makeshift tents on the outskirts of Jodhpur, it is just another chapter in the story of their collective misery.

At this point, the one thing they are concerned about is to get the “refugee status” from the Government of India.Both the Centre and the State government are absolutely indifferent to their plight. All they are demanding is to be declared refugees but the government is shying away because then it will have to provide them with basic facilities like food and shelter,” says Hindu Singh Sodha of the Seemant Lok Sangathan, which has been working with Hindu immigrants from Pakistan.

Unlike other refugees living in India, these people have not crossed over to the country illegally but have visas and passports, points out Mr. Sodha. He feels that the indifference might have stemmed from the fact that the asylum seekers are Bhil tribals with little or no representation in the government or the bureaucracy.

Of late, members of castes like Jats and Malis have also started coming over. Perhaps that will make the government take notice,” he adds.

Four years ago, the Rajasthan government had constituted a high-level committee to address the lingering issue of the Pakistani aslyum seekers. However, Mr. Sodha, who is also on the committee, says the panel has not met even once.
{Of course, we know the reason. The refugees are kafir}
Earlier, people used to cross over via Attari along the Wagah border but since 2006, the Thar Express, an international train service connecting Jodhpur to Karachi, has been the preferred mode of transport for those seeking entry into India.

“Going through the Punjab border used to be a tormenting endeavour. Punjabi soldiers on the Pakistan side used to abuse us and call us kafirs for travelling to India. But Sindhi officers do not care as long as they get their share of bribes and cuts from the ticket prices,” says Gowardhan, who came to Jodhpur five years ago.

Till a few years ago, people came to India on a visitor's visa but with visa restrictions getting tougher, the pilgrim visa has emerged as a surer way to book a berth aboard the Thar Express. Getting a pilgrim visa is easier, especially in view of the ongoing kumbh mela .

Getting tickets to board the Thar Express, however, is also a challenge. “The journey from Karachi to Bhagat ki Kothi station in Jodhpur costs a little over Rs. 400 but when authorities see groups of people desperate to cross over, they charge much more. We paid Rs. 700 each for 171 tickets,” says Chetan.

Once they are here, most of them stay in Jodhpur; but many also fan out to remote villages spread across districts of western Rajasthan.

We originally belong to Jaisalmer but during the 1960s drought, our families crossed over to Sindh in search of labour and settled there. For us, it was easier to go to Sindh than to Gujarat because of the distance. Also the border used to be very porous then,” says Premchand, who crossed over 10 years ago.

In the 70s, we were given identity cards under the Zufikar Ali Bhutto government. It was all good till the Babri masjid demolition in India, after which things took a turn for the worse and we realised we were in the danger of being persecuted,” he says.

Interviews with the asylum seekers suggest the Hindu minorities in Sindh have been living under the shadow of segregation and persecution on religious grounds. People said the harassment was manifested in Hindu children being discriminated against in government schools, Hindu residents not being allowed to buy property and bullied into leaving their establishments among others.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Supratik » 15 Feb 2013 22:25

+1

Also I hear so much angst about Govt. control of Hindu temples. Have the BJP Govts. ever done anything to bring this to an end or is it just mere posturing/

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Suraj » 15 Feb 2013 23:49

anmol wrote:
hnair wrote:^^^ Indeed, Suraj. Even better would be to provide subtitles to the video in various languages (or a voice over). This sort of oratory models are gravely missing, amongst the rabble-rouser types that dominate the current scene.


I can do Hindi to english subtitle.

Its pretty easy, download the video and open it in a subtitle editor and start typing.

One nice (free) subtitle editor for WIndows: http://code.google.com/p/subtitleedit/downloads/list

Thanks anmol! Please do so and link the URL so others can post it around.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby kish » 16 Feb 2013 00:31

sum wrote:Well known resident $%#^, Shri Katju on why India needs to be saved from NaMo:
All the perfumes of Arabia


The truth today is that Muslims in Gujarat are terrorised and afraid that if they speak out against the horrors of 2002 they may be attacked and victimised. In the whole of India, Muslims (who number over 200 million) are solidly against Mr. Modi (though there are a handful of Muslims who for some reason disagree).



I appeal to the people of India to consider all this if they are really concerned about the nation’s future. Otherwise they may make the same mistake which the Germans made in 1933.

Islam Khatre mein hain!!!


GoI is underplaying this number, former judge is stating its "over" 200 million. Don't know who is lying! The numbers of other predatory religion too would be high, but somehow it remains at a constant 2% of the population of India.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RamaY » 16 Feb 2013 01:00

^ Per justice Katju, Justice Katju is an idiot.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ramana » 16 Feb 2013 01:18

Sonia ladrona!!!

In Italian means "Sonia, Big Thief!!!"

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Hari Seldon » 16 Feb 2013 04:12

Already posted on here perhaps but still, here goes...

Chopper scam: BJP leader Kirit Somaiya writes to CBI, seeks probe against Rahul Gandhi's key aide

Citing a report of Italian newspaper Lettera 43, Somaiya wrote: "The main commission agent Christian Michel's late father was 'close to the Congress party' and the other middleman, Guido Ralph Haschke, was a director of Emaar-MGF."


Why in this dhaga? Well, since its important to bring out the true face of dynasty as well, while we're dissecting NaMo's vision and actions....

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Hari Seldon » 16 Feb 2013 04:48

Meanwhile, in non-NDA circles also truth is beginning to cut through status quo cataract...

Ganta enlightened by CM Modi, Wants To Replicate Gujarat Model In AP

Hyderabad: Former Prajarajyam party leader Ganta Srinivasa Rao holds the portfolio of investment and infrastructure but is yet to imbibe the philosophy of the Congress party.In a move that is likely to ruffle feathers in the party high command,the minister has moved a proposal that is sure to give the credit to Gujarat chief minister Narendra Modi ahead of the 2014 elections.Prajarajyam party was merged with the Congress last year.

After a visit to Gujarat which included paying respects to Modi,the Andhra Pradesh minister has decided to set up a maritime board on the lines of what exists in Gujarat.Accordingly,the Andhra Pradesh Maritime Board bill is to be introduced in the budget session of the state assembly in March. As per Gantas own revelations he met with Modi for 45 minutes - to discuss the strategies that Gujarat followed to exploit its coastline so that the same can be emulated in AP that has a coastline of 960 km.Even though only three states,Gujarat,Maharashtra and Tamil Nadu,have set up maritime boards,Gujarat stands out as a model to be emulated, Ganta Srinivasa Rao told TOI full of praise for Narendra Modi.

The minister said his interactions with Modi were illuminating and said that the Gujarat maritime board model would be useful for Andhra Pradesh as well.Modi explained to me how Gujarat has derived the maximum benefit out of it long coastline.The board controls 41 minor ports in the state.Andhra Pradesh has an equal potential to develop smaller ports, Rao said.


Heh.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby vijayk » 16 Feb 2013 05:19

^^ Ganta rings the bell of truth and Kaju reaches the nadir of stupidity

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Prem » 16 Feb 2013 05:33

Who Sang the Swan Song of Suckulings?

Naa Yeh Taaj Rahe , Naa Yeh Raj Rahe
Na Rahe yeh Raaaaaaj Gharaaaana !!

OoSka Naam Modi, Gharana Annam
Behti Hai Sabarmatim Wanha uska dhaam.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Lilo » 16 Feb 2013 05:48

Kajtu's vomit has all the usual requirements supposed to trigger muslim fears against modi - the cherry picked "anecdotes" and "facts" are a dead give away.
Congerez is raising the specter of the big bad Wolf (aka Modi) in trying to cajole its now wandering sheep (aka muslim votebanks).

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Hari Seldon » 16 Feb 2013 06:02

^^Good. i do hop katju and other professional psecs vomit more and often. Will immunize aam aadmi to their bilge that much faster and make them that much easier to ignore. Like has happened with arundhoti who burnt out from overexposure of her true colors.

Meanwhile...

Congress bets on Gandhi magic: The party is pinning its hopes on Rahul's mystique to make a comeback in Karnataka

'mystique'? Or mistake??

Rahul Gandhi could not have asked for a better electoral debut than the Karnakata Assembly elections in April-May. With the ruling BJP in self-destruct mode, media surveys show that all the Congress needs to do is select the right candidates to win a simple majority in the state's 224-seat Assembly

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby sanjeevpunj » 16 Feb 2013 18:44

President Pranab Mukherjee is 78, Prime Minister Dr Manmohan Singh is 80 years old. Three of our last four prime ministers before Dr Singh were septuagenarians when they demitted office. While PV Narasimha Rao was 75, Atal Bihari Vajpayee and Inder Kumar Gujral were 79 and 77 respectively. Modi is now 63 years old.By the time elections are done, he will probably be 64. Rahul is on the other hand, is 20 years younger to Modi.A lot of young parliamentarians will possibly elect Rahul. If Modi is elected, we will again have a gerontocratic state of affairs at the top. I definitely like what Modi has done, but we want younger leaders to come into the powerplay.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby fanne » 16 Feb 2013 18:54

I am young sir, please vote for me

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Hari Seldon » 16 Feb 2013 18:57

^flamebait. Onlee. Fair waring, folks.

Meanwhile, psec spin and pressure on amitabh produces expected results...
Not brand ambassador for Modi, just promoting Gujarat Tourism, says Amitabh Bachchan

whew. tks AB sahib. Here's the actual quote:

"The Gujarat campaign is a push for tourism. It has nothing do with the political beliefs of Modi. Gujarat is a part of India and I support tourism in that part of the country. I am promoting my country. I don't see any wrong in that. My tourism campaign doesn't mean I am aligning myself to Modi. In a democratic society, we follow certain democratic rules and accordingly if he's chosen in a role which is Prime Minister, that's the choice of the people," he said.


slip of tongue? last I know NM is a CM and not PM (yet). Anyway, at least Aby's heart is in the right place, anyone thinking of NM as PM can't be bad only.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_20292 » 16 Feb 2013 21:22

Refuting Katju;

http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/a ... 415539.ece

Narendra Modi is being projected by a large section of Indians as the modern Moses, the one who will lead the beleaguered and despondent Indian people into a land of milk and honey, the man who is best suited to be the next Indian Prime Minister. And it is not just the Bharatiya Janata Party and RSS who are saying this at the Kumbh Mela. A large section of the Indian so-called ‘educated’ class, including many of our ‘educated’ youth, who have been carried away by Mr. Modi’s propaganda is saying this.


False. No one is getting carried away by "propaganda" and use of this term reflects on the thinking of the writer.


The truth today is that Muslims in Gujarat are terrorised and afraid that if they speak out against the horrors of 2002 they may be attacked and victimised. In the whole of India, Muslims (who number over 200 million) are solidly against Mr. Modi (though there are a handful of Muslims who for some reason disagree).


Mr katju, deal is this. Unlike junta like you who writes letters for a living, ordinary men and women actually have to, well, work.

Getting up to running water in the morning, having electricity running your fan in the night, having schools working, having society as a whole function well, and resultantly, having your life and your surroundings working well, is, on the whole, more important for the people of Gujarat than to score points against the butcher of XYZ.

It is this FACT that , sorry to use the term, 'mental masturbators' in Indian society, in the news media, in the govt. CANNOT understand. They spend their lives and times chasing the right POLICY.

Well , people, the right POLICY is getting things done. Bijli Sadak Pani, jobs. Can you do that? If you can, then do it. Wanking and giving fundas is not going to get things done and put money in the bank and food on the table.

Dubious spontaneity

It is claimed by Modi supporters that what happened in Gujarat was only a ‘spontaneous’ reaction (pratikriya) of Hindus to the killing of 59 Hindus on a train in Godhra. I do not buy this story. First, there is still mystery as to what exactly happened in Godhra. Secondly, the particular persons who were responsible for the Godhra killings should certainly be identified and given harsh punishment, but how does this justify the attack on the entire Muslim community in Gujarat? Muslims are only 9 per cent of the total population of Gujarat, the rest being mostly Hindus. In 2002 Muslims were massacred, their homes burnt, and other horrible crimes committed on them.

To call the killings of Muslims in 2002 a spontaneous reaction reminds one of Kristallnacht in Germany in November 1938, when the entire Jewish community in Germany was attacked, many killed, their synagogues burnt, shops vandalised after a German diplomat in Paris was shot dead by a Jewish youth whose family had been persecuted by the Nazis. It was claimed by the Nazi government that this was only a ‘spontaneous’ reaction, but in fact it was planned and executed by the Nazi authorities using fanatic mobs.


If you hate Modi so much....why was he aquitted by the Indian supreme courts, which you were associated with ? Since he has been aquitted by a PROFESSIONAL body, either take that judgement and live with it (this would be a prudent choice, given that you yourself worked in that body for the longest amount of time), OR, file another FIR and pursue Modi till the end of time.

In terms of historical evolution, India is broadly a country of immigrants and consequently, it is a land of tremendous diversity. Hence, the only policy which can hold it together and put it on the path of progress is secularism — equal respect and treatment to all communities and sects. This was the policy of the great Emperor Akbar, which was followed by our founding fathers (Pandit Nehru and his colleagues) who gave us a secular Constitution. Unless we follow this policy, our country cannot survive for one day, because it has so much diversity, so many religions, castes, languages, ethnic groups.


Modi presides over 10% YOY growth and is reelectred thrice. Neither Nehru nor Akbar can claim to have achieved this. Akbars greatness is dubitable.
India, therefore, does not belong to Hindus alone; it belongs equally to Muslims, Sikhs, Christians, Parsees, Jains etc. Also, it is not only Hindus who can live in India as first-rate citizens while others have to live as second or third rate citizens. All are first-rate citizens here. The killing of thousands of Muslims and other atrocities on them in Gujarat in 2002 can never be forgotten or forgiven. All the perfumes in Arabia cannot wash away the stain on Mr. Modi in this connection.


All these first rate citizens want to have bijli and running water Sir. They are sensible Indians.

Non-sensible people in world, who have acted butt-hurt for the longest amount of time, include the Kashmiris and the Palestinians. Acting butt hurt is not going to get anyone anywhere.

It is said by his supporters that Mr. Modi had no hand in the killings, and it is also said that he had not been found guilty by any court of law. I do not want to comment on our judiciary, but I certainly do not buy the story that Mr. Modi had no hand in the events of 2002. He was the Chief Minister of Gujarat at the time when horrible events happened on such a large scale. Can it be believed that he had no hand in them? At least I find this impossible to believe.


Your word vs Modis. Cant believe this writing comes from an ex Supreme Court judge.

Let me give just one example. Ehsan Jafri was a respected, elderly former Member of Parliament living in the Chamanpura locality of Ahmedabad in Gujarat. His house was in the Gulbarga Housing Society, where mostly Muslims lived. According to the recorded version of his elderly wife Zakia, on February 28, 2002 a mob of fanatics blew up the security wall of the housing society using gas cylinders. They dragged Ehsan Jafri out of his house, stripped him, chopped off his limbs with swords and burnt him alive. Many other Muslims were also killed and their houses burnt. Chamanpura is barely a kilometre from a police station, and less than two kilometres from the Ahmedabad Police Commissioner’s office. Is it conceivable that the Chief Minister did not know what was going on? Zakia Jafri has since then been running from pillar to post to get justice for her husband who was so brutally murdered. Her criminal case against Mr. Modi was thrown out by the district court (since the Special Investigation Team appointed by the Supreme Court found no evidence against him and filed a final report), and it is only now (after a gap of over 10 years) that the Supreme Court has set aside the order of the trial court and directed that her protest petition be considered.


Now you are acting butt hurt.....



Mr. Modi has claimed that he has developed Gujarat. It is therefore necessary to consider the meaning of ‘development’. To my mind development can have only one meaning, and that is raising the standard of living of the masses. Giving concessions to big industrial houses, and offering them cheap land and cheap electricity can hardly be called development if it does not raise the standard of living of the masses.


Big capitalists employ people. THese people are paid salaries. This raise the standard of living of the masses.
Either ways....we want our Tata Indicas and Nanos/small cars. So either they are built (after a lot of debate about what is equitable govt and development and drama and tantrums) or we import them.

This tata nano /santro helps me get to work in the morning , which gives me my salary , which raises my standard of living.....

Questionable progress

Today, 48 per cent of Gujarati children are malnourished, which is a higher rate of malnourishment than the national average. In Gujarat, there is a high infant mortality rate, high women’s maternity death rate, and 57 per cent poverty rate in tribal areas, and among Scheduled Castes/Backward Castes. As stated by Ramachandra Guha in his recent article in The Hindu (“The man who would rule India”, February 8) environmental degradation is rising, educational standards are falling, and malnutrition among children is abnormally high. More than a third of adult men in Gujarat have a body mass index of less than 18.5 — the seventh worst in the country. A UNDP report in 2010 has placed Gujarat after eight other Indian States in multiple dimensions of development: health, education, income levels, etc.


Please quote and cite statistics published officially. Do not utter, utter bilge.

Business leaders no doubt claim that Mr. Modi has created a business friendly environment in Gujarat, but are businessmen the only people in India?


No. But they are also not, meaningless. They provide employment to thousands of people. I wonder how many people you personally have provided employment to in a sustainable manner?
I appeal to the people of India to consider all this if they are really concerned about the nation’s future. Otherwise they may make the same mistake which the Germans made in 1933.

(Markandey Katju, a former judge of the Supreme Court, is Chairman of the Press Council of India)


Mr Katju, the above is a EXTRAORDINARILY emotional piece of writing. Thoroughly unprofessional and unobjective.
Since, having retired from the Court, I hope you find time to read up on economics and history , and understand its importance in the scheme of things.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sushupti » 16 Feb 2013 21:29

sum wrote:Well known resident $%#^, Shri Katju on why India needs to be saved from NaMo:
All the perfumes of Arabia

Narendra Modi is being projected by a large section of Indians as the modern Moses, the one who will lead the beleaguered and despondent Indian people into a land of milk and honey, the man who is best suited to be the next Indian Prime Minister. And it is not just the Bharatiya Janata Party and RSS who are saying this at the Kumbh Mela. A large section of the Indian so-called ‘educated’ class, including many of our ‘educated’ youth, who have been carried away by Mr. Modi’s propaganda is saying this.

I was flying from Delhi to Bhopal recently. Sitting beside me was a Gujarati businessman. I asked him his opinion of Mr. Modi. He was all praise for him. I interjected and asked him about the killing of nearly 2,000 Muslims in 2002 in Gujarat. He replied that Muslims were always creating problems in Gujarat, but after 2002 they have been put in their place and there is peace since then in the State. I told him this is the peace of the graveyard, and peace can never last long unless it is coupled with justice. At this remark he took offence and changed his seat on the plane.

The truth today is that Muslims in Gujarat are terrorised and afraid that if they speak out against the horrors of 2002 they may be attacked and victimised. In the whole of India, Muslims (who number over 200 million) are solidly against Mr. Modi (though there are a handful of Muslims who for some reason disagree).



I appeal to the people of India to consider all this if they are really concerned about the nation’s future. Otherwise they may make the same mistake which the Germans made in 1933.

Islam Khatre mein hain!!!


Tight slap in the face of Katju.

Justice For 10000 Killed In Gujarat 2002

Like a box of parrots, Aakar Patel, Ram Guha, others and now MK, everyone in the media lately talks about “Malnutrition” in Gujarat. Even students who are called for debates are tutored to talk of “Malnutrition” in Gujarat. Funny huh? Malnutrition is a national problem and so too in Gujarat, maybe across the world in some countries. But where the other tags failed they are now into the “Malnutrition” song and dance routine. Here’s how their mundane rant has become and how foolish it really sounds:

Great roads in Gujarat: Okay, but what about malnutrition?
Great infrastructure in Gujarat: Okay, but what about malnutrition?
24X7 Power supply: Okay, but what about malnutrition?
Water in Sabarmati: Okay, but what about malnutrition?
Special incentives for girls: Okay, okay, but what about malnutrition?
Crores of investments: Yeah alright, but what about malnutrition?
Women can move safely: Who cares? What about malnutrition?
Modi is not corrupt & incorruptible: Corruption is normal, what about malnutrition?
Sex-determination tests banned: Minor issue, what about malnutrition?
GDP growth over national average: Fine, fine, what about malnutrition?
DoubleDigit Agri growth for years: See the “larger” picture, what about malnutrition?

So, now that everything else has failed the last straw to clutch is the magic word called malnutrition. And I promise you, you will hear this word over and over again in the next one year. I can understand the agenda of the media mafia but considering MK is a lawman one would have expected a more logical and sensible approach with his criticism. Nothing like that! He too sounds like a parrot. So whether it’s 2000 or 3000 or 5000 killed as these magicians keep pulling out from their hats, what’s wrong if I pull out a Matka figure of 10000? For that matter, what’s wrong if I pulled out a figure of 1 lakh even? There are some newspapers and TV channels who are as good as a Matka. They provide the platform for the Matka logic and some writers are the cards.

http://www.mediacrooks.com/

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Kanson » 16 Feb 2013 21:32

In terms of historical evolution, India is broadly a country of immigrants and consequently, it is a land of tremendous diversity. Hence, the only policy which can hold it together and put it on the path of progress is secularism — equal respect and treatment to all communities and sects. This was the policy of the great Emperor Akbar, which was followed by our founding fathers (Pandit Nehru and his colleagues) who gave us a secular Constitution. Unless we follow this policy, our country cannot survive for one day, because it has so much diversity, so many religions, castes, languages, ethnic groups.


Akbar? not Asoka? :rotfl: If these junkets pass as 'intellectual', hey Ram!

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_23629 » 17 Feb 2013 00:28

^^^ Katju is a well-known buffoon. There must be something wrong with the judicial service if such deranged jokers can slip through the cracks to become judges. This whole generation of Indians which spent their youth under Nehru's influence has to pass away before things can improve. These people are in their sixties now. We have to wait for 20 more years before they start to kick the bucket.
Last edited by member_23629 on 17 Feb 2013 15:19, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby krisna » 17 Feb 2013 03:08

ST replies to NaMo speech with glass metaphor

ST ripped off by yinterent yindoos again. see the kaments. only 18 so far, but fun to read. :rotfl:
sample this-
Who told mr.tharoor to think about glass...first think about your 3 marriages then come to glass Mr.Tharoor

ST don't have any knowledge about india and its culture. Running a country is not like a buying an IPL team. he is fit to be a joker for united nations. He don't have about credibility to talk about NAMO.

One more thing - the other half of glass which in Modi's way of approach, is filled with air. Perhaps the reason the Congress minister thinks it is half empty, is because after coalgate, they must be anticipating air-gate ! i.e. make air disappear, just like coal disappeared.... These comments just shows the desperation Congress must be feeling.... There is more coming.... Be ready....
:rotfl: :((

Good to see that tube-light comes on within Modi's opponents. At least it shows that they are listening to Modi's address, despite claiming otherwise. It also shows how afraid they are of Modi's speech, and even to students, that they have all Senior Ministers shooting all guns ! If this is the case with just one address, be ready for Modi, when he comes to Delhi, with undivided attention.... Cannot wait till 2014.... All the best....

You say don't be cynical but that is exactly what you did. you criticize someone else for your own benefit

Shashi Tharoor is always seeking publicity by any stunts. He should present AND, more importantly, implement his own vision in the speediest manner rather than take potshots at others who deliver development at an unprecedented pace!


ST is in the wrong party, becoming useless. Hope he does some good work not just speeches.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RamaY » 17 Feb 2013 04:59

ST is a wrong guy from get go. He just ended up in a party that encourages his kind.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Anindya » 17 Feb 2013 08:52

Regarding the Katju article - what needs to be explicitly stated is that the Godhra train burnings are eerily similar to the Dabgarwad burnings of 1985. In fact Haji Bilal's mob stopping the firebrigade from approaching the burning Sabarmati is pretty much the same as what happened in Dabgarwad, The only difference was the scale.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_20292 » 17 Feb 2013 09:01

st is a talker and a diplomat. Perfectly suitable for mea . No admin jobs though.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RamaY » 17 Feb 2013 09:09

Could anyone point out a single contribution of ST to Indian interests? Even his campaign for UN-SG position was done more for personal benefit that is sold as Indian value.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ramana » 17 Feb 2013 09:35

No thats not right. If he had won it would be feather in the cap for India.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_20292 » 17 Feb 2013 14:50

RamaY wrote:Could anyone point out a single contribution of ST to Indian interests? Even his campaign for UN-SG position was done more for personal benefit that is sold as Indian value.


Qn in general.

If I do something in my own interest...since I am an Indian, something in my interest, is in India's interest?

Yes?
No?

Doing something in public/India's interest does not have to mean that one builds a road a railway or a dam, inaugrates a new school, or starts a pro-poor scheme.

Self interest is the primary interest. All others come after one can stay afloat oneself.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sanku » 17 Feb 2013 15:02

mahadevbhu wrote:
RamaY wrote:Could anyone point out a single contribution of ST to Indian interests? Even his campaign for UN-SG position was done more for personal benefit that is sold as Indian value.


Qn in general.

If I do something in my own interest...since I am an Indian, something in my interest, is in India's interest?

Yes?
No?

Doing something in public/India's interest does not have to mean that one builds a road a railway or a dam, inaugrates a new school, or starts a pro-poor scheme.

Self interest is the primary interest. All others come after one can stay afloat oneself.


Self interest being primary is acceptable as long at is aligned or at least not opposed to the greater national interest. If it is, then it is selfishness. There is always such a distinction.

In any case if that is the standard of merit, Shashi Tharoor should get exactly the same air time as a poor rickshaw puller who is also looking at his self interest. In fact the rickshaw puller is more honest, is more aligned with real India and interests, has not been known to have his hand in the till, and makes a very honest day of labor.

More than can be said for cardboard cutout for coconut oil company.

We need more honest Rickshaw pullers in public life with greater profile than completely empty self seekers whose only credential is the sliver tongued english speaking

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby anmol » 17 Feb 2013 15:51

Suraj wrote:Thanks anmol! Please do so and link the URL so others can post it around.


Modi's Speech with English Subtitle.: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-FVWk_S2Zk
Subtitle: http://www.mediafire.com/?8x2xp37eh7m431j

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby anmol » 17 Feb 2013 15:52


Hari Seldon
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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Hari Seldon » 17 Feb 2013 16:50

Times are changing, Muslim hostility to Modi softening: Jamiat leader Maulana Madani

In an exclusive interview to Rahul Kanwal on Aaj Tak's Seedhi Baat programme, Jamiat Ulema-e-Hind leader Maulana Mehmood Madani admitted there's a change in the Muslim psyche towards Modi.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby fanne » 17 Feb 2013 18:15

Guys why this confusion on ST. Please read what Atri ji wrote. He has given the framework to judge action (as given in Mahabharata) I quote -

Do not judge an act as good OR bad. No act is of higher OR lower stature. It is higher OR lower based on the driving force behind that act. Right action is achieved by the means of coordinated efforts in two directions - Controlling the six enemies (Kaama/Krodha/Lobha/Moha/Mada/Matsara) and strengthening Dharmik intent of the mind. Any action under influence of these six enemies is bad action.
Ahimsaa (nonviolence) and Satya (truth) are the two main pillars of Dharma. A decision on what is truth, under difficult circumstances, should be made by choosing that course of action which would lead to highest good of all that is (Bhuta). And Ahimsa is when person wishes and acts for benefit of all keeping the true understanding of Justice (Nyaya) and virtues (GuNa)."

Decide if ST siad was right or his winning for UN would have been good (in my opinion judging what if is the most useless thing you can do, the act did not happen and then to ascribe fruit (fala) of that act and waste hours discussing it is useless.)

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RamaY » 17 Feb 2013 20:09

Ramanaji

I disagree. ST as a central minister was a disaster. ST as an MP is a disaster. ST as an Indian visiting Pakistan was a disaster (my blog has a post on this - http://bharata-bhuti.blogspot.com/2012/ ... r-inc.html). How can he be an asset to India if he were to be elected as SG? He would have pulled his "universal citizenship" nonsense the moment he gets elected.

An Indian becoming the president of USA will mean nothing, if the individual thinks, works and believes in US self-interests and acts as any other USA president. We have been learning from Bobby Jinxal experience ain't it.

I would rather have any individual from any race in any position as long as he stands for SD world view.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Hari Seldon » 17 Feb 2013 20:19

^^ Come to think of it, thats the reason so many of us here on this dhaga admire NM (IMVVHO) - he may well be a staunch atheist for all I care - but his every word and deed is in Indian interest. Impossible not to admire such an individual.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RamaY » 17 Feb 2013 21:33

Sorry SouthTN vadis...

Ahmedabad (when is NM renaming it to some Indic name :(( )is the 5th largest city by population pushing chennai into 6th place...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mo ... s_in_India
Last edited by RamaY on 17 Feb 2013 21:58, edited 1 time in total.


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