Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ramana » 08 Jul 2013 20:58

Murugan, What exactly he said in a few lines. Can't click on FB from my location.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Chandragupta » 08 Jul 2013 21:08

He says IB should never give any inputs, this government has embroiled one agency against the other, CBI v/s IB; MI v/s NIA and ATS. He says & I quote "We people don't deserve to live. This is what this government has declared in no uncertain terms'. He also makes comments about arrest of Lt.Purohit and 26/11; Nitish's visit to Pakistan & why did he go there? North Bihar has become a haven for LeT and IM after NiKu's visit to Pakistan. The entire Political class & Bureaucracy is being blackmailed by Hafiz Sayeed because he controls Hawala routes.

You should view the video in full.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Ashok Sarraff » 08 Jul 2013 21:16

More detailed version with better video of the RSN Singh (ex-RAW) on India News:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKyLHMS6 ... be&t=5m59s

Overall, it seems RAW has good ground-level insights on jihadis (and Naxalites and politicians).

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Muppalla » 08 Jul 2013 21:39

ramana garu, just pat on your back yourself. Folks need to visit the Malegaon thread and also first 10 to 15 pages of 2G thread on Start forum. In those days all those post used to look like long shot CTs. N3 also contributed in the early days of Malegaon thread (or may be in India Interests thread of that time). The RAW/IB folks are now revolting and now things are unravelling. It is possbile some accidents could occur and we may not see RSN Singh. Indian roads are always hazardous with no dividers and easy to get killed in a head on collison as trucks don't have driving sense.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Murugan » 08 Jul 2013 22:10

Mupalla-ji, your apprehension can be supported by these examples of mysterious deaths

LBS
SP Mukherjee
JP Narayan
Din Dayal Upadhyay
Probably Rajiv Dixit
Attempt to kill Balakrishna Maharaj when he was in custody (Ramdev claims he has all the info)

But these guy RSN Singh, despite knowing this, has very strong conscience and conviction. He is actually expressing what is there in IB and other such agencies

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby SwamyG » 08 Jul 2013 22:27

Chandragupta wrote:He says IB should never give any inputs, this government has embroiled one agency against the other, CBI v/s IB; MI v/s NIA and ATS. He says & I quote "We people don't deserve to live. This is what this government has declared in no uncertain terms'. He also makes comments about arrest of Lt.Purohit and 26/11; Nitish's visit to Pakistan & why did he go there? North Bihar has become a haven for LeT and IM after NiKu's visit to Pakistan. The entire Political class & Bureaucracy is being blackmailed by Hafiz Sayeed because he controls Hawala routes.

You should view the video in full.

There was this weakling, dunno who it was - because they had some graphics instead of the panelist on the screen, who tried to weasel out saying (paraphrasing) "One can go to Lahore for tourism". RSNS responded with such a loaded sarcasm....when he spoke except this weakling the entire panel was stunned and speechless. The anchor to her credit highlighted this was a serious accusation, and RSNS boldly accepted that he was indeed doing that.

Ramana garu, you can find RSNS accusation and points in this article:
Why are some of our politicians so afraid of Hafiz Saeed? He also briefly pointed in that discussion some of his other points from his other article: Indian Politicians: Pakistan's Proxy Soldiers

Like I said elsewhere in another dhaaga, some issues are no longer in the realm of CTs.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby fanne » 08 Jul 2013 22:33

There was this current JDU office bearer (probably apposed to NK), who had accused (video linked on this thread itself) that NK got funds from eye ass eye. I had dismissed that at that time as intra-party fight but who knows. In my personal opiniom, laloo is a buffoon but Niku is way dangerous than him. My 2 cents.
rgds,
fanne

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby abhishek_sharma » 08 Jul 2013 22:35

Hasn't Laloo visited Pakistan too? Wasn't he friends with MCC? Isn't Laloo an ally of UPA? It is difficult to see how he is better than Nitish Kumar.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby fanne » 08 Jul 2013 22:38

Will explain later, at work, not supposed to type many things..

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Prem » 08 Jul 2013 22:51

Muppalla wrote:ramana garu, just pat on your back yourself. Folks need to visit the Malegaon thread and also first 10 to 15 pages of 2G thread on Start forum. In those days all those post used to look like long shot CTs. N3 also contributed in the early days of Malegaon thread (or may be in India Interests thread of that time). The RAW/IB folks are now revolting and now things are unravelling. It is possbile some accidents could occur and we may not see RSN Singh. Indian roads are always hazardous with no dividers and easy to get killed in a head on collison as trucks don't have driving sense.


The guy should have specified that PM office too is compromised because of current political compulsions.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby SwamyG » 08 Jul 2013 23:46

Jhujar wrote:The guy should have specified that PM office too is compromised because of current political compulsions.

He kind of did, though did not go all the way.
Here is what he wrote just after the Blr vispot: http://www.sify.com/news/a-comparative- ... hjdhe.html

Unfortunately, the prime minister, Mr Manmohan Singh also displayed his ugly political side. He did not spare a word of sympathy for the victims of the blast just as he had done for the victims in Boston. He was probably still weighing political gains and loss.


When the leader of the country does not look into the eyes of his people and talk to them in such hours of crisis, speculations and rumours are bound to overtake the truth. A leader leads public opinion and does not pander to it.


Here is an old article from him on the qualities of a PM: http://www.sify.com/news/who-is-indias- ... ghjcd.html {must read}. He again does not go all the way to explicitly call out MMS, but his parameters does not leave any room for doubt.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Vayutuvan » 08 Jul 2013 23:59

Murugan ji,

Murugan wrote:JP Narayan


that is a stretch, me thinks. He was suffering from kidney malfunction needing dialysis which was available only at a couple of hospitals in India - he was undergoing regular dialysis procedure at Jaslok where he died of kidney failure.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Prem » 09 Jul 2013 01:08

SwamyG wrote:
Jhujar wrote:The guy should have specified that PM office too is compromised because of current political compulsions.

He kind of did, though did not go all the way.
Here is what he wrote just after the Blr vispot: http://www.sify.com/news/a-comparative- ... hjdhe.html
Here is an old article from him on the qualities of a PM: http://www.sify.com/news/who-is-indias- ... ghjcd.html {must read}. He again does not go all the way to explicitly call out MMS, but his parameters does not leave any room for doubt.


Thanks,
There is another probabiiity. The communal angel is not only official and political but also observed as an extention of personal biases and prejudices at the highest level now.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Manish_Sharma » 09 Jul 2013 04:39

abhishek_sharma wrote:Hasn't Laloo visited Pakistan too? Wasn't he friends with MCC? Isn't Laloo an ally of UPA? It is difficult to see how he is better than Nitish Kumar.


Retired IB chief Shri PN Dhar has hinted in his book that Mulayam was getting ISI money via aligarh university.

Also I remember when Shri Advani had done jinnah thing in pakistan, and was getting brickbats from everywhere in desh, I only remember two men's comments:

1. Lalu "........This is advani's drama. General Musharraf had said that Agra summit had failed because of this one man (advani)........" (Notice how kargil perpatretor mushy is general musharraf for him, no shame for this @$%^&.)

2. Arjun Singh... (not worth it to mention).

So both yadavs having same formula of yadav + muslims have deep deep connections with porkis. In this maino environment lalu CM hota to aur gul khilataa.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sushupti » 09 Jul 2013 05:54

Narendra Modi to be formally named BJP's PM candidate at end of July

http://m.economictimes.com/news/politic ... 979571.cms

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby abhishek_sharma » 09 Jul 2013 06:37

Delhi Confidential

Putting on track

Two years after Mamata Banerjee announced in her last Rail Budget that the Railways would develop 20 stations in partnership with the Tourism Ministry, the latter has finally woken up to the proposal. After countless reminders, the latest by the just retired chairman of Railway Board, Vinay Mittal, the Tourism Ministry this week reverted to the Railways informing that it had decided to meet its end of the deal and pay 50 per cent of the project cost. Interestingly, the railway station at Rae Bareli — Sonia Gandhi's constituency — figures on top of the five stations selected for the first phase even though the place itself is hardly known for tourism attractions. The list of 20 stations approved by Mamata has more surprises. It lists places like Dooars and Furfura Sharif in Bengal, which do not even have stations yet.

House in order

While Rajasthan Congress leaders were, for long, cribbing about the party being undermined by Chief Minister Ashok Gehlot who paid no heed to state leaders, they may have some reasons to cheer after AICC general secretary Mukul Wasnik, who was AICC general secretary in charge of the state for over nine years, was divested of the charge in the recent organisational reshuffle. Wasnik's successor Gurudas Kamat has gone about reversing the trend. At a recent PCC meeting, he invited all Union ministers from the state and also two AICC general secretaries — C P Joshi and Mohan Prakash — who hail from the state. Joshi as also Union ministers like Sisram Ola and Girija Vyas are known Gehlot detractors. An astute politician that he is, Gehlot's next move is being keenly awaited.

Top of mind

Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi, who was in the capital to attend BJP Parliamentary Board meeting, called on senior party leader Murli Manohar Joshi at his residence on Monday. While the meeting was believed to be an attempt by Modi to reach out to Joshi, who had met RSS chief recently, the issue of Bodhgaya terror attack came up for a discussion. Joshi was said to be concerned about the target of the terror attack because another Buddhist pilgrimage site Sarnath falls in his Lok Sabha constituency.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby SwamyG » 09 Jul 2013 08:06

Jhujar wrote:Thanks,
There is another probabiiity. The communal angel is not only official and political but also observed as an extention of personal biases and prejudices at the highest level now.

Unfortunately I do not see many politicians with some ideology or intellectual leaning to even have biases. They seem to be opportunistic. There be ideologues here and there, but they are aging and thinning out. It is just getting to power and holding it by hook or crook. On second thoughts, us humans nurse grudges and biases nurtured over decades and centuries - mostly in the form of caste in India.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sachin » 09 Jul 2013 10:37

Pratyush wrote:It is just a matter of time before the secularity come out and attack the hindus over the bomb blasts.

The game is afoot, Watson ;).
NIA questions man for Bodh Gaya blasts
Based on a bag found in the temple premises, the police detained Vinod Mistri, resident of the Barachatti block in Gaya. “Vinod was picked up based on certain information. His photo identity card was found in the temple premises,” Abhayanand, Director General of Police, told reporters here

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Arunkumar » 09 Jul 2013 11:09

Media in print and TV is doing a larger than usual coverage of modi. TOI, for two consecutive days is giving its prime center editorial space for modi-bashing. On sunday it was a lady known for covering page-3 gupshup, writing to limit the damage for the dumbo-scambo remarks of Ms Lekhi. Yesterday it was a ex-diplomat turned advisor in jay - dee - (Ulema) writing something about polarising etc. Today its about inclusivness in cricket, but no points for guessing with whom the comparison was intended. This is apart from the little bit of sprinkling of negative news about BJP ruled states in other pages.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby niran » 09 Jul 2013 12:57

Sachin wrote:The game is afoot, Watson ;).
NIA questions man for Bodh Gaya blasts
Based on a bag found in the temple premises, the police detained Vinod Mistri, resident of the Barachatti block in Gaya. “Vinod was picked up based on certain information. His photo identity card was found in the temple premises,” Abhayanand, Director General of Police, told reporters here

He is a temple guide and ran away along with others running away after the blast took place
and when people flee to save their lives they flee they do not care about ID card or SIM card or whatever card, the sleuth uptill now have comeup with zilch from him and about him, Kolkotta
bolis have arrested a mujlim IM that same evening this chappie had returned from Gaya that day
(Gaya is few hours away from Kolkotta by train)some detonators were found and he is singing loike a proverbial canary has told the bolis that 5 participants including one wimmin.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby jagga » 09 Jul 2013 13:43

If Modi becomes PM, he will face a mammoth task to clear up all the filth.

Achievement of Con party. Below is the link from latest Transparency International's survey on bribery. India is among the top 14 countries in bribe giving.
Corruption getting worse, says poll
Countries worst than India in bribery are:
Cambodia, Cameroon, Kenya, Liberia, Libya, Mozambique, Senegal, Sierra Leone, Tanzania, Uganda, Yemen and Zimbabwe.

Have you paid a bribe?
Country Percentage
India 54
Afganistan 46
Pakistan 34
Bangladesh 39
Srilanka 19
Nepal 31

Jai Ho!

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby JohnTitor » 09 Jul 2013 14:33

jagga wrote:If Modi becomes PM, he will face a mammoth task to clear up all the filth.

Achievement of Con party. Below is the link from latest Transparency International's survey on bribery. India is among the top 14 countries in bribe giving.
Corruption getting worse, says poll
Countries worst than India in bribery are:
Cambodia, Cameroon, Kenya, Liberia, Libya, Mozambique, Senegal, Sierra Leone, Tanzania, Uganda, Yemen and Zimbabwe.

Have you paid a bribe?
Country Percentage
India 54
Afganistan 46
Pakistan 34
Bangladesh 39
Srilanka 19
Nepal 31

Jai Ho!

I suspect it is higher (at least slightly more) than those figures suggest. Because not everyone will admit to paying a bribe. Of course it will depend on who/where the question was asked. If it was on the street it would be relatively accurate.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby krishnan » 09 Jul 2013 14:36

its probably close to 70-75%

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby negi » 09 Jul 2013 14:53

100% in India; I count undue favours as bribes.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Rampy » 09 Jul 2013 15:47

Murugan wrote:Mupalla-ji, your apprehension can be supported by these examples of mysterious deaths

LBS
SP Mukherjee
JP Narayan
Din Dayal Upadhyay
Probably Rajiv Dixit
Attempt to kill Balakrishna Maharaj when he was in custody (Ramdev claims he has all the info)

But these guy RSN Singh, despite knowing this, has very strong conscience and conviction. He is actually expressing what is there in IB and other such agencies


I doubt, remember that IT commissioner from Mumbai who made allegation against Pranav, mr q in ramlila Maidan, I guess they will realize that nothing happens and they will shutup. I still believe be it RSN or IT commissioner or for that matter Anna have some sort of backing else they will become very vulnerable

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sushupti » 09 Jul 2013 16:38

Baba Ramdev's Message to BJP Leadership: People are with Narendra Modi


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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sri » 09 Jul 2013 17:33

Stratagems and Spoils

Good balanced article... Claims Rajnath Singh could be the dark horse... Anyways good long read. Apologies if posted earlier.

Few tid bits

Advani’s push for Gadkari as a counterweight to Modi is a minor detail, but it nicely illuminates the multiplying intrigues and rapidly shifting allegiances in the BJP’s current game of thrones. Although he had championed the effort to forcefully eject Gadkari from the president’s chair last year—over the fervent objections of the RSS—Advani was later convinced that Gadkari had been the victim of a conspiracy to tarnish him with an orchestrated campaign of planted stories in the media. Inside the BJP, suspicions pointed to Arun Jaitley, the Rajya Sabha opposition leader, who is known within the party as “bureau chief” for the extraordinary influence he wields at two large-selling national dailies where his favourite journalists run political bureaus. Although nobody knows whether Jaitley was actually responsible for the stories, most people in the BJP, including Advani, believe that he was. Jaitley and Advani, who were once seen as pupil and teacher, have been in enemy camps since last December, when Advani put forth his acolyte Sushma Swaraj, the party’s leader in the Lok Sabha and Jaitley’s bête noire, as a nominee to replace Gadkari as president.

Advani now believes that Gadkari was mistreated, and should therefore be compensated. But like everything else in the BJP right now, Advani’s advocacy also had an ulterior motive: going to bat for the former party president was a way to score points with the RSS chief Mohan Bhagwat, who is very close to Gadkari, his fellow Nagpur Brahmin.



It is important to note at this point that while Advani had resigned from three of his posts, he had not offered to vacate the most important one, as chairman of the BJP parliamentary party—a position that was specially created for him by amending the party constitution in 2009. His apparent intention to continue in this post was an indication, for both Singh and the RSS, that Advani was not really serious about quitting the party; he was using pressure tactics, and would happily withdraw his resignation if they appeared to acquiesce to at least some of his demands.

Bhagwat therefore suggested he would come to meet Advani in Delhi, and urged him to calm down. (The Advani camp claims that the RSS sarsanghchalak further “promised Advaniji that the BJP’s PM candidate will not be decided without his concurrence.”) Bhagwat and Advani made a tentative peace and, following a hastily convened meeting of the party’s highest decision-making body, its 12-member parliamentary board, a unanimous resolution was passed rejecting Advani’s resignation. Advani assented, still hoping that Bhagwat would concede to his wishes for a second election committee and promise not to formally project a PM candidate without his consent.

On the morning of 20 June, Advani went to the RSS’s Delhi offices in Jhandewalan for the promised meeting with Bhagwat. According to an RSS source privy to the details of the discussion, the meeting, which lasted more than an hour, was largely devoted to Advani’s complaints: the unacceptability of Modi as PM candidate, and the total disregard shown by Rajnath Singh to Advani’s cautionary advice about elevating Modi in Goa. Advani also pushed for he and Bhagwat to make the selection of the PM candidate—a decision in which he would like Singh, Jaitley and Soni to have as little influence as possible.

But what happened afterwards demonstrated that there were limits to how far the RSS would go to keep Advani in good humour. A brief statement issued by an RSS spokesman after the meeting suggested little more would be done to pacify Advani: it gave no assurances about Advani’s concerns and established that the RSS would maintain its authority over the decision-making process in the BJP. Later that day, when a Mail Today reporter asked M Venkaiah Naidu who the PM candidate would be, his response was blunt: “You all know who that candidate is.” In the same breath, Naidu cited a newly released Headlines Today poll to make his meaning even clearer. “According to the survey,” Naidu said, “63 percent people in Bihar believe Modi will make a better PM as opposed to 24 percent for Nitish. And these are the results when Modi hasn’t even begun campaigning there.”



Bhagwat’s close relationship with Modi is underscored by a connection between the two men that is described by the academic Nikita Sud in her 2012 book Liberalisation, Hindu Nationalism and the State: A Biography of Gujarat. Sud writes that the Gujarat chief minister was an ardent follower of Bhagwat’s father Madhukar, the first RSS swayamsevak deputed to Saurashtra and mainland Gujarat in 1940 to establish the Sangh in the state. In April 2009, only two weeks after Mohan Bhagwat was selected as sarsanghchalak, Modi paid public tribute to Madhukar Bhagwat at an event in Chandrapur, Maharashtra, the elder Bhagwat’s birthplace, calling him a pillar of the RSS who had been a great influence on the Gujarat chief minister during his days as a young pracharak.

The elder Bhagwat was a committed swayamsevak who helped build a strong foundation for the Sangh in Gujarat, a state characterised by the absence of progressive movements and the heavy presence of revivalist currents like the Arya Samaj and Hindu Mahasabha. Though it was then politically dormant, the RSS in Gujarat grew into a potent cultural force, shaping public discourse and popularising the writings of VD Savarkar, Dayanand Saraswati, and KM Munshi. It was Munshi who, as a minister in Nehru’s Cabinet, laid the groundwork for the future Ram Janmabhoomi movement through his campaign for the “resurrection” of Gujarati and Indian pride by rebuilding the Somnath temple, which had been destroyed by Muslim invaders a thousand years earlier. (He was helped in this venture by another Gujarati Cabinet minister, Vallabhbhai Patel.)



In this situation, the BJP risks finding itself unable to assemble the allies needed to form a majority with Modi at the helm. This is the Gujarat chief minister’s biggest weakness, and a point of relative strength for all the members of the Delhi Club—especially Advani, who has learnt at much personal cost that the BJP is not capable of winning the 272 seats required for a majority in the Lok Sabha on its own. Advani also knows that many top leaders in the party, as well as several of its regional satraps, are uneasy about the prospect of an uncompromising autocrat like Modi taking control of the party’s command structure and dousing their own future aspirations. No one in Delhi—including Modi’s close friend Jaitley—is eager to be engulfed by his larger than life persona. Finally, Advani, Swaraj and Jaitley all know that the allies will seek a ‘compromise’ PM before agreeing to join the BJP if it emerges as the single largest party without having enough votes to insist on Modi.

This same electoral calculus was surely on the mind of Nitish Kumar, whose decision to part ways with the BJP was ultimately political rather than ideological, in spite of his recent speeches about secularism. The BJP has never won more than 182 seats in a Lok Sabha election, and if it cannot top that figure in 2014, its putative allies may be in a position to demand an alternative to Modi—or, Kumar presumably hopes, to put forth one of their own for the position. The other regional parties who might consider an alliance with a Modi-less BJP—like the Trinamool Congress in West Bengal, the Biju Janata Dal in Odisha, or the Telegu Desam Party in Andhra Pradesh—are also eyeing the electoral arithmetic.

Within the BJP, such discussions are already taking place, despite the dominant view that Modi can lead the saffron forces to a sweeping victory. “We are looking at three scenarios,” a BJP leader in the Modi camp told me. “The first is that the BJP gets anywhere between 150 and 170 seats, in which case we form a government without Modi. The second is that we get anything between 170 and 190 seats. In this case, we form the government with or without Modi. And the third, of course, is that we get over 200 seats, in which case the PM will be the leader who got us this unprecedented windfall. And that would be undoubtedly the face of the elections—Narendra Modi.”

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby amitvora » 09 Jul 2013 17:38

Gujarati newspaper says that Modi will be declared PM by end of this month. RSS has already given approval and BJP central committee will be making the announcement by end of this month. Future war for India will be fought between Modi and Rahul Gandhi.
http://www.akilanews.com/daily/news_html/main1.html

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby panduranghari » 09 Jul 2013 17:51

Sri wrote:
In this situation, the BJP risks finding itself unable to assemble the allies needed to form a majority with Modi at the helm. This is the Gujarat chief minister’s biggest weakness, and a point of relative strength for all the members of the Delhi Club—especially Advani, who has learnt at much personal cost that the BJP is not capable of winning the 272 seats required for a majority in the Lok Sabha on its own. Advani also knows that many top leaders in the party, as well as several of its regional satraps, are uneasy about the prospect of an uncompromising autocrat like Modi taking control of the party’s command structure and dousing their own future aspirations. No one in Delhi—including Modi’s close friend Jaitley—is eager to be engulfed by his larger than life persona. Finally, Advani, Swaraj and Jaitley all know that the allies will seek a ‘compromise’ PM before agreeing to join the BJP if it emerges as the single largest party without having enough votes to insist on Modi.

This same electoral calculus was surely on the mind of Nitish Kumar, whose decision to part ways with the BJP was ultimately political rather than ideological, in spite of his recent speeches about secularism. The BJP has never won more than 182 seats in a Lok Sabha election, and if it cannot top that figure in 2014, its putative allies may be in a position to demand an alternative to Modi—or, Kumar presumably hopes, to put forth one of their own for the position. The other regional parties who might consider an alliance with a Modi-less BJP—like the Trinamool Congress in West Bengal, the Biju Janata Dal in Odisha, or the Telegu Desam Party in Andhra Pradesh—are also eyeing the electoral arithmetic.

Within the BJP, such discussions are already taking place, despite the dominant view that Modi can lead the saffron forces to a sweeping victory. “We are looking at three scenarios,” a BJP leader in the Modi camp told me. “The first is that the BJP gets anywhere between 150 and 170 seats, in which case we form a government without Modi. The second is that we get anything between 170 and 190 seats. In this case, we form the government with or without Modi. And the third, of course, is that we get over 200 seats, in which case the PM will be the leader who got us this unprecedented windfall. And that would be undoubtedly the face of the elections—Narendra Modi.”


Did someone not post a article about the 2004 NDA loss was by about 2%. The 2% vote swing got YOU PEE AYE in power. I believe or want to believe that there will be a substantial vote swing for NDA is NM is the PM candidate. All the other equations that many political pundits are writing about are based on the voting patterns in 2009 or after. I think its a wrong lens to see the image. Also overt importance given to the triad in Delhi is unnecessary. They really cannot influence anyone any more.

What is the basis of the argument - 'The BJP has never won more than 182 seats in a Lok Sabha election, and if it cannot top that figure in 2014, its putative allies may be in a position to demand an alternative to Modi—or, Kumar presumably hopes, to put forth one of their own for the position. The other regional parties who might consider an alliance with a Modi-less BJP—like the Trinamool Congress in West Bengal, the Biju Janata Dal in Odisha, or the Telegu Desam Party in Andhra Pradesh—are also eyeing the electoral arithmetic.

It adds nothing substantial to the understanding of the question. If Advani thinks he is that good, he could not attract more votes in 2009 than NDA achieved in 2004.

NM has to go all it or bust. The stakes for survival of the desh are high.

Good economists are born as physicists while bad ones are born as political pundits.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sri » 09 Jul 2013 18:45

^^^

I agree with you Sir. Somehow all those who think that BJP needs allies before elections are doing so with an assumption that somehow 182 is the maximum BJP can achieve ever... because it is the maximum it has achieved in the past.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Hari Seldon » 09 Jul 2013 19:08

^^"Modi or bust", eh? Its a gamble alrite. And one India'll have to take.

India's had terrible luck with what the khans call "bet-the-farm" gambles in the past. The battles of Panipat are stark reminder. The death of Hemu another. And losing 1840-1857 to the EIC a third.

Anyway, by the law of averages, we're due for some luck now, or so I hope.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby fanne » 09 Jul 2013 19:20

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 979857.cms

Breaking News:
Congress routs NCP in Sharad Pawar's stronghold

You think with what Con is doing, it is doomed, it is not!! Looky here.
I don't know (and dont know what to put fingers on), but something is happening in Maharashtra that is defying logic, cong is emerging (even in surveys) at top if you read between the lines. What gives?

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ranjbe » 09 Jul 2013 19:27

Few tid bits

Quote:
Advani’s push for Gadkari as a counterweight to Modi is a minor detail, but it nicely illuminates the multiplying intrigues and rapidly shifting allegiances in the BJP’s current game of thrones. Although he had championed the effort to forcefully eject Gadkari from the president’s chair last year—over the fervent objections of the RSS—Advani was later convinced that Gadkari had been the victim of a conspiracy to tarnish him with an orchestrated campaign of planted stories in the media. Inside the BJP, suspicions pointed to Arun Jaitley, the Rajya Sabha opposition leader, who is known within the party as “bureau chief” for the extraordinary influence he wields at two large-selling national dailies where his favourite journalists run political bureaus. Although nobody knows whether Jaitley was actually responsible for the stories, most people in the BJP, including Advani, believe that he was. Jaitley and Advani, who were once seen as pupil and teacher, have been in enemy camps since last December, when Advani put forth his acolyte Sushma Swaraj, the party’s leader in the Lok Sabha and Jaitley’s bête noire, as a nominee to replace Gadkari as president.

Advani now believes that Gadkari was mistreated, and should therefore be compensated. But like everything else in the BJP right now, Advani’s advocacy also had an ulterior motive: going to bat for the former party president was a way to score points with the RSS chief Mohan Bhagwat, who is very close to Gadkari, his fellow Nagpur Brahmin.


RSS may have a number of faults, but overt casteism (above) is not one of them. Why do clueless Indian journo's love to drag in caste as an explaination for everything?

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Rampy » 09 Jul 2013 19:29

fanne wrote:http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Congress-routs-NCP-in-Sharad-Pawars-stronghold/articleshow/20979857.cms

Breaking News:
Congress routs NCP in Sharad Pawar's stronghold

You think with what Con is doing, it is doomed, it is not!! Looky here.
I don't know (and dont know what to put fingers on), but something is happening in Maharashtra that is defying logic, cong is emerging (even in surveys) at top if you read between the lines. What gives?


On top of that NCP defiance e.g., praful patel... is Sharad Pawar losing control or is the game plan of using Raj T and SS not working this time so they are looking for going alone

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_23658 » 09 Jul 2013 19:31

^ really its very puzzling. BJP / Sena is not in the picture at all in Sangli. MNS won just 1 seat. Granted its a municipality election but its a cause for concern.
added a bit later : now i think about it, sangli-miraj sugar belt was always a congress strong hold which later become pawars stronghold. its all about the local politics in municipal elections
Last edited by member_23658 on 09 Jul 2013 19:40, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby fanne » 09 Jul 2013 19:33

Any Maharastra based (or someone who has some connection with ground, against ppl like us sitting 7 samundar par) would like to speculate what is going on? I think there is paradigm shift right before our eyes which either we do not recoganize or have not bothered to look.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Hari Seldon » 09 Jul 2013 20:01

Modi's Facebook crowdsourcing invite goes viral

The guy does think outside the box. My admiration for the man continues to grow despite my already being a committed fan for quite a while now only.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby prahaar » 09 Jul 2013 20:10

Amol.D wrote:^ really its very puzzling. BJP / Sena is not in the picture at all in Sangli. MNS won just 1 seat. Granted its a municipality election but its a cause for concern.
added a bit later : now i think about it, sangli-miraj sugar belt was always a congress strong hold which later become pawars stronghold. its all about the local politics in municipal elections


NCP-INC tussle in Sangli is at the most a fight between two brothers for division of profits, it has nothing to do with ideology. Politics in Sangli is hyper-local. In this day and age, there are photos of Vasant Dada Patil at an equivalent position to Swami Samartha in small business offices.

One needs to visit Sangli to understand the stranglehold of the local politicians. A city which used to (and still has) excellent manpower (highly educated as well as industrious) has been kept in the grips of local Agri-Business-Politico-mafia. A NCP worker in Sangli is indistinguishable from an INC worker and for the most part from a SS worker.

If someone votes against INC-NCP Amdar/Khasar, they can forget getting any business/job/economic-activity in the local ecosystem. Such is the stranglehold. I would give higher probability to Modi-led BJP winning 200 seats than to BJP winning Sangli.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby fanne » 09 Jul 2013 20:12

How about in the rest of the state?

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ramana » 09 Jul 2013 20:14

To get better feel for news analysis its useful to note the publication and the author.

Caravan is left liberal magazine. And hence will have its lens distorting the picture.
But basci message is LKA is not going to be appeased anymore and they have three contingencies in place.

What it does not deal with is internal sabotage to better the Delhi Company's chances.
Another is LKA was at the forefront of Gadkari being ousted. It was rumored that he used his old contacts to stage raids etc.


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