Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

johneeG
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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby johneeG » 29 May 2014 00:19

prahaar wrote:Looking at RSS reaction, "liberals" have already put the statement as weak. If you look the world over, it is not over until full marriage + child-adoption + other tax benefits are not enabled.


It is the slippery slope. This will never end. Even if RSS or the 'conservatives' agree to 'marriage', adoption, and other demands, the so-called 'liberals' will move on to some other such issue which is seen as controversial. Say, pedophilia. or something else. By nature of it, they seem to be attracted to issues like that and will keep raising them. There is no solution to it.

Frankly, there is no problem at all. This so-called criminalization hardly seems to be implemented in practice. The whole idea seems to be legitimization of such relationships. Once that is achieved, this brigade will move on to some other similar issue. Those who follow such people blindly will also follow them blindly. The 'liberal' thingy is never going to end. The more one gives in, the more such demands will come.

The major danger with such things is that a small but vocal and powerful minority hijacks the narrative and browbeats the majority into accepting their worldview by suppressing/demonizing the opponent viewpoint.

Another point is that lotus should be careful not to become a kongi version. Accepting GMO seeds or decriminalization of homosexuality ...etc seem to be agendas with global players and hopefully lotus will not succumb to such pressure. If they do, then eventually they will become a kongi version.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby sunnyP » 29 May 2014 01:25

SaiK wrote:I want to counter NDTV crap! can bjp/rss do something about it? Can't some joint force team establishe a new info channel, that is really advanced enough to reach billions? DD is crap!


+1

Too many people just say 'oh ignore it and watch something else' however they are such a popular channel amongst those who watch english news channels (I recall reading that their viewership is something like 50m+ in India alone with revenue of around $100m per annum and that's just official revenue - wonder how much the paid media stuff earns them).

Something needs to be done about ndtv - they need to be discredited in a major way or an alternative needs to be launched to take the viewers away.

For starters they should set the income tax department loose on ndtv bosses and head journalists. Dig upmsome dirt on them.

member_27987
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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_27987 » 29 May 2014 01:38

I believe Sanku-ji had mentioned in the other political thread which was locked, but here is the full debate in Times Now - watch MJA and Seshadri Chari ripping a new one to a couple of Pakis

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MrThvqLeBM

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Suraj » 29 May 2014 01:42

This is an excellent, mature statement from RSS spokesman Ram Madhav. It indicates a level of maturity within that organization that does not get sufficient attention. They're gaining much greater sense at how to properly marshal what needs to be done to push positive cultural aspects and look like a progressive and cool organization, instead of looking like a bunch of irrelevant angry old men railing at modernity. They don't have to support gay pride events or anything; just the commonsense argument that while they don't approve it, they don't see it worth calling a crime, is a perfectly sensible compromise.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Jarita » 29 May 2014 01:49

johneeG wrote:
prahaar wrote:Looking at RSS reaction, "liberals" have already put the statement as weak. If you look the world over, it is not over until full marriage + child-adoption + other tax benefits are not enabled.


It is the slippery slope. This will never end. Even if RSS or the 'conservatives' agree to 'marriage', adoption, and other demands, the so-called 'liberals' will move on to some other such issue which is seen as controversial. Say, pedophilia. or something else. By nature of it, they seem to be attracted to issues like that and will keep raising them. There is no solution to it.

Frankly, there is no problem at all. This so-called criminalization hardly seems to be implemented in practice. The whole idea seems to be legitimization of such relationships. Once that is achieved, this brigade will move on to some other similar issue. Those who follow such people blindly will also follow them blindly. The 'liberal' thingy is never going to end. The more one gives in, the more such demands will come.

The major danger with such things is that a small but vocal and powerful minority hijacks the narrative and browbeats the majority into accepting their worldview by suppressing/demonizing the opponent viewpoint.

Another point is that lotus should be careful not to become a kongi version. Accepting GMO seeds or decriminalization of homosexuality ...etc seem to be agendas with global players and hopefully lotus will not succumb to such pressure. If they do, then eventually they will become a kongi version.



Well thought out post that outlines the long term ramifications

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Jarita » 29 May 2014 01:52

Suraj wrote:This is an excellent, mature statement from RSS spokesman Ram Madhav. It indicates a level of maturity within that organization that does not get sufficient attention. They're gaining much greater sense at how to properly marshal what needs to be done to push positive cultural aspects and look like a progressive and cool organization, instead of looking like a bunch of irrelevant angry old men railing at modernity. They don't have to support gay pride events or anything; just the commonsense argument that while they don't approve it, they don't see it worth calling a crime, is a perfectly sensible compromise.



In that case, why does it need a statement. In the totem pole of issues this is not the highest in terms if sheer numbers it impacts. Why not a statement about the millions of trafficked sex workers in India or child rights or if we want to get controversial, the laws regarding under trials
Methinks Ram Madhav is trying too hard to be seen as cool.
In terms of sheer impact, there are other thing he can talk about. This only really occupies the mind space of the English speaking elite, many of whom did not vote.
Disappointed that is is all he could come up with.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Suraj » 29 May 2014 01:58

Ram Madhav is the RSS spokesman. None of us are. Unless someone posts here within knowledge of inner workings of the RSS and whatever internal debate led to statement - which on the surface is a very sensible one - there's no point in debating 'why this ? why not that ?' Anyone doing so is merely imposing their own value systems upon a statement from some organization, or otherwise suggesting they can drive such things while sitting in the backseat here in BRF.

Frankly, the continuous whining about 'why is Modi/BJP/RSS not doing <insert pet hope> ??' is getting pointless. None of us are in the cabinet or in any manner involved with the inner workings of the BJP. If this thread is going to be all about moaning about what the BJP doesn't do, us moderators are better off locking and canning it, for it suggests the thread has outlived its utility. The dynasty is out of the picture today. Campaign mode rhetoric is over. Now things are in administration mode.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Picklu » 29 May 2014 02:00

I get Dr Najma Heptulla - Muslim, Harsimrat Kaur Badal - Sikh and Smriti Irani - Parsi by marriage. Who is the other non-Hindu lady in the magnificent seven?

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby AkshayM » 29 May 2014 02:08

No one in media is discussing Sonia's education except reporting what Uma Bharati and Santosh Gangwar said. They are talking about other leaders and ministers education but not Sonia.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby nachiket » 29 May 2014 02:13

Picklu wrote:I get Dr Najma Heptulla - Muslim, Harsimrat Kaur Badal - Sikh and Smriti Irani - Parsi by marriage. Who is the other non-Hindu lady in the magnificent seven?

Maneka Gandhi - Parsi by marriage. (although I think speculating on their religions is a pointless exercise)

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby SwamyG » 29 May 2014 02:38

Said this on June 28th 2013 (last year)
Agnimitra wrote:
SwamyG wrote:Call me paranoid, but Madhu Kishwar might spring some nasty googly at Modi just before elections - intentionally or unintentionally. And there will be no time to respond. I hope that is not the case.

Yup, paranoid. :P

So after all I am not paranoid. I just got the timing wrong. She is throwing fits after the elections.

viewtopic.php?p=1476801#p1476801

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby SwamyG » 29 May 2014 02:39

July 25th 2013....
SwamyG wrote:
Atri wrote:Neoconverts like kishwar should be cautiously given importance, same as subbu swamy.

Ah!!! I have said it twice already on BRF, one must watch out for Kishwar. Call me cynic, but Modi camp needs to work on handling a googly at the end of her "fact finding mission". Plan for the worse is what I say. As far as Swamy.....just keep him far away. He is a chameleon; and like the good old villains in movie say after eliciting information from a traitor "goli maar do saale ko. never trust a traitor". Mamta, BSY, JJ, Swamy....ityadi are a bunch of jokers (borrowing Mohinder Amarantha's words). Aag se keloge to jal jaoge.

People have said it before.....

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Picklu » 29 May 2014 03:00

nachiket wrote:Maneka Gandhi - Parsi by marriage. (although I think speculating on their religions is a pointless exercise)


Thanks.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Kakkaji » 29 May 2014 03:04

Picklu wrote:I get Dr Najma Heptulla - Muslim, Harsimrat Kaur Badal - Sikh and Smriti Irani - Parsi by marriage. Who is the other non-Hindu lady in the magnificent seven?


Maneka Gandhi = Sikh by birth

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RajeshA » 29 May 2014 03:06

nachiket wrote:
Picklu wrote:I get Dr Najma Heptulla - Muslim, Harsimrat Kaur Badal - Sikh and Smriti Irani - Parsi by marriage. Who is the other non-Hindu lady in the magnificent seven?

Maneka Gandhi - Parsi by marriage. (although I think speculating on their religions is a pointless exercise)


Menaka Gandhi is a Sikh married to Rajiv Gandhi who was son of a Muslim (Feroze Khan)!

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Agnimitra » 29 May 2014 03:27

Agnimitra wrote:
SwamyG wrote:Call me paranoid, but Madhu Kishwar might spring some nasty googly at Modi just before elections - intentionally or unintentionally. And there will be no time to respond. I hope that is not the case.

Yup, paranoid. :P

SwamyG wrote:So after all I am not paranoid. I just got the timing wrong. She is throwing fits after the elections.

viewtopic.php?p=1476801#p1476801

:)
She was also supposed to come on a tour of the US to speak about her recent book "Modi, Muslims and the Media". But that trip's also been cancelled for some reason...

This Smriti Irani appointment is being called "Modi's first misstep". I think that's BS. While it definitely remains to be seen what she is capable of in this space, I can easily see her as being a moderating interface between the ejoocated stuffed hats who make policy decisions about our educational framework and language, etc., and the masses who it is meant to benefit. She will know what can fly and what won't.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby KJo » 29 May 2014 03:28

Abbe maneka was married to sanjay not rajiv!

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Yayavar » 29 May 2014 03:46

RajeshA wrote:Menaka Gandhi is a Sikh married to Rajiv Gandhi who was son of a Muslim (Feroze Khan)!


:D Sonia ka kya hua? Feroze Khan Gandhi was Parsi afaik

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RajeshA » 29 May 2014 03:54

Sorry, I meant Sanjiv Gandhi, not Rajiv Gandhi.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Jarita » 29 May 2014 04:05

The harping about the women in the cabinet is offensive to say the least. India is vast and complex and one sure hopes that a position of such responsibility has been given to those most qualified irrespective of gender.
Frankly Najma Heptullah, Maneka Gandhi and Sushma Swaraj deserve every bit of the post given their qualifications and experience. I cannot speak for the untested others. These three are better than most of the males appointment but their cred is getting trivialized because of the gender association.
It is extremely condescending to make posters about the female ratio in the cabinet. Not cool

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Cosmo_R » 29 May 2014 04:33

RajeshA wrote:Sorry, I meant Sanjiv Gandhi, not Rajiv Gandhi.


The 'iv's win. I could be mistaken but I believe lawn dart guy was Sanjay Gandhi. Or, maybe It's really Rahulive. Quien sabe? Just kidding RajeshA :)

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby SwamyG » 29 May 2014 04:37

We all contributed to the digression. If we do not keep the discussions to Modi then this thread is history.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby amdavadi » 29 May 2014 04:39

totally agree .......

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ramana » 29 May 2014 04:47

Thanks for self moderating.

ramana

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Yagnasri » 29 May 2014 05:03

Sikh is Hindu and Indic. By practice Maneka and her son Varun are Hindus. At least Varun is. I see too many Telugu fellows. Vakayya A.Gujarati Raju, N.Sitaraman.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby KJo » 29 May 2014 05:09

Picklu wrote:I get Dr Najma Heptulla - Muslim, Harsimrat Kaur Badal - Sikh and Smriti Irani - Parsi by marriage. Who is the other non-Hindu lady in the magnificent seven?


Why are we always trying to turn Hindus into non Hindus? Smriti is a Hindu, let us say that, instead of portraying her as "Parsi by marriage". She is not Parsi, she is just married to one.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ramana » 29 May 2014 05:26

DDM hasn't changed. They are playing off Congress stuff against BJP.


Jaitley needs to manage his press contacts.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Saral » 29 May 2014 06:06

Sums it up. Except the ODI has been going on here for the last 2 years and counting. The level of interest is unprecedented.

Image

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RoyG » 29 May 2014 06:23

KJoishy wrote:
Picklu wrote:I get Dr Najma Heptulla - Muslim, Harsimrat Kaur Badal - Sikh and Smriti Irani - Parsi by marriage. Who is the other non-Hindu lady in the magnificent seven?


Why are we always trying to turn Hindus into non Hindus? Smriti is a Hindu, let us say that, instead of portraying her as "Parsi by marriage". She is not Parsi, she is just married to one.


Get it right. Smriti is a mormon. End of discussion.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby SaiK » 29 May 2014 07:15

No.. she is a persecuted jew!

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby AkshayM » 29 May 2014 07:20

Congress goons are after Smriti because she challenged Pappu and almost successfully.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Jarita » 29 May 2014 07:39

On the D'nasty - does anyone know where they are and where they might be headed. Any theories

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RoyG » 29 May 2014 07:48

Jarita wrote:On the D'nasty - does anyone know where they are and where they might be headed. Any theories


Toilet. It's over for the Congress under Gandhi's. Modi will ensure that they never make a come back. A new party will probably come up. Perhaps a bit left of center but dharmic.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Ambar » 29 May 2014 07:49

Madhu Kishwar now calls Smriti "nalayak". If there is a person who fits the description of "useful idiot" to a T, it has to be Madhu Kishwar.

In other news, Samajghatak party in UP have apparently been disrupting electricity throughout the state as a mass punishment to people for defeating the incumbent party in recent elections. I hope the state BJP unit will do its best to tell the janata that the best revenge on SP will be to run them to ground during next assembly elections and bring BJP back to power in the state.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby SwamyG » 29 May 2014 07:58

Jarita wrote:On the D'nasty - does anyone know where they are and where they might be headed. Any theories

Place yourself in their shoes, and think:
1. Are we going to be prosecuted and spend 10-15 years in jail?
2. Are we going to lose our entire wealth?
3. Are our powers/influence going to be diluted?
4. Can we have the best vacations (domestic & foreign), servants waiting on hand, people to support us?

You would obviously do not want to be jailed. So if there is any chance, then you flee the country. If you are going to lose 5-10% of wealth, who cares - you can earn it back again. If you are going to lose some power, because you are out of power - you know power can come back. There are people who still respect you, bow to you and will do things at your beck and call.

So what are you going to do? Continue to do the same. Right? Unless suddenly you have a change of heart, begin working charity, social, religious/spiritual activities; or become a big industrialist, agriculturist, entrepreneur and quit politics. Write books, give lectures and seminars and develop India as an rich and fortunate family. Or simply bow out of public life and tend to bungalows and gardens, sipping tea and wandering around.

Change of heart chances: zilch.
Jail chances: Dunno, but most likely not.
So....it is the same old story....fighting politics.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Yayavar » 29 May 2014 08:06

What with IIT-wal and MA-lallu and PhD-MMS people are still on this. IIM- hmm, the intellectual capital is Chetan Bhagat I guess.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby johneeG » 29 May 2014 08:14

If NaMo doesn't jail the dynasty, he will lose credibility just like Fordriwal lost credibility by not jailing Sheela. The lotus would never be able to make allegations against the kongis/dynasty if they are not jailed. If allegations are made then the kongis/dynasty will say,"if we are guilty, they why didn't you jail us?".
Fordriwal will say,"See, I told you that all these people are together in it and will help each other..."

If the amnesty has to be given, then it should be given publicly after the person has accepted his guilt publicly and promised not to repeat such a thing. For example, if Manly Singh has to be given amnesty, then first his guilt should be established, then he needs to publicly ask for forgiveness and only then the amnesty should be accorded by the Prez(or someone like that) based on exceptional situations. In normal circumstances, the law must take its course especially if those who are alleged to be guilty are rich and powerful.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Murugan » 29 May 2014 08:15

NaMo has more followers than @Pontifex on twitter

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Rahul Mehta » 29 May 2014 08:17

My last post on Smriti Irani chapter.

Smriti Irani says her annual income is only Rs 370,000 and that of her husband is only Rs 210,000 !! She is Rajsabha MP basic salary is Rs 600,000 pa and allowances that cross Rs 400,000 pa.

Image

Above is snap from Mrs Irani's election affidavit. Please see full affidavit at http://affidavitarchive.nic.in/DynamicA ... nstType=PC .

Madhu Kishwar etc are HELPING Mrs Irani by covering up SERIOUS tax evasion issue by flooding tweets on her less serious degree issue. Basically NaMo is controlling the "opposition against Smriti Irani space" via MK. If MK was anti-SI, then she would have raised tax evasion issue. But MK is ignoring away tax evasion issue. Hence MK is pro-SI and her tweets are only to misguide people away from REAL tax evasion issue.

NaMo-bhagats dont have option but to support SI or whoever. Because after all, they have perpetuated the myths of "NaMo == Kalki" , "NaMo kabhi wrong nahi hotaa". As such, all the stories of SI's 4 digit verbal IQ , presence of mind are nonsense. SI is just as good actor who does well in scripted\paid\fixed interviews. Pramod , the man who lives 7 star lifestyles, gave SI Chandani Chowk Loksabha ticket in may-2004 because BJP needed supported of Star network's TV channels. Anyway, education ministry since 2005 has been run wholly by foreigners. SI has to sign whatever WTO ask her to sign. The next big step is FDI in schools and colleges.

=====

The reason why NaMo gave three Ministries to AJ is because raising FDI limit in defence needs co-ordination of 3 Ministries - defence, company affairs and finance. And the companies who want FDI limit in defense to be raised wanted to deal with only one person. That brings down their costs and hassles. Once FDI in defence is raised, defence dept will go to someone else. Many are now feeling that AJ is real PM in BJP !! IMO, real PM in India since 2011 has been PaidMedia. Please note that there is NOTHING defamatory in my post.

=====

Gujarat is all set to give away a mid-size plot to Japanese consortium. That plot will have only Japanese companies. Conclusions are all yours.

http://indianexpress.com/article/cities ... n-state-2/

Enough for one day
Last edited by Rahul Mehta on 29 May 2014 08:22, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RoyG » 29 May 2014 08:20

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