Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_20317 » 30 May 2014 10:53

Agnimitra wrote:
panduranghari wrote:Less than 15% black money will come back.

People need to be named and shamed.

If and ONLY if, all the known money returns, there will be a depreciation of the rupee. Not a good idea. better to hold it offshore and buy arms or buy assets overseas.

Every person holding black money should be made an example of. No other deterent will work.

Recent moves by US Tax enforcement to get Swiss banks to waive their secrecy has been in the news. Several countries in Africa and other parts of the world, whose corrupt elites siphoned off funds, have availed of the opportunity to repatriate substantial sums of money. Any reason you say less than 15% will come back?


@Agnimitra garu,

It is the nature of money itself (black or white or whatever). Actually even 15% is an overly optimistic estimate. And what is not realized (with no harm done) is that even a simple non-acceleration will put in massive amounts of capital into the white sector. 22 years back I was the junior-most paid assistant (mere filler) for a short while in a business developing commercial realty in Delhi on a DDA allotted plot. The buyer and seller were casually talking about the content of the b & w. It was 50-50 that time. Delhi NCR would today have something like 30-70 today. Actually perhaps even less. This is retail transactions off course and not bulk corporate deals which if understood as a historical cost accountant seem resistant to change but if seen as a management cost accountant seem just as cleaner.

Now some part of our growth in the last 20 years can be attributed to things simply turning from black to white balance sheet. Something like a subsidy where you take out some money from left pocket and put it in the right pocket and become khush about it. Existence of that mathematical relation and a generic propensity to have that relationship, between balance sheet growth and mutation of moneyflow can be guessed by the above anecdotal evidence.

Mota mota, this is a dynamic world where the force acts on both balls, striking each other. So moneyflows turning from black to white is loved by a gram positive bacteria like NaMo which gels well with the intent of the mango man (who in turn wishes to use the maximum of bank funding to stock up on maximum of long assets, then raise the maximum amount of LAP or take the maximum benefit of Section 54 of Income Tax Act and have this virtuous cycle go on and on). But this mutation of money flows is hated by a gram negative bacteria like Makhilesh. Even in the later case M is more benign then akhi as akhi responds much more poorly to penicillin.

Pretty soon (~20 years) "Corruption reducing growth" will become an a war cry for AAP types only. With all real evidence being against it.


The harm that gets done, for example is in the following cases (though you cannot do much about addressing it because of effort-reward ratio). Where highly educated people end up giving precedence to personal preferences and personal lifestyles over the collective lifestyle. You can never doubt the intent in any of the cases but you will have to question their facts.

• “FDI is worse than debt. Debt breaks a person or a nation when time to repay comes. But at least debt is scheduled i.e. loan taker knows on which date he has to pay how much capital and interest back in dollars or rupees.”

• “The Ambanis fund Antilla. They take, take and don't give back. Infact, they have twisted govt arms to the detriment of the Indian nation to enrich themselves and their backers.”

• “You might point out Rajahs and Maharajash did that, Taj Mahal, and big temples are all a sign of such display of wealth, prosperity, bhakti etc; still such actions should not be the norm among the uber rich and should not be condoned.”

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RamaY » 30 May 2014 11:01

JohneeG garu,

I weren't writing a treatise on Dharma, but just explaining why it isn't Adharma in contemporary sense.

It is the prerogative of the wealthy to decide how the want to spread their wealth. I don't support/extend the logic of forced philanthropy.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Arjun » 30 May 2014 11:11

Renaming UPA schemes: Modi blocks move, says govt is not for populism

Ok, I have to differ with Mr. Modi on this one. Not a good move from him.
Last edited by Arjun on 30 May 2014 11:13, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Agnimitra » 30 May 2014 11:12

ravi_g ji, thanks for the explanation.

So if the goal is to bring back black money and channel it back into the economy, what are the options to incentivize that? Using te stick will probably not achieve much. What has happened is typical of most societies that transitioned from agrarian to industrialized economies - an accumulation of capital by various means. Macroeconomically, the goal is to invest that capital back into nation-building. so what are the options? Some of the accumulators may already be converting by opening other legit enterprises like educational institutions, 'cultural' institutions (including religious structures as SIVs), etc. How to further incentivize bringing it back? I am assuming a substantial portion of it is merely sitting stashed away in some phoren bank. Is that a false assumption?

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby johneeG » 30 May 2014 11:18

RamaY wrote:JohneeG garu,

I weren't writing a treatise on Dharma, but just explaining why it isn't Adharma in contemporary sense.

It is the prerogative of the wealthy to decide how the want to spread their wealth. I don't support/extend the logic of forced philanthropy.


Philanthropy is absolutely essential in any society, saar. That is precisely my point. There will always be some uber rich and extremely poor in every society. The wealth gets balanced through charity. The rich have to donate to the deserving and needy.

Who are deserving?
The intellectual class and those who protect culture/civilization. (Earlier, it used to be Brahmins). In contemporary terms, this means funding the research, thinktanks, building museums/schools/hospitals/temples, ...etc. Researchers, scientists, teachers, artists ...etc should be able to pursue knowledge without worrying about day to day lifestyle. The uber rich have to fund them through donations and charity.

Who are needy?
The poor.

The rich and uber-rich have to donate to these two classes. Strictly speaking, everyone has to donate to the extent that they can and everyone must try not to take donations from others.

While it is not correct to have fetish about poverty, at the same time, one should not glorify greed either.

Philanthropy is an important cog in the wheel of any society. If the rich are greedy in any society, then such a society will soon crumble.

With power comes responsibility. Those who are powerful and rich also have responsibility to carry the society along with them because if the society crumbles, they have more to lose.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby johneeG » 30 May 2014 11:29

Arjun wrote:Renaming UPA schemes: Modi blocks move, says govt is not for populism

Ok, I have to differ with Mr. Modi on this one. Not a good move from him.


:shock: This is very bad move. The first bad move was by kangrez in naming schemes after its PMs, the second bad move is not removing such political propaganda using tax money. Modi is helping the populism of kangrez by not scraping such naming.

----
Cosmo_R saar,
protecting the producers seems to be the best way to help the consumers in the long run. If producers are harmed, then consumers will also be harmed in the long run. The same applies vice versa also. Protecting the consumers is the best way to help the producers. If the consumers are harmed, then producers will also be harmed in the long run. A country needs both producers and consumers. A country cannot be based only on consumers or producers. Depending on phoren consumers or phoren producers is not at all good for any country or society. At best, it can be a stop-gap temporary arrangement in emergency. But, it cannot be a sustained policy.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Mahendra » 30 May 2014 12:43

Righto, for congress mukth bharath congressi naam waale schemes should also be made congress mukth

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby sum » 30 May 2014 13:05

^^ I still presume that this is Taqqiyya and the thing which needs to happen will happen gradually without creating much ruckus

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Pratyush » 30 May 2014 13:07

Do we have a credible source which states that Modi is not for renaming schemes. Or will never rename the schemes.

This may happen 6 months down the line. When we are up and running in the direction where NaMo wants us to go.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_28025 » 30 May 2014 13:14

Pratyush wrote:Do we have a credible source which states that Modi is not for renaming schemes. Or will never rename the schemes.

This may happen 6 months down the line. When we are up and running in the direction where NaMo wants us to go.


Was this part of the Manifesto? If not, they should wait.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_27987 » 30 May 2014 13:18

sum wrote:^^ I still presume that this is Taqqiyya and the thing which needs to happen will happen gradually without creating much ruckus


+1. For the second term, I am sure. For now, he is going to roll some of the schemes into one and give it new names.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Yagnasri » 30 May 2014 13:27

With names comes recollection and recognition. NM of all people should know that. But doing things right away is not good also. Any other comment would have created fresh news reports from paid media.

But intelligent thing would be naming these scehmes from non family Congress leaders like PVNR, SPatel, Kamaraj Nadar, Lal Bahadur Shastri etc. No one can object for that.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_28025 » 30 May 2014 13:34

See how contradictory these two articles from the same newspaper (TOI) are:

This one says that Modi has moved to 7 RCR

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 771859.cms

and this one says he has moved to 5 RCR and will use 7 RCR as his office

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 771697.cms

Look at this text from the first article:

Families of ministers and parliamentarians who move into Lutyens Delhi bungalows usually come up with special requests for changes, from the colour of walls to upholstery, furniture and fittings.

''Maybe because the new PM comes without the baggage of a family, this time it's different,'' said one official. ''We are painting the house now and we may change upholstery if needed.''


Instead of giving Modi credit for not demanding changes they are attributing it to the fact that he is single. I say, what difference does it make if he is single or married?

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby IndraD » 30 May 2014 13:40

Code: Select all

7 RCR is actually five bungalows - Nos. 1, 3, 5, 7 and 9 - spread across 12 acres on Race Course Road, which has been blocked off for the PM's house and offices for the past three decades.

These bungalows were originally designed by Robert Tor Russell, who was part of British architect Edwin Lutyens' team when he was designing New Delhi in the 1920s and 1930s. Russell also designed Teen Murti Bhavan, Connaught Place and the Eastern and Western courts on Janpath.

After the assassination of Prime Minister Indira Gandhi at her 1 Safdarjung Road bungalow in 1984, 7 RCR was chosen as a more secure location for son and successor Rajiv Gandhi. Today, No. 1 RCR is a helipad, No. 3 is where Manmohan Singh [img]stayed with his wife and No. 5 was the guest house.

Modi will occupy No. 5 RCR as his residence instead of bungalow number 7, which has been the residence of his predecessors. Modi will use the bungalow number No. 7 as his office.

The last bungalow, No. 9 RCR, is occupied by the Special Protection Group that guards the PM.

In the 1980s, when 7 RCR was being set up for the new PM, his office was restored and designed by noted interior designer and architectural restorer Sunita Kohli. In 2005, she also restored No. 5. Over the years, many changes had been made to the houses - ceilings were lowered, rooms were divided and some structures were altered. All this had to be redone when it became the PM's residence.

Upinder Singh, the historian daughter of Manmohan Singh, said: ''The nicest aspect of the house was its lovely garden with its peacocks and many other birds. It was lovely to sit there under the sun in winters.


7 RCR is actually 5 bung laws acc to this article

1,3,5,7,9 http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 771859.cms

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_28025 » 30 May 2014 13:49

Thanks for the clarification Indraji.


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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sachin » 30 May 2014 14:26

Mahendra wrote:Righto, for congress mukth bharath congressi naam waale schemes should also be made congress mukth

Renaming all Indira Gandhi... Chacha Nehru.. schemes at one go, may not bring in much results but would spin-off more controversies. First, it may be taken as the new government taking vengeance on old government and its "leaders". Trust the "secular" media, who is currently sulking to pick this up big time. More and more stories may be spun, and new government folks would lose time explaining things.

Better would be to let the schemes run for a while, identify its faults, let those get declared in the open. Six months down the line, with due advance notice close down the schemes. And if any thing new starts, come up with neutral names or non-Gandhi Nehru names. I would strongly recommend the names of such schemes to be based on the names of commie leaders. 8). This is considering their immense popularity.

Modi & Co are playing a test match now, why think like a one-day match? ;) :). They have five good years to turn around things. By expecting every problem to be resolved in 24 hours, I guess we are all becoming like IT-Vity managers :lol:.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Singha » 30 May 2014 14:35

the min by min news/BRF cycle is going to slow down for sure.
already the Govt has hit ground running.
we can expect +ve sentiments to regain ground in a few months.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby IndraD » 30 May 2014 14:40

Toilet is using terms like

Like his predecessor MMS, NaMo didn't ask for any change in 7RCR

Like his predeessor MMS, NaMo also lives apratan family from same article

this ===== :P

How to rule out 7RCR is not bugged?

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby vina » 30 May 2014 14:41

Singha wrote:the min by min news/BRF cycle is going to slow down for sure.
already the Govt has hit ground running.
we can expect +ve sentiments to regain ground in a few months.

Yawn.. I hope it doesn't turn comical and nay tragical with the kind of stuff that Mamu Modi and Chacha Gadkari are putting out on E85 and stuff.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby merlin » 30 May 2014 14:53

IndraD wrote:Toilet is using terms like

Like his predecessor MMS, NaMo didn't ask for any change in 7RCR

Like his predeessor MMS, NaMo also lives apratan family from same article

this ===== :P

How to rule out 7RCR is not bugged?


It did not need to be bugged for 10 years :P

I'm sure they will sweep it.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Rahul M » 30 May 2014 15:03

Atri ji, http://insidethunderdome.com/content/up ... rolls1.jpg

edit : good, you deleted it yourself.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby sooraj » 30 May 2014 15:35

UP CM Akhilesh Yadav dismisses question by a woman reporter on Uttar Pradesh rape and murder, says 'you aren't in any danger are you?'

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby sooraj » 30 May 2014 15:36

The new Union ministers have that the Congress had struck deep roots within babudom in the last 10 years. In the ministries of home, finance, HRD, for instance, the BJP is said to have found some IAS and IPS officers who remain loyal to their erstwhile Congress ministerial bosses. Two IPS officers who are loyal to former home minister Sushilkumar Shinde are being scrutinised by a team of top BJP leaders, it is said.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_28025 » 30 May 2014 16:04

sooraj wrote:The new Union ministers have that the Congress had struck deep roots within babudom in the last 10 years. In the ministries of home, finance, HRD, for instance, the BJP is said to have found some IAS and IPS officers who remain loyal to their erstwhile Congress ministerial bosses. Two IPS officers who are loyal to former home minister Sushilkumar Shinde are being scrutinised by a team of top BJP leaders, it is said.


How can such UPA loyalists be dealt with? They can't be fired, can they?

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_20317 » 30 May 2014 16:11

Agnimitra wrote:ravi_g ji, thanks for the explanation.

So if the goal is to bring back black money and channel it back into the economy, what are the options to incentivize that? Using te stick will probably not achieve much. What has happened is typical of most societies that transitioned from agrarian to industrialized economies - an accumulation of capital by various means. Macroeconomically, the goal is to invest that capital back into nation-building. so what are the options? Some of the accumulators may already be converting by opening other legit enterprises like educational institutions, 'cultural' institutions (including religious structures as SIVs), etc. How to further incentivize bringing it back? I am assuming a substantial portion of it is merely sitting stashed away in some phoren bank. Is that a false assumption?



While handling any problem the safest+shortest route to success is not to say no to any means (including danda). Though your hunch is right – mere danda is not going to work in India where investment in enforcement mechanism is minimal/absent and the people are simply too smart/varied.

The cultural institution you are talking about has been the staple response in the Indic system (generically, the dharmarth route) which has been damaged to a considerable extent and for the upkeep of which we must fight. However it is a slower response and is driven towards core survival instead of being geared towards achieving super-specialty in economic development. The end result can be characterized as - Gen 4 fighter screw driver level vs. building a Gen 6 airborne fighting systems. The super-specialty can only be build up if we set out for it with intent and purpose – basically the paurush response, where we do it because that is built into our structure.

To comment on your ultimate wish, we first will have to drop the western pretensions regarding money being black or white and start thinking in more existential terms. For example, both of us know that w.r.t. black money the principle of ‘jiski lathi uski bhains applies’. So for example, you can (though you do not), simply take away the black money invested by me in your business and tell me (your black money investor) to bugger off. But you do not do that. Nor do the insanely large number of entrepreneurs hosting the black moneys of even more insanely large number of such investors. Why?

The Indic response starts after answering this ‘why’. Answer is simple the color of the money does not matter but the color of the person’s mind, holding control of the black money or assets arising therefrom does. The varnas/color of the controller’s mind are absolutely and irrevocably linked to both the possible courses of action – to steal or not to steal. Reality is most people, who are interested in a long term fruitful life, one that is bequeath-able to their kids, will not steal, not even black money. What is applicable to most people is also applicable to most entrepreneurs, being subset of their respective universe. More appropriately there would in a sufficiently large population always be people willing to slog for their personal entrepreneurial vision. The black money does not stop an entrepreneur per se. Entrepreneurs by definition (like kshtriyas and brahmins) do not invest their own money. They invest whatever money (black or white) is made available to them by the larger public. It is not like businessmen crave a sensory desire to stash cash. They would actually hate it since it implies non-application of available resources. Quite a few businessmen do horde some amount of cash but that is only because there is no mechanism to bank the black cash. Most people do recognize the ‘ownership of the black money’ too, irrespective of what the law feels like.

So should we simply ignore the black money conundrum. Hell no. As I said the color of the money does not matter but the color of the controller’s mind does. Hence whatever money has been taken out of the Indian economy and stashed in Swish banks is actually today being used in propping up the Chinese economy. That money variously gets used to screw the actual owners - the Indians. So yes it is a wrong assumption that the black money is merely stashed up because that suggests it is benign. It is not benign it is malignant. The ownership is pre-decided even by the standards of the most uneducated. Its Indian. But the control is not in Indian hands. It is in Swiss and Chinese hands. WT_! but alas that is how it is. So should we then just suck up and bear with it. Well yes till the time the winds are adverse and no when the winds are favorable. So Makhilesh == adverse wind and NaMo==favorable wind. Fortunately for us the field of commerce and industry are not a matter of science where you have to look for a new answer to the better understood problems often changing the framework itself. It is a practice with a well-established framework, where you have to apply better the existing solutions to shaaswat problems. Hence declaring black money as national wealth is a dharmic idea. But for reasons stated earlier it is not going to yield results. It only has a much larger purpose of stigmatizing the easy-way of black money. At the same time running current businesses well will be accorded the same degree of sanctity by the mango abdul as vesting the assets in ones heirs. Hence Nationalization of unaccounted for wealth to be collected by the exchequer whenever and wherever traced (India or phoren), should be most welcome steps, from the PoV of long term nationalistic goals. Also for earlier pointed out reasons the ownership thus formally settled, we can begin to target the controllership.

Re. controllership the circuitous route of legislation waghera is not enough (it is actually even weaker than the simpler dharmarth route). Black money arose because there was a will to ignore the law. So lakir-peetna after the snake has crossed makes for a good laugh only but not a nationalistic stance. However we still should have SITs and formal requests to Germany and Switzerland as it helps challenge their controllership and helps establish our own. It also increases the risks for the Indian owners of black money as it symbolizes a will to establish the national character of unaccounted for moneys.

Again for earlier pointed out reasons please note that nobody likes to earn less on black money (I have been told of cases where the black money at times even earns a discount instead of an investment premium). That too with the attendant risk of getting blackmailed (which is well recognized on BRF). The simpler and straight forward route of ensuring a balanced economic growth is more important because that will in effect allow India to compete against china for India’s own money presently controlled by swish banks. This sounds revolting in as much as it involves recognizing the bitter truth of foreigners controlling our money. But it is pragmatic because the alternative is even worse. And if we can source opportunities faster than we can source cash into those opportunities, then at a certain point, we can begin to soak up even Chinese black money through the same conduit of swish bank, to feed our white economy (presently not even a wish, but not unobtanium).

This involves a massive reprioritization of economic planning at multiple levels. Take for example the following extract from another BRF poster’s post.

“The last mile, in the form of the clean store aisle, is the least pertinent matter in the whole topic. The meat of the topic lies behind the scenes - in the backend logistics, supply chain expertise, and more. Refridgeration and transport depends on good roads/rail and electricity. Anyone thinking that frontend retail needs expertise and capital is missing out on a lot of detail. The bulk of what is needed lies in the backend. FDI in retail will not solve that. In fact, it will harm the solution because it will trigger unnecessarily social and political opposition. The history of UPA policymaking is full of examples of supposedly good ideas so poorly implemented that they're a political liability more than a legacy.”


The argument is evidenced quite easily in real life, if you care to witness it. But that is only half an indictment of the ‘FDI in multibrand’. Because even the front end is not served properly by FDI in multibrand. And front end cannot be under-estimated in its value creating potential.

From the consumer’s perspective - The whole rationale for Big Bazar was to create the bazar ambiance which is quite unlike the western sense of retail. That is the reason why even the specialty-stores began by placing themselves in the shor-gul of South-Ex or CP, only later graduating to setting up shops in the Malls (Air-Conditioned and upmarket but still crowded and shoutbox types). I as a consumer want to experience more shopping in lesser time to be able to exercise my consumer-choice effectively. Which is not possible in a typically western retailing. Western retailing works where brands are more important than the products, most times justifiably so because of the investments in the certification processes. And for such brands people are willing travel longer distances and online shopping a real marketplace. Here people like to compare what is available in GIP Mall with what is available in Atta Market.

From the investor’s perspective - Constituents of Sangh (BJP!) are against FDI in Multibrand retail only. Not against FDI in retail, which is a substantial segment on its own and the investing justifies the branding. Now I live in Noida and have seen closely the development of NCR region. When we came to Noida, the commercial sector-18 was sparsely populated. Some early movers invested a lot of their time, money and effort in making it successful. Today this sector already houses & will have more of the multibrand retailing. All of it (the shop frontage, the multibranded shops, the customer service) developed by Indian entrepreneurs, with or without foreign collaborators. Today there are two ways to approaching further growth. One is to help these existing entrepreneurs to unlock their networth and re-invest elsewhere to continue the same cycle. But that presumes that we do not have enough entrepreneurs elsewhere, entirely capable of doing the same thing on their own. Patently wrong presumption, we have the problem of not being able to give enough opportunities to our talented people. We have enough of risk handling businessmen, we do not have enough of business opportunities. The indicted approach would probably be required in Chad, where I presume the large business risk handling ability is limited. So unlocking the wealth for these businessmen, is not a valid reason for FDI in multibranding. If unlocking is required that badly for these existing businessmen then they always have the option of selling out to Indian businessmen who will more than happily pay top rupees for these mature ventures. In fact I singularly doubt if these people want to sell out, except by way of the Parle-type deal. A Parle type deal where the Chauhan brothers sold out a built up brand only to have it killed and used the money to finance other ventures. But those days are well and truly gone, never to come back again. Today we need to increase the number of such entrepreneurs who need to be handed over more such geographies for more such business developments. For this the focus has to shift to domestic businesses management groups being given greenfield areas to develop further. These businesses will have a ripple effect in pushing up the market values in realty, for the mango man and creating further risk taking abilities at smaller level – people like you, me and Fathey. People like you and me will not develop by having Walmart sell our consumer needs to us. Big bazar is good enough, thank you. We will develop because our market value based net-worth is growing by leaps and bounds and we take personal risks based on that and start our own businesses – for example you are foreign return so you take a place in the GIP mall and I am Indian bound hence I take my place in Atta market. But we both compete and cooperate to serve our respective markets better. Where does even the scope for a Walmart arise from an economy wide investment POV. The domestic entrepreneur route will at once suck up all available black cash and white cash with nothing getting exported to swish banks.

From a nationalist perspective – the bane as is recognized by all is that a bunch of crooked people have been able to take large stakes in the Indian economy to secure/develop which they need now to undermine its groundings (social and economic) even further. But luckily for us these people were just names dropper, old-boys networks and cronies. They were not managers even though they could hire good managers, available easily in the Indian talent market. These smart but hired managers gave/generated for, these crooked politicans (even such businessmen were politicians because that is what they did and we know the names by their deeds and end results), some really good but high priced deals. This FDI in multibranding is an issue because the crooked politicians have cornered large parts of Indian urbania in high priced deals where real estate was an important part of the book value and the receivables were discounted to justify the investments. And now they want to offload their stakes to the only people who can buy up these large stocks of realty. Obviously you are not that. Obviously I am not that. Both of us are however voters of NaMo. Walmart is not the voter but they do have the securitization expertise and will have their bunch of assets and liabilities in such deals, sold off to always in the money, amerikhan investors. But the betterment of these stupid politician/businessmen using amerikhan cash, is not a national priority. Having enough business opportunities for the local abduls to soak up all available cash is a valid nationalist priority. Think for the local businessman as you think of the local armyman or the local researcher or the local worker/consumer. Just as more research opportunities cast a wider net to catch real and motivated scholars instead of mere degreeholders. Just as more of hard training and COIN ops prepare an armyman to fight bigger wars. Just as more responsibilities churn out better workers. Much the same way our wishes should be more for the betterment of more Indian businessmen and more resources in the hands of these people. Reality is even the Amerikhans benefited after WW-2 by this process. Its just that some of the Amerikhans now lie to us to force us into a smaller hole so we can be pegged easily by them. While our need is to deny the easy way out to these early mover cronies. This short circuit will prevent the cronies, from getting enough of their cash released for further wrongful deployment. At the same time they will be made to sacrifice their present gratification for the larger good of the national economy. Within the big businesses we have seen how Reliance and Tatas have been able to capitalize in this market. They too will get supported by such measures because these dirty politicians will ultimately be forced to sell off their stakes to these bigger Indian businesses who too will tap into the world financial market to fund their acquisitions. There will however be one important difference this time the Reliance and Tata businesses will be within the legislative jurisdiction of NaMo.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Yagnasri » 30 May 2014 16:16

Mafia will try damage NM by Babu moles which it had kept and overtly cultivated babus. As I have already posted NM has a weakness of not kicking out the babus immediately but to give them some rope.

But it seems that BJP anticipated this babu problem and now taking steps. The IAS people can not be dismissed but can not sent to useless positions wherein they will remaining cooling their sorry a**es.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby pankajs » 30 May 2014 17:05

Shamlee wrote:How can such UPA loyalists be dealt with? They can't be fired, can they?

Babooz are normally shunted out from important positions to ones where they are relatively harmless.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Vikas » 30 May 2014 17:18

There are too many Babus in the system who were cultivated by congress during their younger days and are now
at very senior positions. These babus eventually retire and get plum postings again.
A lot of them consider themselves defender of 'sickularism' as explained by congress outlook and look down upon unwashed masses.

This culture of 'scratch my back and I scratch yours' must be destroyed.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_28025 » 30 May 2014 17:20

pankajs wrote:
Shamlee wrote:How can such UPA loyalists be dealt with? They can't be fired, can they?

Babooz are normally shunted out from important positions to ones where they are relatively harmless.


Is that all? There should be a stricter punishment for such anti-national activities. I know anti-national sounds harsh but whatever is done which is not in the interest of the nation is anti-national according to me.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby rsingh » 30 May 2014 17:45

Narayana Rao wrote:Mafia will try damage NM by Babu moles which it had kept and overtly cultivated babus. As I have already posted NM has a weakness of not kicking out the babus immediately but to give them some rope.

But it seems that BJP anticipated this babu problem and now taking steps. The IAS people can not be dismissed but can not sent to useless positions wherein they will remaining cooling their sorry a**es.


Solution lies in "Yes Prime Minister" serial. BJP has to bring an "Administrative Reform Bill" which includes
-Performance related promotions, thus pay scale
-Strict control on foreign travels
I am sure there are so many other points one can added

Actually just a hint of such a bill will bring Babus in line.
Last edited by rsingh on 30 May 2014 19:44, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_28025 » 30 May 2014 18:40

Now it is official:

Former Intelligence Bureau chief Ajit Doval appointed as national security adviser

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 790461.cms

Yesss!

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Singha » 30 May 2014 18:47

I look fwd and pray for the day our own SOCOM is pushed through. Namo sounds like the kind of guy who can crack IA+IAF skulls together and make them work together like a strict headmaster.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RamaY » 30 May 2014 18:52

johneeG wrote:I weren't writing a treatise on Dharma, but just explaining why it isn't Adharma in contemporary sense.


Philonthrophy is a value that must be imbibed into every human being.

But it cannot be enforced/imposed like Zakat (this amounts to moral policing). I do not know the social services activities of Ambanis. Lets not ask "SarvaViswajitYaga" from everyone, just so we can 'appear' to be Dharmics.

Who are we to question Ambanis if they want to be born poor in next birth thru their karma in this life; as long as they are procuring and spending their wealth in a Dharmic manner?

We will revisit this topic another time.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ramana » 30 May 2014 20:19

Anantha wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/column/how-modis-demonisation-fueled-his-rise/20140529.htm?sc_cid=twshare

Assem Shukla on how Modi baiting back fired in the US... a good read



This is a superficial article. Demonization by US did not build up Modi. Its the power vacuum in Delhi that made the gentle BJP wave into a Powerful TsuNamo!!!


US backed the wrong horse/ass as it has invested and cultivated it and was getting daily briefings from MMS as admitted by Omabba.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ramana » 30 May 2014 20:21

Rahul Mehta wrote:Exchange of tax information between Mauritius and India benefits Mauritius NOT India

I have explained in detail on my facebook post at https://www.facebook.com/mehtarahulc/po ... 6546311922 . The whole status isnt printable here. So I will only print main portion here.

[Mauritius treaty ...] says that if Mauritius company earns profits of say Rs. 1000 crore India , then it has OPTION of paying Rs 30 crore in Mauritius or Rs 350 crore in India. Obviously , company would prefer to pay Rs. 30 crore in Mauritius . Now what some companies used to do is that on their tax return in India, they would write "paid Rs 30 crore tax in Mauritius " and then claim exemption on Rs 350 crore tax payable in India. And then they would NOT even pay Rs 30 in Mauritius . Now Mauritius will inform GoI whether that company has actually paid Rs 30 crore in Mauritius or not. If not, then GoI can collect Rs 350 crore in India. So obviously, now company is NOT going to pay Rs 350 crore in india. Instead, it would pay Rs 30 crore in Mauritius as it said on the return. IOW, the exchange of tax information between Mauritius and India benefits Mauritius NOT India !!! ....


...



Modi could ask for a perpetual lease of an island in the Mauritius archipelago to host a naval facility or else the money will be withdrawn.
There are many things underway.

Constant jaundiced look will distort the vision.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Yayavar » 30 May 2014 20:25

^^ http://www.rediff.com/news/column/how-modis-demonisation-fueled-his-rise/20140529.htm?sc_cid=twshare is the thinking of a the affluent with eyes fixed on US emigration. It was MMS incompetence that has provided the major impetus. The nautanki of the highly educated IITs/IIMs not withstanding - that is my smriti of this election!

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Arjun » 30 May 2014 21:04

ramana wrote:
Anantha wrote:http://www.rediff.com/news/column/how-modis-demonisation-fueled-his-rise/20140529.htm?sc_cid=twshare

Assem Shukla on how Modi baiting back fired in the US... a good read



This is a superficial article. Demonization by US did not build up Modi. Its the power vacuum in Delhi that made the gentle BJP wave into a Powerful TsuNamo!!!


US backed the wrong horse/ass as it has invested and cultivated it and was getting daily briefings from MMS as admitted by Omabba.

Aseem Shukla probably realizes that... He seems to have a pretty constructive agenda though - he wants to convey to GOTUS that any attempt on their part to influence Indian politics through active endorsement or demonization is worthless and, infact, counterproductive.

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sachin » 30 May 2014 21:16

Shamlee wrote:How can such UPA loyalists be dealt with? They can't be fired, can they?

You seem to be new to all this :). They cannot be fired. But how about say a transfer from Lutyen's Delhi to say a remote area in North Eastern India? Or say being posted to such excellent postings like Managing Director, Housing Development Corporation or Managing Director, Police Welfare & Housing etc. There are numerous posts available for IAS and IPS officers who do not gel well with the ruling government. Tamil Nadu I guess, gets the cake. People who ruled police divisons in Chennai city, found themselves posted at Mandapam Refugee camp (for Sri Lankan tamils) security bandobust ;).

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Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Singha » 30 May 2014 21:18

as per another article posted somewhere in BRF today mauritius has offered not one but two island bases (for IAF and IN) but Nai dilli / MEA did not take it up in MMS regime.

thats gotta change now.

the best posts for regime loyalists are as Deputy Commisioner of Narcondam island. skeptics may look it up on the map and yes we have a police/CG presence there.


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