Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

[Suraj]

The communist support base in Kerala is the Hindu OBCs. That they support the CPI/CPM is an anachronism, due to past communist support for their emancipation. They are a ripe demographic whose interests the BJP can safeguard as well or better than the communists, depending on how much effort the BJP is willing to put into it.

Agreed. But BJP I feel should have a Kerala-specific charter for this to be achieved. Some of the stuff which may work in rest of India, may not work in Kerala at all. I also feel that many commies now having pro-BJP thoughts may also be because of the over-pampering of the minorities by the Congress govt. (with the commie leadership keeping a "secular" silence). Antony's statement regarding the pampering also can be read in the same light. Many a neutral commie does have a feeling that secularism is going the wrong way in Kerala. The commie leadership still comes up with their emanicipation (of Hindu lower castes) stories of the 1940s and 1950s to show their relevance. People have started calling their bluff.

That is what I meant by "how much effort the BJP is willing to put into it". They cannot simply say 'vote for Modi' or bring in a cookie cutter UP idea. The Ezhavas etc know that they are hanging on to a party on national life support - the commies - while the UDP keeps enroaching upon their interests and INC is still relevant. Time is ripe for the BJP to step in and actively court them en masse. I would not be surprised if the SNDP, NSS, and even the Orthdox church fox jump into the BJP bandwagon. This combined demographic has enough statewide coverage to consistently outdo the UDP, except in the far north and far south.

[Nilesh Oak]

I guess now there is final run to 1008 pages. Now that election is over and while all BRFites closely follow progress and execution of Modi Sarkar,

consider adding the following to your reading list (even if you don't understand astronomy... you still want to understand the gist of the arguments and their implications for written history of India going back to AT LEAST 14000+ years.

When did the Mahabharata War Happen?
The Historic Rama.

Namo Nama.

[SriKumar]

Indeed, quite a thread. The opening post has so much gravitas and a sense for the times. I would hope Arjun makes a 'concluding post' of sorts before this gets archived.

[sudarshan]

I remember back to when Modi had just been elevated to BJP PM candidate (I think) when the thread was at 200 odd pages. Somebody made the remark "when we get to May of next year (2014 that is), and Modi actually becomes PM, this thread will be at 300+ pages!!!"

Well! I could have told the person right then that he was plain wrong, but my best estimate back then was 500 or 600 pages by May 2014.

The reality was that the thread was at 800 or 900 pages in May, and now it's at a 1000. And can you believe it, Modi really is PM!!! Who cares about page count after that?

But it's been an amazing test of the forum software, for sure.

[Arjun]

Wow, so we finally get to our milestone. 1000 pages in about 18 months !

Thanks to everyone who took ownership of this thread in true "mission mode" over the last year and more - and worked to bring about change in the country. The list of active contributors and participants is too long, so will not even attempt it. Suffice to say it included among the best minds in the Forum and all those who have been concerned that Indians should make the right choice in this epochal elections.

And what a mandate from the Indian people ! I had myself expressed doubt a few months back on these pages as to whether the Indian electorate would be up to the task...I need not have worried. The wisdom of Indian voters was truly stunning. India turned a corner - the world turned a corner.

My hat tip, therefore, is to the wisdom of the Indian people. To me, that has been a revelation. The hat tip is also for its most remarkable set of opinion-makers (many who are on this Forum) - whose voice is now amplified by the power of social media. India is solved - now, we've got to take on the world

[SaiK]

it is like the egg and chicken here.. or the seeds of change to the growth of seeds in people's minds.
internet itself was a big brother seed that implanted subliminal messages otherwise it would be hard to do.
thanks to the growth of mobile devices as well and social networking systems.

[member_28025]

Please don't lock this thread. Let it run along with NaMo. Although I am not the superstitious type, I feel it is linked to NaMo's victory.

[chetak]

GHOSTS FROM THE PAST

- Barack Obama’s concerns regarding Narendra Modi

Diplomacy: K.P. Nayar
Washington is a city of frequent surprises, but this latest one about Barack Obama and Narendra Modi takes the cake. President Obama was at a fundraiser, a very, very exclusive one, to raise money for Democrats in the Senate and in the House of Representatives who are fighting the November election with their backs to the wall. There — predictably as Indians in their current national mood are prone to assumptions — one of the fat cat donors asked about India’s new prime minister.

Obama replied in his calm, no-nonsense style that he continued to have concerns about Modi’s past. The reply shook up the small audience which was hanging on to every word that came out of the president. It was a surprise because the media coverage after Modi’s rise as the new star over the Indian political horizon had created an impression that bygones are now bygones in the Modi-Obama equation, which the incumbent president, in any case, had inherited from his predecessor, George W. Bush.

The invitation to Modi to visit the White House in September, rarely extended to leaders who travel to New York for the annual United Nations General Assembly, had additionally been interpreted — quite wrongly as it turns out — that the United States of America had reversed course on its visa ban on the long-time former chief minister of Gujarat. One television station went so far as to assert that the US had done a U-turn on Modi. Nothing is farther from the truth.

Given such atmospherics, it was only natural that Obama’s admission that he continues to have concerns about Modi’s past triggered a supplementary question to Obama as a follow-up. The president was unflappable. He was a master of understatement. His reply was a classic. Once again, the answer vindicated the 2008 rhyming description of him during his first successful presidential campaign as “No Drama Obama.”

“My name is Barack ‘HUSSEIN’ Obama,” was all that he said in a reply that was pithy but pregnant in its implications. The president did not, of course, emphasize his Muslim middle name. The emphasis in the text here is mine. He did not have to: because the self-sustaining emphasis was not lost on anyone present at the fundraiser. There was a brief, but stunned, silence as everyone who heard the president digested the import of what Obama had said in six words that were worth a thousand.

Ever since I first met Obama in 2004 when he was elected to the Senate as one of its junior-most members and easily accessible then, I have heard him use his middle name only twice. At his inauguration on the steps of the Capitol building in 2009 and again in 2013. Those who follow Obama closely agreed that this fundraiser was probably the third time he used his Muslim name and its significance cannot be overlooked.

On a visit to Washington last week, I was recounted this very revealing anecdote on the strict understanding that if I ever wrote about it I would leave no clues about the source of my information, that I would be as vague as possible about this fundraiser and that I would also balance my account of the incident against the reality that notwithstanding the president’s personal concerns about Modi, the Obama administration will leave no stone unturned to work towards a thriving relationship with the new Bharatiya Janata Party-led government in New Delhi.

Whatever maybe tugging at the president’s heartstrings and triggering his feelings about the man who became India’s prime minister over a month ago, it is a given certainty that Modi will receive a spectacular red carpet welcome in the White House in September. There will not even be a hint during the visit of past baggage in Modi’s equation with two successive American administrations. Every effort will be made to live up to the prime minister’s expectation — which he has shared in the last few weeks in more than one private conversation — that his September sojourn is to be the most important of his foreign visits in the immediate future.

More than most politicians elsewhere, the only times US presidents and presidential hopefuls come anywhere near telling the whole truth is when they are at fundraisers. Which is not surprising because without fat cat donors, no public servant seeking high elected office has any chance of succeeding in America where money is the pivot on which elections revolve.

During the 2012 US presidential campaign, with only seven weeks to go before voting, the Republican candidate, Mitt Romney, was caught in a surreptitiously taped video as admitting at a fundraiser that he did not care about the kind of people who support Obama because they take no responsibility for their livelihoods and think they are entitled to government handouts. Romney acknowledged in the leaked video that such Obama supporters account for “47 percent” of voters and that he, Romney, does not “worry about those people.”

Romney, according to opinion polls then, had a reasonable chance of defeating Obama, but Romney’s true self that was revealed to donors in a purportedly secret conversation severely damaged the Republicans and they did not recover in that presidential poll cycle. Obama quickly pounced on Romney’s disparaging remarks about nearly half of America’s population. His campaign said, “the president certainly does not think that men and women on Social Security are irresponsible or victims, that students aren’t responsible or are victims…”

Politics in America is replete with examples of truth having brought down aspirants for high office. In the 2006 Senate election season, a potential presidential hopeful, Virginia Senator George Allen, was caught on video making racist comments about an Indian American student volunteer for Democrats who was at his campaign event. “This fellow here, over here with the yellow shirt, macaca, or whatever his name is. He is with my opponent. He is following us around everywhere.” The leaked video did Allen in and he lost.

Wiser by such experiences, Obama’s fundraiser where he opened a small window to his true feelings about Modi was carefully managed to avoid any faux pas on account of leaks. Video cameras were out of question, of course. Donors had to deposit their mobile phones outside the venue, pens or even notebooks were not allowed. Every donor was then frisked to ensure that the president would not have to confront the ghosts of any of his truthful assertions to his moneyed supporters.

But there is nothing to beat the most conventional method of passing information which has stood the test of time: word of mouth. I have verified with a second donor what I was told by one donor about Obama’s remarks referring to the prime minister. The second donor, too, insisted on discretion, however, and protection of his identity because this US administration is seen in Washington as the most unforgiving in recent years, where those who fail tests of loyalty to the White House are treated as no less than apostates.

Yet it is a tribute to the perennial concessions that America makes to its larger interests and an example of its diversity of State machinery that work has already begun in earnest in Washington to guarantee that Modi’s first visit to the city as prime minister will be a milestone to remember in Indo-US relations. Like all successes, the perceived transformation of Modi from persona non grata into a welcome friend in the White House is a success that has many claimants for its fatherhood.

However, two names deserve mention: Frank Wisner, former US ambassador in New Delhi, and Ron Somers, who recently resigned as president of the US-India Business Council. These two men took it upon themselves while the Lok Sabha election campaign was under way to mobilize America’s business community as the vanguard of a change in attitude towards Modi.

Contrary to the impression in India, there is no evidence to support any claim that the US has changed its policy on a visa for Modi. His new job as head of India’s national government entitles him to an A-1 visa. As chief minister, he was not entitled to this visa and he was denied a visa in the category that he was eligible for as Gujarat’s top official. What the campaign by Wisner and Somers achieved was to cover up this zone of discomfort and provide respectability to the process of inviting Modi to Washington.

[Pratyush]

Meanwhile back in the loon city that is known as the INC.

Sonia meets President Pranab, pushes for Leader of Opposition status

[niran]

Meanwhile back in the loon city that is known as the INC.

Sonia meets President Pranab, pushes for Leader of Opposition status

there righted the wrong.

[merlin]

Meanwhile back in the loon city that is known as the INC.

Sonia meets President Pranab, pushes for Leader of Opposition status

there righted the wrong.

If I'm reading BJP's approach to this, it is to wait for the Congress to come and formally ask for LOP status. Then decline stating rules. Massive echandee loss for the Congress. That's why they are not formally approaching the speaker for this. Or they will after all efforts at mobilizing public opinion are complete and when denied, whine and try and pass some motion against the speaker of the LS. I don't think they will approach the SC until they are sure that CJI Lodha will judge their case.

[habal]

Leader of Opposition should read as LOO instead of LOP.

[Pratyush]

^^^^

[hanumadu]

https://twitter.com/Narendramodi_G/status/486741341649395712/photo/1
During UPA 60,000 crores sanctioned for 99 new rail lines but only 1 got completed.

[member_28025]

Modi heads for BRICS summit in Brazil

Modi would be accompanied by Minister of State for Commerce and Industry (independent charge) Nirmala Sitharaman and National Security Advisor Ajit Doval.

Sushma not attending? Any feedback on who from the media is attending? I hope NaMo is taking only PTI.

[ramana]

And makes PTI get training on writing. Their reports are carried verbatim.in most media.

[Sri]

This thread is by far the best repository of rise of NAMO phenomenon and possibly start of a new yuga, anywhere in the world. Any serious academic studying this amazing story cannot have a better resource than this thread. Prime example of knowledge sourcing.

Some of the members here have suggested that a pdf document is possible. If true please do share the procedure. I plan to print 1000 copies of this thread, laminate each page and distribute it among friends, family and fellow brfites to keep these pages in safe places. We have to ensure that this soft repository of this modern event is also available offline and secured for the future generations... just in case...

[Ashokk]

Sushma not attending? Any feedback on who from the media is attending? I hope NaMo is taking only PTI.

All eyes on PM Modi's first international summit

Interestingly, the Prime Minister’s Office under Modi has broken the tradition of including 30 plus media persons in his entourage except journalists from two government-owned media agencies. In total there are seven media persons who will be accompanying the PM -- V S Chandrasekar from Press Trust of India, Naz Asghar from United News of India, Sudhir Kumar from Doordarshan and Meraj Uddin from All India Radio, apart from two camera persons from Asian News International and Doordarshan and one photographer from the Films division.

Officially it’s not known why PM Modi doesn’t want media men on board when his flight is big enough to easily accommodate 34 media personalities. Moreover, there are compelling reasons to cover his first official meet with the world’s two most powerful and charismatic leaders.

A senior government officer who was part of the preparatory meetings told Rediff.com that it’s possible that the Modi government doesn’t want to spend exchequer’s money on reporters who belong to cash-rich media houses. It wants media houses to pay from their pockets if they want to cover PM’s visit.

Another explanation doing the rounds is that after having the brute majority the government seems to believe that it can afford to keep media at arm’s length as Modi has done in Gujarat where the media was kept informed only when the chief minister wanted to. It was always a one-way street.

Modi likes to do business with the established media on 'need to know' basis, claims a senior journalist from Gujarat.

“Probably he wants to replicate the Gujarat model in New Delhi,” he adds.

With or without the heavy presence of Indian media the BRICS event is immensely important as it’ll see the launch of the BRICS bank. The “New Development Bank” which is supposed to counter the monopoly of the IMF will have $100 billion of capital within seven years. Each founding country will contribute $2 billion for the next seven years. The bank is set to start lending in 2016.

After concluding the bilateral meetings with Brazil and South Africa’s president, PM Modi will meet leaders from Peru, Guyana and Suriname too amongst other South American leaders.

Lots of whining among the news traders now that the free media junkets tap has been closed off.

[chetak]

Sushma not attending? Any feedback on who from the media is attending? I hope NaMo is taking only PTI.

All eyes on PM Modi's first international summit

Interestingly, the Prime Minister’s Office under Modi has broken the tradition of including 30 plus media persons in his entourage except journalists from two government-owned media agencies. In total there are seven media persons who will be accompanying the PM -- V S Chandrasekar from Press Trust of India, Naz Asghar from United News of India, Sudhir Kumar from Doordarshan and Meraj Uddin from All India Radio, apart from two camera persons from Asian News International and Doordarshan and one photographer from the Films division.

Officially it’s not known why PM Modi doesn’t want media men on board when his flight is big enough to easily accommodate 34 media personalities. Moreover, there are compelling reasons to cover his first official meet with the world’s two most powerful and charismatic leaders.

A senior government officer who was part of the preparatory meetings told Rediff.com that it’s possible that the Modi government doesn’t want to spend exchequer’s money on reporters who belong to cash-rich media houses. It wants media houses to pay from their pockets if they want to cover PM’s visit.

Another explanation doing the rounds is that after having the brute majority the government seems to believe that it can afford to keep media at arm’s length as Modi has done in Gujarat where the media was kept informed only when the chief minister wanted to. It was always a one-way street.

Modi likes to do business with the established media on 'need to know' basis, claims a senior journalist from Gujarat.

“Probably he wants to replicate the Gujarat model in New Delhi,” he adds.

With or without the heavy presence of Indian media the BRICS event is immensely important as it’ll see the launch of the BRICS bank. The “New Development Bank” which is supposed to counter the monopoly of the IMF will have $100 billion of capital within seven years. Each founding country will contribute $2 billion for the next seven years. The bank is set to start lending in 2016.

After concluding the bilateral meetings with Brazil and South Africa’s president, PM Modi will meet leaders from Peru, Guyana and Suriname too amongst other South American leaders.

Lots of whining among the news traders now that the free media junkets tap has been closed off.

aunty burqua has no option now but to interview Hillary once again!

[Arjun]

^^ This is a little short-sighted. If cost is the limiting factor, a limit of say 10 - 12 can be set which would include some slots for promising private Indian channels that are showcasing India the right way.

[chetak]

^^ This is a little short-sighted. If cost is the limiting factor, a limit of say 10 - 12 can be set which would include some slots for promising private Indian channels that are showcasing India the right way.

The @#$%^& media did nothing for him, why would he do anything for the very same @#$%^& media??

Some private channels went to bhutan on their own. Let them do so here also if they so desire

[Arjun]

The @#$%^& media did nothing for him, why would he do anything for the very same @#$%^& media??

Some private channels went to bhutan on their own. Let them do so here also if they so desire

Media is an industry like any other. We want (a) an Indian media that will dominate world media, and (b) we want responsible reporting. Modi must incubate and encourage organizations that are aligned on both points (a) and (b).

[prahaar]

The @#$%^& media did nothing for him, why would he do anything for the very same @#$%^& media??

Some private channels went to bhutan on their own. Let them do so here also if they so desire

Media is an industry like any other. We want (a) an Indian media that will dominate world media, and (b) we want responsible reporting. Modi must incubate and encourage organizations that are aligned on both points (a) and (b).

The segment that is shouting the loudest is not Indian media, but Indian representatives of foreign interests. NaMo wants to exclude unnecessary leaks and drama, only after proper scrutiny intimate access should be provided.

[Muppalla]

He allowed DD and that is enough. If Media as an industry does not occupy any world space, we will still be better off than giving a misusable freedom.

[chetak]

The @#$%^& media did nothing for him, why would he do anything for the very same @#$%^& media??

Some private channels went to bhutan on their own. Let them do so here also if they so desire

Media is an industry like any other. We want (a) an Indian media that will dominate world media, and (b) we want responsible reporting. Modi must incubate and encourage organizations that are aligned on both points (a) and (b).

(a) and (b) both are not available in India.

Available media jokers are liars, @lickers and paid news traders and pressitutes. male and female and some hijras too like radia and her well known notorious media cohorts peddling poison and raking in the moolah while making deals.

ELM or (EJM if you prefer) is/are not owned or controlled from India so loyalty and pride in the country is lacking. The only distinguishing feature is anti Hindu hostility and a deep sense of anti India angst.

Modi has done the right thing.

[kmkraoind]

Modi is speaking in Hindi to Chinese dignitaries (at 3:15).

[member_28025]

Social revolution takes huge leap in Gujarat

AHMEDABAD: At least 80 students belonging to socially backward dalit and tribal families are being groomed to be priests as part of the three-year diploma course of priesthood — purohityam (karmakand) — at Shree Somnath Sanskrit University in Saurashtra.

The course was designed at the behest of then Gujarat CM Narendra Modi to socially empower youth from SC and ST castes with the knowledge of rituals. An allocation of Rs 22.5 lakh was made towards this in the 2011 budget.

[chetak]

Social revolution takes huge leap in Gujarat

AHMEDABAD: At least 80 students belonging to socially backward dalit and tribal families are being groomed to be priests as part of the three-year diploma course of priesthood — purohityam (karmakand) — at Shree Somnath Sanskrit University in Saurashtra.

The course was designed at the behest of then Gujarat CM Narendra Modi to socially empower youth from SC and ST castes with the knowledge of rituals. An allocation of Rs 22.5 lakh was made towards this in the 2011 budget.

Shamlee ji,

It will be a short lived phenomena.

This is not a paying profession/proposition in India.

pity.

[satya]

There is shortage of young pujaris/pandits who can chant mantras/shlokas in sanskrit .Kashi pool is drying up and kids from traditional brahmin families in UP & Bihar are looking for employment in other sectors of economy. 10-15 years ago most astrologers in north india were brahmins but now maybe 70:30 split ( brahmins: non-brahmins).
Financially its not rewarding for a young pujari .Most of time he barely survives. In NCR most of them perform puja+yagya & japas ,sort of outsource contract given by senior astrologers with patronage in Lutyens delhi making an average of 500-1000 rupees ( if lucky) per day.

[KJo]

There is shortage of young pujaris/pandits who can chant mantras/shlokas in sanskrit .Kashi pool is drying up and kids from traditional brahmin families in UP & Bihar are looking for employment in other sectors of economy. 10-15 years ago most astrologers in north india were brahmins but now maybe 70:30 split ( brahmins: non-brahmins).
Financially its not rewarding for a young pujari .Most of time he barely survives. In NCR most of them perform puja+yagya & japas ,sort of outsource contract given by senior astrologers with patronage in Lutyens delhi making an average of 500-1000 rupees ( if lucky) per day.

I wonder whether this is because the erstwhile Christian Govt of India was stealing Hindu money from the Hundis and using it for 'secular' purposes. This reduces the earning potential for poojaris.
Once this is restored, things may get better.

[IndraD]

PM for BRICS, experts in body language can extrapolate more

[SaiK]

if the other hand goes back while handshake means that person is either humbled or lacks confidence.

[hanumadu]

PM for BRICS, experts in body language can extrapolate more

Please, no more of this body language BS.

[Hari Seldon]

PM for BRICS, experts in body language can extrapolate more

Please, no more of this body language BS.

What?! No. More body language analysis pls!

After years and years we have an unapologetic Indic at the helm. Should analyze whatever we can of the man. Be sure that phoren spook agencies will be, even as we speak, constructing detailed psych profiles of the man. We can do our bit to sow FUD among their 50 centers and bots that visit these nether regions of the web.... Only.

[Hari Seldon]

Body language analysts/speculators.... where art thou??

[Suraj]

Putin is constipated. Xi has a bad back and is probably wearing his wife's corset under the suit. Modi on the other hand has great flexibility due to yoga and can therefore bend with ease.

[prahaar]

Nirmalaji Sitharaman looks exhausted, probably fallen sick with.

[member_28025]

Nirmalaji Sitharaman looks exhausted, probably fallen sick with.

She has been working really hard since the govt. came to power. Even before during the election she was very busy. She is one of my favourite persons in politics.

[Prasad]

Putin is constipated. Xi has a bad back and is probably wearing his wife's corset under the suit. Modi on the other hand has great flexibility due to yoga and can therefore bend with ease.

Pictures show a blink of an eye's worth. They're not a video to show proper body-language displayed by the actors. So unless you have videos to talk about, can we quit talking about body-language in these photos BENIS is of course, an exception.

[Sachin]

There is shortage of young pujaris/pandits who can chant mantras/shlokas in sanskrit .Kashi pool is drying up and kids from traditional brahmin families in UP & Bihar are looking for employment in other sectors of economy.

The same situation exists in Kerala as well, so much so that there were media reports on the same. Temple priests in Kerala were traditionally Namboodiri Brahmins. Then came the Tulu Brahmins who filled the shortage for quite a few years. Now among these communities most of the boys have no inclination to take up this job, and have pretty much ignored any aspect of the traditional learning they should have. And now in few districts in Kerala (Palakkad mainly) priests from UP and Bihar have taken up the job . And in an interview these folks (pretty young chaps) said that they get paid better, have a quarters to stay and can send some good amount back home. People are happy with them as well.

Namboodiri community showed a high craze for communism in the 1950s to 1970s. Pretty much every one was a commie, and this has now taken a toll on the temple priesthood business. A few of these commies (now 40+ old at least) have now became turncoats and have started going back. Not because of any love for Hindu Gods, but their own religious tag gives them an undue advantage (other communities cannot do Poojas). These folks have realised that this job has "reservations" for them. Another aspect which makes the young crowd skip the job is the 24/7 nature of the job. A priest has to be available pretty much every day during the course of the year. Their working hours are pretty odd (early mornings & early evenings) which makes their family life a bit problematic. Especially if their wives are working. The pay they get is also not commensurate with the nature of the job. And off course a priest has to live a life which is the society constantly checks (no booze, no non-veg etc. etc.).

I wonder whether this is because the erstwhile Christian Govt of India was stealing Hindu money from the Hundis and using it for 'secular' purposes.

In Kerala this was a big debate. And finally the government won the debate. The government was able to clearly prove that money they received from Temple Hundis were distributed among other temples which did not get much income. As per the government, people are only bothered about temples which gets huge donations. But the various "Devaswom Boards" also have other temples which are small, and does not bring in much revenue. But "staff" is placed there for poojas, and they have to be paid as well. The government clearly stated that pro-Hindu organisations were making a big fuss only for temples which brought in lots of income . So far I have not seen any response from this from pro-Hindutva organisations. In Kerala, Devaswom Minister is a Hindu, the Devaswom Board members are also Hindus, and the staff are also Hindus.