Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

apoorv · Post by **apoorv** » 19 Jun 2013 16:58

One small victory for us voters due to NaMo is that this elections is not going to be a dead one like last time when the performance of the incumbent government was not even discuessed. Only focus was on fringe elements calling themselves as believers in Hindutva line of thought doing some small scale rioting.

NaMo has shifted the whole debate to performance and governance. Yes caste equations, religion and even corruption etc. will be discussed but the soul of discussion will consist of governance, performance and decisiveness of the leader.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 19 Jun 2013 17:30

Delhi BJP chief rejects proposal to congratulate Gujarat CM Modi

The Bharatiya Janata Party's (BJP) internal rifts were apparent in the party's state executive meet on Tuesday. The rift between the Advani and Modi camps forced Delhi BJP chief Vijay Goel to avoid mentioning the Gujarat Chief Minister or declare the Delhi unit's support for him, because Ananth Kumar, a close aide of senior leader L K Advani, was present at the meet.

Goel had to avoid mentioning Modi despite the fact that state units and even the BJP-led corporations want to associate with Modi.

Vijender Gupta, former Delhi BJP chief, brought the proposal to send in a congratulatory note to Narendra Modi on his appointment as election committee chief. Much to his astonishment, Goel reportedly took away the microphone from his hands and announced that no such action is required on the part of the Delhi unit.

"I was shocked when my proposal was turned down. I was expecting that my proposal will get support of the unit chief as we all draw inspiration from Narendra Modi. But when the Delhi unit chief interrupted me and rejected the proposal I was at a loss for words," Gupta said.

Commenting on the issue, Goel said the proposal always comes from the chair and not from other members. "I did not consider it as a proposal and I praised Modi for his development work and the audience clapped, Gupta too may have wanted this," Goel said.

Contrary to his claim that proposal should come from the chair, when BJP MLA Ramesh Bidhuri brought a proposal to give Delhi full statehood, Goel accepted that proposal.

At a time when most of BJP state units and even municipal corporations in Delhi are drawing inspiration from Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi, the Delhi unit president wants to maintain a distance from the party's newly appointed election campaign committee head.

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/delhi ... i/1130801/

Vijay Goel foils motion to laud Modi

By Tarun Nangia - NEW DELHI

19th June 2013 09:04 AM

BJP state unit president Vijay Goel on Tuesday foiled an attempt by party men to pass a resolution congratulating Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi on his elevation as the party’s poll campaign chief.

The motion came up at the first meeting of the newly constituted state executive committee held here on Tuesday.

BJP’s former national president Murli Manohar Joshi, general secretary (organisation) Ram Lal, national general secretary Ananth Kumar, national headquarter in-charge and former MP O P Kohli and Haryana state in-charge Jagdish Mukhi attended the state executive committee meeting.

When the resolution was moved in the state executive, Goel reasoned that the national executive had already passed a resolution to this effect and hence there was no need to pass such a resolution at the state executive, sources said.

Party sources told Express that senior leaders present on the occasion chose to remain silent on the resolution. “Senior leaders neither voiced support nor opposed the motion,” a party source maintained.

http://newindianexpress.com/nation/Vija ... 641774.ece

Thanks to Vijay Goel and other Advani-loyalists, its going to be a 'Modi-less' canvassing in Delhi - http://daily.bhaskar.com/article/DEL-de ... 5-NOR.html

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 19 Jun 2013 18:16

Now that we saw another demonstration of deep pent-up bile against Modi from Nitish Kumar - time to once again join the dots on what the primary driver for hatred against Modi is.

And no - its not Hindutva. Its Modi's economic policies... Nitish views himself as a committed socialist in the line of Ram Manohar Lohia and JP Narayan -a mantle that he's looking to build on.

Advani, Sudhindra Kulkarni, Nitish, Sushma Swaraj - the link between the anti-Modi camp and socialist ideologies is fascinating & not too hard to miss. Inspite of the Dynasty's efforts to turn this into a false secularism vs communalism debate - this elections will primarily be fought on the plank of whose development vision is more appealing to all classes. Modi automatically wins for the upper and middle classes. The key will to work out a promising vision for the lower classes that does not yield to handouts and victimhood glorification- but yet assures a better future with more growth and development for all.

Ashok Sarraff · Post by **Ashok Sarraff** » 19 Jun 2013 18:18

Re. UP, it seems that SP and Congress will have an electoral tie-up, even if its an informal one. That leaves BJP and BSP as the other two players in the field. I was wondering what would be the implications of BJP and BSP forming an alliance. If they do form an alliance, it is likely to be a clean sweep for them. Seperately, both may aim for one third of the seats, but not more. To me a BJP-BSP alliance seems beneficial to both in electoral terms. But in the broader scheme of things, I have always wanted BSP to be closely allied with BJP or even a saner, gentler, and more responsible Mayawati to join BJP for a grand unification of the so called Dalits with the so called caste Hindus. Ultimately, that's what BSP wants and that's what RSS aims for.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 19 Jun 2013 18:19

Since Nitish is so outspoken against Modi, methinks Modi has plans to destroy Nitish. Bihar and UP will go Modi way in 2014.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 19 Jun 2013 19:02

Arjun wrote: Advani, Sudhindra Kulkarni, Nitish, Sushma Swaraj - the link between the anti-Modi camp and socialist ideologies is fascinating & not too hard to miss. .

A small hark back to reality --

I don't see ANY remote backing of the statement that Gujarat's policies are different from Sangh's stated goals, and shared by everyone else mentioned, and I don't see it because there is no difference that they have ever talked about or acted on.

Just saying.

James B · Post by **James B** » 19 Jun 2013 19:03

Advani unwell, defers meeting with RSS Chief till tomorrow

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 19 Jun 2013 19:03

NaMo's security worries me. I hope they are taking precautions unlike Rajiv Gandhi's carelessness that cost him his life and India years of Sonia rule.
NaMo's potential ascent means that there are many Muslim vested interests in Pakistan, Middle East etc who would be unhappy. He has to be on his guard.

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 19 Jun 2013 19:09

SwamyG exactly, thats what I felt, when listening to nitish the words were coming from deep pain. Like a man who knows that he is slipping oblivion slowly but surely and knows Shri NaMo is responsible for it.

rkirankr · Post by **rkirankr** » 19 Jun 2013 19:15

Ajay Maken tweets

'Youth Congress Uttarakhand Workers Help Flash Flood Victims' http://yuvadesh.in/116/IYC Uttarakhand-Workers-Help-Uttarkashi-Flash-Flood-Victims

Cong supporters do not jump with joy. The link is a 2012 article. Shameless.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 19 Jun 2013 19:27

James B wrote:Advani unwell, defers meeting with RSS Chief till tomorrow

I think he is coming to real oldage.. my father did some similar real stupid decisions before he RIP-ed. I am seeing similar pattern. Not to wish anything bad., but hey, we all are part of the life-cycle based planet system.

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 19 Jun 2013 19:38

Advaniji would be best served just enjoying his last years as a respected party elder. Hankering after a PM position - that boat has sailed. He is 85 or so and that is too old. He should have haggled with Atalji back in the 90s.I think the problem is he feels that he has spent his entire career and others are eating the fruits of his labor. He is being very unreasonable, but that seems to be his frame of mind.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 19 Jun 2013 20:13

James B wrote:Advani unwell, defers meeting with RSS Chief till tomorrow

He seems to be often strategically unwell.
Maybe he should consider retiring for the sake of his health.
Its not like there is an epidemic in India.

Ashok Sarraff · Post by **Ashok Sarraff** » 19 Jun 2013 20:17

Advani is like my son in one respect. He falls sick at will when he anticipates encountering a furious teacher.

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 19 Jun 2013 20:18

Modi should promise to make Advani the Indian Ambassador to the UN if he just shuts up and stays out of the campaign's path. Send off the useless old man as envoy to a useless old organization, with plenty of H&D, perks etc. to keep him happy.

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 19 Jun 2013 20:18

^^^LKA has ensured he cannot be taken seriously anymore. Good. Sure, he'll strategically raise some freak issue or the other and the dilli media will lap it up, good for them.

But the show will now be run by gen next in the BJP.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 19 Jun 2013 20:26

Pranav, No such thing. Just scan back the last few pages and see the results. Anyway two of th three have agreed to cooperate. The third is defacto if not dejure cooperating as the others agreed to cooperate.

BTW, guys thanks for the understanding.

Sanku, I want you to study practical political game theory for you will understand whats happening.

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 19 Jun 2013 20:28

Why won't the BJP just put this issue to rest by having an intra party election? Let LKA compete with NaMo.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 19 Jun 2013 20:34

Indian style is not that way. It leads to permanent enemies.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Jun 2013 20:35

Soosai sniper fire at Namo

archan · Post by **archan** » 19 Jun 2013 20:37

Pranav wrote: Is this thread causing takleef outside of BRF (like the YSR accident thread did)?

We've seen a tendency on BRF that members often overestimate the impact of their posts. Outside of BRF, it hardly matters what people post in here. Which is why I am surprised how serious some take themselves/their posts here.
No, no takleef anywhere "outside". Its just that the mods are getting fed up.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Jun 2013 20:41

Besides NiKu Goel is another person liked by both that is Sonia and D4.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 19 Jun 2013 20:42

one danger man is hanging himself in public. One down hopefully with few more to go. This guy may be single-handedly responsible for 2004 and 2009 debacle (and many during ABV govt).

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Jun 2013 20:48

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 19 Jun 2013 20:56

Sanku wrote:I don't see ANY remote backing of the statement that Gujarat's policies are different from Sangh's stated goals, and shared by everyone else mentioned, and I don't see it because there is no difference that they have ever talked about or acted on.

That may be true...but the 'Socialists' see the Gujarat model as very different from the model they would like the country to move towards.

Nitish certainly does. Sudhindra Kulkarni we know is a socialist and he's anti-Modi...Advani is close to Sudhindra, and in his final Yatra he was praising Ram Manohar Lohia more than the RSS leaders. Sushma Swaraj's husband is a known socialist.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Jun 2013 21:05

Interrogating Nitish Kumar’s Opposition to Narendra Modi

Since, all the justificationgiven by Nitish Kumar are just empty rhetorics, what exactly is the reason behind his uncompromising opposition to Narendra Modi?

The reason is multifaceted.

Nitish Kumar belongs to the affluent OBCs (other backward castes)- Kurmi. Leaders of these castes i.e. Kurmis, Yadavs etc, have risen to power in the Mandal era riding on the caste mobilisation in the name of social justice in opposition to the hegemony of the traditional caste elites i.e., upper castes. But what actually happened was just the replacement of upper castes by OBCs as the social and political elites.

The whole structure of oppression and discrimination remained intact. There was no social justice to be had, but only the creation of neo-Brahmins and neo-Kshtriyas as sociologists term it. The EBCs (extremely backward castes) and Dalits continued to be denied equal rights and economic opportunities. It cannot be forgotten that one of the very first massacres of Dalits over the land issue was done by “Bhumi Sena” in Belchi-1978, Bihar. Bhumi Sena was a private militia of the Kurmi landed interests, the caste to which Nitish Kumar belongs.

These OBC satraps are in direct conflict with the upper castes for power and control on the one hand while suppressing any challenge from EBCs and Dalits on the other hand. Sensing that their numbers, though significant, is not enough to capture power they have adopted the language of Congressi secularism to woo the Muslims on their side. Secularism is nothing but a political farce of power hungry, semi-feudal regional OBCs satraps.

No common Muslim has not benefited an iota from this secularist paradigm. All this talk of Islam, Muslim welfare, reservations, minority rights is upper caste Muslim discourse which is used by them to maintain their hegemonic grip over the society with the help of the religious establishment and secular allies. So, politicians like Nitish Kumar speak the language of social justice and minority welfare but have no interest in delivering it.

Therefore, Narendra Modi is such a big threat for them. Modi comes from an extremely backward caste background and has risen through ranks through his sheer hard work and dedication. But what is more remarkable is that he has done so without invoking caste politics. He has succeeded without flaunting his backward caste status and crying hoarse over social justice. This has shaken the whole political status quo in India which is intricately woven around caste.

The most threatened are the OBCs satraps like Nitish Kumar as Modi threatens to lure away a large section of their voters; and horror of the horrors, he may herald the political arrival of EBCs on their own which will severely curtail the free run affluent OBCs have been enjoying since last two decades. This will be the end of the Mandal era in Indian politics. It is therefore, impossible for leaders like Nitish, Mulayam to tolerate the rise of Narendra Modi. And despite differences they have all united behind Congress to prevent that from happening. How on earth can a person of such a low caste sit on the PM chair on his own while we the born superiors are still out there?

Then there is the development politics Narendra Modi represents. By championing agricultural growth, industrialisation and a market economy he is threatening to sweep aside the semi-feudal, casteist order prevalent in Bihar. A free market economy is the most potent antidote to the caste system as argued by this author in an earlier post “On Caste and Economics”. Caste system is ultimately based on the denial of economic freedom enforced by organised violence.

The market economy, industrialisation and urbanisation weaken the caste system by directly assaulting its basis. They break down the old economic relations based on birth and provide unprecedented social and economic mobility which results in the progressive weakening of caste discrimination and the system itself. Naturally the demise of the old order will be the eclipse of old elites who derive their power from caste and clan based social system.

Modi has steadfastly refused to pay homage to caste and communal politics. It is his secular detractors who are going all out in their communal propaganda. If Modi succeeds, there is a very real possibility of India entering into the post-secular, post-socialist and post-casteist political culture. Something which is a real anathema to Nitish Kumar and his new found allies.

http://centreright.in/2013/06/interroga ... ndra-modi/

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Jun 2013 21:08

Is it correct?. Total seats way more than 40.

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 19 Jun 2013 21:09

Sanku wrote:I don't see ANY remote backing of the statement that Gujarat's policies are different from Sangh's stated goals, and shared by everyone else mentioned, and I don't see it because there is no difference that they have ever talked about or acted on.

The Sangh does not have one voice on economic policy. For every Gujarat, there is another body like the Swadeshi Jagran Manch pulling in the opposite direction.

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 19 Jun 2013 21:19

Why the BJP needs Advani more than ever

June 17, 2013 14:21 IST

The shock treatment that Advani administered to the BJP has simply no parallel in India’s modern political history, says Sudheendra Kulkarni.

Strength, said Mahatma Gandhi, does not come from physical capacity. It comes from one’s moral capacity. Strength in this sense is age-agnostic.

L K Advani, the 85-year-old and super-fit patriarch of the Bharatiya Janata Party, is an admirer of the Mahatma. He does not agree with all that Gandhiji did and preached. But in one key respect, he is more Gandhian than most Indian political leaders. If truthfulness is the source and the main criterion of one’s moral capacity, Advani is unfailingly truthful in his political and personal conduct.

When he does not want to reply to a certain question, he may not reveal the truth hidden in the answer to that question. But he will never tell an untruth. He will never mislead someone or indulge in a cunning or dishonest ploy for self-benefit.

In India’s increasingly competitive and divisive multi-party politics, there are many who do not agree with the ideology of the party that Advani belongs to, nor with his views and positions on many issues. Nevertheless, he commands respect across the political spectrum -- from the Congress party to the Communists, and from the Samajwadi Party to the Shiv Sena.

He is admired for his physical fitness and his mental agility, for his vast experience and dedication, but above all he is respected for his personal honesty, trustworthiness and integrity, ingredients that are becoming rare not only in politics and governance in general, but also in interpersonal relations within a political party.

Advani is Gandhian in another sense. He believes in the Mahatma’s maxim -- ‘In matters of conscience, the law of the majority has no place.’

He demonstrated it yet again when he stunned not only his own party, not only the political establishment but also the people of India with his extreme step of resigning from all the positions he held in the BJP on June 10.

He consulted none of his colleagues before taking this step, knowing fully well that a majority, if not all, of them would express their disapproval. What particularly startled others, and shocked his own party, was what he stated in the letter of resignation that he sent to Rajnath Singh, his party president.

A man with courage of conviction

Advani did not write a mere a one-line resignation letter. Rather, he said three things about the BJP, which no leader of the party had dared to say publicly in the past.

First, he said that he could not ‘reconcile either with the current functioning of the party or with the direction in which it is going’.

Second, he remarked that the BJP is no longer ‘the same idealistic party created by Dr (Syama Prasad) Mookerji, Pandit Deendayalji (Upadhyaya), Nanaji (Deshmukh) and (Atal Bihari) Vajpayeeji, whose sole concern was the country, and its people.’

Third, and most damningly, he censured many of the top and middle-level functionaries of the BJP by commenting that ‘most leaders of ours are now concerned just with their personal agendas.’

Even Vajpayee, who founded and built the BJP along with Advani, never criticised the party openly like this, even though it was well known within party circles and outside that he had serious differences with the BJP’s stance on certain issues and, particularly, with the interference of the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh in the affairs of the BJP. Therefore, in terms of the sheer directness and depth of criticism of one’s own party, and that too by someone who has been an architect of that party, the shock treatment that Advani administered to the BJP has simply no parallel in India’s modern political history.

The fact that he withdrew his resignation two days later does not take away the seriousness of his critical comments on his party, because he has not retracted from them. Rather, the BJP’s parliamentary board, its highest decision-making body, has assured that it will ‘properly address’ the concerns raised by him.

This, again, is unique in the history of the BJP.

Coming from any other person in the party, such severe and publicly voiced criticism of the party’s leadership would have meant an end to his or her association with the party. In Advani’s case, such is his strong moral standing within the BJP, that, formally at least, its parliamentary board has had to say that his concerns will be ‘properly addressed’.

Does Advani have a personal agenda?

Two questions arise here. Was Advani’s action dictated by the call of his conscience? Second, was his call of conscience guided by his own personal agenda?

A person’s conscience is his or her own inner voice that is never audible to others, and most often not fully audible even to the person concerned. Precisely for this reason, we cannot dismiss a stand taken by someone when that person claims it to be guided by the ‘inner voice’.

For example, we cannot scoff at Sonia Gandhi’s explanation for sacrificing the office of prime minister when her party had unanimously offered it to her in May 2004.

Advani has not claimed that his decision was in response to the call of his conscience. But it isn’t difficult to glean that he could not have taken such a momentous decision --especially one that he knew could potentially harm him in a debilitating way -- without it stemming from the depths of his agonising conversation with himself. After all, in preaching and practicing discipline and self-restraint in the internal functioning of the party, Advani has had few equals.

Precisely for this reason, he was both respected and feared by his party men, until his position was thoughtlessly weakened by the RSS in the wake of a manufactured controversy over his visit to Pakistan in 2005 and his comments on Mohammad Ali Jinnah, the founder of Pakistan.

Therefore, if such a scrupulous disciplinarian chose to take the extreme step of not just resigning from all the key party posts, but also severely chastising his party’s senior colleagues for both ‘the current functioning’ of the BJP and ‘the direction in which it is going’, it is reasonable to conclude that Advani’s conscience has spoken through his action.

But did Advani do what he did because he too was guided by a personal agenda? Specifically, was his action triggered by the fact that he had been ‘sulking’ -- a favorite word in a section of the Indian media in its description of his current state of mind -- because the party is not going to contest the next parliamentary elections by declaring him as its prime ministerial candidate?

The party did fight the 2009 general elections under his leadership, and faced a debacle, winning less seats than it had done in 2004. There is little doubt that Advani’s leadership, weakened from within by certain party leaders and the Sangh Parivar, contributed largely to the BJP’s defeat. On critical issues and at critical junctures, when he ought to have shown toughness and foresight, he chose to remain weak and indecisive. This proved to be costly since it undermined his own political attack, mounted in the course of his poll campaign, on Dr Manmohan Singh as the ‘weakest ever prime minister’.

Nobody has ever accepted Dr Singh to be a strong prime minister. His strength in office came, and continues to come, from a politically strong leader like Sonia Gandhi who believed in him.

In Advani’s case, he was indeed debilitated by the Sangh Parivar, which no longer believed in him and which, moreover, stoked the leadership ambitions of some in the so-called ‘second generation’ functionaries of the BJP.

Since the defeat of the BJP in the 2009 parliamentary elections, there is nothing in Advani’s conduct to suggest that he has indulged in scheming and manipulation to advance his personal agenda. Yes, he has not announced his retirement from active politics, much against the wishes of many people in the BJP and the Sangh Parivar. This is perhaps because he may genuinely believe, and rightly so, that he still has something vital to contribute to the nation and to the party that he has so painstakingly built.

BJP’s myopia

Five years later, a new ‘strong’ leader, Narendra Modi, has emerged in the BJP, whom many in the party and Sangh Parivar are over-eager to see as the party’s prime ministerial candidate.

However, there are some in the BJP and the RSS, and many outside these two organisations, who reckon that he is not suitable to become India’s prime minister.

The elements of Modi’s ‘strength’ are qualitatively different from those of Advani’s, something that is well known to people who know both of them closely. As the chief minister of Gujarat for the past 12 years, Modi certainly has many admirable achievements to his credit. But are these achievements enough to qualify him to become India’s prime minister? No.

There is no evidence of Modi being a collaborative team worker within his own state party unit and government; how then can he be expected to manage a coalition?

It is a sign of the utter shortsightedness of the BJP, a party that claims to be guided by Pandit Deendayal Upadhyaya’s ‘Integral Humanism’, a philosophical treatise of lofty ideals, and a party whose tallest leader, Vajpayee, once praised Advani as the ‘Deendayalji of our times’, that it has now begun to value Modi’s ‘strengths’ over Advani’s.

An autocrat is sought to be enthroned, and a perfect democrat is being marginalised and humiliated. A self-centered leader who has shown that he cares two hoots for the party organisation and longtime party colleagues in his own state has suddenly become all powerful in the BJP’s national scheme of things, whereas a selfless leader who toiled for many decades to build the party brick by brick is being cast aside as a useless relic.

And a foxy party president, who has his own astrologically-induced delusions of becoming India’s prime minister, has allowed himself to be prodded and dictated by vested interests to undermine Advani’s position in the BJP.

And all this is being done with scant regard for the fact that one of the greatest achievements of the Atal-Advani leadership was to make the BJP acceptable to a large number of non-Congress and non-Communist parties, and thereby building India’s first stable federal coalition in the form of the National Democratic Alliance.

How completely free of myopia, intrigue, mistrust, manipulation, factionalism and unscrupulous power games the BJP was in 1996, 1998 and 1999 when Advani, as the supreme commander of the party organisation, had been striving single-mindedly for the cause of making Vajpayee India’s prime minister!

This stark contrast highlights the decay that has begun in the BJP -- and which will most certainly accelerate if Advani is further humiliated and forced either to retire or to rebel.

Advani’s message serves a timely warning to the party against its own impending downfall. The way forward for the BJP, if it is to avoid being marginalised and even decimated in the forthcoming general elections, is to reinstate Advani as its guiding force, ably assisted by a team of nimble second-rung leaders.

Whether Advani becomes India’s prime minister is immaterial. His greatness as a person and also as a political leader who has rendered service of abiding value to the nation will not be determined by whether or not he moves to 7, Race Course Road, although it must be said that, amongst all the active political leaders in India today, he is most suited to head the next government.

Why? Because, in spite of his age factor -- which is more than compensated for by the factors of experience, wisdom and fitness -- and with all the serious shortcomings in his party’s non-inclusive ideology and politics, the strengths that Advani personifies are still the strengths that ageless India needs.

Sudheendra Kulkarni served as an aide to former Indian prime minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee in the Prime Minister’s Office between 1998 and 2004. He was also active in the BJP from 1996 to 2013, and worked closely with L K Advani. Kulkarni resigned from the BJP in January due to strong ideological differences over two issues -- the BJP’s neglect of Indian Muslims and the growing control of the RSS over the BJP. He welcomes comments at sudheenkulkarni@gmail.com.

Sudheendra Kulkarni

http://www.rediff.com/news/column/why-t ... 130617.htm

Priceless rant. Piss be upon him.

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 19 Jun 2013 21:27

ramana wrote:Indian style is not that way. It leads to permanent enemies.

The existing way leads to nepotism where nanha Gandhi or nanha Yadav comes to power. This is not desirable either. Maybe BJP should blaze a modern trail here.

prahaar · Post by **prahaar** » 19 Jun 2013 21:34

Vera_kji,
I am a strong NM supporter, but why do you expect to have only one narrative for economic policy? Let there be a competition of ideas. And even NM has stated in various speeches that a policy cannot be implemented without changes even in different parts of the same state, leave alone across Indian subcontinent.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Jun 2013 21:39

Here is the link which says Sudheendra Kulkarni worked with Teesta & Gang

A founder-member of Journalists Against Communalism, Kulkarni and his former friends, journalist Javed Anand and peace activist Teesta Setalvad, used to put up anti-RSS and pro-secularism posters in Mumbai. Kulkarni then worked for The Sunday Observer in Mumbai.

“I remember one Sunday when we carried 10,000 posters and pasted them in every compartment of the trains,” recalled Javed Anand. “Sudheen was very much a part of it.”

http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/pol ... 04190.html

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 19 Jun 2013 21:41

Sushupti ji that is vote share (adds to100%). But what they show in ticker is different number. Is this lying without paying attention?
rgds,
fanne

Ashok Sarraff · Post by **Ashok Sarraff** » 19 Jun 2013 21:42

Sushupti wrote:Is it correct?. Total seats way more than 40.

Sushupti ji,

What's the source? I searched Headlines Today website, but could not find the report.

They are talking about vote percentages, not seats.

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Jun 2013 21:44

Yogesh wrote:^^ Atri dev- Kshatriyas (OBCs), Harijans, Adivasis (Tribals) and Muslims ..

That is correct.

KHAM originally propelled and kept Congress in place in Gujarat. In 90's it was BJP which slowly pried apart the KHAM vote bank and now it is truly broken in Gujarat. This was the "experiment" (breaking apart of vote banks) which Congress blamed BJP for.

KHAM in Gujarat translates equivalently into other areas - for example replace Adivasis with Ahirs in say Gangetic belt. In AP it could be Kapus

.

* I take the credit of introducing that into BRF lingo., funny part is in Gujarat., nobody other than older Congress'is remember that. And one lady does - Sheela Bhatt.

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Jun 2013 21:51

fanne wrote:Ahir = Yadav Community. KHAM came about in Gujarat (Solanki etc were the architect). K (Khastriyas, mainly Rajputs, A FC block, that means Brahmis, Kayasthas and Baniyas got excluded), H = Harijan (All of SC castes in Guj, the tribal were at that time mostly loyal Con voters, but KHAM does not capture them), A= Ahir (All backward castes were overlooked for the grouping of a bigger OBS caste called Ahirs, in Bihar and UP they went to form govt on their own) and M = Muslims. Cong game plan was that with this group they had a loyal 40% population and they will rule forever. They had ignored Patels etc in this grouping and perhaps Gujjus were really farsighted, they consigned this strategy within a decade of its formation to dustbin.

A=Adivasi in Gujarat. The "ahirs" were themselves divided and part of them were not in Congress camp., particularly after emergency.

One thing you have to hand it to Gujjus., they immediately recognized that they are being played over caste groupings and fighting intra caste was actually becoming a problem for their aspirations. Congress is still searching for KHAM equivalent in Guj. but it has lost the plot. The game has truly been taken away and there is no more of a caste grouping in Guj.

Now who is truly communal?

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Jun 2013 21:53

Ashok Sarraff wrote:
Sushupti wrote:Is it correct?. Total seats way more than 40.

Sushupti ji,

What's the source? I searched Headlines Today website, but could not find the report.

They are talking about vote percentages, not seats.

It was live screen shot from today's broadcast.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 19 Jun 2013 22:13

He can't. He knows what people of Bihar will then do. 23 minutes ago more »
@Sootradhar : Bihar MT @rahulkanwal: C-Voter Assembly Elections Seat Projections: JDU 73 (-42) BJP 52 (-39) RJD 96 (+74) LJP 12 (+9) Cong 4 Others 6 (-2) 23 minutes ago more »
@kishanreddybjp : Nitish Kumar owes his political career to Sri George Fernandes. But, this ungrateful man insulted and humiliated him. 27 minutes ago more »
@rahulkanwal : C-Voter-@HeadlinesToday Opinion Poll for Bihar. Lok Sabha seat projections. JDU 7 (-13) BJP 16 (+4) RJD 11 (+7) LJP 2 (+2) Cong 2 Others 2

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 19 Jun 2013 23:01

fanne wrote:He can't. He knows what people of Bihar will then do. 23 minutes ago more »
@Sootradhar : Bihar MT @rahulkanwal: C-Voter Assembly Elections Seat Projections: JDU 73 (-42) BJP 52 (-39) RJD 96 (+74) LJP 12 (+9) Cong 4 Others 6 (-2) 23 minutes ago more »
@kishanreddybjp : Nitish Kumar owes his political career to Sri George Fernandes. But, this ungrateful man insulted and humiliated him. 27 minutes ago more »
@rahulkanwal : C-Voter-@HeadlinesToday Opinion Poll for Bihar. Lok Sabha seat projections. JDU 7 (-13) BJP 16 (+4) RJD 11 (+7) LJP 2 (+2) Cong 2 Others 2

Is this if everyone contests alone? GVL's survey for the situation where everyone contests alone is somewhat different I must say.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 19 Jun 2013 23:11

we have to wait for detail