Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

anmol
BRFite
Posts: 1722
Joined: 05 May 2009 17:39

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby anmol » 26 Mar 2013 10:10

^ Good, this may stop it from becoming CBI.

disha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 7251
Joined: 03 Dec 2006 04:17
Location: gaganaviharin

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby disha » 26 Mar 2013 10:26

^^ I read it as good [s]differently[/s] and coming from TOILET one has to be careful of a hit job. Anyway, just basing this on the report from TOILET:

Section 3(1) of the proposed bill says that the governor shall on the recommendations of a selection committee, appoint the Lokayukta. That means his or her discretionary power of appointing the Lokayukta is ceased. All the powers are now vested with a selection committee comprising the chief minister as chairperson, the assembly speaker, a minister appointed by the chief minister, the leader of opposition or any opposition member directed by the speaker, one judge of the high court and the vigilance commissioner.


This is good. There should not be any discretionary power vested with Governor. In fact, the very chair of Governor is anathema to democracy., one can constitute "constitutional courts for the state" to arbitrate any constitutional crisis in the state. CM is the elected representative and there is provenance for inputs from Opposition, Judiciary and the CVC.

The committee will have a search committee with the chief justice as one of its members to recommend a panel of suitable persons twice the number of vacancies.


Excellent. So people are not chosen randomly, particularly not for their bootlicking capacity.

The bill discourages whistleblowers as they will have to file an affidavit and documents supporting the allegations along with Rs 2,000. Moreover, if the complaint is adjudged to be false, the complainant will be liable to pay a fine of Rs 25,000 and serve a sentence of up to six months.


What about frivoulous lawsuits? Rs. 2000/- and an affadavit with supporting documents is actually bare minimum. This will stop from media doing hit jobs. Tehelka kind of drama bazi (or even Dhoti kind of drama baazi like 1000s of wombs were cut open) will stop.

The government has brought all the local bodies under the Aayog.


Another good move. This will keep things like the Ahmedabad municipal corporation (for eg.) on its toes.

While increasing the burden on the Lokayukta, it plans to appoint four deputy Lokayuktas, two of whom will be non-judicial administrative members.


What is wrong with that? 4+1, cannot they get the ball rolling?

The bill says that to inquire against any public authority, the Lokayukta Aayog has to take prior permission of the very same authority. The government has retained the power to restrict the Aayog from investigating any case by handing it to any inquiry commission. The bill also says that the Lokayukta alone will not decide on any case, but there will be benches of deputy Lokayuktas involved.


Separation of duties. Ensuring there is no parallel and conflicting investigations usually at cross-purposes. For example, the Godhra train burning had multiple inquiries some with the sole aim of tiring and weeding out witnesses.

The government has retained the controversial provision of the Aayog submitting its report to the chief minister and the council of ministers with the latter deciding upon its acceptance.


Note the lok-ayukta is a semi-independent body. The CM is the one where the buck stops.

Anyone bringing the Aayog or its members into disrepute may be imprisoned for six months and fined.


Again Dotty and Beesta types do not go off spouting non-sense. They brought the entire judiciary and police of the state of Gujarat in dis-repute? For what? For a few dollars more!

The government has also reserved the right to exclude any complaint against certain classes of public functionaries recommended by the Aayog.


Very important. I am glad this is done. Some public functionaries has to be protected while discharging their duties, and this is not taken in vaccuum but from the Lok Aayog.

All in all, a better act. In this, "agar Kamla beniwal ko mirchi lagi toh nenu emi chestava".

disha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 7251
Joined: 03 Dec 2006 04:17
Location: gaganaviharin

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby disha » 26 Mar 2013 10:34

This is a more balanced article from NitiCentral. It does address two points which the opposition are using against Gujarat Govt.

Posting here in full in the hope that it is read. https://www.niticentral.com/2013/03/23/gujarat%E2%80%99s-new-lokayukta-bill-will-set-standards-58604.html

Yesterday, the Gujarat Government expressed its intention to introduce a new Lokayukta Aayog Bill 2013 on March 26 that would replace the existing law. This move has invited criticism from Opposition parties in Gujarat and the commentariat.

The criticism is primarily two-fold:

» It seeks to make the Lokayukta Aayog into a multi-member institution with one Lokayukta and up to four Up-Lokayuktas, thus possibly diluting the reach of Justice RA Mehta.

» This law explicitly excludes the Governor from the selection and appointment of the Lokayukta and Up-Lokayuktas, thus ensuring that the Governor has no say at all.

It is useful to address these criticisms in turn.

The need to make the body multi-membered

The recommendations of the 13th Finance Commission mandate the creation of the institution of an Ombudsman that covers representatives of local body institutions. Closely tied to this recommendation is performance grant of approximately Rs 300 crore per annum.

In case these representatives of local body institutions fall under the jurisdiction of the State Lokayukta, the State Government must determine whether to continue these arrangements or create a separate institution of an Ombudsman.

It is useful to go back two years to understand why this body is being made multi-membered. In 2011, when Gujarat Assembly passed the Gujarat Lokayukta (Amendment) Bill which sought to cover Mayors, Deputy Mayors, senior-level functionaries of Municipalities and Sarpanchs of Panchayats within its ambit, the Governor sent it back.

The reason was that the Governor felt that one Lokayukta, “howsoever competent and efficient he might be,” will not be able to look into complaints against “such a large number of functionaries”.

Further, the Governor also added that the Bill “does not specify that, if required, more number of Lokayuktas could be appointed”. According to the Governor, this was a “serious limitation of the proposed Bill”.

In order to address this serious and legitimate concern of the Governor, the Government of Gujarat has made the Lokayukta Aayog a multi-membered body bringing within its jurisdiction local body officials as well. Given the recommendations of the 13th Finance Commission, the Government only had two choices – either create the institution of an Ombudsman or make the Lokayukta multi-membered.

Those criticising the Bill on this ground have completely overlooked this fact.

Exclusion of the Governor from the selection process

There has been a gross misunderstanding, deliberate or otherwise, of the SC Judgement on the Gujarat Lokayukta matter. It has been widely believed that by upholding Justice RA Mehta’s appointment as the Gujarat Lokayukta, the SC has handed over a victory to the Governor.

The truth is far from it.

The Governor has, in fact, been strongly criticised by the SC for “misjudging her role” and for her attitude which was “not in conformity or in consonance with the democratic set up of government envisaged in our Constitution”. [Paras 70 and 74]

Why did SC observe this? The reason is that under our Constitutional scheme, except for certain clearly specified powers, the Governor cannot act otherwise than in accordance with the aid and advice of the Council of Ministers.

Gujarat Governor Kamla Beniwal, in assuming that she could act without the aid and advice of Council of Ministers, rode roughshod over the process, unilaterally handing over the appointment letter to Justice RA Mehta. This, according to the SC, was “an outcome of improper legal advice” and was “unwarranted and logically insupportable”. [Para 42]

If SC held the Governor’s actions as improper, why did it still uphold Justice RA Mehta’s appointment? The Court’s rationale is not entirely convincing. According to the SC, the mere fact that the Chief Justice of the Gujarat High Court considered Justice RA Mehta as otherwise eligible for the post, his opinion had ‘primacy’ despite (a) the objections of the Council of Ministers; and (b) Governor’s unconstitutional actions.

This is the bone of contention which has prompted the Gujarat Government to file a curative petition in SC. What has added to the confusion is the fact that the same SC, in another judgement in the Karnataka Up-Lokayukta case, gave primacy to the advice of the Chief Minister and not the Chief Justice!

What happens to Gujarat’s curative petition remains to be seen. Nonetheless, it is crucial to understand that SC has upheld Justice Mehta’s appointment not because of the Governor’s actions, but because the Chief Justice’s opinion had primacy. Even under the existing Lokayukta law as interpreted by the SC, the Governor’s role is practically limited to acting on the aid and advice of the Council of Ministers.

Arguments and debates on who should or should not form a part of the selection committee must bear in mind that whether or not the Governor is a part of the selection process under the new law hardly makes a difference.

In fact, it is preferable if Governors, whose appointment and actions seem motivated more by considerations which are political than constitutional, are expressly excluded from the process. While Governors are envisaged to keep a healthy “checks and balances” system, their use as political pawns often goes unchecked and unbalanced

Rudradev
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3512
Joined: 06 Apr 2003 12:31

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Rudradev » 26 Mar 2013 11:51

Gagan wrote:BJP has to keep things clear, no vaanar sena type antics.
Their wimmen CMs were more busy singing songs and organizing big havans than in actual governance.


Care to substantiate this statement?

AFAIK the only woman CM the BJP has had is Vasundhara Raje, who provided more "actual governance" in Rajasthan than any filthy Die Nasty whelp to rule the state before or since.

http://m.timesofindia.com/Jaipur/Vasund ... 826221.cms



Jaipur: If development was the key issue in bringing back Sheila Dikshit to the helm of affairs in Delhi for the third consecutive term, development apparently was not a criteria in the voters' mind in Rajasthan. There is little doubt that the kind of development the state witnessed in the past five years of Vasundhara Raje's regime deserves to be applauded. And this is something that even the opposition now in power can't deny. 

And just to quote one instance , Rajasthan certainly has moved up significantly to be the third best state in the country after Hyderabad and Bangalore , according to a report by the World Bank on 'Doing Business in South Asia, 2007'. A hindsight at the state from a macro-level will reveal a Rajasthan emerging from a rather dismal power situation to becoming self sufficient in electricity with Rs 8,000 crore feeder renovation programme, revamping transmission and distribution systems to ensure quality power supply.

The state was revenue surplus for the first time since 1991-92 when the revenue deficit was over 30% o revenue receipts. Then just last year a total provision of Rs 50 crore was set aside for restoration work of canals (Rs 30 crore for IGNP and Rs 20 crore for CAD, Chambal) which was no mean achievement .

Talk of infrastructure. Roads, the arteries of growth, were given high priority not only as a means of propelling growth but also opening up the hinterland to new opportunities with over Rs 7,000 crore invested in road development in the last four years. Then considering the lifeline of Rajasthan a new Tourism Unit Policy was formulated two years back to provide impetus to the sector for investments in 20,000 additional hotel rooms. There were concessions in land conversion and development charges and hike in FAR from 1.75 to 2.00 in all existing properties . And today who can say Rajasthan lacks in IT & manpower , a burgeoning sector across the country.

. At the micro-level , take for example youth, women and children. Within three years of Azim Premji commenting in 2004 about Rajasthan not having sufficient numbers of skilled people who were fluent in English, today, GENPACT has its third largest BPO in Jaipur. Infosys, Wipro and Tech Mahindra followed on a quick trot. Under the 'Rajasthan Education Initiative' , government, industry leaders like CISCO, IBM, NIIT, Microsoft , Wipro and bodies like World Economic Forum and Global E-Schools and Community Initiative (GeSCI) joined hands to give education sector the extra fillip so that the real potential of the future generation could be realized. Women and children needless to say were always a high priority for Vasundhara. Midday meals, Janani Kalewa Scheme for 21,000 pregnant and nursing mothers being served hot meals, Palanhar Yojna, insurance for aanganwadi workers, scooty, cycles and transport vouchers for girl students, computerisation of madarsas to being the best state in NREGS implementation are a few of the previous government's achievements. 

Sanku
BRF Oldie
Posts: 12526
Joined: 23 Aug 2007 15:57
Location: Naaahhhh

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sanku » 26 Mar 2013 12:11

Rudradev wrote:
Gagan wrote:BJP has to keep things clear, no vaanar sena type antics.
Their wimmen CMs were more busy singing songs and organizing big havans than in actual governance.


Care to substantiate this statement?

AFAIK the only woman CM the BJP has had is Vasundhara Raje, who provided more "actual governance" in Rajasthan than any filthy Die Nasty whelp to rule the state before or since.

http://m.timesofindia.com/Jaipur/Vasund ... 826221.cms


Ok RD ji beat me to the punch. I was about to post the same. BJP has had three women Chief ministers. Sushma Swaraj, Uma Bharati and VRS.

Of the three BJP actually removed Uma Bharati for lack of governance (ever happened in a Die Nasty state?) in a short time desrmpite her charisma.

Susmha Swaraj was CM of Delhi for 9 months. Everyone remembers her CM term in +ve term.

VRS was the only CM to do a full term and even her worst enemies wont call her ineffectual -- imperious and head strong -- yes. Go getter yes. Ineffectual? :rotfl:

So Gagan-ji, I am sure you did not mean it that way, but the statement did come across and ill informed and somewhat sexist I am afraid.


Sushupti
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5198
Joined: 22 Dec 2010 21:24

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sushupti » 27 Mar 2013 07:12

UPA looks to Nitish Kumar as insurance against unpredictable allies

JD(U)'s political calculations are not as complicated as they might appear. The party is ready to end its alliance with BJP whenever Gujarat chief minister Narendra Modi's projection as PM becomes a flashpoint.

The view in both parties is that differences over Modi are bound to boil over soon and Kumar seems to be increasingly ready for that moment. The JD(U) leader believes he has forged a formidable political coalition in Bihar that will be unstoppable in a three-way contest between him, BJP and a Congress-RJD-LJP bloc.

The chief minister's confidence seems to lie in the success of his strategy to woo the most backward castes and the mahadalits. Support of non-Yadav OBC castes along with a section of the Muslim vote puts him ahead of all rivals.

Kumar hopes to be in a near unassailable position without upper caste support but party leaders feel he is hardly a "hate figure" for this voluble section of voters as Lalu was. He might, they say, get a slice of upper caste votes too for his record in improving law and order and postings of upper castes in key district and state posts.

Keeping in mind that the upper castes and Muslims are more or less accounted for, Kumar can hope to contest on his own in the next national election and wait to see who he could ally with at the Centre thereafter.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... ium=tweets

Pranav
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5280
Joined: 06 Apr 2009 13:23

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Pranav » 27 Mar 2013 07:18

Re Guj Lok Ayukta bill -

disha wrote:Note the lok-ayukta is a semi-independent body. The CM is the one where the buck stops.


Not even semi-independent. Is this the kind of Lok Ayukta suitable for Congress or Mulayam governments, say.

Sushupti
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5198
Joined: 22 Dec 2010 21:24

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sushupti » 27 Mar 2013 09:07

@sisir_gupta: Special status for Bihar is being pushed by Cong ldrs who want Nitish to join UPA 3 & BJP ldrs opposed to rise of Modi & want JDU to leave.

vijayk
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4266
Joined: 22 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby vijayk » 27 Mar 2013 17:06

http://www.rediff.com/news/slide-show/s ... 0327.htm#4

Why is Manish Tiwari after national editors?

All this, and more, in this week's Dilli Gupshup...

He's apparently the biggest threat in Indian politics today.

Congress leaders are walking around with furrowed brows, wondering how they will combat his popularity.

Bharatiya Janata Party leaders too are losing sleep over the rising clamour for Narendra Modi.

If one goes by the mood in election-bound Karnataka, Modi clearly seems ahead of his party.

The BJP unit in Karnataka, including Chief Minister Jagdish Shettar, wants Modi to campaign extensively in the state to shore up the ruling party's poll prospects.

In the 2008 assembly poll, Modi had campaigned in a few constituencies, but the BJP did not fare too well there.

Now, state BJP leaders believe Modi's image as 'Mr Development' and the 'Hindu Hridya Samrat' will tilt the scales in their favour on May 5 when Karnataka goes to the polls.

Modi's office in Gandhinagar is flooded with requests from almost every assembly constituency in Karnataka.

RamaY
BRF Oldie
Posts: 17249
Joined: 10 Aug 2006 21:11
Location: http://bharata-bhuti.blogspot.com/

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RamaY » 27 Mar 2013 19:56

POLITICS, NEAR & FAR
India has slipped internationally because of a weak prime minister and government.
By N.V. Subramanian (27 March 2013)

New Delhi: International politics is connected to domestic politics in ways that are, in the Indian context, at any rate, either not accepted or understood. In the presidential system, the popular vote unifies international and domestic policy decisions in one person, over and above the checks and balances and advices provided by the elected legislature, the cabinet and the bureaucracy. In a totalitarian system or one of limited democracy like Russia’s, political and establishment forces inevitably propel a strong leader into a supreme position, such as with Vladimir Putin earlier, and with Xi Jinping in China now. A strong leader makes for a strong nation, and it is pointless disputing this logic.

In a Westminster system such as India’s, the problem comes when the national parties suffer erosion in strength and countrywide presence, and become dependent on other groupings and forces, regional, linguistic, chauvinistic, regressive, and so forth. The problem has been compounded by the Congress which has turned its back on strong leaders like Jawaharlal Nehru, Indira Gandhi and P.V.Narasimha Rao who crafted their own foreign policy to prefer weak, nominated prime ministers today. This is a function of the fear and insecurity of the current Nehru-Gandhis, which compelled Sonia Gandhi to choose the lacklustre and powerless Manmohan Singh as prime minister. Her son and heir, Rahul Gandhi, will apparently prefer P.Chidambaram for PM if the country should have the misfortune to vote the United Progressive Alliance to power again. In style, Chidambaram may be different from Manmohan Singh, but he would be a substantial non-performer like the present prime minister.

The Bharatiya Janata Party, on the other hand, has Narendra Modi who will make for a strong prime minister. Under Modi, India is bound to have a strong and independent foreign policy, because it would flow from the nature of his distinct individuality. Modi faces powerful opposition within his own party, in the National Democratic Alliance, and generally among the political class. Which is why he seeks to address the people, the electorate, above the heads of power-brokers. What Modi is trying to do in the process, although he may be unaware of it, is that he is unifying the country on some higher principles and interests, values that cut across regions, castes and communities, linguistic chauvinism, politics of victimhood, and so on. The links to all this and domestic politics is clear.

What is less obvious but discernible if you look for it is that this unification is necessary for India to pursue a strong foreign policy and be perceived as a strong nation. When a system does not incarnate supreme power in one person, the people have to come together to strengthen the hands of an indirectly elected head of government. This process of unification does not happen on its own. It has to be spurred. And the only potential prime minister candidate who is doing it today is Narendra Modi, whilst his rivals are engaged in competitive divisiveness. Nitish Kumar is begging for Bihar to be granted special status. The Congress is using Nitish’s weakness to prise him away from the National Democratic Alliance. In other different ways, the Congress is splitting other parties and dynastic groupings. This politics of divide and rule of the Congress has naturally and inevitably divided the country, and given it a weak and effete prime minister. How on earth can India compete with the likes of China or the other great powers lead by single-minded individuals?

In other words, the links between international and domestic politics cannot be discounted or minimized. If the prime minister was a self-sustaining national leader, the Tamils’, Teesta and Sir Creek issues would not have acquired their present state-specific salience. A prime minister cannot conduct foreign policy in isolation of domestic politics and local sensitivities. In the end, everything is politics. The wretched Indian establishment does not understand this simple but all-too-critical point. The Ministry of External Affairs and its scented babus believe international politics to lie in another sphere, in a terrain entirely divorced from domestic politics. Reality is the opposite. Domestic politics dictates foreign policy. The Chinese have always conducted international politics on that philosophy. It stems from their belief that they are the centre of the universe, citizens of the Middle Kingdom. Learning from the Chinese example, India must return to the roots of its greatness and build upon it. The separation of international from domestic politics must end.

disha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 7251
Joined: 03 Dec 2006 04:17
Location: gaganaviharin

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby disha » 27 Mar 2013 21:26

Pranav wrote:Not even semi-independent. Is this the kind of Lok Ayukta suitable for Congress or Mulayam governments, say.


Pranavji, by "not even semi-independent"., I take it you mean "totally dependendant". If that is the case, I am just surprised by your arrogance. Did you even read the complete lok ayukta bill? Do you even know why certain provisions are made the way it is made? If you are basing your opinion on a single news report from ELM, then it is not just arrogance, but ignorance and stupidity as well (sorry for laying out hard facts, if it hurts, please do not shoot the messenger).

On the other hand, if you did go through the lok ayukta bill and have a definite opinion that it is "not even semi-independent", then I would like to hear more from you on this topic. Feel free to point me to the links on lok ayukta and please do give us time to read, parse, understand the bill in its entirety. I am sure the babus we love to hate and the netas we love to deride have some intellect to come up with a bill that will take at least a weekend to read, understand and parse.

If you are saying that by "not even semi-independent" it is actually "independent"., then I think that is better and I take back the first para with due apologies.

Regarding the question (rhetorical I may say) that "is this the kind of lok ayuktas suitable for CONGraze or mullah-I-am govt."., then that is a moot point. Let those governments bring in the lok ayukta bills or make the appointees and then we can discuss from there. Foisting a bill crafted on Gujarat onto UP or Delhi or Maharashtra is not a good idea, those states need to look at their local conditions and act accordingly. Of course if they do not want to act, they can verbatim translate from Gujarati to Hindi or Marathi and implement it. It is their choice and their problem. Gujarat can only show the way.

ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 54023
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ramana » 27 Mar 2013 22:00

Sushupti wrote:@sisir_gupta: Special status for Bihar is being pushed by Cong ldrs who want Nitish to join UPA 3 & BJP ldrs opposed to rise of Modi & want JDU to leave.



Its really about retaining power. The special status for Bihar is an excuse for Nitish to oppose the NDA for he fears the erosion to loss of power if BJP rises.

Anyway nothing stops BJP form offering a bigger package to Bihar which has suffered under-development since the Slave dynasty Sultanate days.

Bihar is Vihara the garden state reduced to a lawless backwaters of India.

Misra
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 100
Joined: 19 Nov 2009 09:03

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Misra » 27 Mar 2013 22:26

NaMo effect ;)

- Wharton splits from UPenn

and

- Gutmann slips, too:

The DP, which obtained Gutmann’s expense reports from 2012, found that she spent over $500,000 at 258 visits to Body Restoration Day Spa in Rittenhouse Square.


edited: yes, seems to be a joke issue
Last edited by Misra on 27 Mar 2013 23:38, edited 1 time in total.

ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 54023
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby ramana » 27 Mar 2013 22:31

Thats a dhamaka without any visit!!!

Its the association with UPenn that allowed Wharton its claim to fame.

Arjun
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4283
Joined: 21 Oct 2008 01:52

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Arjun » 27 Mar 2013 23:11

^^Seem to be early April Fool jokes ?

Virupaksha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 3110
Joined: 28 Jun 2007 06:36

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Virupaksha » 27 Mar 2013 23:17

http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/uni ... versy.html

it seems to be the univ's annual joke issue.

Pranav
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5280
Joined: 06 Apr 2009 13:23

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Pranav » 27 Mar 2013 23:18

disha wrote:
Pranav wrote:Not even semi-independent. Is this the kind of Lok Ayukta suitable for Congress or Mulayam governments, say.


Pranavji, by "not even semi-independent"., I take it you mean "totally dependendant". If that is the case, I am just surprised by your arrogance. Did you even read the complete lok ayukta bill? Do you even know why certain provisions are made the way it is made? If you are basing your opinion on a single news report from ELM, then it is not just arrogance, but ignorance and stupidity as well (sorry for laying out hard facts, if it hurts, please do not shoot the messenger).


hmm? Yes, it is quite dependent. I read your explanations, which imho are not convincing. We never take offense at personal comments, but posts devoid of non-trivial inputs on the issue being discussed tend to get less attention.

disha
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 7251
Joined: 03 Dec 2006 04:17
Location: gaganaviharin

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby disha » 28 Mar 2013 02:58

Pranav wrote:hmm? Yes, it is quite dependent....


Define "quite dependent". Is it quasi-dependent or quasi-independent? Or is it quasi-autonomous or fully autonomous? Is it all four or any 2 of the above or none of it? If it is neither quasi-independent and semi-independent, and wholly dependent - then please prove it. It does not help to make wild accusations like Aiyar who loves Nazis or wink-wink-nudge-nudge enunciations that indicate wholly malefide intentions.

Again assuming that you have read the bill in complete entirety can you please provide me a link to the Guj Lok Ayukta Bill so I can read it up as well? I am sure there are nuances I am missing all-together which you have caught and declared that it is "not even semi-independent or quite dependent".

And if you disagree with my points and not find it convincing you can bring forth your arguments instead of sweeping statements ala Moony Shankar Aiyar. BTW, did you read the niticentral article - does not matter who the writer is or where the message is coming from, you should read it.

A question for you, Pranavji. Why does riots happen? I am hoping for a nuanced answer.

Muppalla
BRF Oldie
Posts: 7084
Joined: 12 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Muppalla » 28 Mar 2013 07:10

There is no need for Lok Ayukta and the shit is only useful to keep a lot of folks on government payroll with taxpayer money.

Pratyush
BRF Oldie
Posts: 8152
Joined: 05 Mar 2010 15:13

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Pratyush » 28 Mar 2013 16:12

A humurous bit of == between the two baba logs.

Baby Bilawal vs Rahul Baba: A 3-0 whitewash

vijayk
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4266
Joined: 22 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby vijayk » 28 Mar 2013 17:04

http://www.rediff.com/news/report/modi- ... 130328.htm

A delegation comprising United States parliamentarians and businessmen called on Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi [ Images ] and imvited him to the US. He has been denied visa by that country after the 2002 riots.

An 18-member delegation, led by Republican Congressmen from Illinois Aaron Schock, arrived in Gandhingar on Thursday at the official residence of Modi around noon, following their visit to Sabarmati Gandhi Ashram in Ahmedabad [ Images ] and held over an hour-long closed-door meeting with him and high ranking state officials.


While welcoming the US delegation, Modi spoke about the fast and inclusive, environment-friendly process of development in Gujarat, an official statement issued said. "With hard work, we have been able to create an impact in the country," Modi said.

During the interaction, Schock pointed out that the people in the US were keen to work with Gujarat and that they were impressed by the way the state has facilitated investment. As per the official press release, Schock stated that there was enormous potential to work together with Gujarat.

It may be recalled that following Modi's fourth consecutive victory in the 2012 assembly elections Schock had made a statement, congratulating Modi, on the floor of the US House of Representatives.


Modi has been denied visa by the US following the 2002 riots. However, whether the visa issue was discussed during Thursday's meeting, was not known.

The delegation is visiting India [ Images ] to promote 'People to People Contacts and Diplomacy' along with the Overseas Friends of BJP’s 'Global Community Overreach Programme'. This is a joint initiative by US-based National

Indian- American Public Policy Institute and India based Delhi [ Images ] Study Group.

Business sector representatives in the delegation has been led by Illinois-based Punjabi NRI businessman and Overseas Friends of BJP member Shalabh Kumar. Other US Parliamentarians in the delegation included Cynthia Lummis (Republican Congresswoman from Wyoming) and Cathy M Rodgers (Republican Congresswoman from Washington state).

In his address to the delegation, Modi urged the need for humanitarian forces coming together and fight terrorism along with other challenges of poverty and unemployment.


This will cause unbearable pain to a lot of ISI-sponsored terrorist NRI Indian activists and PAID media scums

Arunkumar
BRFite
Posts: 643
Joined: 05 Apr 2008 17:29

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Arunkumar » 28 Mar 2013 17:11

Isnt US's westinghouse nuclear reactors to be Gujurat based. Probably they are worried about that aspect too.

krisna
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5829
Joined: 22 Dec 2008 06:36

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby krisna » 28 Mar 2013 19:24

arvin wrote:Isnt US's westinghouse nuclear reactors to be Gujurat based. Probably they are worried about that aspect too.


If true , Quick question -- likely done to humiliate NaMo.
Congis would have planned to have the usa based company n Gujarat knowing his visa issues and other potentially conflicting aspects with his detractors strongest in usa of all countries.
It could potentially cause some friction earning some points to congis. It's writers would have field day in press to further castigate NaMo.

They would not give Gujarat to non usa based companies for obvious reasons.

Hope NaMo turns this lemon into lemonade.

fanne
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3270
Joined: 11 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby fanne » 28 Mar 2013 19:43

Regarding Lok Ayukta I will tell a story. If I say this story I heard from NM himself, people may then not listen to the story, so it is new and real and by me

Once so happened, that there was a Jungle (like India). It had many problems, and it had lions, man eaters (as we have corruption now). The man eater had terrified people, it had killed few but the biggest impact was on the way of life, people were just sitting at home, productivity of society was less, everything was going down. The govt was happy, with people terrified it had nothing to fear, in fact it did turn loose some more man eating lions (more corruption). Handful of people decided to take on the man eating lion. They procured desi local gun (Baba Ramdev) and and wanted to kill the lions. The govt got the inkling of it, they did not like it. These guys with local gun (the gun was desi, very unsophisticated), were making people forget their fear (very less in number but was a start) and combat the man eating lions. This was not good for the government, it feared that once people forgot fear it would be in trouble, who knows where these fearless people will stop. So it decided to institute a act (it was called Lok Auykta), whereby it will distribute license to kill the man eating Lion. That news was wildly publicized. Few people (Arvind K) in fact thought this was the best way kill the lion, and also a chance to maybe be the government. It was told that an unlicensed desi gun in hand of few people was a bad idea, it may be even communal. So the act was passed and the license to kill man eater were granted. That group even got elected and the desi gun carrying group was in fact swept away (some say actually the lion killed it, some say they did not get enough vote, other say they are still there hiding and waiting there turn).
Fast forward to present time. The man eater lions still shows up here and there. People are terrified. Some get killed (in fact few of them tried showing the gun license to the lion, some in fact pulled the 230 pages Lok Ayuka, but that did not impress the lion, it ate these people anyways), rest of the population who are alive thank the license for saving them. Some in fact put it in front of their house or on the alter, believing that that scares away the lion or kills them. The general impression is that the license works. Though an independent group (CAG) made a startling announcement, they say that the number of Man eaters have grown. In fact it did trace its foot print to AK house, but the foot print of the lion disappeared at the garage where a Ford Pickup was parked. On the gate of course the Lok Ayukta book was hanging. When pointed out AK said, see the power of Lok Ayukta, the man eater came so close but could not enter the house. The original Man eaters have grown very fat, however they have to share the territory with the new Man eaters. A small bunch of group still argues that it is gun that kills lions not the license, but people call them communal and blood thirsty. They in fact point out the statistics that more people now believe that man eaters are dead because of license. In that group there is all kinds of conspiracy theory, some say one of the leader of the group is friends with the man eaters, in fact he gets his share of man meat, so he is stopping the other people with gun to go and confront the man eaters. Some others say, that maybe the government is right, if so many people think that the license is killing the Lion it must be true, maybe gun never kills. In AK group, few of the guys who were vegetarian, are now served some red colored soft delicacy, they seam to be enjoying it. Some say that they are man eaters themselves, but that group not only strongly believe that it is wrong, it is also strongly protesting it (But never the less they continue to enjoy that red thing, now affectionately called vegetarian human).
rgds,
fanne

RamaY
BRF Oldie
Posts: 17249
Joined: 10 Aug 2006 21:11
Location: http://bharata-bhuti.blogspot.com/

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby RamaY » 28 Mar 2013 19:57

Sorry to bring MB analogy again.

There are two schools in BJP.

1/ One that thinks NM should be a Krishna and let a Delhi/UP based Arjuna/Dharmaraja be the ruler of Bharat in their image.

2/ Another thinks NM should be a Krahna+Arjuna+Dharmaraja himself and rule Bharat in his image.

We have seen the first model attempted in Bharat twice, both times with dire results.

When closely advised and lead (often in the front) the Arjuna+Dharmaraja were able to do a Rajasuya, MB War, and Aswametha successfully. But when left to their own, the Arjuna+Dharmaraja faltered leading to Jyuda Krida + Vanavasa. When Krishna was next to them, they made a friend out of Takshaka where as on their own (Janamejaya) made a civilizational enemy out of the same Takshaka.

Similarly when under close control and leadership of Chanakya, Chandragupta Maurya became the king of Bharat. But when left to his own it ended up in Ashoka.

Bharat in current time needs a Karma-Yogi or Raja-Rishi. Perhaps it is time to try the 2nd model.

vijayk
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4266
Joined: 22 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby vijayk » 28 Mar 2013 21:08

Pratyush wrote:A humurous bit of == between the two baba logs.

Baby Bilawal vs Rahul Baba: A 3-0 whitewash


This is the not humorous.

The CON PAID woman who always writes farticles on DIEnasty greatness and looniness of Internet Hindu is saying Paki DIEnassty is far worse and Indian DIEnassty is so much better.

Hari Seldon
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9231
Joined: 27 Jul 2009 12:47
Location: University of Trantor

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Hari Seldon » 28 Mar 2013 21:36

Wow, who could have thought this would happen one day...?

Cong downplays US Congressional delegation’s meed with Narendra Modi

Jus' kiddin' only.... Yawn.


Arjun
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4283
Joined: 21 Oct 2008 01:52

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Arjun » 29 Mar 2013 08:52

Must see video on the persons responsible for the Wharton fiasco and the anti-Modi campaign in the US:


SaiK
BRF Oldie
Posts: 36402
Joined: 29 Oct 2003 12:31
Location: NowHere

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby SaiK » 29 Mar 2013 09:39

see.. kangrez at least has a party behind a family .. well a family behind a party. what does modi have?

Sushupti
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5198
Joined: 22 Dec 2010 21:24

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sushupti » 29 Mar 2013 09:43

Bihar CM Nitish Kumar all set to walk out of NDA


http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/biha ... 59723.html

Hari Seldon
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9231
Joined: 27 Jul 2009 12:47
Location: University of Trantor

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Hari Seldon » 29 Mar 2013 09:56

Sushupti wrote:Bihar CM Nitish Kumar all set to walk out of NDA

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/biha ... 59723.html


Fully yawnable. What will happen will happen. DOubt Nitish is that dumb as is projected in the farticle. And if he is, good riddance, really.


Arunkumar
BRFite
Posts: 643
Joined: 05 Apr 2008 17:29

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Arunkumar » 29 Mar 2013 10:16

SaiK wrote:see.. kangrez at least has a party behind a family .. well a family behind a party. what does modi have?


modi ke paas MA he....(Mass Adulation)

hehe its MA vs MAino


member_22539
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2022
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby member_22539 » 29 Mar 2013 16:02

^^Narendra Modi's dismal record on swine (pseudo seculars) is no Gujarat model.

Ya, he should have shot them on sight.

rajeshkathiriya
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 33
Joined: 27 Dec 2010 15:58

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby rajeshkathiriya » 29 Mar 2013 21:14

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/devel ... l/1094889/

Development work in Narendra Modi's Gujarat done with central funds: Kapil Sibal

Sushupti
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5198
Joined: 22 Dec 2010 21:24

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby Sushupti » 29 Mar 2013 21:45

Narendra Modi through the Eyes of Gujarati Muslims, Christians and…
Author(s) : Madhu Purnima Kishwar

When some pockets of Gujarat were convulsed by violent riots in February 2002, I too accepted the version presented by the national media as well as our activist friends and assumed that Modi was complicit in the Gujarat riots of 2002. Therefore, I too signed statements against Modi, published articles sent to Manushi indicting Gujarat government. We also raised funds for riot victims. However, I refrained from writing anything under my name because I did not get the time to visit Gujarat and experience and assess the situation first hand........

http://www.manushi.in/articles.php?arti ... pe=&pgno=1
Last edited by Sushupti on 29 Mar 2013 23:04, edited 2 times in total.

anmol
BRFite
Posts: 1722
Joined: 05 May 2009 17:39

Re: Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Postby anmol » 29 Mar 2013 22:06

rajeshkathiriya wrote:http://www.indianexpress.com/news/development-work-in-narendra-modis-gujarat-done-with-central-funds-kapil-sibal/1094889/

Development work in Narendra Modi's Gujarat done with central funds: Kapil Sibal


:evil:

CLSA applauds Gujarat's growth model

Sanjeeb Mukherjee | New Delhi November 14, 2012 Last Updated at 00:37 IST


Gujarat has a far better chance, according to analysis by research firm CLSA, of sustaining its high growth trajectory in the next few years as compared with competing states such as Maharashtra and Tamil Nadu.

“Unlike most large economies, India’s economy has evolved differently. It has transited from an agrarian economy to a services powerhouse, without going through a phase where manufacturing dominates. But Gujarat has bucked this national trend,” the report said. In Gujarat, it said, industry accounts for 40 per cent of the Gross State Domestic Product (GSDP), while the national average is just 27 per cent. This means far more sustainable growth for Gujarat. It also says the state’s low reliance on central funds would help it deliver strong growth.

Other industrialising states such as Maharashtra and Tamil Nadu have seen a fall in the share of industry in overall GSDP. “The state’s industry GDP contribution to the national GDP has consistently increased from 8-8.5 in 2000-01 to 11-1.5 per cent in FY11,” the report said.

On the oft-repeated criticism that despite high growth, Gujarat’s Human Development Index (HDI) and Infant Mortality Rate (IMR) show little signs of improvement as compared to Maharashtra or Tamil Nadu, the report said with improved governance, Gujarat’s HDI and IMR would soon converge with the other two states.

In agriculture, the report said farming contributes 13 per cent to the state’s GDP, significantly higher than Maharashtra and Tamil Nadu. “The state’s contribution to the national production of wheat and cotton has significantly improved in the last few years and the contribution of its agri GDP to the national agri GDP has doubled in the last 10 years,” the report said.

Regarding the reliance on central funds, CLSA said the ratio of the state’s own tax revenue to total tax revenue is one of the highest among all states, at 84 per cent.

“Less than 30 per cent of its overall revenue receipts come from central taxes and grants from the central account,” the report said.


These, experts said, make Gujarat’s growth far more robust, even if there is a slowing in central allocation.

It spends a consistent 55-60 per cent of overall expenditure on development, while not compromising on spending in other sectors.

In other states, the share of total expenditure on development activities fluctuates widely.


Return to “BR Nostalgia Archive”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests