Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

VikramS
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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby VikramS » 30 Dec 2013 07:22

Atish:

The apolitical types who have suddenly discovered politics are all ape-shit about AAP.
The AK for CM, Modi for PM crowd is now wondering why not "AK for PM" too?
They suddenly start seeing demons in NaMo: dictatorial, anti-muslim.

What you should not forget is that even in Delhi Congress got 25% votes. Just 5% less than AAP, and just 10% less than BJP.

Delhi was IAC-Central. But even here, only the middle-class "Issue Based" vote has shifted, not the "Identity Based" Group.

Think about the rural areas, and areas in the South where the demographics are Congress Friendly. If the "Issue Based" vote does not go en-masse to Modi, it will hurt.

muraliravi
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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby muraliravi » 30 Dec 2013 07:24

Does anyone see any reason as to why Namo is not uttering a word on AAP. Media will give them coverage anyway. My point is that a lot of AAP supporters or fence sitters have goodwill for Namo and it is quite easy for him to poke holes in AAP's agenda, their alliance with congress etc.. and pull these guys back.

subhamoy.das
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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby subhamoy.das » 30 Dec 2013 08:00

In the national scale there are 350 seats which are normally fought between BJP and CONG(I). This time BJP will be over the 200 mark and CONG-I and PAAP will be together bringing up the 100 odd seats with the congress share dipping below 100 for sure. So PAAP will reduce the congi seats rather then BJP. I would say that PAAP will have around 10-20 and congress around 80-90. BJP will be around 220-250 mark.

subhamoy.das
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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby subhamoy.das » 30 Dec 2013 08:04

NAMO's charter is general election where PAAP - even if they sweep Delhi - will have 5 seats. So why should he utter about such a small player in the national arena. As somebody said, every election year new parties are formed and they run out of business by the next election. So the strategy is to treat PAAP just that - yet another new startup. Whether it will succeed or not will be see in 2019.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby hanumadu » 30 Dec 2013 08:17

Atish wrote:You are gonna have a left center strong outfit in the country. Congis with Shastri or even Narasimha Rao was not a contemptible evil anti national force. If AAP becomes that no problem.

Yes if I could design a universe based on my idea of utopia there will be no Left, but thats not the issue.


Seriously, how did you leapfrog from the present AK to him being a Shastri or PVN. What are the indications that there is an even remote chance that he may turn out to be Shastri or PVN. The kind of people he hobnobs with and the kind of views him and his colleagues tells me he is no Shastri or PVN.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Muppalla » 30 Dec 2013 08:23

muraliravi wrote:Does anyone see any reason as to why Namo is not uttering a word on AAP. Media will give them coverage anyway. My point is that a lot of AAP supporters or fence sitters have goodwill for Namo and it is quite easy for him to poke holes in AAP's agenda, their alliance with congress etc.. and pull these guys back.


AAP has already given a lot of opportunities. Just wait and hit hard. Watch out for such a nataraja tandav.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Nitesh » 30 Dec 2013 08:27

The prashant bhushan uvacha against kudankulam is a good ploy to hit the AAP supporters, most of the this crowd wants development, expose the AAP here. And people start muttering blah blah blah.

Virendra
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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Virendra » 30 Dec 2013 08:30

VikramS wrote:Atish:

The apolitical types who have suddenly discovered politics are all ape-shit about AAP.
The AK for CM, Modi for PM crowd is now wondering why not "AK for PM" too?
They suddenly start seeing demons in NaMo: dictatorial, anti-muslim.

What you should not forget is that even in Delhi Congress got 25% votes. Just 5% less than AAP, and just 10% less than BJP.

Delhi was IAC-Central. But even here, only the middle-class "Issue Based" vote has shifted, not the "Identity Based" Group.

Think about the rural areas, and areas in the South where the demographics are Congress Friendly. If the "Issue Based" vote does not go en-masse to Modi, it will hurt.

Indeed. A whole lot of first time voters and debutants of political chit chat are seen now. The saas-bahu type women of my office are talking Congress-AAP and BJP these days. Strange times .... may Ishwara give them proper political aptitude to match with the enthusiasm. Else we're doomed.

However I differ on the last part. Rajasthan is a heavily identity-based voting State.
It has surprised everyone by voting overwhelmingly for BJP in the name of Modi's governance and hope that they will align themselves with a central BJP by May 2014. This was a big smashing vote and wasn't an identity one.
Lets accept that Gehlot wasn't doing so bad. Like 23 seat bad !!

Regards,
Virendra

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Virendra » 30 Dec 2013 08:37

The way Congress has screwed this country in UPA-II, a lot of first time voters will be out with a war cry this time (and have been in Assembly elections too).
This should be considered as a swing section that can go any-where that doesn't look like Congress-where.
If BJP didn't move quick and smart .. these precious and deciding votes are going to AAP's kitty. Will be a big damage.
Many of us thought that Congress was a gone case and the job of NaMo was getting easier every day. Politics is as surprising & volatile as cricket it seems :)

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby ramana » 30 Dec 2013 08:40

The politics party guy is hyper against AAP Kejriwal alleging all sorts of funds transfers. He thinks 6 Congress and 19 AAP will change after 2014 General Elections.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Virendra » 30 Dec 2013 08:42

I think BJP openly attacking AAP might enable the latter into bracketing BJP-Congress together, where the public perception is already against Congress.
Whoever is seen close and similar to Congies will be an untouchable in these elections. Game is on for who that will be .. BJP? or AAP?

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Virendra » 30 Dec 2013 08:47

arindam wrote:This blog is tracking day to day performance of aam-admi-party : AAP Chronicles
Delhi Jal Board Chief transferred by Arvind Kejriwal for pointing out Rs.118cr Loss if 700ltrs water is given free, daily.

Fantabulous. This guy is keeping a close watch. I'm subscribing.

muraliravi
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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby muraliravi » 30 Dec 2013 08:48

Virendra wrote:I think BJP openly attacking AAP might enable the latter into bracketing BJP-Congress together, where the public perception is already against Congress.
Whoever is seen close and similar to Congies will be an untouchable in these elections. Game is on for who that will be .. BJP? or AAP?


Virendra ji, BJP should not attack AAP, they should attack AAP-Cong bhai bhai. They need to single mindedly focus on that and expose that. Maybe the strategy brains in BJP feel that they will not be able to expose that properly with a sold out media and they may end up on the wrong side. Probably that is why they are probably quiet.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby member_23365 » 30 Dec 2013 08:55

Virendra wrote:
VikramS wrote:Atish:

The apolitical types who have suddenly discovered politics are all ape-shit about AAP.
The AK for CM, Modi for PM crowd is now wondering why not "AK for PM" too?
They suddenly start seeing demons in NaMo: dictatorial, anti-muslim.

What you should not forget is that even in Delhi Congress got 25% votes. Just 5% less than AAP, and just 10% less than BJP.

Delhi was IAC-Central. But even here, only the middle-class "Issue Based" vote has shifted, not the "Identity Based" Group.

Think about the rural areas, and areas in the South where the demographics are Congress Friendly. If the "Issue Based" vote does not go en-masse to Modi, it will hurt.

Indeed. A whole lot of first time voters and debutants of political chit chat are seen now. The saas-bahu type women of my office are talking Congress-AAP and BJP these days. Strange times .... may Ishwara give them proper political aptitude to match with the enthusiasm. Else we're doomed.

However I differ on the last part. Rajasthan is a heavily identity-based voting State.
It has surprised everyone by voting overwhelmingly for BJP in the name of Modi's governance and hope that they will align themselves with a central BJP by May 2014. This was a big smashing vote and wasn't an identity one.
Lets accept that Gehlot wasn't doing so bad. Like 23 seat bad !!

Regards,
Virendra


Virendraji what you have seen in Rajasthan is going to be replicated all over India, Information age has changed peoples perception about politics and identity based politics will diminish over the period of time with more education and more information.
I am still of the view that, AAP should have been prevented from even trying to form the government. Its like giving them opportunity to perform.He will get some low hanging fruits and they will be presented by MSM == to Modis 11years achievement in Gujarat.
The other thing will be politically mobile activist who were previously denied tickets by National parties will Jump to AAP. Not only they will take large chunk of votes but also there experience and cadre with them to AAP. If AAP wouldnt have got opportunity to rule these sidelined(power hungry) leaders would have never bothered with AAP. In coming times you will see exodus across the party lines moving over to AAP.

By the way what happened in your constituency.. I hope BJP won.. but by what margin?

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Hari Seldon » 30 Dec 2013 09:00

arindam wrote:This blog is tracking day to day performance of aam-admi-party : AAP Chronicles
Delhi Jal Board Chief transferred by Arvind Kejriwal for pointing out Rs.118cr Loss if 700ltrs water is given free, daily.

Fantabulous. This guy is keeping a close watch. I'm subscribing.


+1. Need to spread the word.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Virendra » 30 Dec 2013 09:20

atamjeetsingh wrote:Virendraji what you have seen in Rajasthan is going to be replicated all over India, Information age has changed peoples perception about politics and identity based politics will diminish over the period of time with more education and more information.
I am still of the view that, AAP should have been prevented from even trying to form the government. Its like giving them opportunity to perform.He will get some low hanging fruits and they will be presented by MSM == to Modis 11years achievement in Gujarat.
The other thing will be politically mobile activist who were previously denied tickets by National parties will Jump to AAP. Not only they will take large chunk of votes but also there experience and cadre with them to AAP. If AAP wouldnt have got opportunity to rule these sidelined(power hungry) leaders would have never bothered with AAP. In coming times you will see exodus across the party lines moving over to AAP.

Yeah and I suspect that Congis would give good under-the-table support to AAP till 2014 elections, so that the short term performance looks a good match against NaMo. Later when they've used AAP they'll pull the plugs after Elections. They can do that easily as M J Akbar's article has pointed out.

atamjeetsingh wrote:By the way what happened in your constituency.. I hope BJP won.. but by what margin?
BJP candidate won by a convenient margin. The number of votes to the top two candidates were literally double the last time. Either the voting went high or it got better oriented .. or may be both.
At a personal level I'm happy that after travelling from Noida to central Rajasthan village for casting my vote, I got a favorable outcome for now :)
Vasundhara has been given a better than expected platform now. Time to show her colours.
It is more crucial than ever that the new BJP state governments don't goof up before May 2014.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby member_20317 » 30 Dec 2013 09:24

Sun Tzu, Voldemort & 800 Cr of foreign funding. Mercy my lord, al-madad ya rasulullah. I only had one lager can last night.

NRI's have taken massive hits on their remittances. They are mostly Indians with families here in India and real plans for R2I. The monies as such are controlled from India for Indians. A massive part of BRF is NRI based.

Avaaz, Moveon tacticians are not NRIs. Fundings raised on self declarations are not NRIs. They would be Foreigners &/or RNIs.

There is a difference between these two.

But I like the effort being put in to convince harakiri. There are holes in the internet where this seems convincing but I welcome you guys to try it out here.

..........................
@Virender ji, you in Noida, kya? Never met you in Delhi meets. Probably because I attended only 1 myself :P .

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby member_23365 » 30 Dec 2013 09:32

Virendra wrote:
Vasundhara has been given a better than expected platform now. Time to show her colours.
It is more crucial than ever that the new BJP state governments don't goof up before May 2014.


Yes, thats what I heard from my sources, she is infulenced by Modi. She been humble this time. Last time she was acting like a Maharani.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby kmkraoind » 30 Dec 2013 09:41

One way to break goodwill of AAP is: Give wider coverage that AK is ultimate solution for your day-to-day problems and he will solve all of them for you, i.e. If the autorikshaw guys refuses to come to destination or does not come by meter, let complain that anarchy to AK and he will solve it (put his trusted autorikshaw unions vs middle class.

On a curious note: Why did not AK did not take people's opinion on choosing his ministers and portfolio allocation, bcz AK himself had said it is 1.5 crore Delhities who are taking oath as CMs.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby krishnan » 30 Dec 2013 09:51

not even 1 week into office and CM got fever and loose motion :lol:

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Sridhar K » 30 Dec 2013 10:04

Prashant Bhushan not only uttered about Kudankulam but he was physically present in TN with the likes of Udhayakumar and pledged AAP support against Nuclear energy.

I have been talking to my colleague from UP (NIT and IIM educated, friends in the army- used to reading BR army forum) who was falling into the AAP's cong==bjp talk and told that both have failed and that AK47 should get a chance. He was wanting to volunteer for AAP Pointed to him about
a) AAP view on Kashmir, Army, sudden growth, source of funding - he retorts saying that all parties are like that and why not give him a chance
b) Him riding on Anna's wave and going against his wish of getting into politics- answer from him- without getting hands dirty and into the system - how do you clean and Anna being very idealistic. Then I asked him to look why , why Kiran Bedi, Gen V.K Singh are not supporting him
c) Him failing on his promise on his kids about taking congress support. he said in politics, you cannot be ideal and needs to make compromises. I asked him there you go. In politics within days of victory, you make a compromise, justify it and then how different are you from other politicians. He says why not we give him a chance.
d) I tell him about him being IIT educated, NAC wannabe, mentored by Sonia NAC, funded and awarded by Ford foundation is no real aam admi and the real aam admi being a chaiwalla Modi and Mohan Parrikkar. Why not vote for the real aam admi?
e) He asks politicians are corrupt and why not try an alternate model to cong==bjp. I tell him, if you want a model, look at MP, Chattisgarh, Gujarat. How are they able to perform despite incumbency? Have not these states shown improvement. Have not their CMs down to earth. Why is not the model successful and why is BJP not an alternative and why should we like a unknown angel with questionable credentials?
f) Then comes Modi - he is extremist - blah blah. I told him despite every attempt by Congress and is pets Media, NGO, the caged parrot CBI etc. trying to fix him have failed after so many years and all they could muster was a snooping issue? You should look at Gujarat model. He retorts, Guj has always been a wealthy state. Then I point about him about the improvement in Agriculture, inclusive growth model followed, my trip report on Gujarat etc to open his eyes beyond reading MSM.
g) How Kejriwal has focussed on removing laal bathi etc. which was such an irritant in Delhi. I told him since you know management, you can pick a low hanging fruit, implement and blow the trumphet big time and bury the real work that needs to be done and gullible people may fall for this gimmick. Pointed him to similar stuff we do in our company and then he realized. Told him we don't need freebie based model now for India but solid holistic reforms and Governance.

He is slowly seeing the light and have asked him to join BRF and read the forum for better understanding. It shows that people can be asked to tread on AK with caution and give a chance to a proven administrator. However, it in an uphill battle with so many gullible people fallen for the MSM psy ops. It is easier to convince ignorant but difficult job to convince people with pre-judices set up over the years.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby VikramS » 30 Dec 2013 10:36

The biggest thing to challenge is the Cong == BJP talk.

That is non-sense..

And tell them that almost what AK is proposing has already been done by NM....
Ex:

http://www.slideshare.net/www.narendram ... vice-award

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Comer » 30 Dec 2013 11:42

Thus spake Yogendra

On AAP's outreach to people's movements

This is not the first time that we've got in touch with people's movements with a view to integrating their energies into AAP. Even before the party was formed, in August-September last year, we had similar meetings. I travelled all over the country to speak to people's movements.

Edit: http://www.indianexpress.com/news/we-we ... e/1213213/

This syncs with Koodamkulam agitation leader Udayakumaran's interview in a Tamil magazine. He claimed that he was invited to align/join with AAP but he refused saying he is of Tamil Nationalist persuasion whereas AAP is national. Still, he said, he was insisted to join AAP.
I wonder what are the ideologies of People's Movements? My bet is they will want to enforce Dictatorship of the Proletariat.
This Yogendra is the real danger guy in the motley urban naxal group. Rest of all may be dancing to his tunes. He may be the Sonia type, hiding behind and controlling the throne. AK could be the MMS.
Last edited by Comer on 30 Dec 2013 11:43, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby KJo » 30 Dec 2013 11:42

A lot of people here, especially virulent NaMo fans seriously hate Kejriwal, and I see it both here and on my Facebook feed. I differ slightly on my position. I am okay and even happy that AK is now CM of Delhi. He gets a small state to try out his plans and people can watch what he can so. The end goal is that India be progressive and corruption free. I can easily see why people voted for him, they are sick of the Congress and the BJP who they both view as corrupt. Even for me, the only reason I support BJP now is because of NaMo. Yeddy was as corrupt as Bangarappa in Karnataka, so they are no better as a party. AK should stick to aam aadmi improvement of life issues and not get into economic issues that he has no idea about like FDI, Kashmir etc. Just stick to the agenda. He does not have to work wonders, even small improvements will go down well.

Hope AK succeeds in Delhi, and hope Modi comes to power in 2014. AAP should stick itself to being a regional party and not stick its nose into national politics at least for the next 10 years.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby RoyG » 30 Dec 2013 11:47

AK is surrounded by NACxalites. He is obviously being used by congress to blunt the modi juggernaut.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby vishvak » 30 Dec 2013 11:48

bcz AK himself had said it is 1.5 crore Delhities who are taking oath as CMs.

He better not blame people for problems he cannot solve if 'people have taken oath',

Modi gives credit to people partnership after successful completion of public works.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby member_20317 » 30 Dec 2013 11:49

viv wrote:As usual MJ Akbar makes a few good points [url]http://blogs.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/TheSiegeWithin/entry/in-cong-s-modi-fight-can-aap-come-to-rescue


By February we will know whether Kejriwal has been able to use Congress, or vice versa. It might suit both if Kejriwal loses Congress support because he has filed corruption cases. Kejriwal would be rid of government, and Congress would be rid of Kejriwal. A wounded Kejriwal could then be unleashed on the general election. In the meantime, all Modi has to do is wait, and keep quiet. If BJP had won Delhi, he would have no answers on electricity rates, water or crime. Delhi’s water comes from Congress-ruled Haryana; electricity from corporations, who are even less generous; and the police is run by the Centre. Some battles are better lost.
[/quote]

viv ji, electricity rates, water or crime.

BJP had driven only 1 of these points. Electricity.

The other 2 in fact BJP could easily have carved out an even more polarized campaign. That too one that would have had received nationwide coverage. Losing Dilli sarkar to a one night stand would make sense only when BJP can either profit even bigger or avoid bigger losses.

There is no doubt that AAP has the public behind it. And in a democracy that does count for something even if it is known to be suicidal.

.................

Thanks for the suggestion nageshks ji. Will try and report back.

................

Moved from NaMo thread to here

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Comer » 30 Dec 2013 11:52

RoyG wrote:AK is surrounded by NACxalites. He is obviously being used by congress to blunt the modi juggernaut.

Nice coinage, fits them perfectly.
But I think there is a larger movement where stopping Modi is only the side effect. There is a lot of NGOgiri going on, the apex of it is the NACxalites. Unless Modi succeeds we may see a hard left turn for India if AAP experiment is allowed to succeed. Congress rule would have been a paradise compared to AAP government if it happens.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Pranav » 30 Dec 2013 12:05

VikramS wrote:The apolitical types who have suddenly discovered politics are all ape-shit about AAP.


Yes, Kejriwal/AAP is getting full backing from owners of paid-media, and the naive / deracinated types are falling for it.

Media reach is higher these days and one can expect even Jhuggi-Jhonpdi-walas to have been subject to some degree of indoctrination.

At the same time, it is true that AAP will attract more of the Congress vote than the BJP vote. So in the first-past-the-post system, the presence of AAP may actually benefit the BJP, unless AAP can do so well that it's vote-share is bigger than that of the BJP. In the LokSabha election, this will be difficult as constituency sizes are larger and the AAP presence is still weak. Also, people tend to gravitate to the most credible option and give a decisive mandate and that is also a hurdle for AAP.

AAP may be able to take some genuinely popular steps in Delhi and get lots of media coverage. However, the fact that Delhi has a hung assembly and that AAP is in power via an unholy alliance with Congress will be a warning for voters.

BJP cannot afford to ignore the AAP - it should be regarded as the principal adversary. There is a significant section of less anchored types who would normally be BJP voters, but who are in danger of being swayed by paid-media. BJP needs to tackle the AAP head-on with issues like Batla House, Kashmir, Communal Violence Bill, Sonia Ghandy letters for Kejriwal, Maulana Tauqeer, dubious land allotment for Bhushans in NOIDA etc. This attack need not be done by NaMo himself, but it still has to be done at a fairly senior and credible level.

At the same time BJP has to sharpen its anti-corruption agenda, and go beyond what the AAP is saying. Dr. Harshvardhan in Delhi had promised to implement RTI+, meaning putting all government files online, so that anybody can access in real time. These are the kind of ideas that can take the initiative away from the AAP-walas. Belittling the anti-corruption agenda will be a serious mistake. NaMo does have a strong development & national security agenda which is being adequately projected at present, but the BJP is not so strong on the corruption issue.

BJP may also have to reach some understanding with media houses, to compensate for its criminal negligence in the media sphere.

All this is of course modulo any rigging of EVMs.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby KJo » 30 Dec 2013 12:34

MJ Akbar got a lot of gaalis here for his lite Islamic agenda. Now he is one among us? :shock:

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby rohitvats » 30 Dec 2013 12:34

The proof of the pudding is when you eat it - same goes for the AAP and AK in Delhi.

The party has risen to power because it promised to solve the day-to-day issues faced by common people - and people have bought into these promises. AK does not need to be a superman to address lot of issues faced by a common man. The government and government machinery in India has become a power-unto-itself without any regard to person on the street - there is every possibility that this status quo can and will be broken under AAP in Delhi. If this happens, it will lead to some level of improvement in the life of a common man.

And if AAP can demonstrate genuine thrust in this regard and if people see accountability in government departments and offices they come in contact with, all the gains are for AAP to take. Everyone knows that AK does not have magic wand to remove all the ills in a super-quick time. But they sure will be looking out for intentions and conduct of AAP leadership and cadre.

Issue like stand of AAP on Batla House encounter or Kashmir are not germane to a state level election - or even LS. These are topics for discussion by the people like us on BRF - to a common person choosing next government at state level (or even national level) the issue is that of governance, jobs, price hike and growth. That is the platform which has been successfully used by NM to reach out to people - and has got a massive response in return.

But the same common man is also keenly looking at AAP experiment - if he sees (or perceives) it as a success and considers it as an opportunity to address his daily issues and make life better for himself and his family, he will give it a chance. The way swearing in ceremony was conducted itself has struck a strong chord with people (at least the ones I spoke to in Gurgaon) - they feel they finally have a voice in the system.

But how long can AAP maintain the image is a real challenge for them - as they grow, they will attract all sorts of character looking to rise the AAP wave to MLA post. It is one thing to manage the show and maintain a identity with a small group but completely different as the body grows. Power centers and power struggles are bound to come up. How AAP fares and the impact it has on their perception remains to be seen.

And IMO, by giving support to AAP, Congress has tried to spoil the BJP's party in ND. And salvage some sort of moral high ground for itself after the massive drubbing. There is not much time between today and LS polls and anything positive done (or perception of honest intentions) by AAP government will strengthen their chances in LS Polls. Congress knows it is a spent force in Delhi but wants to spoil BJP's chances by using AAP as a proxy.

But it has also put itself in a tight spot - Any antics by Congress to withdraw support from AAP will be projected as a betrayal of people's aspirations by AAP and Congress can kiss it's sorry arse good-bye for a long time to come in ND.

When we're looking at the AAP phenomenon, it would be incorrect to focus on the issues like Batla House encounter or Prashant Bhusan's stand on Kashmir. These are 30,000 feet topics - they don't win elections. Simple. People who came out to listen to NM speak and are expected to vote for him are not doing so because they have suddenly developed love and affection for RJB issue or Article 370 or Uniform Civil Code. They have done that because they see in him a leader who they feel can make a material difference in their lives. Same goes for AAP movement and AK. Any attempt at character assassination of AK will back-fire and back-fire big time.

We need to understand and accept that a common person is willing to throw his lot with people who he perceives can give him a better life. BJP local leadership needs to project itself as being able to do that. And engage more with people. You cannot deny the fact that the kind of participatory democracy which AAP proposes with serious accountability from government departments is quite revolutionary from what exists today. If AAP manages to deliver even on 50% promises, people are likely to give it a thumbs-up and will never settle for anything else but what they have experienced under AAP government. Their performance in ND will become their CV for attempting similar exercise in other urban areas. And there is no better publicity than honest word of mouth publicity.

If AAP can deliver good governance to common man in ND in the way they have promised, than it would definitely be a new chapter in Indian democracy. But how long can they sustain the idea and philosophy remains to be seen.

rohitvats
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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby rohitvats » 30 Dec 2013 12:36

KJoishy wrote:MJ Akbar got a lot of gaalis here for his lite Islamic agenda. Now he is one among us? :shock:


Well, depends on whether he praised NM in one of his latest articles... :mrgreen: :P :mrgreen:

RajeshA
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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby RajeshA » 30 Dec 2013 13:08

ashok hajeri ‏@ashokhajeri 15m
JDU MP frm Bihar Aurangabad Sushil Kumar Singh set to join BJP #NiKu

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby JohnTitor » 30 Dec 2013 13:09

atamjeetsingh wrote:Virendra wrote:
Vasundhara has been given a better than expected platform now. Time to show her colours.
It is more crucial than ever that the new BJP state governments don't goof up before May 2014.


Yes, thats what I heard from my sources, she is infulenced by Modi. She been humble this time. Last time she was acting like a Maharani.

Still waiting on that investigation into the vadra land deals... if she doesn't do it, it'll be extremely dissapointing

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Pranav » 30 Dec 2013 14:15

rohitvats wrote:Issue like stand of AAP on Batla House encounter or Kashmir are not germane to a state level election - or even LS. These are topics for discussion by the people like us on BRF


That is because the common man is deliberately kept in ignorance about the Holocausts that are being perpetrated on the Indic peoples.

Consider how most people have no idea about how Indic women in Kashmir had their breasts sliced off by Jihadists, prior to their being raped and murdered. Why have there not been been a dozen Bollywood movies graphically showing Jihadist atrocities? Why have there been no Bollywood movies even about the 1971 East Pakistan atrocities? Contrast that with the atrocity literature that has been created for Gujarat 2002, on the basis of utterly false and invented narratives.

So the need of the hour is bring home to the Indic consciousness that survival is far from assured. A healthy fear is necessary for the survival of any nation. Partly it is a failure on the part of the BJP to communicate.

So yes, Batla House and Kashmir can be very relevant electoral issues provided the BJP has done its homework in educating the people.

But even in the present less-than-ideal circumstances, most people will react negatively to a party being led by people with no respect for Indian territorial integrity, or which is soft on terrorists. It does need to be communicated properly, though, in terms of respect for the sacrifices of martyrs.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Hari Seldon » 30 Dec 2013 15:17

^^ +1 Pranav. Very well articulated. A public figure speaking truth to power (the present establishment) is an event so rare, it boggles the mind. NM's rise (and thatof the BJP and RSS in general) has that one element strongly backing them - a leadership unapologetic about its Indic roots.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Virendra » 30 Dec 2013 15:41

I agree with Rohit that the common man would lend his ear first to the road-food and power related topics, before listening to Batla and Kashmir. Nobody can say that these are not important issues. What has been happening cannot be dnied.
But you also cannot dictate to the common voter as to what factors he considers before casting his/her vote or what factors take precedence over the others for him/her. That is exactly the context in which Kejri's few short term grabs of low handing fruits, hyperventilated by the crazy media as messiaic, will be potentially dangerous.
To add to the problems - there are plenty of first time political fanboys going gaga.
Best strategy is to connect to the people extensively, provide governance and then talk about these 30,000 feet issues once you have their trust and their ears.
People across this country today listen to a man most relenlessly accused of riot crimes in the country's independent history. Why?
Because he has such a record of governance and development that people have hopes in him.
Problem is, BJP doesn't have small NaMos in each and every corner of the country to stand in front of the Kejris.

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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Pranav » 30 Dec 2013 16:04

Virendra wrote:I agree with Rohit that the common man would lend his ear first to the road-food and power related topics, before listening to Batla and Kashmir. Nobody can say that these are not important issues. What has been happening cannot be dnied.
But you also cannot dictate to the common voter as to what factors he considers before casting his/her vote or what factors take precedence over the others for him/her.


Fear for survival is very potent and can, in dire circumstances, take priority over good governance. The real atrocities have happened should be made vivid in people's minds.

Furthermore there does not have to be a choice between the good governance and national integrity issues. One can take up both in a forceful way.

Hari Seldon
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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby Hari Seldon » 30 Dec 2013 16:28

^+1. Anyone can see that the pious vote on perceived survival issues only. No?

Yindooze too wake up from slumber late in the day when minoriy pop crosses about a third in the local area to consolidate identity as Hindus and vote (seen across states, regions and elections).

arindam
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Re: Statewide and National runup to 2014 General elections

Postby arindam » 30 Dec 2013 16:29

Hari Seldon wrote:^^ +1 Pranav. Very well articulated. A public figure speaking truth to power (the present establishment) is an event so rare, it boggles the mind. NM's rise (and thatof the BJP and RSS in general) has that one element strongly backing them - a leadership unapologetic about its Indic roots.


Virendra wrote:<snip>
People across this country today listen to a man most relenlessly accused of riot crimes in the country's independent history. Why?
Because he has such a record of governance and development that people have hopes in him.
Problem is, BJP doesn't have small NaMos in each and every corner of the country to stand in front of the Kejris.


Pranav wrote:Fear for survival is very potent and can, in dire circumstances, take priority over good governance. The real atrocities have happened should be made vivid in people's minds.

Furthermore there does not have to be a choice between the good governance and national integrity issues. One can take up both in a forceful way.


A leader, unapologetic and Indic to the core who leads by example(governance and delivery) is mantra of the day (NaMo). The national integration issues would come to forefront or catch voter's imagination naturally, once you have taken care of the basic ask "roti-kapda-makan"/"bijli-sadak-pani" or if there is an overt imminent threat. It's the selfish gene. :)

Both are election plank for sure. The audiences may differ. bhajpa/rss has their tasks cut out for them. GE2014 - 272+ by hook or by crook. Let NaMo stir the country out of this perennial self-destructive nehruvian legacy. The organization has no time to rest. They should groom future leadership, improve the bjp perception under NaMo's aegis. Simply put, it's a humongous task but hey, who said it would be simple.

"to make the deaf hear" we have to have NaMo at the helm at least for the next 10 to 15 years. ape parties would come and go but you'll never reach your destination if you stop to throw stones at every dog that barks.


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