Wikileaks Diplomatic Cable Dump - News and Discussion

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 27 Mar 2011 19:51

Viv S wrote
but you’ll be surprised how moved fellow India supporter there at Mohali, Manmohan Singh, could be.

He/she or the people surrounding him could be so moved that the banner-displayer could be moved out of the stadium. He or she could be subject to a media led sting operation that shows a video and audio of how that person had been set up with cash by the opponents of Congress to malign the Congress led government of India which of course means maligning the rashtra.

sum · Post by **sum** » 28 Mar 2011 08:43

The Pentagon's $27 billion ‘near term' Indian wish list

A U.S. Embassy cable titled ‘Scenesetter For USD(P) Flournoy's Visit To India' sent on October 29, 2009 to the State Department under the name of Ambassador Tim Roemer presents a list of military equipment that the United States should try and sell India. Against each item, a dollar value is mentioned.

Near term sales opportunities include:

Indian Air Force

Sensor Fuzed Weapons (SFW) — LOA expected shortly for 510 SFW for the IAF. LOA had been on hold pending EUM resolution (FMS, 379M USD)*.

Harpoon Missiles — LOA for 20 air-launched Harpoons passed to the IAF who requested the paragraph containing EEUM requirements be contained in a classified annex similar to EUM text. DSCA has accommodated the change and we expect a revised LOA shortly (FMS, 74M USD).

C-130J — We expect the IAF to amend the existing FMS contract for C-130Js to add six additional aircraft in 2010 (FMS, 800M USD)*.

C-17-USAF/IA is actively working with the IAF to develop an LOR for 10 C-17s. We expect the LOA to be signed in 2010 (FMS, 4B USD)*.

F-125IN Jet Engines — Honeywell is offering the F125IN engine as an upgrade for the IAF Jaguars. This competition for 306 engines is expected to take place in 2010 (DCS, 4.3B USD).

GE-414 Engines — GE is offering to provide 148 engines for the indigenous Light Combat Aircraft (LCA). Competition in 2010 (DCS, 800M USD)*.

Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft — The Boeing F-18IN and the Lockheed F-16IN are among the six competitors to produce 126 IAF fighter aircraft. Flight trials have begun and the IAF technical evaluation is due to MOD in the summer of 2010 (FMS, 10B USD).

Heavy Lift Helicopter — The Boeing CH-47 Chinook is competing to provide the IAF 15 helicopters (DCS, 1B USD).

Attack Helicopter — The Boeing AH-64 Apache is competing for a contract for 22 helicopters (DCS/FMS, 1B USD).

Indian Navy

Network Centric Operations Prototype — Raytheon was the low bidder for this system, but Israeli competitors have requested a review of Raytheon's bid. Although Raytheon was some 20M USD below the next lowest bid, Raytheon is concerned the Indian Navy will be forced to reissue the RFP (DCS, 29M

USD).

Multi-Role Helicopter — Sikorsky (S-70B) and Lockheed (MH-60R) are competing to provide 16 helicopters for the Indian Navy. The announcement of competitors moving forward to flight trials is expected momentarily (FMS, 1B USD).

Indian Army

M-777 Light Weight 155MM Howitzer — LOA in development for 145 M-777 155MM Howitzers (FMS, 900M USD).

Javelin Anti-Tank Guided Missiles — The Indian Army is actively developing an LOR for 9,000 Javelin missiles. We demonstrated these missiles during exercise YUDH ABHYAS (FMS, 1.4B USD)*.

Patriot PAC3 — In 2008 the Indian Army sent the Office of Defense Cooperation (ODC) an RFP for a Medium Range Surface to Air Missile modeled on the Patriot. The USG did not respond and the Indian Army cancelled the RFP because they wanted the Patriot. Currently the ENDP process is ongoing for a classified briefing requested by the Indian Army. We believe an offer to sell Patriot would be well received by the Indian Army and taken as a sign that the US has made a political decision to offer India advanced military technology (FMS, 2B USD).

So the SFW also wasn't procured since the IAF agreed for "secret" EUM type clause to fulfill Unkil conditions ( like for the PM jet) but babus refused to honour it!!

sum · Post by **sum** » 28 Mar 2011 08:45

U.S. cables show grand calculations underlying 2005 defence framework (Part-I)

The cables reveal that the Indian method is never to say ‘No' when asked by the Americans about the Logistics Support Agreement (LSA) or the Communications Interoperability and Security Memorandum of Agreement (CISMOA). Indeed, when pressed by U.S. diplomats, senior officials and Ministers blithely assert that the internal review process has “nearly” been completed and that the Cabinet will “soon” consider the texts. But these agreements remain unsigned despite five years of assurances. A senior member of the Cabinet described for The Hindu, Defence Minister A.K. Antony's jocular response when a ministerial colleague asked how he dealt with the American pressure to sign. “We have not said no,” he recalled Mr. Antony saying. “But I tell them, there are soooooo many procedures. We have to follow alllllll the procedures!”

This resistance cannot be traced to any firmness shown by the Indian government as a whole or the bureaucracy as an institution. It cannot, in fact, be attributed to any single factor. But the primary reason for the mixed balance sheet has been democratic opposition in the polity and public life of the country, to which influential sections of the media have also contributed.

Ha ha..love the Indian babus..

sum · Post by **sum** » 28 Mar 2011 08:47

Read the entire cable since every word is relevant. Good pushback by our babus :
U.S. cables show grand calculations underlying 2005 defence framework (Part - II)

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 28 Mar 2011 09:27

From the above two links posted by 'sum', we can see that Sidharth Varadrajan freely and copiously intersperses them with his own analyses and interpretation just as the embassy staff do in their cables. It is these that we should avoid in such articles as well as in the cables themselves and see the truth for ourselves. The Hindu is not publishing the cables themselves but only excerpts and their interpretations.

One could also see the unseemly haste with which the US wants to push through its agenda rather than escalating the relationship step-by-step.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 28 Mar 2011 10:38

SSridhar, Sum, can you please also point me/us to the cables themselves, for some reason, I cant find the links to the original cables which are dealt with in the latest.

==============

Whatever we said and feared on BRF is turning out to be 100% true.

Maram · Post by **Maram** » 28 Mar 2011 17:36

Babudom and their INFINITE Chai Biskoot sessions...! Babus never cease to amaze me!
This is the Indian version of "Yes, Prime Minister"... onlee it is for Real !

sum · Post by **sum** » 28 Mar 2011 17:45

Sanku wrote:SSridhar, Sum, can you please also point me/us to the cables themselves, for some reason, I cant find the links to the original cables which are dealt with in the latest.

==============

Whatever we said and feared on BRF is turning out to be 100% true.

Does this help, saar?

http://www.thehindu.com/news/the-india- ... he-cables/

Arya Sumantra · Post by **Arya Sumantra** » 28 Mar 2011 20:05

SSridhar wrote:One could also see the unseemly haste with which the US wants to push through its agenda rather than escalating the relationship step-by-step.

It's their String of Pearls approach. Note the endless of barrage of treaties from ABCD to WXYZ. Only that the pearls in this case are not countries but treaties each one worded to be apparently benign and seemingly unrelated to other treaties. String them all together and the game would become apparent but too late by then.

The cautious among us would always be mocked by our own poodles working for the same country that itself labels every nation on the rise as a "threat".

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 28 Mar 2011 21:16

sum wrote:
Sanku wrote:SSridhar, Sum, can you please also point me/us to the cables themselves, for some reason, I cant find the links to the original cables which are dealt with in the latest.

==============

Whatever we said and feared on BRF is turning out to be 100% true.
Does this help, saar?

http://www.thehindu.com/news/the-india- ... he-cables/

Many thanks!!

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 28 Mar 2011 21:18

S Varadarajan is a US citizen. Maybe he arranged for the sequence of the leaks

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 28 Mar 2011 21:50

Also its not the babus being yes minister but its the politicians who dont want to say no. The politicial class is exposing the babus to direct line of fire,while the collest hafta/bribe what not. This happens when you have incompetent leadership based on non-merit reasons. Th epolticiaian thinks its his birth right to hob nob with diplomutts and exchange gossip and let the babu take the heat. You can see the pattern in both parties.
In the end its the steel frame holding it together.

pran · Post by **pran** » 28 Mar 2011 23:23

Ramana,

From the article posted by sum. Indian govt. is being sensitive towards giving any basing rights as the opportunity was squandered fair and square by the US since kunduz airlift. India for once was honest to support a fight against evil but it soon learnt that it is misunderstanding between evil and the protector of evil. As far as real-politik goals nothing has changed except more chai-biskoot sessions. In a way this status quo is good while it raises the cost for both parties to a certain extent but the corrosion has set in for the US side as its resources/efforts are being eroded by its protectorate.

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 28 Mar 2011 23:29

Arjun wrote: With such sycophantic dynastyism and unadulterated feudalism on display from Gandhi family ~~boot-lickers~~ supporters - wouldn't be surprised if there is widespread derision in Western diplomatic circles about India's fancy 'largest democracy' credentials.

G W Bush became POTUS because Jeb Bush narrowly lost the election in Florida (a toss-up state) the first time he tried (1994), while W was presented with Texas. Jeb was considered the POTUS material within the circles who matter, not W.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 28 Mar 2011 23:36

The Hindu twists the wikileaks

Hindu nationalism is opportunistic, said Jaitley

The original cables

Below is the paragraph which The Hindu had twisted ,

” Pressed on the question of Hindutva, Jaitley argued that Hindu nationalism “”will always be a talking point”" for the BJP. However, he characterized this as an opportunistic issue. In India’s northeast, for instance, Hindutva plays well because of public anxiety about illegal migration of Muslims from Bangladesh. With the recent improvement of Indo-Pak relations, he added, Hindu nationalism is now less resonant in New Delhi, but that could change with another cross-border terrorist attack, for instance on the Indian Parliament.”

Now read on..

The “opportunistic” is actually US staffer’s characterization of what Jaitley described – it is not even in quotes.
All leftist say Bjp hindutva as “opportunistic”, is there anything special if a US staffer think so ?
Why did the Hindu twist the cable by putting thoughts of US staffer into Jaitly’s mouth ?

“The Hindu” must answer for this twist…………….

please RT this tweet to N.Ram..

post script : N Ram replies , but did not give a satisfactory answer

Jaitley replies “the use of the word “opportunistic” in reference to nationalism or Hindu nationalism is neither my view nor my language. It could be the diplomat’s own usage,”
now how many have had courage to deny like Aryn Jaitly did ? Has Rahul Gandhi denie the “saffron” remark ?

wonder how many cables have been twisted to suit their ends.
Hope they target the first family then the chickens will come home to roost with some libel cases etc

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 28 Mar 2011 23:55

Hindu is doing a hit job for someone. The fact they got exclusive rights to wikipees is to release the leaks to suit a point of view or agenda.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 28 Mar 2011 23:57

ramana wrote:Hindu is doing a hit job for someone. The fact they got exclusive rights to wikipees is to release the leaks to suit a point of view or agenda.

Also the analysis is to suit a view point.
Who is the beneficiary outside of India? plz think it over

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 29 Mar 2011 00:59

VikramS wrote:G W Bush became POTUS because Jeb Bush narrowly lost the election in Florida (a toss-up state) the first time he tried (1994), while W was presented with Texas. Jeb was considered the POTUS material within the circles who matter, not W.

Vikram, we are comparing a dynasty that has ruled the nation for over 70% of its democratic life and attempting to foist its 5th member on the people of India, vs a family that has ruled what 5% odd of the US' independent history ? Any comparison is IMO, completely silly and invalid.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 29 Mar 2011 01:24

ramana wrote:Hindu is doing a hit job for someone. The fact they got exclusive rights to wikipees is to release the leaks to suit a point of view or agenda.

ramana garu, the point that wikiLeaks is a hit job by the Uncle using its hard hitters (Assanage and localized ones like N Ram, The Gaurdian) etc., is being proved time and again after every trickle of leaks.

At least now folks should beleive leaks are not some breach but a deliberate ones by the uncle.

Nandu · Post by **Nandu** » 29 Mar 2011 03:15

krisna, according to the cable, it is Jaitley, not Blake, who characterized it as "opportunistic". There is no ambiguity there.

Of course, Blake could be lying, but that is neither here nor there. The Hindu has definitely not "twisted" this cable in any manner.

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 29 Mar 2011 07:57

Acharya wrote:
ramana wrote:Hindu is doing a hit job for someone. The fact they got exclusive rights to wikipees is to release the leaks to suit a point of view or agenda.
Also the analysis is to suit a view point.
Who is the beneficiary outside of India? plz think it over

Gentlemen
Grand game is being played here. pawns are being moved.MMS is the key figure. Every statement of his MUST be noted and we can connect the dots. The invitation to dus percenti and groper is not a random event.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 29 Mar 2011 08:15

Nandu wrote:krisna, according to the cable, it is Jaitley, not Blake, who characterized it as "opportunistic". There is no ambiguity there.

Of course, Blake could be lying, but that is neither here nor there. The Hindu has definitely not "twisted" this cable in any manner.

Read carefully-

“Pressed on the question of Hindutva, Jaitley argued that Hindu nationalism ‘will always be a talking point' for the BJP. However, he characterized this as an opportunistic issue,” the Charge wrote in a cable dated May 10, 2005 ( 32279: confidential).

It was the quotes in the hindu paper-Hindu nationalism is opportunistic, said Jaitley by Suresh Nambath

Original quotes-The original cable

” Pressed on the question of Hindutva, Jaitley argued that Hindu nationalism “”will always be a talking point”" for the BJP. However, he characterized this as an opportunistic issue. In India’s northeast, for instance, Hindutva plays well because of public anxiety about illegal migration of Muslims from Bangladesh. With the recent improvement of Indo-Pak relations, he added, Hindu nationalism is now less resonant in New Delhi, but that could change with another cross-border terrorist attack, for instance on the Indian Parliament.”

There are no quotes in that statement.
This was tweeted to N Ram but he did not give a proper answer.

Raghavendra · Post by **Raghavendra** » 29 Mar 2011 08:36

Nandu wrote:krisna, according to the cable, it is Jaitley, not Blake, who characterized it as "opportunistic". There is no ambiguity there.

Fair reading of the cable in question provides an view contrary to your opinion

Nandu wrote:Of course, Blake could be lying, but that is neither here nor there. The Hindu has definitely not "twisted" this cable in any manner.

The Hindu is notorious for its yellow journalism, check its past coverage of tibetan independence issue and the islamist violence in J&K. N Ram being a paid news media goon of the congress party is well known. He has a business relationship with Karat family run communist news channel NDTV and both have started a NDTV-Hindu news channel which is available locally in chennai. Knowning the interlinkages between the congress and communist parties its not surprising for both parties to have paid money to N.Ram for twisting wikileaks cables to muddy the image of BJP and deflect attention from criminal scams that the congress party and its leaders manmohan and sonia are involved in. BJP should counterattack by suing N.Ram and his mafia newspaper and expose this congress party bootlicker.

sum · Post by **sum** » 29 Mar 2011 08:47

A pink box that India would not give to FBI

United States officials believed that a pink foam-covered box found at one of the 26/11 Mumbai attack sites was crucial to proving the Pakistani links to the attacks, but complained that India was “not forthcoming” about sharing information about it.

A U.S. Embassy cable from Islamabad ( 204888: confidential) sent by Charge d'Affaires Gerald Feierstein on April 30, 2009, accessed by The Hindu through WikiLeaks, spoke of Pakistani officials handing over to the Federal Bureau of Investigation a similar box from investigations on Pakistan's side.

The cable said this was “possibly the most important piece of evidence shared [by Pakistan] with the FBI,” and that an analysis of the boxes could help prove that the conspiracy was hatched in Pakistan.

“For successful analysis, the FBI still needs the GOI to provide samples of the pink box in India,” the cable said, but pointed to India's reluctance to do so as a “significant hurdle” in the successful prosecution of the case in Pakistan. The cables do not say if India finally shared this bit of evidence.

Pakistan's Federal Investigation Agency (FIA) found the pink box at a training camp the Mumbai attackers attended in the Sindh province. The cable did not mention the location of the camp. The investigators handed it over to the U.S. Embassy's Legal Attache, a designated FBI official in U.S. diplomatic missions.

The cable noted the turning over of physical evidence by the FIA to the FBI as a significant development.

“The release of physical evidence is a very sensitive issue, and one that could affect the success of the GOP's prosecution. The FIA stressed that this sharing of evidence has to be kept quiet, as any leaks would endanger the prosecution,” the cable cautioned.

Going by the cable, U.S. officials also assisted the Pakistani investigators to prepare the prosecution case.

“Embassy Legatt [Legal Attache] continues to meet with the FIA investigative team on the technical aspects of the Mumbai investigation and prosecution. Currently Legatt is assisting FIA to prepare evidentiary materials for the court trial and the filing of a formal charge sheet,” the cable said.

The cable emphasised that in order to successfully prosecute the five men in judicial custody — LeT operations commander Zaki ur-Rehman Lakhvi, Hammad Ameen Sadiq, Mazhar Iqbal (aka al Qama), Abdul Wajid (aka Zarrar Shah), and Shahid Jamil Riaz — “the GOP [Government of Pakistan] still needs significant evidence sharing from both the U.S. and India. Additionally, U.S. legal expertise will be important in helping to frame third-country evidence in the most effective form for convictions.”

Under the sub-heading “Significant Hurdles,” the cable said acquiring some of the information that Pakistan needed for a successful prosecution would require “high-level intervention” from the relevant governments.

“The two pink boxes found in Pakistan and India are a strong link that proves the conspiracy behind the attacks originated in Pakistan. The GOP has passed its pink box to the FBI. The FBI still requires samples from the foam and glue that make up the box found in India. The GOI has not been forthcoming with this evidence.”

India seems to have learnt of the lessons of the 93 blasts ( US and the Pak made timer).

Btw, what is this pink box??

sum · Post by **sum** » 29 Mar 2011 08:47

India hangs up on hotline to Pentagon

One metric in the Pentagon's quest for a deeper military-to-military engagement with countries is their willingness to post permanent “liaison officers” at the headquarters of specified U.S. command centres. India is “covered” by the American military's Pacific Command (PACOM) based in Hawaii. Pakistan and points west fall under the “jurisdiction” of the Florida-based Central Command (CENTCOM).

Since 2002, the U.S. has been suggesting that India station an officer at PACOM to facilitate better communication. While not rejecting the idea, the National Democratic Alliance government of Atal Bihari Vajpayee suggested that India would rather work with CENTCOM. The Hawaii offer was repeated by PACOM commander William Fallon during his visit to India in April 2005 and followed up within days by Assistant Secretary of State for South Asia Christina Rocca and the U.S. Charge d'Affaires in a meeting with Ministry of External Affairs Joint Secretary S. Jaishankar in New Delhi. “In response to Charge's reminder of CINCPAC ADM Fallon's invitation for an Indian liaison officer (LNO) to PACOM, Jaishankar asked if the US would also host an LNO at CENTCOM. He argued that many areas of Indian concern are west of the PACOM/CENTCOM divide, and that a relationship with CENTCOM would be helpful if India is to provide training in Iraq in the future. If both are possible, he added, it would be good to seek approval from the Indian system at one go.”

The Americans, who had heard this argument before, were not buying it. “A/S Rocca reiterated her recommendation that relevant CENTCOM visitors to the region should consider visiting Delhi as well, but urged Jaishankar to focus first on getting an LNO to PACOM first, and not tie it to a similar request to CENTCOM,” a cable dated April 19, 2005, quotes her as saying ( 31045: confidential).

Six years on, India has yet to post an LNO to PACOM or CENTCOM, with senior officials saying the country is not really looking at a military relationship of the kind where an officer needs to liaise directly with U.S. commands.

sum · Post by **sum** » 29 Mar 2011 08:49

Why India stopped 2005 Dhaka SAARC summit

India cancelled its participation in the 2005 summit of the South Asian Association for Regional Cooperation (SAARC) in Dhaka in order to encourage Bangladesh “to be introspective,” an official of the Ministry of External Affairs (MEA) told a U.S. diplomat.

A U.S. Embassy cable sent on February 10, 2005 ( 26786: confidential) from New Delhi, reporting a February 9, 2005 conversation between Embassy officials and MEA Director Taranjit Sandhu on the decision, reveals much about India's Big Brother attitude towards Bangladesh.

Consequent to New Delhi's decision, the summit that was scheduled for February 6-7, 2005 was postponed. A SAARC summit cannot be held if any member-state declines to attend.

India gave two reasons for non-participation — the imposition of a state of Emergency by the King of Nepal, and the law and order situation in Bangladesh, which had faced several terror attacks in 2004. Another attack targeting a public rally of the opposition Awami League occurred on January 27, 2005, days before the originally scheduled summit.

Was held months later

The summit was eventually held in November 2005. But the February cancellation led to bad blood between India and Bangladesh and resentment within SAARC in general.

The cable reported: “GoI remains unapologetic about the last minute cancellation and the resulting unhappiness in Dhaka…With no apparent sense of urgency to make things right with Dhaka, the MEA explained that the GoI's decision was intended to send a message to BDG [Bangladesh government].”

Mr. Sandhu told the U.S. officials that “in light of increasing intolerance in Bangladesh and ‘sustained anti-India sentiment' there, India needed to bring pressure to bear on Dhaka.”

He urged the Americans not to “lessen the importance” of the events in Bangladesh in New Delhi's decision not to attend the summit. “The Director added to his list of Bangladeshi offenses that ‘sitting ministers' and senior politicians have made statements against India recently, with the intention of raising passions, and concluded that this is not the ‘SAARC spirit',” according to the cable.

He said it was time New Delhi “sent a message to Dhaka,” although the signal was not necessarily a negative one. Rather, “it was meant to encourage Bangladesh to be ‘introspective',” Mr. Sandhu said. He added that India wanted Bangladesh to “realize the danger to themselves from leaving certain issues unchecked.”

Right through Prime Minister Khaleda Zia's tenure in office, India was concerned that the free hand the Bangladesh government seemed to have given Islamist groups would have an impact on India's own security. There was also suspicion of a Pakistani helping hand to these groups, and New Delhi used every opportunity to rope in the U.S. to put pressure on the Bangladesh government.

Mr. Sandhu said “even a layman could see what has been going on.” The U.S. Embassy cable noted that he was “somewhat incredulous” that the U.S. government continued to ask for evidence to support India's claims of “creeping Talibanisation” when even media outlets such as The New York Times had written about it.

When the U.S. diplomats pointed out that a Federal Bureau of Investigation agent from the New Delhi office was on his way to Dhaka to help with the investigation of the January 27 attack, Mr. Sandhu was sceptical of U.S. investigators' ability to get results in Bangladesh.

Are FBI agents allowed to be permanently posted in Delhi? Arent they only given time bound specific visas for FBI-CBI conferences etc?

sum · Post by **sum** » 29 Mar 2011 08:52

A community scared of both Muslim and Hindu extremists

In a cable sent after the 2006 Mumbai attacks, the United States Embassy reported that its contacts had little faith in the ability of Islamic leaders, political parties, security agencies or the Indian government to prevent a terrorist attack and the anti-Muslim backlash that could follow. “Extremists in Uttar Pradesh barely conceal their activities and seem to operate with impunity,” Charge d'Affaires Geoffrey Pyatt quoted the Embassy contacts as saying in a report on the situation of north Indian Muslims after the serial train blasts in Mumbai.

Mr. Pyatt, in the cable sent on July 13, 2006 ( 71263: confidential) said the Mumbai attacks had focussed attention on the fragile communal situation in the North Indian Hindi belt, most particularly in Uttar Pradesh. “While Indians are grateful that the Mumbai attacks have not yet set off a communal conflagration, North Indian Muslims remain nervous and fearful.”

Noting that Uttar Pradesh, with a 17 per cent Muslim population and a large concentration of Shias, has endured a string of terrorist attacks since 2001, including multiple bombings on moving trains similar to the Mumbai blasts, he pointed out that the Students Islamic Movement of India and Lashkar-e-Taiba, the two principal suspects in the Mumbai attacks, are both active in the State.

Maulana Arshad Madani, the president of the Jamiat-ul-Ulema-e-Hind, which is the political wing of the Deobandi sect, decried the Mumbai bombings as “barbaric acts calculated to disturb communal harmony.” But there were no similar statements from other prominent Muslim organisations or leaders, especially Wahhabi organisations such as the Jamaat-e-Islami.

“Less prominent Muslim organizations came forward, with generally anodyne statements, including the Muslim Political Council of India, whose President, Tasleem Rehmani rhetorically urged the GOI to declare all victims of the bombings as martyrs to national integrity,” he said.

The Embassy conducted an informal survey of Muslim contacts from Lucknow and other cities. “Respondents included several Maulvis (both Sunni and Shia), Urdu language journalists, political and community leaders, scholars and academics. Their responses revealed a remarkable unanimity on ‘Islamic terrorism.' All expressed disdain for what they characterized as the ‘weak response' of India's Muslim leadership to the Mumbai attacks, accusing such leaders of taking a ‘head in the sand' approach and denying stark realities. They pointed out that after a string of terrorist assaults by Muslim extremists throughout India, it is now common knowledge within the Muslim community that the terrorists have established a support system and sympathizers' network among Indian Muslims to help carry out attacks conceived and orchestrated by foreign Muslims.”

How is the embassy being allowed to conduct so many surveys, esp in sensitive areas??

Even the recently caught survey guys in Kerala ( for asking questions on Osama and Kerala muslims etc) were sent by the US embassy!!

Raghavendra · Post by **Raghavendra** » 29 Mar 2011 09:37

sum wrote:A pink box that India would not give to FBI

India seems to have learnt of the lessons of the 93 blasts ( US and the Pak made timer).

Btw, what is this pink box??

Will america ever stop this charade of a investigation when it is truly sponsoring terrorism against India by sending its agents like david headley on recce missions for terrorists and at the same time providing expensive military weapons to a financially sinking islamist state of pakistan to prevent an Indian military response to pakistani state terrorism.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 29 Mar 2011 10:08

Raghavendra wrote:He has a business relationship with Karat family run communist news channel NDTV and both have started a NDTV-Hindu news channel which is available locally in chennai.

This channel I feel is also available via Tata Sky. One thing I noticed, is that in Wiki Leaks "The Hindu" *may not* be twisting the contents of the orginal cables etc. But these reports, should be re-read with the "Letters to the Editor" in The Hindu. Seeing lots of letters which sing praises the "principled stand" of the commies like Prakash Karat et. al

.

Commies, certainly can take a "principled stand" on any issue because they never have to take any action for any issues in the near future. It is very easy to sit and pontificate and give opinions on every case, when the onus is on some one else to take actions.

Christopher Sidor · Post by **Christopher Sidor** » 29 Mar 2011 11:18

sum wrote:India hangs up on hotline to Pentagon

One metric in the Pentagon's quest for a deeper military-to-military engagement with countries is their willingness to post permanent “liaison officers” at the headquarters of specified U.S. command centres. India is “covered” by the American military's Pacific Command (PACOM) based in Hawaii. Pakistan and points west fall under the “jurisdiction” of the Florida-based Central Command (CENTCOM).

I agree with resisting the posting of a "liaison" at PACOM unless one is given at CENTCOM. By refusing to give us a "liaison" at CENTCOM it seems that US wants us to be hyphenated with China. Maybe there is some truth in the claim that India is giving one hyphen (i.e. Indo-Pak hyphen) for another hyphen (i.e. Sino-India hyphen)

But this hot line to pentagon, is something that should not have been refused. It would serve our interests to have a hot line between the MoD and US DoD. If there are certain bureaucratic concerns, then MEA can to be roped in to assuage those concerns. It seems to keep everybody else happy (read certain international relations and domestic concerns) we are doing ourselves a disservice.

A Hot line is not an indicator of an alliance or alignment. It is just a means for two entities to interact with one other. And just because we have a hot line does not mean that we will assist US with every venture that it takes.

Nandu · Post by **Nandu** » 29 Mar 2011 11:38

krisna, the added quotes are simply appropriate and precise English grammar. The reporter is indicating that he is quoting verbatim from the cable. As I said, there is no ambiguity in this.

Raghavendra, I am quite familiar with the things you said about The Hindu, since they have been discussed many times on BRF. However, it has no bearing on whether this cable was reported accurately. We have the cable. We have the report. Just compare the two.

Raghavendra · Post by **Raghavendra** » 29 Mar 2011 12:07

Nandu wrote:Raghavendra, I am quite familiar with the things you said about The Hindu, since they have been discussed many times on BRF. However, it has no bearing on whether this cable was reported accurately.

So you agree The Hindu newspaper is a congress party dog but wont agree that its barks against the BJP was due to its master's command

Nandu wrote:We have the cable. We have the report. Just compare the two.

Reading the mentioned cable indicates the word opportunistic issue is interpretation by the American political counselor who met Jaitley. Why should jaitley be accused of saying words he has not said?

NDTV as usual is giving time to dawood ibrahim lawyer kapil sibal who keeps repeating the lies of The Hindu newspaper

Dont you see a pattern when 2 congress party owned dogs start barking the same tune?

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 29 Mar 2011 15:59

I think there are liaison officers posted at both PACOM and CENTCOM now, which is what we wanted... Maybe someone can confirm.

Arya Sumantra · Post by **Arya Sumantra** » 29 Mar 2011 16:14

Nandu wrote:krisna, according to the cable, it is Jaitley, not Blake, who characterized it as "opportunistic". There is no ambiguity there.

It's called reporting as fact where someone is putting words in the mouth. It is Blake's interpretation of Jaitley's comments that they are "opportunistic".

Klaus · Post by **Klaus** » 29 Mar 2011 17:37

Muppalla wrote: According to a diplomatic cable released by WikiLeaks, Chidambaram told US Ambassador Timothy Roemer that India would have registered higher growth rates 'if it were the south and west only', because 'the rest of the country held it back'.

This looks like one of those statements, which revisited a few decades later will give a person the same nostalgia as that associated with the now (in)famous term: "H**** Rate of Growth". At that time in the future, we will still have a few specimens taking pride in that statement by paying glorious tributes to the originator of the term without realizing the amount of insult and denigration associated with it. These people will also try to bring justification to the statements by ascribing present-day statistics to rid the statement of all negativity. We will also have a few souls aspiring and struggling to bring the true meaning and context out to light, fighting an uphill battle in the process.

Maram · Post by **Maram** » 29 Mar 2011 18:37

(quote="Muppalla"]
According to a diplomatic cable released by WikiLeaks, Chidambaram told US Ambassador Timothy Roemer that India would have registered higher growth rates 'if it were the south and west only', because 'the rest of the country held it back'.

I have something to confess. A few years ago, I had very similar views. Those were the heady days of Laloo/Paswan/Patnaik/Basu/Mulayam with the "MY" Card (Muslim/Yadav card.. in essence muslims and BCs/SCs and STs in a powerful political combine). These leaders made themselves prosperous leaving their constituents poor and illiterate.

Nitish Kumar's rule in Bihar has been a game changer. It shows that under proper leadership and administration, they can posper too. Lands that produced Nalanda and Takshashila to Babu Rajendra Prasad suddenly cannot become poor and illiterate.

The same can be said of Gujarat before Modi or Karnataka before Rama Krishna Hegde or AP before CBN(although my AP friends might disagree!). One leader can act as a catalyst for socially transforming Change. May be Chidu like myself might have had a change of opinion after Nitish ji's governance of Bihar.

Orissa/Jharkhand/West Bengal is India's current unproductive areas. Mamata's win in Bengal will galvanise Bengal again hopefully(although I have my doubts). Jharkhand and Orissa bother me, they are hot beds of naxalism, have very poor leadership(of any party), are poor and rampant corruption,nepotism and illeracy with high birth rates, these 2 states bother me....

Sorry, BRadmins This is bit of a deviation from the topic.. Apologies.

There are a lot of my friends and family who hold the view that Chidu holds. They will reconsidering their views post Nitishji's administration of Bihar.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 29 Mar 2011 19:20

JE Menon wrote:I think there are liaison officers posted at both PACOM and CENTCOM now, which is what we wanted... Maybe someone can confirm.

PACOM, I can confirm. This happened in c. 2005.

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 29 Mar 2011 19:56

Stalinist rapist goon yellow propagandists have so much other means of spreading their lies, half truth and propaganda that they dont really have to resort to deliberate wrong reporting of published facts. Selective amnesia (remembering what Savarkar said in 1910 and conveniently forgetting some sewage drinking *MK rowdy's words just a few years back), quoting 'anonymous' BJP leaders talking bad about their own party and not having any such sources in other parties, making it appear BJP is the only party that disrupts parliament without mentioning repeated disruptions of NDA era Parliament, failure to report violence by rapist goons, mass murderers and eye-gouger and their student organisations but playing up incidents involving ABVP, always quoting BJP leaders in third party with snide remarks and sacrcastic comments thrown in by yellow puppets etc. are more than sufficient examples of the rapist goon puppets yellow journalism.

Coming to Wikileaks, it has been reported that Madam Maino trusts the Beijing puppet Nandirgram rapist goons more than some regional satraps because they are 'pragmatic' and talk commie theory to 'keep their party faithful happy' but are 'flexible'....these words can be twisted, turned and reported in the exact same manner as Jaitley's words - that the so-called ideology is just a mask and for the consumption of faithful and not serious. Because the dynasty would not reached this conclusion or shared that with the Unkil's men had definite hints to this effect were not thrown in that direction by Beijing puppet traitors.

But did any rapist goon yellow puppet raise this issue? NO of course...

Sadly, BJP scores self goals and often misses golden opportunities. Classic example is when some of them issued certificates of positive journalism to mass murderer propaganda yellow journalists simply because they exposed the Congress lies in some matters.

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 29 Mar 2011 21:20

I heard (or read) somewhere that CENTCOM happened more recently...

And BTW, has anyone seen the direct quote of Chidambaram on the northern states holding growth back issue? Seems it is no more valid than the Jaitley "quote"...

I don't understand why "The Hindu" is not publishing the raw cables, and even more weirdly, why none of the other papers are making a ruckus about it...

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 29 Mar 2011 21:44

Keep watching wikileaks.ch for the raw cables. The raw cables about conversations involving Narendra Modi were released a few days back.