Pakistan arms sales, ops, doctrine, etc

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 16 Jun 2011 18:58

oh come on folks - stop building up myths about Bakis carrying C&C nukilar briefcases. Those will be papers, cash, lipstick etc. Maybe a pistole. Neither is Bakistan that sophisticated nor is Assphuck that powerful.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Jun 2011 19:03

hooya sir. I think even the US/Soviets are also not in such levels of apeshit alert, but hey it looks cool and presidential to be walking around with such kit and comms gear to talk to submerged nuclear subs...it may just be for show, but thats also a part of deterrence...like the red plumes of greek macedonian helmets, eagle feathers worn by american indian chiefs or the lacquered masks worn by samurai fighters

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 16 Jun 2011 19:11

actually POTUS moves around with briefcase (codename "football"?) not far from him, you can see it when he's getting in and out of marine one

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Jun 2011 19:13

thats not to say it really works

Pratik_S · Post by **Pratik_S** » 16 Jun 2011 19:15

I remember even our security personnel's protecting the PM carrying a similar briefcase. Saw it during the 26 Jan parade. Even I was puzzled to see such a thin briefcase. I think its used as a shield to protect the VIP's, it could be made of up bullet-proof material. But its just my guess.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 16 Jun 2011 19:19

most probably ballistic shield. kiyani sure needs it. "exploding mango days are here again........"

Sushants · Post by **Sushants** » 16 Jun 2011 19:22

Is there any source from where we can get data/names of all the paki military generals and important strategists in the past ?

Avid · Post by **Avid** » 16 Jun 2011 19:26

pragnya wrote:sorry if it's a repost -

US deployed three aircraft carriers to support Operation Geronimo (Updated)

interesting bits. even if pakistan had known about the mission, could they have opposed this??

Incidentally, in an unrelated but milestone development, USS George H W Bush is commanded by a lady officer, Rear Admiral Nora Tyson. It is the first time that a woman is heading a carrier strike task force, and the event also marks the centenary of US naval aviation.

DDM at work. Nora Tyson is not commander of USS George H W Bush. She is the commander of the Carrier Strike Group Two, of which the USS George H W Bush is part of. In other words, she is a much bigger fish who commands the strike group consisting of:
1 x Carrier
3 x Ticonderoga Class Cruisers
6 x Arleigh Burke Class Destroyers
1 x Perry Class Frigate

U.S. Navy carrier strike groups typically consist of an aircraft carrier (flagship), an embarked carrier air wing, at least one Ticonderoga-class guided-missile cruiser, and a destroyer squadron. As of 2011, Carrier Strike Group Two comprises of:

Carrier:
USS George H.W. Bush (CVN-77), flagship
Assigned Air Wing Squadron:
Carrier Air Wing Eight

Cruisers: [Ticonderoga Class Cruisers]
USS Vella Gulf (CG-72)
USS Monterey (CG-61)
USS Leyte Gulf (CG-55)

Destroyers:
Destroyer Squadron Twenty-Two (DESRON-22): [Arleigh Burke-Class Destroyers]
USS Truxtun (DDG-103)
USS Nitze (DDG-94)
USS Mason (DDG-87)
USS McFaul (DDG-74)
USS Mahan (DDG-72)
USS Cole (DDG-67)

Frigates: [Perry Class, 6 of which are to be transferred to PN]
USS Elrod (FFG-55)

This would be ARay's wet dream

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 16 Jun 2011 23:30

Here's an interview of a Paki pilot who claims their F-16 shot down RAF Eurofighters thrice in WVR combat. The first comment on that page makes things amply clear vis-a-vis the Paki's chest thumping. BS achievement. Link

But here's the interesting part:

On US export control practices:

They have ways of keeping an eye on the Block 52s without being personally present. The main concern is the transfer of cutting-edge technology - the avionics and radar, the Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System (JHMCS) the Sniper pod. They have put digital seals all the sensitive technologies, which can only be opened via a code, which only they know. If there is a malfunction or these parts need to be serviced, they will be taken out of the Block 52s and shipped back to the US for repairs/servicing. If we try to pry open these systems without the codes, inbuilt alarms will be relayed to the Americans, which will be a breach of the contract.

Q: Will the Americans be able to track the locations of the Block 52s through some sort of tracking devices hidden inside the aircraft?

A: If there are tracking devices then they will be inside the sealed systems, like the avionics suites or the sniper pods because we will not have the ability to look inside. If their Predator and Reaper drones are transmitting their GPS locations via satellite so can a Block 52 F-16.

Even though Turkey produces the F-16, there are some components that are manufactured in the US and only come to Turkey for the final assembly. In one incident, a Turkish Block 50 crashed and the pilot was killed. They salvaged the wreckage and laid it out in hanger and started putting together the pieces to find out the cause. They found a piece of sealed equipment which had cracked open and inside they found some device that looked like a bug. Upon inquiry, it turned out to be a tracking device.

How do they ensure the americans can't over ride manual control and play video games from Virginia?

Avid · Post by **Avid** » 16 Jun 2011 23:40

Dmurphy wrote:Here's an interview of a Paki pilot who claims their F-16 shot down RAF Eurofighters thrice in WVR combat. The first comment on that page makes things amply clear vis-a-vis the Paki's chest thumping. BS achievement. Link

But here's the interesting part:
On US export control practices:

They have ways of keeping an eye on the Block 52s without being personally present. The main concern is the transfer of cutting-edge technology - the avionics and radar, the Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System (JHMCS) the Sniper pod. They have put digital seals all the sensitive technologies, which can only be opened via a code, which only they know. If there is a malfunction or these parts need to be serviced, they will be taken out of the Block 52s and shipped back to the US for repairs/servicing. If we try to pry open these systems without the codes, inbuilt alarms will be relayed to the Americans, which will be a breach of the contract.

Q: Will the Americans be able to track the locations of the Block 52s through some sort of tracking devices hidden inside the aircraft?

A: If there are tracking devices then they will be inside the sealed systems, like the avionics suites or the sniper pods because we will not have the ability to look inside. If their Predator and Reaper drones are transmitting their GPS locations via satellite so can a Block 52 F-16.

Even though Turkey produces the F-16, there are some components that are manufactured in the US and only come to Turkey for the final assembly. In one incident, a Turkish Block 50 crashed and the pilot was killed. They salvaged the wreckage and laid it out in hanger and started putting together the pieces to find out the cause. They found a piece of sealed equipment which had cracked open and inside they found some device that looked like a bug. Upon inquiry, it turned out to be a tracking device.
How do they ensure the americans can't over ride manual control and play video games from Virginia?

Both of these have been posted and discussed.

The Typhoon claim is under discussion in the MRCA thread right now, and the quoted article was also in MRCA threads a few months ago and hotly debated (like all debates on BR, and in particular in MRCA thread).

Juggi G · Post by **Juggi G** » 16 Jun 2011 23:44

Pakistan’s General Problem

Magazine

Mohammed Hanif is the author of A Case of Exploding Mangoes (2008), his first novel, a satire on the death of General Zia ul Haq

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 16 Jun 2011 23:49

Ooops...sorry for the repost then. Mods please delete it if you can.

Luxtor · Post by **Luxtor** » 17 Jun 2011 02:55

^^^
For an army that has never ever won a war or any signifcant victory over any worthy opponent, why do all these puki generals wear all these decorations on their uniforms? Are these fruit salads on their uniforms indications of how many jihadis they have trained, how many innocent people they have killed, how badly they have screwded up their country...or even how many wars they have lost and how much humilation that they have endured in the hands of India, and now recently the Americans invading their country and killing OBL who was under their protection?

I think they're all looking up to see if there are any American drones in the sky that is about to bomb the musharraf out of them.

Avid · Post by **Avid** » 17 Jun 2011 03:34

Luxtor wrote:^^^
For an army that has never ever won a war or any signifcant victory over any worthy opponent, why do all these puki generals wear all these decorations on their uniforms? Are these fruit salads on their uniforms indications of how many jihadis they have trained, how many innocent people they have killed, how badly they have screwded up their country...or even how many wars they have lost and how much humilation that they have endured in the hands of India, and now recently the Americans invading their country and killing OBL who was under their protection?

I think they're all looking up to see if there are any American drones in the sky that is about to bomb the musharraf out of them.

Each medal for men and tanks lost in wars with India. Hush up medals

ajit_tr · Post by **ajit_tr** » 17 Jun 2011 04:41

PNS Babur attacked by Somali pirates!!!Why would pirates will attack any heavily armed navy vessel and virtually commit suicide????

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6s4kUTX7s9Y

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 17 Jun 2011 05:14

Just proves that the pirates are better equipped than the PN.

hires babar

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 17 Jun 2011 06:18

Luxtor wrote:For an army that has never ever won a war or any signifcant victory over any worthy opponent, why do all these puki generals wear all these decorations on their uniforms?

Why, they have won other battles. They conquered their own people in Balochistan several times, they killed, maimed and raped the enemies in East Pakistan in millions and drove out another 10 million to the neighbouring dar-ul-kafir, they bombed and shelled empty mud houses in FATA and impressed their Masters with their commitment to GWoT, they killed the infidels in Balawaristan and they have proudly supported the terrorists against the Indian infidels by assisting, funding and training them. Why can't they be awarded medals, land and cash for such a selfless effort for the Fatherland ? Would you even question the bravest of them all, Field Marshal Ayub Khan who awarded the title to himself ?

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 17 Jun 2011 09:30

US to replace two P3C Orion aircraft

SLAMABAD: The US has decided to supply two P3C Orion aircraft to Pakistan to replace the aircraft that were blown up in the PNS Mehran attack on May 22nd, 2011, diplomatic sources told DawnNews.

According to sources, the US will also be supplying F-16 aircraft and its spare-parts. Moreover, it is also expected that chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff Admiral Mike Mullen will soon be visiting Pakistan to convey US President Barrack Obama’s message, sources added.

prithvi · Post by **prithvi** » 17 Jun 2011 09:44

shravan wrote:US to replace two P3C Orion aircraft

SLAMABAD: The US has decided to supply two P3C Orion aircraft to Pakistan to replace the aircraft that were blown up in the PNS Mehran attack on May 22nd, 2011, diplomatic sources told DawnNews.

According to sources, the US will also be supplying F-16 aircraft and its spare-parts. Moreover, it is also expected that chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff Admiral Mike Mullen will soon be visiting Pakistan to convey US President Barrack Obama’s message, sources added.

WTF !!!

...guess some of our C-17 money going their way... !!

merlin · Post by **merlin** » 17 Jun 2011 11:09

prithvi wrote: WTF !!! ...guess some of our C-17 money going their way... !!

Precisely

rajanb · Post by **rajanb** » 17 Jun 2011 11:37

merlin wrote:
prithvi wrote: WTF !!! ...guess some of our C-17 money going their way... !!
Precisely

What me worry. As long as we can beat the $hit out of the Pakis.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 17 Jun 2011 12:13

i'd wait to see unkil's official announcement on the P3C's before we get too excited. so far the news is from paks, who have claimed all manner of things in the recent and not so recent past for it to be denied by everyone else

nits · Post by **nits** » 17 Jun 2011 12:17

Luxtor wrote:^^^
For an army that has never ever won a war or any signifcant victory over any worthy opponent, why do all these puki generals wear all these decorations on their uniforms? Are these fruit salads on their uniforms indications of how many jihadis they have trained, how many innocent people they have killed, how badly they have screwded up their country...or even how many wars they have lost and how much humilation that they have endured in the hands of India, and now recently the Americans invading their country and killing OBL who was under their protection?

I think they're all looking up to see if there are any American drones in the sky that is about to bomb the musharraf out of them.

wonder where Kiyani is looking... just checking if any Sucide Bomber coming his way...

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 17 Jun 2011 15:42

Singha wrote:thats not to say it really works

Most certainly one would never know if it works as expected or works partially unless there is a war but these countries certainly have elaborate C&C and EW system which are needed and are building blocks for such suitcase to work , else its pretty much useless , since the suitcase does nothing more then warn of a strike and delegate nuclear codes to General Staff and Nuclear command centers at the time of crises or more likely during Bolt from Blue strike situation.

There is an interesting story during Norway crises and perhaps the only documented one when the suitcase was first and only time employed by Boris Yelstin and that showed the suitcase worked as its suppose to.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/in ... 031598.htm

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Jun 2011 16:59

ajit_tr wrote:PNS Babur attacked by Somali pirates!!!Why would pirates will attack any heavily armed navy vessel and virtually commit suicide????

Me against my brother.

parshuram · Post by **parshuram** » 17 Jun 2011 17:04

NRao wrote:Just proves that the pirates are better equipped than the PN.

hires babar

That 's Pakistani Navy Destroyer Pirates are targetting .....Cool

Avid · Post by **Avid** » 17 Jun 2011 18:19

ajit_tr wrote:PNS Babur attacked by Somali pirates!!!Why would pirates will attack any heavily armed navy vessel and virtually commit suicide????
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6s4kUTX7s9Y

Lesson from the video: they really need to slow down and enunciate P-N-S Babur. I was watching the video when a colleague of mine overheard and said: "WTF did she say? Peni$ Babur?"

Avid · Post by **Avid** » 17 Jun 2011 18:24

shiv wrote:
ajit_tr wrote:PNS Babur attacked by Somali pirates!!!Why would pirates will attack any heavily armed navy vessel and virtually commit suicide????
Me against my brother.

They looked up Wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PNS_Babur_(D182)) found the Babur of adequate antiquity value and figured it was not too high tech for them to operate and add to their fleet of Mother Ships.

Raman · Post by **Raman** » 17 Jun 2011 18:46

Lesson from the video: they really need to slow down and enunciate P-N-S Babur. I was watching the video when a colleague of mine overheard and said: "WTF did she say? Peni$ Babur?"

You didn't hear right. He is paki. He was saying "peni$ barber".

anandsgh · Post by **anandsgh** » 17 Jun 2011 18:59

Raman wrote:
Lesson from the video: they really need to slow down and enunciate P-N-S Babur. I was watching the video when a colleague of mine overheard and said: "WTF did she say? Peni$ Babur?"
You didn't hear right. He is paki. He was saying "peni$ barber".

Amazingly enough, most of the so called Somali pirates looked to me, like mango abdul paki!! A Somalian/African face is easily distinguishable from (Sorry to use this term) "South Asian" face. Did anybody also had the same hunch??

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 17 Jun 2011 19:15

There were some Africans in the vid. However since the pirates escaped and were not killed I believe that they kicked the pakis musharraf. Wonder how long will PN last in Indo pak confrontation.

Mahendra · Post by **Mahendra** » 18 Jun 2011 01:25

Here goes my hypothesis

Somali pirates are just a front for the ISI led terror cum money making operation .

Somali pirates are being trained and equipped by the ISI. The PackeE-Coli Navy has proven terror credentials.

Somali pirates on the ISI's payroll will soon start exclusively attacking Indian interests, before this happens, PAckeeStan will stage a faked we are victims of piracy attack.

Klubs up the musharaff of pirate ships are the only answer. When the pirates start getting their 72s regularly the menace will come to an end.

Mahendra · Post by **Mahendra** » 18 Jun 2011 01:35

ajit_tr wrote:PNS Babur attacked by Somali pirates!!!Why would pirates will attack any heavily armed navy vessel and virtually commit suicide???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PackeE-c ... -burden-on -duniya

The Pirates must have read about the attack on PNS-Mehran, where 4 gunmen held the entire might of Pakistan's military for 14 hours and then escaped unscathed after damaging equipment worth 100 million and Ecch and Dee worth Trillions of khayali dollars.

Raghavendra · Post by **Raghavendra** » 18 Jun 2011 08:18

Pakistan Navy dirty political game over rescue of sailors; trying to save face after Taliban defeated them in PNS Mehran

Pakistan Navy dirty political game over rescue of sailors
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c89P5XFEfwQ

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 18 Jun 2011 08:53

Raghavendra wrote:Pakistan Navy dirty political game over rescue of sailors; trying to save face after Taliban defeated them in PNS Mehran

This is the exact thought I had, plus the need to improve morale by pretending to have stood up to enemy India in a non event. Pakiness to the core

vic · Post by **vic** » 18 Jun 2011 09:37

I was just wondering on the status of Pak MPAs

Atlantiques – Originally 4 – only one in service which is 40 years old and not upgraded? 1 shot down and 2 in storage.

P-3s – Originally 3 (or is it 4?) out of which 1 crashed and 1 (or 3?) is functional? Upgraded (?) – airframes around 30 years old. Additional 7+1 (or 10?) . The spare one to be used for spareparts and not upgraded. Remaining 7 upgraded “partically”. 2 lost, so Pakistan would have around 5 effective P-3s MPAs?? or would it be 12?

ajit_tr · Post by **ajit_tr** » 18 Jun 2011 10:37

sorry posted in wrong thread.

wig · Post by **wig** » 18 Jun 2011 11:35

bakis protesting!

Pakistan has lodged a protest with India over an incident in which an Indian warship allegedly brushed with a Pakistani frigate escorting an Egyptian-owned ship that was recently freed by Somali pirates after the payment of ransom.

The protest was lodged with the Indian High Commission in Islamabad over the "serious incident" that occurred yesterday, a statement issued by Foreign Office spokesperson Tehmina Janjua said last night.

The Indian Navy warship Godavari "not only hampered humanitarian operations being carried out by Pakistan Navy Ship Babur for (Egyptian) Merchant Vessel (MV) Suez but also undertook dangerous manoeuvres, which resulted in the brushing of the sides" of the two warships, the statement alleged.

http://www.ptinews.com/news/1689485_Pak ... s-frigate-

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 18 Jun 2011 17:55

PN needing to show mardangi after mehran episode... nothing to see here folks, move along now...

Guddu · Post by **Guddu** » 18 Jun 2011 22:27

satya wrote:Regarding the photo:

1) Security guy/commando( extreme left of photo ) with some sort of automatic seem bulk up around his stomach or sort of beer belly/pot belly type guy .? Is he wearing some sort of vest below his khaki or just tht he is TFTA with Big Belly ?

2) ADC with briefcase again same carrying a bit more bulk than necessary around his belly?

Am i seeing wrong or this is normal for TSPA officer cadre even young ones if its so am very surprised seem like thullas of desh police . Assuming both the man with gun n with briefcase at most of major rank still in IA officers in rank of major dont seem to carry such heavy bellies other than ASC types

Perhaps its a diaper...be prepared and all that.