J&K News and Discussion-2011

[shyamd]

Basically, it just further confirms that TSPA is doing everything to provoke India and hit the peace talks. Question is why?? What is TSPA so afraid of? I think its trade.

We are lucky afghanistan is on the boil. Otherwise we would face a kargil situation without a doubt as US is weak.

[svinayak]

We are lucky afghanistan is on the boil. Otherwise we would face a kargil situation without a doubt as US is weak.

During Kargill in 1999 India could not strike across the border since it was peace time.
But now after 911 all bets are off and India can strike anywhere to defend any aggression.

[ramana]

On to Skardu!

[V_Raman]

not after 911. but after 26/11

[svinayak]

Even after 911

[uddu]

A war by Pakistan is inevitable. How much MMS wish for Pakistan's prosperity, he will be seeing Pakistan attacking India in the near future. With his wish to see Pakistan prosper, I think he will not be anticipating a Pakistan attack any time soon. But when they attack, it's going to be a rude shock for MMS.
I still don't understand why the GOI is so apologetic when they talk about Pakistan.
Some minister was saying we must trust Pakistan and being the spokesperson of Pakistan.
Another was seen saying we live in a geography that's very troubled, dragged in countries from Bangladesh to Bhutan to claim that there is trouble everywhere. And also quoted the famous MMS view of a prosperous Pakistan. The opposition is good? Ah The guy starts with saying, we also want to see a prosperous Pakistan but...
I don't understand, how can a secular India see a prosperous religious Pakistan? There must not be any Pakistan, simply because our ideologies clash. Pakistan is a religious, fundamentalist nation and we are a secular democratic nation.
And what action being taken by GOI to destroy the nation of Pakistan from our neighborhood? The more time it stays the more trouble for India and the rest of the world. Covert or overt, doesn't matter. But Pakistan must not exist in this world.

[Airavat]

LeT wiped out in Doda belt: IGP Jammu

IGP Jammu Dilbagh Singh said Salman and his associate were gunned down at Nagni, Keshwan after a day long encounter. With their killings, the LeT outfit has been eliminated in entire Doda belt comprising Doda, Kishtwar and Ramban districts, he added. Troops of 11 Rashtriya Rifles and police jointly conducted the operation this morning. Recoveries made from the scene of encounter included one AK-47 rifle, three magazines, 134 rounds, LeT letter heads, other literature, uniforms used by Salman, explosive devices strategic maps of Doda and Kishtwar and other belongings of the militant.

Salman was Lashkar chief for Doda and Kishtwar districts and had direct liaison with Pakistan based commanders of the LeT outfit. His intercepts revealed that he had been trying hard for induction of some cadre in Doda and Kishtwar from the Kashmir valley but had failed. Dilbagh Singh said some cadre of Hizbul Mujahideen were still active in Doda, Kishtwar and Ramban districts. Efforts were on to eliminate or apprehend them, he added.

[Jarita]

What's got Al Jazeeras goat - they've created a section on Kashmir and have extremely biased reporting

[sum]

Of course, the locals tried their best to help the turds but failed:
4 militants killed in anti-insurgency operations in JK

Civilians tried to forcibly enter the area where an encounter was taking place at Putchal village in Pulwama of south Kashmir trying to help the escape of the trapped militant, police said.

Mohammad Rafiq, a police official, said security forces laid a siege around Putchal village on Wednesday night.

“The operation was launched on a specific information that militants were present in the area,” he said.

An encounter followed exchange of fire between the militant and the police, but local people pelted stones at policemen engaged in the operation. Police reacted with shells and cane charging at the stone throwers.

Rafiq alleged that the civilians disrupted the operation and were saving the militant,whose identity could not be established, but he was eventually killed. The extremist was identified as Shakoor Ahmad Teli, divisional commander of Lashkar-e-Toiba.

[sanjeevpunj]

^^^These villagers are so ignorant, IMO, they will simply die in cross fire.I admire the courage and steadfastness of our forces, its such a thankless task.Something the kashmir government (J&K CM listening?)must do is educate these ignoramuses about which side to be with, and try to understand not to get into crossfires like silly heroes.

[sanjeevpunj]

What's got Al Jazeeras goat - they've created a section on Kashmir and have extremely biased reporting

Al Jazeera is the voice of the Middle East, they wouldn't do anything that upsets their finaciers in Saudi.I have always suspected Saudi hand in the Kashmir issue, using Pakistan as proxy. I might be wrong, it could be Iran and Saudi.

[shiv]

http://www.kashmirdispatch.com/headline ... ashmir.htm

Six militants, including three Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT) commanders were killed in four different gun-battles across Jammu and Kashmir, officials told Kashmir Dispatch here on Thursday.

They said Army’s 11 Rashtriya Rifles and Special Operations Group (SOG) of police early this morning intercepted LeT militants in Kashwan forest area of Kishtwar district. The joint team, they said, asked the militants to lay down their arms. However, the militants turned down the offer and opened fire on the joint team.

“In the exchange of fire, LeT’s Divisional Commander, Habib Gujjar alias Salman and his deputy Irshad Ahmad was killed,” Army’s 16 Core spokesman, Lt Col Arora said.

[shravan]

Jammu and Kashmir: Two jawans beheaded by militants
http://indiatoday.intoday.in/site/story ... 47238.html

In a barbaric incident, which has shocked army officials, Pakistan-trained militants beheaded two soldiers and dumped their bodies during an encounter to check infiltration attempt near the Line of Control (LoC) in Kupwara district of Kashmir late last month.

It is suspected that the militants killed the jawans from the 20 Kumaon regiment, beheaded the duo and reportedly retained their heads as war trophies.

But, the army officials are not willing to accept the tragic story, as it might have an impact on the morale of the armed forces waging anti- terror operations in J& K. A jawan of 19 Rajput, who was part of the patrol party, also died in the cross- fire.

A senior Army official, requesting anonymity, disclosed that the two men of Kumaon regiment were killed and their heads were chopped off. Their bodies were also mutilated, he said.

The incident happened around Pak foreign minister Hina Rabbani Khar's visit to the country, in the last week of July, disclosed the officer.

The martyred soldiers were identified as Havildar Jaipal Singh Adhikari and Lance Naik Devender Singh.

The details of the third jawan, from 19 Rajput, couldn't be ascertained.

The soldiers were cremated on Wednesday at their native places in Pithoragarh and Haldwani districts of Uttrakhand.

A state police officer, who was present at the cremation of Devender Singh, confirmed that the bodies were badly mutilated and not shown to relatives. The Army authorities informed that the heads were blown away during the fierce encounter, he said.

Lance Naik Devender Singh's uncle also admitted that the bodies weren't shown to the family members, and so did a 20 Kumaon regiment official. Militants fired rocket propelled grenades at the jawans, killing them on spot and blowing off their heads, the official said.

[sanjeevpunj]

This has to be met with retaliatory action,the stupid talks going on are just nonsense, which we keep falling for all the time.

[ManishH]

Special US Resolution vindicates stand of KPS: Panun Kashmir

Expressing satisfaction over introduction of a special resolution on Kashmiri Pandits in the US House of Representatives, Panun Kashmir today said the resolution has vindicated their stand that the community is a victim of terrorist violence, aided and abetted by Pakistan.

"We express deep satisfaction over the introduction of a special resolution on Kashmir and Kashmiri Pandits in the US House of Representatives by influential Democratic Congressman, Frank Pallone," Panun Kashmir, organisation for displaced Kashmiri Pandits, President Ashwani Kumar Chrungoo today said while addressing the executive council meeting.

The resolution was introduced yesterday by Pallone. This historic resolution in the US law making body vindicates the stand of the organisation that the Kashmiri Pandits, against whom acts of genocide and ethnic cleansing took place in their ancestral habitat, are the main victims of terrorist violence, aided and abetted by Pakistan, he said.

Frank Pallone is a great friend of India and has always supported the Indian cause in the US, he said.

We are thankful for introduction of the current resolution in the US House of Representatives which condemns the terrorist and extremist violence in Kashmir, lack of religious freedom and human rights violations committed against the Kashmiri Pandits, he added.

Pallone had insisted in his resolution that terrorist infrastructure in the region must be dismantled and the terrorists held accountable for their actions, he said.

The resolution moved by Pallone reflects his deep understanding of the historical and cultural moorings of the Kashmiri Pandits as the original inhabitants of Kashmir, he said.

The government should take lead from the resolution and appropriate and proactive measures must be taken against terrorism and also ameliorate the suffering of the Kashmiri Pandits who have been living as refuges in their own country for the last two decades, he said.

[SSridhar]

Jammu and Kashmir: Two jawans beheaded by militants
http://indiatoday.intoday.in/site/story ... l[quote]In a barbaric incident, which has shocked army officials, Pakistan-trained militants beheaded two soldiers and dumped their bodies during an encounter to check infiltration attempt near the Line of Control (LoC) in Kupwara district of Kashmir late last month.

It is suspected that the militants killed the jawans from the 20 Kumaon regiment, beheaded the duo and reportedly retained their heads as war trophies.

[/quote]
This is very, very sad and my humble salute to the martyrs and their families. This is certainly a combined operation of the PA and the HuJI. Ilyas Kashmiri is reported to have done a similar thing and presented the head as a trophy to Gen. Musharraf.

[Anindya]

http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_in ... ts_1573273

Targeting the intellectuals, academicians and journalists for participating in conferences organised by ISI conduit Ghulam Nabi Fai, several experts on Jammu and Kashmir issue today said that Pakistan had managed to fight a low cost war against the country with their help.

"Pakistan has managed to fight a low cost intellectual and propaganda war with the help of India's intellectual class against the country through Fai," said Dipankar Sen Gupta, Jammu University professor and Kashmir expert while deliberating on the issue of Fai-Indian intellectual links at a seminar at Press Club here today.

....
Speaking on the occasion, another Kashmir expert professor ML Koul said that malaise of internal subversion is such that it has almost crippled the policy making process particularly on the issues of national security.

"Fai's arrest in America has only brought out a facet of the problem which has infected the cross section of opinion makers in India.

"Hobnobbing with the agencies (Fai and ISI) of inimical country and masquerading as peace activists, peace individuals living in India have done irreparable damage to the national interest," Professor Koul said.

President of the Jammu Bar Association (JBA) BS Salathia lashed at the experts, peace makers who participated in the Fai's seminar and said that this is the time to isolate such individuals and not to allow them to influence policy making in India.

He said policy making in India should be insulated from subversive influences and this should be prime task of security agencies.

Speaking about the nature of subversion which has afflicted a section of political class in India, Chairman of Panun Kashmir (PK) Ajay Chrungoo alleged that those Indians who have been now exposed to be in ISI-Fai subversive circuit have been operating for years as track-2 lobbyists, emissaries and interlocutors not on the behalf of Pakistan but on the behalf of government of India.

"These persons are entrenched in the system and weaning them out is a critical task for all Indians. Those Indians who have been on the ISI circuit have also been on the US circuit," Dr Chrungoo said.

All of them who have taken part in the Fai's seminars have no commitment to India's unity which they have highlighted in their speeches and seminars, he alleged.

[arun]

^^^ Rats, Foiled! Was going to X Post the same article here. Cheers.

[arun]

X Posted from the Indian Army News and discussions thread.

Chindits: Soon After Indo-Pak Talks, Pakistan's Border Area Team (BAT) Behead Indian Soldiers In Kupwara's 19 Div----Rajput Regt In Question

According to the sitrep (situation report), it mentions four soldiers being beheaded.

Jammu and Kashmir: Two jawans beheaded by militants
http://indiatoday.intoday.in/site/story ... 47238.html

A senior Army official, requesting anonymity, disclosed that the two men of Kumaon regiment were killed and their heads were chopped off. Their bodies were also mutilated, he said.

The incident happened around Pak foreign minister Hina Rabbani Khar's visit to the country, in the last week of July, disclosed the officer.

The story started by Suman Sharma on the beheading of Indian Soldiers and carried thereafter among others by India Today has been flatly denied by the Indian Army.

All this is starting to leave me to wonder if this was another attempt by Suman Sharma to boost traffic to her blog after the previous attempt of boosting traffic by claiming that she would make available first pictures of the Arihant to a chosen few lucky souls

Any way back to story on the beheadings being debunked and Major General Sanjeev Madhok., Additional Director General (Public Information) on the matter:

"The story is incorrect with respect to beheading (of soldiers). It belittles the sacrifices made by our soldiers and is also hurting the feeling of families and the Army".

From Here:

Beheading row:Army rejects report

[Anindya]

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 521945.cms

SRINAGAR: They were supposed to prepare a roadmap for settling the Kashmir issue. But today, with open disagreements among them, the three Central interlocutors are apprehensive of visiting the state and facing local media questions. Because one of the panelists, M M Ansari, refuses to withdraw his remark against his colleague, Dileep Padgaonkar, criticising him for attending conferences organised by Kashmiri American Council. KAC's executive director Ghulam Nab Fai was arrested by FBI last month for alleged financial links to Pakistan's ISI.

"The revelation that Mr Padgaonkar attended an ISI-backed conference and Radha Kumar went for a similar one in Brussels damaged our credibility. In their place, I would've quit," Ansari said recently. In response, Padgaonkar said, "When I was the editor of The Times of India, my sub-editors represented a spectrum of political views, from extreme Left to Right. But once the editor decided, it was the party line. We are on track and shall submit our report to the government."

The interlocutors have cancelled at least two visits to the Valley since the Fai controversy broke out. The question being raised here is whether, owing to their differences and the failure to meet their objectives, the team has outlived its utility. In fact, even Union Home Minister P Chidambaram's interventions have failed to solve down their problems.

Be it the timing of their visits or the places they went to, their political stances or even the amount of airtime hogged by each interlocutor, little they have said or done inspires people's confidence any more. For most people in Kashmir, the Central team is now largely irrelevant. This includes both mainstream and separatist camps. On their last visit here, the three weren't even able to meet Chief Minister Omar Abdullah.

Problem is in absence of a political mandate, nobody in Srinagar or Delhi believes that they matter; a belief sources say the interlocutors share. "They are just waiting for the formalities to get over, just churn out some document and get it over with," said a government source.

The Congress has distanced itself from the panel, careful that the Fai-ISI link doesn't taint it. "They were appointed by the Home Minister. They advise him. If this can improve things, I'll be happy," said J&K Congress chief Saifuddin Soz. From being appointees of the Union government mandated with providing a roadmap for Kashmir, to advisers to the Home Minister, seems a quick demotion.

Radha Kumar said all is well. "Conflict resolution isn't easy. The road is long and hard and as we have seen sometimes nasty. We are still working together despite the differences and shall complete our task," she said.

That "task" is beset with problems. A source said the team's general formula seems to be bending towards increased autonomy for the state as a whole to placate the separatists. This would make parties like the BJP unhappy. "If a political settlement includes genuine devolution of powers to the regions, the demand for abrogation of Article 370 will lose its sting," says the interim document submitted by the panel to Chidambaram. The separatists say it's a backdoor attempt to divide the state and will be resisted. But for all this the three will have to visit Srinagar.

[Anindya]

Another article on the same issue, but this one is by Sankarshan Thakur - who on Kashmir issues is not that far from Ved Bhasin's viewpoint...

Team gives two-pronged solution for Kashmir

[vera_k]

So both the Hindus on that interlocuter panel have been cosying up to the ISI, while the lone Muslim is holding fort against them. And why doesn't the Home Minister replace the two people who are causing the logjam? Or is the intent to have the panel produce two reports - one by Ansari and another one by Kumar and Padgaonkar?

[RamaY]

Hindus by name, (sic) seculars by faith.

[Tumba]

^^^These villagers are so ignorant, IMO, they will simply die in cross fire.I admire the courage and steadfastness of our forces, its such a thankless task.Something the kashmir government (J&K CM listening?)must do is educate these ignoramuses about which side to be with, and try to understand not to get into crossfires like silly heroes.

they are doing thr part in JeeHard ... ... a lesson should be taught next time these Haramis come in between ... a big regretful collateral damage ...

[sum]

The interlocutors have cancelled at least two visits to the Valley since the Fai controversy broke out. The question being raised here is whether, owing to their differences and the failure to meet their objectives, the team has outlived its utility. In fact, even Union Home Minister P Chidambaram's interventions have failed to solve down their problems.

Atleast Amir-khan inadvertently caused this good thing of the sicular panel to be virtually disbanded..

[A_Gupta]

Any idea what he's talking about?
Tweets from a Delhi-based journalist from Kashmir:

When a mentally retarded man becomes a commander of LeT, you can safely assume that the Indian army has lost their brains. #Shame #Kashmir

And when the Army claims that they were involved in a 12 hour long gunbattle with a retard, there is likely involvement of shady agencies

And when d CM comes out tweeting dat justice vl be done, expect him to use all his resources to offer cover to the real culprits #Kashmir

And when the separatists come out demanding human rights and justice, label them Pakistani agents and troublemakers. Crush dissent #Kashmir

Random arrests followed by rape of a woman followed by custodial Killing and now fake encounter. This is called reconciliation #Kashmir

[sanjeevpunj]

^^^ probably keeping himself safe by voicing anti-India sentiments as long as he is kashmir.

[jamwal]

You probably read it wrong. That moron must be Kashmiri muslim based in Nai Dilli. It's amazing how much lies they can shout in public and still get away with

[shyamd]

basically in the past, there were incidents were the CBI had indicted police officers for the fake encounter but the army had managed to get away without any disciplinary measure.

[A_Gupta]

You probably read it wrong. That moron must be Kashmiri muslim based in Nai Dilli. It's amazing how much lies they can shout in public and still get away with

Twitter is as much a means of info. exchange as the regular news media. Quite a few opinion makers tweet and follow on twitter. This kind of stuff is currently going under the radar. It needs to be countered, in my opinion.

[A_Gupta]

http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/a ... 337343.ece

In another major embarrassment to the security establishment and the coalition government of Jammu and Kashmir, a Special Police Officer (SPO) and a Territorial Army soldier are believed to have stage-managed an encounter killing of a mentally retarded civilian, who they claimed was the “divisional commander” of the Lashkar-e-Taiba.

Official sources told The-Hindu that the civilian was picked up by SPO Abdul Majid and Territorial Army soldier Noor Hussain and taken to the forest in Surankot in the border district of Poonch on Saturday. They told the police and the 25 Rashtriya Rifles about the presence of the “dreaded terrorist” in a hutment in the area. Subsequently, an operation was launched to eliminate him.

The sources said he was killed instantly, but both the police and the Army continued firing for many hours. “His face was riddled with bullets, which would mean that he was killed from a short distance,” a informed source said.

When the body was being taken for the final rites, it was found that the deceased was not a Muslim. “People informed the police,” the sources said. They immediately questioned two informers. They told the police that he was a mentally retarded person whom they nabbed and arranged to be killed. The SPO said he wanted to be regularised as a constable and the soldier wanted a cash reward of Rs 2 lakh.

Ironically, an officer of the rank of Brigadier briefed the media on Sunday and declared that the “militant” was Abdu Usman, a “divisional commander” of the LeT. He also said that a pistol, a pair of binoculars and other materials were recovered from his possession.

[ramana]

A-Gupta, You will note that the SPO and The TA soldier were questioned by the security establishment upon being inofrmed of the miscarriage and the truth found out. It was thsoe two people who misused their power for their own gains.

The Brig was misled into making the announcement by the informers.

How is this an embarassment for the establishment except in the Hindu paper's eyes?

[rohitvats]

Recently read a 2006 paper submitted by US Army Major as part of his thesis in some command course in US.

The topic was CI Ops in J&K. Pretty well researched and quite frank and open - it openly says that the Pakistan funds terrorists and provides all the support. Has relied extensively on writings by Indian authors - both ex-military and academia.

Check this: http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA428962

A good primer for anyone trying to get handle on CI Ops w/o having to read detailed books on the subject.

Small excerpt:

The idea of an independent J&K was destroyed during the first week of October
1947, when Muslim rebels from J&K and Pakistani regular army forces on leave,
disguised as tribesmen, started a revolt among the Muslim population (Asthana 2001, 61;
Ganguly 1997, 9-10). Initially, this uprising was successful and captured the territory that
is presently considered occupied Pakistani Kashmir, which includes the city of
Muzaffarabad. Rebel forces then consolidated gains and attacked Srinagar, the summer
capital of Kashmir, thus directly threatening the J&K government. These attacks resulted
in atrocities committed against the Hindu minority throughout Kashmir and a direct threat
to the Maharaja’s rule, which forced him to reach out for military assistance from the
former colonial ruler, Lord Mountbatten, and the new Indian government in New Delhi
(Asthana 2001, 60-61). The new Indian government was hesitant to fulfill the Maharaja’s
request, since without an official request for accession into the new country of India that
was ratified by the people of J&K, the Indian Army could not legally respond (Rajawat
2003, 7-9). Lord Mountbatten, the British Colonial magistrate, and India’s new Prime
Minister Nehru finally agreed that the Indian Army could deploy because of the rebellion
5
in J&K, and that after the situation was secure the vote on accession into India or
Pakistan would take place (Ganguly 1997, 10).

[Suppiah]

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 540413.cms

Intra-intellectual clash...Radha Kumar wants to quit the Kashmiri panel...she does not want to accept any payment for interlocuters? Strange, she seemed to have no issues accepting tickets and other money from Fai without checking on his background and obvious anti-Indian bias, but has problems taking it from GOI!

[sanjeevpunj]

^^^^Dharma Sankat!

[Stan_Savljevic]

Radha Kumar went to Brussels, so it was not Fai, it was that Tramboo character who funded the show. Dileep Padgaonkar went to NYC for the Fai show.

[JE Menon]

I've seen Radha Kumar on TV wiping the floor with a Pak commentator as only an uber-liberal academic who has taken the moral burden of India, the world and a bit of the universe on her shoulders can do. I mean, calmly and with no real sign of emotion except one of yogic calmness she tore the guy several new ones. Unfortunately, I'm quite sure she will attempt the same with anyone who trespasses her moral redlines...

My thoughts? She must have been quite cute at one time.

[R_Kumar]

Recently read a 2006 paper submitted by US Army Major as part of his thesis in some command course in US.

The topic was CI Ops in J&K. Pretty well researched and quite frank and open - it openly says that the Pakistan funds terrorists and provides all the support. Has relied extensively on writings by Indian authors - both ex-military and academia.

Check this: http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA428962

A good primer for anyone trying to get handle on CI Ops w/o having to read detailed books on the subject.

I didn't find it 100% neutral. If I am not wrong there were pre conditions for plebiscite one of them was - withdrawal of Pakistani army from pok which never happened. But in this paper this is what he says

“The Plebiscite is the 1948 United Nations resolution
that called for internationally supervised process whereby the future status of the state of
J & K shall be determined in accordance with the will of the people” (Bose 2003, 39).
However, India refused to allow a free vote, fearing that the Muslim majority would vote
to join Pakistan (Schofield 1996, 24-27). As a consequence, neither side withdrew its
forces from the region, thereby splitting Kashmir in two

In-fact there are lots of false/incorrect information in this paper.

[Stan_Savljevic]

He is quoting Victoria Schofield, one of the beneficiaries of the Fai bandwagon . Its like six degrees of separation.

[abhishek_sharma]

‘I will not attend any meetings with Mr Ansari’: Radha Kumar

J-K: Differences among interlocutors delay report