Indo-UK News & Discussion 9th Aug 2011

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 03 Oct 2011 03:15

Wait a go, Jaimen! I think the stuff at the end of his first message, about bombing Afghanistan, forced the removal of the message, but that could be wrong. The Guardian's policy may simply be to filter out comments that are too pro-India( man, what an horrendous thing to be, pro-India, that wicked, expansionist, militaristic, imperialistic, super-exploitative, self-glorifying India).

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 03 Oct 2011 05:28

^^^Whatever, any 'newspaper' that gives space to the Rundirty Roy types becomes as useful as used toilet paper instantly.
Wouldn't waste energy on such lost causes. However, alsways good to know there are Jaimens out there with the patience, fortitude and forbearance to read A-rundi's bilge and yet keep nausea at bay enough to articulate such brilliant ripostes only. jai ho.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 03 Oct 2011 06:23

The story now have been picked up by FP magazine where Isalmist Bashrat Peer is doing his Ummah duty. Roy's Red Green cabal will now show its coordinated presence in India , WEST and ME.

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 05 Oct 2011 18:38

Taj Mahal could collapse within five years because wooden foundations are rotting

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z1ZunCbaEG

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 05 Oct 2011 21:11

the lefty/liberal UK guardians opinion on India & Afghanistan

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/oc ... fghanistan

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 05 Oct 2011 22:21

So what is the Guardian suggesting India do? Do they have any ideas? Suppose someone in the Indian government, or academia, were to ask this newspaper, "What would be the best course of action, where India can have trade with Afghanistan, and where India can support the movement to a more liberal, pluralistic country in Afghanistan'. Is a hands off policy the best course, keeping these intentions in mind? What would be the best guarantee of peace and stability, India not being there at all? Because you can forget about that.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 05 Oct 2011 22:34

Varoon Shekhar wrote:So what is the Guardian suggesting India do? Do they have any ideas? Suppose someone in the Indian government, or academia, were to ask this newspaper, "What would be the best course of action, where India can have trade with Afghanistan, and where India can support the movement to a more liberal, pluralistic country in Afghanistan'. Is a hands off policy the best course, keeping these intentions in mind? What would be the best guarantee of peace and stability, India not being there at all? Because you can forget about that.

British too have to look after pakis. When bakistan unravel, the failure of two-nation theory can burden masks off justified barbarism.

From Best-selling, even after 70 , about Narendra Singh Sarila's magnum opus "The Shadow of the Great Game: the Untold Story of India’s Partition (2005)"

The core of Sarila’s argument was summed up in one pithy paragraph: “Once the British realised that the Indian nationalists who would rule India after its independence would deny them military co-operation under a British Commonwealth defence umbrella, they settled for those willing to do so by using religion for the purpose. Their problem could be solved if Mohammed Ali Jinnah, the leader of the Muslim League Party, would succeed in his plan to detach the northwest of India abutting Iran, Afghanistan and Sinkiang and establish a separate state there — Pakistan. The proposition was a realisable one as a working relationship had been established between the British authorities in India and Jinnah during the Second World War and he was willing to cooperate with Britain on defence matters if Pakistan was created.”

British are far from the being as clean as clean suits they wear.

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 05 Oct 2011 22:41

"British are far from the being as clean as clean suits they wear."

Absolutely, but why are Indian spokesmen so weak, slow-witted and hesitant to project this fact i.e the British role in Islamic intransigence and separatism? Why are we not hearing this idea widely stated, barring the odd very sharp, principled, honourable Brit( or Canadian, French, Dutch whatever), who really stand out among the idiots or slimebags.

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 06 Oct 2011 15:01

>>Absolutely, but why are Indian spokesmen so weak, slow-witted and hesitant to project this fact i.e the British role in Islamic intransigence and separatism?

What do we have to gain from it, precisely and in concrete terms? Apart from the satisfaction of thumbing our noses at the people who ruled over us for a couple of centuries...broadly speaking.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 06 Oct 2011 16:14

If we want to hurt the Brits we ought to highlight at each and every opportunity how they let the Pakistanis and the Sri Lankan Tamils down, while using British Indians and their money to push the UK Politics in the direction of anti-Islam and anti-Pakistan!

Lathi-charge from both sides!

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 06 Oct 2011 16:19

when the policies written about in that excellent book were formulated, britain still believed that it had a role to play in post ww2 power balances. it was rudely awaken when the US took over western hegemony in its entirety and reduced britain and france to sideshow roles by 1956 (suez crisis). then on, britain and france fundamentally shifted from a global mindset to a eurocentric mindset in strategy and policies with only aspirational involvement in a wider role. the US took over all global matters and these former powers had to agree by and large. indians still mostly assume that the britain of 1947 is the britain of 2011. whilst some continuity remains (and i am sure hari will remind me shortly) there is a fundamental shift between then and now in how these former powers deal with the wider world - and who calls the shots. any pampering britain does of pakistan will be driven more by domestic considerations (thanks to the large and troublesome pakistani minority living in the UK) and not some grand desire to still rule the waves. (incidentally, the RN now has more admirals than it does ships...)

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 06 Oct 2011 16:49

Al-Guardian is run by a bunch of numpties and followed by hordes of blerts. Look at the comments section there. Daily Mail comes across as sensible in comparison.

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 06 Oct 2011 17:40

"Al-Guardian is run by a bunch of numpties and followed by hordes of blerts. Look at the comments section there.."

True, however did everyone notice the supportive comment, by way of sarcasm, from a reader with a very Vietnamese sounding name.

The other quick witted and accurate statement people, including Indian spokesmen, should make is that there is absolutely nothing left-liberal, progressive or uplifting about supporting, defending or mitigating Islamic fanaticism, terrorism or separatism. India is more truly left-liberal than the entities it is opposing, and the idiots and slimebags in the UK who support or excuse those groups.

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 06 Oct 2011 18:07

Varoon,

The al guardian and it's readers are good at criticsizing everything, they will engage in the most petty point scoring. The readers, writers and commentators engage in student style diatribes against anything and everything.

They offer no solutions, they are just a bunch of handwringing dhimmi cowards. They support anyone/thing as long as it is anti-western/Israeli/Indian.

The good news is that if islam ever took over the UK, they would be amongst the first to die, hung from lamposts and shot like dogs in the streets, just like the Iranian leftists were after the 1979 revolution.

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 06 Oct 2011 18:15

Haresh wrote:Varoon,

The al guardian and it's readers are good at criticsizing everything, they will engage in the most petty point scoring. The readers, writers and commentators engage in student style diatribes against anything and everything.

They offer no solutions, they are just a bunch of handwringing dhimmi cowards. They support anyone/thing as long as it is anti-western/Israeli/Indian.

The good news is that if islam ever took over the UK, they would be amongst the first to die, hung from lamposts and shot like dogs in the streets, just like the Iranian leftists were after the 1979 revolution.

Rather, they would be the first to renounce their faiths (if they have any), accept the "glorius religion of peace" and do all including pontificating and supplicating to curry favours with their new masters.

This breed is worse than jihadis in many ways.

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 10 Oct 2011 15:41

More fawning over pakistan from the weak, pathetic al guardian.

Also another dire opinion piece on India

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... opia-bluff

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 10 Oct 2011 17:46

Haresh wrote:The good news is that if islam ever took over the UK, they would be amongst the first to die, hung from lamposts and shot like dogs in the streets, just like the Iranian leftists were after the 1979 revolution.

Pakislam and UKstan deserve each other. Time the Frankenstein went back to live with its parent due to hard ekhanomic times...

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 10 Oct 2011 18:32

sorry I forgot the link!!!

More fawning over pakistan from the weak, pathetic al guardian

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... bush-folly

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 10 Oct 2011 18:40

Guardian should rename itself Barbaadian or G**nduan.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 11 Oct 2011 20:39

1993 Mumbai blast accused Iqbal Mirchi detained in London:

he had sought permission to live in London from the British home office and was granted the same. He was reportedly living in Essex town of Hornchurch in the UK...

Born on 25th April 1950, Mirchi is wanted in India for several crimes including his role in the 1993 serial blasts. According to a UN report Mirchi is currently ranked amongst top 50 global drug barons.

Link rediff.com October 11

How is it that UK where human rights are tomtomed is sheltering a bloody terrorist since long.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 11 Oct 2011 21:11

vishvak wrote:1993 Mumbai blast accused Iqbal Mirchi detained in London:

He will not be extradited to India because now there will be a circus in UK about India's human rights and capital punishment.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Oct 2011 22:01

HMG seems to specialize in this niche competency of sheltering major league criminals from all around the world - from fugitive russian oligarchs, to drug and arms dealers, terrorist PR agents, swindlers, .... often for no political benefit but the custodian fees of their bank accounts and financial wheeling dealing cuts. supports a good sized pyramid of high street retailers, luxury car dealers, wine merchants , realtors, jewellers, whores, bankers, personal trainers, doctors....

its a unique competitive niche in the world economy just as the Swiss specialize in sheltering ill-gotten capital.

to some extent the tax shelters like monaco also offer a base for financial crooks but seldom the kind of vile creatures the UK loves to nurture.

bart · Post by **bart** » 11 Oct 2011 22:12

Haresh wrote:sorry I forgot the link!!!

More fawning over pakistan from the weak, pathetic al guardian

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... bush-folly

MKB seems to be posting there under the pseudonym of 'Skintaj'.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/discussion/us ... ts/Skintaj

No seriously.

Lisa · Post by **Lisa** » 11 Oct 2011 23:08

RajeshA wrote:
vishvak wrote:1993 Mumbai blast accused Iqbal Mirchi detained in London:
He will not be extradited to India because now there will be a circus in UK about India's human rights and capital punishment.

I am not sure that this is strictly true. UK courts recognise India as a
democracy and accordingly effect extradition requests as does India. As
you will see from article below no such attempt.

http://ibnlive.in.com/generalnewsfeed/n ... 54012.html

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 12 Oct 2011 11:39

Singha wrote:HMG seems to specialize in this niche competency of sheltering major league criminals from all around the world - from fugitive russian oligarchs, to drug and arms dealers, terrorist PR agents, swindlers, ....
...
seldom the kind of vile creatures the UK loves to nurture.

Is that atypical for a first world country? There are Swiss with criminals stashing their loot and jailing whistle-blowers. Now here is UK that 'extends banking facilities' to nefarious.

So can the King and the Queen be blamed for this? Usually no one takes any blame on own but atleast there is a parliament in UK. Especially when neither the monarchy not the parliament in UK understands sentences like '1993 Mumbai blast accused Iqbal Mirchi'... so where does the buck stop?

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 13 Oct 2011 21:12

More lefty liberal crap from the al guardian.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 13 Oct 2011 21:36

[quote=]1993 Mumbai blast accused Iqbal Mirchi detained in London: he had sought permission to live in London from the British home office and was granted the same. He was reportedly living in Essex town of Hornchurch in the UK...[/quote]

Can we hope that the British Home Office is declared a terrorist organisation? Indian agencies should have no collaboration with this organisation. Any diplomatic/tourist visas for British nationals must be refused until they prove they aren't associated with this government agency.

Klaus · Post by **Klaus** » 15 Oct 2011 08:15

British defence secretary Liam Fox resigns.

Cameron said Fox had helped prevent Libyans being "massacred" by Muammar Gaddafi's forces and had done a "superb job" since the Conservative-Liberal Democrat coalition came to power after elections in May 2010.

Cameron thanked Fox - Britain's sixth defence minister in ten years - for overseeing "fundamental changes" at the bloated Ministry of Defence and in modernising the armed forces as part of wider government cost-cutting.

It was the al-guardian which first raised questions about Fox's connections with his best man and the private venture started by him.

joshvajohn · Post by **joshvajohn** » 28 Oct 2011 16:30

It is good to see that there is mind to reform the royal family as a commonwealth head. It is essential to also add other churches including Catholic and other churches as part of 'state church' besides the Church of England. The state Church should also include the concept of including Hindu and Muslim reps as part of wider groups rather than simply take one church as the state Church. this will help people feeling part of this country and become more active in contributing towards a better growth of Britiain and people. India is a country where these things can be learnt from!

Lisa · Post by **Lisa** » 30 Oct 2011 23:51

Singha wrote:HMG seems to specialize in this niche competency of sheltering major league criminals from all around the world - from fugitive russian oligarchs, to drug and arms dealers, terrorist PR agents, swindlers, .... often for no political benefit but the custodian fees of their bank accounts and financial wheeling dealing cuts. supports a good sized pyramid of high street retailers, luxury car dealers, wine merchants , realtors, jewellers, whores, bankers, personal trainers, doctors....

its a unique competitive niche in the world economy just as the Swiss specialize in sheltering ill-gotten capital.

to some extent the tax shelters like monaco also offer a base for financial crooks but seldom the kind of vile creatures the UK loves to nurture.

HMG protects no one, the courts do. They have an amount of
independence that can only be described as frightening. They alone act as
interpreters of law and act as the finally body of opinion within the UK.

Lets start at the beginning. The UK is unique, it has no codified law unlike
all other counties. In India like most the rest of the world Napoleonic code
is used to establish your rights.

The UK has NO bill of rights and unlike the rest of the world you are not
told what you can do but what you cannot. The devil is in the detail if you
re-read. Furthermore, there is also virtually no written constitution and like
all laws, utility is based upon precedence.

Sometime back the UK decided to adopt the European Union's Human
Rights legislation. End result, the courts enforce it to the letter even when
its interpretation is contrary to HMG needs, e.g. the attempts over the last
9-10 years to establish "Control Orders" which would have individuals who
have terrorist leaning to be detained in the public interest. Repeatedly
every attempt to lock these individual up has been complicated by the
court system.

One more example. Read the two articles below about how a piece of
legislation in use by several European counties is deemed illegal in the UK
using legislation that also applies to the these same European counties!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... judge.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/colu ... clear.html

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 31 Oct 2011 11:30

From blog - Britain – The Rise of a Pirate Empire
An interesting blog on rise of English on piracy, slavery, loot for about 300 years.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 03 Nov 2011 19:30

Did you kafirs observe this?

Beebs removed South-Asia tab and calls it Asia now

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/

Kaliyugam is coming to an end.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 03 Nov 2011 19:36

vishvak wrote:From blog - Britain – The Rise of a Pirate Empire
An interesting blog on rise of English on piracy, slavery, loot for about 300 years.

the spanish have long referred to the english as pirates

Haresh · Post by **Haresh** » 04 Nov 2011 15:08

Indian poverty levels higher than Pakistan's, says UN report

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... eport.html

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 04 Nov 2011 15:37

Haresh wrote:Indian poverty levels higher than Pakistan's, says UN report

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... eport.html

When Pakistan has not conducted a census from God knows, how does this worthy organisation come up with such a report. For those who do not know results of Pakistan 1998 census had been delayed since the data seemed unreliable and 2008 census delayed indefinitely. i.e last census conducted, So the government of Pakistan does not have the relevant data.

UNDP can hardly count themselves, which means they have pulled the nos out of their Musharaf.

and Pakistan has repeadlty lied about GDP etc.

So lets treat Hogwash as Hogwash.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 04 Nov 2011 16:36

in addition to the above, it says more about UN's shoddy practices and telegraphs' unseemly glee than it does about poverty figures in India. take this report with a truckload of salt.

remember the WHO report in the earlier part of 2000's that India was on the brink of an AIDS epidemic ? 10 years on it is not even a minor issue and the 'experts' have all gone hiding into the woodwork.

coming to the figures, for India they are based on a highly controversial methodology * which is not used elsewhere, which means even people who are not considered poor elsewhere would be considered poor in India. is not the official figure AFAIK. for pakistan, less said the better. unless UN has been conducting nationwide surveys in secret in the most dangerous country on earth, I have no idea how they came up with those figures.

* for example http://articles.economictimes.indiatime ... india-mpce
surveys show Rural India spending more on FMCG and services while the methodology claims poverty has increased.

if UN thinks it is publishing reliable data when it says that there is less gender equality in pakistan than in India, well, no wonder it is an irrelevant organisation.

the last official poverty data pre dubious recommendations came from the planning commission in 2004-2005.
http://planningcommission.nic.in/news/prmar07.pdf page 4 and 5.
the figures came out to 27% and 21% according to two separate broad based poverty estimate methodologies. this was 6 years back, all other indicators point out that poverty has lessened in those years, anyone who lives in India with open eyes has witnessed the same.

out comes the recommendations of the controversial tendulkar committee and the poverty figures rise up to 33%. very well, perhaps it's better to err on the side of overestimation.
not satisfied with that, the NAC under sonia gandhi and her cronies has arbitarily raised the BPL estimate to 40 %.

so there you have the story. in 10-15 years this level of poverty won't be there anymore in India, UN and telegraph will have to find something else to beat India with then.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 05 Nov 2011 22:04

UNDP error: UNDP Human Development Report 2011 lists India has having 86.3 births per 1000 women in 15-19 age group. http://censusindia.gov.in/vital_statist ... rates.aspx (2003) rate as 46.1.

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 05 Nov 2011 22:09

Rahul M-saar, this is a fine shield to wield. I mean, there is a HUGE, HUGE risk in showing poverty has gone down in India - we will see a second round of East India Company type looting and we have only a handful of our own East India Companies. Things like that money-plundering European item-number called F1 Grand-Prix etc are just the beginning of the new wave of such looters. Now some babu in Delhi can wave this UN report if some such showy european entert-turd comes floating our way and say "we cant afford"

So I welcome this report. "We are like this onlee. Pakis are richer than us. Sure saar"

(it is going to get more hilarious soon when Bernie Ecclestone-robberbaron types will duke it out with the UN report wavers like Telegraph. THAT is a real show this injun would relish

)

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 05 Nov 2011 22:12

true nairgolis sahab, I do think along those lines but my problem is when injuns swallow those lies and become despondent.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 05 Nov 2011 22:31

UNDP Human Development Report uses percentage of women in the national parliament as a measure of gender equality. India scores poorly at only 10.7% (e.g., Pakistan has 21%). But this kind of measure ignores, e.g., the 1+ million Indian women exerting influence in panchayats.
http://infochangeindia.org/women/news/p ... patis.html