Tracking Errors in Defence reporting

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 30 Apr 2011 18:25

At least they have shown fighters and not Boeing 747.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 09 May 2011 06:17

Cross post

VinodTK wrote:Failure to locate crash site raises security questions
Sukhoi-30 and ISRO’s mapping provided seven probable sites of the crash of the ill-fated helicopter. Two such sites were inside the territory of Bhutan. Naga GG in West Kameng district was identified as the most probable site.

But the wreckage of the helicopter carrying Khandu and four others, which went missing on Saturday, was found in Luguthang area in Tawang district on Wednesday. The place was not on the list of the probable sites.

The article is an ignorant one IMO. It says "Su-30s could not find crash site, therefore they will not be able to find enemies who hide there". Reminds me of the time when I changed the position of my pillow and that night there was an earthquake killing 10,000. I blamed myself - if only I had left the pillow where it had been..

To me the flawed logic is more an indicator of the freedom to reach erroneous conclusions, but I do not blame the writer of the article entirely for being stupid. I think there has been collective negligence on the part of the government, defence forces and the MoD is failing to educate people on the difficulties that defence forces face in relation to terrain.

I believe that most people in India including the media are informed about the military only in rudimentary terms "Bandook hai. Shatru ayega, goli maarenge" ("have gun, enemy will come, will fire"). This is fundamentally true but it is about as much as a 5 year old child understands. Most people rarely gain any more knowledge than this.

With our education system geared towards preaching that we must love everyone even if he is a rapist murdering neighbor, we ignore the finer points in military general knowledge about camouflage, deception and how terrain and weather matters. Currently Bharat-Rakshak is the only place anyone can come to in order to reach a better understanding. For a country of 1.2 billion people this is pathetic. Teaching the public about the military is not seen by the GoI as its job. The military don't see it as their job - they have a job to do and it's not public education. The MoD is a set of babus.

Like an infant who plays with a toy in his hands even as he relieves himself into his diaper, both body functions go on simultaneously. The hands do their job. The bladder does its job. But the infant is unaware of what or why. India the nation is infantile. The armed forces do their job. The public have no clue other than some rudimentary idea. And in the absence of any serious attempt to teach Indians of what the military is or does the public and media go about reaching their own idiotic conclusions.

Jamie Boscardin · Post by **Jamie Boscardin** » 10 May 2011 19:52

^^
Shiv,
I believe there was a reason they deployed the SU30's to try and identify the possible location of the wreckage both in case of YSR and AP CM.
My question was basically to know:
1. What capabilities the SU's have for which they are been advertised and used for these kind of mission. Assuming that when they are assigned a mission they would not be working on passive mode radars.
And so if they are been deployed, what are the results to show? If it is none, then is there a problem or it is just that deploying them was more of a stunt?

I am trying to learn more on this and would appreciate your insights.

abhishekm · Post by **abhishekm** » 14 May 2011 12:30

Yet another extreme case of DDM-itis on display today. Watch out for the segment by India TV on the Vijayee Bhava exercises taking place in Rajasthan and note the following unpardonable errors:

1. The reporter (first name is Manish- I don't know his surname) jumps on top of a BMP-7 and refers to it as a T-90!
2. Then he moves over to a T-90 and identifies it as an Arjun tank!!
3. Next he heads over to the 7 man infantry complement which rides with the BMP and calls them an artillery team!!!
4. Lastly, the voiceover done by a lady reporter claims that among other aircraft, the IAF is fielding MIG 35s for the exercise !!!!

There might have been more of this rubbish but I had collapsed with shock half way through the segment.

IMHO all DDM should be banned from covering military exercises until they display at least a basic understanding of the military.

Gurneesh · Post by **Gurneesh** » 17 May 2011 23:19

Proudly posted on the Chindits Blog

abhishekm · Post by **abhishekm** » 19 May 2011 18:44

Gurneesh wrote:

For those who did not believe my rant against India TV's defence correspondent- looks like the DDMitis disease is spreading! Look at the caption to the picture in Gurneesh's post above. Even Suman Sharma and DNA is now mis-identifying a T-90!

chackojoseph · Post by **chackojoseph** » 19 May 2011 19:32

Surface launched medium air to air missile. Must be from Skunk works.

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 30 May 2011 10:05

http://epaper.hindustantimes.com/Galler ... 1008021002

T-20 tank!!

Shrinivasan · Post by **Shrinivasan** » 30 May 2011 14:20

Chindu is reaching new depth in it reporting...
http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/a ... epage=true

Shouldn't it report the fact that "India Controls the Siachen Glacier and Pakistan wants it type...."
instead it launches into a long winded drivel... this is funny

On Pakistan Army’s advances in the glacier in 1984, India launched Operation Meghdoot and deployed its troops in most of the dominating features in the area.

I thought the Comrades in Hindu atleast did a Grammar check if not check for accuracy. India was weeks ahead of the Pukes in occupying Siachen Glacier which is an integral part of the J&K state.

Also it states...
“The AGPL is not clearly marked beyond the grid reference point of NJ—9842. The two countries have decided to de-militarise the Siachen Glacier, but the matter is stuck as there are apprehensions on both sides,” officials said.

If two countries have decided to demilitarise (probably they forgot to tell DM A.K. Antony) then what are the thousand soldiers doing in Siachen, playing marbles.

They seem to have just picked up this write-up from Paki Blog/handout.

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 03 Jun 2011 17:28

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 711245.cms
"India is in the process of developing its own BMD system and has carried out six tests in the last two years, of which four have been successful."

When did the two failure happen? If the target missile did not take off, should it need to be reported as a failure of BMD?
Can BR members write to DDM's, explaining them their mistakes. Please post it here as well. The more funny, it is, it's better for us to have a laugh at it as well.

abhishekm · Post by **abhishekm** » 08 Jun 2011 15:50

DDM is on a roll yet again. Instead of just describing the specifications of the “world’s deadliest anti-tank missiles”, an unidentified correspondent from Rediff.com decided to impart his own pearls of wisdom:

"Infantry is crucial for the frontline defence of nations around the world. As technology evolved, these assault vehicles have grown faster and deadlier".

DDM probably thinks a regular infantry guy has got four wheels and heavy armour plating. DDM also thinks that humans (i.e. infantry) can transform into machines (i.e. assault vehicles) like in the Transformers movie.

“The armour-plating on the combat vehicles too has seen numerous upgrades over the decades, As lethal they are for their enemies, they too have their nemesis”.

Does this sentence even make any grammatical sense?

“Armour-piercing missiles have been making life miserable for most infantrymen, especially tankmen”.

DDM probably doesn’t know that there is a separate armoured corps as distinct from infantry. Yet another sentence which sounds very stupid because of poor writing.

For the full article see http://www.rediff.com/news/slide-show/s ... 110608.htm

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 22 Jul 2011 00:02

Shiv Aroor had a photo of Israeli Arrow launch with heading along the lines of "Zomg!! Is this the first picture of Prahaar?!"

If a non-defense, non-journo like me, who have a full time job which has nothing to do with defence, can realize within a second that it is the Arrow, what are the so called defence hacks doing? Without even a cursory check using tools like Google search-by-image or Tineye?

Thankfully the blog post has been taken down -- not before it got pushed to RSS readers.

abhishekm · Post by **abhishekm** » 25 Jul 2011 16:54

Good for nothing DDM can’t get anything right. Check out this quote from rediff.com on Indian Army’s celebrations to commemorate victory during the Kargil war (http://www.rediff.com/news/report/kargi ... 110725.htm):

The presentation was witnessed by officers and soldiers, who are currently posted at Drass, and by those officers and soldiers who were part of the Indian Army during the war. They were drawn from the Northern Light Infantry and the elite commando unit Special Services Group.

According to the glorious DDM, our brave Indian army soldiers who fought and died at Kargil were drawn from Pakistan’s Northern Light Infantry and Special Services Group! This is the height (pun intended) of stupidity. Henceforth, all DDM who commit such macabre errors should be sent to live with the troops in Siachen for a period of 4 months (preferably from November-February).

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 25 Jul 2011 18:19

This is the HEIGHT!

Leave alone re-checking teeny weeny details, they can't even get their basic facts right! I wonder HOW they enter the media field

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 25 Jul 2011 18:26

PTI, as expected. the patron saint of moronic DDM.

Shrinivasan · Post by **Shrinivasan** » 26 Jul 2011 08:15

abhishekm wrote:Good for nothing DDM can’t get anything right. Check out this quote from rediff.com on Indian Army’s celebrations to commemorate victory during the Kargil war (http://www.rediff.com/news/report/kargi ... 110725.htm):

The presentation was witnessed by officers and soldiers, who are currently posted at Drass, and by those officers and soldiers who were part of the Indian Army during the war. They were drawn from the Northern Light Infantry and the elite commando unit Special Services Group.

According to the glorious DDM, our brave Indian army soldiers who fought and died at Kargil were drawn from Pakistan’s Northern Light Infantry and Special Services Group! This is the height (pun intended) of stupidity. Henceforth, all DDM who commit such macabre errors should be sent to live with the troops in Siachen for a period of 4 months (preferably from November-February).

Sometimes the reported would have got it right, the blessed editors would have cut it out to make space for an advertisement. They would have seen a sentence about NLI / SSG from Pakistan were fighting in the guise of Mujahideen. the WKK would have thought, let us not damn our beloved pakis and chopped it off... they are all DDM.

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 02 Aug 2011 16:51

MiG 21 Crash

Cross Post. TOI shows the pic of the LCA. If you bother watching the report, the reporter keeps saying there have been lot of crashes for want of anything better to say. He also says there have been more MiG 21 'crashes' in Feb this year.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 16 Aug 2011 07:46

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/178 ... orial.html

The MIG 23 fighter craft which turned the tide of the war in 1965 war at Longowal, according to a source here has been brought here from Halware in Ludhiana.

Errors:

Hunters not MiG 23
1971 not 1965
Longewala not Longowal
Halwara not Halware
Halwara is in Ludhiana? That is new geography.

The reporting could not be more shoddy and ignorant.

Gurneesh · Post by **Gurneesh** » 16 Aug 2011 08:37

But Halwara is in Ludhiana (district) !!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halwara

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 16 Aug 2011 08:48

Gurneesh wrote:But Halwara is in Ludhiana (district) !!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halwara

Whoops. I could be a good defence reporter then

sum · Post by **sum** » 13 Sep 2011 15:39

Bollywood's Air Force Connection

The latest to develop wings is Shahid Kapur as Squadron leader Harrinder Singh aka Harry in father Pankaj Kapur's directorial debut, Mausam.

Among many other firsts, it also gave the fit and fabulous 30-year-old a rare opportunity to fly an M-16 jet fighter aircraft. So delightful was his experience, even with some objection from Indian Air Force over a few scenes, Shahid gushed how he would liked to become a pilot if he wasn't already a movie star.

F-16+M-2000 = M-16 in DDM language.

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 13 Sep 2011 22:37

^ Either that or they confused M-2000 with M-16 assault rifle.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 14 Sep 2011 06:03

" with some objection from Indian Air Force over a few scenes" Naturally there is no need to tell the readers what those objections are.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 14 Sep 2011 11:50

I hope the reporters who went Hammer and Tongs at the IAF a few years ago will now apologize for their poor reporting and conviction of IAF by Media.

Anjali's allegations were at Amit's behest

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 23 Nov 2011 23:49

x-posting from Indian Army News and Discussion thread....

sum wrote:DDM at its finest:
Operation Sudarshan Shakti in Dec

Close to 300 tanks and 250 heavy artillery guns will blaze fire for 15 days in the western front next month as the Army and Indian Air Force (IAF) would engage in a massive war-game, Operation Sudarshan Shakti, in the desert.

The exercise would help the Army’s Bhopal-based 21 Corpse to validate some of the new technologies it acquired in the last four years since its last major exercise, Dakshin Shakti.

The guns and tanks will be handled by 15000 troops from 21 Corpse, who would be supported by the IAF’s south-western command. The 15-day exercise would commence on December 1.

The exercise would take place in a theater of 175 km x 150 km area covering Barmer, Jaisalmer, Pokhran and Pachpadra, said an officer from 21 Corpse.

Both T-90 and T-72 tanks along with heavy duty guns would be in action in the exercise, the built up for which had began since September end.

Senior officials in the Army headquarters, however, ruled out any connection between the exercise and the recent developments across the border as the exercise was planned two-three years ago.

Pakistani government has been duly notified about the war game, which would take place 150-200 km away from the border. While the exercise will be based on the integrated theatre battle concept, its main purpose is to validate the new technologies like digitised control of artillery fire, battlefield surveillance and other equipment, which was acquired in the last four years.

None were tested in an integrated manner in a battlefield scenario although individually they pass the muster. This is the first time that the armed forces are going to test its new capability-based tactics in a battlefield scenario.

Yup zombies will be validating stuff to be used by IA.

abhishekm · Post by **abhishekm** » 05 Dec 2011 17:27

The DDM would now have us believe that our MIG 21 aircraft possess AWAC capabilities:

http://www.rediff.com/news/slide-show/s ... 111205.htm

The exercise also involves operation by aircraft such as Su-30 MKI, Jaguars, Mig-27 and Mig-21 AWACS and helicopters

I'm waiting for the day when they will say that T-90 tanks can be used as drones.

Shrinivasan · Post by **Shrinivasan** » 06 Dec 2011 03:01

abhishekm wrote:The DDM would now have us believe that our MIG 21 aircraft possess AWAC capabilities:
The exercise also involves operation by aircraft such as Su-30 MKI, Jaguars, Mig-27 and Mig-21 AWACS and helicopters
I'm waiting for the day when they will say that T-90 tanks can be used as drones.

Probably they missed out a comma. but with DDM anything is possible.

Ajit.C · Post by **Ajit.C** » 08 Dec 2011 11:29

Zee news,

Naval Air Stations will soon have UAVs
Last Updated: Wednesday, December 07, 2011, 18:17 2213 0 Tags: Naval Air Stations, UAVs, Tamil Nadu Chennai: As part of modernising the Navy, the southern peninsula will soon have Unmanned Aerial Vehicles in Naval Air Stations in Tamil Nadu.

"We will have Unmanned Aerial Vehicles (UAV) soon, maybe by next year. They will be based in the air stations in Tamil Nadu," a senior Naval official told reporters on board INS Shivalik here today.

Navy has two naval air stations in the state - INS Rajali at Arakkonam and INS Parundu at Uchipuli.

The Navy had joined hands with the Coastal Security Group of Tamil Nadu Police and Indian Coast Guard in educating fishermen along the Tamil Nadu coast on the importance of International Maritime Boundary Line, the official said.

"We have seven units in the state and they are educating the fishermen in their regions. It looks like it's working and the incidents of crossing the border is coming down," he said.

On Indian Navy's part in tackling sea piracy, he said the force was part of the international co-ordination of navies and has been given a stretch of 500 nautical miles in the Gulf of Aden.

"In this convoy system, we tell them (international co-ordination centre) when our ships will be on either of the sides and that information will be given to the civilian ships that are crossing the area. Usually, we take with us some 15 ships safely to the other side," the official said.

Earlier, the Navy conducted an exercise with six naval warships - INS Ranjir, INS Ranjit, INS Ranvijay, INS Shivalik, INS Kirch and INS Airavat, as part of the Navy Week celebrations off the Chennai coast in the Bay of Bengal.

Co-ordinated by Rear Admiral H C S Bisht,Flag Officer Commanding-in-Chief, Eastern Naval Command, the naval exercises including jackstay and simulated gun firing that lasted for almost the two-and-a-half hour sailing for 54 km.

"After 26/11, everybody is more sensitive to the threat (through the sea) and so we have security forces exercises. We are co-ordinating with all the agencies of the government," Rear Admiral H C S Bisht said.

He said the navy was expecting the indigenous aircraft carrier which is now being built to join the force soon, apart from INS Vikramaditya being built in Russia.

Ajit.C · Post by **Ajit.C** » 08 Dec 2011 13:48

Times of India-Day in pics-Indias Naval Prowess

School children walk on an Indian Naval Ship (INS) Airavat, an amphibious assault vessel designed to launch troops on enemy beaches, during the Navy Week celebrations at the Khidderpore Docks in Kolkata. (TOI Photo)

The picture shows P-64-INS Karmukh

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 08 Dec 2011 14:27

Ajit.C wrote: Co-ordinated by Rear Admiral H C S Bisht,Flag Officer Commanding-in-Chief, Eastern Naval Command, the naval exercises including jackstay and simulated gun firing that lasted for almost the two-and-a-half hour sailing for 54 km.

Ajit, you didn't point out what the error was here. The error is that the FOC-in-C Eastern naval Command is now Vice Admiral Anil Chopra, since 31 Oct 2011. Link

Ajit.C · Post by **Ajit.C** » 08 Dec 2011 14:55

Nachiket-Thats true, but Adm Bisht is FOC-Eastern Fleet not FOC in C.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 19 Mar 2012 20:02

sigh

successfully completed their 49 week gruesome training in the Officers Training Academy

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NEWS/news ... wsid=17400

Gaurav_S · Post by **Gaurav_S** » 20 Mar 2012 15:15

5,000 Pinaka rockets to be produced every year

These rockets, with a payload of 100 kgs, have a striking range of 40 kms and can bring devastation around 500 kms of surrounding areas of the target.

I hope this is a typo. But no one even bothers to proof read. However, I doubt if they will see error even if they proof read it. It's not that hard to make it out how a rocket with 40km range and 100kg payload can have effect till 500km. This is from Zee news.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 22 Apr 2012 14:09

The Missile that Cannot Fire
Long delays, cost escalation damage DRDO's reputation

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 22 Apr 2012 14:13

^^From the above article.

"DRDO has a history of claiming foreign designs as its own, like the Arjun tank which is a derivative of the German Leopard,
says a source in the agency.

You can expect nothing more than utter bullcrap from IT these days. Of course, the farticle has absolutely nothing about any missile that "cannot fire".

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 22 Apr 2012 14:19

Austin wrote:The Missile that Cannot Fire

Austin why are you posting that farticle everywhere? There is nothing about any missile in it. It's just one of the regular DDM hit jobs where the title has nothing to do with what is inside.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 22 Apr 2012 14:45

Just posted in Missile dhaga for the record , As for the sum and substance of article goes thats the authors views.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 22 Apr 2012 14:53

If i am not wrong and we had discussed it on other boards , Germans were initial employed as consultants for Arjun and hence the design owes many similarities with Leo 2AV design , Kunal who took pictures of Arjun internal turret space during Defexpo this year mentioned that the internal ammo lay out is similar to Leo.

prahaar · Post by **prahaar** » 22 Apr 2012 16:47

DRDO having employed German consultants is open news, employing consultants does not justify the crap sentence in IT. IT is losing objectivity fast, if not lost already.

sum · Post by **sum** » 22 Apr 2012 18:41

DRDO has a history of claiming foreign designs as its own, like the Arjun tank which is a derivative of the German Leopard

WTF is wrong with IT these days?

The aircraft on which the radar is mounted-a modified Embraer EMB 1451-is imported from Brazil. drdo had to resort to the Embraer aircraft because its own efforts at producing an indigenous carrier had ended in disaster. Project Guardian Airawat was stalled in 1999 when its HS-748 turboprop aircraft crashed, killing eight crew members-engineers, scientists and Indian Air Force (IAF) officers-on board.

Which indigenous carrier is he talking about?

And why is the effort of having made a AESA radar being rubbished like this?