India-EU News & Analysis

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 10 Mar 2012 10:22

The white skinned vultures are gathering. We should extradite the eyetalian marines provided that eyetaly promises to give them the death sentence as per our laws

Fishermen's killing: EU suggests 'bilateral track' to resolve India-Italy row

BRUSSELS/COPENHAGEN: European Union (EU) foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton has said the EU is "ready to work closely" to help resolve the issue of two Italian soldiers jailed in India for killing two Indian fishermen.

"In terms of what happened in India I've already had conversations with the Italian government, my door is always open, we're always ready to support," she told journalists Friday at an informal gathering of EU foreign ministers in Copenhagen.

"For many countries often there is a bilateral track that is pursued and can be successful," she advised.

"But the EU and the (EU) delegation on the ground (in New Delhi) and myself are always there, and I've already discussed this with the government and we're ready to work closely to see what we can do," she added.

Hopefully the norwegians with their well known and ever green sympathy for controversial killers will pitch in next, after all they have had ample experience in srilanka, no?

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 10 Mar 2012 10:36

eyetalian mardangi take a hit yet again? What would the eyetalians have contributed? ferraris??
After not being able to "handle" "piddly" India, they have been rogered by the brits too.

Italian 'rage' at Britain over botched hostage rescue bid

ROME: Italian premier Mario Monti held a security committee meeting on Friday as anger spread over Britain's failure to consult Italy before approving an attempt to rescue an Italian and Briton in Nigeria.

The interministerial committee for the security of the Republic (CISR) was meeting to reconstruct the events of the failed British and Nigerian operation to save Franco Lamolinara and Chris McManus, who were kidnapped last year.

"The tragic episode in Nigeria is unbelievable. The Italians are clearly humiliated," said Antonio Puri Purini, columnist for the Corriere della Sera newspaper, which spoke of the government's "rage" over the diplomatic incident.

"It is an unacceptable slap in the face and saying sorry is not enough," it said.

Monti was only informed by Britain once the blitz was already underway and the Repubblica described the "dramatic phone call" with British Prime Minister David Cameron in which Monti demanded "details on exactly what happened."

g.sarkar · Post by **g.sarkar** » 11 Mar 2012 13:10

http://www.samachar.com/Custody-row-Nor ... fcifd.html
"Custody row: Norway authorities seek legal guarantees from India
Stavanger, Norway: In what seems as yet another obstruction in the custody battle of one-year-old Aishwarya and three-year-old Abhigyan, Norwegian child welfare authorities have sought fresh legal guarantees and assurances from India on "urgent basis".
The two children have been in foster care since May last year after child welfare officials in Norway decided that their parents - Sagarika and Anurup Bhattacharya - were negligent. After the India government's intervention, the authorities had agreed to recommend to a court in Norway on March 23 that the children be placed in the custody of their uncle Arunabhas Bhattacharya. "It has been concluded that care of the two children should be awarded to the brother of the children's father enabling him to take the children back to India," a statement released by Norway's Child Welfare Service (CWS) last month read.
But in a fresh letter written to the embassy of India now, the CWS has asked for legal documents guaranteeing that appropriate care and treatment would be given to the boy who has special needs. They have also sought assurance that the children's uncle would continue to be their legal guardian in India. These documents, they say, ought to be submitted at least one week before the court hearing, failing which the children will have to stay on in Norway. (Read letter here)....."
Gautam

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 11 Mar 2012 16:37

Sanjay wrote:That is good advice.

I reiterate that right now, the legal cards are held by us. Even the jurisdiction point is being heard by the Kerala Court. If they do their jobs properly, no problems should arise despite the Italian bray-fest.

The less the Indian Federal Government does at this stage, the better.

One of my former Prime Minister's had a comment "let the donkey bray" for situations like this.

The question remains, will the Kerala police deliver a strong case ?

Sachin, your views welcome as you know them better than any of us.

There is a crucial bye election in Kerala on the 17th of March in Piravom. The present government is on life support and desperately needs that seat.

Many are estimating that the present government will reveal it's true colors and cardinal connections (!) after that election onlee.

The two eyetalians will be home bound within the week after that election. Some token money for the unfortunate family will change hands publicly as much more is already rumored to have changed hands.

a_kumar · Post by **a_kumar** » 12 Mar 2012 01:52

What is up with Italy, is it some coming out party for the imbeciles at the wheel?

(1) Jan 13th : Costa Concordia hits reef. A show off captain changes the course to wave at somebody, enjoys company of a maiden on the bridge and finally runs like a little b!@tch from the ship. He claimed he fell onto the raft. Subsequent recordings showed port authority folks urging the shameless captain to go back and take control of the situation, which he didn't heed. Toll? 15 dead and around 25 missing.

Port Authority Begged Costa Concordia Captain to Return to Ship

(2) Feb 15th : Italian Rambos from a commercial ship become first to respond with gunfire to "supposed" threat. Instead of talking to the Indian coast guard and keeping them apprised of the situation, the trigger happy jackasses shoot a bunch of unarmed fishermen and have the gall to pretend like Rambos are the victims.

(3) March 9th : England treats them like a non-entity and keeps them out of the loop on a hostage rescue mission in Nigeria to rescue a Briton and Italian from kidnappers. It goes horribly wrong and Italian authorities are running like a headless chicken demanding their "right place" in the world order!!!

(4) March 10th : A tanker runs aground off Sicily as it hit a reef. This they may blame the weather!

Italian tanker runs aground

All above in just 8 weeks!!!

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 12 Mar 2012 02:03

You forgot to add fire in the engine room of sistership of Costa Concordia.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 12 Mar 2012 02:32

Naval guards' arrest: Indian hotels targeted in Italy

La Destra ('The Right'), a right-wing organisation, forcing Indian restaurants in Rome to down shutters for a night as a mark of protest against the custody of their personnel.
...
held demonstrations in front of Indian restaurants.
..
"We are neither against the Indian people nor harbour racist feelings. There are no plans to conduct further demonstrations," he added.
..
claimed to have closed down 10 Indian restaurants in Rome. He also put up posters asking people to boycott Indian products.
..
But La Destra has no intention to boycott Indian products.(political correction?) .. The organisation boasts of 20,000 followers in Rome and more than a lakh across Italy.

The Italian version of IML?

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 12 Mar 2012 03:52

chetak wrote:
There is a crucial bye election in Kerala on the 17th of March in Piravom. The present government is on life support and desperately needs that seat.

Many are estimating that the present government will reveal it's true colors and cardinal connections (!) after that election onlee.

The two eyetalians will be home bound within the week after that election. Some token money for the unfortunate family will change hands publicly as much more is already rumored to have changed hands.

Say it ain't so Chetak! I mean if you're right, we will lose all H&D vs. Raymond Davis and the US has a lot more on the pakis.

Shouldn't Soniaji be condemning the italian righ wingers' actions against Indians?

Agnimitra · Post by **Agnimitra** » 12 Mar 2012 04:13

Something to hector the Norwegians on, if they get too nosy in our sphere of influence:

Rising popularity for Norwegian anti-Islam group

A Norwegian group called “Stop Islamisation of Norway” (SIAN) has doubled membership levels in the last two years, its representatives claim.

“A major burden”

The group, who’s most active membership is located in Rogaland, has also been awarded a government concession to transmit on Radio Kos in Sandnes, western Norway. It alleges Internet radio capacity had to be increased from 25,000 to 200,000 listeners recently because of popularity.

Merete Hodne and Kjersti Margrethe Addehaid Gilje told NRK from Bryne, a small town in Rogaland County, “We have a duty to our country to preserve our Christian values, and not least to protect our children against the terrible, evil forces of Islam.”

According to SIAN’s leader, Arne Tumyr, membership has increased because of the 22nd July attacks. He would not reveal numbers, however, because of Extreme Left press exploitation fears, and being branded as racist by certain groups.

“Unfortunately, coming forward as a member of SIAN is a major burden. You can get problems at work, and it could affect your customer-base if you run your own business. You can end up in conflicts with your family and be harassed in different ways,” he said to Stavanger Aftenblad.
Disgust

Last year, SIAN arranged a demonstration “Never Forget 9/11” in front of the US embassy in Oslo ten years to the day. There were reports of several clashes between its members and others from anti-racist organisations prior to the event.

Arne Tumyr told NTB, “We are here to remember and honor those who lost their lives on 11th September ten years ago. We will commemorate the day from SIAN’s point of view, which is that we fear the growing influence of Islam and believe there is a direct connection between the religion of Islam and extremist actions.”

He and six others also participated at another anti-Islam protest in December in the centre Stavanger.

Approximately 10 times as many counter-demonstrators from SOS Racism and extreme Left Party Rødt (the Red Party) shouted him down during his speech, however, declaring, “no racists in our streets.”

“We are here to show our disgust by turning our backs to them,” said Party member Truls Drageset Dydland.
Surveillance

Journalist, writer, and Right-Extremist environment researcher Øyvind Strømmen, often quoted in connection with articles about Breivik, is sceptical about SIAN claims regarding increased membership.

“They like to brag that they have an growing number of members, but there are not many people who stand and listen to them when hold appeals,” he told NRK, “I think recruitment to this type of extremism has declined.”

Mr Strømmen, together with other prominent figures in Norway, is on a list of people who owner of the site korsfarer.no Oddbjørn Jonstad believes are “pro immigration and Islamisation”. His other list contains those against it.

The site states its goal is “to stop immigration to Norway, as well as stop the Islamification of Norwegian society by peaceful political and religious means.”

Mr Jonstad was a former local Progress (FrP) politician until he was thrown out by the Party for his Right-Extremist views in 1999, Stavanger Aftenblad reports. Today, he edits several sites hostile to immigrants, and is leader of Norsk Folkeparti (the Norwegian People’s Party/NFP).

Other people on Mr Jonstad’s list include Crown Prince Haakon, Crown Princess Mette Marit, Prime Minister Jens Stoltenberg, Bishop of Stavanger Erling Pettersen, and several local Rogaland County politicians.

According to Øyvind Strømmen, “it seems as though scanning the integration debate and updating the Islamisation list has been his [Mr Jonstad’s] main project in the period following 22nd July.”

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 12 Mar 2012 14:24

chetak wrote:There is a crucial bye election in Kerala on the 17th of March in Piravom. The present government is on life support and desperately needs that seat.

You must also read along with this the fact that one CPI(M) MLA Com.Selvaraj from Neyyatinkara constituency has resigned. This means that a bye election would have to be done there as well. And at the moment the commies have lost one of their folks. So the situation for the Congress is improved.

The two eyetalians will be home bound within the week after that election. Some token money for the unfortunate family will change hands publicly as much more is already rumored to have changed hands.

The elections are happening next week end. So far the families of the dead fishermen have not even allowed the italians to come any where near there homes. The media is still keeping the issue on the hot burner. Bearing that in mind, it would be a bit tough for INC and the Italian folks to completely hood wink every one and get the two sailors out. And the Latin Catholics and Roman Catholics in Kerala generally dont work under a common umbrella of "Catholics". But if INC can still pull up some unique tricks, that I cannot say

.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 12 Mar 2012 15:21

Cosmo_R wrote:
chetak wrote:
There is a crucial bye election in Kerala on the 17th of March in Piravom. The present government is on life support and desperately needs that seat.

Many are estimating that the present government will reveal it's true colors and cardinal connections (!) after that election onlee.

The two eyetalians will be home bound within the week after that election. Some token money for the unfortunate family will change hands publicly as much more is already rumored to have changed hands.
Say it ain't so Chetak! I mean if you're right, we will lose all H&D vs. Raymond Davis and the US has a lot more on the pakis.

Shouldn't Soniaji be condemning the italian righ wingers' actions against Indians?

I really wish that it will not be so but as already seen the cardinal and a lot of frocks have already jumped into the fray.

Let us wait and watch.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 12 Mar 2012 15:33

Sachin wrote:
chetak wrote:There is a crucial bye election in Kerala on the 17th of March in Piravom. The present government is on life support and desperately needs that seat.
You must also read along with this the fact that one CPI(M) MLA Com.Selvaraj from Neyyatinkara constituency has resigned. This means that a bye election would have to be done there as well. And at the moment the commies have lost one of their folks. So the situation for the Congress is improved.

The two eyetalians will be home bound within the week after that election. Some token money for the unfortunate family will change hands publicly as much more is already rumored to have changed hands.
The elections are happening next week end. So far the families of the dead fishermen have not even allowed the italians to come any where near there homes. The media is still keeping the issue on the hot burner. Bearing that in mind, it would be a bit tough for INC and the Italian folks to completely hood wink every one and get the two sailors out. And the Latin Catholics and Roman Catholics in Kerala generally dont work under a common umbrella of "Catholics". But if INC can still pull up some unique tricks, that I cannot say .

Sachin sab,

Everything you say is well reasoned and true. But,...

I still have a sinking feeling that the goras will get away with it and the eyetalians will take their kinginni kuttans home safely. (aided and abetted by..........)

g.sarkar · Post by **g.sarkar** » 12 Mar 2012 19:08

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city ... 227754.cms
Did slow probe help erase data on Italian ship?
CHENNAI: A three-week delay in probing the killing of two Indian fishermen by Italian marines onboard a merchant vessel may have allowed the culprits to erase evidence of the midsea attack.
Officials of the Directorate-General of Shipping (DGS) said even though Mercantile Marine Department (MMD) officials investigating the incident were informed that data stored in the vessel's Voyage Data Recorder (VDR) had been tampered with, they delayed the investigation to collect more evidence.
A VDR is a ship's equivalent of an aircraft's black box and records data, including ship position and communications. The DGS officials said the MMD investigators had not even gone through the ship's log books and records of the vessel's movement, internet use, communications or satellite and radar information on the vessel.
Sources on board Enrica Lexie said the vessel's VDR data had been tampered with much before it berthed in Kochi and MMD was informed of this by Indian sailors on board the ship. Nineteen of the ship's 34 crew members are Indian sailors.
Radio experts of MMD Cochin analyzed the VDR data only on Tuesday. TOI had reported last week that VDR data had mysteriously gone missing from the vessel. A senior police officer investigating the case said the probe was being held up by the MMD report as the local police were not aware of the technical details of the vessel. "They delayed the entire process," the officer said.
Shipping and marine security expert Veeresh Mallik said the delay by the MMD, Cochin officials could have helped the culprits destroy crucial evidence. "However," he said, "the VDR data can still be retrieved with a certain software if the equipment on board is not damaged or replaced.".......
Gautam

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 12 Mar 2012 19:26

g.sarkar wrote:.. informed that data stored in the vessel's Voyage Data Recorder (VDR) had been tampered with, they delayed the investigation to collect more evidence.
...
Sources on board Enrica Lexie said the vessel's VDR data had been tampered with much before it berthed in Kochi and MMD was informed of this by Indian sailors on board the ship. Nineteen of the ship's 34 crew members are Indian sailors.

Tempering does not look good for a European at all for advanced industrialized people that Europeans are!

Added later
From Soli Sorabjee
link

Italian insularity

The Prime Minister of Italy needs to be reminded that India is not a banana republic. Rule of law prevails in India and no person, however high or whatever his nationality, is above the law. The accused marines will have full opportunity to defend themselves in the trial which will be in the open court. Italian lawyers can certainly assist competent Indian lawyers who may be briefed to defend the accused. No doubt the accused whilst in police custody should not be subject to inhuman treatment. But they cannot be treated as a pampered lot.
..
not grudge this preferential treatment but doubt whether the same treatment would be accorded to a non-white accused from an African or Asiatic country. We have not rid ourselves of the gora complex.

krithivas · Post by **krithivas** » 12 Mar 2012 21:18

Tampering of evidence amounts to admission of guilt. Regardless of VDR and ballistics, there are 29 Indian seamen on that ship. They will provide necessary evidence even if all evidence has been tampered with. It is time that the captain is investigated/arrested for potential tampering of evidence.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 13 Mar 2012 10:00

Not to derail this thread. This information has some connection with the Italian ship fiasco.
Another Indian ship MV Prabhu Daya is now anchored near Chennai Port. This ship is wanted for hitting a fishing boat in Kerala and killing three fishermen. The first officer is now in Trincomalee, undergoing treatment either after a murder attempt or a botched suicide attempt. Kerala Police had managed to thwart the anticipatory bail plea of the Captain (who used excuses like the treatment given to Italian sailors etc.). But when every thing was okay for the arrest, the Port authorities threw the spanner in the works. The captain cannot be arrested until and unless a replacement is available. The next in command, the Chief Officer may not be a qualified Captain, so he cannot be made in charge. So the captain is technically still free. He is in the ship, but have a few police men from K.P guarding him.
Despite bail denial, ‘hit-and-run’ ship captain eludes arrest
So looks like irrespective the country, shipping companies are trying every rule in the books to some how delay the whole process.

In the mean while, things seems to be moving in certain direction when it comes to the Italian Marines now enjoying at Central Prison, Poojappura.
Decision soon on Italian marines’ imprisonment status: Chandy

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 13 Mar 2012 13:07

there have been a lot of shipping industry conferences and discussions on what to do about the pirate menace. it is clear that the governmental response is not coordinated or effective. i am sure that most companies are now taking the attitude of shoot first and ask questions later

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 13 Mar 2012 13:20

Yesterday at a Dinner had a very detailed conversation with some Mariners. In collisions it's really not the Captain that is responsible. It is the Officer on Bridge watch. The Captain of Exxon Valdez which spilled a few million gallons of crude of Alaska was absolved in a landmark judgement as it happened in the watch of the 3rd Officer. Fishing boats don't move away and at night the smaller ones don't/ may not register on the radar of the ship too.

Another aspect on the Italian thing is very clear. Without VDR the routes are recorded and kept by law in the GPS Log, Official Deck log book and the chart where the physical mapping takes place. So determining the position of a ship is not a problem. Any tampering will be easily detected.

Both cases are vastly different. The Italians fired on purpose without following any rule of engagement. The collision may have been an innocent one, unintended. The last thing any Captain or watch Officer would want is to bang the ship and get into legislative hassles. These 2 cases are completely different.

Dhiman · Post by **Dhiman** » 14 Mar 2012 13:09

RajeshA wrote:Here some suggestions on how to play this game with the Italians:

IMHO, irrespective of how this game is played, the clear message that should go out is that, international laws or not, 200 to 300 miles of waters closest to the Indian coast is not an area where one can expect to come in and mess around. This is critical to the future security of India.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 19 Mar 2012 18:58

looks like racist mass killer on the loose in toulouse - france. first 3 french soldiers were shot and killed by a gunman on a motorbike. 1 soldier was black, 2 were north african - one was apparently wounded and crawling away, the killer turned him over and shot him 3 times. today 4 people including children were killed in a jewish school by a gunman on a motorbike

probably brevik mark 2 type of person - lets see what the police can find out

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 20 Mar 2012 20:39

this french serial killer case is getting more twisted - video footage shows the killer grabbing a little girl by the hair, turning her around and shooting her in the head at close range. he apparently even filmed the shootings.

so far 3 french soldiers killed and 1 in a coma - all north african or black, 4 jewish (french/israeli double citizenship) people killed, 3 of them young children, 1 17 year old in critical condition

3 disgruntled neo nazi paratroopers who had been thrown out of the army and were prime suspects have been interviewed and cleared. The prime suspect remains a miltiary type right wing extremist, although an islamist angle cannot be ruled out either

toulouse city is on the highest alert level in france, police are combing the city. french presidential election campaigning has been suspended, all schools observed a minute's silence today

guy is zooming around on a motorbike and has a number of handguns

nawabs · Post by **nawabs** » 20 Mar 2012 21:24

Norway kids row: Couple to split, mother blamed

http://www.firstpost.com/india/norway-k ... 49869.html

The father of the Indian couple who lost their children to Norwegian child welfare services has compounded the quandry for Indian and Norwegian authorities by now alleging that his wife had a serious psychological problem which he had concealed earlier to get custody of the children.

Anurup Bhattacharya has alleged that his wife attacked him over the weekend. Anurup said he will be seperating from his wife Sagarika after she struck him multiple times all over his body and clawed at his face. .

“This is not the first time this has happened. Sagarika has assaulted me many times before. You can find all those details in the dossier. But this time she created a massive commotion and physically assaulted me. The noise was so great that the neighbours came and my wife told them I was hitting her!” he was quoted as saying in a report in The Hindu.

“If I concealed the seriousness of Abhigyan’s and our family’s problems it was because I thought that was the only way we could get our children back. But I now realise that was a mistake and I should have spoken the truth right from the start,” he said.

“It was not just cultural bias that prompted the CWS (child welfare services) to act. My wife has a serious psychological problem. She is extremely immature, like a teenager really, and all this media attention has gone to her head. I tried to protect her and do her bidding. But last night was such a shock that I have now moved out and am seeking a legal separation,” Bhattacharya said.

The children, presently in foster care, were the subject of a diplomatic furore between India and Norway in which the European country’s child welfare services were accused of a having cultural misunderstanding. Two Indian diplomats have been sent to Norway for a court hearing on the custody of the children on March 23.

The uncle of the child, Arunabhash, who is in Norway to meet with the children and take their custody to bring them to India, has reportedly said that the children are doing better in foster care than they were doing with their parents.

“Every time I see Abhigyan play and laugh, my heart wells over with joy. He’s so happy here. And then I get worried because I don’t know how much support I’ll get in India. If Sagarika’s family comes to our home to take away the kids, what will I do?” Arunabhash said.

Bhattacharya, who is a geologist, reportedly met with the chief of the local child welfare services to seek help and also moved out of the apartment he shared with his wife.

Three-year-old Abhigyan and one-year-old Aishwarya were taken from the custody in May 2011 and placed in foster care. The children’s Norwegian visas expire on March 8 but their visas could be extended if a court rules that the children are better off in foster care.

Teachers at Abhigyan’s had reportedly found his behaviour in school disturbing after which officials from the child welfare services began visiting the family. While denying the custody of the children the Norwegian child welfare authorities had said that the boy had psychological and neurological problems.

These guys deserve harsh punishment for lying to the Indian state for solving their petty issues.But the children must be brought back to India under the care of Indian state and the divorce case between parents should be heard by an Indian court.According to UN Child Convention,the identity of the child must be maintained by all signatories and in this case there Indian identity must be maintained.Indian Gov. must declare in no uncertain terms that the whole matter will be handled by India itself and meanwhile take the custody of children.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 20 Mar 2012 21:42

Lalmohan wrote:this french serial killer case is getting more twisted - video footage shows the killer grabbing a little girl by the hair, turning her around and shooting her in the head at close range. he apparently even filmed the shootings.

so far 3 french soldiers killed and 1 in a coma - all north african or black, 4 jewish (french/israeli double citizenship) people killed, 3 of them young children, 1 17 year old in critical condition

3 disgruntled neo nazi paratroopers who had been thrown out of the army and were prime suspects have been interviewed and cleared. The prime suspect remains a miltiary type right wing extremist, although an islamist angle cannot be ruled out either

toulouse city is on the highest alert level in france, police are combing the city. french presidential election campaigning has been suspended, all schools observed a minute's silence today

guy is zooming around on a motorbike and has a number of handguns

I have spent quite some time in toulouse. Many people here are racist and this is most visible in their shops and restaurants, even more so than in other parts of france.

There is quite a bit of expat student population too.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 20 Mar 2012 22:38

chetak - you probably also know that parts of toulouse are front nationale hotbeds

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 21 Mar 2012 12:46

french police have surrounded the toulose shooting suspect, there was a shootout, two policemen are injured. the suspect is negotiating with police. he is of algerian descent - claims to be a member of al qaeda and has recently been in pakistan

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 21 Mar 2012 15:30

Lalmohan wrote:chetak - you probably also know that parts of toulouse are front nationale hotbeds

You learn to keep your head down, Sirjee. The cops are extermely rough with foreigners onlee.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 21 Mar 2012 16:09

which years were you there?

gunjur · Post by **gunjur** » 21 Mar 2012 16:21

16 judges held in Italy mafia bust; 1 billion in assets seized

The police said the focus of the operation was the Fabroccino clan, which is believed to have bribed officials to obtain favourable court judgements.

Buildings, cars and property worth 1bn euros (£829m; $1.3bn) were seized around Naples and in northern Italy.

The authorities clearly believe that the corruption has spread far beyond the members of the clan itself, and that in this case even judges may have been working with the Camorra (crime syndicate).

sunnyP · Post by **sunnyP** » 21 Mar 2012 17:00

So an Israeli citizen (amongst others) has been butchered in Europe by a jihadi who received training in Afghanistan and Pakistan. Israel, unlike many other nations, actually value the lives of their citizens - the ramifications of this attack will be widespread.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 21 Mar 2012 20:50

sarko made a very dignified speech at the funeral (muslim) of the three dead soldiers, and reaffirmed messages of unity, etc.
perp is holed up with automatic weapons, the police have him under "IR surveillance" and sarko says they want to take him alive
his entire family have been arrested, brother is believed to be a co-conspirator - he arranged meeting with the first assassinated soldier. not clear about his sisters, or mother.

unfortunately, race will not play a bigger role (even if it is as a subtext) in the french presidential elections now

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 21 Mar 2012 21:14

Lalmohan wrote:which years were you there?

Been visiting france since 1986 on a fairly regular basis but toulouse specifically, a number of job related visits, around 5-6 a year regularly from 2006 onwards. Thankfully, that has also came to an end about five months ago.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 21 Mar 2012 21:33

nawabs wrote:These guys deserve harsh punishment for lying to the Indian state for solving their petty issues.

+1. No wonder the Government too acts too slow on such cases. You never know what was really happening. The media also seems to getting hooked to this, and without checking any facts going on an offensive. These buffoons (the parents) have just given Norway another base ball bat to hit them with. And I see no dearth in these folks dishing out sentimental dialogues

.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 21 Mar 2012 21:51

Sachin wrote:
nawabs wrote:These guys deserve harsh punishment for lying to the Indian state for solving their petty issues.
+1. No wonder the Government too acts too slow on such cases. You never know what was really happening. The media also seems to getting hooked to this, and without checking any facts going on an offensive. These buffoons (the parents) have just given Norway another base ball bat to hit them with. And I see no dearth in these folks dishing out sentimental dialogues .

We Indians, government and private citizens, have this perverse knack of bring down the axe on our own legs and setting fire to our houses in full international glare.

Energy crisis: India offers gas export to Pakistan

Even God can't help us.

aditya · Post by **aditya** » 22 Mar 2012 01:00

Sachin wrote:
nawabs wrote:These guys deserve harsh punishment for lying to the Indian state for solving their petty issues.
+1. No wonder the Government too acts too slow on such cases. You never know what was really happening. The media also seems to getting hooked to this, and without checking any facts going on an offensive. These buffoons (the parents) have just given Norway another base ball bat to hit them with. And I see no dearth in these folks dishing out sentimental dialogues .

Not so quick, not so quick, not so quick. Let us not shoot ourselves in the foot by claiming our feet have already been shot.

The husband has denied such reports since then. Let us remember that the trauma of having ones kids essentially kidnapped will take a psychological toll on those affected, not least of all the parents. The mother's reported behavior falls in line with this and is hardly surprising.

http://www.thehindu.com/news/internatio ... epage=true

Anurup Bhattacharya, the father of the two Indian toddlers placed in foster care by the Norwegian Child Protection Service (CWS) on Tuesday denied he wanted the children to remain in Norway. "I desperately want the children to return to their country of origin, which is India. I would not like them to forget their own language, culture or religion. I have problems with my wife. That is a totally separate issue. As for as the children are concerned, I definitely want them to go home." Anurup Bhattacharya told The Hindu.

Mr. Bhattacharya said the Indian television channels had told him about the rumours from the Indian foreign Ministry suggesting he wanted the children to remain in Norway. "That is completely false and I deny it vehemently. The TV channel in question has made up the story and tried to attribute statements and intentions to me which allegedly originated in the MEA. I am more than happy with the compromise proposed. The children will be brought up by my family and my brother will have legal custody," he added. He also said he had not filed for a separation, let alone a divorce and that he and his wife were together in the fight to get their children back to India.

nawabs · Post by **nawabs** » 22 Mar 2012 01:06

^^ I am sure the Indian Gov. will be able to check it if the father has filed for a divorce.I am sure that's what they would be doing right now.If he has not then Norway is playing real dirty and would do nothing other than strengthning our resolve to bring back the children.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 358088.cms

India has put on hold the visit of its diplomats to Norway in connection with the custody row of two children as their NRI parents traded mutual recriminations."Government has tried its best to bring the children home so that they have a future in the country. But a new situation has developed ... we cannot interfer"," minister of state for external affairs Preneet Kaur told reporters outside Parliament House. "The visit of a joint secretary (to Norway) has been postponed," she said, adding that the government will look into the situation before taking the next step.

Foreign secretary Ranjan Mathai also struck a circumspect note.When asked to comment on the latest situation regarding the custody of the two NRI children, who were taken away from their parents on grounds of emotional disconnect, Mathai said: The situation is changing fast. The details are being ascertained in Norway."

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/govt- ... y/926631/0

Sources said South Block chose to ignore the reports by the Indian envoy in Norway R K Tyagi who had consistently raised the “red flag” on the case. He had briefed the officials in Delhi about the marital discord in the family and the factors that led to the children being taken away by the Child Welfare Services (CWS) in Stavanger. Sources said that South Block was making public statements keeping in mind the “populist” nature of the debate in domestic circles, and now that has been exposed after the marital discord within the family—one of the key reasons for the action taken by CWS — has come out in public.

aditya · Post by **aditya** » 22 Mar 2012 01:25

It would appear that some family members have opened their mouths to the media in an ill-considered manner. This is most unfortunate.

However, this does not detract from the crux of the issue. If one of the parents is considered unfit for any reason, the most the authorities should be able to do is give the other parent an ultimatum to find someone to take care of the children(presumably family or friends) until problems between the parents are sorted out. Barging into a family home, kidnapping the children, and handing them over to strangers is most barbaric and unacceptable.

The intervention of the GOI is correct and must not stop because of some intra-familial situation.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 22 Mar 2012 01:55

When it comes to TSP being the holding tank/incubator of terrorist acts, because of US mollycoddlying they will get away scot free.

What did Israel do after the Chahbad House murders by LeT terrorists in Mumbai 26/11 attack? By now its four years and some thing could bhave been done like get Saeed or mysterious fire in Murdike.

Same thing France will do . Just mutter dark things and be careful of foreign visas to TSP.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 22 Mar 2012 06:13

so far the French are doing a nice job of keeping the media idiots well away from the operation

we reduced to stock footage and assault has begun

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 22 Mar 2012 11:33

nawabs wrote:http://www.indianexpress.com/news/govt- ... y/926631/0
Sources said South Block chose to ignore the reports by the Indian envoy in Norway R K Tyagi who had consistently raised the “red flag” on the case. He had briefed the officials in Delhi about the marital discord in the family and the factors that led to the children being taken away by the Child Welfare Services (CWS) in Stavanger. Sources said that South Block was making public statements keeping in mind the “populist” nature of the debate in domestic circles, and now that has been exposed after the marital discord within the family—one of the key reasons for the action taken by CWS — has come out in public.

Indian Express gets it right. Where as the envoy did sense some thing wrong and raised a "red flag", the media had begun their overdrive and started doling out sentimental stories. The GoI was forced to take some action, without getting the time to fully ascertain the facts. And this is not the first time such thing happens. Sensationalism and too much media activism, invariably later lands up GoI in trouble. We have to understand that these folks who report these kind of issues are not the best judges for every thing under the sun (even though many journalists take that stand).

Some thing similar happened in the MV Prabhu Daya case as well. The Third Officer's father comes up with a theory that his son is being framed up, and he was attacked by some one and thrown into the sea. The media goes ga ga over this and comes up with consipracy theories. Kerala Police is forced to charge a case against the Captain and unknown assailants. Now the same Third Officer gives a totaly opposite statement in court

.

Dhiman · Post by **Dhiman** » 22 Mar 2012 13:04

aditya wrote:It would appear that some family members have opened their mouths to the media in an ill-considered manner. This is most unfortunate.

Some people are masters of solving their own personal problems on their own two feet. On the other side their are people who wallow in their self-created problems and will gladly embroil those who try to help into problems as well. Trying to save a drowning man is risky as, in desperation, he may grab and take you down with him so to speak.

If they weren't wallowing in their self-created misery, there should have been some sort of government action against these people for taking the rest of the country for a ride.

However, this does not detract from the crux of the issue. If one of the parents is considered unfit for any reason, the most the authorities should be able to do is give the other parent an ultimatum to find someone to take care of the children(presumably family or friends) until problems between the parents are sorted out. Barging into a family home, kidnapping the children, and handing them over to strangers is most barbaric and unacceptable.

Given that the family situation is unclear, who will take care of the children in India and in what way? There is very little GoI can do other than putting these children in government orphanage in India where they will not get even 10% of the care that they receive in norway. The children will have much better future in norway as future Norway citizens, unless off course you are telling me that GoI has the resources to provide the same level of care to these children as norway will. India is still a poor country and there are millions of other children that GoI has to worry about rather than getting involved in family feuds all over the world - that is the sad truth. For the amount it takes to send a couple of diplomat to norway, you can literally open a school in a village to educate hundreds of children.