Indian Naval Discussion

nelson · Post by **nelson** » 08 Jun 2012 10:10

INS Vikramaditya begins sea trials

nelson · Post by **nelson** » 08 Jun 2012 10:14

Someone commenting on pictures of Vik was correct, Idli-maker it was...
An entirely Indian touch to INS Vikramaditya

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 08 Jun 2012 10:22

nelson wrote:INS Vikramaditya begins sea trials

Splendid:

SNaik · Post by **SNaik** » 08 Jun 2012 11:48

http://kuleshovoleg.livejournal.com/64437.html
More to come.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 08 Jun 2012 13:00

what is the role of that 2nd mast in the rear? some of the older american carriers like kitty hawk used to have it.

kuznetsov class does not have it.

SNaik · Post by **SNaik** » 08 Jun 2012 13:12

Singha wrote:what is the role of that 2nd mast in the rear? some of the older american carriers like kitty hawk used to have it.

kuznetsov class does not have it.

Nimitz class has it as well. Americans use it for TACAN and instrumental landing aerials, probably the same works for Vik, although they should have removed Rezistor-K (Cake Stand) from the top in that case.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 08 Jun 2012 13:13

perhaps it was not removed to not disturb the natural balance of the ship calculations.

SNaik · Post by **SNaik** » 08 Jun 2012 13:15

More pics
http://bmpd.livejournal.com/254314.html

Vashishtha · Post by **Vashishtha** » 08 Jun 2012 14:03

God bless the Vikramaditya and may it forever be a pain in the ass

For our enemies...

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 08 Jun 2012 14:12

Why those guys are standing with the Soviet banner of Sickle Hammer and Red Star ?

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 08 Jun 2012 14:55

Austin wrote:
Kersi D wrote:Are'nt using a modified Popeye from these 650 mm TT ?
Kersi , Yes that was hinted by Naval Forces and other magazine that a modified Popeye with range of 1500 km was tested in Indian Ocean region couple of years back.

Austin. I was told of this many many years ago by a very reliable source (not chaiwallah or panwallah) on BR I understand that these are some Indian missiles that are "inspired" by this beast
.
K

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 08 Jun 2012 18:13

SNaik wrote:More pics
http://bmpd.livejournal.com/254314.html

fantastic! i can't wait to see mig29k take off from it.

btw, from the linked off chindu link

S. Krishna Murthy, who owns Eskay Enterprises, said that he obtained the technology from CFTRI and upgraded it for commercial viability before releasing it the market. Both the dosa-making and idli-making machinery have been installed in 12 ships of the Indian Navy so far. “But installing it on board the INS Vikramaditya was privileged work. We have just returned from Russia, and the automated dosa and idli-making machines will be fine-tuned once the ship is handed over to India in December,” Mr. Krishna Murthy said.

pragnya · Post by **pragnya** » 08 Jun 2012 18:44

INS Viraat – 12 May 1987 to 12 May 2012

details on Vikramaditya -

INS Vikramaditya set for Sea Trials May 25

Indian Navy on Fast Forward

Roperia · Post by **Roperia** » 08 Jun 2012 19:57

Vikramaditya starts sea trials | RIA Novosti

Check out this marvelous pic in its original size from the same article (its rather large to embed here).

Indrajit · Post by **Indrajit** » 08 Jun 2012 20:12

Awesome

the weapon fitting would be done here at home I suppose.By the way is that one of the Kirovs in the background?

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 08 Jun 2012 21:41

Vikramaditya looks much better now wish her and crew good luck for their trial.

Although I just wished they moved the tower closer to the port side leaving all the space for island , right now there is enough space between the main tower and port which for practical purpose cannot be used except for parking, probably they can put some Barak-8 VLS there. Nimitz has rightly placed their towers leaving all space for island.

The one behind the carrier is Kirov class cruiser Admiral Nakhimov think awaiting modernisation.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 08 Jun 2012 23:34

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhanushkodi

Dhanushkodi has the only land border between India and Sri Lanka which is one of the smallest in the world-just 50 yards in length on a shoal in Palk Strait.

Hainji?

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 09 Jun 2012 00:45

only one deck-lift visible

aniket · Post by **aniket** » 09 Jun 2012 00:49

IIRC it it not a new one and its capability has just been increased.

AdityaM · Post by **AdityaM** » 09 Jun 2012 02:01

Admiral Gorshkov was built in Ukraine, so it must have been built in the Black sea, and then sailed through narrow sea lane in Turkey into the Marmara, Aegean & then onto Mediterranean onwards to other parts of soviet union.

Wonder why the Soviets would expose their new ships to the Nato countries like this. Why build it in Black sea, when Black sea is itslef too small for carrier deployment

AdityaM · Post by **AdityaM** » 09 Jun 2012 02:04

Aditya G wrote:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhanushkodi

Dhanushkodi has the only land border between India and Sri Lanka which is one of the smallest in the world-just 50 yards in length on a shoal in Palk Strait.

Hainji?

And 1000s years ago when sea waters were lower, this may well have been a more accessible shallow water route

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 09 Jun 2012 04:36

^^^ Point being?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 09 Jun 2012 06:42

the black sea is ice free all through the year. the tower could not be moved without adding some addl weight on reverse side to balance the ship I think and in any case might affect stability, not being a ground up design like nimitz.

the space to right of tower will likely house some barak1 and ak630, with parking area for deck tractors, small cranes and munition trolleys...

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 09 Jun 2012 09:07

Well, they did extend the deck on the starboard side of the island

From the picture below, one can see that the area is flush with the rest of the deck.

Who knows! One day we might see picture like this

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 09 Jun 2012 09:15

interesting....so the pic suggests this verandah could be used to move and position ac for takeoff ? sounds dicey to me in heavy seas...
given this ship and maybe no other carrier can do takeoffs and landings in parallel is that a a realistic use?

even the CVNs seem to have a verandah albeit narrower.

sankum · Post by **sankum** » 09 Jun 2012 09:17

Google Earth IAC cochin shipyard latest image is available now. Can anyone post online.

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 09 Jun 2012 11:26

indranilroy wrote:Well, they did extend the deck on the starboard side of the island

moving aircraft in that area will require very skilled deck handling. In heavy seas, the roll or pitch can dash the million dollar planes against the superstructure or throw them into the sea

SNaik wrote:
Singha wrote:what is the role of that 2nd mast in the rear? some of the older american carriers like kitty hawk used to have it. kuznetsov class does not have it.
Nimitz class has it as well. Americans use it for TACAN and instrumental landing aerials, probably the same works for Vik, although they should have removed Rezistor-K (Cake Stand) from the top in that case.

.The mast has SATCOM + ESM suite, most probably because the massive funnel, EW jammers, Rezistor-K and Fregat radar do not leave any space for them atop the superstructure. IN designers tried hard to reduce topweight from the superstructure, but one criteria of the deal was only Russian equipment could be fitted, hence the bulky radars. The Chinese have done better in de-cluttering the Varyag superstructure because they had no such constraints. Ofcourse, IAC will have a much refined superstructure than both because of using more modern equipment.

m mittal · Post by **m mittal** » 09 Jun 2012 11:42

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 09 Jun 2012 12:20

SNaik wrote:
tsarkar wrote:
Prem Kumar said, "Tsarkar: the "clean look" requirement is more than just form/looks. Its for RCS reduction of stealth frigates. Going in the Lafayette direction for clean & radar deflecting shaping wouldnt be such a bad idea."

Please explain stealth and RCS reduction. Also explain the means of RCS reduction.
Not that much to search, actually, just a few pages back
http://www.indiandefencereview.com/spot ... rship.html

Good find, SNaik, and Rajeshwar Nath certainly knows what he writes about.

Stealth is an obscure and misleading work coined by Lockheed Martin marketers. A better term is signature reduction for low observable.

Shaping and clean lines go some way in reducing RCS, however, shaping works only for particular radar bands. Multi band shaping has not yet arrived. RAM + Active ECM too help in lowering observability. The Teg ships do also have acoustic and thermal signature reduction measures.

With regards to clean lines, it is a function of equipment. For example, Barak-8 with VLS and Elta 2248 PAR will result in cleaner lines than Shtil rocker arm launcher, Fregat rotating radar and Orekh guidance radars.

Also a larger 5000 ton Shivalik will have more internal space to suitably mask equipment than 3600 ton Teg. Infact Shivalik is the optimization of the Krivak hullform. Also, smaller size also results in lower reflections.

The intent is not to make Teg disappear but to make it appear like a fishing vessel or a ferry or a merchant ship.

SNaik · Post by **SNaik** » 09 Jun 2012 12:34

Both Cochin and Garden Reach have new photos

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 09 Jun 2012 12:41

K Mehta wrote:In pictures: Made in Gujarat,first hydrographic survey vessel ‘Makar’ handed over to the Indian Navy

Australian designed AA built. Very capable ships, though I believe from order to delivery 15 years have passed, including 10 years plus build time.

Built to Australian design http://www.seatransport.com/products-mi ... [quote]Sea Transport Solutions has designed several military vessels including hydrographic survey vessels and landing craft for the Royal Australian Navy, Indian Navy and Royal Thai Navy.[/quote]Makar's smaller Australian cousins are shown.

Using such ships to patrol is like using AWACS for Close Air Support. Not worth putting all this electronics to mundane patrolling.

Makar has the draught of IN WJFAC despite double the displacement.

Hiten · Post by **Hiten** » 09 Jun 2012 13:37

this small news report prior to the Vikramaditya leaving for its sea trials

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jUA3fn_L94

Vipul · Post by **Vipul** » 10 Jun 2012 05:15

India to buy 8 warships from S Korea for 6k crore.

In tune with a growing 'strategic partnership' with South Korea, India is now getting all set to ink a major defence contract with the north-east Asian country for acquisition of eight advanced minesweeping and hunting warships.

Under the programme, which will be worth well over Rs 6,000 crore, India will get two of the mine counter-measures vessels (MCMVs) directly from South Korean firm Kangnam Corporation, while the other six will be manufactured by Goa Shipyard after transfer of technology. "The contract is now being finalized after the conclusion of the commercial negotiations," said a source.

India's need for advanced MCMVs that combine the role of traditional minesweepers and active mine-hunters to detect and destroy underwater mines is critical. Despite intelligence inputs holding that Indian harbours face the clear and present danger of underwater mines being planted by both state as well as non-state actors, the Navy's MCMV project has been hanging fire for several years now.

"Underwater mines are cheap weapons that can be used for high-impact incidents. It's relatively easy for someone to lay mines at the harbour approach or departure routes. There is need to step-up the protection of our harbours and offshore installations," said an official.

Made of composite material and high-grade steel to ensure 'minimal magnetivity', the new MCMVs will have high-definition sonars and acoustic and magnetic sweeps to first detect all kinds of marooned and drifting mines and then use remote-controlled systems like small underwater vehicles to then detonate them at safe distances.

Nick_S · Post by **Nick_S** » 10 Jun 2012 06:28

Singha wrote:interesting....so the pic suggests this verandah could be used to move and position ac for takeoff ? sounds dicey to me in heavy seas...
given this ship and maybe no other carrier can do takeoffs and landings in parallel is that a a realistic use?

even the CVNs seem to have a verandah albeit narrower.

That looks like the 85,000t Ulyanovsk to me. Two CATs for the Yak-44s plus the ski jump.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_air ... _Ulyanovsk

Doubt Vik can carry migs on the side.

Roperia · Post by **Roperia** » 10 Jun 2012 11:26

India prepares to counter China's clout with INS Satpura | NDTV Video

srai · Post by **srai** » 10 Jun 2012 11:41

^^^

Great looking C2 center.

SNaik · Post by **SNaik** » 10 Jun 2012 13:13

Full session
http://kuleshovoleg.livejournal.com/65378.html

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 10 Jun 2012 13:18

Does this not obstruct the runway and landing. It is on the opposite side of the main tower of CV

It is not found in any other CV

D Roy · Post by **D Roy** » 10 Jun 2012 14:08

It does not at all. it is located behind the island and in no way impedes landing etc.

And it is not all that uncommon. it is found in older carrier designs.

See this picture for greater clarity

http://nl.media.rbth.ru/web/in-rbth/ima ... ra_468.jpg

So unless a plane wants to fly straight into the Island, this should not be much of a problem at all.

In fact it can even be seen as a defence in depth structure for protection against cruise missiles.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 10 Jun 2012 14:13

Corrected. Thanks