Boston Bombing Followup Thread

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 25 Apr 2013 22:59

Bade wrote:Ramana, in all likelihood they did not shoot at him, as he was wanted alive, but ricocheted ones must have hit him. They just wanted to do shock and awe to get him out of the boat.

He seemed to be OK when he climbed out of the boat. So it seems he was shot later.

ShauryaT · Post by **ShauryaT** » 25 Apr 2013 22:59

Singha wrote:true that. given the density of miscreants here, state police need to be able to manage. the training of state police commandos by NSG was supposed to bridge that gap...and now the zonal NSG hubs...

how good it is, we will know after the next 26/11

though marcos are military SF, I think they also practice assaulting oil rigs & ships taken over by mock terrorists so some elements of hostage rescue are part of their curriculum...not as 24x7 as nsg though. also afaik the regular army SF curriculum does not feature any hostage rescue drills?

I think the answer to CT in not vested in the IA or SF, unless we over burden them with internal security duties. Look at the attached link, it provides an idea on at how many levels has the great khan invested in to get the desired capabilities.

http://www.americanspecialops.com/speci ... d-tactics/

MH has invested in the "Force One" as a CT force after 26/11, that is the route to go. NSG and others should be a supplemental force - like the FBI's tac team. Each city and state government are charged with internal security duties, cannot just do a hands up every time some idiot brandishes an AK or a grenade or IED. so, how many state and city governments have a "force one" in the making? Need answers for the citizen on what happens in minutes, hours and by the time, it comes to days, it is game over. The sense that I gather is most governments simply "outsourced" the problem of CT to New Delhi.

The citizens of Mumbai should have lynched every one in power in the city and the state for 26/11, instead we know what we got.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 25 Apr 2013 23:16

I can kind of see 3 possible scenarios.

1) if they can trace it to TSP then a pure jihadist angle.
2) if they were us agents who went postal, we will never know for sure.
3) if they were russian plants (motive is clear), then many things do fit as we know it.

The shadowy character Misha holds the clue perhaps.

ShauryaT · Post by **ShauryaT** » 25 Apr 2013 23:16

matrimc wrote:ShauryaT ji,
No hurry. Keep it short if you wish, and preferably in the open (in whichever thread you think is proper). It would be very hard to change my mind since I strongly believe in universal suffrage, but one never knows. If a majority are agreeable to your plan, then I would like to know what your plans are for people of my ilk.

Quick brief answers are posted http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 6#p1447426

saip · Post by **saip** » 25 Apr 2013 23:20

NY Police Comm Kelley said the brothers ran out of gas in the hijacked SUV and so had to stop a gas station. That is when the owner of the SUV managed to escape. That might also be the reason why the younger brother abandoned the SUV later.

Just heard on Fox one brother was pumping gas and the other went to pay for the gas and the victim ran. Strange. Not exactly very bright. If the gas was pumped why did Dzokhar abandon the car? Did they panic and left without taking the gas when the victim ran?

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 25 Apr 2013 23:41

While speculation and hindsight type posts fill up these pages ... a news item..

Tmes Square attack planned by Boston bombing suspects, police say

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Apr 2013 00:49

ramana wrote:AmberG, The thing hits me hard. Long ago there was Indian Physics PhD student at Georgetown, Washington DC. A genius kid with very high IQ. He went for a walk after dinner and never came back. No trace of him was found. His two brothers had the sad task of informing their old parents back in India who both promptly expired from the shock. I had the sad task to thelp them clean up.
Since then my rules for my family are no going out in urban areas after 8:00pm no matter what.

If you know the family please ,please convey my and our forum regards to the family. Will be grateful to you for this kind act.

Have done that.

Yes, as you said these things do hit very hard.

I have to be sensitive and careful what I post here but details are in the news media.. Please just read the reliable reports and do not add/spread speculations etc about the family.

What I can say, is authorities are reporting no foul play is suspected, and many of us sort of knew/suspected that. Sunil was missing since March 16. Let us wait to find out what exactly happened.

IMO, one horrible part was the same social media that family was using was cause of added misery. I think, people not only bothered family (their phones starting ringing contiguously starting at 3AM).. looks like they went through "friends" and classmates of relatives too. (I got a call from one of the close friend around 2-3 AM) (I was awake anyway- talking with my DIL)

BTW, do not come down too hard on BPD (or other law enforcement officers)..Hindsight is 20-20. It wasn't only them who ordered people to stay in (and no, it is silly to suggest that they knew with 100% certainty that culprit was unarmed etc..). I called my DIL and asked stay indoors and not to go out (as a doctor, she keeps strange hours when she is on call) when I heard about MIT shooting. The Inman square is pretty close to their apartment.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 26 Apr 2013 00:57

Thanks. And have I done what you think?

MurthyB · Post by **MurthyB** » 26 Apr 2013 01:08

So the Ruskies had warned the US twice about this guy.

Ruskies telling the US to investigate Chechens for terrorist links is like the US telling the Taliban to investigate Al Qaeda for terrorist links.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 26 Apr 2013 01:27

Still there is something odd that is not being revealed. My question is how did the Russians make the inquiry (in 2011) before his visit(2012) to Dagestan was even planned? And all along he has Russian passport for he has only permanant resident/green card status in US.
And there is a time limit of outside stay or else it impacts the PR status. So was he following all those norms?

saip · Post by **saip** » 26 Apr 2013 01:31

I believe the time limit is six months for external stay without obtaining prior permission from ICE (not that it helps and they may still give you lot of problems if you exceed six months)

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 26 Apr 2013 01:37

Would not the Russians know following his visit, where he visited to and from Russia ? Their network in Chechnya and Central Asian Regions would be extensive and more than that of the US for sure considering their interest.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Apr 2013 01:41

Ramana and others - To add to my previous message, here is a part of the statement from Sunil's family..

This last month has changed our lives forever, and we hope it will change yours too.

Take care of one another. Be gentle, be compassionate. Be open to letting someone in when it is you who is faltering. Lend your hand. We need it. The world needs it.”

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Apr 2013 01:53

saip wrote:I believe the time limit is six months for external stay without obtaining prior permission from ICE (not that it helps and they may still give you lot of problems if you exceed six months)

Slightly OT but useful - Yes, Permanent Residents who stay outside of the U.S. for 6 months or more at a time are risking losing their I-551 Green Card to airport immigration officials when they try to re-enter America, especially when they do it repeatedly ... also There is no explicit "rule of six months" (The rules are complicated, and many, some even contradict each other) ..the criteria is "intend to stay in US" people have been questioned aggressively even if the stay is only less than few months.. (If it happens too often, or ICE has reason to believe that you "do not intend to reside in US"

Helpful documents to show "ties to US"
Round trip ticket;
Sold or transferred property or business abroad;
Purchased a car in America;
Had car insurance or medical insurance or life insurance in America;
Purchased property or a business in America;
Maintained a Bank Account in America;
Filed Tax Returns in America every year that had green card;
Maintained State I.D. or State Driver’s License in America;
Paperwork that proves you have a Doctor in America (saw a doctor before leaving and kept the receipt);
Got a job or volunteer position in America before leaving (even for a few weeks);
Had accounts in America like Netflix, Blockbuster, Library Card;
Leased an apartment in the U.S.;
Utility bill for apartment in U.S.;
Kept a file of ill relative’s medical progress or decline (doctor’s reports, prescriptions, etc.),
Established a Facebook account based in America and visited it weekly while abroad using only the

While do not show things like

Worked or attended school abroad.
Got married abroad.
Purchased a business or property abroad.
Purchased a car abroad.
Also stay away - no record on your passport - (or must have good reason if you visit) from places like land of pure!... (I saw an hmm.. interesting episode when I was with a person - us citizen - who had visited both India and TSP for some conference..)

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Apr 2013 02:04

]Link to the WPost story about NYC plot:

Authorities: Tsarnaev brothers planned attack on New York’s Times Square

Also link to the story about triple murder and its connection to Tamerlan which took place last year and police at that time thought it was just drug related ...

Slain Boston Bomb Suspect Tamerlan Tsarnaev Eyed in Jewish Triple Murder
( CNN has this on yesterday)

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 26 Apr 2013 02:18

Amber G, that was posted a few pages up on the triple murder case. So why was he not on the watch list after that ?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 26 Apr 2013 02:28

They didn't make the connection then. Its only recently the old case is being looked into.

saip · Post by **saip** » 26 Apr 2013 02:43

In hind sight he seems to be the main suspect. Tenth anniversary of 9/11, ritualistic killing. But how could one man decapitate three persons? Were they high on drugs?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 26 Apr 2013 03:00

Also think it thru slowly. A recently avowed Islamist or radicalized Islamist consorting with three Jewish drug sellers?

Lots of twists and turns than a Bollywood movie storyline. Need to suspend disbelief and reason if you want to follow the story. With pious news anchors repeating the twists without wondering what it does to their credibility!

CNN is sunk with this reports. Now average person on street has same opinion of CNN as Indians do. Except the RNIs and MUTUs.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Apr 2013 04:29

Recent TOI Article on some of the background of Pressure Cooker type bombs ...
Explosive-laden cookers preferred to trigger blasts in India

Use of pressure cooker by terrorists in Boston may be new for the US, but this commonplace kitchen utensil had been used by terror groups in India on several occasions in the past.

Pakistani spy agency ISI-backed terror outfits Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT) had used pressure cookers as IEDs by packing it with explosive materials, timers, shrapnel and ball bearings for carrying out attacks in the bustling Sarojini Nagar market here in 2005.

Later, the LeT's proxy Indian Mujahideen (IM) had used pressure cookers to carry out attacks in a Varanasi temple and Mumbai trains in 2006. The Lashkar-IM combine had used seven pressure cookers for carrying out synchronized terror attacks in Mumbai suburban trains in 2006.

Terrorists use it because it causes pressure leading to huge explosion, depending on the quantity of explosives packed in it. Since it is an easily available item, terrorists prefer it over other strong metal containers to make IEDs.

The impact of explosion depends on the kind\quantity of explosive materials (ammonium nitrate or TNT or RDX) and other objects like nails or ball bearings or any other metallic items used inside the utensil. This kind of IED can be triggered by simple electronic components like digital watches and cellphones.

Besides India, other countries, including Pakistan, Afghanistan, Nepal and Algeria, too had reported use of pressure cooker by terrorists in making explosive devices. In most of the cases, it, however, showed hands of local terrorists who could have either acted on their own or with active support of foreign elements. In India, the IM continues to connive with LeT, which has over the years earned the reputation of an outfit present in many countries through its different front organizations.

Officials in security agencies here pointed out that since pressure cooker was often overlooked by police during any kind of search operation, terrorists found it easy to carry to spot without fear of detection.

They, however, at the same time pointed out that the use of pressure cooker could not just be restricted to terror groups like al-Qaida, LeT, HuJI or IM. One need not be a technical expert to make IEDs using pressure cookers. Anyone with ulterior motive can assemble it while looking up the methodology online, they added.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Apr 2013 05:14

There was a mention of Wazirastan and L-e-t in this post by Rangudu .. this story from USAtoday also
notices that:

Movement of Uzbekistan and one of its splinter groups, the Islamic Jihad Union, both have recruited Chechen, Turks and other non-Arab Muslims to fight with them against U.S. forces in Afghanistan. According to Kohlmann, both of these groups are based in the Waziristan tribal area of Pakistan, "and these groups can be just as radical as anything al-Qaeda puts out."

Link: Russia's Chechnya has long terrorist connections

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 26 Apr 2013 06:17

matrimc.. short answer is policy based voting and governance. rest is all magic. certain policies does not required highly educated ilks and shilks. also, just like commissions we have, we could enlarge on that idea to make it specific areas of needs and wants. in some cases, we need brains.. for certain other cases, like how to count number of party tickets, the current babu gen would suffice.

/OT .. the hidden strategy here is take away policies from the hands of babus, while make them serious on tickets only.. while the educated/rightly qualified cloud works towards actual requirements.

==back to T.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/04/25/us/massac ... ?hpt=hp_t1

. Zubeidat Tsarnaev is wanted on 2012 felony charges of shoplifting and property damage in Massachusetts, according to court officials. It is unclear whether returning to the United States would lead to her arrest.

The name of one Boston Marathon bombing suspect was included in U.S. law enforcement and counterterrorism databases, but he was not on any watch list that would have prevented him from flying or required additional screening when he left or entered the country, intelligence and law enforcement officials said.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 26 Apr 2013 06:50

foxnews...interesting stat here.

Republican Rep. Jason Chaffetz said Thursday that the Department of Homeland Security is using roughly 1,000 rounds of ammunition more per person than the U.S. Army, as he and other lawmakers sharply questioned DHS officials on their "massive" bullet buys.

"It is entirely ... inexplicable why the Department of Homeland Security needs so much ammunition," Chaffetz, R-Utah, said at a hearing.
The hearing itself was unusual, as questions about the department's ammunition purchases until recently had bubbled largely under the radar -- on blogs and in the occasional news article. But as the Department of Homeland Security found itself publicly defending the purchases, lawmakers gradually showed more interest in the issue.

Democratic Rep. John Tierney, D-Mass., at the opening of the hearing, ridiculed the concerns as "conspiracy theories" which have "no place" in the committee room.

But Republicans said the purchases raise "serious" questions about waste and accountability.
Chaffetz, who chairs one of the House oversight subcommittees holding the hearing Thursday, revealed that the department currently has more than 260 million rounds in stock. He said the department bought more than 103 million rounds in 2012 and used 116 million that same year -- among roughly 70,000 agents.

Comparing that with the small-arms purchases procured by the U.S. Army, he said the DHS is churning through between 1,300 and 1,600 rounds per officer, while the U.S. Army goes through roughly 350 rounds per soldier.
He noted that is "roughly 1,000 rounds more per person."

"Their officers use what seems to be an exorbitant amount of ammunition," he said.

Nick Nayak, chief procurement officer for the Department of Homeland Security, did not challenge Chaffetz's numbers.
However, Nayak sought to counter what he described as several misconceptions about the bullet buys.
Despite reports that the department was trying to buy up to 1.6 billion rounds over five years, he said that is not true. He later clarified that the number is closer to 750 million.

He said the department, on average, buys roughly 100 million rounds per year.

He also said claims that the department is stockpiling ammo are "simply not true." Further, he countered claims that the purchases are helping create broader ammunition shortages in the U.S.

The department has long said it needs the bullets for agents in training and on duty, and buys in bulk to save money.

While Democrats likened concerns about the purchases to conspiracy theories, Republicans raised concern about the sheer cost of the ammunition.
"This is not about conspiracy theories, this is about good government," Rep. Jim Jordan, R-Ohio, said.
Rep. Darrell Issa, R-Calif., who chairs the full Oversight and Government Reform Committee, said he suspects rounds are being stockpiled, and then either "disposed of," passed to non-federal agencies, or shot "indiscriminately."
If that is the case, he said, "then shame on you."

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/04 ... z2RWsyg1Ai

saip · Post by **saip** » 26 Apr 2013 06:58

Anyone from New Hampshire here? Heard of Stella Tremblay? She is supposed to be a legislator from NH. She allegedly claimed the Boston attack was a false flag operation.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 26 Apr 2013 07:02

200 bullets are nothing. In an incident in Bay Area iirc, a dozen cops fired 80 odd rounds at a suspected stolen vehicle after a routine pull over.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 26 Apr 2013 07:32

Normally, the new mil strategy is don't fire aimlessly.. and they have to be restricted the rapid fires to say not more than 3 bullets per trigger on the machine guns.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 26 Apr 2013 07:36

expecting SF type 1-2 shot fire discipline when under fire themselves from law enforcement types is a bit much.

the idea is what CIA taught the mujahideen to do - put enough lead in the air in a co-ordinated move in front of a moving target or directly at a static target and even a tough bird like a Mi24 will be forced to take some damage and atleast get mission killed.

they also get a lot of legal cover probably for such excesses and have recourse to the "fog of war" ...though how 200 officials surrounding a guy in a boat with a helicopter overhead can suffer from "fog of war" is a bit hard to understand. seems like enthusiastic and heavily armed types willing to travel long and hard to get in a fight though

20/20 hindsight says the lockdown and virtual curfew was a great decision given 5000+ armed police were moving around and gunfight could erupt any minute.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 26 Apr 2013 07:39

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/26/us/su ... .html?_r=0
sad

saip · Post by **saip** » 26 Apr 2013 08:00

Very sad. It is so difficult to diagnose depression. Especially Indian families tend not to seek professional help. But his mother (Judy) an American?

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 26 Apr 2013 08:08

member_26011 · Post by **member_26011** » 26 Apr 2013 08:48

Amber G. wrote:
ramana wrote:AmberG, The thing hits me hard...

If you know the family please ,please convey my and our forum regards to the family. Will be grateful to you for this kind act.
Have done that.

In the wee hours of the rising ridiculous claim season on twitter, my wife and I were tweeting caution like many others were cautioning here on the forum. We had hoped they would find him discovering himself somewhere but we feared this and hoped it did not come true. He seems so much like our own child. We decided to write using Facebook but if there is another way open to the public that you know of, I would be grateful to know. Perhaps this note should go on to another thread (but I don't know where). Sincerely.

Charlie · Post by **Charlie** » 26 Apr 2013 11:23

Effects of "Ummah allegiance trumping all other loyalties" among faithful youth is openly being talked on CNN. Has this happened before on Cnn

Anderson 360

member_20292 · Post by **member_20292** » 26 Apr 2013 16:49

^^^

Would be even worse when they discover that he took the extreme step AFTER his photos were published on the internet.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 26 Apr 2013 17:55

Charlie wrote:Effects of "Ummah allegiance trumping all other loyalties" among faithful youth is openly being talked on CNN. Has this happened before on Cnn

Anderson 360

Do you really take this Anderson Cooper clown seriously? He is another mouthpiece with a pretense of some objectivity.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Apr 2013 18:46

mahadevbhu wrote:^^^

Would be even worse when they discover that he took the extreme step AFTER his photos were published on the internet.

Let us not speculate. Please. (there is no reason to think that the step was taken after the the photos were released).

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Apr 2013 19:15

I am sure the authorities and investigators are looking into bomber's connection with terrorists network..Hard and painstaking as it may be it is important to follow all leads and go wherever they lead. In this regard, anything we know, should be reported/discussed however small it may look. (This is different that useless speculation, CT's and the things we already know or will know pretty soon)

I found it is interesting to read Shahzad (the Times Square Bomber with link to Pakistan) links.
The following is from a report from NY times... Similar links may exist for the other terrorists too.

>>>>> (A rather long piece from some links which I have posted in my previous messages.. but I am leaving here for people to see as I think it is important)

In the aftermath of Shahzad’s failed bombing, the public account of his radicalization has largely focused on his time in America. But precisely how this suburban father and financial analyst came to join a terrorist network in the mountains of Waziristan { This part of Pakistan, as Rangundu reported here is also being looked into by investigators in the Boston case} has remained largely a mystery.

Interviews with American officials, a senior Pakistani intelligence official and others familiar with the case revealed that Mr. Shahzad came into contact with militants in Pakistan through a chain of friends, starting with Shahid Hussain, a 32-year-old Pakistani whom Mr. Shahzad had met in Bridgeport, Conn., where both men went to business school. Back in Islamabad, the two friends and a third man, Muhammad Shouaib Mughal, set out to join a militant group as early as 2008, finding their way to the Pakistani Taliban through a connection at the Red Mosque, according to the interviews.

The group, also known as Tehrik-i-Taliban, initially suspected that Mr. Shahzad was a spy, and turned him away, according to the interviews. But they accepted Mr. Mughal, who ultimately persuaded them to admit Mr. Shahzad. During training, he met briefly with the Pakistani Taliban leader Hakimullah Mehsud, the officials said. After Mr. Shahzad returned to the United States this year, he continued to communicate with the militant group through Mr. Mughal.

(Both Mughal and Hussain have been arrested in Pakistan )

Crucial Friendships

In the years after the 9/11 attacks, Mr. Shahzad’s devotion to jihadist propaganda seemed to grow in tandem with the pressures of his life in Connecticut, where he owned a home and worked for a financial marketing firm, straining at times to support his budding family.
... Shahzad’s visits to Pakistan and the friendships he formed there were critical to his militant evolution. Shahzad seemed to lack “validation” from his family and work environment, finding it instead with “a bunch of like-minded brothers,” said an administration official who, like others interviewed for this article, spoke on condition of anonymity because of the continuing investigation.

Shahzad appears to fit a pattern among young Muslims in the United States who have joined militant groups over the last year. In contrast to their predecessors — the 9/11-era jihadist leaders who framed their movement in religious terms — Mr. Shahzad and other recent recruits carry the attributes of “foot soldiers,” driven less by religious rhetoric than by personal bonds and their sense of obligation to the ummah, or global Muslim community, the American officials said.

“It’s much more attached to kinship with other Muslims,” a senior administration official said. Mr. Shahzad seemed motivated by the duty he felt toward his fellow Muslims and his loyalty to the friends who trained with him in Waziristan, the official said. In court on Monday, Mr. Shahzad said he had made a “pact” with the Pakistani Taliban that he would attack America.

He also told the judge that “until the hour the U.S. pulls its forces from Iraq and Afghanistan”; halts drone strikes in Pakistan, Yemen and Somalia; and stops killing Muslims, “we will be attacking U.S. and I plead guilty to that.”

Raised as the privileged son of a senior military officer in Pakistan, Mr. Shahzad arrived in Bridgeport in 2000, where he enrolled as an undergraduate at the University of Bridgeport. {Boston brothers were brought here by after their "aunt" sponsored them as refugees, and then they were granted asylum} There he met Mr. Hussain, a business student who had been raised in Islamabad, the son of a civil servant. Mr. Hussain was a bright student who “wanted to excel in life,” his brother said in an interview. For a time, Mr. Hussain and Mr. Shahzad appeared to have been roommates in Norwalk, Conn., where Mr. Hussain worked as an accountant for DHL.

Mr. Shahzad struck his peers as fun-loving and professionally ambitious. But by 2004, things started to change. A longtime critic of American foreign policy, Mr. Shahzad began dabbling in jihadist ideology, listening to the Internet sermons of Anwar al-Awlaki, the American-born imam, and Abdullah el-Faisal, a Jamaican cleric, according to a person familiar with the case.

Mr. Shahzad took to sending incendiary e-mail messages to friends, copies of which were obtained by The New York Times. (The text of one message matches an essay posted the same month, under another name, on a jihadist Web site that is now defunct.)

While in some ways, Mr. Shahzad appeared to be thriving — he had married a Pakistani-American from Colorado, bought a home in Shelton, Conn., and, by 2006, was en route to becoming an American citizen and a father — he seemed frustrated. “I got this impression of a guy who just looked at his life prospects and felt unfulfilled by it all,” said an American administration official.

On frequent trips home to Pakistan, Mr. Shahzad seemed to be forming a new circle of friends. In Islamabad, he reconnected with Mr. Hussain, his former college friend, who had moved back to Pakistan after briefly living in Plantation, Fla., and then Canada.

The men sometimes prayed at Lal Masjid, or the Red Mosque, a hotbed for militancy. By the summer of 2007, the mosque had drawn international attention as its cane-wielding students, intent on installing a theocracy, kidnapped Chinese masseuses, raided music stores and took police officers hostage. It is unclear whether Mr. Shahzad was in Pakistan when the government’s security forces stormed the mosque in July, but he was “close to individuals who were associated with that event and that mosque,” an American administration official said.

If before the siege Mr. Shahzad and Mr. Hussain were on the sidelines of militancy, “they heated up after what happened,” said a person familiar with the case. “They realized that more than sympathy was required.”

By 2008, Mr. Hussain had introduced Mr. Shahzad to Muhammad Shouaib Mughal, the owner of a computer store in Islamabad. Initially, they met to discuss a problem with Mr. Shahzad’s computer, but soon found a common interest in the global jihad, an American official said. The men, along with other friends, began meeting at one another’s homes. “They want to do something, but they don’t know what to do,” said a person familiar with the case. “They are searching for anybody who can give them the opportunity.”

That opportunity came at the Red Mosque, where the men met the 17-year-old nephew of a Pakistani Taliban leader who offered to connect them to the network, said the person familiar with the case. But the group passed on Mr. Shahzad, whose father’s military background led them to suspect that he was a spy, according to Pakistani and American officials.

Mr. Shahzad remained determined. He asked his father for permission to join the mujahedeen in Afghanistan; his father declined. An imam in the city of Rawalpindi, south of Islamabad, told Mr. Shahzad to obey his father, said a person familiar with the case.

Return to Pakistan

By 2009, Mr. Shahzad decided he no longer wanted to live in the United States. After getting his United States citizenship in April, he moved back to Pakistan while his wife and two children went to live with her parents in Saudi Arabia, according to a relative.

Later that year, while Mr. Shahzad was staying with his parents in Peshawar, he became incensed by American-led drone strikes in the tribal region of Pakistan bordering Afghanistan. Mr. Shahzad, who is of Pashtun lineage, called Mr. Hussain and said, “They’re killing Pashtuns,” the Pakistani official said. Mr. Hussain was “against innocent people dying in the tribal areas because of the drone strikes,” his brother, Khalid Hussain, said in an interview, adding that most Pakistanis shared that view.

Mr. Shahzad also reached out to Mr. Mughal, who by then had trained with the Pakistani Taliban, earning enough credibility to persuade them that Mr. Shahzad was not a spy, according to people familiar with the case.

“Let’s go,” Mr. Shahzad told Mr. Mughal on the phone, according to a person familiar with the case. In December, the three men met in Mr. Mughal’s home in Rawalpindi, then drove to Waziristan, where Mr. Mughal left them with an instructor and two aides, according to the interviews. Over the next five weeks, Mr. Shahzad, Mr. Hussain and a third recruit underwent boot-camp-style training, followed by instruction in bomb making.

When Pakistani Taliban leaders realized that Mr. Shahzad carried an American passport, they asked him to return to the United States to carry out an attack, and discussed possible targets with him, said people familiar with the case. The group initially gave Mr. Shahzad $4,000 in cash, he said in court. After he returned to New York on Feb. 2, Mr. Shahzad stayed in contact with the group through Mr. Mughal, who remained in Pakistan. They communicated about logistics and Mr. Mughal wired him additional installments of cash; the indictment against Mr. Shahzad says he received $12,000.

After Mr. Shahzad was arrested May 3 trying to flee the country following his bombing attempt, he cooperated with the investigation, officials said. Soon after, the Pakistani authorities arrested Mr. Mughal, Mr. Hussain and others in their circle, including a catering company executive and a retired army major, who has since been released.

During a visit to Islamabad on Sunday, Richard C. Holbrooke, the special representative for Afghanistan and Pakistan, said that both Pakistan and America shared responsibility for the fact that Mr. Shahzad had “slipped through our nets.”

“Neither country paid enough attention to the warning signs,” he said. “We are working with the Pakistanis to tighten our methods of trying to locate and prevent that in advance.”
>>>

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Apr 2013 19:27

saip wrote:Anyone from New Hampshire here? Heard of Stella Tremblay? She is supposed to be a legislator from NH. She allegedly claimed the Boston attack was a false flag operation.

Thanks. Wow! NH is of course, notorious for people like Robert Giuda and his Pakistani origin friend Saggy Tahir. Disgustingly anti-India and pro terrorists and their supporters in the land of the pure.

They made a name of themselves and became a laughing stalk for introducing something like "cashmere" resolution in NH state..

(Unfortunately in spite of lot of efforts from us (I don't even live in NH, and have no interest in local politics but I still got involved with local people there) these guys , (I think) won their seats again and are still in office)

(For those who do not know them, please look them up for background - All NH voters should be aware of them)

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Apr 2013 19:46

^^News items are again putting NH on the map as a laughing stalk - a place where Giuda, Tahir and Tremblay become lawmakers...

Here is one story: Note the headline.. from Huffington post
Stella Tremblay, Boston Bombing Conspiracy Theorist, Serves In Nonsensical New Hampshire Legislature

Tuesday, were introduced to New Hampshire state Rep. Stella Tremblay, the big Alex Jones/Glenn Beck fan in her state's House of Representatives who said the Boston Marathon bombing was an "inside job," and who is advised by a man named David Johnson, who apparently believes that "the United States is still subject to Lincoln's declaration of martial law and is now under the control of Queen Elizabeth II."

I had some exasperated things to say about the situation on HuffPost Live last night, and as soon as I'd signed off, my colleague John Celock -- who has forgotten more things about America's state legislatures than I shall ever know -- gave me the skinny as to how Stella Tremblay became a thing that was happening in America: the New Hampshire House of Representatives has 400 members. "Double-you tee effing eff!" I replied, because huh? The Virginia House of Delegates, by contrast, has a mere 100 members. And, oh yeah, the actual U.S. House of Representatives has 435 voting members.

These two sentences from the Wikipedia entry on the New Hampshire House of Reps is sufficient to put the fear in you: "On average, each legislator represents about 3,300 residents. {Our friend giuda, IIRC had something like 900 people to vote .. no wonder they got elected} If the same level of representation were present in the U.S. Congress, that body would have approximately 99,000 members, according to current population estimates."

On top of that, Celock told me that members of this august body receive a mere $100 a year for their participation, which means that the only people who are likely to seek these offices are people who are just beginning their political careers, people who are winding down their political careers, and people who have literally nothing better to do than run for these seats. With a system designed like this, it can't not feature a nutter like Tremblay.

So, anyone who is truly concerned about getting Stella Tremblay out of office would be well served to stop thinking about running a better candidate in "Rockingham 4," and instead concentrate on making New Hampshire's legislative body a lot less bonkers.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 26 Apr 2013 19:55

Charlie wrote:Effects of "Ummah allegiance trumping all other loyalties" among faithful youth is openly being talked on CNN. Has this happened before on Cnn

Anderson 360

In the end it may urn out these two are maladjusted, failing to assimilate pissed off duo who were successful in showing their bile and are claiming Islam and US foreign policies as grievances to justify their heinous crimes. Its like the Maoist bandits who claim to be inspired by Charu Mazumdar and Kanu Sanyal by way of analogy.

Shiv, Can you analyze the elder Tsarnev? I think his turn to Islam is a veneer to cover his failings.
The younger guy despite his appearance of outward success was failing in his grades at UMass-D.

Garooda · Post by **Garooda** » 26 Apr 2013 22:11

OT but Hilarious...

Someone should post this on their most popular forum(s).

Puki_Bus_Driver

US female sailor 28 years old thwarts Dubai bus driver rapist 21 years old after putting him in strangehold with her thighs and then beating him into submission...

She had been attempting to hail a taxi after visiting shopping centre, Mall of the Emirates and a supermarket when a bus pulled up next to her
After climbing aboard she became suspicious of the drivers route. She said: ‘I noticed he did not take the main road and when I asked him he told me not to worry.’
He then drove for a further 10 minutes before stopping in an area where other buses were parked and attempting to kiss her.
When she refused him he pulled the knife and threatened to rape her but she was able to subdue him.
Following the attack, which occurred on January 19 of this year, she left the bus and reported it to her commander at Port Khalid.

The driver, named as K S, from Pakistan, was arrested the next day at his home and the attending police officer said that he was intoxicated at the time.