China Military Watch - Jan 11, 2011

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 25 Apr 2013 08:16

"...The ongoing incident in the Depsang area of the Western Sector of the India-China Boundary is a localised event. This is a sector in which there are differing perceptions of the Line of Actual Control. That is why we have, since 1996 been maintaining that there is a need for both sides to work together in clarifying and confirming the Line of Actual Control", MEA spokesperson, Syed Akbaruddin said on Tuesday.

Anand K · Post by **Anand K** » 25 Apr 2013 08:24

China’s Rapid Reaction Forces: A New Challenge

CLAWS article from 2008.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 25 Apr 2013 10:50

By terming it localise Nayi Dilli wants to keep this issue low profile......chances are there would be some flag meeting , diplomat from both sides meeting on Chai-Pani-Biscuit and India might agree to slow down on infra development on certain areas regaarded disputed and chinese too will back down and go away.

We barely manage to do any thing on Pakistan while they killed our soldier entering our territory few months back and severed his head other then strong bravado statement from Nayi Dilli and Army...........taking on China is many times more challenging overall when there is no losses of life in this case.

Some good exercise for Diplomat to keep them self fit and busy seems they got lazy sitting in North Block AC room

subhamoy.das · Post by **subhamoy.das** » 25 Apr 2013 12:47

RoyG wrote:
subhamoy.das wrote:This is election year and so the UPA will have to act. In general, giving a benefit of doubt to UPA, democracies tend not to start fire fight as it puts its citizens - read soldiers - in harms way but always waits for the second stike - in self defence - to start the fire fight. Autocracies always does the first strike but pays badly in the end.
What you don't seem to understand is that this isn't a a fire fight. It takes two sides to tango for that. This is an execution. They have the rifle and we are the ones blindfolded on our knees. The UPA isn't a democratic entity. They are just as deadly to our civilizational interests as the dragon.

I donot agree that this is execution. I would considere this more like "terrorists" holed up in a hide out kind of situation where we need to be patiance and give diplomcay a chance. What is the rush, it is just a platoon stength , we need not over-react as over reacting seems us look nervous and weak? I am sure we are also doign the right things on the ground which has forced the CHINES to take this step. No body kicks a dead dog. I welcome more such moves from CHINA and PAKI to act as trigger for UPA to act......It was only after the 62 war did Congress started to modernize IA and before that Neheru even wanted to dismante the army!

nitinr · Post by **nitinr** » 25 Apr 2013 13:32

This is just my intution.

This forward posting is to just check our preparedness physically as well as mentally. They want to see what our reaction is going to be and to what level and what are the step ups we do in the escalation ladder. This might be the beginning of something else which is much more big a grand to come.

Just a hunch based on what I have read. This is not a simple confusion over the perception of LAC. Its the pin pricks to check our sensitivity and reaction of the political class / military and aam aadmi..

Neshant · Post by **Neshant** » 25 Apr 2013 13:41

I notice of late they are picking a lot of fights.

With Japan over some islands, with Vietnam over gas fields in the sea, with Phillipines, with the US..etc.

Usually economic depressions lead to war of some kind.

Maybe their economy is tanking and they need some distraction for their population which might otherwise turn on their (unelected) leadership.

aditya.agd · Post by **aditya.agd** » 25 Apr 2013 15:09

India should cut off their supply lines and smoke them out.

kish · Post by **kish** » 25 Apr 2013 15:21

^^^ Neshant ji, There was a spurt of articles in 2009, about 'possible war with' between 2012 - 2014. Military experts were of that opinion. GOI played it down then. May be those military experts are right.

'Nervous' China may attack India by 2012

China may attack India by 2012

Why China may attack India by 2012

Nervous China May Attack India by 2012

rohankumaon · Post by **rohankumaon** » 25 Apr 2013 16:23

All the above articles are based on a single report, however, how credible is this assessment is, we will see soon enough...

vinod · Post by **vinod** » 25 Apr 2013 16:51

China is testing waters and is merely posturing.

India should move into another strategic location fully prepared. Then we are on equal terms to discuss withdrawal. Till then China has the upper hand. If our politicians have the balls to do this, then it will be great. But I doubt it. So, this drama will carry on for sometime till they move into another area. They will keep on escalating till we put our foot down and I'm not sure when we will do that given our CONgress party rule!

member_23360 · Post by **member_23360** » 25 Apr 2013 18:05

Chinese have planned this move, if we do a single mistake, its going to cost us a lot. India has to bring other countries on its side notably US, Russia and then we can think of negotiating with china.

as regard to military option, India has to repeat operation parakaram, we have to secure our borders before going in for offensive. This will take at least a month.

alexis · Post by **alexis** » 25 Apr 2013 18:35

We should move some 10 km inside Chinese side of LAC and stay there till they vacate from our side. Different perceptions of LAC can happen on Indian side too.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 25 Apr 2013 19:56

alexis wrote:We should move some 10 km inside Chinese side of LAC and stay there till they vacate from our side. Different perceptions of LAC can happen on Indian side too.

Not so simple, the Chinese would definitely have something backing their 30 troops and see us militarily weak, we should strike when they don't expect it

sourab_c · Post by **sourab_c** » 25 Apr 2013 20:54

^ None of that is going to happen. Our politicians take our their biting teeth only for their fellow politicians. The way this scenario is going to play out is that Mr. Khurshid is going to go to China and "personally" beg the Chinese to withdraw in exchange of some concession by us. While his concession may compromise our national security in the future, that is all irrelevant as it is too close to election time and a war at this point is out of the equation as it would mean that they will have to divert their attention away from dealing with the opposition.

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 25 Apr 2013 21:17

As India bristles, China tones down rhetoric over Ladakh incursion

As Toning down its rhetoric on incursion in India's Ladakh, China today counselled patience saying favourable conditions should be created for the two countries to solve the issue through friendly consultations.

At separate media briefings, both the Chinese Foreign Ministry and the Defence Ministry maintained that the People's Liberation Army (PLA) had not intruded into India and had not caused any 'provocation'.

Urging the media to be patient, Foreign Ministry spokesperson Hua Chunying said, "We also believe that the two sides will continue to resolve the issue in a friendly manner. We will not let it affect border peace and security and normal development of China-India relations".

"We hope media can keep patience and create favourable conditions for the two countries to solve this issue through friendly consultations", she said.

The Chinese Defence Ministry too refuted reports that its troops and aircraft trespassed across the LAC.

Denying any violations, a ministry spokesman Yang Yujun said that media reports on Chinese border troops, military planes and helicopters crossing the line of actual control are 'not true'.
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rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 25 Apr 2013 21:18

Few observations

Western media is full of anti china articles these days. export imbalance, human rights,Japan etc.

West is NOT taking any note of Ladakh incident. Such loud silence is very strange. Very soon China specialists will come with the theory of some internal friction among different factions in politburo....PLA trying to derail new Prime'rs ouverture towards India bla bla.

Any hint that Bakistan is in the loop with Chinese? Mother seller as they are, they may stage some drama on western front.

abhik · Post by **abhik** » 25 Apr 2013 22:17

Why not surround the camp with land mines? It won't be a direct military attack but would force China's hand. Of course only if pigs could fly...

Brando · Post by **Brando** » 25 Apr 2013 23:08

The best way to get rid of these "rats" is to treat them as such. Use poison.

A small balloon/blimp launched 50-60mts upwind from their camp with a virulent strain of anthrax/microscopic radioactive nano-particles/ebola spores/weaponized botulinum etc could be used to deliver these spores directly into the Chinese camp silently causing them to slowly get infected and then spread that infection back to their home base. The perfect organism would be some form of weaponize Influenza like Bird Flu/Swine Flu etc. It is better to use biological agents than chemical agents as biological agents are much harder to detect, have a longer gestation period and are more easily transmissible maximizing their effects. The other "plus side" is biological weapons can also function as area denial weapons as some agents can "persist" on the soil for years.

Other less lethal alternatives if the MoD wants to "persuade" them to move would be LRAD, Microwave irradiation, tear gas, pepper gas, hashish/opium smoke etc. Hell you can even hook up a bunch of large mirrors, a dozen floodlights and loudspeakers to harass them all night and day.

At any rate, all communications between this camp and their home base should be jammed with immediate effect as a first step.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 26 Apr 2013 01:20

Telly reports say that Chinese helos on earlier occasions, dropped troops who "dismantled" Indian bunkers.It appears that the scale and extent of Chinese incursions have been deliberately concealed from the Indian public.Gen. BKS's briefing to AKA today.Let's see what happens.

Brando,we read of a massive epidemic of swine flu in China.have they perhaps come into Indian territory to infect us?

PS:The visiting Chinese PM should be quarantined if he sets foot on Indian spoil too!

chanakyaa · Post by **chanakyaa** » 26 Apr 2013 02:57

Few observations

Western media is full of anti china articles these days. export imbalance, human rights,Japan etc.

West is NOT taking any note of Ladakh incident. Such loud silence is very strange.....

West loves China more than India. Just look at how much of day-to-day, low-tech, high-tech products make its way to western markets. West would oppose China in areas that directly or indirectly (with respect to countries which are dependent on them including Japan). If the odds of China and India getting into conflict creep higher, it only means more recycling of thollars, more weepon sales etc..win win for goree chamdi

subhamoy.das · Post by **subhamoy.das** » 26 Apr 2013 16:06

I am not sure how many of u have actually see the telegraph today. It did run a very informative article. I came to know, for first time, that there has been a solid response on the ground. CHINA pitched 4 tents and IA pithced 8 right in front of its nose. It clearly showed our line or perception and theirs and how patrols from both side crosses each others. IA can easily outflank them and pitch tents behind but that would be a unnecessary escalation at this time. We are also responding with go-back banners. So there has been response. But unlike PAKI border, these responses are more with loud speakers and banners and not bullets. In the past, when a CHINESE incursion was surrounded , it was loud speaker war for years even then. Interesting....At some point I feel that CHINA is following its own words - appear strong when weak....

dinesha · Post by **dinesha** » 26 Apr 2013 16:27

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1130426/j ... XpG9LVmiSp

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 26 Apr 2013 19:17

Chinese troops have erected tents 19km inside Indian territory: Govt

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The meeting of the committee was cut short as members were dissatisfied with the insufficient information provided by the officials and they were asked to report back at the next meeting on May 30 with appropriate and exact details of the situation.
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member_23455 · Post by **member_23455** » 26 Apr 2013 19:33

After a week of pretty justified angst about the dysfunctional nature of the Indian national security establishment, maybe it's time to see the positives that will flow from this, again typical of the way in which we only seem to react in crisis:

1. Sanction and rapid (Indian style rapid) completion of road network in Ladakh.

2. Mountain Strike Corps proposals to get pushed through Finance Ministry babus.

3. A more favorable Indian response to the not so subtle Pacific Pivot agenda that the US has been selling us for the past few years.

4. Agni V, VI, whatever getting greenlighted at least for development tests.

None of this will cure the deep rooted malaise that afflicts our national security structures, but I think the forces at least will take what they can get.

Eric Leiderman · Post by **Eric Leiderman** » 27 Apr 2013 00:17

The Idea of blasting them with Microwave energy over a period of time, makes sense.
Once the Princes realize their bravodo has consequences on the libido, we might see less erection s .... of tents

aditya.agd · Post by **aditya.agd** » 27 Apr 2013 00:20

Now they will move 10 more miles. India will claim peace and then Chinese will talk and talk and talk....

If this was any other country including Vietnam, they would have taken some action but indian government is just sitting....

aditya.agd · Post by **aditya.agd** » 27 Apr 2013 00:22

If Indian government is hiding something then let Indians know about it

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 27 Apr 2013 01:02

Aksai pradesh in slow motion?

In Eastern Ladakh, the 45-kilometre long Skakjung area is the only winter pasture land for the nomads of Chushul, Tsaga, Nidar, Nyoma, Mud, Dungti, Kuyul, Loma villages. The area sustains 80,000 sheep/goats and 4,000 yak/ ponies during winter. They consume over 75,000 quintals of tama or dry forage, worth Rs 10 crore annually. The Chinese advance here intensified after 1986, causing huge scarcity of surface grass, even starvation for Indian livestock. Since 1993, the modus operandi of Chinese incursions has been to scare Indian herdsmen into abandoning grazing land and then to construct permanent structures.

Until the mid-1980s, the boundary lay at Kegu Naro — a day-long march from Dumchele, where India had maintained a forward post till 1962. In the absence of Indian activities, Chinese traders arrived in Dumchele in the early 1980s and China gradually constructed permanent roads, buildings and military posts here. The prominent grazing spots lost to China include Nagtsang (1984), Nakung (1991) and Lungma-Serding (1992). The last bit of Skakjung was taken in December 2008. The PLA has also moved armoured troops into Charding Nalla since 2009. It could eventually threaten the Manali-Leh route.

China’s assertion in Ladakh has grown after it built infrastructure in its Ngari area to develop Kailash-Manasarovar into a tourist complex to attract affluent Chinese. Ngari’s rapid development was a precursor of things to come. China may be applying the Sino-India Guiding Principle (2005) to consolidate its position, for it knows that only 0.6 per cent of the Ladakh region is inhabited. The PLA used nomadism as an instrument for incursion. The migration of Changpa nomads on specific routes has been a key component of national security, something India has never understood. The imposition of multiple restrictions by our authorities has led to a massive shrinking of pastureland and the de-nomadisation of Changthang Ladakh, adversely impacting national security.

Shows lack of foresight especially in Ladakh.

skganji · Post by **skganji** » 27 Apr 2013 03:03

aditya.agd wrote:If Indian government is hiding something then let Indians know about it

It is trying to hide but the information is coming out in bits and pieces. It seems that MEA is the culprit in handling the border issue with China. Please see the details on this article .It clearly says how MEA is goofing up and not doing anything

Source : TribuneIndia.

The Indian Army and the Ministry of Defence appears to be miffed at the Ministry of External Affairs the way it has shied away from talking tough to Beijing since 1986 when first Chinese troops intruded into the Indian side in Ladakh region of Jammu and Kashmir.

“The MEA was told several times that it should talk tough and get the boundary demarcated so that the Chinese could be shown their place and it was also clearly stated that today’s India is not that of 1962,” a source told The Tribune.

When the frequency of intrusions, some have calculated it close to 300 in the past 27 years, registered a sharp rise in 2009, the Army and the MoD asked the MEA that it should assert and get the Line of Actual Control (LAC) demarcated so that such situations don’t recur.

The factual position on the ground is that the cold desert where mountains of sand stand tall, it is very difficult to put a barbed wire fence and demarcate the border, but a line can be drawn with rocks which separate China from the India on the LAC. “This is what we had been pleading with the MEA, because it is not the job of the Army to draw lines, they can only guard the frontiers.”

At Daulat Beg Oldie, India did reactivate its airfield on May 31, 2008, and also started work to pave the road, but forgot thereafter every thing. Few trial flights and the airfield was rendered into disuse. Similar thing happened when Fukche airfield was activated on November 4 in the same year. In September 2009, it reactivated Nyoma airfield where Indians could ferry their troops in AN-32 aircraft.

The current intrusion and setting up of the tented post by Chinese in DBO area, close to Aksai Chin that India lost to China in 1962 war, is unprecedented even by the deepest of the deep intrusion inside the Indian side of the LAC.

Another threat looms large that Chinese may attempt to vitiate the atmosphere further by surrounding the DBO airfield. These matters have come up in the strategic sessions of the Indian Army and the only answer they have found is that Indian Bair Force and Indian Army’s aviation corps should start the flights to the three airfields, but the problem that they have analysed is that the airstrips were not repaired after the initial euphoria over resuming the flights over there. The vagaries of weather have damaged the air strips at the forward landing airfields.

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 27 Apr 2013 03:25

IAF resumes supplies to Army units in DBO area

PTI | 08:04 PM,Apr 26,2013

New Delhi, Apr 26 (PTI) After having briefly halted its operations in the Daulat Beg Oldi (DBO) area in Ladakh after the incursion by Chinese troops, IAF has resumed its operations to supply rations to the Indian Army units deployed there. The Indian Air Force had briefly halted its operations in the area after the incursion took place on April 15 but it has now started dropping supplies for the troops in that area using its helicopters, government sources told PTI here. The Army depot for gathering and distributing supplies to the units deployed in the DBO area is at a short distance from the place where Indian and Chinese troops face each other, they said. IAF uses its Mi-17-V5 choppers to keep the supply lines open for the ground troops based there. About four years ago, IAF had reactivated the Advanced Landing Ground (ALG) at DBO by landing an An-32 transport aircraft there. The force has operated all its major transport aircraft including the latest C-130J Super Hercules planes at ALG. Meanwhile, to find ways of resolving the incursion issue, Army Chief Gen Bikram Singh today met National Security Adviser (NSA) Shivshankar Menon to brief him about the various military options before the government. The Army has already given several options to the government including that of using force for resolving the situation. Several meetings of the China Study Group headed by Menon and other forums have taken place following the incursion. PTI AJD SC

Will · Post by **Will** » 27 Apr 2013 04:13

India needs that mountain strike corps up and running asap.But having said that thought this was more to take care of the eastern sector. Maybe another of the existing corps should be converted into a mountain strike corps to care of the Pak-China Axis in the North.

Having said that , have the Chinese really lost it? With how many countries will they take panga at the same time? The Japanese, the south east Asian nations everyone and now India? Even the US cant stretch itself so thin.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 27 Apr 2013 09:42

MEA take its share of the blame , but the IAF+IA have only themselves to blame for not establishing a strong presence in these ALG with regular supply sorties and buildup. no way is the MEA involved in that. if they had no intent to operate them as regular bases, then why the expense and media circus of activating them?

this truth was also hidden until now.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 27 Apr 2013 10:20

18 km inside Indian territory.If that is not an "invasion" or at least 'deep intrusion" then what do you cal it? Quite rightly Mulayam has asked why our For.Sec. is going to Beijing,to "kowtow" perhaps?

If we are going to set up advanced landing grounds,as at DBO,we should have the troops on the ground to protect it as well.The extreme self-delusion of the regime of eunuchs is why we are now in sh*t street.Right now without field artillery and ammo for the heights,as well as the plains-as was so graphically conveyed to the GOI by Gen. VKS,we are in no position to take on the Chinese a spat at the present moment.We should within the next few months,on a war footing,beef up the army in its stance against the Chinese as much as possible,plugging the gaps wherever can be done.A diplomatic offensive to wound the Chinese in equal measure should commence.Withdrawing our stance on Tibet and following up with a deeper relationship with the Tibetan govt. in exile should take place right away.There are differences even in the western states viewpoint of China,Tibet and HH the Dalai Lama.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/ap ... a-hollande
Blow for Cameron as China welcomes Hollande

Beijing punishes PM for his meeting with Dalai Lama while French president gets full state visit treatment

Blow for Cameron as China welcomes Hollande
Beijing punishes PM for his meeting with Dalai Lama while French president gets full state visit treatment

Nicholas Watt, chief political correspondent
guardian.co.uk, Friday 26 April 2013 20.00 BST

French president François Hollande meets Chinese president Xi Jinping in Beijing
The French president, François Hollande, meets his Chinese counterpart, Xi Jinping, in the Great Hall of the People in Beijing, China. Photograph: Pool/Getty Images

David Cameron's mission to change the focus of British foreign policy by boosting trade links suffered a setback after Downing Street was forced to abandon a trip to China as Beijing punished the prime minister for meeting the Dalai Lama.

In a blow to Cameron, who had hoped to hold an annual summit with the Chinese leadership, the French president François Hollande was on Friday feted in Shanghai on a full state visit a few weeks after the prime minister was due to visit China.

Cameron is understood to have abandoned the planned trip after Beijing indicated that he was unlikely to be granted meetings with senior figures. He is now expected to visit in the autumn, two years after his first and only visit as prime minister.

Britain accepts that Beijing is exacting punishment after Cameron met the Dalai Lama, the spiritual leader of Tibet, at St Paul's Cathedral last May. The meeting, which was similar to Gordon Brown's discussions with the Dalai Lama at Lambeth Palace in 2008, was designed to minimise offence in China by showing that Britain regards him as a spiritual leader. Downing Street has made clear to Beijing that it accepts Tibet is part of the People's Republic of China.

Government sources said that tentative plans for the prime minister to visit China this month were put on hold before his visit to India in February for the simple reason that the new Chinese leadership only took over in March. Cameron spoke to Li Keqiang, his new Chinese counterpart, after his appointment.

But the Guardian understands from diplomatic sources that a visit was firmly placed in the prime minister's diary for earlier this month. This was abandoned when it became clear that the prime minister would be denied the access usually granted to a G8 leader.

Douglas Alexander, the shadow foreign secretary who has just returned from China, told the Guardian: "David Cameron came to office claiming he would prioritise the UK's diplomatic and trade relationship with China, and yet the real difficulties in relations have now been laid bare. I was in China this week and it is clear that the new Chinese leadership are focused on the French president's visit, along with a large number of French companies looking for business.

"In the past, UK prime ministers have met with the Dalai Lama without the deterioration in relations with China that we are now seeing. For all of their initial boasts and bluster, the UK government has lacked a strategic or a joined-up approach to China since it came to office, and that's now showing."

A No 10 source said: "Of course, as any good diary planner would, we pencil in early on dates when the prime minister could potentially travel overseas without going firm on destinations. We decided several weeks ago that we wanted to visit some European capitals in the time we had earlier this month. When the prime minister and Premier Li Keqiang spoke in March they looked forward to meeting in due course."

Officials said trade with China is still rising and the two countries are on course to achieve £1bn in bilateral trade by 2015. Exports to China grew 13.4% last year.

But the decision to abandon the visit is a personal setback for Cameron, who said after coming to office that he would place trade at the heart of foreign policy, with a particular emphasis on the so-called Bric countries of Brazil, Russia, India and China. A visit to India in February fell flat after private complaints that the prime minister appeared to regard the country as a trading opportunity rather than an emerging world power.

Hollande was greeted by Xi Jinping, the new Chinese president, when he arrived in Beijing with his partner Valerie Trierweiler on Thursday. They agreed to hold an annual summit – Cameron's original aspiration when he first visited China in November 2010 – after Hollande said he hoped to build a "multipolar" world. This is the classic French ambition to ensure the US cannot dominate the world in a "unipolar" world.

Cui Hongjian, director of European Studies at the China Institute of International Studies, a foreign ministry thinktank, told the South China Morning Post that this message was well received in Beijing. "France sometimes has different ideas from the US. China may co-operate with France."

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 27 Apr 2013 12:01

Perhaps delhi thought symbolic gestures like activating alg and then abandoning them again would scare the panda . Rotfl.

I question the sagacity of the ia and iaf also if they went along with such a stupid scheme without leaking the thing into the media.

Seems to be a lot pf skeletons in the closet. How and when was sumdrong chu, hailed as a great victory at the time, lost again to the chinese ? This kind of thing is never tolerated in right thinking nations.

ashish raval · Post by **ashish raval** » 27 Apr 2013 12:23

^^ I clearly see this as Indian army failure to protect the borders, no matter what. However, this is no wonder for a nation which does not stand by its people and armed forces.

Sabyasachi · Post by **Sabyasachi** » 27 Apr 2013 12:36

Singha wrote:Perhaps delhi thought symbolic gestures like activating alg and then abandoning them again would scare the panda . Rotfl.

I question the sagacity of the ia and iaf also if they went along with such a stupid scheme without leaking the thing into the media.

Seems to be a lot pf skeletons in the closet. How and when was sumdrong chu, hailed as a great victory at the time, lost again to the chinese ? This kind of thing is never tolerated in right thinking nations.

Our leaders are not the leaders like other nations have they are in power to enjoy the impunity to scam. Then there is a communication gap as they are literally illiterate to understand strategic visions, can be easily mislead by people who are directly responsible for power projection and deterrence against such land grab by hostile neighbors. Or They all are in a symbiotic relationship of convenience not accountability, to mislead the nation after such blunders.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 27 Apr 2013 14:09

vishvak wrote: In Eastern Ladakh, the 45-kilometre long Skakjung area is the only winter pasture land for the nomads of Chushul, Tsaga, Nidar, Nyoma, Mud, Dungti, Kuyul, Loma villages. The area sustains 80,000 sheep/goats and 4,000 yak/ ponies during winter. They consume over 75,000 quintals of tama or dry forage, worth Rs 10 crore annually. The Chinese advance here intensified after 1986, causing huge scarcity of surface grass, even starvation for Indian livestock. Since 1993, the modus operandi of Chinese incursions has been to scare Indian herdsmen into abandoning grazing land and then to construct permanent structures.

<SNIP>

Thanks for posting this. One of the most informed articles on the area.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 27 Apr 2013 14:18

Singha wrote:MEA take its share of the blame , but the IAF+IA have only themselves to blame for not establishing a strong presence in these ALG with regular supply sorties and buildup. no way is the MEA involved in that. if they had no intent to operate them as regular bases, then why the expense and media circus of activating them?

this truth was also hidden until now.

DBO has been always air maintained by choppers operating out of THOISE and Leh; the ALG was to test the ability to land AN-32 type of a/c there.

As for regular sorties to the area by AN-32 type of aircraft - what purpose will they serve? There are hardly any troops on the ground which require AN-32 to support them. Choppers do that role. If GOI permits placing more troops in the actual DBO theater than using an AN-32 makes sense. The entire NE is littered with such ALG which are lifeline of that area.

To keep the ALG operational does not mean AN-32/C-130 need to land there; there needs to be support staff on the ground to ensure that ALG is kept in a condition where it can be used at short-notice.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 27 Apr 2013 15:31

I think it was quite clear even in 1986 that a soft approach to chinese border will only result in creeping nibbling which duly occured under the guise of peace n tranqility protocols over the last twenty years. Maybe ia had their reasons to play along like focussed on fighting the last war with tsp.

But in process they seem to have forgotten about the next war with china, unduly rudely awaken a couple years ago but the by that had set in on the border and the infra in tibet.

Goi needs to come clean with a white paper on what was no mans land from twenty years ago and what is the ground situation now wrt chinese paermanent structure occupation and areas where both sides patrol.

Let the people know the balance sheet instead of hiding under the fig leaf of tranquility and because such losses are easy to hide being off limits to media.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 27 Apr 2013 18:20

Chinese officer hints at country’s big aircraft carrier plans

"The next aircraft carrier we need will be larger and carry more fighters," says Song Xue, deputy chief of staff of the Chinese navy.

Song says the current carrier falls directly under the command of naval headquarters, and is not assigned to any of China's three fleets. This is consistent with previous Chinese statements that the ship is not intended for operational use, but rather as a testbed for exploring carrier operations and doctrine. The Liaoning can carry up to 30 fighters, according to the official.

Significantly, Song says China's future carriers will embark not only fighters, but "reconnaissance aircraft, anti-submarine aircraft, electronic countermeasures planes, and rotary-wing aircraft". A composite air wing such as this demands a carrier with catapult assisted take-off but arrested recovery (CATOBAR) capability. The only nations that operate such warships are the USA and France.

Despite his positive comments about China's naval airpower ambitions, Song dismissed media speculation that a follow-on carrier is under construction in Shanghai.