Civil Aviation Development & Discussion

Arunkumar · Post by **Arunkumar** » 02 Jun 2013 14:52

Chankian mallus add another feather in their tourism cap by completing the first project report for operating sea planes to high density tourist circuit.

http://www.trkl.in/FDR/fdr.html

Given the abundance of water bodies in all 14 districts of kerala, the plan is to connect some of these with sea planes operating out of regular airports. The initial plan it seems to connect thiruvananthapuram airport and kochi airport to Ashtamudi - punnamda - vembanad lake - munnar - cochin backwaters locations.

Good Read.

There is some confusion in website. They have started a new org kerala tourism infra ltd with the address www.ktil.in. However it doesnt seem to work. All queries direct to trkl.in address.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 03 Jun 2013 15:35

What else ? Another tale of woe for the new Chennai domestic airport.

Rain finds holes in newly built airport terminal - New Indian Express

It appears as if nature holds something against the new terminals at the Chennai Airport. Barely two weeks after a strong gust of wind brought down a large portion of the false ceiling at the new domestic terminal (T-2), seepage of rainwater forced officials to shut down an escalator on Sunday. Both events occurred within 45 days of the terminal opening its doors.

According to sources with Airports Authority of India (AAI), rainwater entered the domestic terminal through an emergency window near the H3 and H4 gates, and wet the carpeted floor before spreading inward. “It got close to escalators coming from the first floor to the ground floor and it was shut down briefly as a precautionary measure,” explained an official. Though most of the city was cloudy, rainfall lashed the airport with the aerodrome Met office recording 90.1 mm of rainfall on Sunday afternoon.

As the two gates were used by passengers to board buses for their flights, travellers were taken aback. Sources added that rainwater entered the aerobridges through the access gates. Rekha Agarwal, a medico who boarded an evening flight, said, “We were about to board the flight after a long delay when we walked to the lower level towards gate 10. While standing in the line, I noticed a dark stain slowly spreading on the grey carpet.” However, airport officials dismissed the matter as ‘trivial’ and attributed it to teething troubles.

Considering the fact that the Rs 2,200 crore terminals have plush grey-and-red stripe carpeting throughout, even small amounts of water entering the building will take a while to dry. While major airlines reported only minor delays, film industry sources said Bollywood actor Ajay Devgn, who was on a chartered flight from Mumbai to Chennai to attend the audio launch of Suriya’s Singam 2, was stalled by the rain. Apparently, the pilot diverted the aircraft to Bangalore and the audio launch began without him.

Abhijeet · Post by **Abhijeet** » 03 Jun 2013 23:45

Unbelievable. What a chankian strategy to use infrastructure efficiently. After all, as long as none of the panels falls on a plane, no major harm done. A little water in the terminal is no big deal.

As always, India uses its resources for maximum efficiency.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 04 Jun 2013 09:05

blr airport phase2 T1 expansion is nearing the end for external structure and roof. it looked quite complete last weekend. the internal stuff is likely being worked on now. the roof looks very graceful like the curved wing section of a huge spaceship or ski jump of a carrier.

the only complaint I have is passengers going to/from car park or bus stand have to cross 3 driveways on foot which is used for taxis and vip vehicles to pick or drop passengers. every min or so a staff has to manually signal the cars to stop and let people pass.

even now it can be fixed by building a powered ramp and horizontal moving belt near the two corners of expanded terminal - it should really be fixed as I have not seen a 20mil pax airport that is lacking this basic feature. let it slope underground and come up again at the terminal to minimize above ground rework.

if they want to go chinese, scrap the current car parks which have narrow aisles and build a new car park across the main road ...run a monorail system from there to one end of the terminal. or maybe some buses.

Merril · Post by **Merril** » 04 Jun 2013 09:12

Singha wrote: if they want to go chinese, scrap the current car parks which have narrow aisles and build a new car park across the main road ...run a monorail system from there to one end of the terminal. or maybe some buses.

No can do Singha saar. The current master plan puts the second runway and terminal two (or is it three) on the other side of the main road. The master plan actually has a C-Shaped terminal complex - the main road runs into this somewhat like this C----

However, the ramp plus escalator idea is easily executable, even if it is a little expensive.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 04 Jun 2013 09:34

its got to be a ramp all through at shallow angle because because will be having luggage trolleys, the discrete steps of a escalator will not do. plus lifts for people who need wheelchair, old people, people who are scared of the moving belt.
its a routine feature at all leading airports worldwide.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 04 Jun 2013 10:12

arvin wrote:Chankian mallus add another feather in their tourism cap by completing the first project report for operating sea planes to high density tourist circuit.

Yep, the inaugural flight was yesterday. This seems to be a good idea, and let us wait to see its usage etc. How ever being the 100% literate state there were the usual thamashas as well. The flight did not land at Punnamada lake, because the fisherfolk out there felt that such planes would finish of the fishes there.

With the abundance of water bodies and being close to the seas there were some earlier plans to start a water highway by using big high speed boats to ferry people to various places in Kerala. The idea was that good fast big boats/or small size ships would be able to carry large number of people all across Kerala at a faster pace than trains/buses etc.

Arunkumar · Post by **Arunkumar** » 04 Jun 2013 10:32

Oh! already opposed the flight. Good start. Probably in munnar the tea garden workers might object.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 04 Jun 2013 11:09

professional indian fishermen usually lay nets at night after dusk and collect in predawn hours to get fresh fish into market.
so if the seaplanes operate at daytime only there should not be a problem, no more atleast than having 100s of ketu vellams and smaller boats plying their trade in the day. at the night the ketu vellams too need to anchor ashore and are not permitted to go out both for safety and to leave the field free for the fishermen.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 04 Jun 2013 23:16

Why didn't BLR masterplan call for separate arrival and departure levels from the outset ? While the general organization outside is way better than the HAL cowshed before it, they could still have separated levels considering the height of the terminal building.

Zynda · Post by **Zynda** » 05 Jun 2013 00:49

Suraj, apparently separated arrival & departure levels will be incorporated in BIAL Terminal 2. Ideally it should have been present in the existing terminal as well...

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 05 Jun 2013 07:46

'Sting' operation at Chennai airport - The Hindu

On Tuesday, air passengers at Chennai airport were welcomed with a sting.

Around 5 p.m., some passengers were reportedly stung by bees outside the Indian Airlines counter on the departure level of the new domestic terminal, said an official of the Airports Authority of India.

The bees must have come from the hive hanging on the airside of the new terminal, the official said. Workers from the Central Warehousing Corporation were called in to attend to the problem. They used smoke and chemicals to kill the bees. “Passengers were seen running helter-skelter after the bees attacked them. We have to find a solution to the bee problem at the earliest,” said another official.

On Monday, The Hindu reported that passengers on board a Jet Airways flight from Chennai to New Delhi, on May 29, saw honey bees near the aircraft wing. The flight was delayed by 15 minutes owing to this problem. Another official said he also spotted a bee hive on the airside of the new international terminal.

D. Sudhakar Reddy of Air Passengers Association of India said, “It is unfair to subject the passengers to such problems at the Chennai airport. What kind of system are we running here? There should be a staff to inspect the terminal constantly to ensure that passengers don’t face such issues.”

Bee attacks have happened at the Chennai airport in the past too.

In March 2006, an Indian Airbus flight was delayed by 45 minutes when bees covered the nose of the jet. In November 2010 too, a Kingfisher flight was delayed by half an hour after bees surrounded the aircraft wing.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 05 Jun 2013 20:15

on another note, sparrows inside BIAL are common. saw a few pecking food scraps off the floor recently.
not sure how much damage they do if anything.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 05 Jun 2013 20:44

Zynda wrote:Suraj, apparently separated arrival & departure levels will be incorporated in BIAL Terminal 2. Ideally it should have been present in the existing terminal as well...

Thanks Zynda. Yes, it should have been there in the existing T1. HYD has it, and the latter turned out to be a better design overall, from what folks on SSC say, and report pictures of; I've only personally been to BLR.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 08 Jun 2013 07:46

New Cell to Improve Facilities at Chennai Airport - The Hindu

Key Infrastructure Development (KID) Cell has been formed to push forward the public-private-partnership mode in “certain identified” airports. Chennai may be one of the first airports to be professionally managed through PPP route, say officials of Airports Authority of India (AAI) and Civil Aviation Ministry. The cell has been mainly formed to speed up this process. This means the air passengers will get better facilities which the airport currently lacks, said an official in the Civil Aviation Ministry.

“I’m not at all happy with the way the airport is maintained. Also, the CISF and AAI officials are constantly at loggerheads. Due to this, once, even I was denied entry and locked up at a point inside the airport briefly,” he said.

Water seepage inside the new domestic terminal has turned into a nagging issue for passengers during rains, said an AAI official.

“The cell comprising five AAI members may be nodal point for executing the project; such a cell was formed when Mumbai and Delhi airports were privatised too, said another official.

What is the use if the incompetent and clueless AAI officials, who have already thoroughly messed up both the new domesti & international terminals, are once again members of the cell to 'improve facilities' ? Throw out the AAI lock, stock an barrel from Chennai airport.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 08 Jun 2013 22:28

SSridhar wrote:

What is the use if the incompetent and clueless AAI officials, who have already thoroughly messed up both the new domesti & international terminals, are once again members of the cell to 'improve facilities' ? Throw out the AAI lock, stock an barrel from Chennai airport.

Having used a few times both domestic and international new terminals at chennai , I did not have courage to post few photographs at the forum. It was such a bad impression. Then news started pouring in of false ceiling collapse and water logging. Now in last visit I noticed distinct lack of cleanliness. But still worse is the way the whole terminal is designed. I think it is high time it is handed over to some better management. I echo what you say.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 09 Jun 2013 09:16

of late AAI airports have realized the essence of putting the toilets under central AC as well. earlier the toilet were not AC, but had noisy exhaust fans and a pungent smell of urine apart from being suddenly 10C hotter than AC terminal area. this time in GAU noticed the toilets were AC and ok. the old system of pisspot emptying into a salt encrusted open drain along the floor is also gone, it goes internal now.

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 14 Jun 2013 14:13

http://www.rediff.com/business/slide-sh ... 0614.htm#1

Officials from the City and Industrial Development Corporation (Cidco) on Thursday expressed fears that the proposed international airport at Navi Mumbai could become unviable due to cost escalation, following prolonged delays.

"Increase in project cost is a matter of serious concern and further delays may lead to winding up of the project and transferring it to Chakan in Pune district or elsewhere in Maharashtra," a Cidco official, who did not want to be identified, told Business Standard.

manish · Post by **manish** » 14 Jun 2013 14:33

A350 lifts off on maiden flight

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 14 Jun 2013 21:09

IGI airport gets world's second best airport award

NEW DELHI: Indira Gandhi International Airport has been named the world's second best airport in the 25-40 million passengers category by the Airport Council International. The airport also has been adjudged as the fourth best in the world among 199 airports across all categories.

A nine-member team, comprising representatives from airport operator Delhi International Airport Limited (DIAL), Central Industrial Security Force, Airport Operations Control and Air India received the 'ACI ASQ Award' at an award ceremony organized by the Airport Council International (ACI) in Istanbul, Turkey on Thursday. "This recognition is testimony to the efforts of all our employees and partners who have consistently met the expectations of the industry," DIAL CEO I Prabhakar Rao said.

IGI airport scored 4.83 out of 5 on the Airport Service Quality (ASQ) scale.

IGI has managed to retain its position of second best airport in the 25-40 million passengers per annum category for 2012 year.

The airport had an ASQ score of 3.02 in 2007 and ranked last among the 101 participating airports of the world. The airport has an annual capacity of over 60 million passengers, but in 2012, around 34.2 million passengers passed through it.

IGI handled around 550,000 tonnes of cargo and over 300,000 aircraft movements during the same period.

Since its inception in 2006, the ASQ Awards have become the world's leading airport passenger satisfaction benchmark with over 275 airports participating in it.

The ASQ Awards recognise and reward the best airports in the world based on ACI's ASQ passenger satisfaction survey done on uniform format worldwide and represent an opportunity to celebrate the commitment of airports worldwide to continually improve passenger experience.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 15 Jun 2013 06:06

friend of mine is stuck in and out of a AI plane to singapore for 8 hrs now in mumbai providing live updates and pix on facebook

apparently no pilot was available or the pilots overshot their duty time and forced to be on rest. the people boarded, spent hours on plane, arguments with officials on ground , 50% decided to sleep on plane, 50% came on bus....the usual....one pix showed people roaming around on the ground near the stairs on tha tarmac itself! AI had to organize inbound immigration to even move them all back to the terminal.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 15 Jun 2013 09:06

OK,Huge problem in IGI Airport Delhi.

I landed in delhi on a Lufthansa flight at 9 PM. My connecting domestic flight was next morning. So what was I and my fellow passengers to do for almost 12-15 hrs overnight?
There is a very small, post box sized waiting area for domestic passengers with all of 20 odd seats, and roughly 200 passengers waiting for their morning flight.

The other option is to step out into bad bad delhi and go to a hotel and sleep overnight. I dunno if the hotel at IGI (which is 10,000 Rs a night) will accept people who have domestic flights to catch. The last time I checked, they didn't accept passengers with connecting domestic flights to stay there!

This is a crazy state of affairs, worse than waiting at a railway station overnight for a connecting morning train. Right after you arrive in Delhi, the traditional Indian welcome starts!

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 15 Jun 2013 09:12

Went to the new Kolkata airport.
Firstly they don't allow visitors to come inside the terminal, you're expected to say bye-bye from outside.
The airport is still under construction, finishing touches are still being given.

And then since this airport is being managed by the sarkari AAI, there are already posters on every pillar, opposing privatization.

I did manage to get inside (Don't ask, won't tell). The airport is nicely built.
One can immediately identify sarkari AAI employees vs the private airline staff. The AAI employees are older / elderly, unhealthy, poorly dressed, surly & walk around with an attitude. The private airline staff are kids fresh out of college, smartly dressed in western outfits - boys and girls.

CCU needs to be out of AAI's clutches and into a private operator's hands ASAP.

Delhi airport has I felt that most of their staff were female, with a few boys thrown in.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 15 Jun 2013 09:23

If you are not a Dilli billi or a Mumbai Manoos or you have not come on a local business trip to the city you have no reason to fly in there...is what they are saying. Transit passengers are an after thought. It is true of other airports too perhaps. But if you are flying in to Chennai, Kochi or Bengaluru you are not transiting to another place the same night from there, them not being hubs. But Dilli and Mumbai want to be hubs, yet transit services provided are like mofussil airports.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 15 Jun 2013 09:25

I flew Lufthansa from Massaland to Germany, then from Germany to India.

The flight was mostly africans going to catch connecting flights via germany. The airhostesess and stewards are a racist bunch on the massa-germany leg. They interacted, joked, smiled with the gora passangers, but gave a cold shoulder to the boor africans - even forgot to ask them drinks! Me on the other hand - kinda outspoken did straighten a few of the girls out. I pointed out that they didn't offer any drinks to my Africa bound co-passenger. I got a cold stare, and I answered, my co-passenger will expect better service than this. The staff was VERY polite and VERY careful with me. Its a shame that something like this would happen in Lufthansa, but I am certain, these creeps have been doing this for a very long time.

The germany-India leg, was much much better. The flight stewards and air hostesses took care of all the passengers adequately. But case in point - even our own Air Parasite's flight stewards are more hospitable!

And the food on Lufthansa was atrocious! Boiled chicken! No effing taste! I was handed a vegetarian plate (Gawd knows how they had that or figured I would like that) but that was much better than lufthansa's chicken dish.

Moral of the story - DON'T FLY LUFTHANSA, Air FRANCE or British Airway. (Air France was given a solid thumbs down by N^3 a few years ago).

Fly Qatar, Emirates, Jet Airways. Even Air Parasite is better than these ouiropean airlines.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 15 Jun 2013 09:31

I have been saying the same things. The only Oiropean airline worth the money is Virgin Atlantic, rest are selective in their service quality to non-whites. Lufthansa is particularly bad from past experience while traveling with family and a small kid. Made us walk out with baby in a snow storm. I have never tried them since for a decade now. From your description it looks worse than it was then.

Sriman · Post by **Sriman** » 16 Jun 2013 18:39

BIAL is no Dilli T3 but i like the airport, especially after GVK took over. I haven't been to HYD airport, but dad who's been to HYD was very impressed.

I think the issues with Oiropean airlines for desi passengers has been well established by now. I will not fly through Europe if i can help it (haven't tried Brussels yet, so not sure about that) especially CDG.

Zynda · Post by **Zynda** » 16 Jun 2013 19:04

BIAL should be even more impressive once T1 expansion is complete and open for passengers. The only thing which sucks right now is going to BIAL...it has been promised by the contractor, the fly over will be completed by year end. I reckon it will be year or two before the entire stretch is "signal free".

The new MIAL terminal is shaping up to be really gorgeous. Check out SSC forum for some sample interior pics.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Jun 2013 21:04

Water logging in igi airport today t3

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 16 Jun 2013 21:48

It happened last year as well when baggage system was water logged and air india employees were bringing baggage through lift rather than it coming by conveyor belt. Took almost one hour + to get it.

We mostly dont learn from past experience and improve before next strike.

Javee · Post by **Javee** » 17 Jun 2013 01:49

Gagan wrote:OK,Huge problem in IGI Airport Delhi.

I landed in delhi on a Lufthansa flight at 9 PM. My connecting domestic flight was next morning. So what was I and my fellow passengers to do for almost 12-15 hrs overnight?
There is a very small, post box sized waiting area for domestic passengers with all of 20 odd seats, and roughly 200 passengers waiting for their morning flight.

The other option is to step out into bad bad delhi and go to a hotel and sleep overnight. I dunno if the hotel at IGI (which is 10,000 Rs a night) will accept people who have domestic flights to catch. The last time I checked, they didn't accept passengers with connecting domestic flights to stay there!

In T3, there is Plaza lounge; They provide hourly rooms inside the airport, cost about Rs.4500 for seven hours, stayed there recently, a lot better option than going in to the city.

Kakkaji · Post by **Kakkaji** » 17 Jun 2013 02:46

Sriman wrote:I think the issues with Oiropean airlines for desi passengers has been well established by now. I will not fly through Europe if i can help it (haven't tried Brussels yet, so not sure about that) especially CDG.

People on US West Coast have the option to fly the Pacific route to go to India an thus avoid Europe and European airlines. But what choices do those of us on the East Coast have if we don't want to transit through a European airport to go to India?

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 17 Jun 2013 07:29

I have been transiting through the middle east for the last decade mostly, except while flying Air India. No complaints so far. The choice is many from Qatar, Emirates, Gulf Air, Etihad, Jet. The only hurdle left in flying non-stops to India from the east coast is Dilli and Mumbai.

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 17 Jun 2013 08:23

chaanakya wrote:IGI airport gets world's second best airport award

NEW DELHI: Indira Gandhi International Airport has been named the world's second best airport in the 25-40 million passengers category by the Airport Council International. The airport also has been adjudged as the fourth best in the world among 199 airports across all categories.

Best airport my a$$
http://www.ndtv.com/article/cities/delh ... ter-380351

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 17 Jun 2013 08:52

Kairali airlines to commence operations from November 1
Need to see how long this will survive or its viability. Maybe it will be useful for intra-state connectivity along with the recently launched seaplane project to promote tourism.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 17 Jun 2013 11:08

such flooding events and disasters happen at many places worldwide. NYC didnt cut a pretty figure during their storm either.

no need to indulge in the usual muharram of self-whipping imo...our nightly media already has it on the daily to-do list.

I was stuck at newark airport for 6 hrs, during a moderate rainstorm because except for heavy long haul flights all smaller domestic flights unable to operate for unknown reasons.

Zynda · Post by **Zynda** » 17 Jun 2013 15:19

+1 Singhaji.

Last year Beijing airport suffered through similar stuff due to deluge from unexpected cloud bursts. Airports in massa regularly shutdown due to thunderstorms (once we were made to fly 30 near NY due to thunderstorm in Phily and eventually landed in Newark...waited on tarmac for another half hour before departing for Phily)...

Hopefully Delhi Airport will learn lessons and incorporate storm drains or proper conduits for water drainage

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 17 Jun 2013 18:18

has a pic of the beijing airport flooding...this was on the apron itself..this a shock n awe no expense spared airport built for the olympic games.
http://storyful.com/stories/4786

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 17 Jun 2013 22:37

Something is not kosher here.

Why is Jet ceding effective management control unless, more money ( stashed abroad ), has changed hands than has been revealed. Etihad has as much say on the board with 24% stake as Goyal with 51% stake. No sensible businessman would do this unless...........

Jet-Etihad deal: Mideast carrier to enjoy substantial say in decisions

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 18 Jun 2013 05:47

Jet was rumored to have D-gang connections, isn't it right from the beginning. It can hardly be considered a true blue Indian airline. Goyal himself is an NRI.