West Asia News and Discussions

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habal
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by habal »

Rothschild think tank wants false flag as justification for Iran invasion.


Lilo wrote: Habal ji,
Looks like the Pakis are in the fray after all leashed and led by their Saudi masters.
No wonder Paki Taleban was so quick to deny presence in Syria, when questioned.

More reason for India to side with Russia Syria and Iran.
they are more in Aleppo and are often mistaken to be Afghan.
In Aleppo, they are doing more logistics and service duties thus trying to keep low profile. Not many taliban casualties have been reported yet, because fighting is yet to move effectively into Aleppo.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Austin »

RT Breaking News: No Proof of Syrian Army using Chemical Weapons : UN Inspection Result.

http://rt.com/news/putin-syria-interview-ap-387/
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Austin »

Russia may back UN-sanctioned Syria airstrike if chemical claims proven
http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2013_09_0 ... oven-7022/
President Vladimir Putin has not ruled out that Russia may give a go-ahead to a military intervention in Syria if it is proven beyond reasonable doubt that Damascus had gazed civilians with nerve agent sarin.

Russia might well agree to a decision by some countries to launch a military operation against Syria if it is proven for certain that the Syrian government is responsible for using chemical weapons, Russian President Vladimir Putin said.

"I do not rule this out," Putin said in an interview with Channel One television and the Associated Press when asked what Russia's position will be if irrefutable proof that chemical weapons were used by the Syrian government is presented and whether Russia would agree to a military operation against the Syrian regime, possibly launched by the United States.

Mr. Putin also stressed such a military operation must be sanctioned by the United Nations.
Proof of possible chemical weapons use in Syria should be submitted to UN security council, should be convincing - Putin
"We will be persuaded by a deep objective study of the issue and the presence of evidence that would be obvious and clearly show, who used it and what exactly was used. After that, we will be ready to act in the most decisive and serious way," he said.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by habal »

Scientific marketing applied to propaganda

US media uses psychological programing to influence public opinion on Syria

http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2013_09_0 ... yria-7773/
"It is nauseating to see CNN's Jake Tapper using neuro-linguistic programming (NLP) on (D) Rep. Alan Grayson. Every time Tapper asks Grayson a question, Tapper shakes or nods his head to indicate the answer he wants viewers to believe is the ‘truth’ in an attempt to persuade public opinion. This is how mainstream media operates and why you should always remember to ask yourself if you can trust them.
Neuro-linguistic programming (or NLP) is a controversial interpersonal communication model applied in psychotherapy and other contexts of communication and change.

The basic assumptions of NLP draw from aspects of neurology (“neuro-”), transformational grammar (“linguistics”) and cybernetics (“programming”).

It has often been promoted as an art and science of effective communication and defined as ‘the study of the structure of subjective experience’."
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Lalmohan »

anant - assad has blood on his hands, but so do the 'rebels' - there are no clean black and white scenarios here
this conflict is not new, its been brewing since the middle ages and has been amplified through the 20th century. we are merely witnessing its current avatar. the bigger issues at play here are wahhabist extermism, oil interests of the gulf, russia and the west
frankly - syrian civilians are (unfortunately) collateral damage for all sides concerned
no body comes out of this smelling good - nobody
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by habal »

furthering the psychological programming theme ...

Better Actors here.. in Syria latest chemical attacks.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=4a9_1377562800

SHows a father crying for the death of his kids in one massacre and later the rebels Re-use the same actor in the latest chemical attacks.. notice kerry use reference of same videos.
but also the father with military pants.. shows is a rebel. the radio communications , the kids with hands tied. perhaps a chemical reaction.. and the poor actor in first video ..consoling the one that is consoling the father. lol
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Austin »

^^^ LOL , they need to hire professionals and make sure they dont make common mistakes.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Lilo »

Lalmohan wrote:anant - assad has blood on his hands, but so do the 'rebels' - there are no clean black and white scenarios here
this conflict is not new, its been brewing since the middle ages and has been amplified through the 20th century. we are merely witnessing its current avatar. the bigger issues at play here are wahhabist extermism, oil interests of the gulf, russia and the west
frankly - syrian civilians are (unfortunately) collateral damage for all sides concerned
no body comes out of this smelling good - nobody
LM ji,
In case of above - question always rises -
Who upset the carefully balanced apple cart and led to this civil war in the first place ?
Then there is a question of which side to take a stand on - one cannot be as cool as Switzerland always....

Instead of debating on the morality of the issue at hand - we should think on the line of...

What should be India's stand? - this will clear up lot of noise in head.
Last edited by Lilo on 04 Sep 2013 12:21, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Lalmohan »

my stand is simple - i dont want the wahhabis to come out on top
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Lilo »

^ Precisely my feeling too
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by habal »

the arab league foreign ministers are having a meeting, and the guy sitting in Syria's chair- Al-Jarba something is pleading with everybody to attack his country.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Singha »

gotus has now got goahead for strikes. I would imagine early hours of saturday morning after some more saber rattling.

if Namo takes over my some miracle, rahowl , Aroy & diggy will also depose infront of US congress urging their help to overthrow the regime and restore dynastocracy.
Last edited by Singha on 04 Sep 2013 12:42, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by krishnan »

israel says the missiles were part of tests, but russia saidit hit some where after take off...so either test were failure , or israel hiding something
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by ravar »

Apologies if posted earlier-

UK Telegraph: New Hacked Emails Implicate US Involvement In Staged Chemical Attack
A hacker gained access to U.S. Army Col. Anthony J. MacDonald’s email account by first gaining access to his LinkedIn account. Within the enormous haul of emails collected, the hacker noticed a communication between MacDonald and one of his colleagues, Eugene Furst. Furst congratulates the Col. for his recent successes and gives him a link to the Washington Post article about the chemical attacks in Syria on August 21st.

Next, a friend of MacDonald’s wife Jennifer wrote that she was shocked to see all of the children killed in the chemical attack. Jennifer replies that she saw the story but, “Tony comforted me. He said the kids weren’t hurt, it was done for the cameras.
On August 27th, Foreign Policy magazine reported that, “in the hours following the chemical attack in Syria, an official at the Syrian Ministry of Defense exchanged panicked phone calls with a leader of a chemical weapons unit, demanding answers for a nerve agent strike that killed more than 1,000 people.”

The Obama administration is using this intercepted phone call as proof that the Assad regime was responsible for the chemical attack. But this intelligence certainly begs the question, why would a senior official call the chemical weapons unit asking what happened if the Assad administration ordered the attack? A Syrian envoy claims that rebels were behind the gas attacks.
An independent investigation carried out by reporter Jerome Corsi found substantial evidence to support del Ponte’s assertion. Video evidence has emerged on YouTube and elsewhere that shows rebel troops transporting, loading and firing nerve agents into civilian population centers. The munition in the image below {chk the pic on the page} is homemade delivery device, not a standard gas shell that Assad would have at his disposal. The image comes from a video that shows rebels firing the device into a Syrian suburb.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Austin »

krishnan wrote:israel says the missiles were part of tests, but russia saidit hit some where after take off...so either test were failure , or israel hiding something
It fell into Med Sea , it was a BM target for ABM system

http://www.rafael.co.il/marketing/SIP_S ... 1/1171.pdf
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Singha »

the new al-qaeda caliphate will first cut the throat of all other rebels (just as LTTE wiped other tamil parties)
then kill all kurds and shias
then they will strike at their supposed saudi & qatari overlords
and then on to the west

syria will be a nice little springboard on the med to spread the love and peace further west into the soft underbelly of europe through loosely policed balkans, greece and italy.

US is probably thinking by creating this new caliphate in between lebanon/hizbollah and iran they would make their client state israel more secure.

but al queda fronts have their own plans for sure
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by vishvak »

habal wrote:the arab league foreign ministers are having a meeting, and the guy sitting in Syria's chair- Al-Jarba something is pleading with everybody to attack his country.
:rotfl:

Why can't Russia or Iran bomb al-mobs and their backers in Syria after getting some parliamentary approvals? They are openly genocidal, as also chemical attacks by al-mobs would invite such reprisals by principle.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Sri »

Anant wrote: the Assad family are 2 bit war criminals who gas women and children. May they justifiably rot in hell.
Err.. How do we know that? Please provide an independent linky... thanks
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by vinod »

Anant wrote:Lilo, with due deference I think there are many like me who love both India and the United States. I call a spade a spade. Assad is a genocidal war criminal and I'll rejoice the day he is butchered like the kids and women that he did in. You can support whom you want. Ultimately, good trumps evil notwithstanding the blood that all countries including the US have on their hands.
I agree Assad was responsible for deaths of many of his opponents and he should be punished! So what next, put even bigger murderers and cannibals in charge? where would the focus of Jihadis go after that? What will saudi money fund next?

Don't paint this as good vs evil! Like you said US has a lot more blood on their hands than any other nation.

BTW, what is anything good about US? That they are the world's sole superpower and control the media, which you believe without any critical thinking applied! They have the money and military strength now. Yeah, they have left India "for now" - for how long and when do they turn against us? Don't forget they were quick to apply sanctions when we did the nuclear tests - a big give away of their thinking! What extent would they go to maintain their sole super power status? US is the only country which have used nuclear weapons(japan), also used chemical and other horrendous stuffs in (vitenam), was quiet accomplice when Saddam did it (to iran). So, there is absolutely NO moral high ground whatsoever which US can hold! So, this retribution for CW against Assad is pretty hollow. I tend to totally ignore that nonsense and think what US benefits and who else benefits out of having Assad's regime thrown out! As for my preference, Assad fights it out and prolongs the war as much as possible. Hopefully, giving us more time to develop and also at the same time weaken the warring ones!
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Sanku »

If Assad is a criminal by any standards, entire GoTUs need to be stand trial for deaths and murders which will dwarf anything that even Churchill, let alone Nazi's have done.

Just who are we kidding here. There is a different thread for :(( :(( and all these :(( :(( should be done there.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Gus »

Singha wrote:gotus has now got goahead for strikes. I would imagine early hours of saturday morning after some more saber rattling.
.
congress (the US one :lol: ), has not authorized the war. the speaker has said that it will take up the matter, which means hearings and such followed by a vote. Ombaba asked for congress to consider the matter and speaker boehner says ok. that's all. the republicans have not figured out what to do here - join the bandwagon, or oppose it.

my understanding is ombaba put this one on republican led congress - instead of doing a libya where even when he succeeded in securing american interests, he was still pilloried for not acting, then acting without congress approval and finally for 'leading from behind'.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Lalmohan »

congress is going to be persuaded to comply, wonder if hollande would get a majority vote if he put it to parliament...
things get stranger by the day...
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Johann »

The Obama administration could have intervened any point in Syria the last 2 years, and the policy options would have been much cleaner. There are very specific reasons why they have changed gears at this moment;

- The Syrian regime now has the initiative on the battlefield thanks to the use of gas and airpower. Again I'm not talking about the recent event which hurt thousands of civilians and where the attribution is controversial, but the much smaller pinpoint attacks of the last few months on frontline opposition fighters. The rebels are/were not going to be crushed any time soon, but Assad's confidence was growing. There is pressure to take out Assad's key assets and military advantages.

- Obama's domestic leadership on foreign policy has been eroded by the Benghazi attack. He has to take the Republicans on board. That means in reality that the US is likely to commit itself to a *more* rather than less aggressive posture given the Neocons views on Hezbollah and Iran.

These are also people for whom the idea of 'leading from behind' - i.e. ceding leadership in the Middle East to regional states like Turkey, Qatar and Saudi is an anathema. The US must unambiguously demonstrate its leadership and power to all in the region, friends and foes alike.

- US ground forces have had some rest since the pull-out from Iraq, and the beginning of the draw-down in Afghanistan. If the US paints itself into a corner and things keep escalating, the Pentagon knows it does have the resources available for a full on invasion. In recent months regular units have increased the amount of training for operating under chemical warfare conditions.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Lalmohan »

so this is about obama's h&d?
and putin's h&d
so basically - the syrians are musharraffed
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Sanku »

Lalmohan wrote: so basically - the syrians are musharraffed
That part I believe there is unanimity on.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Johann »

p.s. for those who were asking earlier why the Syrian government might use Sarin rather than VX on the rebels.

Syria's VX stocks are relatively limited and their production capacity is/was a work in progress.

They are probably reserved as the country's only strategic deterrent against Israel's nuclear weapons.

http://www.nti.org/country-profiles/syria/chemical/
Last edited by Johann on 04 Sep 2013 16:03, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Johann »

Lalmohan wrote:so this is about obama's h&d?
and putin's h&d
so basically - the syrians are musharraffed
This is about the h&d of every government that claims to be relevant to the ME situation - the US, Russia, France, Saudi, Iran, Qatar and Turkey.

The British public has decided the game isn't worth it, hence the comments from McCain that it is former rather than current power. Plus of course it would have been incredibly helpful to have access to British airbases on Cyprus.

US action is aimed at re-establishing its eroded (in Obama's first term) position as the prime mover in the ME, a reminder to 'allies' like Saudi and Qatar, not just Iran and Russia.

The problem is that cruise missiles are not enough to establish that, however much people like Bill Clinton and Obama wish it was. The US is going to find itself sucked in at a much higher price than it really wants to pay.
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Sri »

^^^ +1
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by anmol »

Did the White House Help Plan the Syrian Chemical Attack?
By Global Research News
Global Research, September 01, 2013

by Yossef Bodansky

There is a growing volume of new evidence from numerous sources in the Middle East — mostly affiliated with the Syrian opposition and its sponsors and supporters — which makes a very strong case, based on solid circumstantial evidence, that the August 21, 2013, chemical strike in the Damascus suburbs was indeed a pre-meditated provocation by the Syrian opposition.

The extent of US foreknowledge of this provocation needs further investigation because available data puts the “horror” of the Barack Obama White House in a different and disturbing light.

On August 13-14, 2013, Western-sponsored opposition forces in Turkey started advance preparations for a major and irregular military surge. Initial meetings between senior opposition military commanders and representatives of Qatari, Turkish, and US Intelligence [“Mukhabarat Amriki”] took place at the converted Turkish military garrison in Antakya, Hatay Province, used as the command center and headquarters of the Free Syrian Army (FSA) and their foreign sponsors. Very senior opposition commanders who had arrived from Istanbul briefed the regional commanders of an imminent escalation in the fighting due to “a war-changing development” which would, in turn, lead to a US-led bombing of Syria.

The opposition forces had to quickly prepare their forces for exploiting the US-led bombing in order to march on Damascus and topple the Bashar al-Assad Government, the senior commanders explained. The Qatari and Turkish intelligence officials assured the Syrian regional commanders that they would be provided with plenty of weapons for the coming offensive.

Indeed, unprecedented weapons distribution started in all opposition camps in Hatay Province on August 21-23, 2013. In the Reyhanli area alone, opposition forces received well in excess of 400 tons of weapons, mainly anti-aircraft weaponry from shoulder-fired missiles to ammunition for light-guns and machineguns. The weapons were distributed from store-houses controlled by Qatari and Turkish Intelligence under the tight supervision of US Intelligence.

These weapons were loaded on more than 20 trailer-trucks which crossed into northern Syria and distributed the weapons to several depots. Follow-up weapon shipments, also several hundred tons, took place over the weekend of August 24-25, 2013, and included mainly sophisticated anti-tank guided missiles and rockets. Opposition officials in Hatay said that these weapon shipments were “the biggest” they had received “since the beginning of the turmoil more than two years ago”. The deliveries from Hatay went to all the rebel forces operating in the Idlib-to-Aleppo area, including the al-Qaida affiliated jihadists (who constitute the largest rebel forces in the area).

Several senior officials from both the Syrian opposition and sponsoring Arab states stressed that these weapon deliveries were specifically in anticipation for exploiting the impact of imminent bombing of Syria by the US and the Western allies. The latest strategy formulation and coordination meetings took place on August 26, 2013. The political coordination meeting took place in Istanbul and was attended by US Amb. Robert Ford.

More important were the military and operational coordination meetings at the Antakya garrison. Senior Turkish, Qatari, and US Intelligence officials attended in addition to the Syrian senior (opposition) commanders. The Syrians were informed that bombing would start in a few days.

“The opposition was told in clear terms that action to deter further use of chemical weapons by the Assad regime could come as early as in the next few days,” a Syrian participant in the meeting said. Another Syrian participant said that he was convinced US bombing was scheduled to begin on Thursday, August 29, 2013. Several participants — both Syrian and Arab — stressed that the assurances of forthcoming bombing were most explicit even as formally Obama is still undecided.

The descriptions of these meetings raise the question of the extent of foreknowledge of US Intelligence, and therefore, the Obama White House. All the sources consulted — both Syrian and Arab — stressed that officials of the “Mukhabarat Amriki” actively participated in the meetings and briefings in Turkey. Therefore, at the very least, they should have known that the opposition leaders were anticipating “a war-changing development”: that is, a dramatic event which would provoke a US-led military intervention.

The mere fact that weapon storage sites under the tight supervision of US Intelligence were opened up and about a thousand tons of high-quality weapons were distributed to the opposition indicates that US Intelligence anticipated such a provocation and the opportunity for the Syrian opposition to exploit the impact of the ensuing US and allied bombing. Hence, even if the Obama White House did not know in advance of the chemical provocation, they should have concluded, or at the very least suspected, that the chemical attack was most likely the “war-changing development” anticipated by the opposition leaders as provocation of US-led bombing. Under such circumstances, the Obama White House should have refrained from rushing head-on to accuse Assad’s Damascus and threaten retaliation, thus making the Obama White House at the very least complicit after the act.

Meanwhile, additional data from Damascus about the actual chemical attack increases the doubts about Washington’s version of events. Immediately after the attack, three hospitals of Doctors Without Borders (MSF: médecins sans frontières) in the greater Damascus area treated more than 3,600 Syrians affected by the chemical attack, and 355 of them died. MSF performed tests on the vast majority of those treated.

MSF director of operations Bart Janssens summed up the findings: “MSF can neither scientifically confirm the cause of these symptoms nor establish who is responsible for the attack. However, the reported symptoms of the patients, in addition to the epidemiological pattern of the events — characterized by the massive influx of patients in a short period of time, the origin of the patients, and the contamination of medical and first aid workers — strongly indicate mass exposure to a neurotoxic agent.” Simply put, even after testing some 3,600 patients, MSF failed to confirm that sarin was the cause of the injuries. According to MSF, the cause could have been nerve agents like sarin, concentrated riot control gas, or even high-concentration pesticides. Moreover, opposition reports that there was distinct stench during the attack suggest that it could have come from the “kitchen sarin” used by jihadist groups (as distinct from the odorless military-type sarin) or improvised agents like pesticides.

Some of the evidence touted by the Obama White House is questionable at best.

A small incident in Beirut raises big questions. A day after the chemical attack, Lebanese fixers working for the “Mukhabarat Amriki” succeeded to convince a Syrian male who claimed to have been injured in the chemical attack to seek medical aid in Beirut in return for a hefty sum that would effectively settle him for life. The man was put into an ambulance and transferred overnight to the Farhat Hospital in Jib Janine, Beirut. The Obama White House immediately leaked friendly media that “the Lebanese Red Cross announced that test results found traces of sarin gas in his blood.” However, this was news to Lebanese intelligence and Red Cross officials.
According to senior intelligence officials, “Red Cross Operations Director George Kettaneh told [them] that the injured Syrian fled the hospital before doctors were able to test for traces of toxic gas in his blood.” Apparently, the patient declared that he had recovered from his nausea and no longer needed medical treatment. The Lebanese security forces are still searching for the Syrian patient and his honorarium.

On August 24, 2013, Syrian Commando forces acted on intelligence about the possible perpetrators of the chemical attack and raided a cluster of rebel tunnels in the Damascus suburb of Jobar. Canisters of toxic material were hit in the fierce fire-fight as several Syrian soldiers suffered from suffocation and “some of the injured are in a critical condition”.

The Commando eventually seized an opposition warehouse containing barrels full of chemicals required for mixing “kitchen sarin”, laboratory equipment, as well as a large number of protective masks. The Syrian Commando also captured several improvised explosive devices, RPG rounds, and mortar shells. The same day, at least four HizbAllah fighters operating in Damascus near Ghouta were hit by chemical agents at the very same time the Syrian Commando unit was hit while searching a group of rebel tunnels in Jobar. Both the Syrian and the HizbAllah forces were acting on intelligence information about the real perpetrators of the chemical attack. Damascus told Moscow the Syrian troops were hit by some form of a nerve agent and sent samples (blood, tissues, and soil) and captured equipment to Russia.

Several Syrian leaders, many of whom are not Bashar al-Assad supporters and are even his sworn enemies, are now convinced that the Syrian opposition is responsible for the August 21, 2013, chemical attack in the Damascus area in order to provoke the US and the allies into bombing Assad’s Syria. Most explicit and eloquent is Saleh Muslim, the head of the Kurdish Democratic Union Party (PYD) which has been fighting the Syrian Government. Muslim doubts Assad would have used chemical weapons when he was winning the civil war.

“The regime in Syria … has chemical weapons, but they wouldn’t use them around Damascus, five km from the [UN] committee which is investigating chemical weapons. Of course they are not so stupid as to do so,” Muslim told Reuters on August 27, 2013. He believes the attack was “aimed at framing Assad and provoking an international reaction”. Muslim is convinced that “some other sides who want to blame the Syrian regime, who want to show them as guilty and then see action” is responsible for the chemical attack. The US was exploiting the attack to further its own anti-Assad policies and should the UN inspectors find evidence that the rebels were behind the attack, then “everybody would forget it”, Muslim shrugged. “Who is the side who would be punished? Are they are going to punish the Emir of Qatar or the King of Saudi Arabia, or Mr Erdo?an of Turkey?”

And there remain the questions: Given the extent of the involvement of the “Mukhabarat Amriki” in opposition activities, how is that US Intelligence did not know in advance about the opposition’s planned use of chemical weapons in Damascus?

It is a colossal failure.

And if they did know and warned the Obama White House, why then the sanctimonious rush to blame the Assad Administration?

Moreover, how can the Obama Administration continue to support and seek to empower the opposition which had just intentionally killed some 1,300 innocent civilians in order to provoke a US military intervention?

Yossef Bodansky, Senior Editor, GIS/Defense & Foreign Affairs

Copyright Defense and Foreign Affairs and Oilprice.com 2013
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by member_27444 »

The Lawrence of Arabia cometh
Again Peace shall be ushered
Prosperity abound
He wishes
Tribes to multiply
Sure they would
A day to bite
The hand that fed
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Lalmohan »

Mukhabarat Amriki
:rotfl:
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Austin »

Syria threatens to attack Turkey, Jordan if they join military operation against Damascus
Syrian Deputy Foreign Minister Faisal Mikdad has called on neighboring countries to abstain from taking part in any US military campaign against Damascus, media report.

He warned that Damascus would strike back not only against Israel but also at Jordan and Turkey if they decide to invade Syria.

“Once the war breaks out no one will stay in control of the situation. We believe that any attack on Syria will undoubtedly lead to chaos in the entire region and beyond,” Mr. Mikdad said. He cautioned Turkey and Jordan to think twice before joining a military operation against Syria.

The minister also called on the US Congress not to endorse a Syria airstrike proposed by President Barack Obama.

“We hope that American senators will show commonsense and take the side of justice, instead of opting for provocative actions. If Congress gave the green light to a military intervention in Syria, he said, it would be “a tragedy for the Syrian people, the American people and all nations in the Middle East.”
Read more: http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2013_09_0 ... scus-9558/
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Lalmohan »

an attack on turkey is an attack on NATO, no?
vinod
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by vinod »

Austin wrote:Syria threatens to attack Turkey, Jordan if they join military operation against Damascus
Syrian Deputy Foreign Minister Faisal Mikdad has called on neighboring countries to abstain from taking part in any US military campaign against Damascus, media report.

He warned that Damascus would strike back not only against Israel but also at Jordan and Turkey if they decide to invade Syria.

“Once the war breaks out no one will stay in control of the situation. We believe that any attack on Syria will undoubtedly lead to chaos in the entire region and beyond,” Mr. Mikdad said. He cautioned Turkey and Jordan to think twice before joining a military operation against Syria.

The minister also called on the US Congress not to endorse a Syria airstrike proposed by President Barack Obama.

“We hope that American senators will show commonsense and take the side of justice, instead of opting for provocative actions. If Congress gave the green light to a military intervention in Syria, he said, it would be “a tragedy for the Syrian people, the American people and all nations in the Middle East.”
Read more: http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2013_09_0 ... scus-9558/
If Turkey is attacked, NATO becomes involved automatically! UK also joins in via NATO irrespective of parliament vote!
member_27444
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by member_27444 »

Looks like curtains for Assad any which way he can
IT reports that Russia may agree to strikes if chemicals were used indeed
Johann
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Johann »

vinod wrote:If Turkey is attacked, NATO becomes involved automatically! UK also joins in via NATO irrespective of parliament vote!
Correct, Article V of the NATO Charter would be invoked by Turkey.

Germany, the UK, and all other NATO states that have chosen not to participate would be faced with a major political dilemma. However while they may make their bases and airspace available, they would not be forced to commit major forces.
habal
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by habal »

another one chugs in ..
Interfax: Russia sends missile cruiser to Mediterranean
Published: 09.04.13, 14:49 / Israel News


Russia is sending a missile cruiser to the east Mediterranean to take over the navy's operations in the region, state agency Interfax quoted a military source as saying on Wednesday, as the United States prepares for a possible military strike in Syria.

The ship, Moskva, will take over operations from a naval unit in the region that Moscow says is needed to protect national interests. It will be joined by a destroyer from Russia's Baltic Fleet and a frigate from the Black Sea Fleet. (Reuters)
a two-way pincer strike is also possible as part of counter-offensive .. & once the spear tip is lodged inside Israeli territory, they cannot use nukes or any other WMDs or air power. This is the tricky part of this war, unlike Eyeraq, Syria & Lebanon share a border with Israel.
It is my belief, that the ground strategy will be left to Syrian conventional forces. Syrian Special forces, Iranian Al Quds Brigade, and Hezbollah, will blaze a S.A.M. Trail through Israel, and capture Haifa and Tel Aviv in 3 -4 days depending on the resistance. The Golani, Brigade, and other I.D.F. Units have been badly degraded since the 2006 war with Hezbollah.
Israeli Youth don't have the stomach for War. 35% of the Israeli reserve are draft dodgers
. In 2006 six George Bush gave Israel 30 days to defeat Hezbollah, and with all their Air power, the Israeli's didn't penetrate two miles in to Lebanon!
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Lilo »

What is this talk of West fighting for its H&D. This is assertion is at the same level as another given post Iraq that Bush did it for his daddys's sake .

A Dirty War is being waged -
Only way to get a fleeting grasp at the truth is deductive logic based on few initial axioms and qui bono tree for the actors involved. This way one can sidestep the whole MSM propagandu - which is firmly in the hands of the belligerent side to this conflict.

Attempting a factual analysis is difficult for aam admi (unconnected to any govt mandated to track the conflict) well neigh impossible in the maze of fast moving social media "proofs" flying around . ShyamD ji seems to do this regularly but how far he was correct ... Only he can answer.

In deductive analysis ,however the specifics about how exactly the gassing op was achieved doesn't matter - only who benefited matters.

Axioms
>Above everything else West calculates about the benefits accruing to it - shortterm monetary or most importantly longterm gain in power.
Corollaries
1) : With a vast information processing system at its finger tips that it is approaching Economic man level information awareness - where it can reasonably predict at a maximum of 10 years (my arbitary limit to this capacity in a "normal" situation- it can vary widely on either side depending on the degree of deviation from "Normal" on either side in due course) the broad outcomes to the events in the world given few vital conditions hold true(lack of technological leaps from non western world, and disruptive events like nuke attacks and occuring of major wars not sanctioned by it etc) .
2)West really doesn't care about Human rights & Democracy .
3)However It cares about the long term sanctity of its power brokering system (international legal/illegal framework) it has put in place beginning since last century.

Conclusions:
Based on passed events and Imvho these fit well
No war started by West in the last decade was waged in anger (or any such irrational basis) - so the contention that personally Bush acted in anger/or the system acted in anger is wrong in case of Iraq war - at least by the looks of it West is happy by the outcome of Iraq war (calculated after 10 years) and is now expanding the outcome over the rest of the theater.
---- Its like a fresh take on the old soviet planning process (but soviets attempted it when its politically and technologically unfeasable while West is doing this with those constraints overcome) --- using supercomputers,historical data,real time parametric models with lateral data updates and all the stuff one can imagine (technology) and the ability to shape/tweak events in play like none other (aka politically a Hyperpower)

On current and future:
Escalation in Syria is a highly gamed scenario and the game began when AssadGassed op was executed.
Last edited by Lilo on 04 Sep 2013 17:16, edited 1 time in total.
habal
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by habal »

It is job of SAA CI to take care of these guys who are on the spot to laze various targets ..
British SAS Troops Already Deployed in Syria, Ahead of Parliamentary Vote on Thursday

The UK’s Mirror newspaper has already let loose that British SAS special forces have already been deployed in Syria to take out Syrian air defense unit and also to provide laser spotting for Tomahawk cruise missile targets which will be fired from British Navy’s nuclear submarine HMS Tireless, already repositioned in the Mediterranean.

The US military has the same program in play, albeit much larger and well-equipped for a longer sustained attack than the British

The missile attack on Syria could very well be followed-up by an air strike and heavy bombing campaign shortly afterwards, which will be conducted by French, US and Israeli, and possibly with some Turkish air military assets. A large contingent of US drones will almost certainly be deployed as a first wave for any US air strike.
Read more: http://21stcenturywire.com/2013/08/28/b ... -thursday/

read comments to this article. Difficult to win the battle against the beast .. really difficult but not impossible.
Trust me. They already have people on the inside who are feeding them information. For months , if not longer , every square inch of Syria has been analyzed and reanalyzed by multiple spy satellites , and every piece of military equipment the Syrians have is known and its location is known. Plus they listen to all communications and they know where the President is at all times. And I am just barely touching on the subject. It is difficult to dance with the beast. Difficult indeed.

In the early 80's a man named Helmut Khol was chancellor of West Germany. When asked if threatened with nuclear annihilation by the Soviets, what would be his response. His answer was a interesting one. He said ....I will surrender to them in order to save my country. Are these the words of a fool or a loser? Or are they the words of a pragmatist thinking in of what is to be gained and what is to be lost? Perhaps there is wisdom in this.

Is it true to say that discretion is the better part of valor?
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Re: West Asia News and Discussions

Post by Johann »

habal wrote:
It is my belief, that the ground strategy will be left to Syrian conventional forces. Syrian Special forces, Iranian Al Quds Brigade, and Hezbollah, will blaze a S.A.M. Trail through Israel, and capture Haifa and Tel Aviv in 3 -4 days depending on the resistance. The Golani, Brigade, and other I.D.F. Units have been badly degraded since the 2006 war with Hezbollah.
Israeli Youth don't have the stomach for War. 35% of the Israeli reserve are draft dodgers
. In 2006 six George Bush gave Israel 30 days to defeat Hezbollah, and with all their Air power, the Israeli's didn't penetrate two miles in to Lebanon!
:rotfl:

This is the kind of delusional rubbish that the Arabs, Iranians and Pakistanis spout from time to time. Usually when they fear catastrophic defeat. Comical Ali, where are you?

The Syrian army and Hezbollah -which can barely hold onto half of Syria against a numerically and technologically inferior enemy- are going to conquer the one of the most heavily militarised, battle hardened and technologically advanced nations in the world?

Anyone who actually believes this has literally lost all touch with reality, confusing wishes with hard facts.

The Assads have not directly threatened Israel - they understand what sort of suicide that would be. Even their threats to Turkey are desperate and poorly thought out. Jordan and Lebanon are really the only governments they currently have the wherewithal to threaten, and even Jordan would be more than they could handle.
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