Civil Aviation Development & Discussion

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 07 Sep 2013 15:20

MAKS Airshow round-up: UAC gathered almost 200 orders and Bombardier signs with Rostec and lessors

manish · Post by **manish** » 09 Sep 2013 19:34

Bombardier CSeries Prototype Commences High Speed Taxi Trials

Probably the Rejected Take Off (RTO) tests should be next, followed by the first flight. Just a matter of days now.

manish · Post by **manish** » 16 Sep 2013 21:01

And its done - the CSeries is airborne! The first flight is underway right now.

Here's a video - notice the relatively quiet engines - the Geared Turbofans are another industry first on this daring, high-risk investment for Bombardier.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... yMIlLKJjFI[/youtube]
AviationWeek says:

The take-off was remarkable for its lack of drama, largely because of the aircraft's extraordinary quietness - thanks to its Pratt & Whitney PW1500G geared turbofan.

Some more snippets on why this little plane is such a big deal (From Reuters coverage):

"The CSeries has already caused an earthquake in the airliner industry. That's what caused Boeing and Airbus to redesign their airplanes," said Michael Boyd, chairman of the aviation consulting group Boyd Group International.

"The CSeries, on paper, was so superior in terms of economics that you have two global companies that had to jump from what Bombardier did."

Airbus and Boeing announced new-engine versions of their respective A320 and 737 class aircraft after Bombardier unveiled its plans for the CSeries.

Already in development for five years, the CSeries represents a major gamble for the Canadian manufacturer. It is the first clean-sheet design to enter the traditional narrowbody sector – the seat category above such types as the Sukhoi Superjet 100 and Embraer 190 – since the debut of the A320 in 1988.

This is the bread-and-butter segment for the big boys with something like 40-50% of the commercial jetliner market coming from A320 and B737 - now they will not rest till Bombardier is pummeled and buried six feet under.

Perhaps more ambitiously, the CSeries marks Bombardier’s first attempt to compete against the Airbus and Boeing duopoly.

As a result, the CSeries is loaded with new technology. In addition to the debut of the P&W geared turbofan, it features the first all-composite wing and aluminium-lithium fuselage to be applied in the narrowbody sector. It has a full fly-by-wire flight control system, supplied by Parker Aerospace and integrated into the cockpit by Rockwell Collins.

One of the bigger risks for Bombardier could also come from its decision to go for a 3-2 seating in the interior vs the 3-3 found on Airbus and Boeing competitors - Bombardier hopes that its promise of widest seats in the segment could be a draw for passengers although it remains to be seen if the airlines really care. The design even has an extra half inch on all middle seats to make sitting on them that much more bearable.

Let's see how this develops.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 17 Sep 2013 09:10

Congratulations to Bombardier.

Aircraft looks good and GTF engines are indeed very quite , Any comparison chart on how CS100 , CS300 fares against latest Boeing and Airbus offering 737 MAX and A 320 NEO ?

manish · Post by **manish** » 17 Sep 2013 11:18

Austin wrote:Congratulations to Bombardier.

Aircraft looks good and GTF engines are indeed very quite , Any comparison chart on how CS100 , CS300 fares against latest Boeing and Airbus offering 737 MAX and A 320 NEO ?

The comparisons (at least for now, as per public domain data) would only be with the lower end of the mainline narrowbody families i.e. Airbus A318/A319 and Boeing B737-600/700 as the largest CSeries model at present would be the CS300 which is expected to seat upto 160 in a high-density, all-economy configuration.

BBD claims are as below:

the CS300, the larger of two CSeries models, would be at least 10 percent cheaper per seat and 15 percent cheaper in total flight costs to operate than the Airbus A319neo, a revamped version of the model the CSeries was designed to compete with.

Compared with the new Airbus best-seller, the revamped A320neo, he said the CS300 would have 25 percent lower trip costs and offer similar costs per seat, give or take 2 percent.

Comparisons with the current A320E family and B737NG family would be even more starkly in favour of the CSeries.

But the competition with A320neo and B737-8 MAX will be head-on only if and when the long rumoured CS500 comes out.

And don't forget, the A320 and B737 are right about at the end of their airframe's maturity age whereas the CSeries' life is just beginning with its clean-sheet airframe and engines which would allow BBD to offer performance improvement packages to unlock more potential as days go by, just the way Airbus and Boeing did in the years gone by with their offerings.

manish · Post by **manish** » 17 Sep 2013 11:25

All eyes are on the CSeries GTF engine as well. Early indications are very positive and that is also a hugely positive development for Airbus as the A320neo will be using a higher thrust variant of the same PW1500G engine.

Boeing's B737 MAX series cannot be fitted with the large dia (relatively, not talking the GE-90-115B size here of course

) P&W GTF engine due to its low landing gear height.

Some analysts claim this is one of the reasons for the relatively poorer showing of the MAX in the market so far vs. the neo.

manish · Post by **manish** » 19 Sep 2013 20:50

Tata joins hands with Singapore Airlines to Set up a Full Service Airline in India(in addition to the AirAsia venture)

This new joint venture comes on the heels of Tata's partnership with Malaysian low cost carrier AirAsia under which they will launch a budget airline here possibly before the year-end.

"Tata Sons and Singapore Airlines have signed a memorandum of understanding (MoU) and applied for Foreign Investment Promotion Board (FIPB) approval to establish a new airline in India that will help further stimulate demand for air travel.... the airline will be based in New Delhi and will operate under the full-service model. Tata Sons will own 51% and Singapore Airlines will own 49%," according to a statement jointly issued.

If this goes through, the clock would have truly come a full circle.

Aviation oldies will tell you that it was Tata-founded Air India which helped to helped Singapore Airlines get on its feet during its early days by providing training, manpower and technical assistance. Hard to believe isn't it?

Also tells you how far we have fallen from the hallowed days of the 1960s and 1970s when Air India was a pioneer with what was apparently the first international airline to transform its fleet into all-jet, built around the legendary Boeing B707.

manish · Post by **manish** » 19 Sep 2013 23:04

In another important development, the mighty 777-X family has its first confirmed commitment, with Lufthansa signing up for 34 of the gigantic 777-9X which will be by far the largest, heaviest and the most powerful twin-engine jetliner ever built and will bring to the table advanced tech engines and folding wings (necessitated by its massive wingspan) a la carrier borne naval aircraft.

The 777 is the modern wide-body classic much in the way the 747 was in its prime and operates in a league of its own with hardly any direct competition in its primary market. The 777-X development will simply take it a notch higher, away from all competition from below while simultaneously jeopardising the future prospects of the A380 and its own larger brother the B747-8.

Abhijeet · Post by **Abhijeet** » 20 Sep 2013 12:49

Will it make travel between India and the US faster?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 20 Sep 2013 17:28

a single a/c type with higher speed will not be welcome vs the others at their usual speed. its a carefully planned system of hubs and connecting flights. airlines usually also restricted by night time noise rules in many hubs so want to arrive in US/EU during the daytime.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 21 Sep 2013 02:09

Abhijeet wrote:Will it make travel between India and the US faster?

No. Might be able to make longer trips while carrying more people though.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 21 Sep 2013 02:13

Singha wrote:a single a/c type with higher speed will not be welcome vs the others at their usual speed. its a carefully planned system of hubs and connecting flights. airlines usually also restricted by night time noise rules in many hubs so want to arrive in US/EU during the daytime.

Higher cruising speed is not really possible without radically changing the airframe design. Current designs have reached their limit long time ago. And passenger jets which travel faster don't really have a market in the age of rising fuel costs. Only more efficient ones do. They weren't really in demand even when fuel was cheap. Or else the Concorde would have had more orders and the Americans would have built one of their own.

BTW, here is a (really) ambitious design that Singha saar will love.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reaction_Engines_A2

It envisages a range of 20,000 km and a cruise speed of Mach 5.2.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 28 Sep 2013 14:14

was reading reviews of shanghai pudong one of the largest and swankiest in the new china crop.
recent reviews are very negative.
seems just like android phones, there is more to a pleasant and efficient airport than a QUAD CORE processors, 2GB RAM and FHD screen

http://www.airlinequality.com/Airports/ ... um/pvg.htm

reading about delhi t3 is mostly gora whines about the tight security checks, need to print a proper boarding pass at airport after checking online, need to get the hand baggage tag stamped...but no real complaints of unfriendly or rude staff as above, and +ve comments about shopping, food , soldiers etc.

try having TSP and BD as neighbours my brothers and you will soon fall in line with us.

manish · Post by **manish** » 28 Sep 2013 19:27

Singha wrote:was reading reviews of shanghai pudong one of the largest and swankiest in the new china crop.
recent reviews are very negative.
seems just like android phones, there is more to a pleasant and efficient airport than a QUAD CORE processors, 2GB RAM and FHD screen
http://www.airlinequality.com/Airports/ ... um/pvg.htm

reading about delhi t3 is mostly gora whines about the tight security checks, need to print a proper boarding pass at airport after checking online, need to get the hand baggage tag stamped...but no real complaints of unfriendly or rude staff as above, and +ve comments about shopping, food , soldiers etc.

try having TSP and BD as neighbours my brothers and you will soon fall in line with us.

As Bose Babu would no doubt say, it is all about the UX!

And I agree wholeheartedly. Just waiting (erm.. dreaming rather!) for the day when our visa, security and immigration rules and babus enforcing them finally become travel-friendly enough to allow us to claim our rightful position as a potential hub for air travel between east and west on routes such as EU-SE Asia/JPN/Oz etc. I understand that in the grand old days of civilian air travel DEL was a frequently used stopover on such routes, but was necessary probably more due to the range limitations on the aircraft.

We have half a start already with a reasonably large and 'piss and plogless' style airport run with a touch of Indian flair for hospitality which is showing that it is able to hold its own against its bigger brothers in cheen. Hope we continue to progress further. Humongous capacity scaling up is apparently already part of IGI master plan as per the DIAL (GMR controlled operator of IGIA) website here:

Phase 3 - 2016 - New T4 plus T3 expansion plus new runway and other facilities
Phase 4 - 2021 - New T6 for LCCs plus expansion of T3 & T4 among others
Phase 5 - 2026 - New T5 - 'Saturation Phase'

Perhaps it should settle down as a 70mn-100mn pax mega hub ideally.

Of course all of this depends on traffic growth keeping up with projections. But with a country the size of ours located in a geographic location like ours shouldn't have any trouble supporting even the most ambitious of growth projections. Heck, Turkey is already moving to build a massive 6-runway, 150mn pax airport at Istanbul!

In fact just a couple of days ago IndiGo proclaimed its stated goal of becoming a 1000-aircraft airline - and no one really doubted them all that much.

All we need is the political and bureaucratic will to move forward - airlines and airports will surely follow as the market potential does exist out there.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 28 Sep 2013 19:47

another microtrend in the south is that BIAL is moving rapidly to overtake MIAL as the preferred gateway airport into the south.
if you think about it MIAL had a massive head start, been a metro apt for decades as chennai has miles more GDP than blr and lot of tamil diaspora...but their apt sure isnt doing much to improve itself while BIAL is smoothly expanding its T1 to twice the size while minimizing the disruption deftly. only sore point is the sub-par outdoor car parking with passengers having to drag their luggage manually across two driveways and even across the main road where volvo buses leave their stand....a very sub par route that and dangerous as well.

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes ... er-traffic

CHENNAI: It looks like Chennai is losing ground to Bangalore as the southern gateway for business and tourism owing to deficiencies at the city airport.

After overtaking Chennai in domestic passenger traffic, Bangalore airport is inching closer to Chennai in terms of international passenger traffic.

Bangalore's annual international passenger traffic is only 50% of Chennai's, but the airport has been registering a higher rate of growth for the past three years. Last year, Bangalore's domestic traffic grew at double the pace of Chennai and the international traffic at more than six times. The trend has continued into the first quarter of this year.

Last year, Chennai handled 44 lakh international passengers, while Bangalore had 25 lakh of them. But statistics compiled by the Airports Authority of India (AAI) shows that the passenger traffic grew at the rate of 6.5% in Bangalore while it was 3.6% in Chennai in 2012-13. In the first quarter of this year, international passenger numbers grew by 0.8% in Chennai while it increased by 5.2% in Bangalore.

In 2011-12, Bangalore registered a growth of 5.9% while Chennai saw only a 1.5% increase. "International travellers from Bangalore are young professionals, while a good percentage of those who fly from Chennai are families. Bangalore also has the highest number of people working in multinational companies. This is fuellilng the growth," said Air Passengers Association of India president D Sudhakara Reddy. Attempts by the hospitality industry to change this pattern in Chennai have failed because the airport is not up to the mark.

An airline official said that "Bangalore will catch up in the next couple of years as red tape and infrastructure limitations at Chennai airport discourage airlines from increasing frequencies. The private owner of Bangalore airport offers incentives to shift passenger and cargo flights from Chennai." SpiceJet on Friday announced that it will start a Bangalore-Bangkok flight.

A senior AAI official said "being public sector has its limitations. Chennai will pick up when the airport gets privatized early next year."

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 29 Sep 2013 00:25

Airport expansion in madras has been stuck since I was in school! The recent shambles of renovation with falling ceiling panels just shows how much initiative matters and how the govt kills it.

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 29 Sep 2013 03:13

In fact just a couple of days ago IndiGo proclaimed its stated goal of becoming a 1000-aircraft airline - and no one really doubted them all that much.

IndiGo currently flies 70 aircraft.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 29 Sep 2013 08:40

they do have 195 a/c on order incl 150 of a320neo.
http://articles.economictimes.indiatime ... r-airlines

"This is the fifth year in a row that we have posted profits since we broke even in 2008-09. We submitted our financial results to the Directorate General of Civil Aviation today as per the legal requirements," IndiGo CEO Aditya Ghosh told PTI here.

----
if they remain profitable should not have a issue getting funds for this pipeline of purchases.

manish · Post by **manish** » 29 Sep 2013 09:50

sanjaykumar wrote:In fact just a couple of days ago IndiGo proclaimed its stated goal of becoming a 1000-aircraft airline - and no one really doubted them all that much.

IndiGo currently flies 70 aircraft.

sanjaykumar ji, instead of dismissing them off hand rolling eyes do look at what was stated by IndiGo if you haven't done so already.

They went from 0 to 70 in 6-7 years in an industry and economy in the midst of a bloodbath and they are targeting 150 in the fleet by 2023. 'Eventually 1000' is the goal. May or may not happen, but good luck to them.

Nothing wrong with ambition. Airlines with far lower industry standing have set audacious goals in the past and have succeeded. In fact for those not aware, the Indonesians running LionAir have a mind-boggling 700+ A320/A320neo/B737/B737-MAX (yep, all of 'em!) on order and are planning for a large Bombardier CSeries CS300 order too.

Emirates started with a grand total of 2 planes in 1985 in a pint sized country - the planes were ex-PIA

, an ancient B737 Classic and an Airbus A300 and see where they are today. They don't even have large home country to rely on like Indians and Chinese could (heck they still became our defacto national carrier anyways

).

Closest analogy perhaps could be Southwest which runs a fleet of ~ 700 aircraft today in an LCC model built up over the decades.

You've got to start somewhere. People rolled eyes when India said it would built T3, one of the biggest airport terminals in the world and then do it in nearly half the time that the British took to build the comparable Heathrow T5 a couple of years earlier. See what happened.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 29 Sep 2013 09:51

>>well again something good about Gujarat- from niticentral-
this time Ahmedabad inetrnational airport ransk first in consumer satisfaction

I disagree.. Since ahmedabad is my hometown I have used to airport countless times to travel back and forth nyc..it is not exactly an international standard airport..

it is a small airport with only 6 departure gates and 4 aerobridges ... 2 of the gates are downstairs where there is no aerobridge...seats are quite uncomfortable..and the departure gates downstairs have insufficient seats as they built a fountain nearby...

all direct flights are to gelf or south east asia onlee as the airport can only handle boeing 737/airbus a320 sized aircraft...airlines flying to amreeka are etihad,quatar,emirates,jet,air yidia,jet.....i take etihad as it is the cheapest and most of the other options have a stop-over at heathrow which i absolutely want to avoid...(londonistan airport is the worst IMHO,the rudest,and u need to walk miles)....

not much options in food....no wifi unlike delhi...not much in shopping...

airport is clean...immigration is not much of a problem...most of the staff are from Guj so i find them polite...security is OK ...since the airport is quite small you don't have to walk much..

on arriving to ahmedabad getting the luggage is a bit chaotic because people tend to crowd around... i have observed desi co travellers who were extremely disciplined when they boarded flight in jfk and also when they boarded a transit flight in abu dhabi or dubai,suddenly become animals on arrival to Yindia

..trolley's are free unlike most unkil airports where we have to pay $6..again since there are not too many flights we get our stuff quite quickly...

demographics of travellers:mostly yindian (60-70%)... quite a few arap phourphathers..(20%)...and gora firangis...10%..most are tourist/jobseekers to gelf and south east asia...and nri's to londonistan and amreeki east coast...

manish · Post by **manish** » 29 Sep 2013 10:03

Singha wrote:they do have 195 a/c on order incl 150 of a320neo.
http://articles.economictimes.indiatime ... r-airlines

"This is the fifth year in a row that we have posted profits since we broke even in 2008-09. We submitted our financial results to the Directorate General of Civil Aviation today as per the legal requirements," IndiGo CEO Aditya Ghosh told PTI here.

----
if they remain profitable should not have a issue getting funds for this pipeline of purchases.

GD do look up Rusdi kirana and Lion Air that he started in 2000 - outrageous growth plans with seemingly complete disregard of safety or strong operations culture. Perhaps could go on to become a case study in itself for future generations like Southwest is today, but probably not always for all the right reasons!

prahaar · Post by **prahaar** » 29 Sep 2013 12:44

gakakkad wrote:>>well again something good about Gujarat- from niticentral-
this time Ahmedabad inetrnational airport ransk first in consumer satisfaction

I disagree.. Since ahmedabad is my hometown I have used to airport countless times to travel back and forth nyc..it is not exactly an international standard airport..

it is a small airport with only 6 departure gates and 4 aerobridges ... 2 of the gates are downstairs where there is no aerobridge...seats are quite uncomfortable..and the departure gates downstairs have insufficient seats as they built a fountain nearby...

all direct flights are to gelf or south east asia onlee as the airport can only handle boeing 737/airbus a320 sized aircraft...airlines flying to amreeka are etihad,quatar,emirates,jet,air yidia,jet.....i take etihad as it is the cheapest and most of the other options have a stop-over at heathrow which i absolutely want to avoid...(londonistan airport is the worst IMHO,the rudest,and u need to walk miles)....

not much options in food....no wifi unlike delhi...not much in shopping...

airport is clean...immigration is not much of a problem...most of the staff are from Guj so i find them polite...security is OK ...since the airport is quite small you don't have to walk much..

on arriving to ahmedabad getting the luggage is a bit chaotic because people tend to crowd around... i have observed desi co travellers who were extremely disciplined when they boarded flight in jfk and also when they boarded a transit flight in abu dhabi or dubai,suddenly become animals on arrival to Yindia ..trolley's are free unlike most unkil airports where we have to pay $6..again since there are not too many flights we get our stuff quite quickly...

demographics of travellers:mostly yindian (60-70%)... quite a few arap phourphathers..(20%)...and gora firangis...10%..most are tourist/jobseekers to gelf and south east asia...and nri's to londonistan and amreeki east coast...

I used Ahmedabad airport few weeks back. The airport was in quite decent condition. There were sufficient seats and they were quite the usual variety. Food options were there as well (4-5 outlets). Of course it is quite a small airport, but much better than Pune International airport. It is not in the scale of Mumbai or Delhi airport.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 29 Sep 2013 16:01

^^ considering the size and economy of the city , and the volume of travellers, it needs a massive upgrade. Gujaratis arguably are the largest bunch of travellers in the country and guj is an industrial hub..with lot of foreign investment... and the state has a single international airport with merely 6 international departure gates..

Surat has not even been given a functional domestic airport...when it happens to be the richest Indian city by per capita income...

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 29 Sep 2013 18:23

Finally flew in and out of Incheon and covered the last biggie (others being Changi, HK, Beijing, Narita)

IMHO HK leads the pack ever so slightly

HK, Changi and Incheon are pretty equal - with the food variety giving HK the lead with Changi second.

What it shows to Beijing is that just being super ginormous does not make a comfortable airport

Leaving glittering airports in the East and arriving at dark danky US airports can be depressing

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 30 Sep 2013 06:58

I spent a long layover inside changi once. used the light rail to explore the other terminal also. was not too impressed with the interior ... looked kind of cramped, disorganized and busy. their LCC part was undergoing renovation at the time to be fair.

bangkok was much newer, more spacious and more logically organized .... their arrival baggage claim was pure shock and awe a single endless cavern with 50 belts in a long line. that hall itself is bigger than most airports. and their duty free area was huge and again neatly organized. the exterior design of the terminals didnt look too good...kind of like a exoskeleton with huge rods engulfs the structure, probably to avoid pillars inside and support it from outside.

you must remember I had gone from HAL apt, with a grand total of 2 big belts and 1 small belt which sometimes 5-10 incoming flights had to share in evening

manish · Post by **manish** » 30 Sep 2013 08:54

Singha wrote:I spent a long layover inside changi once. used the light rail to explore the other terminal also. was not too impressed with the interior ... looked kind of cramped, disorganized and busy. their LCC part was undergoing renovation at the time to be fair.

bangkok was much newer, more spacious and more logically organized .... their arrival baggage claim was pure shock and awe a single endless cavern with 50 belts in a long line. that hall itself is bigger than most airports. and their duty free area was huge and again neatly organized. the exterior design of the terminals didnt look too good...kind of like a exoskeleton with huge rods engulfs the structure, probably to avoid pillars inside and support it from outside.

you must remember I had gone from HAL apt, with a grand total of 2 big belts and 1 small belt which sometimes 5-10 incoming flights had to share in evening

BKK doesn't seem to have been maintained well. On my recent visit saw a lot of broken floor tiles and a couple of horribly maintained washrooms.

In fact the particular gate I boarded from (a painful 'bussing' gate, no aerobridge despite flying out on an Airbus A330-300 widebody) was so shabby that it didn't even have single working Flight Info Display - our flight had been delayed and the same was written with a ball point pen on a piece of white paper and stuck to the counter near the exit

To be fair, many of the aerobridge equipped gates had far better facilities and the airport in general was otherwise pretty good, but evidently it had seen better days.

Mind you, people at Airport Service Quality (ASQ) score obsessed Indian pvt airport terminals would have lost their jobs for far lesser.

I think the political unrest in Thailand and the subsequent occupation of the airport that took place a few years ago left behind a lot of damage.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 03 Oct 2013 14:36

nachiket wrote:
chaanakya wrote: After reaching Gate 10, I got pleasant surprised as I stepped into Dreamliner 787-8. Very smooth takeoff and cruise and landing. Interiors look very nice. Wingspan is huge. I think Indian Airports are barely enough for Dreamliner , even Delhi. \
The Boeing 747 is much larger with a bigger wingspan. 747's have been flying into Indian airports for decades now. They dock at aerobridges too wherever available. The only aircraft which will have problems is the A380.

And here is sort of confirmation of what I felt

Passengers from India are able to fly on board A380 from Dubai to London. But they do not get the luxury on the UAE-India route. A bigger plane like B747-800 that can seat 700 passengers or a B747 400 that can seat 416 passengers cannot be flown into Chennai because it may end up blocking the taxiway or runway. Though the Airports Authority of India (AAI) claims that Chennai airport can handle an A380, sources said that other operations would have to be brought to a halt till the aircraft lands and is brought to the parking bay.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 426926.cms

Besides other complaints regarding foreign airlines.

Here is the unspoken truth: Foreign airlines don't deploy to India their best aircraft from hubs like Dubai, Singapore, Frankfurt and Brussels. The India-leg of a long-haul route always has planes which have been in service for a few years.

Passengers travelling from the US or Australia perceive a change in quality of amenities and service inside a flight the moment they change over at a hub like Frankfurt, Dubai or Singapore.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 03 Oct 2013 21:12

Well foreign airlines don't mind charging current costs now. The same could be said for stopovers but that could be tricky to prove and perpetrators identified. Locking urinals on a stopover for example.

neerajb · Post by **neerajb** » 04 Oct 2013 11:50

Plane crash near Nigeria's Lagos airport kills 16

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/ ... 9T20131003

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 04 Oct 2013 16:00

Russia Considering Offering India Airliner Assembly Deals

MOSCOW, October 4 (RIA Novosti) – Russia could agree on a deal to start assembling Sukhoi Superjet 100 and Irkut MS-21 passenger jets in India, an official at the Russian Economic Development Ministry said Friday.

Russia is considering a number of projects to promote the country’s airliners “with the possibility of cooperating in their production,” said Yevgeny Popov, who heads the ministry’s department of Asia and Africa, adding that this concerns both the Sukhoi Superjet 100, now being built in Russia, and the next-generation Irkut MS-21, due to enter production in a few years.

He did not provide more details.

Popov made the statement ahead of the 19th meeting of the Russian-Indian intergovernmental commission on trade, economic, scientific, technical and cultural cooperation in Moscow on Friday.

According to Indian experts, assembling the Russian passenger jets in India could cut production costs per plane by 40 percent, Popov told journalists.

The Superjet 100 is a medium-haul passenger aircraft capable of carrying 75-95 passengers developed by the Sukhoi Corporation in cooperation with US and European aerospace companies.

The MS-21 is a family of twin-engine jet airliners still under development by the Irkut and the Yakovlev design bureau, part of Russia's United Aircraft Corporation. It has a capacity of 150-212 passengers.

India has a long history of building Soviet and later Russian aircraft under license at Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL), going back to the MiG-21 in the 1960’s, but has only assembled military types. HAL is currently license-building the Russian Su-30MKI strike aircraft in India.

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 05 Oct 2013 21:44

govt ready to prvt air india, not to infuse anymore funds

kshirin · Post by **kshirin** » 05 Oct 2013 23:29

Can anyone please tell me if any thread is discussing the National Civil Aircraft Development Programme? Thanks.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 06 Oct 2013 00:11

krishnan wrote:govt ready to prvt air india, not to infuse anymore funds

Link?

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 06 Oct 2013 06:46

news channel ticker, also its in sunday times

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 10 Oct 2013 22:22

Seems like Dreamliner bad run continues

Boeing fails again: JAL diverts two Dreamliner flights after technical glitch

Technical failures seem to be haunting the Boeing 787 Dreamliner. Just recently, Japan Airlines (JAL) has been forced to turn around two of its brand-new Dreamliner planes.

A Tokyo-bound plane that took off from San Diego was diverted after one of its two anti-icing systems failed.

On another flight, from Moscow to Tokyo, an electrical glitch made six of the plane’s seven toilets unusable.

A JAL spokesman said the company was looking into the problems.

Earlier this week, JAL, which preferred Boeing for decades, announced plans to buy 31 A350 passenger jets in a $9.5-billion deal with Boeing’s rival, Airbus.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 16 Oct 2013 11:58

Panel falls off Air India Dreamliner midair, DGCA to probe incident

Was the flight plain lucky or it speaks of sturdiness of Dreamliner's design that it could fly and land safely despite such mishap.

NEW DELHI: Air India's Dreamliner troubles don't seem to end. In a shocking incident, a large panel on a Boeing 787's fuselage flew off when the aircraft was winging its way from Delhi to Bangalore last Saturday with 148 people on board.

The Dreamliner 'miraculously' landed safely in Bangalore without the pilots realizing a thing. The gaping hole caused by the missing part — measuring 8 by 4 feet — was discovered when the plane was being prepared for the return flight to Delhi. The aviation safety regulator is investigating this incident.

The missing part was taken out of a brand new Dreamliner (VT-ANO), AI's 9th B-787 which had landed here just days back and is awaiting certification to begin commercial flying, and taken to Bangalore. Only after this part was fitted in the aircraft grounded in Bangalore (VT-ANA) could the plane fly again after a delay of almost 10 hours. However, now the brand new "Christmas tree" VT-ANO is grounded in Delhi, awaiting the part from Boeing!

AI spokesman G P Rao said: "The panel has since been fixed and the aircraft is in operation again. The DGCA is probing this." According to sources, the panel was covering the Dreamliner's AC bay. It flew off when AI 803 was on its way to Bangalore.

This is the latest in a series of troubles hitting Boeing's latest commercial aircraft, the Dreamliner. This January, the US aviation regulator had grounded Dreamliners globally and they resumed flying only in May after the fears caused by its battery overheating were resolved.

But even after the aircraft resumed flying, airlines have been reporting troubles with it. AI recently had oven overheating in its aircraft and then the electric systems of ovens were changed in all its B-787. AI flies this aircraft on both domestic and international routes. It flies on Delhi-Bangalore, Delhi-Chennai and Delhi-Kolkata routes apart from long-haul flights between Delhi and London, Frankfurt, Paris and Australia. AI's turnaround banks heavily on this plane.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Oct 2013 18:32

maybe it flew clean and safe out of the bottom. if it had hit one of the tailplanes on the way back, things could get nasty though the FCS could likely still manage to preserve controlled flight using the wing controls....I wonder if FCS is designed to operate like this in degraded mode as control surfaces or combinations of them are progressively lost...?

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 16 Oct 2013 18:59

Not sure if it was a manufacturing defect or someone in maintenance failed to secure all screws properly after checkup. Need to wait for official report.

ManjaM · Post by **ManjaM** » 16 Oct 2013 19:07

There appears to be some exaggeration on the part of media in this situation. While there is no denying that losing a panel is a serious failure of the design, the fact that
1. the airplane did not depressurise
2. the panel is definitively stated by media to be from the fuselage area.
suggests that, the panel is most certainly a wing to body fairing panel. A WTBF panel is not primary structure and there is no risk of catastrophic failure or primary load paths. The fact that the hole was discovered not by a change of the flight characteristics, but instead by mechanics/ ground staff is an indicator of the minimal impact to safety and performance. This section of the 787 was originally designed in Boeing, Winnipeg, not to allude that the origins of this design has anything to do with the performance. Additionally since the airplane is back up in the air again, with a panel salvaged from another 787, indicates that there is no underlying structural damage to the frames and longerons supporting that section of the WTBF so the mechanics were able to pop in the replacement panel without repairs needed for the structure. Sounds like a fastener failure, likely a worksmanship issue with some fasteners being missed. It appears that the panel got sucked out by tearing apart the fasteners and the sealant between the GFRP/CFRP WTBF panel and the Aluminum frame under significant negative pressure, which is why the pilots didn't notice a drop in performance. Had the hole been in a region of positive air pressure, the added drag and subsequent deceleration would have been immediately felt.
It might be easy to track this down, but it is likely that this particular tail number came from Boeing, Charleston which started operation in 2011. They have good people but do not have the experience that Boeing, Everett has. Most certainly and most importantly, it doesn't appear to be a fleetwide issue which is the silver lining for Boeing.

Just my thoughts, maybe someone here more closely involved with that tail# might have better inputs.

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 18 Oct 2013 11:27

Engineer suspended for panel falling off Air India’s Dreamliner - Firstpost