Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 18 Oct 2013 21:23

ramana, yes US cities are twinned as an cultural connector. What Gujarat does, and what many PRC cities and provinces do, is to enable autonomy at that level to seek economic investment. PRC specifically targeted this at a provincial level towards specific places, knowing that its wealthier diaspora in certain countries originated from narrow regions and therefore gave them the deal of access to their ancestral lands in exchange for investment.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 18 Oct 2013 21:31

ramana wrote:chaanakya resisted posting this but during Emergency Indiria Gandhi was also digging for gold in Jaipur fort and found nothing. It was to spite Gyatari Devi who was in the Opposition.

So Baau following in Saas footsteps of folly.

Actually I remembered one story. It goes like this. One farmer heard some thieves planning to commit burgalry in his house. So he started talking to his wife that she should not tell anyone about the gold he has stashed away in his field. Wife was surprised but hearing this thieves went to his field and dug everywhere whole night. In the Morning farmer went to his field and found that soil has been dug and upturned. His labour was saved and he could get better harvest while thieves reaped bitter harvest.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 18 Oct 2013 22:07

Thats a very famous Tenali Rama story.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenali_Ramakrishna

panduranghari · Post by **panduranghari** » 18 Oct 2013 22:08

Sushupti wrote:A new business idol

http://www.economist.com/news/business/ ... iness-idol

Yada yada. How thatcher is the bench-effing-mark. Typical condescending western bull shit passed as anal lysis. The problem is (or is it?) economist is respected. But then so is NYT and there cannot be any other newspaper more anti India than NYT.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 18 Oct 2013 22:10

KaranM, Did you know TRK was also a very wise minister for Krishna Deva Raya and helped stave off a Mughal-Bahmani allaince to invade Vijayanagara?

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 18 Oct 2013 22:10

chaanakya wrote:Congis are reduced to digging gold and already three or more similar claims have surfaced. Having looted the country for 9 years , in tenth year they are made to dig for themselves based on dreams . On the other hand Maharashtra , ruled by Congi+NCP combine has passed a law against superstition. And SP Chief goon has rushed to lay his claim on the prospective gold.

Even if we find gold, it is ASI job to capture the history of India , its past glory and deliberately Congis have not conducted systematically the excavation of significant historical sites and one can find many treasures , artifacts but not necessarily based on heresy or conjecture or dreams but on scientific investigation of India's rich past. Sad that they are making a mockery of all that.

Cant we wait just a few days before mocking spiritual guru, in this case the sadhu. We have tons of such instances where some revelations have come through dreams. Here is the latest example of a dream coming true. If you cannot separate wheat from chaff, at least do not call the whole as chaff.
Dream leads woman to ancient idols

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 18 Oct 2013 22:11

@Ramana,

Didnt know that at all. Would love to read more about him!!

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 18 Oct 2013 22:14

kmkraoind wrote:
chaanakya wrote:Congis are reduced to digging gold and already three or more similar claims have surfaced. Having looted the country for 9 years , in tenth year they are made to dig for themselves based on dreams . On the other hand Maharashtra , ruled by Congi+NCP combine has passed a law against superstition. And SP Chief goon has rushed to lay his claim on the prospective gold.

Even if we find gold, it is ASI job to capture the history of India , its past glory and deliberately Congis have not conducted systematically the excavation of significant historical sites and one can find many treasures , artifacts but not necessarily based on heresy or conjecture or dreams but on scientific investigation of India's rich past. Sad that they are making a mockery of all that.
Cant we wait just a few days before mocking spiritual guru, in this case the sadhu. We have tons of such instances where some revelations have come through dreams. Here is the latest example of a dream coming true.
Dream leads woman to ancient idols

Sir, applaud your faith in these cynical times, but there is a reason for the cynicism in that there is difference between true spiritual gurus and the number of folks who keep popping up in India, don saffron robes and attempt to con everyone. That "swami agnivesh" is a perfect example of such a character.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 18 Oct 2013 22:15

panduranghari wrote:
Sushupti wrote:A new business idol

http://www.economist.com/news/business/ ... iness-idol
Yada yada. How thatcher is the bench-effing-mark. Typical condescending western bull shit passed as anal lysis. The problem is (or is it?) economist is respected. But then so is NYT and there cannot be any other newspaper more anti India than NYT.

Seeing it is the economist = not clicking on the link. E-con-mist and NYT are the two most anti India rags still carrying the gora mans burden of civilizing us heathen natives.

member_23658 · Post by **member_23658** » 18 Oct 2013 22:21

kmkraoind wrote:
chaanakya wrote:...
Cant we wait just a few days before mocking spiritual guru, in this case the sadhu. We have tons of such instances where some revelations have come through dreams. Here is the latest example of a dream coming true. If you cannot separate wheat from chaff, at least do not call the whole as chaff.
Dream leads woman to ancient idols

Rationally one could propose that the woman found the idols by chance and made up the story of dreams to get some attention.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 18 Oct 2013 22:21

Swami Agnivesh is not at all a saffron Sadhu. Imama bukhari tomorrow wears saffron, doesnt make him one. That guy is out an out anti-national and a chamcha of current establishment. A jholawala

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 18 Oct 2013 22:25

to her credit..palin knew how to make millions in the past few years.

the problem with rahul is not just ignorance..he is filled with bad ideas (hindu terrorists are the biggest danger to india)....has no heart or connection with the people..and is not hardworking. politics is hard work. the sheer amount of people you have to smile at, talk to, figure out what they want, assuage, inspire to work even when you don't give them what they want, literally a hundred different skills like this.

he looks like he just woke up and got into politics...even after being in politics for 10 years? now..

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 18 Oct 2013 22:26

https://www.google.com/search?q=Modi+SI ... 1&ie=UTF-8

Folks: I have noticed this before but Google chacha is giving a much higher priority to anti-Modi stance in its search results.
Thee is absolutely no reason for the fekunama blog to be #1 in the search results.

panduranghari · Post by **panduranghari** » 18 Oct 2013 22:26

disha wrote:2. Gujjus are the latest entrants into "big business" in mumbai - particularly Ambani poached into what was considered holy territories of parsis - best epitomised (even though not correctly) in the movie Guru. And thanks to Datta Samant, the textile industry went lock stock and barrel to Ahmedabad and thence to Surat.

Mumbai is moving back to what it used to be - sleepy hamlet of kolis. It was nothing until Brits decided to reclaim it. Hope it happens sooner.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 18 Oct 2013 22:30

fanne wrote:Swami Agnivesh is not at all a saffron Sadhu. Imama bukhari tomorrow wears saffron, doesnt make him one. That guy is out an out anti-national and a chamcha of current establishment. A jholawala

Exactly. There is no shortage of such characters in India right now.. and hence one gets wary of a lot of these political sadhus..

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 18 Oct 2013 22:30

why I like modi is, in his talks he reflects least governance and giving the power back to people and make them rich.. convert all the poor to rich, is what that gives.

this helps in moving this congress control on our lives and future. i hope we can banish congress form of gov for ever.. this is a cancer. /sorry.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 18 Oct 2013 22:31

Gus wrote:to her credit..palin knew how to make millions in the past few years.

the problem with rahul is not just ignorance..he is filled with bad ideas (hindu terrorists are the biggest danger to india)....has no heart or connection with the people..and is not hardworking. politics is hard work. the sheer amount of people you have to smile at, talk to, figure out what they want, assuage, inspire to work even when you don't give them what they want, literally a hundred different skills like this.

he looks like he just woke up and got into politics...even after being in politics for 10 years? now..

Exactly. +1 to all your points.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 18 Oct 2013 22:32

VikramS wrote:https://www.google.com/search?q=Modi+SI ... 1&ie=UTF-8

Folks: I have noticed this before but Google chacha is giving a much higher priority to anti-Modi stance in its search results.
Thee is absolutely no reason for the fekunama blog to be #1 in the search results.

Shouldn't EC take into account twitter NREGA and such crowd.

If search engines are gamed is it not a serious issue in parliamentary democracy?

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 18 Oct 2013 22:41

vishvak: Anyone inside Google who can check

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 18 Oct 2013 22:45

No but I have seen excel sheet of twitter accounts of certain types deriding NaMo/BJP with time of creation of account. Seem to be created in same time frame - within 5 minutes of each other.

johneeG · Post by **johneeG** » 18 Oct 2013 23:01

First they ask for the account of temple gold, now this digging. There seems to be some amount of desperation in this. So, my guess is that the treasury is in very bad situation. And people will know about the full extent of economic damage only after the election.

These people simply destroyed the desh(I think willfully) in a decade. This was the time when the desh could have risen because the rest of the countries were in economic problems. Instead, these people have crashed the economy to ground.

I really hope the gold is found. That may be the only way to save the desh in immediate short-term. Anyway, the elections are coming, so these people may not have the time to loot gold if it is found.

kmkraoind wrote: Cant we wait just a few days before mocking spiritual guru, in this case the sadhu. We have tons of such instances where some revelations have come through dreams. Here is the latest example of a dream coming true. If you cannot separate wheat from chaff, at least do not call the whole as chaff.
Dream leads woman to ancient idols

Yep, and if the gold is indeed found, then the desh should be grateful to that Saadhu.

Amol.D wrote: Rationally one could propose that the woman found the idols by chance and made up the story of dreams to get some attention.

One could propose anything and 'rationalize' it. Whether something is 'rational' or not depends on the personal bias.

-----
I was kind of confused over the Amirkhan court's summons to Antonio. But, there may be one possible explanation. I'll put it out and you guys can say whether it makes anysense:

The pappu and antonio wanted to stage coup against the MMS. They were preparing for it for some time. Basically, MMS is a Amirkhan plant. Whenever MMS was threatened, the Amirkhans would leak something or the other to threaten pappu or antonio. For example, pappu's saffron remarks stopped pappu for at least a couple of months.

For sometime now, MMS has been trying to do some big deal in Kashmir. Earlier, it was about Siachin. I think Siachin thingy was scuttled when Modi started pushing the topic. He first wrote a letter to PM on this. There was also a proposal of MMS about joint management of LOC. He was about to close it with Mushy. But Mushy was deposed(perhaps, not an accident. Perhaps, the paki generals were not keen on this development).

Recently, MMS may have prepared for some big gift for the pakis. His meet with Badhmaash Shareif may have been for this purpose.

Now, pappu and antonio seem to have their own headaches. Firstly, there seem to be many aspirants for pradhan-manthri seat. Chidhu and Pranab may have been the leading contenders at one time. And there seems to have been open rivalry between the two. The rivalry was so intense that their offices were bugged by each other. Eventually, Chidhu was somehow suppressed, while Pranab was kicked up to president-giri. But, it seems Pranab has not given up on his ambition and is going to continue to make his own moves.

Now that Chidhu and Pranab are not in the path directly, pappu wanted to remove MMS. He may have been preparing for this for some time. May be for a month or two. Somehow, the Amirkhans may have learnt about it. And they sent a warning shot to the Mainos by issuing the summons to Antonio to dissuade them from going after MMS.

It seems that the Mainos are preparing for the elections. They will blame all the scams on MMS and present themselves as the alternative. This is the original plan. But this plan was preponed when Pranab refused to sign the ordinance. So the plan was preponed and MMS was targeted by pappu. And immediately a chorus of MMS should resign started.

Pappu wanted MMS to resign. But MMS didn't. But, Pappu and Modi's attacks on MMS stopped MMS from doing anything major on Kashmir. It seems to me that MMS is still expecting to emerge as the consensus candidate even after the elections with the backing from Amirkhan. Similarly, Pranab is also expecting to do some hustling after the election, so he is taking care to keep a clean image and make all the right noises.

Now, it is clear that kongis are not going to form the sarkaar. So, they are trying for a third front. It seems there is real panic in the kongi sections that they will be completely wiped out. So some are demanding the biyanka to come because pappu and antonio are completely over.

The problem with biyanka is vadra. The amount of dirt that is there on vadra, it is simply not possible for biyanka to come. If she enters, then it'll be much more negative impact for kongis.

The real problem for the kongis is that they have committed suicide in AP. Now, if the idea is to stitch a third front in 2014 and try for a re-election in 2016, then it is not going to work because in two years, their situation is going to further worsen in AP(if that is possible at all, given that they are already touching rock bottom).

Frankly, I am expecting the kongis around 75 this time. Anyway, with the kongis wiped out of AP, kongis are never again going to form a proper govt. From now on, they will be like left if they manage to survive. Left survived because it found two solid bastions(Kerala and Vangal). The bad luck of kongis is that AP is one of its bastions. By losing AP, they have become like Left after it lost in Vangal.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 18 Oct 2013 23:31

SwamyG wrote:He is urging 30 States to take care of 30 countries. Adopting a country

May be Jammu & Kashmir can "adopt" Saudi Arabia!

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 18 Oct 2013 23:41

We still haven't fully adopted J&k. This temple excavation is expected. With high deficits, inflation, and the world moving toward a partial gold standard, the RBI in collusion with the government wants to stock up. It will try to target more temples. This is just the beginning. They will take the gold and melt it down into bars and store it in a vault.

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 18 Oct 2013 23:52

johneeG wrote:
...

The real problem for the kongis is that they have committed suicide in AP. Now, if the idea is to stitch a third front in 2014 and try for a re-election in 2016, then it is not going to work because in two years, their situation is going to further worsen in AP(if that is possible at all, given that they are already touching rock bottom).

Frankly, I am expecting the kongis around 75 this time. Anyway, with the kongis wiped out of AP, kongis are never again going to form a proper govt. From now on, they will be like left if they manage to survive. Left survived because it found two solid bastions(Kerala and Vangal). The bad luck of kongis is that AP is one of its bastions. By losing AP, they have become like Left after it lost in Vangal.

I think congis are banking on history in AP: around election time--before or soon after--the "rebel" factions will merge into congi. This happened with the old Telangana Praja Samiti (TPS) in 1969, which swept the parliament polls in Telangana and then promptly merged. More recently, it happened with Chiranjeevi's party, and I think it will happen again with TRS and with YSR Congress. Of course, congis are doing everything they can with the CBI to bring this about.

So, I would caution against counting congi out in AP. When it comes to forming a government, I think they will have 30+ seats in their control, barring the few which will go to TDP which is struggling to articulate a position and strategy.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 19 Oct 2013 00:00

TRS merging with INC will lead to an INC sweep in T but will also open up the opposition space in T. I see TDP and YSR as SA parties. It is for BJP to exploit the situation in T provided they have capable leaders.

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 19 Oct 2013 00:02

KLNMurthy wrote:
johneeG wrote:
...

The real problem for the kongis is that they have committed suicide in AP. Now, if the idea is to stitch a third front in 2014 and try for a re-election in 2016, then it is not going to work because in two years, their situation is going to further worsen in AP(if that is possible at all, given that they are already touching rock bottom).

Frankly, I am expecting the kongis around 75 this time. Anyway, with the kongis wiped out of AP, kongis are never again going to form a proper govt. From now on, they will be like left if they manage to survive. Left survived because it found two solid bastions(Kerala and Vangal). The bad luck of kongis is that AP is one of its bastions. By losing AP, they have become like Left after it lost in Vangal.
I think congis are banking on history in AP: around election time--before or soon after--the "rebel" factions will merge into congi. This happened with the old Telangana Praja Samiti (TPS) in 1969, which swept the parliament polls in Telangana and then promptly merged. More recently, it happened with Chiranjeevi's party, and I think it will happen again with TRS and with YSR Congress. Of course, congis are doing everything they can with the CBI to bring this about.

So, I would caution against counting congi out in AP. When it comes to forming a government, I think they will have 30+ seats in their control, barring the few which will go to TDP which is struggling to articulate a position and strategy.

They will merge only if congress is in some position of strength (meaning at least 130-140 seats), anything lesser than that, they have no reason to yield to congress demands. Once congress crashes below 130, they will be in no position to form a govt and then no cbi or ib can blackmail these parties. They are free to demand what they want from BJP which will be in a better position if indeed congress does so bad.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 19 Oct 2013 00:10

link

Also note "The Antiquities and Art Treasure Act of 1972 says that if you or any institution has artefacts or materials with cultural or historical value, the state has no problem in you possessing it. Nevertheless, you cannot misuse, melt or export them. That is why the Supreme Court has ordered for the preparation of an inventory of the temple assets." in the same article. One can not therefore value it in terms of weight legally.
..
"We cannot destroy the assets by melting or selling them to 'solve' the present deficiencies and difficulties. It will not be much different from a thief stealing them for his/her own rational convictions!"
..

It's not government job to sell of county's artifacts but to preserve it.

About wealth of temples for better economy, there is no connection. In fact national treasury can't be overspent under excuse of some wealth found somewhere.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 19 Oct 2013 00:24

kmkraoind wrote:
chaanakya wrote:Congis are reduced to digging gold and already three or more similar claims have surfaced. Having looted the country for 9 years , in tenth year they are made to dig for themselves based on dreams . On the other hand Maharashtra , ruled by Congi+NCP combine has passed a law against superstition. And SP Chief goon has rushed to lay his claim on the prospective gold.

Even if we find gold, it is ASI job to capture the history of India , its past glory and deliberately Congis have not conducted systematically the excavation of significant historical sites and one can find many treasures , artifacts but not necessarily based on heresy or conjecture or dreams but on scientific investigation of India's rich past. Sad that they are making a mockery of all that.
Cant we wait just a few days before mocking spiritual guru, in this case the sadhu. We have tons of such instances where some revelations have come through dreams. Here is the latest example of a dream coming true. If you cannot separate wheat from chaff, at least do not call the whole as chaff.
Dream leads woman to ancient idols

Well I am not questioning "YOUR" belief in Dreams of a Sadhu or Pious Religious Man. All are entitled to have our belief system and faith and I don't see that arguments of rationality would apply there.

It is not open to ASI to have such belief in dreams etc. It should investigate and find the factual or historical or scientific basis to support or refute the claim.One could understand If it had conducted detailed investigation before rushing to dig the gold out before dhanteras, else that is laughable. If they put out a statement giving reasons for their going to the place supported by other evidences one could have given benefit of doubt.Otherwise treasure hunt might result in accidental findings of gold artifacts but that would prove nothing.

I have no gripe against the Holy man. On the contrary I have utmost respect for him.

Misplaced hope of Congis and SP Chief goon to use family jewels to tide over the economic crisis and using this action to instill a false sense of hope among masses is pathetic. Like wiping debt away or removing inflation or solving economic crisis is miserable attempt to lull the public into complacency. They should be kicked out simply for that. Anyway they cant do much if findings turn out to be of historical value.

ShyamSP · Post by **ShyamSP** » 19 Oct 2013 00:56

KLNMurthy wrote:I think congis are banking on history in AP: around election time--before or soon after--the "rebel" factions will merge into congi. This happened with the old Telangana Praja Samiti (TPS) in 1969, which swept the parliament polls in Telangana and then promptly merged. More recently, it happened with Chiranjeevi's party, and I think it will happen again with TRS and with YSR Congress. Of course, congis are doing everything they can with the CBI to bring this about.

So, I would caution against counting congi out in AP. When it comes to forming a government, I think they will have 30+ seats in their control, barring the few which will go to TDP which is struggling to articulate a position and strategy.

Fake third party strategy has been used successfully by Congress in AP. Only this time people are more aware with experiences from TPS (in long past) and PRP (in recent past) and they are getting convinced of TRS and YSRC as Congress plants.

Three scenarios with respect to AP.
1. Split: Current strategy by INC. INC and TRS will get most seats in Telangana. YSRC and INC to get good enough seats in AP. Not a bad case for Congress
2. No split: Nandyal strategy by INC. INC and TRS blackmails till last moment to get most seats in Telangana. YSRC and INC get most seats in Seemandhra. Good case for Congress.
3. Split or no Split: Awareness strategy by TDP. INC and YSRC are flushed out (may be 5-6 seats) in Seemandhra. TDP+BJP grabs 6+ seats in T. This is predicated upon awareness among people and is worst case for Congress.

BJP is no where in either scenarios. AP is not Karnataka to have some dedicated BJP mindset. They will have to get into mud and fight like INC, TRS, TDP, and YSRC. Some BJP folks are ventilating prospects of getting TRS and YSRC (both are Congress products) into supporting them. BJP with its own cadre screwed up in Karnataka but now some BJP wallahs want BJP to build its own for some glory days in Telangana in decades later. If BJP loses this time, Congress will press the RED button on BJP. This is most likely case in such scenario

INC at surprising speed is moving money to Hyderabad via "IT" projects. Retaining Control of Hyderabad is key in case Delhi falls.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 19 Oct 2013 01:09

ShyamSP, What is Split-No split case? How is it different from 1 & 2?

ShyamSP · Post by **ShyamSP** » 19 Oct 2013 01:28

ramana wrote:ShyamSP, What is Split-No split case? How is it different from 1 & 2?

It is more of awareness case. All test subjects (Botsa, Buvaneswari, etc.) INC released in Seemandhra have failed even to convince an iota. If INC or YSRC don't succeed getting Seemandhra with 25 seats whole calculations go wrong for INC.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 19 Oct 2013 01:37

INC at surprising speed is moving money to Hyderabad via "IT" projects. Retaining Control of Hyderabad is key in case Delhi falls.

Interesting! Meaning con race state or con race center or both?

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 19 Oct 2013 01:54

Treasure Trove Act
May be other acts too.

The president is custodian of such wealth.

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 19 Oct 2013 01:57

http://guruprasad.net/posts/modi-phenom ... r-reality/

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 19 Oct 2013 01:59

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 19 Oct 2013 05:13

why is this sudden urge to prove that 2002 is not entirely the fault of gujarat?

i think, it can happen anywhere in India or on the planet when jihadic mindsets present and clear danger.

that is exactly what should be highlighted and brought forward to attention.

strategy: kill the bug, where it procreates.

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 19 Oct 2013 06:19

Today is 19-oct, the much awaited namo UP campaign begins today from Kanpur. Anyone have any details on schedule etc?

I'm sure ETV UP will cover it Live so that I don't have to rely on the tender mercies of the angrezi poseur channels.

Would be interesting to watch and decode every word and nuance he speaks in UP.... rest assured UPites and the vrnacular press will do so anyway. What caste refeences if any will be made? What communities may get a mention or two? What issues will get highlighted? the list goes on...

Go namo saar, desh tumhare saath hai...

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 19 Oct 2013 06:23

Just pray that his safety is adequately taken care of. I guess first time he is going to an unfriendly govt state that has no morals ...

Santosh · Post by **Santosh** » 19 Oct 2013 06:30

^^ True. One of the dhagas under GDF had a link to some news article that had a very detailed itinerary including means of transport, route and timing. Scary. I pray he stays safe.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Oct 2013 07:24

Pathetic!