Navy Chief Resigns over Sindhuratna fire

Akshay Kapoor · Post by **Akshay Kapoor** » 01 Mar 2014 11:49

Disgusting. You can say what you like if you are 'press' it seems.

And calling Adm Joshi's departure as unceremonious...he has left in the most ceremonious way - for honour and integrity. But what would she know about these things or I suspect about the English language!

The sad part is that only the best fall on their swords.I have seen some of his interviews - one was 1 hour long interaction with students on Doordarshan. Do watch it.

Akshay Kapoor · Post by **Akshay Kapoor** » 01 Mar 2014 11:50

Here it is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTbQxxo6X1w

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 01 Mar 2014 12:08

Delay in changing submarine batteries could have led to smoke on submarine INS Sindhuratna

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 01 Mar 2014 12:14

30 years is a long time to operate Submarine of any class least of all Conventional SSK.

IIRC in late 90's when NDA was in power the IN warned that we will be facing such a scenerio by 2010 or so and wanted to replace it fleet of submarine.

The Kilo and Type-209 purchase has happened in late 80's and early 90's , most of our submarine fleet are over 25 years and approaching the end of their structural life.

We need to get Scorpene submarine outright made via DCN yards .....Relying on MDL to stick to its promise of revisised time line is very risky ....by the time MDL promises to release the first Scorpene in 2016 all our submarine fleet will be 30 years old since its induction.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 01 Mar 2014 12:17

HILIFE batteries does not seem to have any entry on the web. Amaron has some product named Hi-LIFE and a factory in Tirupati, thats why I was confused if the two are same(I mistakenly assumed their factory in tirupati means HQ in Hyd). Amaron is partially owned by johnson controls.
they are surely different
http://images01.olx-st.com/ui/19/41/63/ ... attery.jpg

it looks like they are in involved in K-15/Arihant as the India today article suggests "Drdo sub"
http://www.indiandefencereview.com/spot ... tory-k-15/

Much is secret of the components but HILIFE Batteries Hyderabad had built submarine batteries but the Navy would not test them as Navy has strong bonds first with Standard Batteries who supplied the 200 ton batteries for submarines and later Exide who bought out Standard. HILIFE went to court against the Indian Navy on ‘competition law’ to make Navy buy its superior and cheaper batteries and in court revealed they were supplying DRDO submarine batteries for a project. Now one can link up it was the first name given to the underwater missile SAGARIKA ‘from the seas’, but it was classified.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 01 Mar 2014 12:26

this court case deadlock must have been going for a while. our courts are also quick to grant stay orders. would be interesting to know if court had banned further purchase of Std bats pending judgement or the MOD took it on its own to consider it sub-judice hot potato and refused to sanction further orders for expired bats.

either way 2 people are dead and 7 badly damaged due to this mess. and we nearly lost another sub. plus CinC gone.

since the kilos were acquired close together nearly 1 per annum, there must be another 3-4 subs with similar batt expiry issues probably - a scary thought imo.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 01 Mar 2014 17:22

Austin,what do you think is the current price of a DCN built Scorpene? With an escalation clause of 1 crore per day for our measly 6,can you imagine what it will now cost. Now the Spaniards left in indecent haste,right after their version's design was found to be too fat to float and would sink like a stone to the bottom! I would estimate that by now the cost of just one conventional non-AIP Scorpene would be almost or equal to the cost of an Akula-2 on lease for 10 years!

Frankly our best option for augmenting the IN's sub fleet is to asap replace the 3 or 4 oldest Kilos ,not upgraded,with newer 636.3 ones,the same which are being built for Russia and Vietnam.These are being built at the rate of 6 for Vietnam within 5 years. The U-boats are also being upgraded and we don't know the full details.They will not be able to fire the range of Klub missiles and will have their weaponry limitations.One does not know of the Greek U-boats are still available,and at what cost,surely a lot more than the Kilos.In with more of the same.out current eco crisis,we'll have to tread water

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 01 Mar 2014 18:14

Immediately purchase few Kilos as a interim solution and let fresh subs as our last international purchasing. We already started privatization of sub building with Arihanth and same should be extended to SSKs in future with strict penalty for delays in delivery. I am sure we can manage well with people like L&T making boats.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 01 Mar 2014 18:22

This is the curious policy.Despite proven sub capability,L&T and Pipapav were deliberately kept out of the sub building business by MDL who have a woeful track record of building subs,whether they were U-209/1500s in the 80s (just 2!) and the 6 Scorpenes of which not a single one has hot water.The astronomical prices for Scorpenes ,even where the entire lot are being built in India,which theoretically should bring down costs, is a highly questionable deal.

The best way forward to strengthening the sub fleet is for the defence shipyards focussing on building nuclear boats,both SSBNs and SSGNs,while the private yards build conventional AIP subs under licence.L&T who have provided the hulls of the ATVs under construction,could easily build both types if needed. Immediate imterim purchases are required as of yesterday,but AKA's pen is permanently out of ink!

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 01 Mar 2014 20:13

PSU rubbish doing any reasonable work is out of question. But even in private sector shipyards like Bharathi ( now under CDR and can not recover - Entire work is getting rotten and all the workers left their jobs - huge debts which can never be cleared)should be kept out.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 01 Mar 2014 21:09

To look at the bright side, of this mess. This may just create a crisis situation needed for the next government led by NaMo to bring in the pvt sector yards to build subs and additional ships.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 01 Mar 2014 21:33

IF NoMo came to power, that should have happened no matter what. India did not have to wait for such a tragedy. This seems to be total neglect from this government and add to that total silence, which is even worse.

Brando · Post by **Brando** » 01 Mar 2014 21:44

I don't think NaMo is going to be some magic panacea. The NDA is astutely promising the sun and the moon for political gain and expediency but delivery is far from certain . I think the AAP has shown that "good intentions" don't translate into "good governance" and the MoD needs institutional change from the ground up.

We will have to wait and see who the next DEFMIN is and who the next NSA is going to be. If another "George Fernandes" is put up, nothing much will change.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 01 Mar 2014 21:45

Captain pulls it off this time too

INS Sindhuratna’s commanding officer, taken grievously ill on Wednesday after jumping into a hellish pit of poisonous fumes to try and save two juniors, has cheated “the jaws of death” and been taken off the ventilator, navy sources said.

Commander Sandeep Sinha, 40, had inhaled toxic gases during the accident on the submarine, when a battery leak started a fire and extinguisher fumes filled two compartments.

Should provide some good validations and perhaps even some new story items to drown the Saint.

INS Sindhuratna’s commanding officer, taken grievously ill on Wednesday after jumping into a hellish pit of poisonous fumes to try and save two juniors, has cheated “the jaws of death” and been taken off the ventilator, navy sources said.

Commander Sandeep Sinha, 40, had inhaled toxic gases during the accident on the submarine, when a battery leak started a fire and extinguisher fumes filled two compartments. Two officers died and many were left critical.

“He has been taken off the ventilator. He was quite serious till morning but in the afternoon, there was a sudden turnaround,” a Western Naval Command source said.

“The doctors are saying that his willpower has brought him back from the jaws of death.”

A fellow submariner and former National Defence Academy mate had yesterday described “Sandy” Sinha as a “fighter” and hoped he would “pull this one off too”.

Sinha is the son of a retired naval commander of the logistics directorate and the son-in-law of a retired rear admiral from the naval armament inspectorate.

His wife Meetu, a computer engineer, had quit her Tata Consultancy Service job two years ago to support him during his command posting in Mumbai. The couple have a four-year-old daughter and a two-and-a-half-year-old son.

“Meetu has been by his side. Coming as she does from a family of naval officers and submariners, she has shown a stoic grace during these very tough and painful two days that few can emulate. The doctors were not sure how Sandy would fare,” the navy source said.

Meetu’s brother, Commander R. Sominder, is a submariner too. “Sandy and Sominder were course mates and close friends,” the source said.

The family’s naval connection doesn’t end there: the husband of Meetu’s sister is also a navy commander.

“This is a family that has the Indian Navy in its veins. They know the challenges of the job. They know the sacrifices that are needed and are not scared of them,” the senior naval officer who spoke to this newspaper said.

‘Heroic’ effort

Sinha had rushed into compartment 3 of the Sindhuratna on finding that two officers —Lieutenant Commander Kapish Muwal and Lieutenant Manoranjan Kumar — had been trapped inside.

“He had gone in to try to rescue them in total disregard of his personal safety. But his heroic efforts failed to save the two juniors’ lives,” said the source.

Despite taking in the gases and fully aware that they could be lethal, Sinha had manned the controls personally and brought the submarine up to the surface.

He had then stood by till every single soul had climbed to the surface to breathe in fresh air and revive themselves.

“He insisted he wouldn’t go up till every person on board had done so. Then, after ensuring shutdown of the controls, he was the last to go up,” the source said.

By that time he was quite sick, but still refused to be air-evacuated with the first lot of seven critically ill crew members.

“He agreed to go only when a ship came in after three hours to evacuate 22 more sailors and officers. This worsened his condition,” said the source, who is on the navy’s board of inquiry that will probe the accident.

The board of inquiry is to be headed by Rear Admiral S.V. Bhokare, Flag Officer Submarines. Bhokare is posted in Visakhapatnam but was in Mumbai during the accident.

This afternoon, the navy conducted a wreath-laying ceremony with full military honours in memory of Muwal and Kumar at the Western Naval Command, where there were few dry eyes. The bodies had been handed over to their families last night.

Sources said Muwal had probably been the first to spot the fire and had swiftly jumped in to contain its spread, with Kumar’s help. The two of them died trying to save the others in the two gas-filled compartments.

After the ceremony, Muwal was cremated in Mumbai. Kumar’s body will be flown to hometown Jamshedpur for the last rites.

It was erroneously reported in today’s edition that Muwal was married and leaves behind a child.

Akshay Kapoor · Post by **Akshay Kapoor** » 01 Mar 2014 23:26

Great news, thanks for posting N Rao. Get well and get fighting fit soon Commander Sinha. All our best wishes are with you and your sailors.

Is it essential we call AKA a 'saint'. I wince every time I hear that.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 01 Mar 2014 23:30

"Saint" is NOT a compliment.

Perhaps you need to get one of these : ) :

ManuJ · Post by **ManuJ** » 01 Mar 2014 23:33

Vice Admiral Sinha was expected to resign, but apparently hasn't.
Even when a junior officer has been made the officiating Chief.
And when all the incidents happened under his watch.
He let his senior officer take moral responsibility for his own shortcomings.
As per some reports, he was asked to resign by Admiral Joshi and he refused.
Seems to be the opposite type as compared to Adm. Joshi.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 01 Mar 2014 23:44

Resignation?

If we are to believe this report, he is real busy to even think about resignation.

Western command chief still eyeing top naval post, but AK Antony not keen

After the sudden resignation of navy chief Admiral DK Joshi, Western naval commander Vice-Admiral Shekhar Sinha, who is now the senior-most naval commander, has been desperately trying to reach the defence ministry to explain his position. Sources said Sinha has been unsuccessfully trying to seek defence minister AK Antony's appointment for the past two days given the fact that he is the frontrunner for the top post in the navy.

A source told dna that Sinha has even been making attempts to reach Antony through top officials of the defence ministry. "As the defence minister has ignored his request so far, it appears to be an act to convey his displeasure. He is now trying to put up a case for himself by approaching other key officials of the ministry," the source said.

Akshay Kapoor · Post by **Akshay Kapoor** » 01 Mar 2014 23:58

NRao wrote:"Saint" is NOT a compliment.

Perhaps you need to get one of these : ) :

You are too kind. I KNOW that but not everyone takes it that way. I am sure most of our press get irony which is why they keep saying he is honest ! Most commentary I read portrays him as 'clean'. And that picture gets reinforced in people's minds. I say that not doing your job is dishonest.

sunilUpa · Post by **sunilUpa** » 02 Mar 2014 00:51

Lt Commander Kapish Muwal and Lt Manoranjan Kumar,
Words fail me to express the anguish at your loss, but thank you for your supreme sacrifice. We will not forget it.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2014 08:22

Received by email

We should have got AK Anthony's head, instead of the Admiral's.

Mohan Guruswamy

The ill-fated INS Sindhuratna, the Russian made Kilo class submarine, which
took the lives of two officers, and cut short the tenure of Admiral DK
Joshi in its wake, was commissioned on November 19, 1988. Before it was
handed over to the Indian Navy the Russians sailed it for about a year on
trials and weapons testing. So effectively the submarine has been in
service for 26 years. When the Russians hand over a submarine they
stipulate a service life of twelve years, and after a major refit, which
entails of almost rebuilding the submarine from its outer skin to inner
skin, and the incorporation of new weapons and navigation systems, the
submarine has a stipulated service like of another ten years. But the
Indian Navy squeezed out another two years of service. The active life of
this submarine ended in December 2013.

A Kilo class submarine is powered by 240 batteries, each weighing 800 kgs.
Each of these batteries has a service life of 200 fully charged to fully
discharged cycles or exactly 4 years whichever comes first. The
Sindhuratna's batteries used up their life cycle in December 2012. Since
the Navy's underwater arm is now hugely depleted, the Navy had no recourse
but to stretch the service life of these aged submarines. The Sindhuratna
underwent a minor refit for the last four months and it was on its first
sea trial or Task 2 sea examination before it could be re-inducted into
active service. It was still fitted with the batteries whose service life
had expired 15 months ago. The ship didn't get new batteries because the
procurement was delayed by the MoD.

These batteries are now made in India, by Chloride India and Standard
Batteries and are procured at much higher than international prices. The
reasons for this are easily understood. One is we need indigenous sources
to be self reliant, and the other is the usual malaise that afflicts
defence purchases. Lolly. The costs of these batteries too have gone up
hugely in the past decade. A set of batteries takes two years to build and
the Sindhuratna was not expected to get its new batteries till the end of
2014.

To cut a long story short, a submarine that should have been cut up in a
scrap yard was still sailing with batteries, which have long outlived their
service life. I saw an admiral relate on TV just a few minutes ago about
how he has seen batteries with electrolyte leaking and running on the
floor, and how sailors were mopping it up. Yesterday, the INS Sindhuratna
had on board, the Western Command's Commander of Submarines and the Chief of Safety. There was a good reason for this. They were there to personally
check out if the submarine was indeed sea and battle worthy. It clearly was
not, and two young officers paid with their lives.

Who is responsible for this sad state of affairs? Clearly a MoD, which is
incapable of sanctioning critical consumables like batteries in time or
forever has to bear the burden. The file requiring the purchase of new
batteries was under process for years with the MoD. The fleet is required
to have a set of batteries as a reserve. The HDW designed Shishumar
submarines use different batteries so the Fleet was supposed to have
another set as a reserve. Let alone two reserves that they don't have, our
submarines make do with expired batteries.

AK Anthony knew all this. The Navy has brought it to his notice many times,
with a monotonous regularity. He didn't get off his butt, busy as he was
covering it. That's why he accepted the Navy Chiefs resignation with great
alacrity. He didn't ponder over it, as is his well-known habit. He has
managed to deflect attention. For now at least. He will now make a big show
of cracking the whip, when it is he who needs a few lashes of the
cat-o-nine-tails.

mohanguru@gmail.com

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 02 Mar 2014 08:32

^ all things considered any other country's PM (other than mountbatten singh) would have fired his Minister of Defence under both moral and public pressure in such a situation.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 02 Mar 2014 08:43

The most powerful force of nature: Madam Nidra Devi.

Cannot do much against Her. It is said that she even has hold over Lord Vishnu. What to say of *us* mere mortals.

satyamev jayate

Forgotten: nānṛtaṁ

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2014 08:46

Undermined chiefs unhappy with Antony

VISHAL THAPAR New Delhi | 1st Mar 2014

The dramatic resignation of Admiral D.K. Joshi as Indian Navy chief on Wednesday has brought the enigmatic leadership style of Defence Minister A.K. Antony into the spotlight. He has had a tenuous relationship with a series of military chiefs, which has led to strains and eruptions in civil-military relations like never before.

A furious former chief alleges that this style is focused on "undermining chiefs to force them on the back foot". This is what happened with Admiral Joshi, he infers. On 23 November 2013, Antony issued a press release to publicly criticise the Navy leadership over its safety record, and asking it "not to fritter away precious national resources". From then on, it was all downhill. Every single "incident" at sea found its way into the public domain in a grossly exaggerated manner, forcing the Navy into a continuously tense fire-fighting mode, and ultimately triggering Joshi's resignation.

Other chiefs at the receiving end of Antony's style include Air Chief Marshals S.P. Tyagi and N.A.K. Browne, General Deepak Kapoor and Admiral Sureesh Mehta. General V.K. Singh was both indulged and treated like the bête noire. Most ex-chiefs, who spoke to The Sunday Guardian, also blamed the minister's innuendo-laden style, "blurred communication" — famously described as a "bizarre mix of inadequate vocabulary and strange body language"— and unwillingness to take decisions as reasons for tensions with the civilian establishment.

Tyagi, who was energetically branded as the villain in the VVIP helicopter scam — despite the purchase having been processed and deal signed three years after his retirement — is known to have bitterly complained of malfeasance and defamation by a coterie. The CBI has not been able to press charges against Tyagi even after a year of investigation.

Public sector units such as the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) were pitted against Browne to label him pro-import. Generous patronage was extended to a belated HAL attempt to produce an indigenous basic trainer after the aircraft of this class had been imported. Under Admiral Mehta, the military leadership, for the first time in Indian history, openly expressed resentment and discontent against inadequate pay.

Defence Minister A.K. Antony
"Antony did not take independent decisions. He pushed everything down to the bureaucracy. We were at loggerheads over the Pay Commission issue," acknowledges Admiral Mehta, who as Chairman Chiefs of Staff Committee was forced to go to the Prime Minister when Antony did not address the grievances of the services. "Thereafter, for every issue, he would ask me, 'Have you spoken to PM?'" shrugs Mehta, bemoaning a total lack of leadership.

While Antony's relationship with General V.K. Singh is widely perceived as "dysfunctional", there was tension with his predecessor, General Deepak Kapoor. "Faith and trust had eroded," admits Kapoor. Buffeted by the Sukna "land scam", a disturbed Kapoor complained to Antony that he was being undermined through rumour and misrepresentation. "He told me he didn't know and would check up," recalls Kapoor.

Kapoor's bigger complaint is that Antony, despite his good connections, did not have the political weight and gravitas to "get things done" for the forces. "Budgets are falling. Military modernisation has suffered. Nothing comes through. He told me the Army would get the long-required artillery guns any time, very soon. I'm four years into retirement. The guns have still not come. There's total drift," he rues.

Admiral Mehta lamented Antony's overdependence on the civilian bureaucracy. "When I went to him with an urgent proposal, his response would be, 'Have you discussed it with the Defence Secretary?' The Defence Secretary was not in my chain. There was never a balance between the Ministry and the forces," he said.

Another former chief, who did not wish to be named, blamed lack of clarity and the tendency to play games for the current predicament. He expressed surprise that Antony should so resolutely oppose action against General V.K. Singh at a Cabinet Committee on Security meeting, but so quickly accept Admiral Joshi's resignation. "With Pranab Mukherjee, there was clarity. He could be very tough, blow up a chief, but also mollify another one and assuage hurt, like he did while tearing up Admiral Arun Prakash's resignation," he pointed out, making a case for sophisticated political interventions to keep the sensitive civil-military relations on an even keel.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2014 09:05

The eminence grise keeps very very quiet....... The Defence Secretary and his bunch of venomous babus

What about Admiral Joshi’s bosses?

1st Mar 2014
With a year left before the end of his term as Chief of the Naval Staff (CNS), Admiral D.K. Joshi decided to call it quits, accepting moral responsibility for the series of well-publicised mishaps that has plagued the Navy during this and the previous year, of which the worst was the August 2013 explosion that sank nuclear submarine INS Sindhurakshak in the safety of its harbour in Mumbai. Till today, the Ministry of Defence has been silent on the causes of the blast, although Defence Minister A.K. Antony was quick to rule out sabotage within hours of the incident, presumably on the basis of his skills in telepathy.

Another submarine, INS Sindhugosh, escaped being scrapped after it almost ran aground in low tide a month ago, again in Mumbai harbour, and now two gallant submariners have paid with their lives for the negligence or worse that caused a battery leak in yet another submarine, INS Sindhuratna, about 50 nautical miles off the Mumbai coast. As Admiral Joshi pointed out to A.K. Antony, many of the Navy's submarines are by now antiques, suitable less for operations than for being displayed in a maritime museum.

Since the 1980s, successive governments have been in a pell-mell rush to purchase expensive imported weaponry, so much so that India has become the largest buyer of weapons in the world, displacing even China (with its four times bigger economy) or cash-rich states such as Saudi Arabia. The private sector in India has been kept off defence production, even while foreign companies have expanded their presence in Delhi, gaining influence not simply in the corridors of government, but in sections of the media as well. The clout of the arms lobby is reason enough to wonder whether the removal through an induced resignation of an upright officer was motivated by the desire on the part of international lobbies to ensure that a more pliable person be appointed as his successor. Too many in the armed forces are these days falling prey to the blandishments of international arms manufacturers, thereby making India dependent on countries such as Russia, France and now the US for super-critical defence equipment.

However, much more than those in uniform, it is the bureaucratic establishment and their political overseers who are to blame for the flood of expensive imports into the armed services, and for the neglect of domestic capabilities, especially in the private sector. The mess in the Navy was created not by Admiral Joshi but by those actually in charge, the Minister of Defence and the Defence Secretary. It is these two who ought to quit, rather than Admiral Joshi.

pushkar.bhat · Post by **pushkar.bhat** » 02 Mar 2014 09:44

While we all blame the saint for not doing anything we often forget to look into the role played by the Finance Ministry's "Financial Advisers" to concerned ministries who have been used ruthlessly to stall projects. Remember it takes 2 lungi walas to tango..

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2014 09:56

pushkar.bhat wrote:While we all blame the saint for not doing anything we often forget to look into the role played by the Finance Ministry's "Financial Advisers" to concerned ministries who have been used ruthlessly to stall projects. Remember it takes 2 lungi walas to tango..

Especially considering the fact that the congis and shehzada's desperate campaign depends solely on nationally distributed freebies and sops requiring large scale diversion of funds from other requirements.

If AKA could not help, he should not have actively aided the damage.

All this in the face of the fast approaching train wreck of the impending obama's afpak pullout....

Jaybhatt · Post by **Jaybhatt** » 02 Mar 2014 10:46

Chetak : "The eminence grise keeps very very quiet....... The Defence Secretary and his bunch of venomous babus"

Couldn't agree more with you. My earlier post and others by fellow BR members have all emphasised this scandalous feature of the tragedy that occurred a few days back, and the fact that this is a long-standing malaise in the country's defence structure.

It is actually much more sinister than a malaise - it is a cancer that has eaten into the bones of our armed forces. Unless the babu-neta plague is eradicated, not just in the defence structure but from all other governance systems, we will be doomed very soon.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2014 11:37

Jaybhatt wrote:Chetak : "The eminence grise keeps very very quiet....... The Defence Secretary and his bunch of venomous babus"

Couldn't agree more with you. My earlier post and others by fellow BR members have all emphasised this scandalous feature of the tragedy that occurred a few days back, and the fact that this is a long-standing malaise in the country's defence structure.

It is actually much more sinister than a malaise - it is a cancer that has eaten into the bones of our armed forces. Unless the babu-neta plague is eradicated, not just in the defence structure but from all other governance systems, we will be doomed very soon.

Sirjee,

In all this melee, my crystallized personal opinion for what it's worth...

The resignation of the Chief has left many of us flabbergasted and disappointed.

His quitting has not resolved anything. A man that the entire Service looked up to, riding off into the sunset in the face of perceived difficulties is a bit incongruous to say the least.

Better that he should have tenaciously stuck around, faced up to the technical challenges, carried on the good fight and mentored the Navy to rise like the phoenix from the ashes of this undoubted disaster. There were absolutely no issues of moral turpitude or corruption tainting his tenure. What was the intolerable rush or the provocation??

A Chief never walks or backs away. They are chosen and appointed not to. What sort of example has he set for those who follow in his footsteps to emulate??

Service officers do not have the luxury of resignation in the face of challenges. He is either relieved by due process by a higher authority or falls dead or at best seek to be relieved on some specific grounds when unable to carry out the duties assigned. Certainly 'owning up moral responsibility' for some mishap somewhere is no ground.(Paraphrasing a friend who can obviously express his thoughts much more eloquently)

The Navy is not a commercial organisation bound by the "principles of management". Did he forget the adage "When the going gets tough, the tough get going."?? The Navy is not the Railway ministry of LBS.

The Chief does not provide a "service", he provides "security". The metrics for the two are vastly and fundamentally different. One deals with comfort of the citizen and the other with his very life.

While we wish him well, we also wish that he had seen things in a slightly different light.

negi · Post by **negi** » 02 Mar 2014 12:15

^I agree with Chetak sir's sentiments issue is services are not engaging the MOD , following orders without asking questions works in an ideal system where each player fulfills his/her duties ; time has come for the services to show a bit of dissent and make MOD realize that silence shouldn't be mistaken for weakness . IMHO General V K Singh set a very nice precedent for other folks in his capacity i.e use the sustem's machinery to take the government to court . His letter to the Government regarding irregularities with procurement and misconduct of bad apples is a way to go . Admiral Joshi has taken a route of a Samurai warrior who takes defeat too personally nothing wrong with it however unfortunately in today's world old school sentiments are hardly valued or even seen in right light , he is dealing with folks with a rhino's skin tendering a resignation is probably the best thig which would have happened for the MOD , what goes their father's ?

Admiral had lot of power and authority when he was in the IN , he could have compiled his observations and grouses in a book/letter sent it to the MoD an at the same time made them public by doing so he would have drawn the ire of MOD like COAS however that would have probably made much bigger dent than just walking away into the sunset .

What is happening now is media is spinning stories around his responsibility , painting his tenure as disastrous filled with accidents etc etc , selectively leaking facts to paint IN officers as selfish power hungry individuals and all this is diverting the attention from the main issue i.e lack of coordination between MoD and services .

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 02 Mar 2014 12:41

http://www.asianage.com/interview-week/ ... signed-504

‘Admiral Joshi need not have resigned’
Mar 02, 2014

Former Admiral Arun Prakash (Retd), former Indian Navy Chief

Admiral D.K. Joshi resigned as Navy Chief last Wednesday, after a submarine incident. Did he over-react or did he read the writing on the wall?

There was no writing on the wall. Admiral Joshi need not have resigned. By following the dictates of his conscience and “judging himself by the same yardstick” — to use his own words — as he used for others, he has sent an exemplary message to the whole country. Remember, the concept of “moral responsibility” has disappeared in India and, until recently, even convicted criminals could remain in Parliament and become ministers.
While there was no pressure on the Chief to resign, the alacrity with which his resignation was accepted certainly indicated a keen desire by the government to deflect mounting media criticism.

As a former Navy Chief, were you taken by surprise at the turn of events? The perceived line of succession has been upset on account of the Chief’s sudden departure.

The Chief’s resignation did, indeed, come as a major surprise. As the head of the Service, the Chief leads by example. The putative “line of succession” exists only in the imagination of the media. When a new Chief has to be selected, there are clear-cut guidelines for the government, keeping in sight the basic principle of “merit-cum-seniority” from amongst a number of eligible candidates.

Surely, the defence minister could have insisted that Admiral Joshi stay on. Was there a trust deficit with the ministry of defence (MoD)?

Had the government ensured actual integration of Naval Headquarters with the MoD, the latter should have borne collective responsibility for whatever happened, and Admiral Joshi’s resignation need not have been accepted. However, the armed forces HQs remain outside the MoD, whose approval they need for each and every activity.
The Chiefs carry full responsibility for their Service — operational and administrative — but they have no locus standi in the MoD. The defence secretary, on the other hand, has been assigned authority for the “defence of India and for the three armed forces HQs”. However, he has zero accountability for anything, especially when things go wrong.
Service Chiefs are excluded from the process of national security policy and decision-making. It may be useful to integrate the Service HQs with the MoD, and constitute a Chief of Defence Staff as military advisor to the Raksha Mantri. In the past 15 years, two high-powered committees and the Standing Committee of Parliament have made comprehensive recommendations about security reforms. No action has been taken, largely due to resistance from the bureaucracy and lack of resolve on the part of politicians.

The previous two Navy Chiefs enjoyed cordial relations with the government. They even went on to become High Commissioners. Where did Admiral Joshi’s equations with the government go wrong?

It was clearly an unfortunate sequence of events that saw a number of incidents at sea in quick succession. This could have happened in any Chief’s tenure. I have no doubt that Admiral Joshi maintained a correct and appropriate relationship with the civilian establishment, which is all that is required.

Have so many accidents occurred on account of an ageing fleet surviving on refits? Is the quality of all components checked in a foolproof manner?

Most of the Navy’s ships are relatively young and there are enough measures in place to safeguard technical safety aspects. However, some vessels of Soviet/Russian origin are nearing the end of their service-life. Both accidents involving loss of life took place on board old submarines of Russian origin. This calls for in-depth investigations into Russian repair standards and our own operating/maintenance procedures.
Since 2008, the Navy’s operational tempo has been mounting steadily on account of overseas deployments, anti-piracy patrols, tactical exercises, coastal security and other commitments. This has brought additional strain on personnel as well as ships and machinery. It is up to Naval HQ and the commanders to ensure that excessive pressures are not built up on men and machines, and safety norms are not violated.

Will frequent removal of commanding officers of vessels demoralise the officer cadre and force them to play safe?

Eight of the 10 incidents that took place in the recent past can be termed “trivial” — minor cases of collisions, groundings and fires. Without playing down the aspect of professional competence, these do occur on a regular basis in all active sea-going Services. One way to stop such incidents is to stop sailing, flying and diving; in which case, why have a Navy?
Reduction of accidents and conduct of operations in a safe, professional manner is a primary responsibility of every commander. How he chooses to execute it is a matter of personal style and prerogative. Removal of commanding officers is one way of attempting accident reduction, but there is the serious danger of inducing risk-averseness or a “zero-error syndrome” which will eliminate initiative and enterprise, so essential in a fighting Navy.

Submarine shortage in the Navy has reached a point of criticality with the delay in induction of the Scorpene. Overall, how would you assess the Navy’s war-readiness?

The Navy had started warning the MoD in 2004 that submarine force-levels were declining and would reach criticality by 2015 if approved plans were not implemented. Decisions kept getting stalled at the political level for reasons unknown. Even after the hugely delayed signing of the Scorpene submarine contract, it has been bedevilled by further slippages on account of a serious decision-making deficiency in MoD.
Indigenous warship production is certainly a bright spot on our maritime horizon, and very soon a majority of our force will be home-built. Notwithstanding the recent run of accidents, the professional standards and combat readiness of our Navy remains very high. This assessment comes from the dozen or so foreign navies who exercise with the Indian Navy regularly.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 02 Mar 2014 12:44

chetak , May be he tried and did not suceed much in his tenure ... considering the current government is at its fag end of life expecting any thing now would have been too much.

May be there are letters sent to MOD that described the seriousness of the situation and they are not available in public domain.

He could have done a VK Singh and played a media war to highlight the issues , but perhaps Joshi is too much of a gentleman and does not want to get into politics of it.

Rather then be a lame duck chief with hands tied like we have a lame duck DM ....he though it was more honorable to quit.

In the coming days we might hear more from the ex Chief.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2014 13:16

Austin wrote:chetak , May be he tried and did not suceed much in his tenure ... considering the current government is at its fag end of life expecting any thing now would have been too much.

May be there are letters sent to MOD that described the seriousness of the situation and they are not available in public domain.

He could have done a VK Singh and played a media war to highlight the issues , but perhaps Joshi is too much of a gentleman and does not want to get into politics of it.

Rather then be a lame duck chief with hands tied like we have a lame duck DM ....he though it was more honorable to quit.

In the coming days we might hear more from the ex Chief.

Gen VK Singh is an honorable man done in by a vicious media, kangress dirty tricks and a spineless judiciary.

All he asked for was that his DOB be recorded or corrected as per his birth certificate, period. No more, no less, repeat No more, no less.

Everything else is tripe and hype, motivated concoctions by pressitutes in the media and tiwari/sibal type of psyops against a decent and very honorable man.

With Adm Joshi, comes the hard realization that the pressitutes cannot pull the same wool over people's eyes the second time.The pressitutes are confused waiting for directions from clients who are busy desperately safeguarding their own backsides from the NAMO onslaught.

A watergate type of scenario, with massive destruction of the paper trail like what happened in Delhi prior to the kejriwal take over may well play out as the end game draws near.

The current lot of pimps are distraught that with NAMO looming ever larger over the horizon their very existence is at stake. A new lot of pimps are eagerly getting dandied up to serve new clients. The pressitutes resignedly await the new clients not knowing whether it will be "aage" ya "peeche" or worse.

negi · Post by **negi** » 02 Mar 2014 13:20

Report of court of enquiry which presided over sinking of INS Sindhurakshak has not been made public actually none of the findings of such accidents are made public and it is a clear pointer to the fact that there are ugly things which the services need to hide for various reasons and this is yet another reason why people high up in the chain of command can afford to just complete their tenure and move on. If the fire aboard Sindhurakshak was due to technical issues then logically rest of the kilos should have been grounded until issue was resolved however that did not happen or at least we do not know of any such grounding nor did we hear about any human error IMHO that is major mistake on part of the IN i.e MOD's indifference aside it did not do enough to ensure that kilos were safe and in operable condition.
If the batteries were indeed old and well past their service life then decision to push the envelope lies with the IN and not the MOD , one cannot have the cake and eat it too i.e either you do not operate a faulty platform or do not blame others for putting the lives of men at risk . At least now all the kilos need to be grounded with immediate effect and only released back to the sea after thorough checks else how does one ensure that this won't happen again ?

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2014 13:22

Austin wrote:chetak , May be he tried and did not suceed much in his tenure ... considering the current government is at its fag end of life expecting any thing now would have been too much.

May be there are letters sent to MOD that described the seriousness of the situation and they are not available in public domain.

Sirjee,

The detailed letters on record were sent repeatedly, regularly, monotonously and needless to add, fruitlessly.

The $#%&^ money was diverted to the shehzada rehabilitation fund.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2014 13:26

negi wrote:Report of court of enquiry which presided over sinking of INS Sindhurakshak has not been made public actually none of the findings of such accidents are made public and it is a clear pointer to the fact that there are ugly things which the services need to hide for various reasons and this is yet another reason why people high up in the chain of command can afford to just complete their tenure and move on. If the fire aboard Sindhurakshak was due to technical issues then logically rest of the kilos should have been grounded until issue was resolved however that did not happen or at least we do not know of any such grounding nor did we hear about any human error IMHO that is major mistake on part of the IN i.e MOD's indifference aside it did not do enough to ensure that kilos were safe and in operable condition.
If the batteries were indeed old and well past their service life then decision to push the envelope lies with the IN and not the MOD , one cannot have the cake and eat it too i.e either you do not operate a faulty platform or do not blame others for putting the lives of men at risk . At least now all the kilos need to be grounded with immediate effect and only released back to the sea after thorough checks else how does one ensure that this won't happen again ?

I know the last line of all such reports.

" The loss is to be borne by the State "

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 02 Mar 2014 13:53

Aging weapon systems and eqpt.,some past their replacement date like the batteries,and increased operations,for exercises with the USN and its allies,combating piracy,with dwindling numbers has been the straw that broke the proverbial camel's back. After the SRatna tragedy the truth has outed and the underlying fact that the GOI/MOD/Deaf Min. were aware about it for a decade and did b*gger all!

As I said before, an officer caught asleep on watch in wartime will be shot.What about our sleeping minister and babus ,snoring for over a decade?!

Now that more and more former chiefs are coming out of their retirement silence and are speaking boldly on the issue/crisis in the armed forces,they should collectively hold a media conference and show the nation who are the real culprits for the tragedies and the pathetic state of the armed forces.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2014 13:58

Philip wrote:Aging weapon systems and eqpt.,some past their replacement date like the batteries,and increased operations,for exercises with the USN and its allies,combating piracy,with dwindling numbers has been the straw that broke the proverbial camel's back. After the SRatna tragedy the truth has outed and the underlying fact that the GOI/MOD/Deaf Min. were aware about it for a decade and did b*gger all!

As I said before, an officer caught asleep on watch in wartime will be shot.What about our sleeping minister and babus ,snoring for over a decade?!

Now that more and more former chiefs are coming out of their retirement silence and are speaking boldly on the issue/crisis in the armed forces,they should collectively hold a media conference and show the nation who are the real culprits for the tragedies and the pathetic state of the armed forces.

What!!??

And no more governorships thereafter!!!

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2014 14:07

A.K. Antony's hallowed bubble finally bursts

It takes just five minutes to pour cold water on a reputation built up in a political career spanning over half a century. Defence Minister A.K. Antony has had to learn this the bitter way with the resignation of Admiral D.K. Joshi as the Indian Navy chief, the immediate provocation being an incident aboard INS Sindhuratna that resulted in the deaths of two officers and injuries to seven sailors when smoke filled the battery compartment of the submarine, 80 nautical miles off Mumbai.

Having taken "moral responsibility" for this accident and a string of others in the past seven-odd months, everyone agrees that Admiral Joshi has gone out in a blaze of glory while Antony has been shamefacedly left holding the wooden spoon.

That Admiral Joshi was an upright, highly competent and no-nonsense officer with a hitherto blemishless record who would never hesitate to call a spade a spade is also not in doubt. Matters came to a head last November when Antony asked the navy to clean up its act and ensure that its valuable assets were not "frittered away".

But then, Antony chose to not look within, where the fault actually lay -- there were repeated reports of the Comptroller and Auditor General that procurement delays were resulting in the Indian Navy losing its blue water capabilities. Antony, it must be remembered, is the chairman of the Defence Acquisition Committee (DAC) that clears the purchases of all military hardware.

In its report of 2008-09, the CAG said: "The process of procurement of battery monitoring system urgently needed for submarines witnessed inordinate delays".

This report must now come to haunt Antony. On INS Sindhuratna, there was a smoke build-up in the battery compartment. In the case of INS Sindhughosh, a hydrogen build-up in the battery compartment resulted in a massive explosion that killed 18 officers and sailors and caused the submarine to sink in Mumbai harbour on August 14, 2013.

Interestingly, the two vessels were anchored virtually alongside and an astute operation by personnel of the Indian Navy and the Mumbai Fire Brigade manged to remove INS Sindhuratna to safety.

Now, let's look at the Scorpene project under which six French-Spanish diesel-electric submarines were to be built at Mumbai's Mazagon Docks Limited with an option for another six. The deal was signed in 2005, but nine years later, not a single boat has hit the water due to procedural and bureaucratic delays.

Originally slated for delivery from 2012, which has now been pushed back to 2016, the Scorpenes were meant to replace the ageing Soviet-era Kilo-class vessels -- which INS Sindhughosh and INS Sindhuratna were -- of the Indian Navy, all of which are ending their normal 25-30-year service life.

But why focus on submarines alone?

As recently as Feb 24, the DAC failed to clear the navy's proposal for four amphibious warships and 16 multi-role helicopters with ASW (anti-submarine warfare) capabilities, among many other items also on the wishlists of the Indian Army and the Indian Air Force.

Okay, it's been argued that since 10 accidents in seven months occurred during Admiral Joshi's watch, he should take the rap. In that case, under whose watch has the Indian Navy struggled to keep itself afloat and what penalty should this individual incur?

But then, politicians say different rules apply to them. As a Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) leader famously said the other day: "Why should Narendra Modi be held responsible for the (2002) Gujarat riots? There were other officers to control the situation."

There is one other aspect of defence acquisitions during Antony's watch. The tender for purchasing 126 medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) was floated in 2005 and six manufacturers short-listed in 2007. The Dassault Rafale got the nod in 2012 but the contract is yet to be inked, apparently because of protracted negotiations on issues like the cost of transferring technology and life-cycle costs.

It must be remembered that the MMRCA was meant to replace the IAF's fleet of the 1960s vintage MiG-21 combat jets that have been dubbed "flying coffins" due to their propensity to crash with maddening frequency.

Does the DAC care for the lives of the IAF's young pilots? Apparently not, because what it has cleared is the purchase, among others, of three B-737 BBJs (Boeing Business Jets) for the IAF's Air Headquarters Communication Squadron that ferries dignitaries like the president, the vice president, the prime minister - and Antony himself.

This purchase was on a single-vendor basis, meaning there was only one contender in the fray. India's Defence Procurement Policy expressly states that this route should be adopted only in exceptional and emergent situations.

India also purchased three Phalcon AWACS (airborne warning and control systems) mounted on an IL-78 heavy-lift aircraft. This too was on a single-vendor system. Many wonder whether this system was needed at all!

Then, a contract was signed for the purchase of 12 Agusta Westland VVIP helicopters, again for the Communication Squadron. This contract, which was cancelled last year on graft charges, also took the single-vendor route.

Given Antony's track record on the armed forces' need for modernistion, the tactful thing for him to do was to persuade the admiral to stay and to promise to address his concerns.

Instead, what did he do? He promptly accepted the resignation. As Admiral Arun Prakash, a former Indian Navy chief, succinctly put it: "If the chief resigns, it suits everyone."

What this has also done is to puncture Antony's holier-than-thou halo.

(02.03.2014 - Vishnu Makhijani is an Associate Editor at IANS. The views expressed are personal. He can be contacted at vishnu.makhijani@ians.in)

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 02 Mar 2014 22:00

The GOI has done the right thing. Spending Rs 500 crores on useful activities PR rather than mundane things like submarine batteries.