Indian Military Aviation- September 29 2013

[Victor]

HAL immediately initiated an inquiry into the charges through its Chief Vigilance Officer, which has found credence in the charges.

Who could this be? AFAIK only Jags are being upengined?

IAF’s several programmes are expected to get delayed but the Defence Ministry is firm that it would not allow any corruption to take place in its procurement process and would take strict action even if it means delays in some of the projects.

What else is new. Lungi must exit the scene starchy white even if a paki called in with false allegations. Complete waste of a RM and curse on the armed forces.

[Sid]

^^

News reports says its Rolls Royce.

If RR is blacklisted, then it will affect AJT (aur ker lo import), C-130J, Jaguar, Embraer business jets. This will effectively push back our AWAC program as well.

http://idrw.org/?p=34133#more-34133

When they will start blacklisting politicians/babus who actually accept these bribes? All we know it can be a babu dropping a letter because a XYZ company refused to pay him his desired salary.

Babu's/Politician's don't move a file unless they are paid to do so (highly professional). Hence you need an agent.

To get around this problem they have started to hire these agents as employees until deals are secured. Wolf in sheep's clothing??

[srin]

Who needs sanctions when St Anthony the Clean Dhoti is around?

Almost every other manufacturer is going to be blacklisted, and the clean ones cannot compete because they are now 'single vendors'

The next govt needs to make a choice ASAP, does fighting corruption in the short term mean we thoroughly neglect national security priorities.

We don't want no America to impose sanctions, we can manage it ourselves, thank you !

[Philip]

...and change his name to "Scamthony"!

[Singha]

looks like his elevation process into the patron saint of Failure is well underway by the papal council here.

[Austin]

looks like his elevation process into the patron saint of Failure is well underway by the papal council here.

[Austin]

AJT deal was signed during NDA times .....so likely its a political game plan to blame the NDA ....atleast I suspect so

[Philip]

"Patron saint of failure"...!
He's also a very good advertisement for washing soap.Surf,rin,Nirma...nothing can beat his white dhoti.
"Scamthony washes whitest!"

[ramana]

Err AK Anthony is a Patron Saint of Disarming India.
He does this by turning down all procurements for offensive weapons.
There is no deal he does not reject.

How come he did not order a CBI inquiry as to how bribe were apid despite his clean reputation?

Maybe there is a kitchen cabinet behind him with AP as the reciever of scam monies?
Recall Westland_Augusta had noted money paid to AP for the helicopters.

[Vipul]

There should actually be a investigation on how AK Antony is willfully undermining India's security by scuttling deals of long required hardware under the pretext of "enquiry".

[Austin]

If MOD is indeed in the process of Black Listing RR then this might impact more than Hawk in service .......Hopefully even if they blacklist its not going to be complete blanket black listing of RR as we use RR engine on Jags and others.

[Prem]

Only Dusss Numbri Single Vendor qualified is Shroud of Turin or Shwet Mundu of Malabar.
Next step is to Black List Armed Forces Itself.
No need for Defence Ministry:
Replace It With Ministry of Secularism and South Asian Sangeet Kla.

[Austin]

Excerpts from FORCE

It (IJT programme) is Already Eight Years Behind Schedule. We Are Hoping That IOC Will be Obtained by End of This Year as by 2015 Our Kiran Assets Will Start Dwindling
AOC-in-C, Training Command, Indian Air Force, Air Marshal Paramjit Singh Gill AVSM VM

Please provide an update on the Pilatus PC-7 Mk-II and the training being undertaken.

It is a beautiful aircraft and we are happy to have got this machine. The way our instructors and trainees have taken to the aircraft is something to be appreciated. The sustainability of the aircraft on the flight line and maintainability has been very good, we just need one man to perform the daily inspections, turn around the aircraft and receive the aircraft which is very convenient. The time period between servicing is also very large and the workload on the technicians and engineering faculty is reduced. The response that we have been getting from the Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) is excellent, it is, after all, a new machine and there would be teething problems. However, when anything goes wrong they act in quick order and have been professionally sound in accepting responsibility, in case there is an issue from their side. As a result we have been able to maintain a very high availability rate on the aircraft and this is very encouraging. The Maintenance Transfer of Technology (MTOT) is supposed to be signed by HAL and that process is on. Presently, all servicing is handled by the IAF along with assistance from the OEM. The IAF is looking at flying 40 hours per month per aircraft. At present we have 26 aircraft and the ultimate goal is for 75 aircraft (expected by August next year), so we would be able to stagger the flying hours.

Please provide an update on the Hawk fleet and delivery schedules.

All the Hawk Mk 132 Advanced Jet Trainers (AJT) from the original contract are with us now. From the additional order of 40 Hawks, HAL has delivered five aircrafts which are stationed at Aircraft System and Testing Establishment (ASTE). Seven more are scheduled to be delivered by March this year and 40 aircraft are due to be available with the IAF by March 2017. We intend to acquire another 20 Hawks for the aerobatic display team. The Hawk has a good radius of action. Simulators for the Hawk are in place and those for the Pilatus should be in place soon.

What is the status of the Kiran fleet?

The Kiran is a beautiful machine and even the present Chief of Air Staff flew the Kiran as a trainee. It has now been flying for a long time and it has given us good service. Now, there is a need to change as they are approaching their Total Technical Life Extension (TTLE) of 750 hours. The fleet consists largely of Mk1s. The Kiran Mk2 is used for flying training at the Qualified Flying Instructor’s Course (QFIC) at Flying Instructor’s School (FIS), Tambaram. Availability of spares for the Orpheus engine used on the Kiran Mk2 has been an area of concern in the recent past. Beyond 2015, it will be difficult to sustain the Kiran fleet.

Please comment on the status of the IJT programme.

It is already eight years behind schedule. We are hoping that IOC will be obtained by end of this year as by 2015 our Kiran assets will start dwindling. We are lucky that the Pilatus delivery is ahead of schedule, so some of the load of the Kirans will be taken by the Pilatus at Tambaram. That will give us some respite. However, by 2015 we need to have a replacement for the Kiran, so either the IJT comes up or we approach the government for an alternative. There are issues related to the stall and spin characteristics that need to be resolved; HAL is trying to resolve this. Once this is done, hopefully the progress will be much faster.

[Austin]

Indian aerospace industry faces talent shortage: HAL chairman

"India needs better training and education infrastructure with a pragmatic policy-industry-academia ecosystem to tap the huge employment potential in the aerospace industry," he said at the first aerospace round table conference here.

Delivering the keynote address on "Challenges and Opportunities for Talent Management in the Aerospace Industry" at the day-long conference, Tyagi said due to lack of vocational skills, the aspiring youth required extensive training to match the high standards of the industry.

"For instance, in the light combat aircraft (LCA) Tejas project, we had build technologies from scratch and build an industrial base due to technology denial and shortage of vocationally skilled workforce," he said.

The Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) is the sole manufacturer of the fourth generation fighter Tejas, designed and developed by the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) of the Defence Research and Development Organization (DRDO).

The multi-role supersonic fighter secured initial operational clearance Dec 20 for induction into the Indian Air Force after three decades of design, development and extensive field trials.

Noting that a mere two percent of Indian population had vocational skills as against the ratio of 75 percent in Germany, 96 percent in Korea, 80 percent in Japan and 68 percent in Britain, Tyagi said coordination, direction and role definition were some of the human resource challenges HAL had faced during the LCA's development.

"Though we had to involve multiple agencies to build a talent pool for the LCA project, absence of large trained workforce poses HR challenges to the medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) project in terms of supply chain and technology," Tyagi observed.

Outlining the challenges faced by his company in executing multiple projects, he said besides skill upgradation and cross training, specific education to maintain aerospace life-cycle at the entry level was imperative.

"Leadership development for mid-level management, succession planning across levels, attrition and retention are some of the HR challenges we face on the research and development (R&D) and offset fronts," Tyagi pointed out.

In this context, he said global aerospace majors were citing capability and capacity within the Indian industry as impediments to meet offset commitments and seek international certificates for indigenous products and overseas marketing.

"Facilities for basic and specialised training have to be reviewed to develop infrastructure and improve curriculum for upgrading the skill base," Tyagi noted.

Advocating specialized training on par with international standards and requirements, Tyagi lamented that the country was yet to have an aviation university as against six such varsities in other countries.

Vivek Lall, chief executive of New Venture, Reliance Industries' aerospace subsidiary, and Parag Diwan, vice chancellor of University of Petroleum and Energy Studies also addressed the conference.

[Manish_Sharma]

Noting that a mere two percent of Indian population had vocational skills as against the ratio of 75 percent in Germany, 96 percent in Korea, 80 percent in Japan and 68 percent in Britain, Tyagi said coordination, direction and role definition were some of the human resource challenges HAL had faced during the LCA's development.

What are these vocational skills, in which korea beats both germany and japan?

[tsarkar]

Indian aerospace industry faces talent shortage: HAL chairman

Noting that a mere two percent of Indian population had vocational skills as against the ratio of 75 percent in Germany, 96 percent in Korea, 80 percent in Japan and 68 percent in Britain, Tyagi said coordination, direction and role definition were some of the human resource challenges HAL had faced during the LCA's development. "Though we had to involve multiple agencies to build a talent pool for the LCA project, absence of large trained workforce poses HR challenges to the medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) project in terms of supply chain and technology," Tyagi observed.

Nonsense. Its a typical PSU self glorification that PSUs are the only fountains of knowledge, skill & training, and the only source of superlative skills in India.

Sweden, Israel, South Africa, Czech Republic have much smaller populations than India.

2% of 1.237 Billion is 24.74 Million People, that is 2.5 times the entire population of Sweden that is 9.517 Million People assuming all of them have vocational skills.

Real problem is not all of these 24.74 Million People work for HAL, and hence their skills are untapped.

Its like MoD wanting HSL to build Project 75A submarines when HSL cannot build Coast Guard Patrol Vessels properly.

Throw open a competition to build a fighter plane to all 2% of 1.237 Billion People = 24.74 Million People, and watch the difference.

[vic]

OFB & DPSUs are lazy, incompetent, corrupt whiners!

[vina]

Thinking on the instability in Ukraine, there is large danger for the IAF in terms of fleet maintenance. The AN-32 fleet undergoing modernisation is in jeopardy. The MI-17s are also going to be in trouble. The engines are from Ukraine.

These two are the backbone of the transport fleet. Time to get out of the FSU arms stuff .

Also, the Delhi class is in trouble due to the dependence on the Zorya Ukranian gas turbines. The only saving grace is that the Chinese ships using that are in trouble as well.

[Singha]

they are located in the eastern part of the ukraine. east of the dnieper river.

onlee problem is antonov - located in kiev.

that is why rus need to keep a hold on entire ukraine not just eastern part. maybe the extreme west can join back their polish and romanian cousins.

[Lalmohan]

first the volga-dnieper line, then the oder-nesse...

[chetak]

A small ray of sunshine midst the general gloom doom wrought by scamtony


Desi Tyres on Sukhoi Fighters a Runway Hit

Desi Tyres on Sukhoi Fighters a Runway Hit

Anantha Krishnan M

05th March 2014

BANGALORE



- [: The IAF started looking within the country after facing difficulties in sourcing tyres from abroad.]


The IAF started looking within the country after facing difficulties in
sourcing tyres from abroad.


The Indian fighter jets have begun the process of changing over to desi
tyres, probably signalling an end to escalating cost and non-availability
concerns.

The Indian Air Force sources confirmed to Express that the 'India shining'
story is being scripted by the MRF, which has got the clearance from the
military airworthiness officials to produce the main wheel tyres of
frontline fighters Sukhoi (Su-30 MKI). The indigenous tyres named
'Aeromuscle' are 30 per cent cheaper than the imported ones.

The IAF started looking within the country after facing difficulties in
sourcing tyres from abroad. It was even forced to use tyres from war
reserves for some aircraft, after supplies from Russia became an issue.

The idea to approach Indian companies was taken up during P V Nayak's
tenure as the IAF chief.

"The MRF agreed to do all design, development and quality tests at their
own cost in the nation's interest," an IAF official said.

The MRF took the tyres for dynamometer tests thrice to a facility in China,
incurring a cost of around `10 crore.
(A dynamometer test simulates the entire sequence of taxi, take-off,
landing and braking loads on the tyre.)

"Later, the tyres were sent for trials at the IAF bases in Bareilly,
Jodhpur and Leh in 2011. They were finally cleared for getting on to the
IAF assets in 2012. The MRF has so far delivered 350 tyres and the
remaining are being manufactured at their plant in Medak near
Hyderabad,"the official said. A Sukhoi has two main wheel and two nose
wheel tyres.

Seeing the success of 'Aeromuscle' tyres, the MRF has been given the
mandate of designing the nose wheel tyres for Sukhois.

"Currently, the fitment trials are over and they are being taken to China
for dynamometer tests. By June, these tyres will be sent to Bangalore for
the clearance of the Centre for Military Airworthiness and
Certification,"the official added.

Speaking to Express from Hyderabad, Dr K Tamilmani, Director-General
(Aero), confirmed that even the Indian Navy wants Aeromuscle for the
MiG-29Ks. "We are planning to change the Tejas tyres very soon, which will
be followed by Dornier, Pilatus and Hawk. Currently, the Tejas runs on
Dunlop, being imported from the UK," said Tamilmani.

He said aircraft tyres normally undergo various tests such as burst, air
retention, bottoming-up (emptying the air/flat tyres), fitment and taxi.

[NRao]

About time!!!!

And, they have no dynamometer within India? Strange. Hard to believe.


IF that is true, then it is time to seriously make a list of such items (that the nation needs) and start funding universities.

[vic]

If we fund useless things like indigenous labs, who will fund important things like politicians Swiss accounts.

[Cain Marko]

These should be picked up asap.
http://www.armstrade.org/includes/perio ... tail.shtml

The 29Ms would cit in perfectly right now, logistical footprint is v.small since they will have huge commonality with IN Ks and IAF SMTs. Not expensive either, plus new frames.

[tushar_m]

MiG Building MiG 31 replacement

http://theaviationist.com/2014/03/05/mi ... placement/

According to the famous experimental pilot Anatoliy Kvochur, the MiG-41 is to be capable of reaching speeds above Mach 4, even Mach 4,3. That would make the plane faster than the (now retired) American SR-71 Blackbird. Currently, the Foxhound is capable of flying at speeds of Mach 2.8.

Nevertheless, while developing a Mach 4+ replacement for the Foxhound, the Russians will to continue the modernization program of the Foxhounds, overhauling over 100 aircraft.

MiG-31 is an interceptor based on MiG-25 Foxbat, with a combat radius of 720 km. A group of four Foxhounds is able to control an area that is 1000km wide; 190 MiG-31s are currently in service within the Russian Air Force, 100 of those are still flyable.

[Austin]

Cyber attack on Russia hits India, secret defence documents leaked

[Philip]

Rotislav Belyakov,who took over the MIG design bureau after Mikoyan's death died at the age of 94.He was the designer of the legendary MIG-25 and other MIG aircraft.Belyakov became the MiG chief designer in 1969, succeeding the firm's founder, Artyom Mikoyan, and led the development of a family of MiG fighters, including MiG-23, MiG-25, Mig-29 and their versions, which have been the backbone of Soviet and then Russian air force.The bureau produced the highly agile MIG-29 with high off-boresight missiles,and the MIG-31,the first aircraft with an electronically scanned radar.He co-authored with French journo Jacques Marmain,the aviation classic ,"MIG-50 years of secret aircraft design".

Belyakov was a great friend of India as this moving tribute to him testifies.

http://indrus.in/blogs/2014/03/04/a_tri ... 33489.html
A tribute to a legendary MiG designer and friend of India
March 4, 2014 Vinay Shukla

On March 1, the Russian news agencies announced about the sad demise of Academician Rostislav Belyakov, the Honorary Chief Designer of the Russian Aircraft Corporation MiG. After a prolonged illness he died on February 28, just a few days before his 95th birthday (March 4).

Academician Belyakov's achievements in aeronautics are well known, the MiG-21, MiG-25, MiG-27, MiG-29 and MiG-31 fighters designed by Mikoyan-Gurevich Bureau under his leadership have dominated the skies in the latter half of the 20th century, while MiG-29 fighters have undergone further development to be transformed into cutting-edge weapons platform like carrier-borne MiG-29K fighters for the Indian Navy for deployment on the INS Vikramaditya aircraft carrier as well as 4++ generation MiG-35.
пустым не оставлять!!

MIG Corp eyes broader cooperation with India

But there were different times in the life of Academician Belyakov, when everything around him looked bleak and nobody had the idea, how the defence cooperation with India would proceed? But Belyakov, a visionary never lost his optimism.

It was the middle of March 1992, few months after the collapse of the USSR in December 1991. There were more questions about the future of Indo-Russian military-technical cooperation than answers. A friend of mine in the Indian Embassy asked me whether I would be interested in interviewing Chief Designer of MiG. Of course! Which journalist would miss such an opportunity, specially knowing that in the Soviet times even their names were classified?

I was given his phone number, without any problem he gave me an appointment on a murky March morning and I was given the instructions how to come to the super-secret design bureau by public transport. I don't remember the metro station, but it was on the Leningrad Highway. I boarded a red tram, which took me through winding alleys to the gate of MiG Design Bureau.

Unlike these days, there were hardly any security checks. I presented my Foreign Ministry Press Card to the guard, who let me in and told me to proceed to a building in the compound. I was ushered in by the PA to Academician Belyakov into a spacious room with a big table and lot of chairs, probably the conference room of the MiG design bureau.

Academician Belyakov, who looked tired and worried, however, warmly welcomed me and offered some tea before beginning our interview.
пустым не оставлять!!

MIG Corp eyes broader cooperation with India

Naturally, my first question was about the future of our defence cooperation in general and military aircraft in particular as Indian armed forces were heavily dependent on the Soviet supplies.

At that juncture there were also questions about Moscow's policy vis-a-vis India. In January 1992, new Russian Foreign Minister Andrei Kozyrev had refused to meet Indian Foreign Secretary Mani Dixit, who was sent by Prime Minister PV Narasimha Rao on a fact-finding mission after the Soviet collapse. The atmosphere was further aggravated by the talks of “equidistant” policy in relations with India and Pakistan and “stop looking at Pakistan through Indian goggles.”

Academician Belyakov rubbished such talks saying that in the long run relations with India, both politically and militarily will continue to develop in the new scenario.

“No country can replace our friendly ties with India, not even our new American friends,” he was categorical. It was the time when the American advisers had occupied the spacious cabins of former politburo members in the headquarters of the Soviet Communist Party in the heart of Moscow.

He said that although the Soviet military-industrial complex has disintegrated with the fragmentation of the USSR, but its core industries were based and remain in Russia.

Before the Soviet collapse India had inducted 70 MiG-29 fighters - a 4th Generation air superiority multi-role fighter and talks were on to acquire 10 more aircraft. However, the fate of new acquisition was under cloud due to radically changed scenario.
пустым не оставлять!!

Ready to supply MiG-35s to India - Korotkov

Academician Belyakov vowed to fulfil the Indian contract, if signed, saying that all the units of MiG were functional in Russia. Not only this, he was perhaps the first Russian weapon producer, who envisioned the transition of bilateral cooperation from buyer-seller relationship to joint development and production of weapon systems and platforms with India, which today has become a reality with projects like BrahMos cruise missiles, fifth generation fighter aircraft (FGFA) and multi-role transport aircraft (MTA) for the armed forces.

He had prepared the MiG-21-93 project for the modernisation of the Indian Air Force's work-horse MiG-21, which had scope for the bilateral cooperation in their upgrade.

Academician Belyakov's interview widely carried by the Indian media had a definite impact on the decision making in New Delhi. In 1994 India acquired nine MiG-29 fighters and one trainer version.

This was the resumption of bilateral military-technical cooperation, which today has become a strong pillar of India-Russia privileged strategic partnership, foundation of which was laid by people like Rostislav Appolosovich Belyakov.

RIP: A true friend of India.

Perhaps,the best tribute to his designing would be as many are advocating,we pick up more MIG-29/35s as a very cost-effective solution for the IAF.

[Karan M]

I'd take that marketing spiel by Mr Belyakov (may he RIP though, he was a brilliant man) more seriously, if the MiG guys had not held an abusive press conference in Moscow blaming the IAF alone for all the MiG-21 related issues. Their egos were bigger than their common sense. And as a result, India looked more favorably at Su-30s than the MiG-35 and that was it for MiG.

[Philip]

The SU-30 /Flanker stands on its own merit.It is a larger aircraft with a larger all round capability,acknowledged worldwide to be the best apart from the F-22.I don't believe that the IAF chose it merely out of pique at MIG!

[Karan M]

Not merely because out of pique, but to deny that MiGs atrocious behavior played a role, would be to deny the sky is blue. In the mid 80's-early 90's, the production quality of some of the MiGs we received was atrocious. They literally had to be fixed airframe to airframe. Engines had pathetic MTBOs. MiG-21s, 23s and 27's required multiple design fixes, most of which were done locally at HAL by Indians, with Russians hemming and hawing at even admitting they were issues. When attrition rose and IAF started taking up the issue sternly with Russia, MiG went to the extent of calling a press conference and blaming the IAF entirely for the attrition. One of the BRD persons who was maintaining MiGs and led a yeoman effort to indigenize many MiG spares in India with better engineered items, said the MiG effort was a case of classic arrogance and BS.

Such arrogance on MiGs part obviously did not go unnoticed and the feedback obviously went all the way upto AHQ. The Bison may be a big success in public, but even there MiGs attitude was noted. First, many items did not meet agreed upon MTBO specifications. They had to be reworked. Second, the original deal had TOT built into it. Sokol protested and MiG walked out of teh TOT part. IAF, in necessity, agreed to mere assembly of kits in India at HAL.

The perception created by all these hadn't died out in recent years either.
A CAS when the MMRCA contest was launched much later, when told the MiG-35 would be competing, publicly said let them fix their smoky, old generation engines first. The MiG-35 has newer engines but the RD-33 experience was clearly still in the memory.

Net, Sukhoi benefited from all these aspects. Even that has had teething issues as is the norm with such complex programs, but the sheer arrogance shown by MiG folks in putting all the blame on India has been absent. Ask others, and MiGs abysmal product support for many other customers is also an issue. The MiG-29 Upg contract hence has many more strict conditions.

[Philip]

There was also some od reports about competition within Russia for funding,as it could no longer afford to have to separate design bureaus.Eventually all aircraft bureaus were merged into the UAC,with the Sukhoi bosses coming out on top.The I.42 was cancelled in favour of the T-50.It is only in recent times with the 29UGs/Ks that MIG has bounced back.

[chackojoseph]

President’s Standard to 112 Helicopter Unit & President’s Colours to 4 Base Repair Depot

[Arunkumar]

A saras with IAF paint scheme of grey was preparing for takeoff?? today afternoon. Program seems to be back on track .

[anand_sankar]

ACM Raha... RWR screeching, MISSILE LAUNCH... Feminist BVRAAMs are diving for the kill...

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/women-physic ... 3-242.html

"As far as flying fighter planes are concerned, it is a very challenging job. Women are by nature not physically suited for flying fighter planes for long hours, especially when they are pregnant or have other health problems," he said.

[Sid]

^^^
That's a very insensitive and uneducated remark. Didn't expected this from ACM.

Doesn't women IAF pilots do long hauls in transport planes or heli operations? And why a pregnant lady be involved in flight operations in the first place? What the hell he was talking about.

[Vasu]

A female colleague who just retired (SSC) from the Air Force after 11 years said that the recent legal wrangles for more opportunities for women in the AF has left a bad taste in many people's mouths.

As a woman, she felt that the attitude of some had hardened even more towards female staffers.

[Karan M]

^^^
That's a very insensitive and uneducated remark. Didn't expected this from ACM.

Doesn't women IAF pilots do long hauls in transport planes or heli operations? And why a pregnant lady be involved in flight operations in the first place? What the hell he was talking about.

Yeah sure, high G operations in fighter aircraft are the same as in transports and helis. And yeah, of course the ACM is too brainless to understand that war can break out anytime, and pilots on maternity leave cannot be part of those.

Tell you what, since you are such an expert, go on & ask the ACM for his job and tell him all about sensitivity and education.

PS: Before you bring in the US etc, their recruitment pool & resources are different. So please, not that tilt @ the windmill either.

[Sid]

^^^
That's a very insensitive and uneducated remark. Didn't expected this from ACM.

Doesn't women IAF pilots do long hauls in transport planes or heli operations? And why a pregnant lady be involved in flight operations in the first place? What the hell he was talking about.

Yeah sure, high G operations in fighter aircraft are the same as in transports and helis. And yeah, of course the ACM is too brainless to understand that war can break out anytime, and pilots on maternity leave cannot be part of those.

Tell you what, since you are such an expert, go on & ask the ACM for his job and tell him all about sensitivity and education.

PS: Before you bring in the US etc, their recruitment pool & resources are different. So please, not that tilt @ the windmill either.

High Gs in other countries have different effect on their women then women in India? And they don't get pregnant there? And in India if women pilots conceive, who fly transport plane or chopper in their absence? Why allow them to fly at all if that is the case?

What Madrasa logic is this?

And since you are such an expert on recruitment pool in US and India, why don't you educate us on the difference. Looks like our pool is super specialized then all the countries listed below.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fighter_pi ... ter_Pilots

Seriously what are you trying to pull here by defending a stupid statement by ACM?

[member_20453]

^^^^

Really??? comparing fighter to transport and helo G forces??? Thats silly to say the least. Fighter pilots have to endure anywhere between 9-10G, piltos of the F-22 and if Rafale is being will have to learn to cope with upto 11-12G since these fighters are capable of that. Trasnport and Helo pilots will never exeperience that unless their aircraft is going to crash. EF can pull 9G for a sustained period of time and fighter pilots need extensive G training.

Indeed there is a couple of F-22 women pilots and plenty of airforces have women F-16 and other pilots, however all those airforces have problems because when a woman does get pregnant, it takes plenty of retraining to get them flight worthy again. Which means added costs and knowing that our forces have to make the best use of their limited budgets they would rather save those costs.

Also fighter pilots have an offensive role and the enemy can capture them and Puki neighbors are not really the gold standard when it comes to handling of prisnors of war, a woman would be brutally raped, tortured. The same reason why women are not allowed in SF or infantry. As it is in our own country, women are brutally raped and killed, the enemy's treatment will be nothing short of horrific. Our women deserve better than that.

There are plenty of roles a woman can play in the battlefield, they can operate air defence SAMs, radars, they are ideal for clear and crisp comms at all levels. Ideal for recon, operating of combat/recon UAVS, transport helos, AWACS aircraft.

[Sid]

^^^
Lets talk objectively here, just answer these question and if you guys have plausible theories i will back down from this discussion.

1. Can women work in High G, like 9 or 10 you just mentioned on latest fighter planes?
2. Can a transport plane or halo be shot down by enemy, if yes then what will happen to our women?
3. How many times a working women is expected to conceive a baby, in her lifetime?
4. Why other countries, even like Pakistan, allows it but IAF does not?

Personally attacking me wont go down very well, nor will yield a positive outcome for this discussion.